Conference unifix::sailing

    My understanding is that San Diego will be the next site and the
    competition will continue use 12 Meter boats.
    
    The Kiwis apparently forced a decision when they came up with a
    challenge using boats with a 90' waterline. This is the maximum size
    allowed for sloops in the Cup's Deed.
    
    I'm disappointed, based on earlier discussions of potential sites,
    because San Diego doesn't have a lot wind and there is a lot of
    kelp there. Imagine the discussions around kelp-cutting keels!!!
    
    Any one know anything about pro 12 Meter racing starting next year?
    
    
    Ed

    
    	What are they gonna do down in Dago...it's a bad place 
    	for the race. I do believe however that Connor deserves
        a place of his choice
    
        I heard that Hawaii was a strong contender...any new 
        developments along those lines??    	

    I'm pretty sure it's a done deal. Can anyone recommend things to
    do, places to see in SAn Diego?
    
    Ed

    Re .2
    SD is not Dennis' choice. He wants Hawaii but his organization (Sail
    America) has a minority voice on the committee controlled by the SDYC.
    
    If the defense is in SD it looks like we'll see a repeat of the
    12 meter "Worlds" recently held in Sardinia. Boring!

    JR

If the Cup is in SD, then I think we will see boats designed with light
air in mind.  Tall masts, short boats, maybe no wing keels.

In light air,  a fast boat will have maximum sail area, and the smallest 
wetted area.  

Light air is less exciting, but a more demanding condition for racing.
I would worry that it will bomb on TV.  A few races will be called 
because no one finished in the time limit.

Lots of computer time will be used to try to make a boat go fast in 6 knots
of wind or even less...  

I wonder what course will be set up, and what the min. wind speed rule 
will be.. 

Time to dig up the meter rule, and see how much sail could be added
with a waterline lenght of say 20 feet...


Phil

    I don't think San Diego will be a total fiasco -- the winds
    should average around 12 knots during the time of the trials and finals.
    However, I hope the Cup won't have to stay in San Diego.
    No, I doubt we'll loose -- at least not for two or three 
    defenses -- but after 1990, it would be nice to see the 
    "venue" change.  Let Hawaii have a go, San Fransisco -- imagine
    spectating from Alcatraz -- a return to Newport, and etc.  I believe 
    we'll see things progress more and more towards a national style of 
    backing that will leverage the Cup around the country.  
    
    As for design trends, we won't see masts taller than 90
    feet -- that's the limit under the 12 meter rule as it 
    presently stands.  But given the rule changes that have occured,
    we're likely to see -- probably never actually see -- some 
    extremely exotic underbodies.  Above the waterline will likely
    change too.  I wouldn't be surprised to see someone try a wing-mast.
    
    Things to do in San Diego include Sea World, the San Diego Zoo,
    whale watching, sailing, beaching and etc.  La Joya is close
    by as well, and has some fabulous restaurants, shops, and
    etc.  You're also close enough to Mexico to take a two-day
    junket to the Baja, or wherever.

    Anyone interested in doing a charter?  Line up an 80 foot
    stink pot -- we'll carry a microVAX and simulate the races in 
    real-time!
    
    ;)

    we might see some interesting things in sails as well as those EXOTIC
    UNDERBODIES (I'm just a dirty ol'man :-))
    
    Perth showed us those spoilers on the leeward side of spinnakers. Or
    was it gennys?  I think it was Sail Magazine theat just had an article
    on an inflatable genny, essentially two membranes joined along the luff
    and roach, that allows you to change the shape of the foil. THe tough
    part of the process was designing the cloth valves that control the
    amount of air in, literally inside!, the sail. The designer is an
    Aussie who was working for North's Australian shop. He's gone back
    to board sails to perfect his design for a mass market but i'll
    be surprised if we've heard the last of inflatable gennys.
    
    Ed
     
    

    INFLATABLE GENNYS!??!
    

    > Time to dig up the meter rule, and see how much sail could <
    > be added with a waterline lenght (sic) of 20 feet          <
    
    An interesting point, but there is a minimum waterline length (
    I think it's about 45 feet ) for Americas Cup boats, which
    restricts designers a bit. This is not part of the meter rule
    but is in the Deed of Gift.
    
    A writer in a British Yottie Magazine speculated that a syndicate
    could build a faster 12 by reducing the waterline length below
    the minumum. This could not compete in the AC but would probably
    win a world championship held in light airs very easily. This
    would have the effect of gaining prestige for the syndicate and
    therefore attracting more sponsorship, etc.
    
    P.S. Did you know that when the schooner America won the cup
         originally, it missed out one of the marks in the course.
    	 I'm glad the didn't create a precedent !!!
    
    

    I don't think "America" missed a mark.  Rather,
    she elected to take advantage of an ommission
    in the racing rules.  I believe one or two
    Brittish boats followed suit.

RE: .8 --

>    INFLATABLE GENNYS!??!     <

Imagine the inevitable design trend *that* (along with other increasingly 
fashionable design ideas) would start.

(Turn to 1992:)
"Mayday!  Mayday!  Coast Guard, this is the yacht 'Uptadate'.  Our genny 
is flat.  We are disabled and need a tow.  The boat is a Presumptuous 46,
teal hull, taupe deck and cabin, with a sort of pale mauve wingmast.  If 
you could bring out a new genny valve, and a tank of Hood Genny-aire...."

Not to be too cynical, of course.
                                  J.

    
    Hawaii would have been a much better choice.  The weather is always
    nice, the trade winds blow consistently and the time difference
    would have put the races in "prime time" tv on the east coast. 
    I'm sure the networks weren't ready to gamble and pay big bucks
    for tv rights hoping that sailing would be competitive vrs. other
    shows in that time slot.

    Besides, I'd rather go to the Islands!  :)
    
    Tom--

The trouble with the America's Cup is that it is boring ......

Now, if the TV people would broadcast live coverage of the next Whitbread
race, we could see sailing at its most exciting and dangerous best. We 
could see real men and women struggling against a real ocean, not 
against some wimpy little 12 kt breeze and a one foot chop. Heck, I've
sailed in those conditions, and exciting and interesting it isn't. 

Imagine seeing, live and in color:

  An 80' maxi surfing (and broaching) at over 20 kts in a gale with the 
  spinnaker set.

  A crewman resewing a mainsail seam with the main set as the boat 
  booms along in a big sea.

  The crew struggling to change a genoa to a storm jib in a Southern Ocean
  storm with 50' seas. 

  The crew rebuilding the hull in midrace.

  The crew cutting away a broken mast and jury rigging something to 
  them to the next port before the beer is gone.

Now, folks, that would be interesting! 

    re .13
    
    The AC in Perth wasn't totally boring. How can I justify staying
    up to watch boring stuff!! :-) The AC in Newport and probably San
    Diego as well, is boring. Although being in the Spectator fleet
    on the reaching legs is hair-raising. ;-)
    
    But more importantly!! Why is there no TV of the Whitbread!!?? Don't
    the French networks do telecasts of the race? Maybe live broadcasts
    can't be done because it would be virtually impossible to keep a
    satellite link up from an 80' Maxi surfing at 20 knots? Alan's right
    though, that would be GOOOOOOD tube.     
    
    Ed-who'll-tape-anything
                                
    

    
    	RE:.13
    	Alan...sounds good how could we film such exciting races?
        ....follow them around in what? Battleships?
    
    	I remember seeing a film of Chichester going around the
    	Horn. The pictures, as I remember, were taken from an
    	Aircraft Carrier...50' seas in an angry mood..real stormy
    	and, for me, kinda frightning. 
    
    	I was a contract engineer in Bremerton some years back
    	for Puget Sound Shipyard. We used to go out in the No.
    	Pacific for sea trials. I learned to RESPECT the oceans.
    	...and those were mild storms too.
    

According to an article in yesterday's Boston Globe, the New York
Sumpreme Court has upheld New Zealand's America's Cup challenge. This
means that, barring a reversal on appeal to a higher court, the next
America's Cup races will be sailed next summer in boats with 90'
waterlines, 130' masts, and crews of 30 or so.  Ta da, racing in J-boats
again! This should be fun. 

By the way, the Kiwis estimate that this challenge will cost them maybe
$7 million. Dennis Connor, et al, were talking about raising $130
million (!) for the 1991 defense in 12 meter boats. If you think $130
million is ridiculous, the Japanese challenger is talking $150 million. 

    Sounds like we will beat you this time.....
    
    Our chappie has already got a campaign boat that he spends his weekends
    on wining and dining people who might have more money than sense.
    
    This campaign boat, instead of being a nice steady motor boat/yacht
    happens to be a converted (i.e. it has a cabin big enough for a
    grand piano) J-class yacht......
    
     

    re .16
    
    Didn't see the article, but I did watch ESPN Sports Center
    last night, and they confirmed that indeed, the court upheld
    the KIWI challenge, and San Diego has accepted.  Whether or
    not the race actually happens is another question.  San Diego
    does not want to disrupt the "routine" Cup defense scenario,
    so they have refused to accept any other challenge within 
    the context of defending next year.  It seems their plan is
    make the KIWIs look like spoilers.  
    
    Certainly, this turn of events is an unfortunate disruption
    for a sport that was just gaining public interest.  Yes, it
    would be exciting to see 120 foot maxi boats, but I have to 
    believe that Kevin Fay is merely trying to catch the US with its 
    pants down -- snitching the Cup with its attendent rewards -- by port 
    tacking all other considerations of sportmanship.  STARBOARD!

Sounds to me like the Kiwis are simply playing by the rules set forth in
the Deed of Gift and that the San Diego YC is trying to change the 
rules.

    I have heard that one before..... 
    
    I thought that was one of the definitions of the New York YC.... that
    they would change the rules to favour the locals as and when they
    wanted to...... 
    
    Are the San Diego YC people the same??, or do they just play by the
    same rules???

    re Alan, .19
    
    San Diego is abiding by the rules -- they have accepted the
    challenge.  
    
    Recent evolution of Cup competition has set some good precedents -- 
    nothing written down -- but tacit protocol, and it's bad form to 
    disrupt it.  The situation is much like deliberately starboard 
    tacking a bare-headed competitor before the 10 minute gun. 

Sure, the San Diego YC is playing by the rules -- after the courts have
told them that they have to. That doesn't win them any praise from me. 
Now if San Diego had accepted the New Zealand challenge when it was first 
made some months ago .......

    Would you so decry the KIWIs if the 
    situation were reversed?

Sure. If a player's conduct is allowed by the written rules of the game, 
then the player should not be accused of unsportsmanlike behavior. While 
the rules allow the San Diego YC to limit the challenge to one country, 
that is contrary to the unwritten rules (which you assert New Zealand 
isn't abiding to). The judges have ruled, and now New Zealand and San 
Diego should start building the boats. Maybe the next defense will be in 
Auckland. 

    According to the written rules, neither side is out
    of bounds; according to the unwritten rules, both
    sides are.  Is one side more justified than the other?
    Put another way, I'm the guy in the bare-headed boat,
    and you come after me on starboard before the ten minute gun.
    I can't maneuver -- I'm not ready to maneuver.  We protest each
    other.  What would the race committee decide?  If you know the 
    rules, you know the answer.
    
    Perhaps that's one of the problems here -- the "race committee"
    wasn't called in.  This issue would be better settled by the
    IYRU, not some land-bound court in the state whose name
    so closely resembles that of the aristocratic chancre from
    which the Cup was so recently liberated.
    
    At any rate, my only real point was that these circumstances seem 
    unfortunate for the CUP, as it may rob the competition of prestige,
    as well as public interest.  In turn, this could blunt the growing
    enthusiasm for competitive sailing in general, which I think would
    be unfortunate.  
    
    Maybe not.

    > Maybe the next defense will be in Auckland.       
    
    But where is this defence going to be ?
    
    If SDYC are playing by the rules, they don't have to announce the
    venue until 90 days before the defence starts, so they could test
    their boat out and if it performs badly in light winds, hold the
    defence in Hawaii, if the opposite, hold it in SD.
    
    However, what do they test their boat against ?
    

    Almost definately will be in Auckland.....
    
    Last time the Kiwi's and Plastic Fantastic came from nowhere to
    almost beating the best of the world in under four years. N.Z. have
    not challenged before, they just designed a boat, and sailed it....
    
    America has had a number of years (decades) of designing 12-metres,
    and they still only just managed to beat them. Now the two (?) countries
    are starting level..... Who will get there first ......
    
    
    Or was it those on board microVAXes??

    
    I read in a national ( UK ) paper yesterday morning that the San
    Diego YC have decided to have the cup in HAwaii and they're planning
    on building a 90 foot waterline CATAMARAN to take on the Kiwis with
    . A 90 foot mono will be pacy , but a 90 foot multi - hull in strong
    winds is going to absolutely blow the pants of the kiwis boat .
    
    Apparently the Kiwis are completly freaked out , and are saying
    that the CUP deeds talk in terms of a 'vessel' which imlies a 
    single hull .
    
    Looks like back to the courtrooms ... 
    
    All excellent stuff , its going to be a super radical competition
    .
    
    Dave

	Please excuse my ignorance here, but can some one explain what the issue
is here.  Most of the last 10 responders obviously have a knowledge of rules and
politics which may not be public knowledge (or maybe I am just ignorant, more
likely!).  Why can New Zealand define the types of boat to be used?  What has
happened to 12 meter racing?  Why do they want to change at all?  Does not the
defender have some rights to define the context of the race?  I am very
confused!

chris.

    All this ties into the rules set forth in a deed of gift for the
    'Cup when it left England.
    
    I dont think the authors planned on it having significance for
    anyone other than a few yachties.
    
    The type boat used to challange for and defend the 'Cup were not
    specified in the deed, but left up to the challenger.
    
    When J-boats became way to expensive (or the number of really
    rich benefactors declined) to race, the challengers and and defender
    agreed to use the 12-meter rule for yacht of choice. That has
    been the way it has been for some time although I dont know what
    agreements were actually drawn up or how binding they were.
    
    The 12-meter class has been helped by the America's Cup competition,
    but there has always been a lot of grumbling from the racers about
    the boats themselves (heavy, slow...).  Maybe it is time for a change
    (from a spectator standpoint wouldnt it be more exciting to watch
    maxi's , J-boats, or sailing hydrofoils ?).
    
    Walt 

>    Why can New Zealand define the types of boat to be used?  What has
>    happened to 12 meter racing? 

    Thats the way its always been. The challengers define what boats
    the challenge is to be in. The 12 meter bit was just considered
    to be a good thing for challengers and defenders alike, but was
    never written in to the rules.
    
>   Why do they want to change at all? 
    
    'they' being the kiwis, no-one else wants to change. Why ? - Partly
    a publicity gimmick, partly Michael Fay getting fed up with the
    Americans putting politics & commercialism before sailing and giving
    them a kick up the A***.
    
>   Does not the defender have some rights to define the context of the
    race?  
    
    Yes, but not specifying the venue until 90 days before hand is hardly
    very fair, is it?
    
>   I am very confused
    
    Aren't we all.  Some people think that 90 footers will be a good
    thing, others not, but there seems absolutly no point in holding
    the event if both sides aren't playing the same game. 
    

    There is evidently an article in Yachting 
    that outlines what a 90 ft waterline maxi would look
    like -- 125 or so overall, 6,000 sq ft mainsail, 30
    crew, bicycle driven winches, and etc.  Would be
    magnificent -- out of a dream -- but far more costly
    than the 7 mil the Kiwis project.  An average maxi
    runs between 1.5 and 3 mil -- sails and electronics included --
    and they don't get cheaper per foot as they grow.  
    Add the staggering costs of campaigning, multiply that by 
    the intensity of preparing for the Cup, and I bet a 1 boat 
    challenge or defense will run 25 mil, minimum.  They could certainly 
    spend more -- if they had the time -- but I doubt they'll spend 
    less.  I wonder if anyone will be interested in coughing up the 
    ante this soon after the Fremantle regatta.  On the other hand,
    there are several big CATs already around that would probably
    suit SDYC's purposes rather nicely.  ;)
    
    As for 12s being slow and old fashioned, I think the beauty
    of a 12 lies in moving volume -- a more elegant problem
    than maximizing speed for a given length.  It would be too bad
    to abandon the problem -- especialy now that 12s have entered a new
    era of development.

    Yesterday's Globe explains that SDYC is evaluating
    3 design concepts -- an ultra-light monohull, a
    catamaran, and a hydrofoil.  The last must be purely
    hype.
    
    Although a catamaran would have a higher theoretical top
    speed, I think the mono might actually be better.  Wouldn't it
    have better speed made good to windward, as well as 
    manueverability?  These would have to count as big advantages
    on a triangular course.  SDYC also staunchly refuses to
    accept other challenges -- they "want Fay."  
    
    Does anyone know if DEC is going to be a sponsor?

    There is a proposal in right now for dec to sponsor Sail America
    to the tune of $4.5 mil over 3 years.  The scuttlebutt is that Jack
    Shields supports the proposal and that it will be brought to 
    Executive Committee.  Lots of perks go along with it.  Maybe
    can get a new job code started, e.g. F-492, Corporate Yacht Rigger.
    
    Encore un ete

>    catamaran, and a hydrofoil.  The last must be purely
>    hype.

    I have no reason to doubt they are looking at hydrofoils.
    There are many sailing hydros now.  I'm not sure its obviously
    the fastest, but since its all computer modeling at this point,
    I don't doubt it being taken seriously.

    --gerry bell
    

>    Although a catamaran would have a higher theoretical top
>    speed, I think the mono might actually be better.  Wouldn't it
>    have better speed made good to windward, as well as 
>    manueverability?  These would have to count as big advantages
>    on a triangular course.  

Key factors would include average windspeed and course design.  Higher 
windspeeds would allow a multihull (I'll leave the hydrofoil for the 
dreamers to contemplate) to overcome low-speed wetted surface and
wave-making resistances and go substantially faster than even a monster 
monohull, and at a less stratospheric cost per knot, too.  A good multi
(tris even more than cats) will go to windward remarkably well, enough
to surprise the average Hobie sailor, fer sher. 

And can't the defending team control the course design to some degree? 
(Didn't the Aussies add more windward/leeward legs than had been used
before?)  A course could be designed to favor one particular type of boat
over another.  Even excluding the obvious beating/reaching/running
trade-offs, longer legs probably favor multis over monos, whereas shorter
legs requiring more maneuvering favor monos over multis.  (Reduced to the
absurd, a Tech dinghy could probably beat a 70' cat on a course with 100'
legs in the right wind!) 

John.

    Todays Daily Telegraph in UK, says that the SDYC have promised to
    return to 12 meters when ( if ? ) they have disposed of the Kiwis,
    and there are proposals to change the deed of gift to prevent surprise
    challenges. The Kiwis have made no such assurances.
    
    If people want to match ( or even fleet !! ) race 90ft wl boats,
    then lets draw up a rule, somebody ( Fay ? ) put up a trophy, and
    off we go. What is going on over the Americas Cup at the moment
    is just plain silly.

    Maybe time for a kiwi point of view!
    
    I think Micheal Fay decided to challenge in a big boat under the
    deed of gift that says the challenger has the right to challenge
    no sooner than ten months after the previous race and that a challenger
    must specify the water line length of the yacht he stated the maximum
    as if had said in 12 metre boats the u.s. could have built a bigger
    one and blown him away.
    
     The  decision was brought about by the in fighting between thre
    SDYC and Sail America over the venue for the next cup.Another reason
    is that to campain a 12 metre over the projcted regatta length and
    the increased complexity of the new rule allowing moving underwater
    appendages and with lack of an aerospace industry in N.Z. we wouldn't have
    been competative.
    
     Micheal Fay has also said that he will sail off against anyone
    interested in competing in this the event,last friday he attended
    a meeting in New York with representatives of England (peter de
    savary Blue Arrow Synd.) allan bond from Australia (He's real keen
    to have a go) Japan,canada,french.He is meeting the officals of
    SDYC today or tomorrow to futher discuss details.
    
    I believe the 12 metres became the norm as NYYC stated during their
    defences of the cup that should they sucessfully defend it that
    in 4 years time they would again run the defence in 12 metre boats
    at newport when SDYC didn't do this
    
    Work has started on the Kiwi boat to known as New Zealand One it's
    designed by Bruce Farr,Sails by Tom S the local Norths sailmaker
    and also sailmaker for allan bond's Australia 2.The boat is a monohull
    of 90ft waterline 123ft L.O.A. 145ft mast,the boat is built out
    of exotics and is almost ready to be turned over,Micheal Fay has
    also stated that he will definitly be sailing aboard the yacht in
    some capacity making coffees,mixing the drinks or general ballast.
    
     

    One of the main reasons for going to 12 meter for 1958 (?) defense
    was to reduce the cost of the boats. Defenses in the 20s and 30s
    had been in J boats, which were so expensive that there was little
    interest in the 50s. Clearly, cost is not the same issue now as
    it was 30 years ago, with the project figures for new 12 development.
    Why not go for a big boat again? In fact, the cost would probably
    be LESS than for a competitive 12, because the main money in 12
    development these days is in searching for that magic 1/10 knot
    within a rating envelope which is well understood. A new class might
    have a bit of latitude for a few tries. Costs might be less as burning
    simulation dollars might not be as important (of course, that doesn't
    mean they won't be spent).
    
    Actually, with the recent furor over Marchaj's Seaworthiness book
    and the CCA's recommendations, it would be neat to see a cup defense
    which produces seaworthy boats rather than ones which do well against
    a rule. Not that I'm holding my breath. But my ideal race would
    be 3 races in SD, sail to Hawaii, hold 3 more...
    
    Ross Faneuf
    

    re .38
    
    The boat is almost complete!?!  Sounds like this was a Kiwi
    back-up plan regardless of who won the Cup -- save the Kiwis
    themselves.  You've got a tremendous jump on everyone!  And if Fay 
    can bring in some other syndicates to tune up against -- amazing!  But 
    I don't think you're fair in asserting that SDYC would have departed 
    from 12s anyway.  They would not have.  They will, however, build a 
    very fast boat -- probably a Cat -- and define a course to favor it.  
    Good luck.
    

    Unless someone beats me to the .41 slot, I'll have two
    notes in a row.  My appologies, but this is something
    I'd really like to add, and hopefully get some feedback:
    
    I'd like to suggest that 12 meters are by far and away the 
    best suited weapon to use in America's Cup racing.  It is because
    the 12 meter rule is restrictive that races are competitive.  For
    instance, take the argument that sailing skill plays an ever
    diminishing role in the ultimate success of a campaign.
    That's rediculous.  Sailing skill is emphasized when the 
    competition is between relatively equal boats.  Maybe it wasn't
    intentional, but the rule has evolved to emphasize sailing skill,
    and this past Cup regatta was a consumate example.  If you swapped 
    skippers and crew amongst the top 3 boats, you'd see the skippers 
    and crew triumph more often than the boats.  Of course, that's
    speculation, but don't some of you agree?    
 
    It has taken decades for the class to evolve to this
    point.  To replace 12s with a no holds barred approach will wipe
    out this parity.  We'll get blow outs -- triumphs of pure technology.
    Period.  The sport will loose depth, and interest will wain.  
    That's when we'll start putting some rules in place to even the 
    field -- and it will be the evolution of the 12 meter rule all over again.
        
    There are already plenty of sailing contests intended to explore
    high speed designs.  These contests aren't nearly 
    as publisized as the America's Cup, but they exist.  
    It will do nothing for the Cup to turn it into one of them; that 
    will only confuse matters and destroy the Cup's identity.  In the long 
    run, strong Cup competition in a fixed class will do far more to 
    promote sailing excellence -- the entire spectrum -- than by robbing
    the Cup of the 12 meter stage to parade design wizardry.  The 12 
    meter rule is an excellent class, and the allure of 12 meters has 
    made a tremendous contribution to popularizing the Cup.  I would say 
    we've got a mature concept -- not a dinosaur.  Why jump ship?

    But as noted a few notes previously, if people want to race in 
    super-maxis, then start it up.  Michael Fay, why not start the Kiwi Cup?

>< Note 636.41 by DELNI::FACHON >
>                           -< A contest, or a rout? >-
>
>    I'd like to suggest that 12 meters are by far and away the 
>    best suited weapon to use in America's Cup racing.  It is because
>    the 12 meter rule is restrictive that races are competitive.  For
>    instance, take the argument that sailing skill plays an ever
>    diminishing role in the ultimate success of a campaign.
>    That's rediculous.  Sailing skill is emphasized when the 
>    competition is between relatively equal boats.  Maybe it wasn't
>    intentional, but the rule has evolved to emphasize sailing skill,
>    and this past Cup regatta was a consumate example.  If you swapped 
>    skippers and crew amongst the top 3 boats, you'd see the skippers 
>    and crew triumph more often than the boats.  Of course, that's
>    speculation, but don't some of you agree?    

    I strongly  disagree.  I believe that the 12s between Intrepid and
    Austalia II were relatively equal, but Intrepid was a real advance
    over  the  boats  that  preceeded her, and A 2 was a breakthrough.
    There  is no question that A2 was faster than any previous 12, and
    almost  no  question  that Dennis Conner was the better skipper in
    83.  It  is  amazing that he managed to even make it close against
    such a fast boat.

    As for  87,  I'm  convinced that Stars and Stripes was the fastest
    boat  by  a fair margin. Even if you're not convinced that she was
    sandbagging  (and  there  is  some film showing them intentionally
    mis-trimming  the  main), her tactics were those of a faster boat.
    She avoided pre-start maneuvers and often simply sailed higher and
    faster  than  her  opponents. This might be due to better sails or
    sail  trimming,  but  I  think  the difference was more than could
    reasonably  be accounted for by sails. The S+S road show mentioned
    that they were convinced that they had a faster boat.

    Twelves are  a  reasonable choice because they allow some room for
    the  designers to create new shapes, while restricting them enough
    to  make it interesting. If you really want to test only the crew,
    go  to  a  one-design.  There  are  several match racing series in
    one-design  35  ft. boats (A famous one is the Congressional Cup.)
    It  is  interesting  to  note  that the winners ofthese one design
    match racing are often not even close to competitive in 12 meters.

    re .42
    
    I agree with much of your argument that there have been evolutionary
    breakthroughs which have rendered prior 12s obsolete.  That
    possibility does add spice to the design game.  I also agree
    that for the conditions she was designed for, S&S was the
    fastest 12 in Fremantle -- but not by a breakthrough margin.
    The S&S "breakthrough" came in using game theory to develop a
    pervasive program strategy:  The entire program -- not just 
    the boat -- was an excersise in probability.  At least, that's the 
    impression I got from the "road show."  If "Sail America" had done 
    everything else exactly the same, but campaigned "Kiwi Magic,"
    I'm convinced they still would have won, only the scores would have 
    been closer.  K3 is a toss-up.
    
    In any sort of competition, it's difficult to separte the hype from
    the misdirection from the facts from the fodder.  I'm aware of the
    alleged "sandbagging" by S&S.  Dennis Connor is well known for
    the ploy.  And when they say they weren't sandbagging, the statement
    itself is probably sandbagging, so I don't buy it.  I've
    based my opinion on what I saw during the races, and I believe I
    saw a boat whose superiority was marginal accross the boards, 
    and whose sailors were honed to an overwhelming excellence.  "Higher 
    and faster," in the words of Tom Whidden, and as echoed by Gary
    Jobson, has every bit as much to do with being on the right side of 
    the course, having Dennis Connor at the helm, and pumping the main
    as it does with having a "superior" boat.  And what about the races 
    where S&S was clearly not at her best?  I don't think Whidden missed 
    a shift. 
        
    You yourself expressed the view that A2 was much faster than "Liberty," and 
    that you were amazed DC did as well as he did.  In fact, "Liberty"
    did as well as she did was because her performance was not so far
    off the money as to A2 out of striking distance of a superior
    Dennis Connor and company.  And they haven't gotten worse,
    so I don't think it's unreasonable to speculate that they would still 
    have prevailed in Fremantle, even if they'd been sailing "Kiwi
    Magic," which I'm sure you'll agree was a much closer match for
    S&S than "Liberty" was for A2. 

    In any event, do you think a departure from 12s will reconsile
    or worsen discrepancies in design?
    

    It's not that evolutionary breakthroughs have rendered 12s obsolete;
    if that's the rule the cup is raced under, they are by definition
    not obsolete. But 12 design is now exceedingly refined. They only
    way to produce winning boats in most cases is to either take a chance
    on a gadget (like the winged keel or the oddities that showed up
    last year), or spend huge amounts of $ to seek out the next refinement.
    
    After all finding 1/10 knot is a big deal; that's about 2/10 of
    a mile over the course of a race; 1200 feet tends to look like a
    big margin when you see boats cross the line.
    
    I certainly agree about the importance of crew training and skipper
    quality. But those fractions of a knot are also REAL important.
    That's why I'd be interested in a change of rule; clearly $ no longer
    makes 12s attractive since they are so expensive due to the high
    cost of added refinement. A new class might produce winners which
    did not require many megabucks up front; design brilliance would
    have more opportunity.
    
    Besides which, I find the search for better gadgets to make 12s
    go fast disturbing. In my view, the winged keel is a disaster. As
    usual, racing success has made it a glamorous option for cruising
    boats. There, its only virtue is that you can design a boat with
    reduced draft which points as well as the deeper draft cousin. But
    this may be a poor option for cruisers; that boat will have reduced
    lateral plane and thus poorer seakeeping qualities (c.f. Tony Marchaj
    on the effect of lateral plane on stability in a seaway). Many of
    these boats have too little lateral plane as it is, and here's an
    excuse to reduce it still more...
    
    I fear the same effect from other gadgets. If someone wins the cup
    with a boat with three keels and four rudders, sure as heck some
    semi go-fast cruiser will be out with the same configuration regardless
    of whether its manageable or seaworthy.
    
    Ross Faneuf
    

    re .44, 45
    
    Whatever rule -- or lack thereof -- under which the Cup is raced,
    there will always be frenetic design activity.  To me, when that
    activity is focussed on getting 1/10th of a knot, the results
    represent an approrpriate portion of the impact the
    design should have on the outcome of the Cup.  No one factor
    should be able to overcome the combined excellence of the others -- factors
    being hull shape, sail shape, tactics, sailhandling, weather forecasting,
    helmsmanship, preparation, and etc.  The 12 rule has evolved to a
    point where I believe there is a fairly close parity amongst these 
    factors, and so each is well developed and the competition is very good.  
    
    One thing I can't figure is why any competitive sailor would complain
    about 12's being slow.  For me, the excitement of racing
    has everything to to with the proximity of my oponent, and whether
    I'm sailing a Hobie 16 or a J35 makes no difference at all.  In
    around the buoys racing, I like close competition -- and winning ;) -- 
    MUCH more than doing a horizon job.  Besides that, tell me its
    boring to go 8.5 knots at 30 degrees true to the wind!!
    12s are fast enough to look pretty smart as they get where they're
    going; they're manueverable enough to allow close in-fighting;
    they're seaworthy enough to sail off Fremantle; and they're getting
    popular as all hell.
    
    As for the current 12 designs being "gimics," not really -- although
    I'm a bit leary of what the latest rule changes might conjure up --
    but even a turbo-charger is a gimic if you try to sell one on a Chevette.
    Yes, an inverted keel with a wing has inherently less directional
    stability, and a designer has to carefully weigh the trade-offs
    versus the purpose of the design, but unfortunately, wing keels are
    somewhat trendy, and the temptation to use one may not stem from
    sound nautical reasoning.  But for some applications a wing or a 
    derivative of a wing is worthwhile, although I agree that a grassy
    wing wouldn't do much good.
    
    One thing that particularly interests me about 12 design is the
    thinking that's gone into distributing volume throughout the hull.  
    In this area, I think cruising boats have A LOT to gain from what's 
    being learned in the 12s.  Imagine a 45 foot S&S hull with a Scheel 
    Keel and an off-shore interior.  I'd wet my pants!

1.  Well, my slightly cynical view is that no matter what boat is raced, 
syndicates will try to raise and spend:  a) more money than the other 
side, and/or b) every penny they think they possibly can.  Given the
budgets being bandied about for the upcoming Cup defense, it's hard to
imagine needing to spend, say, double that amount for a J-boat as for a
12, at least at this early point in modern J-boat development.  Sure, the
boats cost more, but even at perhaps as much as 10 times the cost per copy
to build, most of the cash goes to design, testing, and logistics.  Many
rich people today could afford to buy a 12, even sail it.  But only a
small handful in the entire country could afford to campaign it
competitively, even if they were so inclined. 

2.  Besides, there's an inherent contradiction in America's Cup racing. 
We've been on a course leading towards equality of design, support, and
tactics.  On one hand, one can argue that we're getting closer to creating
a toss-up rather than measure of skill (whether at the design process or
sailing). On the other hand, we can focus on each group's skill at
developing good ideas and learning fast by changing the rules regularly
(boat-type, as a most obvious example).  Or on the third hand, why not
make it strict one-design, and let it be a test of crews alone?  As it is
now, we don't know for sure what's most valuable in achieving success, so
we have to chase everything, which perpetuates not knowing in detail what
contributes how much to what (so sayeth the Cynic again.)  Will this all 
be as interesting when the results are as random (and unattributable) as 
the World Series winner?

3.  The cost per extra 1.0 kt or 0.1 kt is likely similar, and far more 
dependent on the level of development within a given rule.  If, as Ross 
says, .2 kt difference means 1200' at the finish, then eventually they'll 
be fighting just as hard for .02 kt, and then .002 kt -- who'd want to 
argue with even a mere 12' advantage?  It just might win a race for you....

4.  Argument in favor of J-boats for all future Cup races:  Think of the 
TV coverage you'll see on ESPN!  A dozen cameras focused on 30 madmen as 
trained and coordinated as any team in sports (but larger), watching a
5000 sq ft genoa come down, speed on a reach approaching (and surpassing?!?) 
20 kts....  Now *that's* a way to make sailing look pretty exciting to 
almost anyone.

Maybe we're approaching the time to set up another notesfile,
SAILING_SOAPBOX.NOT. 
                       ;-),  John.

    re .47
    
    Regarding changing the rules to keep the game sharp, a constant
    rotation of venue would do this -- at least until we'd sampled a
    representative spectrum of wind and sea conditions.  Certainly,
    it's a given that Fremantle 12s will be dogs in Diego, but then,
    perhaps Diego 12s will just be the next generation of Newport 12s.
    
    Several notes back -- in the teens I think -- I suggested that the 
    style of future defenses might leverage the Cup around the country:
    There may be some impetus in that direction, as the January "Yachting"
    has an article which talks about the curent shortage of defense
    syndiactes -- prospectives figure Dennis will do the job.  A suggested 
    method to solve this is to let the defending synidicate take the Cup 
    home -- if indeed they defend.  That's some pretty serious incentive, 
    and I'm willing to bet that's how things go -- if we get through
    next summer.  

    According to a friend who knows Gary Mull, Sail
    America is building a 119 ft trimaran, and the races
    will be held in the weeds in late August.

    Where ??  My paper says "in the rough water of Santa Cruz". What
    are the conditions like there ?

    Sata Cruz is just south of San Fransisco.  Heavy sea
    swell and generally more breeze than San Diego.  
    However, a friend from SAIC said he heard that Hawaii was again
    a possibility.  Who knows.  Seems Sail America will keep the 
    world guessing -- and the Kiwis -- for as long as possible.  
    
    Anyone heard anything different?

    Reading the Cup Watch section of the most recent SAIL brought a
    thought to mind.
    
    It appears the challenger is permitted to inform the defender what
    kind of boat he intends to bring, and the defender can pick the
    venue.
    
    I think that SDYC should inform New Zealand about a month before
    the race that the venue is a short .1mi course layed out on an area
    which only gets 2' deep at high water, and that SDYC will defend
    in a Hobie cat or wind surfer.
    
    Walt
    
   

re -.1:

As the SAIL article mentioned, Sail America and the SDYC have already 
lost much goodwill in their handling of the New Zealand challenge. 
They would be well advised to begin behaving like responsible adults. 

One of the arguments the SDYC used in court was that New Zealand hadn't
completed its boat and therefore couldn't properly challange. Er, wasn't
Stars and Stripes designed and built long after the SDYC challenged the
Australians? Another argument the SDYC has put forth is that allowing
racing in boats with 90' waterlines makes the racing too expensive
except for the very rich. Oh really? Sail America's budget is reported
to be over $100 million for the 1991 defense. Logic and fair play are
apparently unheard of at the SDYC.

    I find it impossible to place any greater degree of blame on the
    SDYC and/or Sail America than Fay's New Zealand challenge. 
    
    Neither has a surplus of sportsmanship to wrap themselves in.
     
    Sail America didn't have to have a boat built (although they in
    fact had one or more) when they challenged because they were responding
    to conditions set by the Aussies. i.e. Bond's syndicate had set the
    T&C's of the defense when they stated back in Newport that they
    would defend in 12 meters, in Perth, in 1987. SDYC screwed around
    trying to select a site which inadvertently caused them to not announce
    the terms of a defense. That's the opening Fay needed to name the
    boat size.
    
    No way can Fay's actions be justified simply by saying he's following
    the rules unless you also want to justify SDYC's position for following
    the rules too. Fay didn't do this to give the other challengers a better
    chance at the Cup. He did it because it gave HIM the best chance at a
    successful challenge and a lock on the financial benefits that would
    accrue by hosting a defense. Hardly because he was a responsible
    adult.
    
    In terms of including Sail America in this discussion you have to
    remember that they are simply interested bystanders. While it
    would be naive to think that they are totally disconnected from
    the SDYC, they still have to win the right to represent the SDYC
    from other US syndicates. Blackaller, Melges, or any number of others
    could still put together a syndicate and eliminate Dennis early
    on.
    
    I'm not sure, is it known if SDYC will hold defense eliminations
    in the big boats or only if and when the 12's race for the Cup? In the
    event that this 90' charade continues will they just commission
    someone (S. A. maybe?) to build one 'guaranteed' winner cat, get this
    race out of the way and proceed as before.
    
    J_R

    RE: 52   Hey Walt, I love it, Hobies in 15 inches of water. they
    only need 10, so you could get your rudders at least 1/3 of the
    way down. the downwind legs would be fine, but got upwind is going
    to be decided by who has the biggest ape at the tiller to control
    the excessive weather helm!! 8>)  Or better yet, how about racing
    in a Navy gunnery range? Boy that would sure add to the excitment
    eh?
    
       Instead of wasting all that money and computer analysis on boats,
    why not just bench race? You could put all the normal 12 meter 32
    bit machines on a wharf at the computer museum in boston. BASICly
    you queue everyone's FLOATING point ACCELLATOR up for the start.
    Everyone would run the same software LOOP until the competitors
    CRASHED.  This would save a lot of time in the sail lofts (i.e.
    we can all get our gear on time because real customers would again
    be #1), and the courts would not have to listen to a bunch of 
    wealthy crybabies.
    
       This saga is starting to sound like the NFL strike. Two groups
    of fools trying to prove the pointless. And in doing so, they have
    taken the sport from world class to the pits. I just wish they would
    race the same darn boats. If they want multihulls, tell to race
    the little America's Cup. I only hope these bozos turn off the general
    public so that the demand for moorings slows down. 

The Supreme Court of New York held that the SDYC "has failed to ...
justify making truly radical and fundamental changes in the deed ...
Many of the customs that San Diego seeks to have formalized into the
deed through interpretation or amendment were adopted under the
mutual-consent provision ... In the face of a properly tendered
challenge, SDYC, having accepted the Cup pursuant to the terms of the
deed, may either accept the challenge, forfeit the Cup, or negotiate
agreeable terms with the challenger ... MBBC has tendered a valid
challenge, and SDYC must treat it as such in accordance with the terms
of the deed." 

Whatever one's view of the propriety of New Zealand challenge, the 
challenge is within the terms of the Deed of Gift of the America's Cup.

    It took decades for the America's Cup to mature into a 
    world class event.  When we lost the Cup in '83, it was sad, 
    but it was fair; it marked the Cup's arrival.  Now, regardless 
    of name calling and court rulings, the '88 America's Cup will 
    be anything but fair.  Just like the good old days.

    re: .56
    
    Yes, exactly, and now what is wrong with SDYC exercising their rights
    under the same Deed and chosing the site?
     

    re: .58
    
>>    Yes, exactly, and now what is wrong with SDYC exercising their rights
>>    under the same Deed and chosing the site?
     
Nothing. But the SDYC can't have it both ways. Probably nothing in the
Deed says that the races must be sailed in deep water over long courses
in monohulls, but they always have been. For the SDYC to argue that
(recent) past races have been sailed in 12 Meters and that therefore the
next races should be sailed in 12 Meters is to argue that custom should
prevail. But custom also requires that the races be sailed over long
courses in deep water in monohulls. To do otherwise would be contrary to
custom, and the SDYC says that custom should be followed. Or should 
custom be followed only when it is to the advantage of the SDYC?

    I feel that the previous noters have missed a point.
    
    The SDYC ( & the majority of others ) would like to see the Americas
    cup raced in 12 metres with Defence & Challenge elimination series.
    
    Faced with a blatently unfair challenge ( The Kiwis had designed
    and started building their Monster before telling the SDYC they
    have got 9 months to arrange a defence ) they decided the only way
    to return to normality ( having failed in the courts ) is to get
    this one out of the way quickly and in such a way that they can't lose.
    
    I believe that the SDYC are not doing what they are doing for personal
    or collective glory ( which was obviously the Kiwis motive ), they
    just want to see the 12's out on the water again.
    
    By the way, when the Cup was first sailed in Britain, and for one
    or two of the early defences in the US, it was sailed between one
    boat from the challlenging nation and as many boats from the defenders
    as they could muster. Is this still the way the Deed is Written.
    
    This would allow SDYC to spread there options with , say, a 90 footer,
    a 120' Trimaran, a Hobie 18 and a Windsurfer, in case the weather
    changed.
    
    

    .52 and .55 hit the nail right on the head! The whole situation
    between Fay and the SDYC has become so peurile that there is no
    further interest for me at least.  The prospect of the Olympics
    and their 470's, Finn's etc. is *infinitely* more exciting than
    this farce.
    
    Brian

    ...if I used some of the comments we've made
    concerning the current America's Cup debacle in 
    an article I'd like to submit to "Sail" magazine?  
    So far, I haven't read any accounts of public opinion, 
    but I think many of our comments would be interesting
    to other sailors. 
    
    This isn't to say I'm definitely going to write the
    article -- even if nobody objects -- but I wanted to
    ask before I got into it.  Let me know what you think.
    
    If you'd rather not reply to this file, please send me mail.
    
    Thanks,
    Dean F.
    DELNI::FACHON

	Having recently returned from San Diego....

	I was out there 21-23 Jan on business..honest..

	I was sailing during one day (on board Liberty) and I
	enjoyed it no end. We sailed (crew 1/2 duffer, 1/2 people
	who had crewed during one of various races) against 
	Star & Stripes 86.

	The following comments were heard... There will be a 90+'
	catarmaran. This was later confirmed by Saturday 23-Jan-1988
	San Diego version of L.A. Times. 
	There will likely be another boat of unspecified type. The
	general feeling that there may not be time to build a boat 
	of exactly the same type as the Kiwis. Rumour seems to indicate
	that two boats will be built, only slightly possibly a third.
	Modelling (heavy computer work, but not much else has yet has
	either been rumoured or confirmed).
	General public comments would indicate that
	Betting is either a trimaran or something more exotic...
	quite possibly a multi-step or hydrofoil. One would presume 
	that it would need Razor fronts to cut through all of the
	kelp.. but who knows. I also believe, based on the paper,
	that the race for the monster boats, as one person called them,
	Will likely NOT be in San Diego, but more likely in Long Beach 
	or possibly Hawaii. 
	   Anticipation is that presuming that the Cup is defended that 
	16 months later that things would go back to 12 metres with the
	previous challenge/defender sail-off.
	

Re: .63
	< I was sailing during one day (on board Liberty) and I
	enjoyed it no end. We sailed (crew 1/2 duffer, 1/2 people
	who had crewed during one of various races) against 
	Star & Stripes 86.
				>

	Before people ask, The Stars and Stripes '86 stays at the
	KONA KAI CLUB and RESORT (Note: there are two hotels adjacent
	owned by the same people. Make sure you get the right one.)
	(It's on Shelter Island for those familiar with the area)

	One may (as part of a party of 6) rent the vessel for $100 each
	for 2 hours. Inquire at the desk when you go in. Usually this
	is the only boat there (I think). It is the only one owned by
	the resort, at least as I write this. This is what I heard,
	I was out there on a slightly different arrangement, but I think
	that what I have stated is the "normal mode"

	Having put my two cents in on the last two notes, a question:

      1.Does the deed state that one must sail the challenging vessel 
	under her own hull, or was this just a requirement of the NYYC
	to eliminate (Canadian) skimmer hulls transported via barge etc.?

	I recall that this was at one time enforced by NYYC, and if it is
	actually in the deed, could make for an interesting voyage from
	New Zealand to the challenge venue. 
	

      2.I wonder if it is possible, even though not sporting, to build a 
	very shallow draft hull, or cat, and then lay the course close to 
	land, with some short cut legal, but not accessible by a deeper 
	draft ship.


      3.I also wonder if the course might be laid almost entirely as a
	broad reach or run, possibly giving advantage to a multi-hull?
	eg: Long Reach, Short Beat, Long Run .. Nobody says you have to
	end where you start do they? The sporting aspect, or rather lack 
	therof,mentioned in 2 would also be apparent.

re .63:

I repeat my comments of .59. If the SDYC builds anything except a 
monohull, then they are putting themselves in the ridiculous position of 
arguing that custom shall prevail when it is to their advantage that is 
should and shall not prevail when it is not to their advantage. Even if 
the SDYC wins this year, there may not be any racing in 1991. Who'll 
care? 

I, for one, am interested in racing that results in better cruising
boats and equipment for them. I am fascinated by the BOC races and the
boats and equipment that are developed for them. If a small fraction of
the money that is spent on the America's Cup was spent on designing BOC
boats, we'd have much more capable and safe cruising boats. Imagine the
enormous benefit to all sailors if many millions were spent investigating 
why boats capsize, what design features minimize the probability of 
capsize, what is the best (safest) way to cope with storm conditions, 
etc. Spending those many millions to make a heavy, slow, unseaworthy 
12 Meter boat .01 knot faster than other heavy, slow, unseaworthy 12 
Meter boats is just plain silly. 

Alan

    To say nothing of the results of spending some of those results
    on developing and manufacturing cheaper long-range communications
    gear, collision avoidance systems or better ship approach warning
    systems, global positioning systems, damage control equipment, etc.
    
    Ross Faneuf
    

    .66, .67
    
    San Diego's position is more like, "Custom shall prevail as
    long as it's in the majoritiy's interest, but if you [Kiwis]
    want to use dormant custom to our disadvantge, we'll do the
    same.  You started this, we'll do our best to finish it,
    so choose."  Ironically, SDYC offered a compromise -- see
    last Sunday's globe -- but Fay slapped it down.  And incidentally,
    lest we forget the good old NYYC, it's not as though SDYC's proposed 
    antics are without precedent.  "Custom" is a double-edged sword.
    
    As for 12s being slow, few if any monohulls of equal length
    can match a 12's speed to windward.  Period.  End of discussion.
    Off the wind 12s are slower, but off the wind racing -- save
    dead down wind -- lacks tactical dimension.  Or would someone
    like to elaborate on power reach tactics?  Whether by accident 
    or design, 12s have evolved to perform well to weather, and America's Cup
    courses have evolved to emphasize that point of sail because
    it's the best test of tactical skill.  12s have optimum speed
    for the most adverse direction.
    
    Not seaworthy?!  What do you think 12s had to be to sail off
    Gage Roads?  Granted, S&S, the Kookas, and Kiwi Magic weren't
    optimized for long ocean passages, but that's not the point
    of modern America's Cup racing.  As I mentioned way back,
    the beauty of 12 meter design is moving volume, and the lessons
    learned in the design of 12 meter hulls could go a long way 
    towards speeding the passage of sea-kindly cruisers.  I would
    have NO trouble going to sea in a hull inspired by a 12.

    About spending the money on more "pertinent research," what more
    do you want.  A vast number of modern sailing innovations owe
    "royalties" to America's Cup racing.
    
    Who'll care?  I do.  I've given a great deal of my time to
    racing -- almost joined a cup campaign -- but this calamity
    has certainly yanked the event into absurdity.

    Personally I'm glad about Michael Fay's inspirational move.  I watched
    many of the races on television and found the last America's Cup
    absolutely boring.  Two boats, usually well apart, lolling around
    for a couple of hours.
    
    The crew work helped a bit but the races were won many months
    previously when the boats were designed.  KZ7 was the fastest boat
    in lighter conditions, Dennis Conners had the fastest heavy weather
    boat and was undoutedly the best at twelve metre racing.
    
    A return to large boats will bring a welcome breath of fresh air
    to the event and return it's former spirit and granduer.  I don't
    expect the sportsmanship to improve as there's too much money involved.
    And if anyone forces a race in Multi-Hulls, we have a suprise ...
    
    BTW:  Fay Richwhite Merchant Bankers (Fay's Bank) is a client of
    Digital.  He may have used an ICL computer on KZ7 but when it comes
    to business computing he's not taking any risks.
    
    Cheers, Martin

    I fear I would be most uneasy going to sea in a 12-meter inspired
    design. For an elaborate rundown of the reasons, see C.A.Marchaj's
    "Seaworthiness, the Forgotten Factor". While 12's are not so offensive
    as some IOR boats, all share unfortunate dynamic stability properties
    brought about by an emphasis on reduced wetted surface and the ability
    to go to windward to the exclusion of other desirable properties.
    
    A major consideration of any good cruising boat is habitability
    and survivability in extreme weather conditions; both 12's and IOR's
    do not rate high in this area due to lack of emphasis/relevance
    in their intended use.
    
    Ross Faneuf
    

    .69 
    
    Another surprise?  What a siege.  Perhaps SDYC should
    forfeit the damn thing.  Fresh air?  The current debacle
    is blanketing the best breeze the America's Cup has E-V-E-R
    known.  If you don't know that, you haven't been following the
    Cup very long.  Big boats would be interesting -- although I 
    certainly don't favor them -- but not like this.
    
    .70
    
    That book sounds interesting, and I'll get it.  I'm curious, 
    however:  I know IOR boats are lousy at sea -- they're flat -- but 
    what problems are inherent in the full hull of a 12?  I
    would think that their volume distribution would be ideal for 
    load carrying, and certainly their wave motion is gentle when
    compared to an IOR boat.  The boats we saw racing off Fremantle
    moved beautifully through the sea -- especially Kiwi Magic.  
    You don't think that hull likes the ocean?  As a point of order, 
    I'd also like to remind you that one of the world's most successful 
    ocean racers, "American Eagle," is a 12.  That must say something.

    Marchaj's criticism of modern racing hulls doesn't have to do with
    how the move through the seas under racing conditions, but how they
    behave in extreme conditions at sea. To simplify a LOT, flat hulls
    with minimal lateral area are for more likely to be rolled over
    or pitchpoled in large or breaking seas than deeper, narrower hulls
    with large lateral areas. In this respect a 12 is undoubtedly more
    seaworthy than an extreme IOR boat, but is still quite likely to
    show undesirable characteristics. They are not particularly wide
    and flat, but they do have reduced lateral area.
    
    It's also true that bigger boats are safer than smaller ones, and
    that 12's are big enough to have notably different characteristics
    than 30-40' boats. But we're still talking about boats designed
    entirely for a fairly narrow range of racing conditions and not
    boats designed expressly for survivability and habitability on blue
    water. (Not that I would want to sail in a boat designed exclusively
    for those conditions, either).
    
    Marchaj has a lot to say about the disastrous effect of rating rules
    on seaworthiness. He likes boats which are very conservative, more
    conservative than I like or think are necessary, but it's very good
    reading.
    
    Ross Faneuf
    

    For those who haven't seen it already, February "Yachting" has two 
    extensive articles on the current state of America's Cup affairs.  
    The first article reviews the squabble, the second reviews SDYC's
    legal position vis-a-vis the deed of gift.  I will not
    summarize the second article other than to say that the author's
    interpretation of the deed of gift leaves SDYC with no recourse
    but to race a 90 ft lwl monohull off the cost of San Diego this
    summer.  About all they can do is appeal the court decision, thus 
    delaying the match.  The author is a lawyer, and the former consultant
    to the NYYC on all matters pertaining to the deed.

>>>   ..... the author's interpretation of the deed of gift leaves 
>>>   SDYC with no recourse but to race a 90 ft lwl monohull ..... 


:-)

    .74
    The key word is "interpretation."  There may be a multihull
    loophole:  The article states that the deed "can't be considered 
    to contemplate multihulls because [they weren't around] when the deed 
    was written."  Ipso facto, multihulls aren't allowed.  However, 
    the deed's omission is not synonomous with prohibition.  We have
    seen in the past that similar incidents have forced the re-writing of 
    the deed, but not before the omission was exploited.  Not a pretty
    argument, but it's there.

    .75
    Have you ever raced on a REALLY big boat?  The maxis are
    very exciting -- they whip around like dingies -- but do
    you have any idea how much work it takes to coordinate the
    crew?  Multiply that by the "K-boat" factor, and a BIG chunk
    of change will go into crew training.  Even at that, the 
    K-boat scale will likely preclude the kind of crew coordination 
    we've seen on the 12s.
    
    The impression I've gotten is that the KIWIs were forcing the
    time, as well as the craft.  Time is the single biggest factor
    working against the SDYC.
    
    BTW:  With the exception of New Zealand, all aspiring challengers
    have signed an agreement to return to 12s following this 
    regatta -- unless, of course, you win.

    News from San Diego indicates SDYC is proceding
    with its multihull plans, and planning to race
    off LA or Santa Cruz in September.

    Todays UK papers say they have design a cat and a tri, they are
    most likely to use the cat which has been designed by the designers
    of 'Patient Lady', a Little Americas cup winner. It is believed
    to be about 70ft long.
    
    The racing is now scheduled for Sept. 4th. , but I wouldn't book
    your hotel rooms just yet...
    		      

                                -< Sept 4th?? >-
	re .78

	A magaizine out the other day here is suggesting 10-15 Oct 1988  
	may be the dates? I'm not sure why then.

	Also according to the article, Alan bond and the Royal Yacht
	Club (that's how they said), both had also tried to challenge
	in 90'ers, but apparently they will be frozen out. New Zealand
	has been stated to be the challenger of record, and there apparently
	will be no sail off. Too bad, as there apparently were 5 U.S.
	syndicates who were willing to challenge in 90' boats as well. Could
	have been very interesting. Alan bond apparently is already building
	a 90' boat to challenge in. ??? Perhaps there are more things to
	hit the courts yet?
	    Venue will likely not be announce until about 90 days 
	before the race, the limit required in the deed.. 
	    Also Sail America has been declared the defender of record,
	They also have said that if they win, they will defend in 12 metres 
	in 1991.
	   The article was in the February or March issue of SAIL here in
	the U.S. Had an interesting article about Michael Fay.. Other
	notes as seen in a recent newspaper article. 
	    (Let's propose requiring Top'sal schooners or Brigantines
	     for the next challenge... I suppose they would be seaworthy,
	     and they do require large crews,.. if that is one's pleasure?)

			Russ
		     		      

    According to  a lawyer writing in the March issue of Sail, the San
    Diego  YC  and Sail America are taking positions which are legally
    almost  indefensible.  He claims that the clear intent of the deed
    of  gift  and  its  amendments  was  to foster fair racing and the
    language must be interpreted in that light.

    From this he argues that multi-hulls are not acceptable as the few
    multihulls  used  by  the  time  the  deed  was  written  were all
    disqualified  from  further racing, so the deed should not be read
    as  contemplating them. He also argues that the defender cannot be
    longer  than  90  ft.  on the waterline, but could be shorter. And
    finally,  he  argues  that the venue must be specified in advance,
    and  must either be the "usual ocean course" of the defenders or a
    mutually agreeable site.

    I don't   know   how   much  to  believe  his  position,  but  his
    biographical blurb indicates a very experienced lawyer and sailor,
    as  well  as  one  who has been involved in the America's cup. The
    article is persuasive in its arguments, so I'm inclined to believe
    his positions.

--David

    re -.1, the beauty of lawyers is that given enough money, you can
    hire one with the same background and qualifications as the other
    guy's, but with the opposite opinion on any given point of law.

re -.1

An even more cynical view is that lawyers have whatever legal opinions 
they are paid to have. The most spectacular America's Cup racing in 1988 
may be in the courtroom. I'd be extremely surprised if New Zealand 
didn't file suit if SDYC actually decides to race a multihull. This may 
well be the first America's Cup defense in which more is spent on legal 
fees than on naval architects' fees. 

:-)

Re: last two

    The cynicism  is well founded, but as far as I know, the author of
    the article in question is not paid by either side, and has in the
    past worked for the NYYC. With that background, I would expect him
    to lean towards the Americans if he was biased.

    I agree about spending more on legal fees than on boats. (Remember
    last  time when the big legal argument was whether the great lakes
    were "an arm of the sea"?

--David

    re last few...
    
    See march "Yachting" for a rebuttal of the exact sort
    you discuss.
    
    I think the bottom-line tactic for San Diego is 
    to cross the line first no matter what, because past precedent
    leaves little or no chance for the Kiwi's to win a court battle
    once the racing is over.  
    
    For those of you who've been following this note, you
    know I'm a staunch 12 meter fan, and in lieu of loosing
    the 12 meter platform I've sided with SDYC in their efforts
    to derail this challenge.  However, I can't help but mention
    that even with all this chicanery, it's still very possible for 
    Kiwi's to win this conflict on the race course:  Just think 
    about the relative advantages and disadvantages of racing 
    a 505 against a Hobie 16.  A skilled helmsman will finish 
    the race before the starting gun goes off. 

    re .83
    
    An NYYC rep biased towards San Diego?!  Think about it.  If anything, 
    I'd suspect the exact opposite.  There was an underlying feel to 
    that article that struck me like the NYYC sucking up to the Kiwis out of 
    jealousy, wounded pride, and maybe just a little wishful thinking.
    
    On the other hand, see the rebuttal mentioned in .84 for an equally 
    "unbiased" interpretation.  
    
    In the end -- and to coin a para-phrase, "possession will be 
    99/100ths of the deed when it's all said and done."
    
    You know, the Aussies produced a mini-series about their conquest
    of the Cup, but I think we've got material for a block-buster sit-com.

re the last several:

Sure, but sailboat racing is well-known for the winners later losing in
the protest room. What if the SDYC sails a multihull and wins, New
Zealand protests in court, and the court rules that SDYC's boat was
illegal? Cup goes to New Zealand. Given the various legal opinions being
bandied about, the SDYC could very well lose a court challenge. That 
would be more embarrassing than losing on the race course. 

    Well it seems that SDYC have avoided legal action on one count by
    accepting additional challengers.  They announced to the NY Supreme
    Court that this will now be so.
                                     
    Perhaps it is also part of a strategy to gain more time to prepare
    for the challenge by trying to oblige Michael Fay to postpone the
    September defence date.  I don't think Fay will look to kindly on
    that at this stage considering it is SDYC who caused the delay for
    the other challengers.
    
    So ...  who else will be there?.  Bond.  De Savary.  Other US based
    syndicates?.
    
    The next likely item to be changed must be the issue of how many
    hulls the SDYC boat can have.  Then big boat racing at last !!!.

    FYI:  SDYC has begun construction of a 50 ft cat.
    
    What will the outcome be?  SDYC will beat the KIWIs on the
    water, there will be a major uproar and protest, but a
    strict interpreation of the deed will exhonerate SDYC, and
    at last the America's Cup will get back on track with
    competitive 12 meter racing.
    

    I'm not  so  sure.  The  deed requires the boat to be propelled by
    sails,  and  I'm  wondering if a wing mast counts. Also, the Kiwis
    have won every court battle so far, so if there's another won, I'd
    give them every chance to win it.

--David

    You might have something regarding sails.  If push came
    to shove on that issue, I bet SDYC would be stuck.  I wonder if
    anyone there has thought of that?  As for the multi-hull issue, 
    however, the KIWI's will not win a law suit if the court 
    bases its decision on a strict and literal interpretation of
    the deed.  That's really what this whole confrontation 
    boils down to, isn't it -- interpretation of the deed?
    
    You can bet that whoever wins will make some changes.

    FYI: The NY Supreme Court is already on record as saying the
         only design constraint is lwl.

    Well, the 90 footer is in the water and masted.  Sunday is "official"
    launch day if anybody wants to come to Auckland and join the fun.
    Actually, I thought it just looked like a bigger version of KZ7!.
    
    I agree with the comments about multi-hulls.  Trying to bar them
    from racing because they are not specifically mentioned in the deed
    is like trying to diallow Turbo Chargers in Formula One.
    
    With wings now being accepted below the water line, it really opens
    up a whole new debate on what a mast can look like - what's the
    difference between a streamlined hull and a "streamlined" mast?.
    
    Anyone know how long the deed of gift is?.  Any chance of it being
    posted?.
                  
    Cheers, Martin

    SDYC's site selection -- San Pedro -- will likely
    get the boot too.  The deed explicitly states that
    failing an agreement on venue, the course will be
    the regular ocean course of the host yacht club.
    
    Michael Fay has been very vocal in saying he will
    race in San Diego, and if SDYC fails to show, he will
    assert that they forfeit the Cup.  And he's right.

    I'm losing track of the charges and counter charges, but,
    hasn't the NY Supreme Court judge already ruled in SDYC's favor
    on this issue?
    
    J_R

    re .93  Not sure on that.  If they did, would certainly cast doubt on
            design constraint ruling.  However, the deed is very explicit on 
            the venue question.  The defender can make the selection, but
            if the challenger does not agree, the race must be held on the 
            ocean course of the host club.  I presume this is where the 
            "arm of the sea" clause came about.  The deed seeks to
            restrict courses that would favor local knowledge, and
            an ocean course is ostensibly less susceptible to local
            vagaries.  Consequently, competing YCs must have an ocean
            course upon which to race.  Not sure how the "Heart of America"
            syndicate got around this.
    
            FYI:  Sunday's Globe had a photo of the Kiwi's boat under sail.

>< Note 636.94 by DELNI::FACHON >
>                      -< "Sailing away, sailing away... >-
>
>              Consequently, competing YCs must have an ocean
>            course upon which to race.  Not sure how the "Heart of America"
>            syndicate got around this.
>    

    I believe  that  SDYC lost on the issue of venue, and must race on
    their "customary ocean course" or some such language. (So far SDYC
    has  lost  every  issue  that came before the court that I'm aware
    of.)

    "Heart of  America"  got  the New York State Supreme court to rule
    that  the  Great  Lakes  are  "an  arm  of the sea." I presume the
    channel through the St. Lawrence seaway was the deciding factor.

--David

If the deed says that propulsion must be by sail, I presume it does not say
what the sails be made out of.  (They had mylar sails back then?) Therefore
making sails out of aluminum would be allowed.  Likewise I presume the deed
does not restrict the shape of the sails.  Every sail designer plays with this.
Therefore wing-shaped sails would be allowed.

Careful reading of the 12-meter formula will be required to see how to figure
in the height, depending on whether it says "height of mast", "height of
top of highest sail", "height of highest part of boat", etc.  One could
get interesting effects if the "sails" are allowed to extend above the "mast".

How about if they fly a giant spinnaker like a kite, at about 500 feet in
the air where the wind is stronger?

    The deed is printed in full, the early April edition of Yachts &
    Yachting, a UK magazine. It is rather long ( about 500 lines )
    so I will not attempt to type it in.
    
    

    Anyone heard anything about the KIWI multihull
    court case?  I've heard nada -- not even when
    it's supposed to take place.

    To keep this note current, I just wanted to mention
    that Sail America has been actively racing Formula 40
    catamarans to prepare for their boat.  I've heard
    nothing about expected lauch dates.  Dennis Conner
    is skippering the cat, and he's had his share of goof-ups.
    Most recent was a capsize and turtle -- right in front of
    SDYC.  A portent of things to come?
    
    New Zealand's boat is very impressive.  She does 20+
    knots on a regular basis, and a Yachting rep was aboard
    when she was doing 12+ to windward with just her main; at that,
    he was convinced they were sand-bagging.
    
    Last proposed date for a racing was Labor Day weekend.  Still
    haven't heard any confirmed info on litigation.

    The Kiwi boat is here.  No word on lauch date
    for Sail America's cat, now rumored to have grown to
    60 feet.  Also, no word on cat vs mono issue.

re .100

>          Also, no word on cat vs mono issue.

This gives me time to comment. 

The basic argument that Michael Fay is making in court is that SDYC's
catamaran is not similar to their boat and therefore the race would not be a
"match" as implicitly required by the America's Cup deed. Well, I've now seen
(on TV) or read about both boats and it seems pretty clear that both are
imitation boats, useless for anything other than this race. This would seem to
make it a match. :-) 

- Bob

    I read, last week I think, that DA JUDGE, had accepted the arguments
    of both sides and was going to render a decision in a week or so.
    AHHHHH Sport!!!!! 
    
    a nice irony, the judge is a woman. :-)
    
    Ed
    

    Saw an interesting quote from brit Chance:
    He basically said he was "confident" he could
    design a faster monohull than the Kiwis if the
    judge rules that SDYC must race a similar vessel "next spring."
    
    Next spring?  Where did this allowance come from?
    10 months form the date when the terms of the challenge
    get all sorted out?  
    
    
    
    
    
    

    Re:  .102
    
    Ed,  Thanks for the update, but the note regarding irony has me
    puzzled.  What's the irony again?
    
    Thanks,
    
    Ron
    

    I saw that 60 cat on TV last week. Heaven help them if they have
    to tack that monster in heavy seas because of a storm. They will
    be on a reach till Hawaii!!!
    
      In USA today last week, there was an interesting tidbit as each
    side closed their case. The judge asked M. Faye's lawyer if she
    threw out the cat, if the New Zealanders would give Sail America
    the time to build a monohull, to which the lawyer said "NO, We
    gave them a chance earlier, but they didn't take it".
    
       Sure hate to be the forward man on a pitchpole on that cat!!!!
    
    
    

    The following Graffiti was seen on a wall in a gents in a pub in
    the solent area. First some terminology 
    "gents" - male washroom
    "solicitor" - UK Lawyer
    "solent" - Area of water between the Isle of Wight and UK south
    coast where first race took place.
    
    
    "America's Cup should be re-named The Solicitors Cup"
    
    in a different hand
    
    "send the cup back to the solent and bring back sanity"
    
    and in a third hand
    
    "The colonials are getting restless and are Know (sic) GENTLEMEN"
    
    Many a true and untrue word writ after many pints . Iwas sober at
    the time I saw it but as the evening progressed and I saw it again
    I began to agree with some of it......
    
    Pete 

    re .104
    
    I found it ironic (maybe poor use of word?) that the decision of
    major impact on such a macho sport would be made by a woman.
    
    I'm gonna catch it now!. Thanks, Ron :-)!
    
    Saw in sunday Globe that the Kiwis offered to give SDYC time to
    build their own big dinghy and were told to buzz off. Ahh
    sportmanship!! 
    
    Anyone heard anything about the technology (especialy video) going
    into these boats? 
    
    ED
    

    Everyone is telling everyone to fly a kite!
    Kiwis had said to judge they'd refuse to give
    SDYC time if she ruled against them.
    
    When the good judge decides, will likely be
    with stipulations:
    
     The cat is illegal, BUT the Kiwis must give SDYC
     time.
    
     Or how about, the cat is legal, but SDYC must
     allow other challenges.
    
    We should hear something real soon.  Supposedly
    being decided as we "speak."
    
    About a woman making the decision, I've always 
    thought of sailing as having a very feminine allure.
    What I object to is that a court is deciding in the
    first place.  Why isn't the IYRU involved here?

    opening day at the San Diego Yacht Club ...
    
    The design team adds sail area and brings the pontoons closer togather
    on the formula 40 training cat, great for stability.
    
    Dennis flys by the club raising a pontoon in the air, but it keeps
    going ... high tech turtle.  The lower pontoon fills with water
    and the mast gets stuck in the mud.  Dog paddl'in Dennis, nice move!
    
    					<-john-

    Now it's rumored that the court will put off
    any decision until October.  Seems the judge wants
    to encourage an out of court settlement.  

    

    re .109    No No NO, you don't high tech turtle while flying a hull.
    You either crash and burn, then turtle ,  or you grind to halt,
    pitchpole the pig, and then turtle it  8>)
    
       If your going to bench talk catamaran stories, fact or fiction,
    you have to use the right terminology  8>) 8>)
    
    
         Will someone please tell both parties that the idea of sailing
    is to have fun.                        
    
    john (If ya don't flip the pig, your just not trying hard enough!)
    
    
    

The tax-exempt Sail America Foundation is being investigated by the 
Internal Revenue Service for allegedly making illegal, excessive 
payments to Dennis Conner and others. Supposedly some $1 million was 
paid to Conner and other trustees and officers of Sail America and very 
little, if any, of the $16 million the foundation has earned the past 
few has gone to charitable causes. The tax laws require that a 
substantial amount of a foundation's income be distributed to charities 
and that its trustees and officers receive only reasonable compensation. 
(In 1985 Conner was paid $175 000 and John Marshall $149 597.) Needless 
to say, Sail America denies the charges and says that it operates within 
IRS guidelines.

    Did anyone see/tape the ESPN special on the Cup?  I missed it.
        
    re .112  Sail America's favorite charity?  Sail America, of course.
    But what the heck, the IRS might as well get in on the action!
                    
    The S&S cat is every bit as amazing as the Kiwi-mono.  Although 
    they like to downplay their chances, insiders say the cat exceeds 
    expectations.  If nothing else, they may have a boat that can break 
    some speed records.

    re. -1
       Yes, and there was ESPN had the 1973 challange on last night.
    Boy, those Newport boys sure took a lot of movies in the old days.
    Last night I got to see Dennis Connors as the navigator. Excellant
    series.
    
    

    The ESPN films indicated that Connors was used at the helm during
    starts because of his "agressive" pre-start tactics.  His yelling
    was very clear on the sound track even though the camera was at
    a respectable distance.  And I thought it was just the people I
    hang around with, who yell like that!

    The only problem with the America's cup races and races in general
    is that the boats that are designed are only good for good weather
    sailing. The cat that connors wants to use would not be a very safe
    boat for an ocean crossing.

    So what?  Are Formula One cars safe for crossing the Baja?  Can
    you imagine races around short courses with boats that would be
    safe for ocean crossing?  Would that be fun, or what?  Maybe we
    should ban Hobie Cats.  I can see it now, the Cup being sailed for
    in heavy double enders.
    
    For the extremely small number of sailors that truly go across oceans
    the Cup races may hold no interest.  For the millions of sailors
    who race at one level or another the relative merits of self steering
    devices hold no interest.  To each his own.
    
    As to the reference of racing in general only in good weather, I
    wish that were true!  Maybe I should sell my foul weather gear.
    
    Dave
    

    RE .116
    
    >  The only problem with the America's cup races and races in general
    >  is that the boats that are designed are only good for good weather
    >  sailing.
    
    Not necessarily so.  Some are more seaworthy than others.  I've been
    out on a J/36 in some horrendous weather.  Not fun, but also not so
    dangerous as long as you shorten sail and pay attention to what you're
    doing.  And many of the "racing" boats I see out there just about every
    week-end are a lot more seaworthy than the J/36.  We race whether it's
    good weather or bad.
    
    However, to a point I agree with you.  Case in point, look at
    some of the latest replies in 845.  The wind was only doing about 30
    knots, and a lot of "racing" boats had to drop out because their
    hardware got abused and broken.
    
    However, Dave's point in .117 is well taken.  Some of us LIKE the
    additional danger associated with boats built for speed as opposed to
    seaworthiness, particularly when the weather gets nasty, it adds an
    additional challenge.  We recognize that when you make a boat lighter
    and add more sail you give up the ability to do "ocean crossings".  But
    some of us aren't particularly interested in crossing the ocean anyway.
    
    As to the cat that Conners wants to use, it's being built for speed,
    not comfort.  I doubt anyone would ever consider crossing the ocean in
    it.  Why would they ever want to?  
    
    ... Bob

    re safety
    
    Ah, my love for 12s will never die!  Somewhere back in
    this note Ross Fanuef had a fair amount to say regarding
    stability [aka seaworthiness, aka safety].  To make a long story 
    short, Ross stated that modern racing designs are inherantly
    unstable.  I argured that 12s are the optimum compromise 
    between stability and speed.  
    
    As for the cat and the Kiwi-mono, they are certainly
    on the extreme fringe of design.  Not particularly safe.
    Millpond-worthy maybe, but not SEAworthy.  They definitely take 
    Cup racing beyond the realm of practical application.
    
    I'd still like to scuttle them both!
    
    ;)

    		re .117
    
    	 I don't believe Formula 1 racing is a fair comparison.  The
    original intent in America's Cup boat assumed a seaworthy boat that
    was capable of crossing an ocean and contending for the Cup.  It
    also assumed a fair challenge but Connor doesn't seem to care about
    that anymore.
    

    re .116
    
    Appearances can be deceiving.  A few years back the winner of the
    Bermuda race was Holger Dansk.  It was about 20 years old at the
    time and had made several previous trans-atlantic crossings.  Holger
    Dansk was a heavy discplacement double ender which, when viewed against
    the high tech competition, seemed hoplessly outdated.  By the way,
    this was not the cruising race either but the "serious" one.
    
    Some biases in the IMS handicap rule, which was being used in a major
    race for the first time, had a lot to do with the win.   But the elapsed
    time was better than that for many more racing oriented boats. 
    
    On the flip side some crazy sailed the single handed race to Bermuda
    in a modified Etchells and got there alive.  This is not quite like
    doing it in a Laser but it's close.
    
    One of the reasons breakage is so common in racing is that racers will
    stress equipment until it breaks.   The idea is to sail on the edge
    of disaster.  The only way to know where that line is, is to go
    over the edge occassionally.   It doesn't matter how overbuilt the
    gear is.  They just pile on enough sail until it gives.  After enough
    DNF's and bills have accumulated, some racers smarten up, but most
    are incorrigible.       
    
    - gene ho

    re .120
    
    Without rehashing another discussion a few dozen replies
    back, I don't think it's fair to blame Sail America.  When
    they went to Perth, they played the game fairly.  I'm sure they
    now feel -- however right or wrong that feeling may be -- that 
    they're playing the same game as the Kiwis.  

    re.120
    
    I believe the comparison to F1 cars is right on.  The highest level
    of competition gives rise to material breakthroughs and designs
    that often end up in rather pedestrian versions of the same vehicle.
    Sixteen valve four cylinder engines now taken for granted were not
    developed for driving to the grocery, but now are used for everyday
    driving.  Rod rigging, braided line, composite hulls and improved
    sail design were just some of the benefits of racing that crossed
    the line into recreational sailing.  
    
    The original requirement that the challenging vessel sail across
    the ocean in order to challenge was very quickly exposed as a handicap
    as the defending vessel need not meet that same requirement.  Anyway,
    it's moot.  If anything, the twelves are too seaworthy in that they
    are truly displacement designs (a rare thing in racing circles
    nowadays).  
    
    I'll make a deal.  I won't force you to appreciate racing if you
    won't force me to sail slow.
    
    Dave

    The comparison with cars is right on. The cars you buy today are
    to hard to work on. Designed to fall apart after 60k miles. They
    are designed to appeal to driving excitement and looks.
    Car are not design to be dependable, and low maintenance costs.    

    Fair, as in Fair Play is NOT one of the words one would use to describe
    very much of the Americas Cup history.Its already been noted that
    the challenger was always required to sail across the ocean, while
    the defender got to call off racing when conditions weren't "safe".
    It was also common in early years to put out a fleet of defenders,
    all but one of which were simply there to get in the challengers
    way. 
    
    Not much of a Sporting Event!
    
    

Dennis must be having fun out there on a cat that can flip over at any moment,
considering that he can't swim.  (or so he claims)

Well, I've just returned from several days at the World Multihull 
Symposium, held in Newport this year to coincide with the CSTAR finish. 
While I'm brimming with all kinds of info and opinion from that, let me
share some of the stuff I learned from talking with Randy Smyth (Sail
America sailmaker), and from a presentation he gave yesterday.  I'll just
let it tumble out, rather than organize it carefully.  

Randy reviewed the two-page Deed of Gift, explaining SDYC's strategy and 
rationale, without getting defensive.  First question was mono or multi, 
and the committee came down strongly in favor of multi -- apparently 
because we know more about high-tech push-the-envelope multis than we do 
about mega-monos.  Also, for the design wind range, multis make sense.  
They looked very hard at the Formula 40 scene, even buying a hot F40 cat 
to make an early training testbed.  To do that, they cut the beam from 36' 
to 22' (?) and raised the stick from 60-odd feet to 82'.  Now, THAT is 
cutting your stability!  This reflected their strategy to build strictly 
for that narrow wind range.

Cat vs tri:  To build a high tech cat takes one mold, used four times to 
make two boats.  Thus time is saved, a critical factor in the project. 
Also, it was determined that a cat of X performance could be built
lighter.  [Sidenote:  the Formula 40 competition so hot in Europe right
now is dominated by tris, which most attribute to the 4000 lb minimum
weight limit -- today considered too high for optimizing the latest
building techniques.  Tris' stability curves are steeper, hence they tend 
to perform optimally across a wider wind range if designed to do so.  
Also, tris are more close-winded.]

The design wind range is 8-12 kt.  Yes, that is a very narrow range, and 
it is the crux of Sail America's strategy.  If the wind is less than 5 
kts, or more than 15, you can pretty much kiss off the cat's chances.

The key in cat sailing is to get one hull out of the water to reduce 
friction and wave-making resistance.  [BTW, this is why there is actually 
a theoretical upper limit for overall beam on a racing cat -- you want to
get one hull up, in whatever wind it's designed to do so.]  Sail America's 
cats both lift one hull at precisely 7 kts wind.

The current 3-element wingmast is largely carbon fiber, 100' long and
about 1000 lbs all up.  Working on it both in design and construction have
been Dave Hubbard, of Patient Lady fame, and Burt Rutan, of round-the-
world-on-a-tank-of-gas Voyager fame.  It is optimized for upwind
performance, and would be an utter dog once the wind gets aft of the
beam.  But since trials show typical boat speeds around twice wind speed,
the wind very rarely makes it aft of 90 degrees.  (Randy said she'd done
22 kts in 10 kts wind on a reach.)  BTW, the area is about 1300 sq
ft. 

The other rig is a more "standard" wingmast with larger softsail, about 
1700 sq ft *plus* jib.  If the air is light and abaft the beam, the 
boat is fast enough they can't use even a reacher, let alone a spinnaker. 

The solid wing weighs less than the cloth sail rig, mostly due to weight 
savings in standing and running rigging, and winches (the former is close
to balanced, requiring only about 6:1 sheeting to be easily handled).
The solid wing is also much more efficient tacking, as it never luffs, or 
has to pop the battens over, etc.

In light air (<12 kts) the soft sail is faster.  Size beats efficiency.  
In heavy air, the solid wing is faster.  At 12 kts they are exactly
matched in boat speed.  Yes, according to Randy the rigs *are* demountable
and exchangeable between races.  Sail America's strategy does include
making such changes during the series. 

To the argument that Dennis isn't the best choice to skipper because he
hasn't got the multihull experience, Randy says Dennis is getting lots of
lessons this summer -- sailing and swimming ;-).  Seriously, he projected
that by September Dennis will have more hours at the helm than many
Formula 40 skippers, and most importantly, almost all of them match-tuning
and match-racing against an identical boat. 

Fun facts:  Each hull is 60' long by 36" BWL.  At speed with one hull 
flying, the leeward hull draws 18".  When underway both hulls immersed, 
both boards are down (14' long, 10' immersed); when flying a hull, the 
windward one is retracted to cut friction, as the leeward one becomes 
efficient enough to work well alone.  Five guys sail each cat; on the 
solid wing boat, that's two more than needed to sail it.

Finally, someone whose opinion I tend to trust is Californian Alex
Kozloff, who has sailed Class C cats in the Little America's Cup for
probably two decades, and is one of the most skilled skippers of that type
of craft around.  He gives the edge to the Kiwi mono, *unless* the wind is
absolutely ideal.  Malcolm Tennant, an Aussie who has designed perhaps all
the current record-holding multis Down Under (with the notable exception
of the new "Steinlager"), would love to have a multi win, but tends to
favor the big mono a little.  I don't believe he spoke in this case from a
Southern Hemispheric chauvinism. 

According to a story in last Sunday's NY Times, Dennis Conner and crowd 
may be a bit worried. They've ordered a new wing mast (8' taller than 
the original 85' mast) with 20% more area. Cost: $350 000. The original 
mast cost $1 000 000 (including engineering costs). Apparently their 
boat has trouble accelerating in light winds and sloppy water. The Kiwis 
have built a new mast and rudder. 

Also, the NY court is expected to rule soon. Regardless of the ruling, 
an appeal by the loser is expected, which is likely to delay any racing 
until next year. 

    re .125  
    
    '83 and '87 were absolutely fair contests.  That's why
    this entire turn of events is so pathetic.  I guess we'll
    just have to wait another 132 years.  
    
    re .127
    
    Nice report!  I'm surprised at the conclusion, however,
    as several simulations I've heard of predict the cat winning
    big time.  Given the thoughts you've related, it
    might just be worthwhile to let these boats race.  

    On the other hand, maybe Sail America is "sand-bagging"
    the PR, trying to raise enough doubt to make the Kiwi's think they
    have a chance.  Wouldn't it then be funny if the Kiwis did
    win!  
    
    At this point, I don't care, as it looks doubtful the 
    event will salvage much stature from the previous two contests.
    
    re .128
    
    Seems we keep hearing that a decision is pending, only
    to find out it's been delayed.  It would be nice to
    get the court ruling.  Although the loser will only
    appeal, a ruling might help force a compromise.
    
    Dean
        

    By way of keeping note current...
    
    I haven't seen it yet, but evidently there's an
    article in Sail that runs some simulation races
    between the cat and the mono.  On ALL points,
    the cat appears to be significantly faster.
    
    Also, saw a picture of the two boats sailing together --
    crossed paths for a moment.  Interesting to see
    them on the breeze -- similar headings!  
    
    Looks like no decision is forthcoming from New York.
    The race will happen, the Kiwis will protest, and
    the final decision will come out of the protest room.
    Probably the way it should be.  Who picks the committee?

    Read somewhere a few days ago about the potential British challenge.
    Seems to be something on the line of 90' length and 2'6" beam (yes,
    you read right - 2'6"!!!) with a huge daggerboard and rather a lot
    of sail.
    
    Anyone know more?
    
    Brian

    
    Just a guess...  I've seen recent pictures of a British boat called
    'Switchblade' or 'Slingshot' which had an extremely narrow hull (maybe 
    about 2'6") and a hiking platform/pontoon that extended *way* out from 
    the hull, together with a lot of sail area.
    
       - Jim
    

    There was in interesting 2 page article in the latest issue of Hotline
    , the hobie Cat magazine. It had interview with John Wake who is
    working on the boat. John is the Design engineer for the two newest
    Hobie designs, the 17 and the 21.
    
    1. the hulls are being laid up in an old Hobie Cat factory
    
    2. The hulls are vacumm molded like Hobie cat hulls to get rid of
    any air.
    
    3. the hulls are made with Nomex. In fact, the stuff is so scarce
    they belieive they have all the Nomex available in the world. The
    stuff is super expensive.
    
    4. If puctured, the hulls can take on water, they are building extra
    hulls for that reason.
    
    5. they have a team of experts working on the boat. They are working
    well together as a team 10-12 a day, 6 days a week. Most of the
    Cat design people (Randy Symth, Wake etc) get a kick out of watching
    Dennis sail a catamaran as most of them have been beaten by the
    great Dennis on monohulls in the past.
    
    6. They think the race will be a toss-up. Fay's boat is based off
    a Sydney 18, only scaled to 100 feet. The Kiwi's have built the
    boat to be light. In fact, they think it weighs no more than a 12
    metre.  It also has a bulb keel that can be moved forward and 
    aft for various conditions.
    
    7. The tall mast on the Kiwi's boat will allow is to capture air
    that is moving 2 knots faster than the wing on stars and stripes.
    
    8. they believe the winds will play the biggest part. Under 8 knts,
    they think Fay will win, over 10 knts, S&S will win. between 8 and
    10 knts, it is anybodys race. The winds for the course avg 8-10.
    
    john
                               

The following is extracts are from the UK Sunday Times 17th July 1988 by Keith 
Wheatley.                    
                             
The Headline " The Falmouth Flyer tunes up for the America's Cup"
                             
"Midnight on Cornish Waters is an evocative time.The witching hour was close 
and a creamy moon had risen, as a strange craft headed out into Falmouth Bay 
under tow late last week. Aboard, a small group of weary but exhilarated men 
felt as the Wright brothers must have when Kittyhawk first pulled her wheels 
from the grass and flew.     
The boat was Blue Arrow the most radical sailing boat ever contstructed and
one that, if she lives up to her design expectations, will also be the fastest 
ever. the world speed record under sail is held by a windsurfer, but it is 
projected that Blue Arrow will be capable of at least 40 knots.
At first glance she looks similar to the kind of exotic trimaran the French 
build for single handed ocean racing. Except that where the outside floats 
should be, there are fine vertical pylons dipping into the water.
Attached to these pylons are the key to the whole concept : horizontal foils 
that trim like an aircraft's flaps and provide lift or down-thrust, as 
required. The whole machine is so spidery-delicate in appearance that it looks 
more likely to fly off the crane hook than tackle solid green waves."
    
The article then goes on with quotes from Peter De Savary and others involved 
in the project.
    
"The blade-thin central hull is around 65 ft long and has a maximum beam - 
width, in landlubber speak - of 2ft 6in. In the stern is a cramped cockpit 
full of hydraulic controls. Clark will sit here and "fly" the boat."
    
The article then goes on with quotes from Clark on their concept. 
    
"Sometime today comes the crucial moment of sailing under her own power' 
generated by the Kevlar mainsail and carbon fibre wing mast, which is 80ft 
high and up to 4 ft wide."
    
The article continues with quotes etc on the problems of sailing the craft.
    
"In other corners of the America's Cup Circus, life is still in flux. But 
privately, a New Zealand observer based in Falmouth is known to have 
telephoned the Kiwi syndicate boss, Michael Fay with the terse message : 'Our 
boat is a bloody dinosaur'."
    
The whole article and photograph is quite interesting.........
    
Rule Britannia...........Pete
    

    Has San Diego indeed agreed to accept multiple challenges?  
    I've forgotten the results of that flap.
    
    My, that boat sounds practical -- a speed record contender perhaps 
    -- but I wonder how maneuverable or seaworthy it will be.  And how
    much wind do you think it will take to go 40 knots?  Not much you 
    might say, but the apparent wind will swing too far forward to
    generate that kind of speed in light air.  You'll need enough wind 
    to maintain the optimum angle of attack to the wing-mast -- perhaps
    25 knots.  Hmmm, so what will that do to the apparent wind velocity?  
    Maybe 55 knots?  Did you say what kind of glue holds this beast together?

    ;)
    

    British Aerospace did much of the fabrication with componants made
    out of Titanium.........It quoted in the article that De Savary
    has the agreement of the US and Kiwi syndicates to race......The
    craft was built in 90 days. The crew will be a pilot and six sail
    handlers lead by Chris Law a former Olympic helmsman.
    More as the UK press releases it.......

RE: .135, on apparent wind angle limitations,

Ice boats have successfully gone more than a hundred miles an hour.  
Because she floats, the major limiters of Blue Arrow are friction and
wave-making.  But if those can be reduced by radical design approaches, 
she should reach like little else afloat.

What's the limit?  An endless source of fascinating speculation....

J.

    re -.1
    
    > craft was built in 90 days. The crew will be a pilot and six sail
    > handlers lead by Chris Law a former Olympic helmsman.

    SIX sail handlers!?!?  Where do they sit/stand? Communications might
    prove to be an interesting problem if they're stung out along the
    deck.
    
    Ed

    Heard on the news last night that a NY judge has thrown out de Savary's
    challenge. He's going to appeal.
    
    On the boat itself - saw some pictures with the news story. The
    boat is REAL thin. The helsman sits up on some sort of high seat
    at the back and the grinders are strung out in a line along the
    boat with communication being through headsets.  The outriggers
    with their control system looked very impressive. It certainly looks
    like a real flier.
    
    Brian

    re .137
    
    If an ice boat is reaching at 100+ knots, what is the apparent 
    wind angle vs true wind speed and angle?  I've got to believe
    they start their run in heavy air on a very broad reach and the 
    apparent wind moves progressively forward as the boat accelerates.  
    Eventually they reach the point of diminishing lift from the 
    sails -- perhaps an apparent beam-to-close reach -- and the speedo
    is pegged.  Now they must trade speed for true-wind pointing ability.
    Since the race committee will set a weather mark and this vessel 
    is going like a bat out of hell in the wrong direction, they'll
    have to trade a lot of speed.
    
    My point is that while all this may be great for strait-line records,
    I question the merit in a round-the-buoys confrontation.  What is the
    theoretical performance "envelope" for this vessel in winds of 12 
    knots or less?  Is that enough wind to raise it up on the hydrofoils 
    while going to weather?  What are the tacking angles?  

                

    
    From Associated Press Reports:
    
    
        A judge in New York ordered the SAN DIEGO YACHT CLUB [sic]
    yesterday to accept the challenge of a NEW ZEALAND [sic] club and
    settle the battle for the AMERICA'S CUP [sic] on the seas instead
    of in the courts. The ruling also cleared the way for the San Diego
    club to use it's controversial two-hulled catamaran in defense of
    the title it reclaimed for the United States in 1987. State Supreme
    Court Justice Carmen B. Ciparick ordered the two clubs to begin
    racing Sept. 19 off the coast of San Diego. She also denied the
    request of an English yacht club to join the race, and rejected
    the New Zealanders' petition to hold the San Diego club in contempt
    of court.
    
    
       (Reprinted without permission from the Worcester Telegram of
        Tuesday, July 26)

    EEEEHAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

re .142:    

>>>  EEEEHAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I assume you're cheering for New Zealand.

:-)

RE:.140 by MANTIS::FACHON 

> My point is that while all this may be great for strait-line records,
> I question the merit in a round-the-buoys confrontation.  What is the
> theoretical performance "envelope" for this vessel in winds of 12 
> knots or less?  

A hydrofoil SHOULD have a big advantage starting at winds less than 12 knots
on all courses except dead downwind.

The practical problem is that the "helmsman" is flying a waterplane a few
feed below the surface of the ocean, and if a foil lifts out of the water,
there is a large, abrupt force causing a "capsize" or worse.

> Is that enough wind to raise it up on the hydrofoils while going to 
> weather?  

Should be enough.  I am trying to use "Sailing Theory and Practice" by 
Marchaj to go through a reverse engineering job on the British boat.
There have been lots of experimental hydrofoil sailing craft, and all to
date have failed.

> What are the tacking angles?  

Who knows?  The key thing is what is VMG.  And is the beast controlable?
                

Phil

    re .143
    
    I'm just ecstatic that the judge pushed this
    thing back out of court.  Let them duke it out on 
    the water and in the protest room -- that's what
    they are for.
    
    I just hope that whoever wins will try to restore
    some of the structure from previous events.
    FYI:  The 12-meter accociation is rumored to be
    working on a "Super 12" formula.  70 ft waterline,
    lighter displacement, more sail, bit still more
    robust than IOR or ULDB maxis.
    
    re .144
    
    Tough to estimate VMG without knowing tacking angles and
    speed...

    Any scenarios for the upcoming protest between
    the Kiwis and San Diego?  What, if any, are the 
    specific racing rules governing such a contest?  
    Significant precedents?
    
    Will the race committee be chosen by SDYC, or an
    international jury from the IYRU?  Neither?

< Note 636.145 by LDYBUG::FACHON >

> Tough to estimate VMG without knowing tacking angles and
> speed...

VMG = close_hauled_speed * cos ( (tacking_angle / 2) + leeway_angle) )

For racing, VMG is the important spec.  The real question is not how much
do they gain with a hydrofoil craft, but is it controllable.


Phil

    	Are there any regulations on what type of course has to be set
    for the races?  It seems to me that a reach around the triangle
    course would insure victory for the cat.
    					=Ralph=

Hot off the (Associated) Press:

1)  Sail America and Fay's folks are now negotiating to reschedule the Cup 
races (starting 9/19) to avoid conflicting with the summer Olympics 
(starting 9/17).  

2)  ESPN is committed to cover the Cup races, whenever they are held.

3)  S.A. wants a best-of-seven series, with shorter courses, rather than 
best-of-three 20-milers.

4)  From an article a couple days ago about the NY Supreme Court decision, 
while the judge threw out NZ's suit for now, she did allow them to re-file 
after the races if they wish.  (So, if you lose, you sue?  And if you win, 
you just go home?  That's a funny way to run a legal system....)

J.

    RE .149
    
    I think the reason the judge ruled the way she did has to do with the
    fact that technically the SDYC doesn't have to declare the defending
    boat until the day of the race.  In other words, till the race happens
    they can't really say for sure what the Sail America(n)s are going to
    defend in.  So they wait till the "crime" is committed before they
    bring it to trial.
    
    ... Bob

    It seems the Brittish have brought their boat
    to the US and are still trying to convince the
    Kiwis to let them race.  Puts Faye in an 
    awkward position:  If he lets them race,
    he is basically endorsing the legitimacy of 
    an open class, and therefore SDYC's cat, and
    he almost assuredly guaranties himself of
    loosing on the water.  If he doesn't, well...

    Whether Blue Arrow competes for the Cup or not, 
    there is talk of starting up an open-class around 
    the buoys event to compliment the America's Cup. 
    

    Does anyone have a schedule for ESPN coverage of
    the Cup races?  What about pre-race specials?
    Since racing starts next month, I'd think something would 
    be coming up pretty soon.  Yes?
    
    Does anyone know for sure which cat SDYC plans to race?

    ESPN has a Special scheduled for next Monday night at 10 or 11 pm.
    Check your local listings :-)
    
    They had a 30 minute show on last Monday night that was interesting. SA
    has a new wing. It's 40% bigger than the original wing. They're still
    (at least when the show was taped) trying to figure out how many people
    they need to actually sail the cat.
    
    Gary Jobson (sp?) went for a sail on Stars and Stripes (the '88
    model) and said the thing is very hard to steer. (Comments on this
    from knowledgeable multihullers would be appropriate) Considering
    the forces they're dealing with and the fact that they're using
    a tiller I'm amazed they can steer the thing at all. At one point
    Jobson casually mentioned that they were doing 20 knots. I get excited
    at 6 knots! 
    
    Fay has obtained the services of one of the faster cats on the West
    coast ("B Class" and "4th fastest catamaran" were phrases used) as a
    trial horse. I had the impression at one point (the skipper who
    replaced chris Dixon was talking about how Stars 'n' Stripes is
    "illegal") that they're planning to just sail around the course and
    protest the whole thing. 
    
    Ed

      What a great special ("Give me that &*&*& &*&*& channel changer
    honey !!).
    
    The cat sailed really quietly, what does that bozo know about cats!!!
    The main was trimed using hydralics. Crew looked like he was driving
    a tank!
    
     The thing that really got me going crazy is the size of the Kiwi
    boat. They had a helicopter shot of the monohull with the D Cat
    going to weather next to it. The D Cat looked about 1/4 the size
    of the monohull. In the background were a couple of yahoos on a
    Hobie 18. The 18 looked like a speck on the screen. If the monohull
    ever gets a cover going, nobody  30 miles to leeward is going to
    move!!!                                      
                                               
      If the weather ever comes up halfway through a race, both sides
    are going to be in trouble. The Kiwi boat looks like it will have way
    to much sail up, and the S&S cat has a bizzare bounce to the bows when it
    starts motoring across the waves.   
    
      I can't wait to see the action start.

    While in Newport this past week I had the pleasure of talking to Tom
    Blackaller about the two boats.  He's sailed on the New Zealand boat. 
    Tom's straightforward answer to my questions about who should win is
    that the cat is at least 25% faster on ANY point of sail, and that all
    this talk about the Kiwis having a chance is just sandbagging.
    
    ... Bob

    It's rumored that SDYC is seriously considering using the
    soft-sail cat to avoid any possible controvery over the
    wing mast.  As we ourselves discussed in this note some time ago,
    there is now debate over whether or not a wing constitutes
    a sail within the context of a "strict interpretation of the
    deed."  
    
    FYI: A brief clip in last Monday's ESPN special showed the
    cat and the monhull sailing quite close to each other -- looked
    like pre-race jousting.  The cat actually looked surprisingly
    nimble.

    One hour ESPN special tonight -- 8 pm.
    Followed by a special on the 12 meter worlds.

    We have just had a long weekend here in the UK, so the club on Friday
    night was well filled. The conversation turned inevitably to the
    Americas Cup. As the evening progressed and more pints were consumed
    the whole future of the cup was discussed. From a hazy memory the
    salient points of agreement were ........
              
    Does the cup as the situation stands today have a future? The cup
    is in the hands of the lawyers and no matter who wins the loser
    will inevitably turn to the courts for retribution. The conclusion
    was that the outcome is in the hands of the big legal battalions
    and thus the future would have more to do with international law and
    less to do with sailing.
              
    The conversation then turned to how the cups future could be secured
    without packs of lawyers examining every challenge. We concluded
    that one way forward might be thus -
              
    The cup should be held by The Royal Yacht Squadron at Cowes (Simple
    because they have not mounted a challenge in recent years and are
    the premier yacht club in UK and are located at Cowes where the
    first race took place). They should in turn set up a conference
    of all the premier Yacht Clubs of the World to agree a definitive set of
    rules for racing for the cup eg As per other international races such
    as the Congressional Cup. The first race would be run in the same
    waters as the first race with full elimination events.
                                                          
    It was also felt that unless something was done that the spirit
    of the cup would be lost and that eventually the cup would not be
    challenged for ,assumimg that the litigation ever ends on the current
    challenge.........                                    
                                                          
    I for one would like to see the cup continue more in line with the
    spirit of the deed of gift and as the premier racing event in the
    world.                         
                                   
    Off the soap box.              
                                   
    ......Pete                                     
                                   
    

    The Cup will recover, but not until some of the pre-Kiwi
    conventions are re-established.  Steps are already being
    taken to do so.  How much doubt is cast over the post-race
    developments by litigation remains to be seen.
    Michael Fay plays the sincere, sporting, and undeservedly 
    abused challenger very well, but I think it's time he admitted 
    his challenge was a sneak attack and just drop it.  If he is 
    a true sportsman -- and I think he may be -- that's what he will 
    do, letting history decide who the real villan was.
    
    Did anyone watch the 12 meter worlds?  A sad farewell to the 
    premier Cup racing class.  Whatever rule is adopted, it's got
    a tough act to follow.
    
    

My understanding is that the Deed of Gift allows the challenger(s) to 
specify what boat he wishes to race. Historically, the defender has 
raced a similar boat. Now that the SDYC is meeting the New Zealand 
monohull challenge with a high tech catamaran, it should be quite clear 
to any future challenger that the only boat to bring to a challenge is a 
faster multihull as long as the defender can sail whatever he wishes. Of
course, Sail America is now one design generation ahead of any future 
multihull challenge. 

Three possibilities: The courts will decide (after New Zealand loses) that 
the defender must sail the same type of boat as the challenger (ie, the 
Sail America catamaran was illegal). Or the Deed of Gift will be changed 
(is this even possible?) to specify more clearly what boats will be 
raced. Or everyone (if anyone) interested in racing for the Cup will 
like gentlemen agree before the event what boats to race (as in the 12 
meter racing). 

I think that the SDYC and Sail America have lessened the prestige of the 
America's Cup considerably by choosing to race a multihull. It would be 
much more interesting (to me, at least) to see two boats of similar 
design racing (ie, two mulithulls or two monohulls). Is it really a race 
when two such dissimilar boats with such different performance sail 
against one another? 

    Boy do I feel dumb, but when are the races starting, and is it true
    that it is simply best 2 out of 3?  I am not a big 12 meter fan,
    especially in light conditions, but the Kiwis can cry in their beer
    all they want as far as I'm concerned.  They brought this whole
    mess upon themselves.  That all this money is wasted to satisfy
    the ego of one man is infuriating.  Multihull technology will
    definitely benefit even in this poor excuse for a cup.
    
    As for the suggestion that the cup go back to Cowes, come and win
    it back ;^) .
    
    Dave

    Re -2

    Alan,
        
    Since we've argued this before, I won't rehash our
    previous thinking -- interested readers could refer back
    to the .50s or so, I believe.  It is merely my opinion that
    SDYC responded in kind to the Kiwis challenge by adopting
    an unexpected tactic that in no way violates a "strict interpretation"
    of the deed.  That the contest will be lop-sided does not matter.
    The class rule in the deed amounts to 90 lwl.  Nothing more.
    Nowhere is the phrase "similar yacht" mentioned.  That
    phenomenon is historical, as you mention, or one might even
    say traditional, a concept you once brow-beat me for invoking.
    The Kiwis could certainly have challenged in a 90 foot cat -- 
    or a hydrofoil -- had they only followed through on the thinking 
    that got them on this tangent in the first place.
    
    SDYC's reaction has been strictly defensive, as they felt 
    rather strongly that they had little chance of designing and building 
    a competitive monohull in the time allowed.  And since their desire 
    to retain the Cup is at least as strong as Michael Fay's desire to get it,
    they did what they believed they had to do -- just like Fay.
    Neither side has the Cup's best interests at the forefront of 
    their mind right now, but I dare say that SDYC did plan to follow 
    through with the 12 meter-era traditions and there's no fault in
    that.  You once seemed to think they were getting what they deserved
    because they hesitated in making a decision, but I can hardly blame
    them for perhaps being a bit overwhelmed at actually having
    the decision to make.  They worked hard for three years to win
    the Cup -- who is Michael Fay to try and snatch it away with
    any less effort?
    
    As for Fay's altruistic proclamations of wanting to restore the
    Cup's "former grandeur" -- implying the need to raise the Cup up 
    from the evidently sordid depths to which it had sunk at Newport 
    and then Perth -- it's all just "grand yacht" propaganda, however much 
    we romantics would like to believe otherwise.  The only way Michael
    Fay can lend grandeur to his challenge is to be magnanimous in
    defeat, and then come back and play on terms everyone agrees
    to up front.  
    
    Ever yours,
    Dean F.
 

Serious questions, and I have no answers: How much research and design 
time was required for the Stars and Stripes catamarans? How does that 
time compare to the time required to design a 90' lwl monohull? There 
seems to be a tremendous amount of far out engineering and construction 
time in Stars and Stripes. 

I won't criticize the SDYC and Sail America folks for wanting very much
to win. Is it possible that they felt that their chances of winning were
better with a catamaran than with a monohull, and that saying that there
wasn't time to design a monohull is a puff of hot air? I must confess
that the arguments both for and against the legality of the catamaran 
sound persuasive. I'm glad I'm not the judge. 

I agree with you, Dean, that it would be very nice if everyone would 
agree on the rules of the next challenge well in advance so that all the 
unseemly squabbling that has occurred this time could be avoided next 
time. And yes, for the benefit of future Cup racing, Fay should follow 
the example of Sir Thomas Lipton -- accept defeat gracefully and try 
again next time.

Alan

    The rationale of setting up a conference of the premier yacht clubs
    of the world to decide the future of the cup is to ensure it has
    a future....... The original deed was drawn up under English law
    (I differentiate because Scottish law is different) and has been
    actioned under US law another different system etc etc it could
    mean that the legal challenges could go on for ever. Prior to the
    current challenge there was some observance of the spirit of the
    cup now things are out of control because of the egos of three men
    one NZ, one US, one UK. To bring the cup back to the premier event
    action needs to be taken now else it will fall in to even more disrepute
    than it currently is.                                     
                                                              
    What's happened to the sportsmanship in this event. 
      
    During Cowes week a few years back a small cruiser was dismasted in a squall
    a group of 38 footers racing near by hove to and stood by the cruiser
    until assistance arrived , they later by mutual agreement resailed
    the race. 
      
    Surely thats what it is all about and not the posession by one man of
    a piece of metal that daily is being devalued.   
                                                              
                                                              
    .....Pete                                                              
                                                                  

    In my opinion this race (and maybe all recent races in the series)
    break the spirit if not the letter of the 'law' as put forth in
    the deed of gift.  If memory serves me, the first America's cup
    race was sailed in working ships.  This event has it's roots in
    maritime history when sailing ships had commercial purpose and
    fast sailing ships were desirable for their commercial advantage.
    
    No author of the original rules could have forseen the extent to
    which sailing 'ships' have been perverted for this extravaganza.
    Any current interpretation of the rule should properly account
    for the unwritten rules that were overlooked in the original through
    presumption.
    
    I don't think we need to hold the race carrying 160 tons of cargo
    but neither do I think this race should have been allowed to degenerate
    into a brawl where the weapons have absolutely no other purpose
    than to advance the ego's of the participants.  Neither of these
    boats is suitable for even a short daysail, neither boat is seaworthy,
    practical, or even pretty.
    
    There is a place for racing this kind of experimental craft because
    admittedly this kind of racing ultimately advances the state of
    the art.  But does it have to be in this context?  For my money
    I find much more excitement in something like the Gloucester Schooner
    race where real ships duke it out with (recreated) real people who
    make their living from the sea. This event is miles closer to
    the intent of the deed of gift than the current 'authentic' America's
    Cup.

    Neither the America nor the British yachts she sailed against were
    working ships in any sense of the term. All were designed for pleasure
    use, usually as racers, by men who specialized in yachts rather
    than working craft. Even their construction was beginning to diverge
    significantly from contemporary working vessels of similar size
    and rig. The main reason they could be confused with working vessels
    is that they were closer in time to their working ancestors (the
    first genuine pleasure yachts date to the late 17th century).
    
    It is certainly true that the America was more seaworthy than
    contemporary 12 meters; she crossed the Atlantic on her own bottom.
    That may be due to the fact that she wasn't designed to a rule :-).
    But plenty of unseaworthy racing yachts were built in that period,
    as well as a few working boats. Consult the history of fishing
    schooners in the mid to late 19th century.
    
    Fishing schooner races involve boats which are much more similar
    to working boats than any yacht or racer, but historically many
    were significantly 'bent' to make them more competitive. At least
    one of the schooners involved in the Fisherman's Cup in the 30s
    made exactly one trip to the Banks, and then only to qualify. Go
    take a look at the next Lobster boat cup in Jonesport if you want
    to see major deviation in nominal work boats from real work boats.
    
    All competition corrupts, but absolute competition corrupts absolutely.
    
    Ross Faneuf
    

    Neither the America nor any of the first defenders were working
    cargo ships.  All were pleasure vessels built and operating
    specifically for racing.  They were the equivalant (sp?) of modern
    IOR racers with wealthy owners and the whole bit.
    
    Dave

    I think the spirit of the "working ship" comment -- not its 
    factuality -- relates to the boats in question having some 
    practical/beneficial value.  Egos and design extremes aside, 
    the 12 meter era gave birth to some of the MOST practical/beneficial
    yachts in recorded history.  The support industry -- the "entourage"
    if you will -- that accompanies the Cup is worth hundreds of millions 
    of dollars to the host country.  We're talking about jobs for little
    people as well as promotional windfalls for big people.  
    By comparison, the viability of these yachts as commercial vessels
    or their impact on the sailing industry is a mere speck.  This is 
    the reason the Cup has fallen on such hard times -- I mean, lets be 
    honest, the economic insentive to possess the Cup is a pretty big 
    distraction.  
    
    Unfortunately, as with so many economy driven issues of late, if the
    underpinnings aren't sustained, the entire structure seems doomed.
    I'd like to think that the sailing community will find a way -- in a
    very subtle but tangible fashion -- to set an example that reaffirms the 
    values of international cooperation, even handedness, and friendly 
    competition.  
    
    In my dreams.  Sorry for taking such a tangent.
    
    :|
    Dean

    Sorry about my rusty memory!  My intent really was to connect the
    racing to some tangible purpose.  The cup, I suspect, is firmly
    rooted in commercial 'racing' that preceeded it.  Some skippers
    and their ships became legendary with their passage times and success
    was (in those days) heavily dependent on getting the cargo moved
    in one piece and on time [fast].
    
    The current boats are hilarious in this context.  One is totally
    dependent on live ballast while the other has to be tipped on its
    side at night to keep it from blowing to pieces at the dock.  The
    rumored British entry sounds like a piece of plywood sailed on edge.
    
    I might just be an incurable romantic or something but this race
    interests me only in the sense of its shoot out value not its
    esthetics.  Kind of like the difference between watching a forest
    fire or a barbeque.

    How long before we see a 90' sailboard with 45 people hanging off
    the boom to keep it going?  Should move though ...!!!

RE: .165,   "I find much more excitement in something like the Gloucester
             Schooner race where real ships duke it out with (recreated) 
             real people who make their living from the sea."

Minor tangent to those for whom this strikes a responsive chord:  This 
Labor Day weekend, Sunday I think (but call the C of C to check), is the
Esperanto Cup -- the annual schooner race out of Gloucester.  The city's
new pride, the Adventure (most successful ($) fishing boat out of
Gloucester, ever), will be sailing, along with the Harvey Gamage, Spirit 
of Massachusetts, and probably another half dozen or more.  If you can get 
out on the water between Cape Ann and Halfway Rock off Marblehead, it 
makes for an interesting and impressive show.

Sorry for the diversion from topic, but why start a new one-shot note....

J.

    Oh yeah, forgot to mention that SDYC picked
    the winged cat.  The last ESPN special
    showed her sailing close-hauled with a genoa.
    Must be quite a headstay arrangment that
    keeps enough tension yet does not interfere
    with articulating the wing.
    
    Anyone heard more about Blue Arrow?  She is in
    San Diego, yes?  Have they taken her out for
    informal speed trails against the cats or the Kiwis?
    
    Dean

    ;)
    

    You call that a race ??? HAH !
    
    The first two minutes looked like it.  After that it was a joke.
    The S&S tactician was just along for the ride.  Dennis looked about
    as bored as he did in the Pepsi commercial.  The damned cat looked like
    a billboard.  (They outta put a sign on the bow saying "this space for
    rent".)
    
    Perhaps they should give both boats PHRF handicaps.  That'd really
    give'm something to fight about.  Whoever heard of an America's Cup
    race where one boat deliberately slows down so it doesn't win by too 
    much?  What a travesty.
    
    I'm just glad this thing isn't a best of seven.  Hope the damage to the
    interest in Cup racing isn't too bad.  It's definitely a far cry from
    Fremantle.
    
    ... Bob
    

    -1  What happend ?
    
    in the german speaking countries,americas cup is not in the
    press. (not even 1 line).I have to relay on this notesfile entry.
    So what happend ?
    
    Peter

    Peter,
    
    Stars and Stripes won by 18+ minutes -- and they
    deliberately went slow throughout the 40 mile race.
    They could probably have finished close to an hour
    in front of KZ-1.  To say the boats are mis-matched is a
    gross understatement.  
    
    If it goes back to court and the judge bases her decision 
    on an interpreation of the word "match," as opposed to an
    interpretation of the "class-rules" in the deed, Faye could win 
    the court battle.  Certainly, all the TV commentators are 
    supplying plenty of expert testimony -- over and above the 
    incontrovertible fact that S&S significantly outperforms the Kiwis'
    boat on all points and, apparently, in any breeze short of
    what it would take to break the wing mast or pitch-pole the cat.
    
    The court case aside, the contest does bring one point home.
    A free-wheeling design confrontation is doo-doo.  Without
    extremely strict design parameters, the America's Cup will
    go down the tubes.  There are all kinds of rumors about the 
    "next" class -- the old 12's again for one last round to give 
    newcomers a fair shot; maxi ultra-lights ala KZ-1 but "only" 
    85 feet; super 12-meters that borrow heavily from the old rule 
    but loose some weight and gain some sail.  I'd vote the latter.
    
    Hope the wind really blows on Friday -- 15+ knots.  It would
    at least be exciting to see both boats in high gear.
    

    Stars & Stripes won by 18 minutes.  And that was dogging it.
    
    So it's boring.  That was the intent.  Dispense with this stupidity
    as quickly and as quietly as possible and get back to real cup racing.
                                
    It's like Fay is saying "I've got the fastest Roll Royce in the
    world" and Conner is saying "That's great, but I've got a Formula
    One."  
    
    Dave

    ... and if you think yesterday's race was a slaughter, wait'll they
    race tomorrow.  
    
    A Hobie 16 could probably beat the Kiwis on a course that's mostly a
    reach.
    
    This is a classic "tortoise and hare" situation.  Perhaps Dennis should
    stop at the first mark for a little nap.  Turn over Aesop, grab a pen
    and re-write the ending.  The tortoise loses, then the wise owl decides
    it wasn't a fair race.  But the hare appeals to the fox, who ...
    
    g'day ...
    		... Bob

    Gee folks, what a call huh??? " let the kiwis have the start, and
    then motor". All of us Catamaran nuts appreciate Dennis upholding
    the honor of "high performance" sailing. That means going fast,
    not some relative term!!  8>)
    
    I loved the CNN newclip showing S&S leaving half the stinkpots in the
    harbor yesterday!!!   Under her own power.
    
    Luckily it will be all over come tommorrow. I hope the courts will
    uphold the deed and let the world go back to racing 12 metres for
    the cup.
    
    Re .178  Hey Bob, you dig up a 16 in San Diego, and I'll run Fay
    for pink slips (Hey, it's not my boat!!!). Actually, an article
    in Hobie Hotline this month commented that a couple couldn't keep
    up with the monohull on a 16. 
    
    john
    
    (remember, a monohull is only half fast)

    	I love Conner's comment at the post-race Press Meeting -
    "I'm sailing a cat.  He's sailing a dog."     - Chris

    Yeah, Conner is quite the sportsman all right.  That's why we had this
    wonderful "match" race to entertain us all.  Honestly, you could have
    as much excitement watching paint dry.
    
    Now let's hope they clear up the court nonsense quickly and get back to
    real yacht racing.
    
    ... Bob

    One more Conners quote from the end of the press conference
    as everyone was leaving:

    	'Get lost.  You're losers, get off the stage.'

    Very nice.

    Yeah, Dennis is a real sport.  I heard, though, that the Kiwi spinnaker
    is so large that it could completely cover his ego.
    
    :^)

    
    I don't see anything wrong with Conners' sportsmanship.  The "dog"
    remark came after NZ said Conners was dogging the race, which prompted
    Conners to say, "I have the cat.  They have the dog."  It was a
    joke.  
    
    If anyone's sportsmanship is a little weak, it's the syndicate that
    tried to "win" the Cup with a nontraditional interpretation of the
    rules that seems designed more for a courtroom challenge than a
    sailing one.  Proof of where NZ plans to do its real fighting is
    that the _loser_ is complaining about not having _lost_ by the biggest 
    possible margin.  This is what Conners is responding to, both with
    his "dog" remark and his suggestion that NZ not tell him how to
    race until they demonstrate that they know something about winning
    the cup.
    
    If Conners seems cynical, I think it's because the NZs approached this
    challenge so cynically to start with.  I think Conners disposed of this
    challenge in exactly the spirit that it was made. 
    
                                                     

	So, what happened in the second race, for those of us who had to work
	out of town on Friday and could not watch the race?

chris.

    In Perth, Dennis Connors at least affected a semblance
    of sportsmanship -- but being magnanimous in victory is easy.
    So why is Dennis showing his true colors again now?  
    Could it be he's really worried about the court battle?
    
    Could be.  
    
    Now the world gets to wait for another trial.
    Hope they get it over with quickly -- either way -- as it's 
    time to plan a REAL regatta!!!!!!!

    The second race was also a blowout.
    
    I think Dennis treated the whole affair with the respect it deserved.
    

    Now on the the real America's Cup.  (courtroom antics aside)
    
    Speaking of lawyers...  you heard about the tragedy of a bus load
    of lawyers going over a cliff...
    
    ...there were 3 empty seats.
    
    Walt

    ... Pepsi ...
    
    Everybody else lost.  New Zealand lost the race.  Dennis lost his cool. 
    Michael Faye lost a whole lot of money.  I lost respect for D.C. for
    his post-race behavior.  And a whole lot of folks lost interest in the
    whole affair.  Let's hope we can all suffer some memory loss now before
    the next "real" challenge takes place.
    
    ... Bob

    In the Boston Globe sports televsion column there was a nice dig....Who
    makes Pepsi's marketing decisions---first Mike Tyson, now Dennis
    Connor.
    
    I agree, DC's attitude is almost enough for me to root for Tom Blackhaler!

    I have been rather turned off by this whole affair until I had
    a thought come into my memory the other day....
    
    I have pretty much stayed on top of all of the events with
    this fiasco.  The one thing I can't recall the media, Stars &
    Stripes, or N.Z. make issue with is what happened in Fremantle.
    
    If anyone recalls, I believe that Dennis Connor made alot of
    stink about Kiwi Majic in the 1987 Cup Race.  How many times
    did Conner accuse the NZ syndicate of having an illegal boat
    because it was fiberglass?  How many times did he publicly prod
    the 12 meter police into drilling into the hull of KZ-7 to
    test for illegal weight distribution, etc.?
    
    Did Dennis actually start this whole mess, and now Michael Fay
    having back at him for delayed revenge?  Seems possible to me!

    Firstly, congratulations to SDYC.
    
    Michael Fay came up with a good challenge, but left at least one
    loophole which was cleverly exploited.  I think he should forget
    about the court case.  It might help with clarifying future challenges
    but I can't see a judge finding in his favour.
    
    Doesn't it say in the deed that the vessels must be ocean going?.
    I wonder which, if either, of the boats could sail the oceans!.
    
    
    Sportsmanship.  This is not what the America's Cup is about.
    Business.       This is     what the America's Cup is about.
    
    Michael Fay may have lost the race, but with promotional ventures
    and various business meetings I doubt that he and his business partners
    will be out of pocket for long.
    
    It's that extra interest of high finance, grand gestures, and
    wheeling and dealing that makes the America's Cup have a following 
    more akin to "Dallas" than does the world 12 metre championship.
    There are boat races for those who only want sailing.
    
    
    Imagine if the current meeting of previous cup holders comes up
    with a "fair" set of rules!.  Interest will wane.
        
    
    Send in the clowns.  The America's Cup is good entertainment; even
    with old-fashion, cost-cutting, 12 metre barges that everyone can
    afford.
    
    
    BTW:  Who slipped the judge a back-hander to disallow Peter De Savary's
    ultra-fast challenger :-).
    
    
    Cheers, Martin

    Is it just me or does anyone else out there see an analogy between
    the events around the American Cup and Formula 1 racing. The
    commercialization, the "rules games", the petty bickering, etc...
    
    What evolved over several years in auto racing seems to be taking
    place in a relatively short time in this series. The formula is
    quite simple: he who rules the rules rules the race OR he who puts
    in the most bread rules the rules and thus the race.
    
    Maybe its just MY perception, but I'm experiencing deja vu,
    
    Bob

    Finally had a chance to view the tapes from ESPN. I don't understand
    what all this Conner bashing is about. From where I see it Michael
    Fay is the turkey in this situation. His and his whole crew's attitude
    reminds me of the Cowardling Lion from the Wizard of OZ. He thought
    he could huff and puff and bully his way to an America's cup victory
    with his one off winged deck monster. Now that someone has poked him
    in the nose all they do is whine and complain about how mistreated
    they are and they don't get any respect from Big Bad Dennis.
    
    Give me a break, Michael!
    
    This whole thing smacks of a vendetta against Dennis because of the
    nasty things he said at Perth about KIWI MAGIC. I don't think it
    was a good challenge at all. It was meant to embarrass Conner and
    Sail America. If he wanted to be taken seriously he should challanged
    in a twelve meter. San Diego would have been forced to meet that
     challange in a fair fight. Apparantly a fair fight was not what
    Michael Fay was looking for. He was hoping to catch the Yanks off
    guard with the "K" boat.
                                                                     
    Sail America's response to Michael Fay's challange was an appropiate
    one to a sneak attack. And Dennis's comments have been right on
    and if anything to restrained. I'm hoping he'll tell Michael to
    next time save your sneak attacks for the New Zealand sheep.
    
    to 
    

    hi,
    
    I am not a sailor, but I am a fan of the America's Cup. I'd like
    to distract the conversation a bit into speculation about the boats
    that were raced in '88 themselves. 
    
    As I understand it, both boats esentially created brand new classes.
    Are these just one-shots, are these boats attractive enough in their
    own rights to create a following? Any speculation?
    
    Sm

    Re.195  Good point.  Neither of the boats has much of a future I
    can think of.  The NZ is way too tender and has too much draft to
    be converted to a super cruiser economically.  The cat simply has
    no competition and is certainly no cruiser.  A lot less to scrap
    though than NZ.  Then again, what good were the 12's?  Just kidding,
    no flames, please.  
    
    Dave

    Re.196 The Cat never sailed against DeSavary's craft (I chose the
    word craft carefully...) which if it didn't sink would certainly
    be competition for it.
    
    Pete

    re .195
    
    More than likely, these boats will be one-offs.
    It might be that S&S -- in modified form -- could
    make a run at sailing's world top-speed record, but 
    I think that's highly unlikely.  The Kiwi boat
    is a "dinosaur."  The only way she would survive
    as a racing class is if she won and the Kiwis immediately
    announced that they would defend in K-class boats in 
    199? -- ala 12 meter tradition.  Wouldn't that have
    been a twist of the blade!
    
    I would not put it past someone to convert the Kiwi boat
    for his/her personal use.  Put a wing keel on her and the
    draft problem is solved.  I'm sure Bruce Farr could
    design a smaller, more easily handled rig -- knock off the
    bow-sprit, move the mast slightly aft, add a roller-furly jib,
    and use lazy-jacks on the main.  There must be plenty of room below 
    for luxury accomodations, and if Farr added a ballasting system that 
    pumped high-volumes of water from the low to the high side, 
    I could see the boat sailing with a crew of 6.
    
    It is too bad that Blue Arrow and S&S haven't sailed against
    each other.  Pete, did you say Blue Arrow sank?  Or do you mean
    she has a penchant to fill up with water?  That's a pretty
    big IF to qualify her as competitive with S&S.
    
    Stay tuned for court action and the politics of selecting
    a new class.
    
    ;)

    To my knowledge Blue Arrow is still on the West Coast of the US
    waiting for someone to race against. My reference to her sinking
    was partly in jest but based on some reading over here that if the
    "pilot" ie him who operates the hydraulics accidently put the control
    surfaces in the wrong position she could go under.......... There
    has been some speculation over here that she may have a go at the
    speed record, if nothing else it would be good publicity for DeSavary.
    The "pilot" would be Chris Law who is one of the better Olympic helmsman
    we have produced. It would be a shame not to see her at her full
    potential. Saw Valsheda (I think) out last weekend one of the original
    J boats, bought it all home about how far technology has taken us....
        
    Pete      

    
    Does anyone have footage of Blue Arrow that they would be willing
    to lend out?  I have a VHS format player and am interested in getting
    a look at this boat.  
    
    						-Dave Concordia
    						 CTC1-2/K4
    						 (Chelmsford, MA) 

    Forgive me for mentioning this, but isn't it correct that the
    rules for the next race haven't been finalized yet?  Maybe the
    sensible thing would be to make the rule "90 feet overall length,
    soft sail, one hull", and let the designers work from there.  I
    don't see that the 12 meter formula keeps cost down, since there
    is always more technology to spend any available money on.  Perhaps
    some real improvements in racing boats would be the result of a
    fairly open formula.

    Re .201 How do you define "hull"?  Would outriggers be allowed?
    How do you determine where the "soft sail" begins and the mast ends?
    Could have a 40 foot wide mast conveniently in the shape of an airfoil
    and a 3 foot wide soft sail.  No, I agree with those who believe
    that real competition and development is best in a well defined
    and constrained environment.  Also, if people have the money to
    spend on these boats, let them.  Sailing at grand prix level is
    not cheap.  Realistically, you better have a budget of $400 to $500
    thousand to campaign a world class one-tonner!  Before travel expenses!
    
    Dave

    Bob B. and I were discussing the lack of TV coverage 
    Olympic sailing received this year, and it dawned
    on us that this could be directly related to the earlier
    America's Cup fiasco.  Perhaps the network beleived the
    America's Cup so deadened public interest in sailing that
    little or no coverage was warranted.  The first manifestation
    of just how bleak that side-show really was?
    
    Anyone see any other signs to support this notion?
    

    I don't believe this is the way it happened. Things I've seen written
    about this indicate that the network planned all along to provide
    very minimal coverage. This was despite lobbying by some sailing
    organizations for more time. The network did make contingency plans
    in case there was some 'newsworthy' controversy at Pusan or if the
    USA sailors had some spectacular successes - they love to cover
    flag raisings. Arrangements were made with ESPN and Gary Jobson
    to make him available for commentary if needed, but this never occurred.

    J_R

re 203 & 204

Actually sailing did receive a fair amount of coverage, only it was covered as
part of the 4-5pm show (east coast) and not in prime time. Unfortunately I
didn't discover this until the second to last day; but the footage I did see
was very impressive. 470s flying spinnakers in 25+ knots and heavy seas does
make good television. 

- Bob

    Well, to revive some additional interest ... there was an article in
    Sunday's Boston Globe that described the design that's apparently been
    agreed to for the 1991 America's Cup.  It's designed by Britton Chance,
    part of Dennis Conner's Stars & Stripes design group.  
    
    Some excerpts from the article:
    
    **********************************************************************
    
    ... The new 23-meter boat would (a) be a thoroughly modern racer that
    reflects the new technology and construction materials and (b) strike a
    balance between being an exceptional boat worthy of the higest level of
    the sport, and yet come in at an affordable price. (about $1.5 million)
    
    ... The "America's Cup Class - or 23-meter - is about 56 feet at the
    waterline (LOA 77 feet), with an 18-foot beam, a draft of 14 feet and 
    a displacement of about 35,000 lbs.
    
    This makes the boat just half the weight of a Twelve, yet with a rig
    about 20 feet higher, at 106 feet.  The rig will feature a masthead
    spinnaker on a pole abouty 30 percent longer than normal, will have a
    fully battened main, and may use gennakers.
    
    ...According to the designers' computer modeling, in ideal conditions
    it should be capable of 16 knots on a broad reach, should surf 20
    knots, and be able to go upwind at 10 knots.
    
    ... most of the challengers for the 1991 Cup studied the design at a
    meeting, and there was no serious objection.
    
    ... "Twelve-meters ... are a dead issue" (designer Britton Chance).
    
    *********************************************************************
    
    Any opinions ???
    
    ... Bob

    just after the cup, we had the maxi cup in the sf bay. the local
    paper did not give it any coverage. these 80ft boats were docked
    at my marina and i thought they were the most beautiful boats i
    have seen. conners was on one of the boats!! each one cost around
    1-2 million..
    
    i left a note for conners,for drinks, but i didn't show...
    
    jfk

    re.206
    
    Sigh... The America's Cup is dead.  Long live
    the America's Cup.
    
    That will drop the bottom out of the
    used 12 market.  Anyone want to form a syndicate and
    buy one?  We could get "Heart of America" for about
    $100,000.  I'm sure others will pop up for much less.
    Converted 12's have done admirably in all sorts of
    racing...
    
    As for the new design, I'll have to dig up the Globe.
    One thing is for certain, the cost will exceed Brit's
    sales-pitch estimate.

>>>    That will drop the bottom out of the
>>>    used 12 market.  Anyone want to form a syndicate and
>>>    buy one?  We could get "Heart of America" for about
>>>    $100,000.  I'm sure others will pop up for much less.
>>>    Converted 12's have done admirably in all sorts of
>>>    racing...
    
Maybe we can get Dave Johnston interested in one to replace FT. 
Lots more room aboard for all us DEChands!  (And some of us, it 
seems, would be admirably suited for the afterguard....) 

;-),  J.

    No interest in one of those pigs.

    You'll NEVER convince me that a 65 footer doing 9 knots at 25 
    degrees true is the definition of pig.  I'd gladly own a "Kiwi Magic"
    and take on all comers.    ;)
            
    Of interest:  There will be a rematch of the '87 Perth finalists
    using the "Kookaburras."  Connors and Murray square off this
    January in what promises to be a good match race event. (They
    will flip a coin to determine who gets which boat.)

    Heard on the news the other day (only jst got back to notes after
    vacation) that "Blue Arrow" capsized and broke up off the southwest
    coast of England.

    Now that's a shame that S&S and Blue Arrow never
    met on the water.  I suspect Blue Arrow would
    have shown spurts of superior speed, but 
    overall she'd have been too fragile and finnicky
    to run 'round the buoys.

    The court battle for the Cup has commenced.
    Anyone making odds?

    Even the boys on New Zealand didn't believe that the courts would
    rule in their favor when we talked to them a month ago.

    I find it interesting that the New York and Royal Perth yacht clubs are
    supporting the New Zealand argument.  What's in it for them ??
    
    ... Bob

    The New York Yacht club supports the Kiwi's suit because it affords
    them a potential oppurtunity to challenge directly for the cup.  If
    the San Diego Yacht club prevails, the defender will sail as that
    club's representative even if the boat is sponsored by a syndicate
    of New York Yacht Club members.  Thus, there is no incentive for
    NYYC to compete for the right to defend if they just have to hand
    the cup over to the SDYC.  
    
    If the Kiwis prevail, the NYYC can mount a challange which, if
    successful, will give them complete posession of the cup.
    
    For the Australians, there's the possibility of a closer venue and
    more inconvenience and expense for the other challangers.
    
    - gene

    L.A. Times 1/9/89
    
    			AUSTRALIA OKs YACHT PROPOSAL
    
    	Dr. Stanley Reid of Australia's Royal Perth Yacht Club, the Challenger
    of Record for America's Cup XXVIII, announced an agreement Sunday
    at San Diego on a proposal to replace the 12-meter yachts.
    	The Challenger of Record, representing 25 challengers for the
    America's Cup, said the new class of boat will be 75 feet on the
    waterline, 102 feet high with an 18-foot beam, 13-feet draft and
    a displacement weight of between 16,000 and 25,000 kilos.
    	Tom Ehman, executive vice president of the America's Cup Organizing
    Committee, said the defending San Diego Yacht Club has agreed in
    principle with the items with confirmation coming by Jan.21.
    
    Don 

    The NY Supreme Court has reiterated its position
    that the America's Cup case is an extrememly low
    priority.  I think that must make New Zealand's chances
    all the bleaker.
    
    Does anyone know what happened in the 12 meter series between
    Conner and Murray this past week?

Iain Murry won the first race. In the second race, Dennis was leading, lost 
the lead to a wind shift and then went aground. Iain wins.

There was a picture of the grounded Kookabura in this morning's Manchester 
Union Leader.

- bob

    The series sailed on Sydney Harbour must have been a disappointment
    to anyone hoping to see good competitive 12 m racing.
    
    It can best be described as as spectacular day on the harbour...I
    sailed my boat to Pittwater for the weekend to get away from the
    crush.
    
    On the first day Conner was hit by a spectator boat, and the harbour
    was so crowded that the two 12's spent most of their skill in avoiding
    spectator boats.
    
    There were seven races over the three days.  It ended up that the
    last race would be the decider.  In the last, Conner was leading until he
    hit Shark Island. Until that point he was well ahead after Murray was
    forced to execute a 270 degree after hitting Conner.
    
    This was a result of an over zealous move to stop Conner passing to
    windward when both boats were approaching the first mark.
    
    The real winner was probably the ANZ Bank which was the major sponsor.
    However Murray picked up $A300,000 for coming first, and Conner received
    $A200,000.
            

    Why didn't they go back out off Fremantle -- in the
    Indian Ocean where the twelves thrive?  A commercial
    circus -- what a bleak finale for 12 meter racing.
    
    :(

I grew up in Newport (before it turned into snob heaven), so I have a 
strong affection for the 12's. Back then, very few people knew of the 
America's Cup or 12 meters. I'm sorry to see the 12's die, even though 
they're outdated. I'll never forget catching Australia II out on the 
practice course. The Aussies raised the genny, dropped the chute, and 
hardened up right in front of us as we bobbed along in a Rhodes 19. There
was a good breeze and that 12 went by with the power of a freight train.  
I loved the coverage of the Freemantle challenge, heavy boats crashing
through big seas!  I found myself watching all night.

If the Cup stays in San Diego, the races will never match those at
Freemantle. I don't think it matters what type the boats are. Heavy
weather and close competition makes great TV and will be hard to beat.

-Paul

    Re.222
    
    To add detail to your comment about a `commercial circus' the two
    boats had a TV cameraman aboard so we saw and heard everything,
    plus both skippers and navigators were wired for sound!
    
    Last night I watched a video of the last race. I was wrong in my
    note .221.  Conner went aground on Shark Island when he was some
    distance behind Murrey in race 7.  Murrey hit Conner in the following
    race (8), which was described as an exhibition race as the `series' had
    already been won by Murrey with his success in race 7.  Guess the
    sponsors wanted their full quid.  
    
    The TV coverage from the airship really showed just how close was the
    spectator fleet.  Both boats were regularly affected by the wash
    from the fleet of watchers.
    
    A sad end to the 12's.  Incidently both boats were covered in sponsor
    logos. Best to think this was a summer event, not 12 metre racing. 
                              

    A ruling on the Kiwi case was due this month, but
    it seems to be delayed.  Can't imagine why.
    The Kiwis have vowed to appeal a negative decision,
    which could push the issue as far out as '92. 
    
    On the home-front, the new class has been accepted.
    The rule is similar in intent to the 12 meter rule,
    although the boats will be thoroughly "modern."
    A new course has also been approved -- 22.6 miles
    with several more legs (I don't remember how many)
    than the traditional 12 meter course.  

    Oh yeah, an interesting side-bar:  It seems 
    that sponsorship of tobacco companies has 
    been barred.  
    
    Aren't you proud to be associated with such an 
    upstanding sport!

The NY court ruled today that the Stars and Stripes catamaran was 
illegal (no details on what this means) and has awarded possession of 
the America's Cup to New Zealand. 

I feel sorry for those whose hard work was for naught, but the SDYC and 
Sail America and Dennis Connor richly deserve this ruling (in my view) 
for their arrogance and poor sportsmanship. 

Ta ta! Three cheers for a better match next time!

    The NY court said that the SDYC violated the "spirit of the rule
    by racing a catamaran against a monohull".  (Ah, g'day mate!  Is that 
    different from a mega-story, flat-topped behemoth which kinda meets
    the rules???)
    
    "We've been had..." said a spokesman for the SDYC.
    
    The San Diego Yacht Club will review the court's decision and decide 
    upon an appeal within the next day or so...
    
    Months later, the saga continues; more to come, I'm sure...
    
    Aaron

moved by moderator

================================================================================
           <<< MSCSSE::SYS$SYSDEVICE:[NOTES$LIBRARY]SAILING.NOTE;1 >>>
                                  -< Sailing >-
================================================================================
Note 1162.0                   America's Cup Stolen                     3 replies
XCUSME::JOHNSEN                                       2 lines  28-MAR-1989 19:53
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Just heard the news, the America's Cup was awarded to New Zealand
    by the New York Supreme Court. Is this fair? 
================================================================================
Note 1162.1                   America's Cup Stolen                        1 of 3
SHRARA::BAKER "What's 200yrs/40000yrs fellas?"        8 lines  28-MAR-1989 22:34
                  -< DC,the only man to lose the cup,TWICE! >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

RE:>                     <<< Note 1162.0 by XCUSME::JOHNSEN >>>
   >                        -< America's Cup Stolen >-
   >
   > Just heard the news, the America's Cup was awarded to New Zealand
   > by the New York Supreme Court. Is this fair? 
    
    
    YES.
================================================================================
Note 1162.2                   America's Cup Stolen                        2 of 3
SQPUFF::HASKELL                                       5 lines  29-MAR-1989 07:35
                                    -< YES >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    You'd better believe it was fair.
    
    This was just another case of America trying to bamboozle the world.
    
    Paul
================================================================================
Note 1162.3                   America's Cup Stolen                        3 of 3
DOCO2::GINGER "Ron Ginger"                            8 lines  29-MAR-1989 08:29
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Sure its 'fair', whatever 'fair' means. This is just the latest in a long series
of grossly unsportsman like activities in the cup history. Admittedely the 
recent era- say 1960 to 1983- was reasonably sporting, the 1880-1910 era was 
grossly unfair.

I just hope the kiwis have the good sense of sport to define some reasonable 
new rules and return this thing to a sporting event, not a legal event. Ive
heard enough loud mouth BS. Lets have a sailing contest!

Somewhere in this file I've previously given my opinion that both boats were
inappropriate to the America's Cup, so I'm no fan of Michael Fay or the SDYC.
I would say that neither side deserves the Cup; but I guess I'm pleased that it
appears to be going to New Zealand. At least in NZ there's a chance of more
interesting sailing conditions than offered by San Diego. Anyone have any info 
on sailing conditions on Mercury Bay?

- Bob

    To paraphrase Dennis himself (now the only American to lose
    the cup TWICE!) -- 'Get out of court Dennis, you're a
    loser.'

    Re. 230
    
    Mecury Bay is a very small sailing club.  The size can be judged
    by the fact that the Club's `operation base' is a 1956 Ford Zephyr.
     For those unfamiliar with a Zephyr, it was a British car.  Still
    a lot of them in N.Z.
    
    I believe the next series will be sailed in the Hauraki Gulf off
    Auckland.  A very pleasant stretch of sailing water.
    
    A little known, and enjoyable area, just about to get the world
    spotlight!
    
    Heard last night that Alan Bond reckons his attept will cost between
    A$30 and 50 million. 
    
    

    "Dennis Connor, now that you've lost the America's Cup, what are
    you going to do?"
    
    

                                      
                    "I'm going to Walt Disney World/Land"
                                                      
                                                      

    I'm also glad to see Dennis Conner take a beating. Reading his book
    "Comeback" convinced me that he is basically a jerk. Very fast and
    competitive on the water - but still a jerk. If Dennis ever decides
    to quit the America's Cup game don't worry, we've got Tom Blackaller,
    another poor sportsman waiting to carry on the tradition.
    
    Unfortunately, this decision rewards Michael Fay. A man whose sole
    motivation in this whole affair is to make a ton of money. He and
    Dennis deserve one another.
    
    Whatever happened to real sportsman like Sir Thomas Lipton and Bob
    Bavier?

>>>    Unfortunately, this decision rewards Michael Fay. A man whose sole
>>>    motivation in this whole affair is to make a ton of money. He and
>>>    Dennis deserve one another.
    
I can see how the local businesses in whatever place the competition is
being held can make additional profits as a result of the America's Cup.
The cost of a Cup campaign is reportedly now in the over $50 million
range. Some of that money comes from corporate and individual sponsors,
to be sure. It seems to me that Fay is man with sufficient personal and
corporate financial resources to indulge his desire to win the most
coveted trophy in sailing. If you want greed, read the comments made by
the mayor of San Diego (which included impugning the judicial integrity
of Judge Ciparick). Connor is no doubt makes much money from the Cup
through the salary he is paid and all those Pepsi commercials, etc. I
have difficulty seeing how Fay is personally going to profit financially
from all this. 

    RE .234
    
    Pardon my ignorance, but what makes you refer to Tom Blackaller
    as "another poor sportsman".  From what I've read, and from having
    met the man last year, he doesn't impress me as coming from the
    same mold as Conner at all.  Granted he seems to have a supreme
    ego, but what else do you expect to find at that level of any sport?
    
    RE the Decision
    
    Dennis simply got what he deserved.  Unfortunately, Michael Faye
    didn't.  They should've treated this whole situation just like what
    it was; a couple of spoiled rich kids fighting over a favorite toy.
    Any child psychologist will tell you the proper response is to take
    it away from both of them.
    
    Personal opinion - losing the Cup to Australia was the best thing
    that could have happened, from a public interest viewpoint.  Bringing
    it back to San Diego was the worst thing that could have happened.
    It's definitely in my "who gives a sh!t" category on my interest
    list.
    
    ... Bob
    

RE .235

New Zealand's economy will benefit enormously, and Michael Faye 
is invested in it. At Mercury Bay (or wherever the defense will be), real
estate investments alone should turn a nice profit for Faye. I think
we are in for some San Diego style arrogance and greed with a New 
Zealand twist. 

RE .236

I've read that Blackaller likes to play mind games to rattle his oponent.
According to Conner (I know - bad source), these are some of the things
Blackaller has done:

 * Cut the deck of Conners Star boat with a hacksaw during a world championship.

 * While Conner's kids were playing in the center of a circular driveway in
   Newport, Blackaller drove a van in off the street and circled the kids
   at high speed to scare them.

 * In Freemantle, Blackaller would have his crew pound the decks and
   scream curses at Conner whenever the two boats were in close proximity
   during a race. Conner called this the "Monkeys in the jungle" routine.

 * Again in Freemantle, Blackaller's chase boat commonly hurled half full 
   cans of beer into the cockpit of STARS & STRIPES.

Now I have no love for Conner, but nobody deserves this kind of abuse. 


    In the past, there have been several periods where the America's Cup
    was a dirty game. So it seems the tradition continues in grand style.
                            
    -Paul
-Paul
 

    Granted, Blackaller is a wild man, but immensly (sp?) likable. 
    My favorite story about him is when he was racing our old boat (then
    named Detente) in the SORC.  The owner had spared no expense in
    using ultralight materials for everything, including the head door
    which reportedly cost a thousand dollars itself.  In the middle
    of the Gulf Stream during a night race the crew hears a ripping
    sound whereupon Tom appears on deck with the offending door and
    tosses it into the ocean to the owners horror.  "Hell, we don't
    need this" was his only explanation.
    
    At that level of racing psych games are part of the territory, and
    Conner is not innocent of them at all.
    
    I'm glad the cup went to NZ just so it won't automatically go back
    to San Diego if the US wins next time.  Would rather see it at St.
    Francis or even New York YC.  Can you imagine racing in San Fran
    bay?  To me any place is better than San Diego!
    
    Dave

Re: .237

    I'm really dubious about Connor's claims. If Blackaller was caught
    cutting  someone  else's  boat  he  would  have been kicked out of
    racing  for  5  years. It's not worth the risk. He might have told
    Connors that he was going to, but I don't believe that he would do
    it.

    As for the reported incidents in Freemantle, there were TV cameras
    everywhere,  including  on the boats. Has anyone looked at all the
    footage?  I'm  sure  someone had a camera on during crossings. (Of
    course pounding your decks is perfectly legal.)

    Knowing that  Conners  accused  everyone in sight of cheating, I'm
    quite  sure  that  if he had any evidence of these charges that he
    would  have  brought  it to the protest room. Throwing things onto
    your  opponent's  boat  isn't  legal.  Since  there  were a lot of
    cameras around, I have to believe that Conners is making this up.

--David

    RE. -1
    
    The onboard camera'a were not installed until after Blackaller was
    eliminated. I think the beer can throwing occured before and after
    the races.
    
    Is Conner a liar? We'll never know for sure. But it's sad that Conner
    and Blackaller represent us to the world.
    
    -Paul

    I tend to agree that I find some of Connor's claims to be pretty
    unbelievable.
    
    Having seen the intensity with which Connor goes after his opponents,
    I can't imagine he'd just sit idly by while somebody cuts his boat.
    Not only would this tend to get one diqualified from racing, but
    I'd have to believe it'd be a criminal offense as well (vandalism
    at the least).  Do you think Connor would just ignore the opportunity
    to have an opponent arrested ?  I think not.
    
    As for the beer throwing incident, to my knowledge it wouldn't have
    to occur during a race to be considered grounds for disqualification.
    I have to believe this, because a few years ago I heard of an incident
    where a boat was disqualified from a race because the previous night 
    some of the boat's crew had poured beer down an opponent's hatches.
    If that's the way they handle the amateur races, I can't imagine
    they'd overlook such behavior at the "professional" level.
    
    These guys are all a bunch of overblown egomaniacs anyway.  Show
    me any of the prominent "contenders" for the cup who are sportsmanlike.
    Sorry, it just doesn't happen that way.  There's too much money
    involved.
    
    ... Bob
    

    One prominent sportsman:  Buddy Melges, Heart of America challenge

    hi there i live in auckland n.z. the temporary home of the america's
    cup as i beleive the san diego yacht club will appeal ,the decision
    so it could take up to 18mths to decide.
    
     but as for the sailing conditions where they will hold the defence
    if it happens, they are about 1hrs motoring out from the main port
    of auckland off the northern suburbs of auckland,well i spent the
    last three days racing my 30ft keel boat over the area.The breezes
    in the morning where less than 3kts the first day with a sea breeze
    comming in the early afternoon at about 10-12 kts.the second day
    we had a drifter of less than 1-2kts in the moring with 1 triangle
    taking 4.5hrs with as it turned out 2 windward legs again in the
    afternoon we had a good breeze of 10-12 kts true, yesteraday it
    blew 20-30 kts all day and today it's back to 5-10, so the wind
    can range from nothing to 40kts plus and it changes daily so it's
    very variable.
    
     Auckland is also the home of the Admirals Cup, the One Ton Cup
    won in san francisco, Two Maxi's competing in the round the world
    race both designed by Bruce Farr.
    
     New Zealand is at the moment building up to defending the Admirals
    Cup off cowes later this year,the nz team is sonspored by Fay Richwhite

    Let's hope the SDYC does not appeal the decision.  I think the whole
    world is tired of battling for the Cup in court.  Besides, I'd LOVE
    to see the Cup defense held in New Zealand.  Can you imagine everybody
    piling into the "club house" for a protest meeting?  It'd be worth
    the price of admission.
    
    Personally, I hope it doesn't come back to the US, either through
    a court appeal or through a successful challenge in '91.  It gets
    boring to see the same principal actors in this thing all the time.
    
    ... Bob
    

    
    Heard on the radio this morning, that the San Diego YC will be
    appealing the decision, and that the appeal could delay knowing
    who is going to defend the Cup for another nine months.
    
    (arrgh!)
    
    ..klaas..
    

<   The breezes
<   in the morning where less than 3kts the first day with a sea breeze
<   comming in the early afternoon at about 10-12 kts.the second day
<   we had a drifter of less than 1-2kts in the moring with 1 triangle
<   taking 4.5hrs with as it turned out 2 windward legs again in the
<   afternoon we had a good breeze of 10-12 kts true, yesteraday it
<   blew 20-30 kts all day and today it's back to 5-10, so the wind
<   can range from nothing to 40kts plus and it changes daily so it's
<   very variable.

    
    Why not try to get it moved to Wellington - no drifters there. 
    We had an A Class Catanaran Worlds there in about 1983 and the winds
    were WILD.  Nobody died of boredom.
    
    Richard.

    I guess I see this a bit differently.  It seems to me that the fault
    here lies with the court, not Conners or any of the other
    personalities.  Please correct me if I have misunderstood some 
    facts, but this is how I see it:
    
    1) SDYC had a deadline in which to establish the terms for the next
    defense.  They failed to meet that deadline.  Assessment: Our fault,
    stupid move.
    
    2) NZ took advantage of the loophole presented by the above and
    issued a challenge.  Assessment: Smart move.
    
    3) NZ took advantage of the void in definition of terms to challenge
    with a radical new design which did not have established class
    guidelines.  Assessment: Questionable.
    
    4) SDYC did not really want to defend the cup against NZ without
    contender elimination races and with a design they knew less about
    than the competition.  They took advantage of the lack of definition
    of class to counter with another radical, but different, design
    they knew could win in order to put this challenge aside and regain
    control of the process.  Assesment: Questionable.
    
    5) The two "Questionables" above, coupled with a race deadline,
    set up a situation where a court challenge was inevitable.  Assessment:
    Too bad it came to this, but that's what courts are for.
    
    6) But the court couldn't decide and millions were spent on preparing
    boats to act out a chrade, the outcome of which was never in question.
    Assessment: Inexcusable.  If the court needed more time to decide,
    they should have postponed the race as necessary rather than proceed
    with the farce.  (Ironically, probably the only good to have come
    of the whole affair is the development work on both sides during
    this period and the advancement of sailing technology.)
            
    7) After the money spent, the work done, and the race over, now
    the court decides it wasn't a fair race, a fact that was obvious
    to the most casual observer in the first place.  Assessment: Bull**it.
    By allowing the race to go on, the court forfeited its right to
    decide the fairness of the contest.  If it is possible, it would
    seem both sides have good grounds to sue the court!!
    
    One man's opinion.
    
    Rick,

    I don't think it was a case of the court not being able to decide
    the case before the fact.  As I recall from an article, the judge
    said she couldn't legally make a decision about something that hadn't
    happened.  So she told them to come back after the race.
    
    Questionable??  I'm not so sure.  You can't "make an arrest" till
    after a "crime" is committed, can you?  I think the same logic applies.
    
    However, I still think the judge was in error for not telling the
    both of them to take this farce out of the courtroom and stop wasting
    her time.  After all, I should think that courts in this country
    have better things to do than decide who won a sailboat race.
    
    ... Bob
    

>>>   After all, I should think that courts in this country
>>>   have better things to do than decide who won a sailboat race.
    
Amen.

The judge essentially ruled that the situation was analogous to the old 
practice and etiquette of duelling.  NZ said "We choose sabres!", and
O'Connor said, "OK, but we'll use a pistol!" 

Given that most people agree that the challenge was justified by the terms 
of the Deed of Gift, the main argument has been over choosing weapons.  To 
me, DOC and SDYC tried to unlevel the playing field rather than accept the 
challenge in good faith, or even negotiate a way to allow reasonable
development time for a defending yacht.  Note, BTW, they did one heck of a
lot of development on their own boats in the time they had.  Given the
difficulties the Kiwis had managing their boat for maximum efficiency
during the race, it's hard to believe that O'Connor & Co. couldn't have
mounted an effective defense in monster monos if they'd traded in some of
that ego for pride, energy and imagination. 

Instead they simply whined and bullied, making the whole show look bad.

J.

    Hi guys, sorry I'm late.  ;)
    
    I think the ruling is lousy -- no one deserves the Cup.
    Send it back to Perth and 12s!
    
    "OBJECTION!  That statement is irrelevant, and I move it be 
    stricken from the record."
    
    "Sustained.  The jury is advised to disregard the previous
    testimony."  
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    If you can...
    ;)

Re: .247

    The real  reason  that  SDYC  delayed  accepting  a  challenge was
    internal  bickering  about  where to hold the next defense, with a
    major  issue  being  who  would get all the tourist money. See the
    mayor  of  San  Diego's  bitching  after  the court ruled that New
    Zealand should get the cup for evidence.

    The choice  of a new "class" by New Zealand was clearly within the
    deed  of  gift.  The choice by SDYC to defend in a different class
    was  clearly  questionable. I think that SDYC just assumed that no
    judge  would  order  them to give up the cup. They tried to ignore
    Fay's  challenge,  even  though  it was clearly a legal challenge.
    Their hubris was eventually too much for them.

--David

    >The choice of a new "class" by New Zealand was clearly within the
    >deed of gift.  The choice by SDYC to defend in a different class
    >was clearly questionable.
    
    I think NZ is getting off too easy here.  Sure they were within
    the deed of gift with their challange.  But the deed of gift says
    that the defender need not announce what boat they will sail until
    the day of the first race.  Who is NZ to define for the world what
    the "new" class will be?  Do they deserve to even race for the Cup
    let alone defend it?  Did they beat the world in Perth?  Let's face
    it, they had a clear advantage in Perth with their "plastic fantastic"
    and a great record in the challenger series.  They were cocky and
    thought they would win.  They choked and were psyched by Stars &
    Stripes.  Chris Dickson hit the mark in the semis.  So they mount
    this challenge through the courts.  I think they were still hacked
    off about losing in Perth.  If they were truly fair and sporting
    they would have challenged in a 12 or pushed for an international
    monster mono race from the beginning.  SDYC's complaint now is that
    the judge has changed her ruling from a literal (letting NZ challenge
    in a monster ignoring decades of tradition) to an interpretive
    (let's have a fair match) view of the deed.  I agree with those
    who wish to keep sailing out of the courts.  If NZ feels a cat is
    illegal they should protest to the RC not the U.S. Courts.
         Michael Fay said here at a talk at the California Yacht Club
    in January that he would never accept the Cup if it was forfeited
    to him.  How fast we change our mind.  I'm glad he did though. 
    It should be a much more interesting and exciting contest in NZ.
    
    Don

    re "class"
    
    Slow down.  The deed of gift defines no class.  The
    Kiwi mono was their expression of a no-holds barred
    design that lived within the length restrictions -- 90 ft
    waterline for a marconi/sloop rig.  If you call that 
    class rules, then your tolerance for variety should
    certainly include a cat.  Be honest, any real discussion of
    "class" got thrown out with the 12s.  The only techical ground 
    for throwing out S&S might be that she could be said to have 
    a 120 foot waterline -- 60 x 2 hulls.
    
    As for sportsmanship and etc, both sides were in the gutter.
    Michael Fay is the better promoter.  I'm not upset because
    the US lost the Cup, I'm upset because all the positive
    developments through '83 are gone -- wiped out.  I do not 
    belive the Cup will ever recover the spirit of the races in '83.  
    I'm glad I taped them.

    RE: .251
    
    I have no problem with NZ challenging in a "new" class.  What I
    found questionable was their challenging in an undefined class,
    one in which no one else had boats.  (what stage was their boat
    at the time of the challenge?)  This seemed guaranteed to result 
    in some kind of arbitration in court or out, even if SDYC had decided
    to respond in kind.
    
    Rick,

Ive got to poke at this 'class' concept. There was a time when boats were
custom designed and didnt belong to a class. Until the 30's and theJ boats
all previous challenges had been in unique boats, and even with time handicaps.
So in the much longer tradition of the cup NZ was doing exactly what was 
expected- issue a challenge and give the basic parameters of the vessel.

I get annoyed every time I read boat ads and see '1987 BRAND X model z' I
am more in tune with 'xx foot Yawl designed by joe'. ALl this model number
and year stuff makes me think of cars and other disposable products.

Then of course my widely known bias toward wood and tradition is now further
expressed in my new nodename!

    I think this subject can (and probably will) be argued for years
    to come, with people seeing the rightness or wrongness from both
    sides, and not much sympathy for either side.  I agree with Dean
    that it's done irrepairable damage to the prestige of the event.
    
    However, perhaps it's more relevent to ask, "what next".  If the
    Cup stays in the hands of New Zealand (please!) and the appeal is
    thrown out of court (please!), then what can we expect from Fay
    and his cohorts?  Will they try to pull some further sleaze to ensure
    that the next staging of the event is heavily weighted in their
    favor?  I suspect they will.  Do we still have an agreement on the
    new class of boats that everybody agreed on a few months back? 
    Or does New Zealand get to redefine the rules to suit themselves?
    
    It was my understanding that the new class was agreed upon contingent
    on the next race being held in San Diego.  Does this mean that we'll
    see further court cases to determine the type of boat used in the
    next challenge?  God, I hope not.
    
    Personally, if this atmosphere continues to surround the event I
    think we may start to see boycotts by nations and syndicates that
    would otherwise participate (how many other prospective participants
    can afford a supertanker like the Kiwi boat?).  Then the event would
    start to take on the same kind of political connotation that other
    "sporting events" such as the Olympics have taken on in recent years.
    
    In which case it won't be worth following anymore.
    
    ... Bob
     

    
    Well according to micheal fay the cup if sailied down here will
    be sailed in the new class of boat about 75ft long,the challenger
    of record will be the Royal Perth Yacht Club,it will sailed off
    the east coast bays area off auckland with most proberly 2 of
    auckland's senior yacht clubs running the regatta on behalf of mercury
    bay, but who knows as micheal fay owns an island just off the
    coast in mercury bay. There is talk of running a regatta in the
    new class of boat in 1991  even if the appeal process isn't completed
    by then as a prelude to the cup itself.
    
    Just as an aside the citizen match racing series is on in Auckland
    this weekend with peter isler and tom blackhauler both competing,the
    weather is very light so they are drifting around the harbour.
    
    regards 
    revel

    The cup has always been in the hands of the wealthy, but as
    more and more people take to the water for relaxation the interest
    has grown significently as has the cost of mounting a challenge. Would
    other nations boycott if some agreement was not reached well in
    advance of a series, I believe so purely for financial reasons.
    There is some parallel with what happened in motor racing some years
    ago where engines and componant designs were getting out of control
    and what came out of that was a rigidly enforced Formulas I, II,
    III classes. Hopefully this will happen to the cup else it will
    be lost and the wealthy may turn some their attention to other good
    standard races like the Hobart Sydney, Congressional Cup, Admirals
    Cup etc etc.
    
    Lets hope the series in NZ takes the cup to a degree of reality
    where all nations can compete and where there is some super sailing
    for TV viewers everywhere.
    
    
    Pete 

    re what next?
    
    I'd heard that Alan Bond would be the lone
    challenger; they would race "K-boats;" and
    the campaigns would cost 50,000,000.
    
    If Fay and Bond define a new 75 foot class, that sort of 
    puts the lie to Fay's proclaimed intention of restoring 
    the grandeur of the Cup by racing "big" boats.
    
    An ironic footnote:  Subsequent to the ruling, representatives
    from the NYYC -- who supported NZ's claims -- allegedly urged 
    SDYC to appeal!
    
    Yeah, boycott the whole mess.  
    
    So Bob, it's time to start sizing up this year's PHRF fleet!
    See you in #845.  
    
    ;)
    
    
    

    I too had heard the rumor that Fay and Bond had some sort of agreement
    that would exclude other challengers.  That's why I put in the entry,
    to see if anyone else had any further information on this rumor.
    
    If it happens it'll sure make SDYC's "violation of the spirit of
    the deed" look like sportsmanship, and make Judge Ciparick look
    like a fool.
    
    Dean, you may see me in #845, but you won't see much of WAGS on
    the water this year.  The cutoff for "A" fleet is 81 this season.
    That puts us in "B" fleet.  And just when we thought we might give
    you guys a run for the silver too ...
    
    ... Bob
    

    Dennis Conner will sail one of the controversial Stars & Stripes
    catamarans in the 42nd Newport-Ensenada race starting Friday, April
    28, and this time nobody objects.  Starting at noon in a fleet of
    27 multihulls, Conner and a crew of eight will be racing the 125
    mile race aiming for the 10 hr 31 min 2 sec record set by Bob Hanel's
    Double Bullet in 1983.  Stars & Stripes is about the same size -
    60 feet - as Rudy Choy's Aikane X-5, which has won the last two
    Ensenada events, but is lighter and carries more sail.  She has
    been assigned a (PHRF) rating of minus-172 to Aikane's minus-58.
    How 'bout that for a (PHRF) rating?  Aboard with Dennis will be
    Tom Whidden and Tony Wilson, the president of Hobie Cat, which is
    sponsoring the effort.
    
    Don

    Are they using the hard or soft sail? From what has been written,
    the hard sail is very fragile. Maybe we'll finally get to see how
    fast that cat really is.
    
    -Paul      
    

    re: 262
    
    According to the L.A. Times, Vic Stern, secretary-treasurer of the
    Ocean Racing Catamaran Assn., said Tuesday that the organization
    had approved the conventional, "soft-sail" rig that was the Cup backup
    boat.  "If she gets a steady 12-knot wind, she could finish in 7
    plus hours," Stern said.  "It's a fantastic boat.  When I sailed
    on it recently, we were doing 20 knots in a nine-knot breeze."
    
    Bill Trenkle, crew member and vice president of marine operations
    for Dennis Conner Sports Inc., said the boat won the last tuneup
    race against the airfoil rig, but Conner chose to sail the airfoil
    against NZ because it performed better in light air.        
    
    Don

    >> Maybe we'll finally get to see how fast that cat really is.
    
    That'd be fun.  Anybody know if there's going to be any TV coverage
    of the event (wishful thinking ??) ?
    
    That cat will have to be fast.  With those ratings Conner will have
    to cross the line about 4 hours in front of the previous winner
    in order to take the gold.  ( -172! Would've LOVED to see the back room
    shenanigans that went into determining THAT rating.)
    
    Bet Dennis won't be sittin' on the rail sipping Diet Pepsi this time.
    
    ... Bob
    

What are the typical winds?  S&S should smoke Aikane unless it's rough 
enough to risk damage.  Choy's design (and construction) can probably take 
a great deal more punishment than S&S.  It's won some serious open water 
races already.

*Some*body better get some videotape of at least parts of that race, 
for delayed broadcast or whatever -- it could make from some fine viewing.
Let's hope ESPN is thinking ahead!

J.

    The -172 rating given to Stars & Stripes was based on the prediction
    of 10 knots of wind the whole way.  Crew members feel that winds
    will be lighter than that off San Diego as the sun sets.  Her rating
    assumes that her weather hull will be out of the water 50% of the
    time, much unlike those sandbagged Cup races.
    
    Don

This past weekend I attended a Friendship Sloop Forum at the Apprentice Shop 
in Rockport Maine. The event occured because Frank Snyder, commodore of the
New York Yacht Club is having a Friendship built. At the reception on Friday
Evening, Frank introduced his 'dear old friend', the commodore of the San Diego
Yacht club. Frank noted they are still friends in spite of having recently lost 
a lawsuit and are in the process of an appeal. 

I didnt catch the SDYC guys name, but he jokingly told the audience  "there
seems to be some pressure for us to return to tradition so I came to see about
a traditional boat"

Looks like this thing is not out of the courts yet!

PS- for our non- New England readers, a Friendship Sloop is a 25-35' gaff sloop
with clipper bow, FULL proportioned hull lines. They are abuot the last 
working sail vessels, having been built around 1890-1910 as lobster
fishing boats.

    Re: Friendship sloops
>                                             They are abuot the last 
>  working sail vessels, 
    
    Ron, better not let a Chesapeake Bay 'Waterman' hear you talking
    that way.
    
    J_R

    My preference in this affair would have been for the judge to have
    found a way to forfeit the cup to the previous legitimate holders.
    Appoint them as 'caretaker' to stage another go at it in Perth.
    Maybe with a format that used random seedings rather than the
    current defender/challenger twin eliminations.
    
    As a letter published locally said:
    
    "I've never known Michael Fay to win a sailboat race on the water,
    I've never even known him to to steer a boat in a race or even call
    a tack, yet his appointed yacht club is currently the 'legal holder'
    of the most publicized sailing trophy in the world. He won the cup
    in court. This is a blight on our sport..."

    I think this whole affair is actually GOOD for sailing.  Racing
    of boats should have the same place as racing cars:  it should
    provide a situation where research on new ideas can be carried
    out in an environment where money is less of a limitation.  In the
    same way that car racing leads to multi-valve turbo-charged engines,
    sailboat racing should lead to sailing technology that is useful
    in the real world.  There have been pictures in rags like popular
    mechanics for years about how sail powered transport ships could
    compete with motorized ships, but they never seem to show up
    in practise:  because nobody knows how to make them work.  The
    technology needs to be developed in a racing environment.
    
    The cup should be awarded to the fastest 90 foot boat.  If it
    is a cat with wierd shaped keels, rigid sails, and a "driver" sitting
    in the bottom keeping it upright, and is fastest, it should win.
    I say that the argument about single and multi hulls is b.s., and
    San Diego won the race with a faster boat.

Re: .269

>    "I've never known Michael Fay to win a sailboat race on the water,
>    I've never even known him to to steer a boat in a race or even call
>    a tack,

    This is   really  unfair.  Fay  was  the  owner  of  the  "Plastic
    Fantastics" at Perth one of which made its way to the challenger's
    semi-finals.  So  his boats have won some races. Alan Bond doesn't
    sail  much  either,  and  he  held the cup for a while. There's no
    requirement  that  syndicate  heads  know  how to sail, and as the
    price  of  entry climbs, I expect we'll see more syndicates headed
    by landlubbers eager for the publicity.

Re: .270

    Perhaps the  cup  should  be  a  completely open event, but you're
    proposing  some  limit  on the boats (90 ft. length). We need some
    rule  or  the  event  turns into who can buy the longest boat. The
    example  of  auto  racing  is  that  there are a lot of rules (for
    example,  in  many  classes  a  turbocharged engine must have less
    displacement than a non-turbocharged engine.)  

    There are  *very*  few  completely  open events, as they raise the
    cost  way  beyond  the  outrageous  costs  we're  seeing  now. The
    question is what set of rules to use.

--David

    re .270
    
    This sounds more like an arms race than a boat race.  It was the
    approach taken in the early years of cup racing.  The quality of
    those early races was greatly inferior to what we've recently become
    accustomed to.  Despite the technological wonders displayed, the
    San Diego series was a throwback to the early days - boring mismatches.
    What made the two previous cup series exciting, for the first time
    in their history, was the closeness of the racing.  Newport didn't
    have the gear busting meteorological pyrotechnics of Perth but that
    didn't matter.  It was haveing closely matched boats and crews that
    made what is normally a participants's sport into a spectator
    sport.
    
    If it's high tech you want, French Catamaran racing is where it's
    at.  Not that exciting and the boats are ugly to boot.  Give me
    slow boats that look good and sail the same.  Boat racing is
    denominated in millimeters and tenths of knots.  A win by the width
    of your forestay should be more satisfying than a horizon job.
                     
    re .271
    
    I recall reading that Bond was (and still is) an enthusiastic ocean
    racer.  It was during a visit to Newport to check on the progress
    of an ocean racer that he was having built that he and Ben Lexcen
    stumbled onto a 12 meter in the same shop.  Never having seen one
    before, he asked what it was all about.  That was the start of several
    challenges which ultimately lead to winning the cup.  
    
    It's hard to avoid putting "right" and "wrong" labels on things
    that don't merit that kind of value judgement.  But something seems
    to insistently say "right" when I think about the Aussie challenges
    and "wrong" when I look at what the Kiwi's did.  Bond's four or
    so challenges, some of which were embarrasing, are hard to inpret
    in any other way than as "earning" the cup.  He worked harder and
    smarter than the NYYC and deserved to win.  Few things in real life
    turn out so nicely so it's satifying to see something so much in
    the public view that does.  But the Kiwis success on the their first
    challange and the smart*ss attitude of both skipper and owner are
    hard to find endearing.  Sorta like haveing a company you've spent
    all your life building bought out by a Wall St. wunderkind.  Happens
    in the real world all the time.  Who wants more of it sports.  I
    can watch lawyers duke it out anytime.
    
    - gene
    
    

    From the Newswire:
    
    "In the matter of the America's Cup, America should now be both
    gracious and magnanimous...It is better to race and lose than never
    more to race internationally at all....There will then be an outpouring
    of social and national amenities for the next race.  And a noble
    sport will be revivified."
    	Sound reasonable?  It's from the Saturday Evening Post, the
    edition of Sept. 26, 1903.

    From the L.A. Times:
    
    ENSENADA - Even Dennis Conner's 60-foot catamaran Stars & Stripes
    can't sail fast in almost no wind - especially if the zephyrs are
    on the nose.
    	The two-time America's Cup winner steered his soft sail catamaran
    across the finish here at 4:15 a.m. Saturday for an elapsed time
    of 16 hours 15 minutes, about 5 hours 59 minutes short of the record
    of 10:22 set by the catamaran Double Bullet in 1983.
    	Even so, Stars & Stripes was the first yacht to finish, about
    5 hours, 16 minutes ahead of John DeLaura's ULDB 70-rater Silver
    Bullet, California Yacht Club.
    	Rudy Choy's 65-foot catamaran Aikane X-5, first to finish in
    the last two Ensenada races, was the ninth boat to finish, about
    six hours behind Stars & Stripes.
    	The top 10 finishers were Stars & Stripes, Silver Bullet, Taxi
    Dancer, Cheval, Ragtime, Grand Illusion, Swiftsure III, Evolution,
    Aikane X-5, Maverick.
    	Winner of the President of Mexico trophy for the best corrected
    time in the IOR class was Amante.  Winner of the President of the
    U.S. trophy for best corrected time in PHRF was Hot Rum.  The presenter
    was Walter Cronkite, who crewed on one of the racing yachts.
    	Dennis Conner won the special NOSA trophy for the first yacht
    to finish, but failed to show up to accept the award.  It was accepted
    by a crew member.
    
    Don

    Dennis Connor is said to have approached NYYC for
    support for a Cup challenge.  Don't think they were
    interested.
    
    Has the appeal even been decided?

    Yup, just heard it.  San Diego won it's appeal, now NZ is appealing 
    to the NY Supreme Court.  
    
    I wish they would just race, one design, for the glory and fun of it.
    The money has corrupted it (what else is new).
    
    I vote we take it back to Perth and start all over.  
    		I loved watching those races in those conditions!
    				YaHoo

    Yup, as the sportscaster on TV said tonight ... as of now, September
    19, the America's Cup belongs to the San Diego YC.  Stay tuned for
    further developments.
    
    During the inevitable interview with Michael Fay, he said something to
    the effect that all this has irreparably damaged the prestige of the
    cup, and that it will never regain that prestige.  Funny really, seeing
    as how he is the man mostly responsible for the demise, if indeed his
    opinion reflects the truth.
    
    Personally I wish the judge would just throw the whole thing out as not
    worthy of the courts time, and tell those little boys to go settle
    things amongst themselves.  I'd be willing to bet the legal fees have
    now exceeded the expense of the campaign that put them in the courtroom
    in the first place.
    
    Maybe one of the networks could turn the whole affair into a sitcom ...
    
    ... Bob
    

    How about awarding the Cup to neither, putting out some sensible
    rules, and running a race?
    
    	Gregg

    Retire the CUP.  Run it over with a steam roller,
    and blast it into a decaying orbit.

    Bury the Cup with Tom Blackaller.

    
    No, blast Conner and Fay, send them into decaying orbit and bury them
    with Tom Blackaller (if he'll have 'em, that is).  Then let the rest of
    the world compete for the Cup.
    
    These clowns have forgotten that in order for any trophy to have
    prestige, ya have to EARN it.  Not bicker over it in court.
    
    ... Bob
    

    Maybe we should start a petition -- Concerned yachtsman
    urge that CUP be returned to Fremantle.  They "earned it" best.

    Sounds like a good idea - lets hire a lawyer to word the petition.  ;)

    We, the undersigned yachtsman, wish to express
    our disgust at the state into which the America's 
    Cup has fallen.  In our opinion, neither San Diego or
    New Zealand deserves to retain the Cup.

    As the Australians were the last to claim the Cup in 
    the spirit of sportsmanship, we petition the court
    to return the Cup to their custody, and empower them to entertain
    challenges in the newly defined "America's Cup Class."
    
    Dean Fachon, USA

    
    (Had written something vastly more elegant and official
     sounding, but the net ate it.  Probably new what it was doing ;)

    I would like to stir this pot some....
    
    As a person who sails I am starting to wonder if the America's Cup
    is a test of man or machine. Or if it has become a test to see who
    can use the most tricks within a vague set of rules.
    
    I would like to see the "Cup" become a test of sailing skills. A
    race where all of the boats are the same and are rotated so there
    would be no advantage from a technical point.
    
    I would also like to see all electronics off the boats and make
    the sailors use "their skills" to win or lose.
    
    This would be sort of a take-off from what they are doing in the
    car racing field.
    
    Having to rely only on ones skills in boats that are almost equal
    without the aid of electronics.....I wonder how many of our great
    sailors would even be around for the finals???
    
    
    Reading the notes on local racing is far more interesting than any
    America's Cup that I've been around for. It's about people and sailing
    not tricks and secret devices.
    
    *****
    Well the pot is stired...lets see if it boils..
    
    
    

    We sort of debated this about 200 replies ago, or
    there abouts.  At the time, we were discussing the balance
    between all the elements that comprise Cup competition.
    It's when any one factor overbalances the rest that the
    situation gets out of hand -- ie the design discrepancy
    in the last "match."  This situation is a direct result
    of inadequate rules; what survived admirably as a gentlemen's
    agreement has finally been swept aside.  The next era in Cup
    competition will have stringent and explicit regulation.
    
    As for skill, it takes skill to design electronics, boats,
    sails; skill to steer, call tactics, trim sails; skill
    to raise funds, write a press release, manage a campaign.
    Sure, computers and software take out a lot of guesswork,
    but someone had to design those too.
    
    Modern Cup competition competes on ALL of these levels,
    involving hundreds of people.  Too many people and too much
    effort to entrust the results to second-rate sailors.
    I think the guys on those boats (women too -- S&S backup
    navigator) are the best in the world.
    
    Two-cents worth,
    Dean
    

    As I recall my history of the America's cup, the old rules were
    very much in the united states' favor. Weren't there provision that
    you had to have all your equipment from the country represented--
    which gave many people disadvantages? And wasn't there a rule at
    one point that the boats had to be *sailed* over rather than
    transported? This is what some of my history enthusiast friends
    tell me. If this is the history of the cup, I would say the current
    crop of rule "infractions" to be in the long standing tradition
    of the cup.
    
    I looked at pictures of the previous entries in the cup race of
    years ago and it seems to me that "machine" has been important
    in the race from the very beginning. To cut it out now would be
    a change, not a restoration.
    
    If you compare the situation with the indy, say with the turbine
    cars of the sixties, the avowed reason the cars were banned from
    the indy was because of the unfair competition of machine to man.
    However, it is my understanding that the actual reason was that
    there was no clear flow of the indy technology to the commercial
    car, and this made the race unusable as either testing ground or
    PR by the automakers. They threatened to pull out, and suddenly
    the indy doesn't allow turbine cars. Again, the story is of newspaper
    quality, not historical accuracy.
    
    So, wherein lies the motivation of competing in the cup? When this
    many millions of dollars is spent, who profits? I suggest that the
    grants that made the american boat technology in the last cup will
    be recouped by the researchers in the same way the racing designs
    of the cup boats in the past were recouped in ship sales and new
    ship designs. And this is how it should be.
    
    If there's a flaw in the process, it is in making the rules so that
    they don't reflect the rest of the yachting community.
    
    Besides, I thought it was a beautiful boat.
    
    steve popkes
    

    In a surprising announcement last Tuesday, the Appellate Division
    of the New York Supreme Court said it would allow New Zealand to
    take its case to the last possible legal venue, the New York Court
    of Appeals.  Most thought that the lopsided 4-1 overturn ruling
    on Sept. 19th provided little chance that New Zealand would be
    allowed to appeal further.  
    	
    Initially, San Diego had hoped to defend the Cup in 1991.  The legal
    fight pushed it into '92, and now the major concern is that it will
    be caried into '93 because, by agreement of the major potential
    competitors, no defense can start until 24 months after the end
    of all litigation relating to the previous defense.
                                  

    Foreign challengers rumored to be petitioning NY Supreme Court
    to act quickly in favor of SDYC.  Want races in '92
    or plan to organize a new event.  
    
    SDYC said to be interested in holding a "World 
    Championship" regatta for the new Cup class.

   Next court decision supposedly due in April.

    Regardless of where the next cup will be held, it will be raced in the
    new Americas Cup class.
    
    The first of these was launched in France a couple of weeks ago. Photos
    in 'Seahorse' and the French magazine 'Regatte' show a boat about the
    size of a Maxi, but beamier and with less freeboard, and a fully
    battened large roach mainsail, set on a carbon fibre mast. The upwind
    rig is fractional, with a masthead spinnaker for downwind. It will
    carry a crew of 16.
    
    The boat is reported to be as exciting to sail as a multihull, and way
    faster on all points, then an similar sized IOR boat or a 12 metre.
    
    The Italians are expected to launch their first boat in the summer,
    with most of the other syndicates waiting until they know where it is
    being held before committing themselves. The French, who are based in
    the Mediterranean port of Sete, say that their boat is just a test bed for
    new ideas, and they will build a new boat later. This seems a little 
    optimistic though, as they have yet to secure a sponsor ( The boat is 
    currently known by its sail number F-1 )
    
    Chris
    

    I just heard on CNN that the New York Appellate court just awarded the
    America's cup back to the US. As the news was just breaking, there were
    not a great deal of facts or reasons behind the decision. The news
    should be very interesting tonight.

    At last that's over!  There's no further it can
    go, right?  But how will the loopholes to be closed?

    And what of the future?  Although disgruntled,
    I'm still a fan.
    
    Dean    

    Right, it's over.  The loopholes havbe already been closed I believe. 
    The good news is that the new AC class boats look pretty hot.  Seahorse
    has a good review of the French effort.  The bad news is that we
    definitely want to lose to get it out of the hands of SDYC and the
    thrilling sailing around Point Loma.
    
    Dave

    The May issue of Sail has a pretty good article on the
    new AC class.  From the sounds of it, 16 crew isn't enough.
    The Italian effort is extraordinary.  A lone billionaire 
    is taking the whole thing on.  Even owns a private builder
    and plans to make "as many boats as it takes."  So much
    for cost-reduction.  The Italian boat also has 
    an incredible paint job.  Won't see any sposor logos
    on that boat!
    

    There is an interesting article on the front page of today's Wall
    Street Journal about the Japanese challenge to the America's Cup.  The
    Nippon Ocean Racing Club is estimated to be spending $100 million -
    four times what the San Diego defenders spend in 1988.
    
    The crew includes a New Zealand sailing coach, Roy Dickson and his son
    Chris.  Chris will be the helmsman during the race.  Some of the
    sailors on the crew had never sailed before.
    
    But, they know what every American crew has know since
    1851 - "There is no second."

    Seems the would-be contestants are pretty fired up.
    What a "disappointment" it will be if they find the
    public's interest doesn't rekindle so quickly.
    
    The more I think about it, the AC spell has worn off
    a lot -- for me at least.  Nothing like the Perth
    tapes for a blast of nostalgia!  ;)
    
    Anyone know the complete details on the revised
    rules for advertising on boats?  Anything goes,
    or do they have some discrete limitations?  

Another interesting thing to watch in the next AC match will be the
involvement of the USYRU.

No longer content to refine the rules, the USYRU has become aggresive
at classifying sailors, who's allowed to sail, and getting a slice of
the advertising money. Seeing the potential money in the sport, they
have visions of becoming the NFL of sailing.

In the last AC match (toy catamaran .vs. aircraft carrier), there was
quite a battle between the AC folks and the USYRU about big money in 
return for use of the rules.

Sailors tend to be independently minded. How much control of OUR sport 
do you want to surrender to an organization with $$$$$ in thier eyes.

Paul

      RE .299
    
>In the last AC match (toy catamaran .vs. aircraft carrier), the
    
    TOY CATAMARAN <<<<  HEY PAUL SOME OF US TAKE EXCEPTION TO THIS!
     I believe you forgot what blew what out of the water   ;>)  ;>)
    
    As to professional sailing, In the US, We already have two classses
    of professional Catamarans in ProSail (formula 40s and Hobie 21s) in 
    addition to Johnson-18's and ultimate 30s. The only thing that is 
    going to slow down the race for professional series will be the glut
    of various races that sponsers are getting sick of paying for to be
    lost among the adversting (Excellant article in Wall Street Journal
    on this either tues or Wednesday).
         
>Sailors tend to be independently minded. How much control of OUR sport 
>do you want to surrender to an organization with $$$$$ in thier eyes.

    They said that when NASCAR got started in the 50s. Look at the sport
    today. Not only do they do Grand National cars, they do other classes
    in other regions too. They even got a Series started in Australia. 
    they are better off for it as they get National coverage. The real 
    problem will be if the USYRU tries to screw around with the rules to 
    the point they are in conflict with the international rules 
    (i.e. AMA vs FIM in motorcycle racing). If they work to coordinate 
    defences, it may be a good thing for A.C. cup racing in the US.
    
    john "A Catamaran Racer"

    John,
    
    No offense intended toward catamarans. I was aiming at the race itself,
    it was a joke. But you must admit, the Stars & Stripes cat is one of
    the most fragile of it's kind. It would break up in any kind of sea,
    unlike the Hobie 21's and Tornado's I've seen blasting through waves
    in RI sound.
    
    The rules have already started to fracture. One of the Pro series
    has invented thier own rules because of USYRU demands for money.
    To fight back, the USYRU is considering banning anyone who has raced
    in a non IYRU/USYRU event! It's not what I want to see happen.
    
    Paul

    Are there any plans by Digital to support any of the teams in the
    America's Cup, both here and overseas?
    
    Our MicroVaxes gave some visibility to our products at the 86 and
    89 cups.
    
    Bruce.
    

    I wonder if the entire sponsorship thing
    might blow up.  There are so many syndicates that
    want to participate, but only the finalists
    give sponsors the face time they crave. 
    How anxious are corporations to back 
    likely also-rans?  Probably less than we think.

    Some of the teams may be fairly obvious bets for publicity, 
    eg Dennis Conner, the Russians, The Kiwi's etc. They probably will be
    getting lots of press before even racing.
    
    It wont take to much to sponsor a few of the best contenders.
    
    
    Bruce.
    
    

re .304: 
    
>>>    It wont take to much to sponsor a few of the best contenders.
    
Oh? Did you read reply .297? Or isn't $25 to $100 million much?

:-)
    

I'm Digital's software account manager for Fay, Richwhite Ltd in NZ. 

You may recall a certain gentleman named Michael Fay.... 

Despite being Fay Richwhite's sole vendor Digital NZ did not offer 
sponsorship in the last effort because we couldn't afford to. 

H-P came in and gave the "Challenge" group a *very* good deal.

We are having informal discussions with the Challenge group involved in 
the upcoming event, but without corporate support. With such support
I believe we could deliver a SOTA solution that would generate
considerable publicity in the premiere rich-man's sport.

On another front, we *sold* and delivered the on-board MVAX2000 system being
used by Fisher & Paykel in the Whitbread. Because we didn't sponsor the boat 
we haven't extracted any publicity.

For more info contact me via EM at NZOV01::GORHAM

Richard

    RE.305
    
    I don't mean that we neccesarily pay for the entire deal!
    
    That would be rediculous, rather, sponsor the computer equipment. A few
    decstation 5000's could do wonders for the navigation and design on a
    Americas cup team.
    
    Bruce.
    
    Re .306
    
    Please let me know how you guys do, I think we shoud approach the right
    corporate level for this, to make it consistent.
    

    I guess one problem at the corporate level would be who to sponsor,
    we have companies in all the countries likely to be entering and
    thus I guess it will be a country manager decision?
    
    
    Pete

    Hey, sponsor them all! Think of the advertisement possibilities...
    
    "Digital, the only computer trusted in the harsh ocean going
    environment, where accuracy, speed and uptime are critical
    requirements."
    
    If we could get them on the yachts and then successfully advertise the fact
    it surely couldn't hurt!
    
    Robert

    We did all of that.  The practice spinnakers for Austrailia II had the
    DEC logo on it.  We made a lot of hay about all of our computers used
    in design teams - I even have the videos, "The Twelfth Man" that
    highlights our participation.
    
    You have to be really careful about on-board hardware.  During the
    Cup when Mr. Humility was skippering Courageous, we had an LSI 11
    aboard doing some innocuous functions.  After losing a preliminary
    race, he yanked out our micro and tossed it overboard.  The press
    got some real nice shots of it too.
    

    And great gobs of electrical power is not available either.

    
    	AUSTRALIA - Royal Perth Yacht Club (Alan Bond); Royal Sydney Yacht
    Squadron (Syd Fisher); Darling Harbur YC (Iain Murray).
    
	CANADA - Secret Cove YC (Mike Cornellison).
    
    	DENMARK - Royal Danish YC (Valdemar Bandolowski).
    
    	ENGLAND - Port Pendennis YC (Peter de Savary);  Isis Corinthian YC
    (John Prentiss);  White Rose YC (David Hollum).
    
    	FRANCE - Yacht Club de France-Sete (Marc Pajot, Eric Ogden).
    
    	GERMANY - Deutscher America's Cup Verein (Uwe Below).
    
    	ITALY - Compagnia Della Vela (Raul Gardini).
    	
    	JAPAN - Bengal Bay YC (Masakazu Kobayashi); Nippon Ocean Racing
    Club (Yamasaki).
    
    	NEW ZEALAND - Mercury Bay Boating Club (Michael Fay).
    
    	SCOTLAND - Royal Findhorn YC (Robert Perryment)
    
    	SPAIN - Monte Real YC of Bayona (Clas Krueger).
    
    	SOVIET UNION - Odessa Arcadia Yacht Racing Club (Timir Pinegin).
    
    	SWEDEN - Stenungsbaden YC (Tomas Wallin).
    
    	SWITZERLAND - Swiss Ocean Racing Club (Hans Bernhard).
    
    	YUGOSLAVIA - Yacht Club Galeb (Bojan Butolen). 
    
    Boy, if all these countries actually show up in San Diego with boats it
    should make for a very interesting year of racing.
    
    Don    	

    The Lenigrad Yacht Club has increased the number of 1992 America's Cup
    challengers to 21, from 15 countries.  The deadline for posting $25,000
    entry fees was May 26, but Leningrad - designated as the Red Star
    Syndicate - was granted a two week extension because of difficulties in
    transferring money to the United States.
    
    Don

    Where is the Soviet Union getting money for
    these events?  Pepsi?  ;)

    David Barnes and a race hardened crew of 10 defeated American hopeful
    Peter Isler's outfit, five races to three, in San Diego this past
    weekend.  The event was sailed in borowed 68-foot maxi-sleds, which are
    the nearest facsimiles to the new America's Cup class boats.  Isler
    arranged the event in his ongoing campaign to sharpen his crew's skills
    and keep a high profile in a town and country where most people think
    Dennis Conner is the America's Cup.  Earlier he trounced the Danish
    team.  In October he'll meet one of the two Soviet entries.
    
    "You're only going to get better by sailing against people like David
    and Rod [Davis]" says Isler.  Davis grew up on San Diego Bay.  He was
    Barnes' tactician and steered the boat through the starting sequences. 
    Isler won seven of the eight starts.
    
    L.A. Times 

    re: .314
    
     Yeah, I was wondering that myself. The entrance fee has to be hard
    currency,and the Rouble is not yet convertable.
    
    Gregg

    New Zealand's crew came up one man short before the final day of last
    weekend's match-racing series against Peter Isler on San Diego Bay when
    the key sail trimmer, Grant Loretz, became ill early Sunday.
    
    Isler, already down in races, 4-1, gave rival David Barnes one of his
    extra sailors, Gordy Wagner.  
    
    What's this, an outbreak of sportsmanship in the America's Cup?
    
    Isler was the navigator for Conner on the Stars & Stripes catamaran in
    the lopsided 1988 defense that wound up in a storm of name-calling at
    the bitter news conferences after the two races.  Isler sat silent and
    embarrassed at one end of the podium as Conner swapped insults with New
    Zealand's Barnes, tactician Peter Lester and designer Bruce Farr.
    
    "I felt bad that all the sailors on both teams had to take part in the
    races.  For me personally, it was a fun, positive learning experience,
    except that we had to go race in the end.  The racing wasn't any fun
    for anybody," said Isler.
    
    L.A. Times

    SAN DIEGO-The America's Cup Organizing Committee announced Friday that
    it has endorsed four syndicates, amoung them one that plans to use the
    Beach Boys in its promotional campaign, and dropped five others from
    consideration to defend the America's Cup in 1992.
    	All the groups approved are based in San Diego County and led by
    members of the host San Diego Yacht Club.
    	Those approved include a syndicate headed by veteran America's Cup
    skipper Dennis Conner and another called the Beach Boys America.  The
    Beach Boys' syndicate is headed by real estate developer David Lowry
    and Beach Boys President Elliott Lott.
    	Also approved were Isler Sailing International, led by Peter Isler,
    Conner's former navigator, and Triumph America Foundation headed by
    Larry Klein.
    	Amoung the five failing to receive approval were both syndicates
    that had planned to include women on their crews, San Diego-based Betsy
    Ross and Santa Cruz-based U.S. Women's Defense Syndicate.  Also
    rejected were Advance America of Old Bridge, N.J.; the Christina Group
    of Beverly Farms, Mass.; and Yankee Syndicate of Cleveland.
    	Tom Ehman, ACOC general manager, said the groups dismissed had
    failed to meet the committee requirements set at a meeting in San Diego
    three weeks ago, which included written evidence of the ability to
    raise $6 million in sponsorship by the end of the year and a $150,000
    performance bond.
    
    L.A. Times

    
    
    Where will the Cup go?  I give the US a slim chance
    of keeping it -- we're just too far behind already.
    
    

    Consider that the new AC 75's are a hybrid between a Maxi and
    a ULDB. We have strong design and racing experience with both.
    Are we really behind?
    
    For the Freemantle challenge, the NYYC got in the water before SDYC.
    But the NYYC 12 turned out to be a dog.
    
    The French must hold the record for building the slowest AC
    challengers, I wouldn't worry about them being first in. 
    
    The big question is, what are Australia and NZ doing? 
    

    Don't discount the Italians.  They are the current force in Maxi racing
    and the Il Moro group has Paul Cayard and an unlimited budget.  I don't
    see a united Aussie attempt.  The economy is in too bad of shape right
    now.  The high rollers are struggling to hold onto what they have.
    
    New Zealand has the best sailors as a population.  They also treat
    sailing much like we treat football.  It is a national sport.  I think
    they will win.
    
    The Japanese are spending huge amounts, but need a few challenges under
    their belts to become serious contenders.
    
    Ain't it funny how all the "approved" defenders are from the left
    coast?  Notice how the NYYC didn't put up a defense?  They (and I) want
    a challenger to win so they can then win it back to New York.  If it
    isn't going to be sailed in Hawaii by SDYC, then maybe the NYYC will
    bring the cup there.
    
    As for the Christina challenge (our "local" challenge), it doesn't
    break my heart to see them not get in.  They didn't have the horses to
    do anything serious anyway.
    
    Dave

>>>    Where will the Cup go?  

Anywhere but San Diego, one hopes.  By and large, boring conditions.  And 
unfortunately some boring sailing personalities, too.  

Besides, ruling dynasties aren't nearly as much fun as some real variety.  

J.    

    	The five syndicates eliminated last Friday from consideration for
    the America's Cup trials probably don't realize what a favor was done
    them by San Diego's America's Cup Organizing Committee.
    	At first glance, the act smacked of the arrogance of the old days,
    when the New York Yacht Club was running the Cup.  After watching the
    potential defenders sail a few races among themselves, the race
    committee, wearing traditional blue blazers, straw hats and red pants,
    would cruise over and politely inform a luckless skipper that he was
    excused from further competition.
    	The late Tom Blackaller, who was inevitably excused, railed at the
    system, which was scrapped when the Royal Perth Yacht Club, as host of
    the 1986-87 defense for Australia, switched to the innnovative method
    of picking the survivors on victories and defeats.
    	The New York Yacht Club never thought of that.  The ACOC, which is
    managing the 1992 defense for the San Diego Yacht Club, simply refined
    the New York system by excusing apparent non-contenders before they
    could waste money they didn't have building boats they wouldn't sail as
    well as some others in the fight.
    	"It's not the old straw hats, red pants routine," said Tom Ehman,
    the ACOC chief.  "This is a much sounder process.  We've borrowed a
    page from both New York and Royal Perth."
    	Ehman said he talked to Stan Reid, who was commodore of the Royal
    Perth during the '86-87 defense.
    	"Stan said, 'You have significantly strengthened your defense.  We
    should have done the same.  And you've done the [five] a favor.'"
    	Reid always felt that Australia's cause was hurt by allowing too
    many weak syndicates to clutter up the defense program for too long,
    diluting the competition and available sponsorship funds.
    	Although the America's Cup Organizing Committee has eliminated both
    women's syndicates from the defense competition, J.J. Isler says there
    are some individuals who would qualify as crew members.  She is one, of
    course, but is going to concentrate on another Olympic campaign for
    '92.  Two women who should be considered are Martha McKeehnie, a
    regular in major events, and Dory Vogel, who was Isler's backup
    navigator with Dennis Conner in '87.  There will be a crew weight limit
    of about 195 pounds a person in the new America's Cup class.  "The
    teams are going to have to go with smaller people [to bring the average
    down]," Isler said.  "The grinders will be bigger than that."
    
    L.A. Times                                            

    Re: -.1
    
    It's Martha McKecknie.  She and her husband, Ian, own Team One in
    Newport.  She's a heck of a bow person.
    
    One of the guys who sails with us was leading the development of a
    specialized wind reading instrument for the Christina group.  Dave
    Vietor hadn't told him about the dismissal, we did.  Dave just told him
    he wanted to talk to him about "political matters".
    
    Back to the women issue.  Any defender would be nuts not to try to
    include at least a couple of women on their team.  There are plenty of
    great female sailors out there and not all jobs require a huge amount
    of upeer body strength (the traditional excuse).  The marketing
    implications would seem to be to great to pass up.
    
    Dave

    re.320:
    >> The French must hold the record for building the slowest AC
    >> challengers, I wouldn't worry about them being first in. 
    
    Very interesting info!!!
    Can you explain to the poor French sailor I am, following very closely
    the French challenge with Marc Pajot and his powerful team, where you 
    found it?
    How can you make such an affirmation, as the first European AC boats
    (French and Italian) are only laboratories designed to improve in full
    scale sails, rigs, fins, computers, crew, etc... and when a second boat 
    is actually builded?
    Please, don't be so sure of yourself, like a certain... Denis! ;-)
    
    . Pierre .
    

    Hi Pierre,
    
    Dig up the race results for the modern America's Cup competition. This
    begins in the late 50's with 12 meters. The French have never won the
    right to challenge for the Cup. In Newport the French were never
    competitive, mostly finishing at the bottom of the challenger series.
    I think my statement is more factual than pretentious.
    
    As a sponsor, Baron Von Bic holds a special place. Toward the end of
    one unsuccessful campaign, he took the helm from his skipper. Having little
    experience, he quickly became lost and sailed right off the race
    course!
    
    In Freemantle, the French challenge enjoyed more success than before.
    But contrast this with New Zealand's amazing performance on their first
    challenge. 
    
    Paul

   With a lay weekend in the regatta schedule, I took last weekend to
work on the cars, house (when will they invent fibreglas grass, the real
stuff is more maintenence work than a teak rubrail ;>)  ) and generally
tried to show my SO that I did things other than sail that "stupid boat"
all the time. 

Between chores, I took a break and turned on ESPN. Lo and Behold, they
had the Statue of Liberty Cup regatta on (if I could having timing like
this on a starting line, I could turn pro !!) They were using Benetteu
28s (the ones with the beautiful lines except for the bow which looks
like it came from a Bearing Straits icebreaker) 

Interesting racing. The FRENCH were strong all weekend and met in the
finals against the Australians. The French were very agressive on the
first race and it cost them a win as they went against a strong current.
A bad squall nixed any chance of winning 2 out of 3. The US (peter Isler
captaining I believe) got blown out of the water with an overall record
of 7-6. 


Other interesting tidbits: 

An interview with Dennis Connors was pretty good. He said the US was
running behind schedule on their challange, but that the gap can be made
up before the 12 metres start racing. He said that 4 syndicates were
preparing, and that Buddy Melegson (sp?) might be able to field a 5th.
He also said cutting back on entries was the best way to go to ensure a
strong defence, and that some of the Australians he had spoken to wished
they had limited the number of defenders. 

The other tidbit involved the refereeing. They used on water committee
boats which allowed them to get rid of protest rooms after the race.
although it seems a nice idea that the committee can see it happening
and rule immediately, this looks to be a real dangerous concept. 

During the semi-finals, the Italians and French were racing with France
in the lead. The captain for Italians was waving his protest flag every
30 seconds on one minor infraction or another. The Committee boat kept
signalling back "no infraction". The Italian captain turns and quietly
says this will help blow the French boat's concentration. After about
4-5 protests, the committee boat finally does "see" something and calls
for a 270 (yes that's 270 degrees). 

The Italians move ahead, but the French boat caught them before the end.
The thing that concerns me is  that this could really add to the
cry-baby atmosphere already surrounding 12 metre cup racing as captains
try to imtimiate each other and the committee boat. What may be needed
is a 360 or 720 for the protesting boat if what they are doing is deemed
frivious. 

The next televised race on ESPN will be in mid October.


john 

    re.326:
    
    Hi Paul,
    
    I think we don't talk about the same event! If the ugly trophy is the
    same, all the rest is completly different today, specially with the new
    concept of the AC class, wich drastically cut the human and technical
    advance of the Americans and Australians specialists. And that's
    probably why there is so much challengers for the very first time.
    
    You are talking about Baron Bich. Yes, all his campaign were
    unsuccessful, but he let enter the France in the competition at a time
    where we didn't know anything about "sponsoring", and he finally got
    his goal achieved taking the American market for his products! :-)
    
    I think the first serious entry, in a competitive sense, was the
    "French Kiss" ;-) campaign in Freemantle. If it was not the best, it
    was probably the best quality-price ratio of all the fleet! Because if
    France have a lot of success in different kind of sailing class, it's
    not the favourite sport, and money is hard to find, one of the most
    important factor in this competition. On the contrary, New Zealand is
    puting sailing sports at the top, giving a small country the
    possibility to be stronger.
    Anyway don't forget the last winner of the cup is a French designed
    boat (Bernard Nivelt)! And as john says in the last replie, French
    helmsmen are often in the top on the match racing scene.
    
    Don't worry, I don't want to be more chauvinistic than some of your
    compatriots, I just want to say in fact you can't predict so easily
    what will be the performance of each challenger (same thing for the
    defenders) as it was less difficult in the past with the old Twelve
    generation. And if the huge advertising campaign of the "Defi Francais"
    bring back all the money it expect to have, this one will be as
    respectable as many others.
    
    . Pierre .
    
    re.327: John, we are not as lucky as you to see all these interesting
    sailing images...
    
    
    
    
    

   I was reading an article on the History of Catamarans the other day, and
I saw this quote that really hit the spot: 




 " To me the pleasure of sailing is almost in direct proportion to the
speed, and wallowing around in some pot-bellied abortion, heeled over and
straining under a lapping jib or some other rule cheating windbag, seems
quite ridiculous. 

   Some yachtsmen seem to think the sole object of sailing is to beat a
brother yachtsmen and have adopted certain rules of measurement that ensure
the wealthy to be winners. They sail around courses perhaps at a rate of
five miles an hour and if they have won consider themselves great sailors. 

  But the general public, and particularly the sailor, is getting sick of
that game. He sees no sense in trying to force several thousands of dollars
worth of lead through the water with several thousand dollars worth of rule
cheating sails handled by a big crew. The sailor wants to sail and say to
hell with the wealthy, bridge playing sea lawyers who win races traveling
at a rate slower than their ancestors". 


 - Nathaniel Herreshoff (son of Francis Herreshoff) from "Common Sense of
Yacht Design" 



     I guess things never change huh ??? 



john ;>) 

    Nathaniel Herreshof is remembered today mostly for mega-sized America's
    Cup defenders and some quaint looking pleasure boats (12 1/2's).  But
    as a young man just out of school he set himself up in the catamaran
    designing and building business.  Sort of a nineteenth centry Hobie
    Alter.  Speed and simplicity were his main selling points.  The quote
    sounds like it might have come from some of his advertising copy. 
    Unfortunately, the world was not yet ready the fast lane lifestyle and
    the catamaran business soon folded.  He and his brother John then got
    serrious and joined forces as the Herreshof Mfg. Co.  Among their first
    products - naval torpedo boats.  Good money in those and they were
    plenty fast.
    
    - gene

    Speaking of old times and the America's cup, a local resident has just
    purchased the 12 meter Valiant.  This was one of the unsuccessful
    candidates for the 1970 defense.  Despite a good pedigree (drawn by the
    hand of Olin Stephens himself), Valiant could never muster enough knots
    to fulfill her high expectations and passed from the competitive scene
    after the 1970 trials.  The consensus was she was too heavy.
    
    The new owner has pulled some of the lead out, re-decked her, discarded
    the below decks winches, and upgraded the sail trimming hardware with
    up-to-date gear.  Still the same rig and still stripped out inside
    except for a new engine.  This is a wooden 12, with the ribs and
    planking visible when you look down the hatches.  Plans are for some
    participation in traditional wooden boat races in the New England area
    and some casual day sailing.  Crossed the line first in the recent
    Emperor's cup race in M'hd but couldn't save enough time to win. 
    Finished second to a schooner of all things.  The owners have had her
    out practicing a lot lately.  Must be taking this traditional boat
    racing seriously.  With one in M'hd, two in Boston, and around half a
    dozen in Newport, there are more 12's available for racing now than
    there were in their heyday in the 1930's.
    
    - gene  
    

    Valiant has her original titanuim mast, too.  Actually a lot heavier
    than a comparable aluminum mast, but probably strong enough to stand
    without stays!
    
    Dave

RE: .329 

>>> - Nathaniel Herreshoff (son of Francis Herreshoff) from "Common Sense of
>>> Yacht Design" 

Wasn't L. Francis one of Nat's sons, not the other way around?

J.

RE: .333


>>Wasn't L. Francis one of Nat's sons, not the other way around?

>J.


you caught me john, I meant to change that as i was typing it in, but
must of forgot.


   john

RE: mention of L.Francis,

His Marblehead home, known as "The Castle", is currently for sale.  Needs
some refurbishing, apparently, but it's got a commanding view of the
harbor.  No idea on price, but this market is probably the one to buy into
for those interested. 

Perhaps a DEC sailors's clubhouse, eh?  We could watch the 12's and 
Wildside and Bodacious and Toward Morning and all the others....

;-),  J.

    The Castle is going for $499,000. The estimates of the repair work
    necessary to make it liveable (the roof leaks horrendously), is $500,000
    to a cool $1,000,000.
    
     Not too inviting, huh?
    
    We walk down to the Dock, and Crocker park most every evening. I
    noticed the other day, that the Castle view could be somewhat blocked
    by the big house that is off to the left of it. Bummer.
    
     Also, it wasn't built for the Herreshoffs. It was merely bought by one
    of them.
    
    Gregg

    While out on an evening cruise last night watching the finish of the
    PHRF brearcan race in Marblehead I saw the 12 meter Valiant in the
    middle of the A fleet.  Usually, 12 meters race each other although a
    few have been modified for ocean racing.  This is the first time I had
    seen a stock 12 in a handicap race.  
    
    The term "dinosaur" immediatly came to mind as most of the boats around
    her pulled away in the 6-8 knots of wind.  And these are boats 20 - 30 
    feet shorter.  While most of the smaller ones heeled about 10 degrees, 
    Valiant stood bolt upright.  On her final tack to the finish line it 
    took about twice the time to pass through the wind as it did for the 
    others.  
    
    This is a bit of surprise since Valiant was designed as a Newport 12, 
    intended for relatively light air prevalent there.  I got back to 
    the dock too late to inquire about her PHRF handicap but it wouldn't 
    surprise me if it were 100+.  It looks like the new America's cup class
    is the right way to go.  Racing for the cup in a boat that is slower
    than one that can be bought right off the showroom floor doesn't seem
    exciting any more.
    
    - gene
                                                  

    Last week I competed in Cowes Week ( A big regatta - 800+ boats - held
    every August ), and although the week is mainly aimed at one-designs
    ( both offshore and day boats ) there is quite a large handicap fleet,
    both IOR and CHS. This year the converted 12-Metre White Crusader was
    competing. She was the British boat at the Fremantle Americas Cup
    series, and was taken by Richard Matthews, owner of Oyster yachts, in 
    part exchange for a 60' cruising Yacht. Matthews has converted it for
    offshore racing under Channel Handicap, putting in accomodation, an
    engine and other luxuries.
    
    By the standards of the other boats it was ridiculously low in the
    water ( the crew all wore drysuits ), very fast upwind, but no faster
    downwind. She did win a couple of races on handicap, and nearly all of
    them over the water. The only boat that got near her was a new J44
    called J-Hawk, with Harold Cudmore, Stu and Rod Johnstone and various
    other rock stars on board. This boat was much faster than the similar
    sized Beneteaus and the boat I was on, an Oyster Lightwave 485.
    
    White Crusader is also raced in proper offshore events on the East
    Coast of England ( where Oyster is based )
    
    Chris
    
                                              

    re. 338
    
    Gene,
    
    Valiant probably isn't a good representative of twelve meters. Brit
    Chance performed the now-infamous "fastback" modification on the stern 
    of Valiant, as a trial horse for Mariner. Both boats later had their
    sterns chopped off and rebuilt - but they were never fast.
    
    I've also noticed the older twelve meters with old sails slow down
    considerably. I think this is due to the unusual and critical nature
    of the sail shapes. To point as high as they do, the Main can only
    carry about 5 to 7 percent draft, positioned 60 percent back in
    moderate conditions (compared to 14 percent draft positioned 50 percent
    back for the average boat). The 12 meter Mains are cut this way because
    the cord of the genny is so close to the centerline, the draft of the 
    main must be reduced and moved back to reduce backwinding and open the
    slot. I imagine that once the sail shapes begin to distort, the
    delicate balance is gone and performance goes to hell.
    
    I spent my teenage years chasing after 12 meters in Newport. I've 
    seen well tuned 12 meters go like freight trains, the retired 12's
    seem like different boats. One syndicate used an old twelve as a trial
    horse. The old boat had a motor and prop. The new 12 had to drag a few
    buckets over the side to slow down and make the training competitive.
    
    Paul

    The Beach Boys' America's Cup syndicate figured how to get a boat in
    the water before any other U.S. effort.  It bought one, ready-made.
    
    An agreement with the financially struggling French team gives the
    late-starting Beach Boys use of F-1, one of the new International
    America's Cup Class 75-footers that Marc Pajot's crew has been sailing
    for several months.
    
    Beach Boys' skipper John Bertrand will join the French crew for next
    month's European IACC championship.  Then the boat will be shipped to
    San Diego, where the crews will train together until next summer, whin
    the Beach Boys' own boat will be ready.  This way, instead of sitting
    around for another six months, Bertrand's crew hopes to be sailinig
    before Christmas and can compete in the IACC world championships at San
    Diego next May, while the French can afford to build a second boat in
    their development program.
    
    Peter Isler's recent withdrawal makes it clear that in the United
    States one must be a salesman as well as a sailor to compete for the
    America's Cup.
    
    Nobody worked harder than Isler, a successful regular on the world
    match-racing circuit.  But that didn't seem to impress potential
    sponsors.
    
    The privilege of defending the trophy for the San Diego Yacht Club will
    cost $15 million to $20 million, and even Dennis Conner won't come
    close to raising the $40 million the Italian and Japanese syndicates
    are each expected to spend.  Corporate America can't see any value in
    five months of international exposure on a floating billboard.
    
    There are now only three listed potential defense syndicates--Conner's,
    Larry Klein's Triumph America and the Beach Boys.  That's not enough to
    fill a fleet for the defender semifinals in April 1992, let alone stage
    a competitive round of trials.
    
    Nearly half of the 21 challengers were chased out by this month's
    requirement to post a $150,000 performance bond.  The list shows 12
    entries from a record 10 countries, including one from the Soviet
    Union.  A second Soviet entry dropped out.
    
    Design ace Bruce Nelson, who became available when Peter Isler gave up
    his America's Cup campaign, has rejoined Dennis Conner, with whom he
    served in 1986-87.
    
    L.A. Times

	According to the latest issue of RACETIME magazine, ESPN has a new
Boss. He is the guy who thought up and produced the 12 metre coverage for
ESPN. Sure hope he doesn't forget what made him successful!

john

    Looks like lots of shake up at ESPN.  Gary Jobson
    is taking a LOA to campaign a CUP boat -- again as
    tactician.d

    ESPN had an excellent special on the Cup this past weekend. Peter
    Isler is now commenting for ESPN.
    
    The Beach Boys syndicate with skipper Larry Klein has folded. The
    US is now down to two defenders: Dennis Conner Sail Int and America
    Cubed (as in **3). 
    
    Dennis Conner continues his annoying habit of referring to himself
    in the third person. His design effort is similar to last time. Pedrick
    and Nelson are back, Brit Chance is not. Interestingly, the bowman from 
    the Freemantle campaign, Scott Vogel, is on the design team this time. 
    They hope to have a boat in the water by Summer. 
    
    America Cubed is funded by Bill Koch (sp?), of Matador fame. Koch has
    money to burn. Matador and Matador Squared spend alot of time at Ben's
    Boat Basin in Portsmouth RI. Matador Squared recently won the Maxi
    Worlds sporting a secret keel and underbody. Buddy Melges and Gary
    Jobson will be onboard for this campaign. They bought up the French F1
    boat from the defunct Beach Boys and are on the water practicing. Their
    design effort will try to leverage off the Matador Squared design. I
    think I'll be rooting for these guys.
    
    For Challengers they listed three main threats: the Italians, New
    Zealand, and Japan. The Italians have hired an American from
    Blackaller's campaign (forgot the name). The Japanese have hired New
    Zealander Chris Dickson. A NZ skipper with Samurai crew - watch out.
    
    Paul
    Maxi based out of Portsmouth RI

    Larry Klein is an active member of the America cubed campaign now. 
    Great article on him in the December Seahorse.  
    
    Dave

    Does anyone have an ESPN schedule of specials/events?
    Missed the special last weekend...
    
    Dean

    The San Diego Log which is a southern California boating newspaper
    listed the following ESPN cup coverage.
    
    Date		Time(ET)	Length (minutes)
    Feb 15		9:30 pm		30
    Feb 22		9:30 pm		30
    Mar 11		8:00 pm		30
    Mar 19		7:30 pm		30
    Apr 15		8:00 pm		60
    May 20		8:00 pm		60
    Jun 17		8:00 pm		60
    Jul 25		7:30 pm		60
    Aug 19		8:00 pm		60
    Sep  9		9:00 pm		60
    Oct			TBD		60
    Nov			TBD		60
    Dec			TBD		60
    
    
    Side notes, two boats are in the water and sailing, America3 and the
    Kiwis.  Italy has two boats here in the yard with their keels covered.
    A issue that is brewing here is on boat substitution.  The "Deed of
    Gift" states "The challenger must give 10-months notice of their
    challenge and they must, at that time, identify the yacht with which
    they are challenging".  The defender, on the other hand, "has the right
    not to disclose its boat until the day of the first race of the
    America's Cup match".
    
    Todate I have not seen any of the boats sailing, as I do I will try
    enter a few notes.  Maybe this weekend.
    
    Chuck

    America's Cup race dates.
    
    IACC World Championships
    
    Fleet races on May 4,5,6,7,and 8, 1991.  Semi-finals on May 10th and
    the Finals on May 11th.
    
    U.S. Defender Series
    
    Jan 14-26, 1992	First round
    Feb  8-20		Second round
    Mar  3-14		Third round
    Apr  1-12		Semi-finals
    Apr 18-May 2	Finals
    
    Challenger Series
    
    Jan 14-26, 1992	First round
    Feb  2-6		Second round
    Mar  1-15		Third round
    Mar 28-Apr 12	Semi-finals
    Apr 21-30		Finals
    
    America's Cup Match
    
    Begin Saturday May 9, 1992; Sunday May 10; Tuesday May 12; and Thursday
    May 14.  If necessary the following Saturday, Sunday, Tuesday, Thursday
    races will continue until one boat wins four races.
    
    

I am a member of "Le Club Defi Francais America's Cup". 
(Club of the French America's Cup Challenge).

Next race is in '92, so I'd like to get some information on 12JI US boats,
teams, training.

    Did you notice the news in last Sunday's Globe sports section?  The
    America 3 program has canceled hull #1 being built by Eric Goetz's yard
    in Rhode Island (same place that just delivered the new Stars and
    Stripes AC boat) in favor of continuing hull #2 being built in Utah by
    Hercules, the same guys that built Voyager, the round the world
    aircraft.  Hercules (Dick Rutan, I believe) is the world's leading edge
    applicator of carbon fiber composite materials.  It seems the hull is
    projected to be so much lighter than even the Goetz constructuion
    techniques allow that to complete the "conventional" hull was a waste
    of effort.  
    
    Now keep in mind that the "conventional" AC boats already have 85% of
    their displacement in the bulb at the bottom of the keel.  This may
    have over 90% of displacement in ballast!  To put that in perspective,
    a good racer/cruiser may have a 50/50 ratio if modern construction is
    used.
    
    The stiffness of these boats will be incredible.  This is why the
    America's Cup is such a great thing.  Koch will spend millioins and
    millions developing applications that will work their way down to grand
    prix level racing, then higher tech local racing and then to all the
    rest of us bozos.  The higher the ballast ratio, the stiffer, dryer,
    and safer a boat is given a hull shape.  I believe the singlehander BOC
    boats are changing the face of short handed cruising designs forever.
    The application of this technology  makes these designs even safer and
    faster.
    
    Are there any restrictions as to mast composition?  If not, are there
    any restrictions as to mast chord etc.?  Could be some interesting
    composite rigs that come out of this as well.  
    
    Koch is doing it the right way.  Without having to beg for money he is
    free to seek out the best and most technologically advanced solution to
    his problem.  His MIT connections are strong through Jerry Milgram.
    A company in Colorado has been awarded the contract to develope a laser
    wind scanner that will display wind strength and direction up to 6
    miles away at various gradiants.  The key is making it less than ten
    pounds so the scanner can be put up the mast.  Tell me you wouldn't
    like to get your hands on that!  You will be able to in very few years.
    
    Thank God for rich people who love sailing!
    
    Dave  

    The afterguard and braintrust for America Cubed now 
    consists of: Gary Jobson
                 Bill Koch
                 Buddy Melges
                 Bill Shore
                 John Kostecki
    
    This is an amazing collection of talent.
    I heard Ken Read was jockeying for position with Kostecki for awhile
    but didn't make the cut. I enjoy seeing Dennis Conner being outpaced
    at his own game: money, boats, and talent.
    
    On the carbon fiber trickle-down theory: I was shooting the breeze with
    Jim Miller from The Rigging Company this weekend. He's starting to see
    more carbon fiber rigs all the time. They're difficult to modify and 
    maintenance, many shops just don't have the equipment. So even after
    the manufacturing costs come down, it will be awhile before the
    maintenance cost and availability is acceptable.  
    
    Paul

>>>  ...hull #2 being built in Utah by Hercules, the same guys that built
>>>  Voyager, the round the world aircraft.  

Given that Voyager's fuselages were roto-molded, speculation is that
Koch's boat is, too -- possibly the biggest structure yet built that way.  
As designers learn to design shapes that can take advantage of this
technology, we'll start to see increasingly large production boats built
this way.  Some small multihulls and sailboards already are, and several
multihull designers (Kurt Hughes, Malcolm Tennant) specifically design for
builders capable of wrapping fibers around 360 degrees.  High performance
hulls and spars may actually be made the same way. 

As for Dennis Connor, it is so good to seem him running second in money, 
boats, and technology.  Not to mention class.  At least he doesn't have to
worry about anyone outrunning him in mouth. ;-)  Seriously, Dennis is at
his best when he's an underdog; when he's on top, he's just obnoxious. 

J.

    I don't know if anyone else got this but two weeks ago some junk mail
    from America**3 arrived.  It was a solicitation to contribute $25 to
    the campaign.  Several folks from frostbiting received the same letter
    so they must have gotten the mailing list from an employee of the
    Courageous Sailing Center.
    
    On a 75' hyper high tech boat, is there a single piece of hardware or
    rigging that $25 will buy?  Maybe a computer designed, roto-molded,
    carbon fiber tell-tale, at least for the starboard side.  
    
    Even the sole owner of the largest privately held business in the
    country is getting stretched a bit thin.  Boating will do that to you.
    
    - gene

    Yeah, I got the slick too. And I have nuthin to do with frostbitin'. 
    
    Gregg

    You mean you didn't get MY mailer yet?  I figure if Koch can do it I
    might as well try.  And all I'm asking for is $20!
    
    Dave

I reveived a similar mailing back in Feb that indicated that something called
the 'Corintin Fund' would match checks up to $100.  My guess at the time was
that since the letter was 'signed' by Gary Jobson, that my name was gleaned
from the drawing that they had last year when Gary did his bit at Marblehead
High School. I know at least Gene was there too. 
        
I bought their pitch and parted with the $25. Of course my generally negative
attitude toward DC helped me make up my mind. Anyway, just like my $15 wool
baseball cap with the Hinkley logo is as close as I will ever come to owning a
Hinkley, I figured that my $25 would be as close as I would get to being part
of the America's Cup. If I get the promised future editions of thier news
letter, I will share the info. 
Fred 

>>>    Yeah, I got the slick too. And I have nuthin to do with frostbitin'. 
    
Everyone who subscribes to any sailing publication and has an affluent 
zipcode probably has been targetted.  They may also qualify with each 
individual's donation history to any maritime causes.

J.

A couple of local (Mass) concerns are working big-time on the America's Cup
scene in addition to MIT and Goetz.  Mark Lindsey of Lindsey boatbuilders is
in Utah and San Diego for 6-8 weeks working on Koch's boats.  What an
opportunity for him to learn. Talk about bringing this type of technology back
into local racing... Navtec is working around the clock building bits for
boats all over the world. (Navtec has just been purchased by Giardini, the
$$$'s (or Lira) behind the Itailian America's Cup campaign - his company (IMI)
now owns Barient, Lewimar, B&G, Autohelm, Sparcraft, etc., etc.). 

Carbon fiber standing rigging has been ruled out for all the racing formulas
(including IOR 50's) except IACC.  Carbon fiber shrouds and stays saved
something like 25 pounds on the rig of an IOR 50, costs 25 times as much as
stainless and had questionable reliability (bonding carbon fiber rod to
stainless turnbuckles apparently still needs some research). 

There seems to be a real desire to use carbon fiber masts, even in
production cruising boats.  They are stronger and much, much lighter than
aluminum.  These are not free standing poles such as on Friedoms.  These are
supported with shrouds and stays and made to be very bendy.  However, the 
cost is still a problem.  A carbon fiber mast for an IACC yacht, including 
rig, is around $600,000.00.  For example, the spreaders all have hydrolic
cylendars for adjusting their fore/aft rake.  They also tension the entire
standing rigging with a cylendar under the base of the mast.  There are a more
hydrolics for jumper stays, babystays, etc., etc. 

    
    	Jeff Kent, DN and Tornado hotshot, and local guy_to_catch on
    Wednesday evenings, has set up an oven for (prepreg) carbon fiber
    spinnaker poles down in RI. I guess they're selling- they ARE legal,
    aren't they?
    
    	I messed with strips of the stuff, and when it sticks, it's
    wonderful. I'm working some math for a direct-stress-spreading web for
    the keelbolt area. My keel's steel, so any gounding's a serious jangle.
    
    	Anybody seen West-System-type books for prepregs? THAT would be
    fun. (Yeah, like tearing up cash in the shower... I know!) But if the
    material info trickles down, I'm psyched. Hey, you can buy a roll of
    that yellow stuff down the street- a few years ago, hardly anybody even
    knew what it was. Now Robbie, Judd, Norm, et al can line their pockets!
    
    	Does Easy-Off take that nasty mast mess off the oven? All I gotta
    do is drill a couple 15" holes in the wall, and off we go!
    
    	Go ahead and laugh! Those Kevlar satchels have probably bought
    someone a new boat!  How about carbon fiber wingtips? Just the thing to
    go with your teak briefcase......
    
    Scott.

    One of the British '89 Admirals cup boats had a carbon pre-preg
    washing-up bowl, made as a joke by its crew, claimed to be half the
    weight of a conventional one.
    
    Yes, Carbon Spi-poles are legal, and becoming almost standard on top 
    racing yachts in this country.
    
    Chris
    

    Some of this carbon based high tech is already available off the shelf. 
    A few catalogs have listed nylon/carbon spinnaker pole ends.  They may
    be a bit lighter but the real advantage is they don't rust up the way
    aluminum ones do.  They're about the same bucks as the traditional
    ones.  My poles last about two seasons before they break or fall
    overboard.  Since it made it through last year intact, It'll probably
    not survive this coming season.  I'll give the carbon ones a try next
    time.

    Re: poles
    
    Our new boat has a carbon pole.  It is considered prudent to carry a
    spare tubing section made out of aluminum down below.  The carbon poles
    don't do well when they hit the forestay.  I was amazed at the weight
    difference, though.
    
    Re: keel frames
    
    BE CAREFUL!!!!  Fat Tuesday had carbon reinforcing around the keel
    joint frames.  When we hit ground they all broke.  The problem is that
    while carbon is very strong, it has zero flex.  We replaced the frames
    with heavier, conventional fiberglass frames.  Not as light, but when
    we hit again (we love rocks)  the damage was limited to the keel.  The
    frames flexed enough to pull the floorboard screwheads partway through
    the boards without breaking the frames. some flex ain't a bad thing.
    
    Dave 

    re .359
    
    What's the problem getting carbon fiber to stick?
    
    I was considering laying up carbon fiber over a mailing tube to use as
    an internal stiffener for my boom where the vang attaches.
    
    - gene

    Koch's connections within the academic and scientific community are
    quite deep, as are a certain computer company's. I'm not sure how, if,
    or when it'll become public but you can be sure that an enormous number of
    MIP's are being burned as we speak. Not to mention a significant
    workstation effort. 
    
    There is an obvious desire to be certain that our efforts don't come back
    to haunt us should a certain west coast sailor win. "We'll win the
    computer race, and let others try to win the sailboat race," is how this
    seems to be shaping up.
    
    JR

>    BE CAREFUL!!!!  Fat Tuesday had carbon reinforcing around the keel
>    joint frames.  When we hit ground they all broke.  The problem is that
>    while carbon is very strong, it has zero flex.  We replaced the frames
>    with heavier, conventional fiberglass frames.  Not as light, but when
>    we hit again (we love rocks)  the damage was limited to the keel.  
    
	Why do you need keel frames to be light ? It seems a little
    	pointless when you are hanging an enormous lump of cast iron/lead
    	directly on them.
    
    	Returning to the America's cup, I have heard that most of the boats
    	have lightweight ( presumably Carbon ) keels, with all their weight
    	in the bulbs/wings/winglets at the bottom. The Spanish boat had
        hers snap off - there were pictures in 'Seahorse' of the boat lying
        on her side, taken by a young Optimist sailor who was watching
        them practicing. The feeling in the article is that it won't be the 
    	last IACC boat to fail in this way.
    
    	Chris
    
             

    Re: -.1
    
    Exactly.  The frames were actually surrounded by 1200 lb.s of internal
    ballast lead bricks!  At any rate, the idea was that for those of us
    who may touch ground every now and again, a bit of flex is a good
    thing.
    
    The picture of Espana in Seahorse was pretty funny.  they acted very
    quickly to ensure the boat didn't turn turtle.
    
    Dave

DIGITAL'S SUPPORT OF AMERICA'S CUP IN 1992

In the 1987 America's Cup races, in Fremantle Australia, the Stars and Stripes 
boat was the winner.  Digital has donated all the computers to this winning 
syndicate.  Our computers were utilized in the most versatile applications 
including hull design, hydrodynamic analysis, statistical analysis, weather 
predictions, etc..

Tune in to ESPN on April 15 1991 (Monday) at 10:00 PM EDST, if you want to learn
about Digital's newest involvement in the upcoming America's Cup races in 1992,
in San Diego CA.  

We, naturally and optimistically, hope to again support the winning syndicate.

    Evidently, DEC donated a 9000 to MIT to help in the design
    effort for Koch's syndicate.  Milgrim is heading up the MIT effort.
    Anyone know specifics about this?

    SAN DIEGO - A Kiwi at the top of a mast, a missing Dennis Conner, a
    secret fin under the Japanese boat, Ted Turner and Jane Fonda - is it
    too soon for America's Cup drama and intrigue?
    
    That was all part of the scene Thursday when seven boats wound up two
    days of practice racing before the first International America's Cup
    Class Championship, starting Saturday.
    
    Rod Davis sailed New Zealand to a 45-second victory over Paul Cayard's
    new Il Moro di Venezia boat in Thursday's 21.2-mile race around the new
    eight-legged America's Cup course.
    
    Chris Dickson skippered the Nippon Challenge to third place and the
    overall, if unofficial, victory in the three-race non-event, following
    two seconds Wednesday.
    
    The underside of the Nippon boat was of some interest.  When the white
    hull bounced off a swell and the forward section lifted out of the
    water, a thin, vertical fin became visible.
    
    It is similar to the forward rudder featured on Tom Blackaller's USA
    12-meter in 1986-87 but is set farther aft, slightly forward of the
    keel.
    
    Is it a second rudder?  A kelp cutter to prevent the proliferation of
    seaweed off Point Loma from collecting on the keel?  No one is saying.
    
    Conner decided not to sail Thursday after hearing the forecast for
    20-to-25 knots of wind and hearing tactician Tom Whidden's report after
    a drive out to the end of Point Loma in the morning.  "It looked like
    the Gulf Stream out there," Whidden said.  "We've got one mast and one
    boat.  It'd be silly to break something and not be ready for Saturday."
    
    The sea settled, though, and the wind never got above 12 knots--and, if
    the truth be told, Conner and company did not seem terribly depressed
    about not going out.  They learned Wednesday with two third-place
    finishes that their new Stars & Stripes is competitive and see no point
    in risking it, considering the breakdowns other boats have suffered and
    the larger stakes ahead.
    
    Conner also will be sailing in the World Championship day-to-day.  The
    worlds will have five days of fleet racing, then two days of match
    racing among the four semi-finalists May 10-11.
    
    Turner rode the race aboard Bill Koch's older America-2 boat, the one
    he bought from the French for crew training.  Buddy Melges, with Gary
    Jobson as tactician, steered it to last place after a premature start
    and a questionable gamble sailing far away from the fleet to the left
    side of the course.
    
    Koch decided to keep his new boat, nicknamed "Jayhawk" for his native
    Kansas, in port after cracking the boom Wednesday.
    
    --- L.A. TIMES      
    

    8 leg America Cup Course? How does it work ?
    
    Peter

    As an Italian supporter of the two "Moro di Venezia" in the
    I.A.C.C. in San Diego I'd like to hear from your point of
    view about the two regattas already sailed.
    What forecasts about Mr. Conner and the other boats?
    Is Digital aboard some boat?
    Bye.
    Arrigo
    

    I think the new AC course uses the following mark pattern:
    
                               W
    
                  G1
    
    
                                         G2
    
    
                               L
    
    
    To get 8 legs the sequence would be:  L (start), W, L, W, G1, G2, L, W,
    L (finish).
    
    It's not the different from three consecutive windward leewards except
    that the two gybe marks on opposite sides of the course force the
    competitors to sail at least one identical downwind leg.  This will
    give opportunities to take time differences at the gybe marks.  It'll
    also force gybes at fixed points rather than at the skippers option
    which will give the more practiced crews a chance to show off spinnaker
    handling (and sponsors' logos) in front of the ESPN camera boats.
    
    I expect there to be a lot of gybing.  A light air venue and light
    boats mean there will be a lot of reaching to max VMG on the downwind
    legs.  But given the fragility of the new boats at this time, the
    relevant tradeoff may not be speed for distance but speed for risk of
    gear failure.
    
    There were a few newspaper articles this past weekend on the fleet
    racing going on in San Diego.  The range of budgets is something like
    $25M to $40M.  Anyone know what Elizabeth Meyer spent on her J-boat
    Endeavor?  J-boats were abandoned for being too expensive.  But I bet
    her construction costs were nothing like that.
    
    - gene

    
    	That is basically correct but two windward marks exist.  In
    addition I thought that a gate mark existed in the middle.  I do not
    have a copy of the course here in the office.  I might have one at
    home.
    
    	I also thought that the course length for the worlds was different
    between the fleet races, and the match races.  I am not positive of
    this but I am sure the ESPN coverage  this evening will cover the
    course layout.
    
    Forrest

    Second Race
    
    Boat/Skipper			Time
    
    1. New Zealand, Barnes		2:41:9.2
    2. Il Moro de Venezia III, Cayard	2:43:18.5
    3. Il Moro de Venezia I, Kolius	2:43:35.1
    4. Stars & Stripes, Conner		2:44:11.6
    5. Ville de Paris, Pajot		2:45:38.0
    6. Jayhawk, Koch			2:47:15.7
    7. Spain, del Campos		2:47:58.9
    8. Nippon, Dickson			2:49:13.2
    9. America3, Kostecki		2:49:26.5
    
    This is from the San Diego Union, Monday May 6.
    
    Second Race Summary Sunday May 5
    In 7 knots of wind and 2 foot seas, conditions half those encoountered
    Saterday, the nine boats got off to a clean start.  The left side of
    the course was slightly favored.  Stars & Stripes was clearly in the
    
    lead halfway up the leg and led by 25.2 seconds over New Zealand at the
    first mark, with Il Moro di Venezia III another 24 seconds back.  When
    Stars & Stripes encountered problems with the spinnaker pole after the
    rounding, New Zealand and Il Moro di Venezia sailed past.  When Stars &
    Stripes blew its fifth spinnaker in three days, it dropped two more
    places.  New Zealand led Il Moro III by 41.2 seconds an the end of the
    Z-leg as winds built up to a high of 12 knots.  Going to wind the
    second time, Stars & Stripes repassed Ville de Paris for fourth.  Both
    Nippon and Il Moro III blew spinnakers on the final run.
    
    There were several pages in the paper today on the subject and I will
    edit some notes from them.
    
    - In both of the first two races Stars & Stripes has clearly led to the
    first mark.  They know they have a fast boat and it was pointed out
    they out pointed by 10 degrees both New Zealand and Il Moro III to the
    first mark with out loosing boat speed, as they got there first.  Tom
    Whidden, S & S tactician, said "A boat that points higher into the wind
    and sails faster than the opposition is nearly unbeatable in match
    racing".
    
    - You are allowed to measure 17 sails for the Worlds.  Since Stars &
    Stripes has only been in the water a month they have only 2/3 of the
    allowed sails.  All of their spinnakers are 2 and 3 year old recycled
    Maxi boat spinnakers.  The Italians have tested over 30 sails.
    
    - On Saterday the Nippon/Dickson boat broke their 106-foot off at the
    goose neck.  Over night they replaced the $400k mast but could finish
    no better than eighth.  The older mast is heaver and there have been
    some doubts about whether or not one of the pre-race favorites can
    reach the match-racing segment.
    
    I was out watching the race Saterday.  At the start the wind was about
    15 knots and around 20 by the finish.  The Coast Guard kept everybody
    1000 yards from the course so it was impossible to tell one boat from
    another.  There were so many huge (100-200') power boats out there that
    the water was very choppy.  One would probably be better off buying a
    ticket on one of those boats than taking your own out.  ESPN should
    have some good coverage as there were many news helicopters following
    the boats.
    
    I will try to enter some more notes before it's over.
    
    Chuck 
    
    

    re . 372
    
    Gene,
    
    I don't race, but that second turn around the leeward mark seems like
    it is going to create some very interesting situations - crossing the
    trailing boats' courses while on a port tack.  Was that part of the
    design??  Full contact racing??
    
    Ron

    re .373
    
    Yes, there is more to it.  But I can't remember what the additional
    marks are. 
    
    re .375
    
    Since the trials and actual cup races are match races, I don't think
    there will be that much opportunity for full contact.  The first boat
    around the leeward mark will be on port tack initially while the one
    behind will still have his spinnaker up on starboard tack.  One will be
    going upwind towards the right while the other comes downwind from the
    right.  If no one changes course, they'll just sail past each other on
    parallel tracks in opposite directions.
    
    But since the boats are light and, presumably, tack fast, the boat
    ahead may wish to tack onto starboard just to make the boat behind go
    around him thereby upsetting the second boat's preparations to douse
    its chute.
    
    There probably more chaos in normal fleet racing at the leeward mark. 
    A boat that tacks onto starboard immediatly can cause havoc among the
    boats about to round.  However, there is a cost (besides potential
    sinking) in that the air, with all the chutes of the boats behind
    blocking it, is badly disturbed.  It's often better to go out on port
    tack a ways before flipping over just to avoid this.
    
    - gene

    You assume that the marks are to be rounded on the same side.  If the
    diagram is right (not sure it is), the second leeward would be passed
    to starboard and the subsequent windward also to starboard.  Right?
    
    Dave

    This month's Cruising World has a nice section on the competition,
    the new class of boat (as compared to the old 12 meter), and the
    race course.
    
    	Howard

    The following is by Rich Roberts, L.A. Times Staff Writer.  I like the
    way he tries to put as much color and stir up as much controversy as
    possible in his reporting.  Always entertaining.
    
    San Diego -- Bill Koch says the new International America's Cup Class
    boats are "incredibly dangerous" and the men who designed them are
    "idiots."
    
    Chris Dickson disagrees.  He says maybe his mast fell down Saturday
    because it was Butsu Metsu Day--the one day a year that Buddha takes
    off, depriving followers of his protection.  
    
    Koch was serious.  Dickson?  It depends how far the New Zealand citizen
    is into the culture of the Japanese, for whom he sails.
    
    Winds up to 20 knots swept in the new era of high-tech boats in the Cup
    with the first race of the IACC World Championship Saturday, and the
    toll was terrific.
    
    --Three spinnakers (Dennis Conner, two, on Stars & Stripes and Koch on
    America-3;
    --Three spinnaker poles (Conner, Koch and Ville de Paris);
    --One steering pedestal (Spain '92);
    --One boom (Conner);
    --One boom vang (Koch);
    --One mast (Diskson);
    --One soggy crewman (Nippon).
    
    Americans Paul Cayard and John Kolius sailed the two red boats from
    Italy's Il Moro di Venezia syndicate to a solid one-two finish, but
    three of the nine starters were knocked out and Conner limped through
    most of the 21.1-nautical mile race without a mainsail, finishing
    sixth, but finishing.
    
    The question for months has been whether the new, high-tech boats could
    withstand the battering of strong winds and heavy seas.  Nobody
    expected much of that off Point Loma, but before this event, which runs
    through next Saturday, two boats--New Zealand and Il Moro--had been
    dismasted in practice and Dickson predicted there would be more.
    
    There was.  His.  Dickson had just stopped to retrieve a man overboard
    at one mark when his mast fell down at the next.
    
    Spain and Koch also dropped out, but Conner, after his boom cracked
    midway of the race, dropped his mainsail and completed the race with
    only a headsail--although he did raise two spinnakers that blew out.
    
    Koch, a multi-millionaire industrialist, thinks it could get worse.  "I
    think the guys that made up the rules to design these boats are
    idiots," Koch said.  "I think these boats are incredibly dangerous.  I
    think someone's gonna get hurt out here."
    
    Dickson said: "These boats are....a great challenge....exactly what the
    America's Cup is all about.  These are not boats that an average sailor
    is gonna feel happy with."
    
    Don                                                                   

    ESPN did a great job last night.  Race two was not as destructive. 
    Can't remember who won, but the Italians came in second and third. 
    America 3 came in first on Monday's race.
    
    I was wrong about the race course.  The leeward mark is indeed button
    hooked at the second rounding.
    
    Koch was really upset in the Saturday night news conference.  To an
    extent he is right.  These boats are not built to go in heavy breeze. 
    Yet.
    
    Dave

    I liked the cross-section of spinnaker pole that Isler
    held up.  Did you see how thin the wall was!!!!  Looked like they
    could afford to go a few nanos thicker... 
    
    The boats are lovely to look at -- very reminiscent of 12s.
    They are delicate, but that's teething pains.  They'll certainly
    target higher loads in the next generation.  
    
    Wouldn't it be great to see a fleet designed for Fremantle!
    Hope they find some why to rotate location, even if one
    club keeps winning.  Should be some equitable means of preserving
    the home-court (financial) advantage.
    
    What the heck is this law suit about?  What alleged crime was
    commited?
    
    Ah, Cup fever is setting in!!  What a great compliment to the
    start of the racing season!
    
    Dean
    
    
    
    

The leeward mark "buttonhook" (as Dave calls it) after the reaching legs 
is quite intentional, according to the CW writer.  

>>>  If no one changes course, they'll just sail past each other on
>>>  parallel tracks in opposite directions.
    
After rounding, the boat still on port tack should easily point high 
enough to cross the reaching leg rhumbline, if they don't choose to tack 
immediately.  The apparent intention is to give a tactical advantage to 
the trailing boat at that point, as the leading boat may have to deal with 
a) dousing a spinnaker, b) jibing that fragile rig, c) setting headsails, 
d) tacking onto the favorable side, and e) avoiding the other boat.  All 
within a minute or so....

That mark, BTW, is intended to be a focal point for viewer coverage, as 
it's possible to place a camera boat quite close by to leeward without 
disturbing the racing, yet providing some close-ups.  This should be one 
heck of a TV series...we'll need VT1500's or something that can provide a 
live video feed into a window while we try to do some work in another!

J.

    Results of third fleet race, Monday May 6
    
    1. Jayhawk, Koch-Kostecki   	2:54:22.2
    2. New Zealand, Davis		2:55:14.1
    3. Nippon, Dickson			2:56:18.3
    4. Stars & Stripes, Conner		2:57:54.8
    5. Il Moro di Venezia I, Kolius	2:58:12.5
    6. Spain, Campos        	   	2:58:13.5
    7. Il Moro di Venezia III, Cayard	2:58:43.4
    8. America3, Melges			2:59:19.1
    9. Ville de Paris, Pajot		3:00:49.7
    
    Distance 21.2 miles
    Winds: 6-10 knots
    Summary: Spain, Il Moro III, and France were all over the line early
    and had to restart.  Stars & Stripes appeared to be doing well early
    but sailed to far to the right corner and overstood the first mark when
    the wind shifted to the left.  New Zealand led at the first mark by
    12.5 seconds over Jayhawk with Nippon 20.1 seconds behind.  Stars &
    Stripes was 2:54 behind in sixth.  Jayhawk flew a large gennaker and
    slipped behind Nippon on the first reach.  The Japanese were gaining on
    New Zealand on the second reach when the spinnaker halyard broke and
    the chute fell in the water.  New Zealand led Nippon by 39 seconds at
    the end of the Z-leg with Jayhawk 1:16 behind.  The leaders didn't
    change on the next windward-leeward lap.  On the next beat to wind,
    Jayhawk worked inside Nippon going to the left side and moved into
    second.  Jayhawk rounded the last mark 36.7 seconds behind New Zealand. 
    After the Kiwis picked the left side of the course, Jayhawk bore off to
    the right, caught a windshift and overtook New Zealand with a more
    conventional spinnaker.  Jayhawk crossed New Zealands bow halfway down
    the run and won by 51.9 seconds.  After a bad start Stars & Stripes
    rallied to finish fourth.
    
    Standings after three races;
    
    Boat			Finishes	Pts.
    1. New Zealand		3-1-2		5 3/4
    2. Il Moro di Venezia III	1-2-7		9 3/4
    3. Il Moro di Venezia I	2-3-5		10
    4. Stars & Stripes		6-4-4		14
    5. Jayhawk		      dnf-6-1		16 3/4
    6. Villa de Paris		5-5-9		19
    7. Nippon		      dnf-8-3		21
       America3			4-9-8		21
    8. Spain		      dnf-7-6		23
    
    	
    Chuck

    Fleet Race Four called after the 4 3/4 hour time limit.
    
    -The winds were only briefly higher than 6 knots and under 4 for most
    of the race.
    
    -Stars & Stripes had a 10 minute lead and was only 1/2 a mile from the
    finish line when the time limit ran out.
    
    -The nine boat fleet was spread out over 39 minutes and tailender Il
    Moro di Venezia I was almost a full leg behind.
    
    -In second position when the race was called was Il Moro di Venezia
    III.
    
    -Yesterday's race (four) will NOT be resailed.  The fleet series will
    be shortened to four races and will end today, wind permitting.
    
     
    Question??  Does anybody know the rules on who makes the Match Race
    Series?  Is it the top four by the point standings?  Two match races
    Saturday and the winners on Sunday?
    
    Chuck

    Top four by point standings after the fleet racing make the match
    racing.  Don't know if the whole thing wraps up this weekend or not.
    
    Dave

    
    re .384
    
    Difficult to predict much based on this regatta.
    More of a shake-down than anything.  
    
    But you want a forecast?  Stars and Stripes will win
    the Cup again.  The boat seems to have superior upwind
    ability right out of the box; DC and company are the 
    smartest bunch out there with the added advantage of local
    knowledge and home-court fans; and the competition from 
    Koch's syndicate will give them a world-class tune-up.  
    Maybe that's the easy prediction to make, but, *gulp*, 
    that's how it will go.
    
    Who will challenge?  That's the big question....
    Somehow I think it will end up being Australia or New Zealand.
    
    Sorry,
    ;)
    
    re. 385/386
    
    nevermind...

    re. 384 Arrigo's questions
    
    The Italian boats;
    They are very well prepared and have been sailing this type of boat for
    over one year.  Their experience shows as after 3 races both are in the
    top four.  In the called race, III was second and I was ninth.  They
    seem to be well financed, their compound here is very large, well
    equiped.  They have tested more sails than most of the others.  They
    have been sailing in San Diego since January and both boats have been
    out almost 7 days a week since then.  Chucks cut is that at least one
    of their boats will make the Match Series and a good posibility both
    will as they are only 1/4 a point appart.  
    
    Conners team;
    Stars & Stripes was christened on April 7th, thus they do not have a
    lot experience with the boat.  Most of the key crew members have been
    with Dennis for a long time, they know each other very well.  They are
    experts at planning and execution.  Most of their current sails are
    re-cut Maxi sails and with their lack of sailing time they are blowing
    them out and resewing them for each race.  They have proven they have a
    fast hull design in varied wind conditions.  Race 1 & 2 they were first
    to the windward mark at which point they started equipment failures. 
    They have the ability to out point the  others by up to 10 degrees up
    wind.  They also have an excellent light wind boat as they had a 10
    minute lead when time ran out.  Their problems are keeping the boat
    together.  Currently he has only one boat and one mast.  His goal is
    the America's Cup and not the World's.  He has to keep this boat
    together, and major failures will set him additional months behind.
    Chucks cut is he would like very much to remain in the top four, but
    will sail a conservative race from an equipment point of view. 
    Remember in the Australia Worlds he kept his boats in Hawaii
    practicing.  In the newspaper this morning Conner said he's made his
    decision about whether Stars & Stripes will sail in the match races. 
    But he's keeping it a secret.
    
    Digital's involvement;
    We have just announced a 500k dollar equipment donation to the America3
    team.  It is made up of 5000 and 3100 workstations and time on MIT's
    9000.  
    
    Also the Italians have 6 or so 3100.  I believe they purchased them. 
    Our office is servicing them.  The engineer at our carry in desk says
    that they come in with the terminals and pay cash from a large roll of
    bills.
    
    Hope this helps on your questions.
    
    Chuck

    The AC boats are kind of a cross-bread between Maxi's and ULDB's.
    Both types of boats have been around for awhile, the designs are
    so mature it's almost one-design. I'm having a hard time believing 
    that Conner's boat can outpoint the fleet by 10 degrees without
    a drop in boatspeed. If this were true, he'd win every windward
    leg easily.
    
    -Paul 

    re. 388     thanks, Chuck. Your statements look very well based.
    
    Is it true what I heard this night i.e. D.C. will not race the
    match races so leaving the place to another boat?
    If so, which is the classement now? Will the races start
    on 10th? Which boats will run against?
    Sorry for all the questions but, as you can easily imagine,
    there is poor coverage by newspapers and, of course, the races
    end late in the night. Moreover the coverage is only made
    by Tele Montecarlo (partly owned by Mr. Gardini); no coverage
    on the national channels too busy with soccer and soccer and soccer
    and, if time is left, with soccer!
    Thanks and bye.
    A.
    

    After the fleet racing the two Italian boats, Stars & Stripes and New
    Zealand make up the top four that qualify for the match racing.  In the
    semi-finals the Italians would race each other and Dennis would race
    New Zealand.  Dennis has until this morning at 9:00 to announce if
    he'll race or not.  This morning's paper says that he has accomplished
    his goal of learning as much as possible about the other boats and
    where Stars & Stripes stands in the fleet.  He doesn't want to risk
    damage to the boat by more racing with inadequate sails.  Also the bad
    feeling between NZ and Dennis left over from the cat vs. mono fiasco
    has still not been completely healed and Dennis may not want to open
    old wounds with a showdown now.  He'd rather wait for '92.
    
    On the other hand Dennis feels like the host skipper and wants to
    support this event as much as possible.  The general feeling is he
    won't sail and Nippon will take on NZ.
    
    Don

    Conner qualifies for semifinals, but won't race.
    
    Fourth and last fleet race results;
    
    1. Il Moro di Venezia III, Cayard	2:31:15.5
    2. Stars & Stripes, Conner		2:33:29.5
    3. New Zealand, Barnes		2:33:40.5
    4. Nippon, Dickson			2:33:41.1
    5. Spain, Campos			2:34:41.1
    6. America3, Kostecki		2:35:44.6
    7. Il Moro di Venezia I, Kolius	2:37:14.4
    8. Ville de Paris, Pajot		2:40:16.5
    9. Jayhawk, Koch-Jobson		2:40:30.1
    
    
    Final fleet race standings
    
    Boat			Finish		pts
    
    1. New Zealand		3-1-2-3		8 3/4
    2. Il Moro di Venezia III	1-2-7-1		10 1/2
    3. Stars & Stripes		6-4-4-2		16
    4. Il Moro di Vene	zia I	2-3-5-7		17
    5. Nippon		      dnf-8-3-4		25	      
    6. Jayhawk		      dnf-6-1-9		25 3/4
    7. Ville de Paris		5-5-9-8		27
       America3	                4-9-8-6		27
    8. Spain		      dnf-7-6-5		28
    
    The summary in the paper is extreeemly long so I will pick and choose
    some data.
    
    - Weather conditions, moderate winds 12 to 15 knots and 3-foot seas
    
    - At the start Il Moro I was over early and Stars & Stripes was trapped
    on the left courner of the line and had to port tack under everyone. 
    Both boats were 33 seconds late on the start.
    
    - Conners pushed from eighth at the start to second at the first mark,
    18.6 seconds behind Il Moro III with Nippon third.
    
    - By the end of the Z-leg Il Moro III was 45.5 seconds ahead of Stars 
    & Stripes and 57.3 seconnds ahead of Nippon.
    
    - At the finish New Zealand was able to nose out Nippon by 6/10th of a
    second to take third.  
    
    
    As I suppected yesterday both Italian boats made the finals with New
    Zealand and Stars & Stripes.  With Dennis NOT race and Nippon will get
    his spot.  The two Italian boats against each other and New Zealand
    against Nippon.  The first match races will be on Friday.
    
    I have heard a local rumor that Stars & Stripes has a long thin rudder
    in front of the keel, similar to the one tried by Blackholler (sp?). 
    This would help explain his pointing capability.  There is no question
    after being eighth and 33 seconds behind and then overtaking six boats
    in the first leg he has a fast upwind boat.  The design team feels they
    have come along way in making up for their late start.  My take is they
    may have the cutting-edge boat design.  It will be real interesting to
    see  their second boat.  Give this team some proper sails and some time
    on the water and watch out.  
    
    Chuck   

    
    More interesting data;
    
    - Koch's America3 effort offered to lend Stars & Stripes all the
    headsails it needed to compete the Worlds.  "It was on the table but
    never picked up," said Jayhawks co-skipper Buddy Melges.
    
    - Conner's comments....When we get a little bit more financing, we'll
    be able to increase the performance of this boat.  Demonstrating that
    his boat is probably faster than Koch's 2nd boat, and right up there
    with Italy's 3rd and New Zealands 3rd, won't hurt Conner's fund-raising
    efforts, either.  That will determine when he builds his second boat.
    
    - "The designers are confortable that they can make a step ahead with
    the next piece of equipment, based upon what they learned with this
    boat," Conners said.  "This tells you their tools are good, which is
    the encouraging part.  And it tells you that the tools that some other
    people have arn't as good, because you wouldn't build a slow boat on
    purpose.  Some of the boats out there were obviously off the pace."
    
    - Kolius is in a sticky situation.  He's out to beat his boss in the
    pairing of Paul Cayard's Il Moro di Venezia III vs. Kolius' Il Moro di
    Venezia I.  "We're stoked," said Kolius about Italy's "B boat."  "I
    don't have to worry about setting a curfew for my crew.  Everyone's
    fired up."  
    
    Just a year ago, Italy's first attempt at the new 75-foot America's Cup
    Class rule was reportedly getting thumped by France's first boat (now
    America3) in a series of tests.  Now Il Moro Venezia I will go to the
    semifinals while the new French boat (Ville de Paris) and the new
    America3 (Jayhawk) are heading to the barn.
    
    Kolius and Cayard know the "B team" has a shot at upsetting Il Moro di
    Venezia III tomorrow.  "I don't think Paul would switch boats with me,"
    Kolius said. "But sudden-death racing is fun."
    
    - With Dennis gone, all four semifinalists have one thing in common. 
    None is skippered entirely by a skipper from the nation of the
    challenge.  Italy's tandem of Cayard and Kolius are both Americans. 
    Japan borrowed Dickson from New Zealand, and the Kiwis have Coronado
    (San Diego suburb) native Davis sharing the wheel with Barns.
    
    
    With all the "mind games" going on here in San Diego, it is just like a
    good TV "soap".  
    
    Tune in next week, same time same note.
    
    Chuck

    I got to see some of the match racing on ESPN this past Saturday.  It
    was almost as exciting as watching a grass growing contest.  For this a
    collective budget of >$100M is being spent?
    
    An interesting comment from DC in last Friday's Boston Globe which
    went along the lines of "Our boat's performance shows our tools are
    good.  It also shows some other peoples tools are not so good 'cause
    they wouldn't deliberately build a slow boat".  Just whose tools did he
    mean - surely not OUR tools.
    
    - gene

    I watched the IACC Worlds final match race on Saturday. Paul Cayard
    and the Italians won. 
    
    I still feel, no matter how big and exotic the boats are, racing
    in medium to light air is not exciting on TV. It just doesn't
    compare with 12 meters in Freemantle or International 14's in Corpus 
    Christie.  
    
    Paul

    	I believe he was talking about the tools developed by his design
    team.  Bruce Nelson, and his other designers (cannot remember all the
    names), some input from the Partnership Americas Cup Technology (PACT),
    and from the testing tank.  I heard from a friend the other day who is
    doing much of the tank testing for DC, and PACT.  They are working 16
    and 18 hour days 6 and 7 days a week.  He gets a chuckle out all the
    secrecy they insist on.  He said that we worked under fewer
    restrictions when we did handling studies for the Trident program.


    Forrest

    Racing in medium to light air is never exciting live, imagine on TV!
    
    Anyway, from an Italian point of view it has been exciting, even
    because an Italian TV presenter, at the end of his show, before
    the link with S.D. announced: " Moro III has broken her main and
    New Zealand is going to win. What a pity." It was a sudden pain
    to my heart, I couldn't believe, I didn't want to believe to such
    a "sfiga" (kind of unluck in slang). But I waited for and I could
    see that the guy was not well informed (!).
    Anyway, I agree that twelves in Freemantle were really superb and
    I too have a kind of "nostalgia" for these wonderful boats. Proba-
    bly an enhancement of the A.C.'s would be desirable in terms of
    sea capabilities but, then, the Cup should be always raced in windy
    seas. Anyway, on my opinion, the final regatta has been a good match,
    and has shown two good crews. Don't forget that, in the past history
    of the Cup, lots of regattas have been raced in very light airs,
    with the winner taking up to 20 minutes advantage on the other boat
    (happened only once) and you must also remeber that, in the 19th cen-
    tury regattas, the defenders always took advantage from being desi-
    gned and built for sailing in light airs and smooth winds (off of
    NY). Don't forget that in 1934, Sopwith's Endeavour on the 3rd race,
    while had already won the first two, had the start delayed because
    the wind was too strong for Vanderbilt's boat (but not for the En-
    glish) and the racing committee decided to postpone the start, so
    allowing NYYC to win. 
    Light airs are always a boredom but, what would you suggest?
    
    Ciao, Arrigo.
    

    I, for one, have not a bit of "nostalgia" for the pigs known as the
    12's.  They were the ultimate in boring unless raced in Freo or Hawaii. 
    These new boats are cutting edge and very exciting.  Keep in mind this
    is the first racing of brand new designs.  There are going to be
    breakthrough boats and it might not be very even at first.  SO WHAT!!
    
    These boats at least have the potential for making uncommon
    technologies more common and tested.  We will all benefit from this.
    I loved it.  Bring on more!!
    
    Dave

    Are 12 meter's really pigs???
    
    These new IACC boats cost ten times as much, have about twice the sail
    area, and feature the latest in hull and keel design. Yet the
    comentator on last weekends racing said "these new boats are going
    a whole knot faster than the 12's upwind!"  The 12's typically went
    9.5 knots upwind. So the new space age boats go 10.5 knots, big deal.
    I also heard these new boats aren't pointing very well.
    
    Downwind, the IACC performance is impressive. I heard 13-14 knots. 
                                   

    From the camera's eye, these boats are no more exciting to watch than
    12s, especially to the average viewer.  Which doesn't mean I wouldn't
    love to sail one, but I'd love to sail a 12 too.
    
    Will the technologies applied yield more practical applications than 
    the 12s would have?  Doubt it.  That era was headed in the same direction 
    and would have accelerated just as quickly.  In fact, the new class 
    owes an awful lot to the 12s.  What innovations will filter down 
    to average sailors now that would otherwise have not?  Bow rudders?  
    Winged keels?  Composites?  Asymetrical chutes?  What?
    
    If yacht design ends up eclipsing the contributions of crew work,
    tactics, and etc, the racing will be *very* dull.  So what?  How many 
    people really enjoyed the last America's Cup???  It's in the Cup's 
    best interests to have relative parity in design, such that all the 
    competitive elements have equal weight in deciding the outcome.
    If the upcoming Cup ends up a blow-out, you can bet big $$ they'll
    be "tuning" the new rule to neutralize that advantage.  Maybe that
    will amount to no more than requiring that the winning boat's design
    be released.  Whatever it takes to keep things even.  Don't forget,
    this is the age of "standards."
    
    $.02
    Dean

    I recieved a publication in the mail from the America3 Foundation
    looking for $$$$.  It included the basic specifications between the old
    12's and the new A.C. boats.  How one interprets the rule will vary
    the specific dimensions.
    
    			12 Meter		America's Cup
    
    Overall length:	65ft.			75ft.
    Speed Upwind:	8.5-9.5 knots		10-11.2 knots
    Speed Downwind:	10-12 knots		14-16 knots	
    Beam:		12ft.			18ft.
    Draft:		9ft.			13ft.
    Mast height:	86ft.			110ft.
    Sail Area:
      Main/jib:		2,000 sq. ft.		3,000 sq. ft.
      Spinnaker:	2,500 sq. ft.		4,500 sq. ft.
    Displacement:	56,000 lbs.		37,000 lbs.
    No. of crew:	11			16
    
    
    I have a soft spot in my heart when a 12 sails by, but I agree with
    previous noters, lets get on with the new boats.  Change always causes
    us to realign our thinking.  Once you have seen these new boats in
    action it doesn't long to wish you were at the helm with the spinnaker
    flying.
    
    Saturday we saw the old 12 Meter, Defender down from Newport Beach, Ca.
    out watching the races.  It tied up next to two other 12's, Heart of
    America and Stars & Stripes.  Defender has been retrofitted with a
    diesel and roller furlling jib!   8-)  Now there is a TRUE race/cruise 
    design.
    
    Chuck

    A "whole knot" is ovr a 10% speed increase.  That's like Indy cars
    going from 200 mph to 220 mph.  And the downwind/reaching increase
    would be like Indy cars zooming up to 300 mph on the straightaways.
    I'll take that kind of increase.  These things are light displacement
    monsters with little, high aspect headsails.  One wouldn't expect that
    uphill speed or pointing ability would be their strongest point.
    
    Plus, the course is designed to favor off wind speed over upwind speed
    if a trade off is necessary.
    
    My real beef is that there was virtually nothing learned or tried in
    Freemantle that applied to the sailing public.  The technology of the
    everyday club racer had surpassed that of the twelves.  Incremental
    speed increases were gained by arcane hull coatings and miniscule hull
    shape advances.  Talk about a waste of money!  These new boats are of
    totally new construction  materials that will be well proven through
    breakage and use.  Better to let these guys pay for the trial and error
    than us!  The Italian campaign is sponsered by Montedison's owner not
    just because because he happens to like sailing a lot.  The knowledge
    of composites gained has applicability to what his company does.  We
    will all gain from this series.
    
    Soo...I go back to my position that I don't miss the twelves any more
    than I miss propeller driven airliners.
    
    Dave

    Dave, Dave, Dave,
    
    If the Cup were still in 12s, they would be composite.
    If 12s were 10 feet longer, they would go faster.  
    OK, they'd be a 13 or 14s, but you know what I'm
    saying.  
    
    The King is dead.  Long live the King.
    
    Dean
    
    

    The benefits of racing technology should be obvious to one and all.  I,
    for one, intend to take advantage of the latest Indy 500 thinking in
    aerodynamics.  As we speak, a whale tail is being fitted to my Ford
    Escort.  Now it'll do 10.5 knots easily.
    
    - gene

    Dean and Gene,
    
    You two, of all people, surprise me!  Perhaps you'd both like to be
    racing wooden boats with long overhangs and Egyptian cotton sails.  To
    build 12's out of composites doesn't get you a whole lot as the NZ
    boats showed last time.  It's the design that makes the use of
    composites exciting.  These designs are more in tune with modern
    offshore racers than 12's are.  
    
    Just some of the common feature we now take for granted that were
    considered radical when introduced by the grand prix racing community
    are:  fiberglass hulls, cored laminate hulls and decks, roller bearing
    genny cars, multi speed winches, self tailing winches, sheet stoppers,
    low stretch sheets, integrated digital instruments, slab reefing,
    feathering and folding propellers, foul language and bad manners.
    
    Well, maybe the last two weren't really invented for racing, but they
    were perfected there.  Dean and Gene, pull your heads out of your
    transoms! ;^)
    
    Gene, can't help you on your Escort.  Sorry.
    
    Dave

    If Digital payed me $1 million per year, I'd be excited about a 1%
    increase. But they don't.
    
    If sailboats went 200 mph, a 10% increase in speed would be something.
    Hydroplanes are pretty neat, they actually touch the water every few
    seconds.
    
    But since we're talking about real sailboats: I just can't see
    (especially on TV) how 1-2 knots of speed differential, in the 9-14 knot 
    range, makes one boat much different from the other. They're both 
    turbo-slugs to me. These boats were supposed to be "very exciting to 
    watch" in San Diego. 
    
    Gary Jobson gave an interview in Newport a few months back. On the
    future of the IACC class he said "I don't think it will stick around".
    On carbon fiber masts, he called them "a big waste of money".
    
     

    (pilot light lit)
    
    I can't believe all the negative fibes coming from a sailors
    conference.  It seems that there are people out there that do not enjoy
    watching "daddy warbucks" filling large holes of saltwater with a
    endless supply of money.  It's not your or my money.....why worry?
    If the sailing community benifits from new technology, great, if not
    then it's a path no one needs to take.  Could we squeek more speed out
    of the 12 meter rule?  Probably, but why not take a quantum leap?? 
    Were else can we test new ideas and concepts, then benifit from the
    results and spend not a dime?
    
    Chuck

    It seems to as this new class is not meeting expectatives.
    On my opinion A.C.'s are really beautyful boats but I don't
    consider myself a good judge about boats (from a technical
    point of view). I never saw the twelves racing (just a little
    tape, here in DEC, after the 1987 Cup, showing the Kookaburras)
    nor sailed something similar (6 or 8 meters) so I can't judge
    the performances but I wouldn' call them 'pigs'.
    On my opinion again I think that we should consider the Cup
    from two different points of view:
    on one side, in the past, the Cup was supposed to be raced by
    the fastest possible and most extreme boats, probably expensive
    toys for whealty people (Lipton, Sopwith, Vanderbilt, Morgan, etc.)
    and this could justify Fay's challenge with KZ7.
    On the other side, in 1957, NYYC and English RYS agreed that the
    Cup was too expensive and so they choosed the 12's that, at time,
    were 'small' and 'cheap' (against the J class) so we can assume
    that this decision involved too not to race with ratings and this
    seems to me a good idea; this means too a trend towards standards.
    Now:
    were the 12's really outdated? 
    Are the A.C.'s really up-to-date?
    Is the show really more exciting and interesting? Is it able to
    capture the attention and the interest of more people towards
    sailing as a sport for many and not only few rich persons?
    It seems to me that 12's were more 'charming' but I must say
    that also the A.C.'s give a good impression. Probably in Free-
    mantle they could be more impressive while in the Adriatic Sea
    they could be boring (but how boring is a 12 in very light air?).
    Consider the matter also from the show point of view: people that
    don't know sailing don't understand what work is going on aboard;
    in the 4th race (the one out of max. time) I looked till the end
    but it was piteous even for one that sails; I don't think a 12
    would have been faster. What I mean is that you also have to keep
    in mind the show, an exciting show of boats that run over waves,
    of a crew working frenetically, of a competition that sees the boats
    one close to the other. This last point is probably the most important
    towards standard boats. 
    Let me say that the Cup would have lost interest if never left the
    NYYC; this happened because someone found out a winning idea about
    winged keels. Now we'll see if these new boats will provide a better
    balanced competition between challenger and defender so creating
    the 'suspense' in the 'better of seven'. The class rules seem to be
    clear to everybody and this should avoid the 'court of justice race'
    that, sure, is not so interesting and, as someone wrote on a former
    note, this class is brand new, let's wait and see.
    Ciao a tutti.
    A.
    

    
    
    No negative vibes here.  I'm having fun.  
    A good philosophical debate!!!  ;)
    
    What's happening to the Cup is the direct result of
    Faye's renegade challenge.  Had that not occured, we would
    not see the changes occuring so fast.  That's all.  I've
    got no problem with these new boats -- "I'd love to
    sail one" --  but neither would I have a problem racing wooden 
    boats with long overhangs and cotton sails, just as long as 
    the competition has comparable gear.  
    
    For me, the Cup is more about men sailing than it is design.  Hell, we
    can't even see the designs.  We're only now getting to see some
    of the last-generation 12s, and they are *very* advanced.  These new
    boats are just longer and lighter 12-meters.  
    
    But my *real* point is that design should not outweigh the other 
    competitive elements, irregardless of class rules.  ie, "The King
    is dead..."
    

while (rathole == TRUE)
{

The 12 meter formula is 80 years old.  These are essentially very heavy, full
keel boats.  Their turning radius is twice what a modern yacht is.  It takes
minutes for them to accelerate out of tacks.  They are very hard to stear.  The
helm is quite unresponsive.

Of course, in match racing, it doesn't make any difference.

I don't think anyone would argue that the 12 meter formula is very out of
date from the perspective of "modern" navel architecture.  

Whether the IACC boats are the answer is another question.  They are certainly
pushing the materials technology.  But their performance potential is
way ahead of any other design rule of today (IOR MAXI, IOR 50's, etc.).  

Absolute performance doesn't result in good spectator sailing.  Nothing would
in my opinion.  Even out on the race course as a competitor, you don't spend
a lot of time watching other boats.  You have to wait too long to see who's
ahead (either at mark roundings or crosses).  Neither does heavy air sailing. 
That's just the stock car, let's watch them crash mentality. You can have a
lot of that in light air with a fragile boat!

The great thing about the IACC boats is they are pumping a tremendous amount 
of $$$'s into an industry that is languising.  They are also pushing a
technology in design and materials that will eventually filter down to the
average boat.  It may take 10 years, but I'll bet that in 2000, you'll see
most of the new boats being designed and constructed with ideas and materials 
that came directly out of the IACC.

One example is the use of computer technology for integrated instrument and
information systems.  Functionality that used to take a DG Nova with lots of
batteries in the early 70's is now a standard feature of almost every
instrument vendor. 

Another topic is commercialism in sailing.  There needs to be a place for the
big boys (and women) to play.  The local PHRF fleet is no place for the pro's.
I know of a couple of boats in the "local" fleet that are helmed exclusively 
by professional sailors at the owner's expense.  If these people want to be
heros, they should be in the pro circuit (IOR MAXI, Formula 40, IOR 50, etc.)
I just looked at the back cover of this year's YRUMB book.  It made me sick.

}

    re .411
    
    Your last paragraph says it all.  The big boys (and women) need a place
    to play.  Even if the 12 meter rule was intended (at the time) to hold
    down the entry cost, wealth will continue to put pressure on the high
    end.  I get a kick out of "lottery shopping" by reading all the adds in
    Yatching magazine.  What these people are actually doing is what my
    wildest fantasies are about.  Let's not stagnate, keep moving the stake
    further down the beach.
    
    Chuck

    Prior to 1914 (WWI) in Europe most crews of racing yachts were 
    professional and yachts privately owned. The owner was the 
    "skipper" but employed a sailing master, who in reality was the 
    man in charge. WWI changed the social makeup of Europe and from 
    1918 to 1939(WWII) most yachts were owned by very wealthy 
    families but the crews were mixed friends of the owners and 
    professional crews. Since WWII the cycle has gone from syndicate 
    owners with mainly "amateur" crews to large corporate owners 
    with professional crews. The style of boats has also reflected 
    the changing social evolution. 
    
    The new class will also cause change and perhaps may lead to a 
    super sailing professional league that perhaps will like tennis, 
    golf etc have venues in many locations so many of us can enjoy 
    the spectacle. If some of the technology eventually filters down 
    to us cruising crews so much the better.
    
    Pete

    We have the cart before the horse.
    
    IACC boats haven't instigated new technology or even new uses for old
    technology.  They've simply taken construction techniques common in
    other areas of sailing and scaled them up.
    
    Carbon fiber masts have been around for a while in windsurfers where
    they allow the fabrication of masts with known and reproducible bending
    characteristics.  As any finn or Etchells sailor knows, that's hard to
    do in aluminum.  And what do you think they use in Freedom yacht masts?
    
    Ditto for the hulls.  Take a up-to-date 505 hull, stretch it, and,
    presto, instant IACC hull.  And where have we seen high roach mainsails
    before?  Is John Kalinowski reading this?  High aspect jibs on big
    boats?  Hmmm....isn't there a certain one-tonner on the used market
    with one of these?  Long thin keels with bulbs on the bottom?  Remember
    the Tempest?  The boat that replaced the Star class in the olympics
    back in the late sixties for one year then disappeared from the sailing
    scene.  Look underneath one of them.  Fittings and hardware - straight
    out of the Haarken big boat catalog.  
    
    I think the only trickle down impact on us simple folk might the glut
    of used, stripped out, lightweight 75' hulls on the market two years
    from now.  Place your order now and get a reservation for the 1993
    Monhegan race.  It's notorious for light air.  You might give Starlight
    Express, the local Santa Cruz 70 a run for her money.
    
    - gene
    
    

    Ah well you can tell the level of coverage and interest over here, I
    had assumed that it was all new etc etc..........Thinking about it
    though Brookes & Gatehouse only came up with Digital displays etc to
    appeal to their wealthy clients not the racing fraternity, so I wonder
    how much new technology, apart from sails really comes out of racing.
    Don't see many Freedom's over here and thus hadn't realised what their
    masts were made of. I had better duck out of this racing conversation
    as a mere cruiser I am getting out of my depth......
    
    
    Pete

    A few other things that racing has given to cruising...
    
    Halyards led back to the cockpit. This is almost universal now on new
    boats, virtually unheard of 10 years ago, except on racers.
    
    Modern Slab reefing, although I guess it may have been racers that led
    the move away from the old points reefing, to boom-roller reefing in
    the first place.
    
    Wing keels - Now quite common on upmarket-shallow draft cruising
    yachts, even though their use in racing has proved limited.
    
    Separate Keels & rudders ??
    
    One thing that went the other way... Cruising Chutes existed long
    before racing yachts sprouted asymmetric spinnakers
    
    Chris
    
                                                               

    Re: Gene's note.
    
    Yes the composite construction is there in small boats.  There is a bit
    of a difference between a 505 and an IACC hull!  Bulb keels, too.  The
    advances passed down will be mainly in the area of applying these
    construction techniques to larger hulls.  The more experience, the
    cheaper these applications tend to become.  The cheaper they become,
    the more we (at the bottom of the sailing food chain) will see them
    used to our benefit.
    
    I never said these boats were radical in design.  Only in construction.
    They are closer in design to current mainstream design than the 12's
    are.  
    
    At any rate, I like 'em.
    
    Dave

    Ok Gene  I was going to stay out of this one....
    
    
        First, I like the boats. from the side they look just like a hobie
    21 from a waterline-mast-sail profile. It has to be fast. 
    
        Second, I hate the money that is being wasted. This stuff isn't for
    free. You guys are going to foot the bill in passed on advertising costs,
    more expensive sails (Lord help you who use the same loft as the winner
    comes from). The only sailing people I know of who are getting a couple
    of bucks in this country are 2-3 design teams and builders along with
    the city of San Diego. That really is not much of a trickle down effect
    to our dealers, marina owner, or yacht club.
    
       Some people talk wistfully of big bucks coming to sailing. It will
    happen, but like tennis or golf, only a couple of folks will hit it.
    And much like tennis, most people will pick up the wrong things in
    life much like pro tennis has turned the sport from a gentile game to
    something close to roller derby because the pros whine like sissies. If
    you think it is going to become a "big" money sport, what are you
    comparing it to??  Pro baseball, football, the NBA??
    
       No, the 80s have seen an increase in lots of 2nd and 3rd level
    sports trying to vie for the big time. Sailors like to think their
    sport could be one to. But there is a difference. If you watch the
    sports that are trying to be legit, they are all based on really low
    budget venues. No knock, but it is easy to find 20-30 young to middle
    age folks to pump up to think they are the best. Just throw in a TV
    show right? Sports like "professional" volleyball, jet skiing, power
    golf, gladiators, tractor pulling and my favorite, putt putt golf.
     
    Darn little capital needed, available supply of rookies, and no
    large training requirements.
    
       Compare this with current IACC sailboat racing. You need 18 guys for at
    least 12 months (perferably 2-3 years) plus the support staff. No one
    can afford this for many campagins, so the sponsership routine is
    brought into play. But those are still big costs, and chances are with
    cycicial business cycles, even the sponser may have trouble hanging in
    there for what????  Add the tremendous demand for these type of
    sponsers (formula 1, CART, NASCAR, AMA) and you have a real fight on 
    your hands. 
    
       In many of these events, the sponser guarentees the purse,
    and much of it comes back in gate reciepts. In 12 metre racing, there
    is no gate. And ESPN is not going to give you a lot of coin to show 
    a race that is boring to most local folks (heck,as small as a group
     sailors are, even some of us got bored with Saturday's race).
    
      No a small bunch of guys are going to try to outdo each other,
    whether on the water in the courtroom. And you are just feeding their
    glory. This is pure "he who spends the most dough wins" theory and
    these guys eat it up. I hate match racing. Too easy to use your little
    bag of tricks to get ahead and sit on your opponent. The fleet racing
    was a lot more facinating, and make mark rounding more interesting.
    
       As for the technology routine. You want a high aspect kelvar sail
    with carbon fibre hull that is great in light air and dangerous in
    heavy seas, I will give you the name of a catamaran shop in NC. $8,000.
    How many of us are ever going to need the purchase power of those winches
    on board ???? Or how about the fact that good ol'e polyester sails are
    getting harder to come by cause most factories are now making mylar or
    kylar sails, the ones that can't take a bit of trashing in the wind
    without delaminating ???  Or the stupid wing keel idea. Great concept
    till they tried to put it on a cruser and they found out they also make
    great plow anchors. or how about artifical sharkskin on the hulls like
    S&S had in Perth, or....
    
       You had a chance with technology. Dennis Conners and John Wake did
    it right the last time. Too bad NZ didn't whip out a racing cat. If you
    liked Freemantle, just think of those seas with 45 foot cats with
    spinnakers, and boats so light that losing a crewmember is a constant
    concern and getting back into a race is always possible. Rememeber when
    Randy Symthe just missed making up 3 minutes on the Russians in Korea??
    But, no, we want our kind of technology....
    
       Sorry, but for a fraction of the cost, you could do the little
    America's Cup. Get the egos out, get more competition in. And make
    a sport that can be tranported to different venues more easily (put
    them all in a single cargo jet when dissembled). 
    
       Some of you are saying, "oh john justs wants his cats, and besides, the
    formula 40 circuit still hasn't cut it". Although I would rather see
    two hulls rather than one, I just would rather the IACC stop saying the
    best racing in the world is there. It isn't. The most money is being
    spent. The Technology is for the most part useless since it is a closed
    specification. 10% extra speed doesn't whet my appetite, and I figure
    this is true of most non sailors. And there just isn't enough of us sailors
    as a percentage of the population to keep sponsers around. The Pro-Sail
    idea of circuits to different places of different wind strengths is 
    better cause it opens the audience up. Much like the NBA goes to 
    smaller cities on certain nights other than playing at home.
    
       The 80s are dead, lets get back to basics. For you racers. What if
    the 30-40 million dollars was cut up into 2-3 million dollar chucks and
    given out as part a regional racing program in all major cities with
    water. The winner during the season gets 20K a week. At the end of the
    season, a bonus is awarded in a big celebration in the city's center.
    Then it is off for divisional racing. The Finals are only 1 week long, 
    you get 2 weeks to get ready (yes, we are talking superbowl here). The
    boats are standard mid sized boats. Sort of like the Firsts used for
    the Liberity Cup. These could be trucked to the next venue during the
    week. And sailed in the city harbor where everyone could view the 
    sponsers spinnakers (he always wins since his name is on both
    spinnakers).
    
       The America's cup started when people thought sailboats were the
    only way to go. Sort of a 1800 version of F1. Nobody races Ben Hur
    style with carbon fibre carts. Why not update the sport we all like.
    
    So then Gene, Be careful when you ask my opinion.... ;>)
    
    john

re .last:

Right on!

    My sentiments too, John.  FWIW - Why couldn't they all just get
    off-the-shelf Santa Cruz 70's or J/60's and race around in them for a
    fraction of the cost?  I doubt the IACC boats are that much faster, and
    a whole lot more expensive (and no more fun from a spectator's
    viewpoint).
    
    ... Bob
    

    Sure, they COULD race SC 70's at half the cost.  So what?
    
    The only benefit I keep coming back to is the testing of technology. 
    The sailmakers will not be able to charge more for their sails because
    of that pesky thing called competition.  The advertising dollars were
    already going to find a home, so they're not incremental either.
    
    My whole premise is let's let these bozo's pay for the experimentation.
    Nobody's forecasting sailing becoming a big money sport.  At least not
    me.  Not enough of a following that gives a rat's behind.  If these
    guys want to do it, let's take advantage of it.  That's all.
    
    As for multihull racing, Seahorse has a great article in last month's
    edition on the Little AC.  One of the finishes was literally a photo
    finish!  Great racing!  As for offshore multihull racing, it doesn't
    get much better than Pierre 1er's finish in Guadalope this spring in
    the Route de Rhum!  Most Europeans would argue that those are the
    premier racing events now.  The AC doesn't, and should have, a lock on
    the title of "best racing".  The fifties are better right now.
    
    As for fleet vs match racing, I couldn't agree more.  I don't
    appreciate match racing mainly because I don't do it.  And that is the
    biggest mistake the AC format has.  What audience they have has
    experience in fleet racing and could identify with that.  Very few of
    us have ever seriously match raced.
    
    So, I feel pretty lonely defending these idiots.  Somebody help me out
    here, okay?
    
    Dave

    re .418
    
    Your main point is the cost of IACC racing and that we will foot the
    bill.  Additionally that there is not much trickle down effect on the
    technology.  How much trickle down is caused by you or me spending
    $1000 (or what ever amount) each season in the sailing industry?  The
    100's of millions being spent in IACC racing is over and above all the
    dollars the rest of the sailors spend.  R & D is paid for by the IACC
    design teams when they go to a Harkin or Lewmar etc. and spec something
    that has never been built before.  That is a whole lot more trickle
    down than I can cause.
    
    Companies spend money for advertising to promote product sales.  They
    feel that they are getting a return for their money.  If IACC racing
    was not there, they would be spending it on; TV, billboards, magazines,
    or auto racing.  This definately does not support the sailing
    industry.  There is also more than one Koch out there putting their own
    wealth in.
    
    Sailing offers a whole spectrum of racing, fleet, match, one-design,
    bouys, off-shore, to around-the-world.  Some are exciting to watch or
    participate in, other are like watching cactus grow.  Different strokes
    for different folks.
    
    Your closing statement caught my eye, "Nobody races Ben Hur style with
    carbon fibre carts".  It is obvious you have never been to the horse
    races.  It is called "harness racing".  Harness racing = IACC boats,
    and Ben Hur = 12 meters.
    
    Long live this debate!!
    
    Chuck

    One little point I think a few people are missing.
    
    The people doing the AC ( and just about every other sport ) are not
    doing it to entertain spectators, sponsors, television audiences etc,
    they are doing it because they want to. Most sports have a tournament
    that is percieved to be the pinnacle of the sport ( Wimbledon, Olympic 
    Athetics, US Masters Golf, World Cup soccer ) and the reason for this
    is partly self perpetuating, i.e. the best turn up, because last time, 
    the best turned up. The Americas cup is, rightly or wrongly, the
    pinnacle of inshore keel-boat racing.
    
    The Americas cup is not, and never has been, only about sailing
    ability. Design, sailmaking, boat construction and organizational
    skills are all part of the game. 
    
    If you, as a spectator, want to see the worlds top sailors, racing
    Identical boats, there is the World match racing circuit already 
    in existance. Even though the boats are sometimes quite exciting ( eg
    the Farr MRX ), the racing is still pretty dull.
    
    Keep it up !
    
    Chris
    
                    

    > I hate match racing. Too easy to use your little
    > bag of tricks to get ahead and sit on your opponent. The fleet racing
    > was a lot more facinating, and make mark rounding more interesting.
    
    Well, I've got very small experience of match racing (and of racing
    regattas, BTW) but I personally do not agree. The history of the Cup
    has been made with match racing and lots of them have been really 
    full of "suspense" till their end (just these last days I've re-read
    "20 challenges for the America Cup" by Capt. J.H. Illingworth).
    Moreover, match racing gives the Cup that very strange "charme"
    that originates from the fact of being a (final) competition 
    between 2 entities (skippers, boats, clubs, countries, etc...) where
    all the sum of the efforts shows a total result. It's, on my opinion
    the purest kind of competition, apart all the money spent in it.
    Of course it's tremendously expensive, it's always been; the famous
    names have been like Lipton, Sopwith, Vanderbilt, Rockfeller, Morgan
    etc. because they could afford it. It would have never existed if no
    one had "wasted" an enormous amount of money for it.
    Sure, we could race the Cup, but all competitions too, without spending
    a cent for each million actually spent but, would it be the same game?
    Sure, they're toys for monomaniac millionaires who hide behind the
    finger of "advertising expenses"; well, my opinion again, they'd do
    it even without any (potential) return at all.
    The Cup is the target but, I think, all the way you walk towards it
    makes the game important and fascinating.
    Of course my poor, 24 years, craft-made wooden Snipe, will not benefit
    anything from the Cup, nor I but I'm not sure it matters at all.
    Ciao, ragazzi, hear from you sooner or later.
    Arrigo
    
    

    I like match racing too.  Can't argue with the drama
    of race #3 in the challenger's finals in Perth?  What a fight.
    There's nothing magic about sticking close in a tacking duel.
    It takes flawless execution and lots of stamina on both boats.
    
    Sure, fleet racing tactics are different, and in some ways more
    complicated, but that's not necessarily better.  When you have to
    factor handicap into your tactics, it sometimes gets
    too damned abstract.  We often get trapped by handicap
    debates:  Do we cover a boat with a 69 rating?  Depends on how much 
    of the race is left, and who the 75-rater is that's way out on 
    a flyer.  It's impossible to judge an oponents seperation in seconds
    except at roundings, but sometimes that's just what's required to make
    the right decision, but you can almost always tell the relative position 
    of another boat, and in level racing, that makes the choices a lot
    clearer.
    
    For the purest sailing competition, match racing is much cleaner 
    and more subtle.  I'd have to say that one-desing fleet racing is 
    most similar, with the top boats eventually going at it like a match.
    
    BTW, what's the going exchange rate for dollars to lire these days?
    
    Cheers,
    Dean
    
    

    Reminder-  My ESPN schedule shows a one hour Cup coverage tonight at
    8pm (ET).  This list was printed before daylight savings started so I
    would check your local TV schedule.
    
    Chuck

    1 U.S. $ should be 1,300 lire more or less.
    Bye.
    A.
    

All the talk of let the rich folks spend their money as they choose and 
of technology trickle down is all well and good, but ......

Right now the America's Cup is a prestigious event, and many people are
willing to spend tens of millions of dollars, billions of lire, etc, to
compete. But what about next time? Will the costs become so staggering
that only one or two syndicates can afford to build a single boat, let
alone multiple boats? That won't make much of a spectacle that
commercial sponsors will buy into. Is one of the reasons IOR racing has
declined the increasingly ridiculous costs? 

On ESPN's Indy coverage last Sunday the point was made that there are
not 33 competitive cars in this year's race. The back markers are way
back. After all, the cost of a car capable of winning is about $500 000,
carbon fiber chassis included. God knows what the other costs are. There
are just not enough teams with enough money to compete at the top. By
constrast, the cost of a competitive Winston Cup stock car is about $100
000. And Winston Cup racing is really good racing -- a dozen cars on the
lead lap after 500 miles is not what we'll have at Indy this year.
Watching good, close racing is a lot more interesting than watching
technology. 

Back to sailing. The America's Cup may be having its last blaze of glory 
unless costs are controlled. Every race has rules. Why not some rules 
that constrain costs? Would the America's Cup racing be any less 
interesting to the vast majority (>99.99%) if masts had to be built from 
aluminum? I doubt it. Would the costs be less? Substantially. I'm sure 
that there are many other ways to limit costs to something a bit more 
sane. 

And on a different tack altogether ..... I would expect far more
technology of use to us common sailors to come from BOC racing than from
America's Cup racing, and BOC budgets are miniscule compared to
America's Cup budgets. 

    I agree that over the short sterm much more applicable technology comes
    from BOC than AC.  Saw the BOC boats last weekend in Newport.  Pretty
    cool.  I'll bet one thing we'll see much more of is the gooseneck on
    deck angling up and not on the mast.  Reduces pressures on the mast and
    makes rigging less complex.  Trade off is boom height forward.  The
    fixed dodgers and sheeting systems were something I'd want if I were
    going offshore for any length of time.  
    
    Dave

You want to see some trickle down that really works? Let's figure out some way
to have the AC (or something - weird drugs?) convince all power boat owners
that they need at least one sail-like object and at least one winch-like object
on their boats. Wouldn't it be lovely if the kind of mass market did for those
what power boats did for Loran prices and features?

Ross Faneuf

    
    	From Digital Today, 28 May 1991
    	page 11, right sidebar
    
    	A Digital VAX 9000 will be used to design hulls for boats entered
    	in the next America's Cup.
    
    	"Digital is providing a $3.8 million VAX 9000 System Model 420VP
    	with vector processors to the Massachusetts Institute of Technology
    	(MIT), Cambridge, Mass.  One of the first applications run on the
    	VAX 9000 system will be the hull design of the entries sponsored
    	by the America**3 Syndicate in the America's Cup race next May.
    
    	The VAX 9000 system--part of a research agreement--will include:
    	disk storage, equipment for networking connectivity, version 4.2
    	of Digital's ULTRIX operating system, and several layered software
    	products.
    	
    	In addition to distributed computing research, MIT will use the
    	VAX 9000 system for scientific applications ranging from computer
    	modeling of the design of ship hulls and other ocean engineering
    	systems to economic research, including the development of economic
    	models using large databases, such as the census.  MIT will house
    	the VAX 9000 system in its Central Data Center."
    

    
    	The question I have is: are we offering computing resources to
    	Dennis the Menace too? (aka Dennis Conner)
    
    	I believe the Stars and Stripes syndicate in 1987, with Conner
    	skippering, got substantial help from Digital.  I would hope we
    	would offer the same services to the syndicate that brought the
    	cup back in the first place or are we going to see an "IBM" logo
    	on the side?! :)
    
    	Tom--
    	PS: I'm sick of the junk mail I've been getting from America**3
    	so I guess I'm pulling for Conner's syndicate even if he's an
    	arrogant sob at times...  OK, most of the time! :)
    

    Had the chance to sail on a winged-keel cruiser
    this past weekend.  It's *NO* gimick.  A 26 footer
    that draws 4 feet, points and tracks very nicely, 
    walks over several 30+ footers of more conventional design,
    and even gives a 38 foot Sabre a tough time in the passing lane...
    
    
    

re .434:

And the keel is responsible for all this performance? Seems like a 
rather too stong an inference to make. After all, a J24 can outsail my 32' 
all-out cruising boat in some conditions. From your description, it 
sounds like a fast 26' boat. Perhaps it would be even faster with a high 
aspect conventional fin keel!

    re .433
    
    Digital is only supporting the America3 group.  HP is supporting Dennis
    and Stars & Stripes.  The Italians have 6 of our 3100's, but I believe
    they purchased them.
    
    Chuck

    C'mon Alan, give me a little more credit than that.
    I'm not making an outlandish comparison.
    
    The boat I was on was a Hunter 25, and
    we sailed higher and faster than a Catalina 30,
    a Sabre 28, an older C&C 32 (I think), and we gave
    catfits to two Sabre 38s.  All reasonably fast
    cruisers for comparison's sake, don't you think?
    
    Yes, the boat is a spritely performer that moves
    like it *does* have a high aspect keel -- which just 
    happens to draw about a foot less than one might expect.

    
    Four of my friends have purchased radio controlled model 12 Meters and
    formed M.F.Y.C. (Meter and Friendship Yacht Club). I am the Judge ( or
    do you say Referee in english?) in the Club.
    
    This is all in the America's Cup spirit (my friends' "aliases" are
    Bond, Conner, Faye and De Savary).
    
    I think is was fun to read about Digital supporting an America'a Cup
    group (America3). Is it possible to obtain Digital/AC "gadgets" 
    like Caps, stickers, belts etc somewhere?
    
    Thanks,
    
    Ivar
    

    My schedule shows Cup coverage on ESPN tonight.
    
    Chuck

    Something new worth of discussion? Here the only important question
    seems to be: Mr. Gardini has been fired from CEO of Ferruzzi Finan-
    ziaria (the financial holding that owns all the Montedison and etc.)
    and all the matter seems to be a new "Dallas". We don't give a damm
    of the stupid matter but would like to know if the fact will affect
    negatively the challenge, is it?
    A poster of the Moro 2 off of Point Loma shows on the wall in front
    of me but I find hard to concentrate on work that way; summer has
    arrived and my 24-wood-Snipe is still under her cover waiting for me.
    Holidays, that's what I need!
    
    Well, hope to read from you.
    
    Ciao a tutti. Arrigo
    
    
    

    >and all the matter seems to be a new "Dallas". We don't give a damm
    >of the stupid matter but would like to know if the fact will affect
    >negatively the challenge, is it?
    
    In Yesterdays Daily Telegraph, it was announced that the dismissal
    would have no effect on the challenge. The Fifth boat is going ahead.
    
    Peter De Savery has announced a one-boat British challenge. The yacht
    will be built by Vision Yachts in Cowes, starting this week. No sponsor
    has been found, so De Savery will pay for it out of his own pocket. The
    boat will be skippered by Lawrie Smith who is currently sailing a De
    Savery chartered one-tonner in the British Admirals Cup team. This boat
    is called "Port Pendennis" after PdS's marina and housing development
    in Falmouth ( where he will presumably want to hold the Cup in the
    unlikely event of them winning it ). I think that this is an attempt to 
    make sure Britain don't lose too much ground in the technology, rather
    than a serious attempt to win it.
    
    >A poster of the Moro 2 off of Point Loma shows on the wall in front
    >of me but I find hard to concentrate on work that way; summer has
    >arrived and my 24-wood-Snipe is still under her cover waiting for me.
    >Holidays, that's what I need!
    
    I too have a poster by my desk, this one of Wings of Oracle, the
    British two-tonner Admirals cup boat, sponsored by the Software firm.
    I keep sitting here looking at it, daydreaming, whilst I wait for batch
    jobs to finish !
    
    Chris.
    
    p.s. What do Montedison do/make/sell ?
    

    Ciao, Chris.
    
    Montedison is the biggest italian name in the chemical/plastics
    manufacturing. It's owned by the Ferruzzi Group (former Serafino
    Ferruzzi was Gardini father in love) that controls a lot of other
    firms, more or less all related to chemicals.
    I've been told that the plastic hull of Moro III is an experiment
    for the plastic hulls of new generation mine-sweepers (of course
    war industry is everywhere).
    I've been also told that Moro IV is now on at sea and it's going
    to be prepared and tested; it'll need to be a very good boat to
    do better than III. What can I say? I don't think an Italian chal-
    lenger could win the challenger's regattas but, if yes, well I think
    my heart could beat faster. The problem probably is that we still
    lack of all the match races background that Brits, Aussies and Kiwis
    have already got.
    Oh, bah! I'll keep my fingers well crossed.
    
    Bye for now.
    Ciao a tutti.
    A.
      

    I read in the paper this morning that Gary Jobson has resigned from the
    Koch/America 3 camp following in the footsteps of John Kostecki. 
    Apparently, Gary feels that a firm afterguard should have been set by now
    which it's not.  Bill has been doing most of the steering so far.  It's
    reported that Gary will be going back to ESPN.
    
    The defense committee will be interviewing this week a possible third
    defense syndicate from Connecticut.
    
    Don

    Peter De Savery has announced thath the British cup effort will now not
    go ahead after all.
    
    I think he was hoping that the announcement that building had started
    would bring the sponsors in, but this failed to happen.
    
    Meanwhile, Port Pendennis, the one-tonner he has chartered, won the
    long offshore race in the One-ton cup in Belguim. This put it close 
    behind the American boat Vibes and just ahead of the Italian Brava.
    
    Chris
    

    How strange (and little sad) Brits no longer challenge for the Cup.
    Everything started with their tries to regain it and created this
    unique event in the sport's world. Well not all people are Lipton
    or Sopwith.
    BTW. Potential challengers now are: NZ, Ita, Jap, Fra, Spain,
         Austr, and who else?
    
    Bye. A.
    

[set flame: cynical]

>>>    How strange (and little sad) Brits no longer challenge for the Cup.
>>>    Everything started with their tries to regain it and created this
>>>    unique event in the sport's world. Well not all people are Lipton
>>>    or Sopwith.

Agreed.  In fact, the AC is turning into a reflection not of a nation's 
maritime experience and collective skill, but rather of its economic 
muscle.  Look at the current contenders, and the US struggling to mount 
a confident defense; not much different from our position in the global 
economy.  Italy can be seen to represent the resurgent EC (and Britain an 
example of a nation that has resisted joining.)

If this holds water, then the Japanese will win before the millenium.  For 
a first time out-of-the-box, theirs has been a rather credible effort.  
For further evidence, consider their success in F1 and sports car racing,
where they came from not competing at all to best of the best in little
more than a decade, and all this based on no tradition of automobile-
building.  Why should high-tech/high-dollar yacht racing be any different,
especially when it's possible to hire whatever talent you want? 

More power to all of them for setting an example of goal-focus and
achievement.  But the sport just ain't the same.  And, for my money, not 
nearly as interesting anymore as a human endeavor.

[set flame: resigned]

J.

    Re .446
    
       John, I believe that it more who has the technology. It may equate
    to $$$ or yen or lira, but it's boasting about technology.
    
       It just so happens technology costs a lot. As they say in the
    automotive world, Speed costs money, how fast do you want to go ?
    
    
    john

    I spent last week in S.F. and enjoyed the coverage of the Etchells
    Worlds sailed out of the San Francisco yacht club.  Dennis Conner took
    top honors after 6 races on the Bay.  Always one to enter a regatta
    with an advantage, this time he entered with a combined crew weight of
    an astounding 795 pounds!  That's 3 guys including Dennis.  Where does
    he get these guys?  Most boats weighed in at 500 - 550.  That's like
    having an extra crew member on board his competitors complained.  It
    was an advantage in the typical S.F. high wind and tide induced chop. 
    However, most of the races were light and the flood tide was
    predominant smoothing out the waters.  Dennis seemed to be the only
    skipper in the fleet who was able to come from way back after
    the start to finish near the top.  Even his acrh rivals were impressed
    with his sailing using words like "magical" to describe his finishes. 
    Apparently he hasn't lost his touch and is not afraid to mix it up with
    a large and star-studded fleet.
                     
    Don

    140 years ago today, America beat Aurora to begin the world's longest
    continuous running sports competition.

    re. 448 Dennis Conner
    
    I'm not surprised at all. As G.B.Shaw so well stated:
    
    "Happy the man who makes his hobby his work and his work his hobby!"
    
    re. 449 America Cup birthday
    
    Best wishes and may the future be full of good racing.
    
    Bye you all.
    
    Arrigo
    

    Thinking about the original America, I think I saw a show on TV that
    covered the original races ... (Walt Disney) and one of the points that
    they made was that the underwater shape was radically different from
    the usual style.
    
    If that is the case, perhaps all of that broughaha 8 years ago was just
    "what goes around comes around ...."

    You're right. "America"'s hull shape was really unconventional
    and revolutionary in 1851; same as above for the sails that were
    in cotton instead than in flax (or vice-versa?). Moreover the mains
    were tied at the edge of the boom (like on Lasers) and the jib was
    boomed too; she had more beam towards the poop etc. etc.
    
    It was the total amount of small differences that made her the winner
    and gifted us sailors with a still lasting sport-legend.
    
    I don't think that "Australia II" has been so revolutionary but I do
    agree with you: "what goes around, comes around".
    
    Ciao.
    Arrigo
    

    re .448
    
    I received an interesting peice of mail from the Etchells association
    shortly after the completion of the world championships.  It was a
    ballot asking for my vote on a proposal to limit total crew weight in
    sactioned regattas to 624 lbs.  If that had been in effect a month ago,
    DC would have had to sail with only one other person aboard.  
    
    - gene

    How much does DC weigh these days?!  Thought he was on 
    a diet...
    
    ;)

    
    
    		ESPN and possibly other cable and public TV channels
    have recently broadcast several presentation on the work that is being
    done for the America's Cup. Would anyone have video taped these broadcasts
    and be willing to loan the tapes or make copies?
    
    Dan LeBlanc

	New Zealand's America's Cup Skipper Announced

	Rod Davis has being appointed skipper of NZ's America's Cup challenge.
 David Barnes will be tactican. Mike Quilter is the navigator.

What I know about these guys but it is from memory.

Rod Davis  is a californian and has represented the US at the 1984 olympics
in the Soling(?). He has lived in Auckland since just after the perth AC event
and has married Tom Schenberg's(the guy that designed OZ2's sails) sister, 
calls NZ home. At least this year. Competes on the World match racing series
and is currently ranked 3rd.

David Barnes, races as tactian to Rod davis in the World Match Racing circuit
 was world 470 champ for 3 years, made a mistake in the NZ olympic selection
trials and missed out on the 1984 games while current world champ. Was involved
in the perth challenge on the backup boat. Steered the big boat against the
cat,Rod Davis hadn't being a NZer for long enough to qualify to be on the boat.

Mike Quilter, navigator to Peter Blake in the last whitbread and we all know
how well they did. Also sailed with Peter Blake in the round Oz race in the 
tri Steinlager 1.

Peter Blake is the shore boss.
Eddie Warden-Owen is the coach.

The backup boat will be sailed by Russell Coutts (gold medal finns 1984)

	The new boat was shipped from NZ and will arrive SD shortly, Bruce Farr
has discribed it as a "BREAK Through" in yacht design. It will be unveiled to
the NZ public on Dec 20th. So we'll see. There was a lauching here but they 
lauched a big box with as ribbon around it. We dont even know if there was a
boat in it. This is boat #4.

Chris Dickson New Zealands best match racer, current world champ ranked #1 
etc is sailing for the Japanese. But then I guess Micheal Fay is paying the
bills so he can pick whoever he likes.


Regards 
Revel

    I heard the Japanese were out of it, having run out of money.
    Sounds pretty unlikely, but then...  Anyone know more?
    
    Dean

	
	There where originally 2 japanese entries I know that the Nippon 
Challenge which Cris Dickson sails for is still definitely involved 
and is at SD. The other syndicate was the bengal synd and I cant coment on them
as I've not heard a lot from them.


Revel

    At the Japan Expo (next door to DECUS in Anaheim, Calif) the Nippon
    Challange had a booth which obviously cost more than the money they
    earned selling T shirts.  I'd guess they were in it.
    
    -gayn
    

    With all the money and number of boats being fielded by the challengers, 
    a challenger victory is looking most probable.
    
    Evidently, the Stars and Stripes syndicate is going to have a
    one-boat campaign.  I'd heard they were building a second, but that
    may have been rumor.  Anyone KNOW otherwise?  Koch's syndicate is 
    building upwards of 5 boats, but his insistance on taking the helm 
    seems a weak link.  The final death-knell for "amateurs?"
    
    The scenario is an awful lot like Perth in reverse.  The defending
    champs look/looked weak, the upstart would-be defenders have/had 
    gobs of money, and the challenger armada is/was incredibly formidable.
    
    I don't know how close the actual competition will be, but I guess
    I'll be watching when I can.  Loius Vitton starts this month, yes?
    
    Dean
    

    
    	I have a friend who did a fair amount of testing for the ACOA and
    for Dennis.  He would like to build another boat but simply does not
    have the money.  He has made extensive modifications to his boat and it
    is quite fast.  The question is, will it be fast enough to win, has
    another group found a radically faster boat.  Wish I could say what has
    been tested, but my friend was impossible to get information out of
    this time around.
    
    	In the past the New York Yacht Club would remove a skipper that
    they felt was not up to snuff.  I could see the San Diego Yacht club
    after selecting a an America 3 boat to put another skipper and
    after guard on the boat.  I am not sure he would like it but you never
    know.
    
    	Frankly, I am past the to the point where the cost of a challenge
    or defense makes any sense.  I would rather see the money, and effort
    spent other ways to help get people involved in sailing.  The money
    spent on one mast would run several community sailing programs for
    years.
    
    
    Forrest

    Last weeks ESPN coverage said Dennis went out when Challangers were
    racing a couple of weeks ago and blew everyone away upwind. He then
    quit thinking things still look good.
    
    They also had video of Dennis's boys chasing a frogman out of thier
    compound as they started to lower the boat. The guy had a rebreather on
    to minimize the bubbles. I don't understand why they don't just chain
    a junk yard shark in there ;>) ;>)
    
    Italy is looking really really good. But time will tell.
    
    ESPN is about to start weekly reports on Friday nights. I think the 
    first one is tomorrow.

>    Italy is looking really really good. But time will tell.


How are they being funded?  I heard Gardini lost control of Montedison
and was going through some hard times (for him, of course, I'd love
to have *his* hard times).

F.

    
    	If I remeber correctly he struck a deal, and Montdenison (sp?)
    continued funding it.
    
    
    Forrest

    Montedison owns IMI (International Marine Industries).  IMI owns:
    	Lewimar
    	Barient
    	Sparcraft
    	B&G
    	Navtec
    plus a couple of other high-tech marine related companies.  To say the
    least, with or without Gardini's personal involvment, Montedison has a
    a fairly serious interest in yacht racing and the Americas Cup.  And they
    still campagin the IOR 50, Abracadabra.
    
    As far as Team DC building a new boat, with Navtec (local company in
    Littleton, MA,  down the street from NAC - for whom my wife works)
    building all the rigging and hydrolics for the boats - its a MAJOR
    secret.  No one will say anything (and I've bought these guys a lot of
    beer).  Some of the engineers are spending a lot of time down at Getz
    though.

re: .461,

>>>    	Frankly, I am past the to the point where the cost of a challenge
>>>    or defense makes any sense.  I would rather see the money, and effort
>>>    spent other ways to help get people involved in sailing.  The money
>>>    spent on one mast would run several community sailing programs for
>>>    years.
    
Amen!

And FYI, ESPN has a half-hour AC update scheduled tonight at 10:00 pm.  

J.

    Re rumors:
    
    It would be *JUST* like Connor to say he couldn't afford
    a new boat -- then show up with one at the last minute.
    Typical mis-direction.  As a matter of fact, I'd bet that's
    what gonna happen.  We'll see.
    
    At this point, I have to say a word on Dave J's behalf about
    spending gobs of money.  "I think it's great!"
    
    ;)

    
    	Anybody else read Tony Chamberlain's report on DC donning the
    	blonde wig, bopping out with the boat for a `guest shot' and
    	pretty much walking by the leaders? (I've obviously omitted most
    	of the details, but from my one meeting with the man, he musta
    	been coached how be a wiseguy...)
    

    I've read on press that Moro (5?) has broken her rudder during a
    training and has risked the sinking due to 12' waves off SD and
    only after 2 hours has been possible to tow her back to the harbor.
    Is it possible that that kind of efforts on the hull has compromised
    her structural integrity? How did it happen?
    
    Bye.
    Arrigo_who_is_anxiously_waiting_for_January_24th_and_tightly_crossing
    _his_fingers.
    

    Is anyone planning on going to San Diego for any of the races. I'm
    planning on traveling out there on Feb. 13 for th Challenger and
    Defender Selection Series. If anyone is interested, I thought we could
    kick aound places to stay, prices...etc.. I'm new to the notes and
    don't know if this convesation is already going on. Gonna be a great
    series.
    
    Bye.

    Which are the final defenders and which victory percentage are
    they credited?
    
    Bye.
    A.
    

    Defiant (one of Bill Koch'S boats) beat Stars & Stripes (Conner's boat)
    three times in three races, albeit close races.
    
    If Stars & Stripes looses to Koch's Jayhawk then Defiant and Jayhawk
    finish the defenders first round.  Who knows what happens after that?
    Is Conner just about finished?
    
    Don
    

    Buddy Melges is easily the equal of Dennis and arguably the best
    closed course racer in the world.
    
    I think Dennis may also be the worlds best sandbagger. He wants nothing
    more than to have everyone count him out.
    

    The newest America Cubed boat supposedly HJ'd "Stars and Stripes."
    Anything more about a second boat for DC?  If he hasn't got
    one...

    
    	Then Defiant whooped poor DC... is he just trying to keep things
    from breaking, or will he just be a memory?
    
    	Staying tuned.... and having fun watching breakage coming out of
    someone else's wallet!
    
    	Scott

WAG Prediction:

DC will lose the Defender Series in his boat, BK will hire him (he seems 
destined to have every remaining American sailor work for him at some
point anyway, on some kind of FIFO/LILO basis), and DC will defend in BK's
3rd or 4th boat.  DC's already made the right conciliatory advances in
this direction.  BK should be smart enough to know even Buddy probably
can't beat DC in an even match race.  Everybody (on the US side) will feel
like a winner, except maybe Melges. 

IMHO, DC Redux (sailing as the American Phoenix?) could do a bigger psyche
job on the Challenger than any current A**3 team member.  Might worry them
into one or two more mistakes, just enough to win. 

J.

    Spencer, from my Italian point of view (and as an intrigued of
    America Cup since my tens) I don't think DC is only a psyche
    effect; IMO he really is the most efficient, smart, subtle etc.
    helmsman in a Cup defense. Probably the Cup makes his life whorth-
    living. Anyway, maybe I don't appreciate some aspects of his
    personality, but he's super when at the helm.
    BK should consider very seriously to have DC to defend the Cup
    (still IMO) if he doesn't want to be the 2nd American who lost it.
    
    Bye.
    A.
    

    I saw a promo this morning on ESPN; America's Cup coverage
    tonight (Tuesday) at 10:30pm EST.

    Perhaps we'll see DC's ego actually deflect the falling mast...

    I saw th last 20 minutes.  All challenger news.
    Any defender news before that?  Spoke with a friend
    in San Diego who does not beleive there's another boat
    in the card for DC.  That's what he was told by a friend
    who is on the design team.
    
    Koch get his new boat yet? 
    
    

    according to friday night's ESPN show, DC is in the middle of scooping
    out a section of the aft hull in order to lighten the boat.
    
    They also showed his snapped mast. They will now use the original.
    DC looked quiet in the show, but he said he doen't fear Koch, but
    he does respect him as he has seen what Koch did to maxi racing
    with the Matador boats.
    
      john

    Now that we're in the actual America's CUP, I decided to
    put my coments back here.  Where no one will see them.  ;)
    
    Race 1 was somewhat of a wash, with Il Moro jumping the gun.
    Too bad.  Up to that point, Cayard had abused Dellenbaugh in the
    pre-start.  From then on, A-cubed played it realatively safe 
    and conservative, and held the advantage around the course.  To 
    the commentators, it looked like A-cubed had speed.  It sure
    looked to me like Il Moro maneuvered and accelerated a *lot* better
    than A-cubed.
    
    Race 2 was a squeaker, but A-cubed really sailed poorly.  Tactical
    gaffs and amazingly bad crew work were their demise.  Again, A-cubed
    seemed to have the speed, and quite astoundingly, she hounded Il Moro
    to within a boatlength in the big tacking duel.  The final run home 
    was classic, but there's no excuse for the poor sail handling.
    They looked like novices on A-cubed, and Bill Koch was reduced to
    babble.  I can't beleive he instills much confidence in his crew.
    
    We've seen both teams play from behind and under great pressure, and 
    I'd have to give the advantage to Il Moro.  Now we'll see if A-cuded 
    can bounce back and regain some composure.  If so, the series should
    go the distance with A-cubed coming out the winner.  If not, I still
    like Il Moro in 7, maybe 6.
    
    Ciao,
    Dean

    
        A3 looked like it was sailed by fools yesterday, Buddy included.
    These guys have got to concentrate on their sailing and leave Paul
    Cayard's moves to the tactican. 
    
        Speaking of Tacticans, who is the nitwit who almost fouled Paul
    when he pulled the defensive luff at the leeward mark the first time
    around yesterday. Did they think Paul was just going to let his boat 
    get rolled? Those Cubens looked like they were in a trance and couldn't
    get their heads out of the boat because they were too busy looking at
    El Moro.
    
        I do like the onboard microphones. You can really appreciate the
    rules when every one of the them is brought into play during a race. ;>(
    Then you get analysis from the commentators on the alleged infraction,
    instant replays, chart talk, etc. This is better than Berry's racing
    rules book! And it keeps them from talking about 
    the Cup/Sir Lipton/Dennis .
    
         john

    Dellenbaugh is the vaunted A-cubed tactician. He's the same
    guy who tried to protest that Il Moro was sailing too high
    on the last run home.  And how does he know Il Moro's polars?
    Actually, I was amazed that Il Moro was not more aggressive
    in dealing with A-cubed's final surge.  Instead of jibing
    away, I'd have luffed them to China.
    
    ;)

    I think that, having now had the chance to understand a little
    bit more about each other, and being now a best of 5 races, today's
    race should be a significant one from a tactics setting point of view.
    
    I'm really surprised reading by the press (London TIMES and Dayly
    Herald) that A3 seems really faster than Il Moro. As far as I could
    see her in the defender races broadcasted in Italy it didn't appear.
    She really seems, as someone said, Il Moro 6 (a 6.0 release?) as she's
    really a copy, even in the way she cuts the waves, of our boat.
    
    Anyway, 5 races still to sail,  probably 5 unforgettable ones.
    
    How is the audience in U.S.? As usual Italy has discovered herself
    a sailing soul and so, now we have the Il Moro clubs, and 3.5 upto
    4.0 millions people (of a total 57) wasting sleep time in front of
    the TV and trying to understand the match racing. I'm afraid of what
    will happen this year on the sea and lake shores; sailing schools are
    already overbooked and, as in 1983 lots of baby-girls where named
    "Azzurra" (by the italian 12mtrs SI in Newport), I'm now worried about
    an inflation of Moro kids even if it will not win the Cup.
    
    Re. -1: I couldn't see race # 2 but I've enjoyed a lot your's
            "...I'd have luffed them to China." It's great.
    
    Bye for now. I'll meet you all again tomorrow.
    
    Arrigo
    

    Re Jim,
    
    Yeah, I had cable installed to watch this.  Money back
    if I'm not fully satisfied...  ;)
    
    Re Arrigo,
    
    I agree about today's race.  The winner will be favored to clinch,
    and not just statistically.
    
    As for A-cubed looking like Il Moro, there are some similarities,
    but Il Moro is much better looking.  The up-swept bow, the topside
    flare.  That boat is sexy.  A-cubed looks plain by comparison.
    
    Ciao,
    Dean

    
    A3 by about 1:58 over Il Moro, the whole race appears to have been
    decided at the start.  I did not get a chance to replay the whole tape
    yet...  Cayard and company bet against the odds and went right and the
    left at the start as it has been most of the time was favored.  First
    cross A3 by about 6 boat lengths they protected the lead and won.
    
    
    Forrest

    Cayard & Co. have made a conceptual mistake (IMHO):
    
    they've forgotten the main rule in match racing between two similar
    boats, stay close to your opponent and race on him, that's what would
    have given a revenue.
    Seems to me that they're still using the old tactics that didn't work
    with NZ; may be they need to well smacked before starting with clear
    ides of what has really to be done.
    I'm a little bit frustrated.
    Bye.
    A.
    

I can't help but think that yesterday's race meant a lot
more than one loss for Il Moro.  I can imagine no reason for
Cayard's strategy except that he's more intimidated by 
A-cubed's speed than he has let on.  I suspect that's why he 
took the right side of the line -- to have starboard rights at 
first crossing and hopefully force A-cubed underneath,
like in race 2.  I don't think either boat could predict how 
much of a lift would be on the left, but Cayard held on to the 
right hoping the wind would come back so he could engage at close
quarters.  He would not have done so unless he figured that was
his best hope.  But the wind never did come back, and he was handed
a huge deficit right off the line.  As we saw, A-cubed extended on most
every leg.  Couple that with the closeness of race 2, in which a poorly
sailed A-cubed was still able to threaten the entire race,
and I think it looks very bleak for Il Moro.  Not what I 
expected at *all*.

Tomorrow, look for Il Moro to stay on top of A-cubed at the 
start -- after being *extremely* aggressive in the pre-start.  
If he can get his bow ahead and block A-cubed's advance, he's 
got a 50-50 chance of winning *that* race -- breakdowns notwithstanding.  
Once A-cubed is ahead, I think the odds drop to 80-20 against Il Moro.

I hope Il Moro wins another race or two, but I don't think 
they can take the CUP unless they push A-cubed to the wall by taking
the next two races.  Conversely, I would not be surprised to see A-cubed
win the next two.

At least they're getting some wind...

Ciao,
Dean

    re. -1
    
    Your analysis is quite correct but it's anyway been a stupid
    mistake. Figure this:
    
    as soon as Paul starts the line, he turns on left after a 5";
    now (as he has crossed the line 4" early than A3) he would be
    ahead and in a better route towards the mark and upwind with
    right of way. What else he would have needed?
    He could go faster than A3 and control them very easily as A3
    should need to turn right and cross Il Moro, surely back of her
    and without right of way. All the rest would have been another
    kind of race.
    
    They've made a very stupid mistake, believe me.
    
    Ciao.
    Arrigo
    

    I read that Il Moro carefully watched the wind go left all morning, all
    the way to 270 and stop.  They expected it to go back right.  They
    wanted the right, fought for it and got it.  Then "invested heavily",
    Paul's words, in the right side of the course.
    
    I think it's a little harsh to call it a stupid mistake.  They had a
    plan and followed it.  It just turned out to be a bad plan.  Shifts
    happen, and then sometimes they don't.  I expect them to come out
    swinging on Thursday.
    
    Don
    Don

    	I am not so convinced that it was a stupid mistake.  If the right
    had turned out to have more pressure or he got lifted he gets a big
    gain.  He believed that the right would be favored based on prerace
    data and choose that option.  He was wrong, his mistake was hanging in
    too long after it was clear he was loosing, I want to look at the tape
    carefully to see how it plays out.  

    	I disagree that an immediate tack was of any value.  It would have
    slowed his boat and left him in a position of windward and behind.  If
    A3 was able to gain an windward gauge on him (very likely) he has to
    tack away.  Two tacks vs 0 for A3 this is a loose loose deal, it could
    have worked only If A3 was way late and going slow.  Neither of those
    conditions were met.  Bottom line they made a choice based on the data
    they had it was not correct.

    	I believe they Il Moro will be a lot more aggressive Thursday and
    will try to get the lead and sit on A3.  The trick is to get and hold
    an early lead.  I was glad to see that they decided not to file the
    technical protest about the diver in the water.  It was stupid that he
    was allowed to get in the way. 

    Forrest

TM                                                   
digital                   Worldwide News                      LIVE WIRE
                                                     

  DECWORLD visitors use computer software to design and race their own yachts

  A popular exhibit at DECWORLD '92 allows visitors to design and race their
  own yachts, linking two concurrent events:  DECWORLD and the America's
  Cup race.

  All the software in the exhibit is combined into an interactive demonstration
  using internally developed Rapid Application Development (RAD) software.
  Five DECstations are set up at the exhibit, along with a large video
  screen.  Various windows on the terminals display an array of hulls, keels
  and sails which the customers choose from to design their yachts.  The
  completed yachts are then lined up at the starting point on the video
  screen, along with a default yacht, the Jayhawk (one of the America3 fleet).
  And the race is on.

  Customers who win the race can board the real Jayhawk, which is on display
  outside at the World Trade Center, and have their pictures taken while
  wearing an America's Cup jacket and hat.
     
  Digital is supporting the America's Cup race by donating computer hardware
  and software and contributing to the enhancement of the America3's on-board
  computer system.

 

    Re. .494
    
    Even accepting your statements I'm not anyway convinced that it's
    good tactics allow your opponent to sail away alone and free. IMO
    Golden Rule # 1 in match racing is (provided similarly fast boats)
    just stay close to him as much as you can, unless you have the proof
    of evidence that you're right and he's wrong. And, still IMO, they
    didn't have that proof.
    
    Anyway, here it's now 13:30; still 8 hours left to the moment.
    
    We'll see.
    
    I'll be back on notes on May, 19th, and we'll see if there'll be a
    final race or  if the matter will definitely be on.
    
    Again (pls pardon me): Forza Moro 5! Show'em your best!
    
    Ciao a tutti.
    A.
    

    Funny how both skippers declare they fought like crazy
    for the sides they got.  Given where they ended up, what
    was there to fight about?  ;)  Must have been bluffing.
    Interesting concept -- fight for the side you don't want,
    and let your opponent beat you...
    
    I don't think Cayard's move was stupid so much as a long shot
    that kept getting longer until he was out of touch.  He should
    have tacked and consolidated his losses sooner, but the reason
    he didn't, I think, is as I stated before;  he must beleive
    that A-cubed is generally faster than Il Moro.
    
    Eagerly anticipating today's pre-start.  Can you say 
    "P-R-O-T-E-S-T!"  I knew you could.  
    
    ;)

    I think it's becoming clear that A3 has a big boatspeed advantage
    compared to all other IACC boats. Stars & Strips doesn't look as
    bad now that we see the job being done on the Italians.
    
    Say what you want about Koch - he has no experience, gets bonked on the
    head all the time, grab the wheel lose the deal, etc. But he has
    produced two amazingly fast boats in his short career: Matador2 and
    America3. He's doing something right.

    Yeah ... he's going something right ... spending tons of money ...
    
    ... Bob
    

    Speed costs money, how fast do you want to go?

    A3 wins again. Love to hear Bill getting bent out of shape on the 
    last leg. Buddy turns to him and says "Bill, Chill out will ya?".
    Great!!
    
    

    After what Koch has been saying about Conner ("the best"),
    Cayard ("second best"), and Melges ("good enough, given OUR boat"),
    I'm suprized that Buddy hasn't said something stronger than
    that.  It will be interesting to see what he has to say about
    all this after the races are over (and his contract presumably
    completed).

    So what happened. I saw a one liner in Vogon news on the results of
    race #4, but zero commentary.
    
    Can some good soul give a run down?
    					Many thks, 
    						  Nick

    From what I saw fast forwarding through my tape last night was Cayard
    pinning A3 up on the starboard end of the line and controling the left
    with about a minute to go.  Then A3 did a quick jibe away escape move
    and took the left end.  It was a very even start with A3 slightly ahead
    and to leeward.  They straight lined way out to the left before Il Moro
    tacked away and A3 covered.
    
    A3 had about 24" at the first mark and stretched it out downwind.  Il
    Moro closed to 1 boat length on the 2nd beat but A3 was able to hold
    them off and walk away downwind again.
    
    Some dramatics were an A3 crew member getting tangled and partially
    washed overboard then saved by a companion, and A3's mast flexing wildly
    at one of the reaching marks but not breaking.  A3 seems to get
    frazzled easily when Il Moro gets close.  Go Il Moro!
    
    Don

    Watched race 5 and have to give some credit to Koch for
    letting Buddy drive most of the race.  There were some
    "grab the wheel" antics between them as they crossed the line,
    but Buddy gets the credit for driving.  When they took A-cubed
    to the SDYC, Koch dove off, swam to the dock, climbed up, and
    hoisted the A-Cup over his head.  That was classic, and you had
    to feel good for the guy.  A vindicated nerd.  ;)
    
    At the press conference, Bill also praised Buddy as one of 
    the best, if not *the* best, sailor in the world.  A bit gratuitous,
    but arguably true.  Buddy had some good words for Paul Cayard, 
    predicting that Paul would out-do Buddy two-fold.  The one black 
    moment came when Koch said he thought all the contenders "worth 
    their salt" had been trying to find out all they could about 
    their opponenets, ie spying.  Cayard looked pretty pissed about 
    that, saying the Il Moro team must not be worth their salt then, 
    because he would guaranty that no one from Il Moro did *any* spying.  
    I don't think Koch meant to offend Paul, but the damage was done.  
    Gardini seemed in good spirits, all considered.
    
    With the fastest AC boats already in hand, I bet Koch is there again
    in '95.  But they'll have to find some way to keep the costs down
    if they want to maitain the level of competition.  
    
    Cheers,
    Dean

    
    	re -1; the costs: I believe that's part of the facination. If it
    	were speed, where's the Speed Week films? Windsurfers (well, speed
    	needles, actually) are more than doubling the IACC's best. Then 
    	there's Crossbow et al-
    	And if it were skill, where's the OLYMPIC coverage?
    	Nope, sorry, to get on TV you need that National Enquirer-type
    	backing, maybe some cheating and dirty laundry- and of course
    	gazillions of bucks, to get folks interested.
    
    	That all said, congratulations to _everybody_ who busted their
    	butts out there (crew & land support) and, hey, DIGITAL's guy
    	(guys) have taken it twice in a row now! Hmmm is the connection
    	$$$ or disk farms??
    
    	Back to the LOCAL RACING note, huh?
    
    	Scott.

    It's interesting how SDYC is taking on a negative image similar
    to the NYYC before. Koch said he's tired of the SDYC politics
    and next time "they can spend the 65 million". Dennis Conner
    is starting his own yacht club/marina in New York of all places.
    ESPN said DC will represent that his own club next time.
    
    I'd like to see an end to the challenger and defender categories.
    Make it a match race elimination series, the club/location
    that wins gets to take the Cup. This would inspire more local business,
    hotels, and resorts to contribute to a challenge.

    if it's a match race elimination, where do you hold the race?

    Sorry to ask here but could someone point me to a topic (if any)
    about the so-called "mini-twelves"?
    They are also called the "2.4", I think because they are designed
    using the metric series formula reduced to 2.4 mtrs. The only thing
    I know is that there are two builders in Sarasota (FL).
    
    Reason is that my best half has discovered that there lots of races
    in which disabled can compete using those boats and she has fallen
    in love with them and wants to buy one.
    
    Thanks in advance and bye.
    
     Arrigo
    
    ARRIGO DEANGELI @RIO
    _ROMOIS::DEANGELI
    

    	Historically they are even more popular in Europe than in the
    states.  I thought I had some more information on builders and the
    class association here but I cannot find it right now.  I know that
    there are builders in the Scandinavian countries as well.  

    	The boats can be customized so to work around the owners handicap
    and are quite stable.  They are not light despite their relative small
    size.  It is this weight that gives them their stability.


    Forrest

    re. -1
    
    Thanks a lot Forrest, it`s always a pleasure to hear from you.
    
    If you`re still interested in any news about Snipes lok at 
    Sailing_in_Eu, # 57 etc.
    
    Bye for now.
    
    Arrigo.
    

A class of Mini-twelves were built in England in the early Eighties and there
a still quite a lot around.

They were called 'Illusions', and were quite good copies of the 12metre class.

Chris

    
    	I replied directly to the author with mailing addresses for the
    class associations for the Mini 12s, the Illusion class, and the 2.4 M
    class.  He will get in touch with them and see if they can help him
    locate a local class contact, and supplier.
    
    Forrest

reprinted from NZ herald 14-Oct-1991 without permission

The sdyc and the challenger of record the Yacht Club of France have formally
agreed to the format of the next AC in 1995.

Summary Time:

	The final will be a best of 9.
	Raceing for the final to start on the first saturday in may.
	Some wanted September dates.
	Course is to be 4 windward/leewards. finishing downwind.

Still to be finalized are any changes to the AC cup boats themselves. Must
be completed before end of Dec.


Thats about the guts of it.


revel

    Some weeks ago Mr. Gardini has officially challenged for the
    new Europa Yacht Club. Don`t know who else will be with him
    in the new challenge (apart from Paul, of course).
    
    We`ll see, 1995 is still very far to come.
    
    re. -1: best of 9, eh? Seems someone will have a very long thrilling.
    
    Ciao a tutti.
    
    Arrigo
    

Following the success of the French indoor Funboard events (Bercy stadium - 
Paris) where top creasy funboarders were racing in a big swimming pool 
between huge fans (20-25 knots minimum) and an unbridled audience surrounded 
by heavy rock music (wow :^), they decided to vary the idea and will propose 
for December (I think) during the Paris boat show, a mini-twelve event with 
the big match-race's stars (Pajot, Cayard & co.). Even unknown sailors will 
be able to participate after a strong selection!
I'll tell you more about it soon.

Oh, by the way, I went to St Tropez (French riviera) two week ago to watch 
some of the most beautiful boats in the world racing for the "Nioulargue" 
wich is becoming a must in Europe for the richest boats owners. Among them 
was "Ville de Paris" the AC Class with Marc Pajot and... "Endeavour" the 
restored J class with Mrs Meyer: Amazing!
They raced together for the symbol the day before (the event was shown on 
every French TV channels), and in a 15-20 knots wind, the AC class "only" win 
over the J class by 5 mn!

. Pierre .

    re. - 1
    
    Pierre, this should be an event to watch (I mean Paul, Marc and so
    on racing on mini-twelves); pls, if possible, let me have further
    infos about, eventually via mail, my best half is looking for a cheap
    mini-12 to start racing.
    
    J Class v/s ACupper ? Lords! something I would have seen!
    
    Ciao, Arrigo
    

    Please, any pointer to the actual Cup news?
    
    Thanks in advance, Arrigo
    

    I read in the Boston Globe yesterday that Dave Dallenbagh (sp?) was 
    scheduled to join the crew of Mighty mary, Acubed's new boat, as
    starting helmsman.   I think it was Koch who was quoted as saying that
    men have been racing at this level for a long time, and there is no way
    women, who have heretofore not been included in the afterguard, can be
    expected to have the tactical experience needed to successfully compete
    first time out.  And then there were people quoted who said it was
    better for the team to stay all women and lose, than to lose the purity
    of the concept.  I suspect that person is not a racer, since most
    racers don't go out figuring it's not whether you win or lose, but how
    you play the game, when you get to this level.  ergo the level of
    snooping and spying that went on in the previous A.C. defense a few
    years ago.
    
    djc
    

    re .521
        
        Yup, it's time for the real A.C. contests. Political of course.
    It's nothing new though. Read Dennis's book on how he got played with
    in Newport twice.
    
        Sail magazine has the levels of funding in the April issue.  Acubed
    was reported at $25 million US. Heck of a price to be P.C. On sail New
    England yesterday, they were in Point Loma and met with the Acubed
    team. They has some great footage of scrimages from the leeward side 
    during starting practice. Nice to see some real sailing between the 
    trip to Seaworld and BoatUS ;>)  .
    
        All for naught, the Kiwi's are taking the cup home this time. Even
    DC in his Saturday show last week week alluded to it. when asked who is
    going to win this thing, He said the Black boat looks like the
    favorite, but us Americans will try and stop em.
    
        john
    

    Hi from NZ
    
    Gee, glad to see you accept that we are going to win. I suggest you all
    save a heap and just give us the cup now and save up for next time. :)
    
    I can't see how anyone really knows as yet. Sure it looks good but the
    challengers and defenders have not sailed against each other so there
    is no bench mark to go by.
    
    Dennis is not silly. He only needs to get to the next round. PACT and
    the NZ Black Boat are winning all but its still not crunch time for
    them.
    
    Dennis, Cube, TAG and Aussie 1 are at the edge. Japan appears dead and
    PACT and NZ look thru on current form. If you want a prediction from me
    then:
    
    	Challengers
    
    		Pact
    					Stars and Stripes
    		Stars and Stripes
    
                                                                ?????????
    	Defenders
    		
    		New Zealand
                     			TAG			
    
    		TAG
     
    There is still a long way to go. Dennis and Chris are doing every thing
    really well. Not over extending and learning all the time. I fear both NZ
    and PACT don't really know the true strength of the others.
    
    Given that NZ and PACT could change boats again its still very hard to
    pick. What I have noticed is that NZ seems really slow in the start
    area. The boat appears to die at very slow speeds. Both in the start
    and during low speed tacks.
    
    There is still a huge number of races to go for all the boats. Given
    the Aussie problem one wonders if all the boats will last the distance.
    Wear and tear must be mounting. I would kill to know of the limited
    number of sails that each is allowed who has what left. Tag is clearly
    keeping some back for the semi's.
    
    It could be reasonably assumed that PACT, NZ are too. Aussie must be
    short. Japan will be using every thing that it has and Dennis and Cube
    will be too. It may simply become those who have conserved resources. 
    
    

    There has to be Las Vegas odds on each competitor for winning the Cup.
    I agree with our NZ friend in that I too believe the finals will match
    NZ against Dennis. I'm not concerned about the Defender series thus
    far. Team DC just does enough to make the cut. I suspect DC will
    continue to sandbag all the way to the Cup match itself. Then, all the
    stops come off, and the Cup stays in San Diego. 
    
    Carl...whose body is in the office, but the mind is in the boat.

	DC will be steering the PACT boat, unless the crack repair lets go!

	I'd LOVE to see the cup move back to New England, especially Maine!

	Instigator_Scott who can't believe Cayard is steering...

    Team New Zealand made it through to the America's Cup by this morning
    winning her 5th race in the final of the Challenger Series (Louis
    Vouiton (sp?) Cup) downing OneAustralia by 5 races to 1.
    
    I gather that Team Dennis Connor are now leading the Defenders Series
    after also beating the Young America Team, to take out a 2 point lead in
    their final...
    
    Noone in NZ will be suprised if DC wins the right to Defend the AC...
    in fact very few will be suprised if he retains the Cup for America,
    despite the impressive performance of Team New Zealand, all
    parochialism aside...
    
    Wrenching the Cup away from San Diego would be the best thing for the
    sport (if it can be still called "sport"), however if the example of
    "rule bending" we have seen to actually allow DC to compete in the
    Defender Series final is anything to go by, there is fat chance of this
    outcome becoming a reality.
    
    Both the Defender and Challenger Series have had fantastic Live Television
    coverage in New Zealand, with racing each day starting at about 8:00am NZ
    Time... Both series are pretty much of equal interest to New Zealanders, 
    particularly with Leslie Egnot being a New Zealand citizen, and DC just 
    being DC.
    
    With Russell Coutts, Rod Davis, Chris Dickson, the Skipper of Nippon, and 
    Egnot all being NZ citizens, Kiwi interest has been sustained
    throughout.
    
    I suspect however that we will be a very disappointed little nation
    later on in May when the SDYC pull their next stunt... whatever that
    might be (in keeping with the history of the AC of course!)..
    
    Glen...with_fingers_crossed_that_it_will_be_a_fair_contest
    
    
    
    

    There once was a sailor named Dennis
    
    Sailing was his game, not Tennis
    
    He beat every yacht
    
    That the defenders had got
    
    and now he's going to roll over NZ in the final 'cause he is the master
    mind game man and he just happens to write good management books and he
    picked Paul Cayard to help him and without him the America's Cup would
    not be of any interest to anyone (in the same way that Mohammed Ali
    made Boxing interesting) and Canadian TV is finally carrying the races
    and I watched Dennis last night and I LOVED IT.  Come to think of it
    there will be a double whammy I believe as the Canadian Rugby team is
    just about to hand the All-Blacks a well deserved clock cleaning in
    time for the world cup next month.  

    Before you say Dennis, remember, If he ties, he is out (part of the
    "agreement"). So if A3 does him up 1 more time, say bye-bye Dennis.
    
    If Pact 95 would just get thier head out of their behind, they could 
    take this. They have sailed like trash this entire series. All of it
    bad calls (tacks, tactics, aggression etc). May be the presure.
    
    Hat off to the Aussies for never quiting, being polite, and racing smart.
    I hope the Defenders learn from them what class is all about.

    
    Is today's race on ESPN at 4pm?
    
    /jim
    

    re .528
    
    
    Great call.... The Canadian XV were walloped 73 points to 7, by a
    NZ XV struggling to find some sense of form before the world cup..
    
    I hope your AC predictions are just as accurate!
    
    I understand that todays do or die match for DC agaianst Mighty Mary
    has been postponed 24 hours due to flukey winds. (Another reason the AC
    needs to be taken as far away as possible from San Diego!)
    
    Glen_hoping_like_hell_that_Dennis_gets_his_butt_kicked_tomorrow.

    Yeah but if you knew anything about Rugby you'd know that with one or
    two luck breaks, a team can rack up 70 points by fluke while a better
    team can get stuck in lower point range.  I once played on a team that
    got beaten 70 something to nothing ... it was sheer luck.

    Yeah I know what you mean, its like getting a lucky break in all but
    one of the challenger series races, but despite that single loss on the
    water still reaching the Final of the Americas Cup, and finding out
    that you're up against Dennis Connor in the final who got there not
    through sailing ability, but by being able to negotiate a rule change
    after failing by fair means to qualify.... such luck some people have!

    So with that sort of luck record, I predict that Dirty Dennis (as he is
    affectionately known in this part of the world) having now done a
    Houdini act by coming from well behind and beating ACUBED today, will
    retain the AC for San Diego, using whatever Luck he can muster from his
    vast array of influential friends who will stop at nothing when it
    comes to keeping the Auld Mug in the SYDC Trophy Cabinet.
    
    There will of course be deep satisfaction if this prediction is not met
    and that the contest is won fairly and squarely on the water by Team
    New Zealand.... beating Dennis on the water will in fact be much more
    satisfying than beating any of the alternative defenders, given the
    odds against doing so!
    
    Roll on May 7.
    
    Glen. 

    It just struck me that it would be interesting to poll Digital
    employees on Dennis and see how the various "groups" react to him.  I'm
    in sales and I respect and admire people that use their negotiating
    ability to win.  I suspect that other folks might view negotiating your
    way into the final is a "broken" rule, however it was just as broken
    for acubed and Pact at the time the deal was done.  But be that as it
    may.
    
    Slight aside with no smiley face, Michael Fay is the "dirty" one, he
    broke the rules in the first place by trying to ambush the traditional
    boat design for the America's cup and he deserves what he got and
    that's what the court said and that's how the history books will show
    it.
    
    Now, here's the irony.  The cup was on TV here at 5:30 so I ran home
    got parked in front of the TV and watched and got depressed because
    Dennis was back of Mighty Mary, I waited and waited for him to pull a
    rabbit out of the hat.  At the end of the thrid upwind leg I said
    "that's it" and turned off the TV and sadly gave up on Dennis.  DAMN !

Negotiating a win may be commendable in marketing, but this is supposed to be a 
sail boat race. The cup has spent more time in court since going to San Diego 
than it has spent on the water. I think Dirty Dennis is a proporly 
representative name fore him. The only good that can come from him defending 
the cup is to let him be the one to loose it. I would like to see the cup leave 
San Diego so that it can be raced for, on the water, in boats that can handle
conditions I cruise in.
	As for Micheal Fay changing the traditional boat, I believe that the 12
meter rule is only a boat of the mid 1900s. There is nowhere in the dead of gift
that specifies the 12 meter rule. 

	By the rules, which were clearly written before the races started, Dennis 
should have been eliminated several weeks ago. I cannot agree that winning a
sail boat competition by working well around the bargaining table is a 
commendable feet. 

	Not only would it be great to see the cup go to New Zealand, but then 
it can come back up to Maine in 4 years where I can sail to, to watch some 
races. 

	Go New Zealand!!
	Geoff

    
    What an amazing finish!  If anyone taped it, please let me know.
    
    I'm not a big fan of Dennis, primarily because I don't think he has the
    right personality to be the spokesman of the sport.  I do respect him
    as a great racer, though.  Nobody can take that away from him.
    
    I don't think that anything that has gone on thus far has been "dirty",
    since every defending team felt the deal was in their personal best
    interest at the end of round 2.  Maybe he's "Lucky Dennis", but not "Dirty
    Dennis".  I guess an interesting question is whether a similar rule
    change on the part of the challengers would have been tolerated.  We'll
    never know the answer to that one, but it might make for a lively
    argument in the right pub.
    
       /jim  
    

    re .536

    If you can can get to http://www.ac95.org/index.shtml, one of the
    articles about yesterday's race includes a gif image map of courses
    sailed on the last leg. It tells the story of the last leg very nicely. 

    My own summary of the last leg would be that S&S got a lucky break from
    the wind that allowed her to catch up to A3; but bad sailing and
    strategy on A3 contributed to its being passed and eventually losing.

    After S&S caught A3, the boats eventually gybed away. From the course
    map, the difference between the courses sailed by the two boats is
    remarkable. A3 took a very high course compared to S&S.

    - Bob

    The point about the deal is that all three agreed to it then and there. 
    That made the sail off to be nothing more than the first race of the
    finals, except that in the event of a tie, the loser of the race-off
    was out.
    
    So, what if Dennis continued his subtle ways and did a little
    sandbagging in the sail off ?
    
    Remember 1987 when Dennis limped into the challengers finals and
    everyone counted him out "Dicko" included ?  Someone on ESPN said the
    other day that Dennis is very easy to underestimate - that is right on
    he wants people to underestimate him.
    
    No mention of Stinky-Bill here who has so little respect for the cup
    and the sailing that he feels that if you throw enough money at it that
    you can win ?  Compared to Bill, Dennis is a Saint.  What about the
    collusion between Pact 95 and A-cubed ?  no sportsmanship there.
    
    Re. the old chestnits about "they didn't used to sail in 12 metres so
    the NZ's can come along and decide what size boat they want" - that's
    just plain wrong.  The 12 metre rule was adopted by the stakeholders in
    the Am-Cup at the time by consensus.  Shifty-Sir-Michael just popped up
    with 120 foot boat and challenged.  He had no respect for the tradition
    of the Vitton cup ... he couldn't win it so he thought he would change
    the rules make himself the only one who could challenge and get his
    chance that way.  Dennis just one-upped him.
    
    So Dennis is "Dirty" becuase he beat "dicko" in 87 and Shifty-Sir-M in
    89.  Oh yeah, by the way what about mighty mary and the protests ? 
    Every time they saw stars and stripes they raised a red flag - if they
    had not protested.  Dennis does America's Cups better than anyone, you
    have to give him that.
    
    In my unbiased opinion.

    re -.1 >> Dennis does AC cups better than anyone else.
    
     I'll reserve comment for 2 weeks. That Kiwi afterguard looks pretty good...
    

    Our friend from Ottawa isn't related to Dennis by any chance is he?
    
    Lets look foward to the Cup and hope like hell that it is sailed fairly
    and that both parties treat it with the respect it deserves...
    certainly the NZ Challenge is being run by sailors for sailors, and Sir
    Michael Fay is totally dis-associated from this challenge...  
    
    Noone here is underestimating DCs abilities to win the match, by
    whatever means, and his sailing prowess has never been questioned..
    
    It'll be a great contest, I hope its close and exciting, and good
    television....  the $60,000 question is just how similar are the
    performances of the two boats going to be (at this stage we don't
    appear to know what boat DC will use, and even if we did it is still
    impossible to guage the relative performances of the best challenger
    and the best defender boat..)...  One scenario is that one boat will
    have a clear advantage over the other and the races will simply be a 
    procession...
    
    
    Glen.

    not Ottawa, Newfoundland - a far more civilized place.

    Thumbing through the PBS directory for May, I spied a program on the
    history of the AC cup to be aired. In Boston, WGBH will be doing this
    next Saturday around 6:30-8:30 (forget the exact time).  I think they
    will have second run later in the month.
    
    You may wish to keep a weather eye on those TV listings.
    
    
    Got to remember to reset that VCR, as I have a business trip to get
    to.. ;>(

    
    Yes! Yes! lumpy seas and light air......
    
    Doing the heavy air parade is just plain boring. but 5knt true in left
    over 4fters is what the stuff skill is made of.
    
    Nothing is finer than to slice and slash through a bewildered fleet
    bouncing and bashing their bows upwind, or roaring over, under and
    through them downwind. (spoken like a true Soverel driver?)
    
    If you could order ala cart:
    
    		Racing: on the nose at 5knt true
    
    		Cruising: 20knt at 90deg AWA.
    
    

re last couple:

Racing in light winds may be a better test of skill than racing in heavy 
winds, but watching it on television it is ***BORING*** to the virtually 
everyone (including me). And boring doesn't bring viewers and sponsorship 
money. I'd vastly rather watch the Whitbread or BOC boats in the Southern 
Ocean. And I doubt that the Whitbread or BOC crews would consider sailing 
in the Southern Ocean a parade.

Now if the America's Cup were sailed off Cape Horn in winter gales with
icebergs as turning marks, we'd see some really exciting sailing. Good 
test of humankind and boats, too.

    If the goal is TV audience, the rules could easily be changed to
    encourage more close calls, more equipment breakage, more protest room
    hearings (hey, Court TV works!!!), etc. The question is whether sailing
    in general is better served by a bunch of multi-billionairs "racing"
    one-time-use-only boats designed by MIT professors and sailed by
    professionals, better served by American Gladiator Sailing, or by a
    bunch of small local clubs racing on weekends in ratty-to-mediocre old
    14 footers... Personally, since I can't qualify for either of the first
    two, I opt for the third. See you Sunday.
    
    Doug.

    
    Evidently Joe Public doesn't think that racing in heavy weather is very
    interesting either...  if racing is aired just for the benefit of the
    few of us that appreciate it, then let it be a test of skill, at
    least.  (well, ok, skill and the ability to negotiate back room deals) 
    
    

    I guess one could say that this is not the best "spectator sport"  out
    there.
    
    
    

    When asked if he would be watching the America's Cup, Ted Turner replied
    "Sailing is something you do, not something you watch." This from a guy
    who has both been there, and owns a cable broadcasting company. 
    
    Don't get me wrong, I enjoy the commentary as well as the coverage (on
    board cameras are great), but it kind of reminds me of watching golf.
    O.K during the winter months, but more fun doing it.

    Re -.1   Sure beats professional pool, and mountain biking... ;>)
    
    
       Late Saturday night ESPN ran an AC update including the entire
    last leg. Team DC did very well enduring a blown chute to come from
    behind. The real story was shown on the trible/sun course plot. Yes team
    DC reacted to the shifts better, but the real story was the driving
    on Mighty Mary. Twice on gybes they were all over the place. Looked 
    like a a Etch-A-Skeh drawing from a 3 year old in a car on a bad road.
    
      Paul Cayard on the other hand was smooth and used the mimimal amount
    needed to get onto a course. All around bad down wind tactics  and 
    execution by A3. The decision not to use their best downwind driver is
    going to haunt these folks for some time.

    re: .552
    
    Stereotypes often have a kernel of truth to them and if men are
    stereotyped as Neanderthals, it's statements like these that provide
    that kernel.
    
    "Network news" isn't a very specific attribution given the number of
    news networks there are in this country, but I doubt I saw the show
    anyway, so I won't attempt to comment on it.  
    
    I will call you on your comment about "rowers" vs. "sailors."  How many
    "sailors" do you think it takes to sail an AC boat anyway?  It's
    certainly well less than 1/2 the crew.  Do you really think that the
    grinders on Stars & Stripes were put in that position because they
    didn't make the cut when trying out for Whidden's job rather than being
    selected for the size of their biceps and the intellectual capacity to
    understand the grinder's extensive command set ("trim", "hold").  Do
    you call what a bowman does "sailing" or could it be done as well or 
    better by a light, agile moutain climber who is good with knots and
    hardware and looks cute in a climbing harness?
    
    While some amount of cross training and skill certainly helps team
    members with their assignments and provides additional depth, the roles
    on an AC boat are pretty specialized.  There's also a non-trivial
    contribution by boring old management.  Things like making sure that
    everyone knows what's expected of them, that there's enough food at the
    meals, enough beer at the parties, etc.
    
    All this stuff is part of any team sport and the America's Cup isn't
    any different.
    
    Tom

    
    re: .-1
    
    	If experience at positions other than navigator, tactician, and
    	helmsman matter as little as you imply, then I suppose that might
    	be one explanation for the lack of interest in the sport.
    
    	I will agree with you that experience at these positions matters 
    	more than, for example, experience at trimming a sail; however,
    	even trimming a sail in various wind speeds and at various points 
    	of sail calls for experience and knowledge of aerodynamics that
    	are not acquired in rowing.
    
    	"Network News" == "Channel 4 in Boston", fwiw.  Does that matter?
    
    	When wind pressure and tactics were discussed on board S&S, there
    	was quite a high-powered sounding board in Whidden, Connor, and
    	Cayard.  As I suggested in a previous reply, even the non-elite
    	positions were staffed with the likes of Jud Smith, a champion
    	sailor in his own right.
    
    	When Dave D. made some choices on MM that seem dubious in
    	retrospect, the quality of his sounding board was poor compared
    	with that on S&S.  When things started going wrong on the final
    	leg, it appears from their reactions that panic set in.
    
    	When the spinnaker blew out on S&S, panic did not set in (except
    	for one urgent comment by Cayard), and they had a new one up and
    	drawing in 10 seconds.
    
    	Experience matters.  Not just at the helm, either.  This is not
    	a stereotype, it's a empirical fact that has been proved on the
    	race course.
    
    /jim
    

    The Sunday Boston Globe sports section had Tony Chamberlain's article
    in it.  He said that Dennis C's team is going to be racing Pact95's
    boat as the defender.  Koch was said to be upset that Dennis hadn't
    approached him about racing MM as the defender.
    
    If it's true, it doesn't give DC and his troops much time to learn the
    new boat, does it?
    
    S&S mast and boom are supposed to be transferred to Pact95, complete
    with all the advertising paraphenalia.  The hull graphic of the mermaid
    will remain, but I'm not sure what, if anything was said about the
    other advertising logos.
    
    djc
    

    	Yup. See note 526. Feed me enuf brewskis, I might even say how much
    	DC will beat NZ by in the final, staged, "cliff hanger" race.
    
    	Tho my sportsman's heart Does favor the Kiwis.
    
    	Xtal_Balls

    
    	As of 8 am west coast time Tuesday the PACt 95 boat was in TDC
    compound with their mast and boom that had only an apple logo on it. 
    I saw TDC and PACT out sailing on Sunday and Monday, on Monday the
    PACT folks were on S&S and the S&S folks were on the PACT boat.  The
    folks in the PACT compound were still not sure about sails and logo's
    that was still being sorted out.

	Talking to folks in the One-AUS camp they expected that TNZ had a
    good shot at winning.  But they figured that TDC and a better than even
    chance with the PACT 95 boat.  Also while there was no love for Dennis
    there was lots of respect for the team and crew.  More respect than for
    either of the other U.S. teams.
    
    
    Forrest

My 2cents

With the racing starting, I hope that Team New Zealand do very well, they
only have to win 5 races.

Dennis Conner gets some bad press in NZ, some of which is deserved
but a lot is not. He is an extremely tough competitor that will be hard
knock over. 

I am off to Sydney next week, which will mean no live coverage of the
races, in fact the only way I'll be able to keep up to date will be
via the internet.


SAN DIEGO, Calif. (May 4, 1995) -- The America's Cup is likely to be
won by the team that sails the best -- boat speed will play only a
small role. That according to  Pact 95 President John Marshall, who's
syndicate has agreed to "loan" its boat, Young America, to Team Dennis
Conner for the America's Cup match. 

 The America's Cup is a technology race first and a test of sailing skill
second. Except for rare instances, the fastest boat, historically, has
won the America's Cup. But when the boats are evenly matched, then its
the team that makes the fewest mistakes that prevails. 

 Speaking at a press conference at the Conner compound today, Marshall said
he believes Young America and challenger Team New Zealand's Black Magic
will be fairly even in terms of sheer boat speed. "The boats are more
similar than different," he said. "My gut feeling is that they'll be
very close. It'll probably come down to sailing." 

 And that is a concern of Dennis Conner's. Because of the electronic 
instruments on the boat, "Paul (Cayard) and Dennis will not have much
difficulty sailing this boat at the optimal speed," Conner said. But
the two boats have different deck layouts, and his crew, especially those
who work the pit (the area around the mast) will have to make adjustments. 
There
are fewer winches, and the winches are in different places. In the heat
of battle, when automatic reflexes are critical, lines could be mishandled. 
"(Pitman)
Josh Belsky will have the most difficult job adjusting," Conner said. 


 Young America's foredeck is also narrower than Stars & Stripes', giving
the foredeck crew less room to work, Conner added. 

 Still, he prefers the Pact 95 boat over his own, even though Stars &
Stripes defeated Young America three of the four times the boats met
in the final round of the defender series. "In light air and smooth water,
there's not much difference between the two," Conner said. "But as the
wind comes up, Young America has more stability, accellerates better and
tacks better." 

 Young America Faster Scuttlebutt has it, however, that in sailing trials
this week Young America was not any faster than Stars & Stripes. But
that was due, in large part, because Stars & Stripes was "turbo-charged" with
over-sized sails that would not be legal in a race. Conner said the two
boats are fairly even downwind, but Young America is two to three boat
lengths faster on the weather leg. That translates to 12 to 18 seconds a
leg. Because there are three weather, or upwind, legs in the six-leg, 
18.55-mile
race course Young America should be 36 to 54 seconds faster in a
race. 

 Conner hopes that becomes reality when he meets the New Zealand boat
for the first time on Saturday. "I have a lot of respect for the Kiwis,"
he said. He should. Several of the crew, including tactician Brad 
Butterworth , sailed for Conner in the Whitbread Round the World Race last
year. "When I had the chance to pick any sailor in the world to sail around
the world, I picked key members of the New Zealand team," he said. 


 He also described a recent breakfast he had with oneAustralia's 
John Bertrand, the man who beat Conner in the 1983 America's Cup. "He
says they have no weakness," Conner said. "They're 37-1 on the water. You
tell me where their weaknesses are. I don't see any weaknesses." 


 Mentally Tough Marshall said the Stars & Stripes crew won the defender
trials in a slower boat because they "are mentally tough" and they received
"a sprinkling of angel dust" on the last leg of their final race against
America3's Mighty Mary. "If I were the Kiwis, I'd be worried about that,"
Marshall said. 

 "I've never seen him so pumped. He's ready to kick head," Marshall said
of Conner. Marshall sailed with Conner in the 1983 America's Cup, and
headed Conner's design teams in the 1986-87 and 1988 Cup campaigns. 


 Conner figures to improve Young America's performance by using the
best sails from his and Pact's inventories. "Hopefully, the mix and match
of sails will improve our program," Conner said. Each team is allowed 45
sails, but Conner has used only 24 so far, allowing him to either make
or acquire 21 more. The Pact 95 mast will remain on the boat, but some
S&S rigging techniques will be employed to make between-race adjustments 
easier.
 

 Star Not Getting Any Higher Conner explained why he wants to sail
Young America. "My star is not getting any higher. If I lost the Cup,
and if I had sailed Stars & Stripes and lost, I would always wonder what
would have happened if had sucked it up and asked for the boat," he
said. "(But by sailing Young America), if we lose, our heads will be
held high. 

 "Yes, the crew would like sail Stars & Stripes," Conner continued. "but
the bottom line is, I believe we're doing the right thing and optimizing our
chances of winning." 

 Marshall said Pact agreed to the deal with Conner for two reasons --
to try to keep the America's Cup in America and because it keeps the
Pact program alive. But emotionally it hasn't been an easy transition for
him or the Pact 95 crew. "It's a great shame the sailors can't be with
the boat; it's our spirit. The hurt is deepest with the sailors," Marshall
said. "It has been difficult for me to not have our team on the boat. But
I'm proud to be part of (Conner's) team. The speed and performance of
our boat is a testimony to our design." 

 Sponsor Concerns The most difficult part of closing the deal was
answering to the two team's respective sponsors, Conner and Marshall said.
Under the terms of the deal, most of Pact's major sponsors -- Science 
Applications International Corp., UNUM insurance company and Apple Computers
-- will get their corporate logos on the boom. The exception is 
Lincoln-Mercury, which
agreed not to have signage on the boat, a condition that Cadillac, a
key Conner sponsor, insisted upon. 

 Conner's sponsors will have their logos on the boat's sails. But there
will be no logos on Young America's hull, which has a Roy Lichtenstein 
mermaid
painted along its 75-foot length. 

 Name Change The change of boats was particularly hard on Sears, Roebuck
& Co., a key Conner sponsor that is merchandising the Stars & Stripes line
of nautical apparel. "Sears has a vested interest in Stars & Stripes," Conner
acknowledged, asking the press to begin refering to his syndicate as
Team Stars & Stripes, rather than Team Dennis Conner. 

 The change of boats has also forced Conner to incur additional "financial
obligations." He did not disclose the details, but Marshall said Conner
will "cover the costs" of sailing Young America. "We'll add up the costs
and send him a bill when this is all over," Marshall said. Pact 95 CFO
Tom Stark said earlier this year its costs about $10,000 a day to sail
an IACC yacht. 

 
----------------------------------------------------------
Designed and produced by Science Applications International Corporation
and Events On Line. For more news, photos, and video clips please
check out the web site at http://www.ac95.org/
To unsubscribe mail to: raceresults@ac95.org
with Message body: unsubscribe raceresults
----------------------------------------------------------

    
    Team New Zealand drew first blood in America's Cup '95 in a convincing
    2'45" win over Team Dennis Connor, much to the delight of the entire
    3.5 Million population of New Zealand who have had a heavy media diet
    of this regatta (and the Louis Vouitton Cup) since January this year.
    
    TDC got a slightly better start, but at the pin end which was not
    favoured by TNZ, who started to windward and maybe .25 of a boatlength
    behind.
    
    TNZ appeared to be able to point higher and therefore sail over the top of
    TDC from a posiition on TDCs hip that I for one thought may have been
    difficult to achieve. However the relative ease with which TNZ did this
    then effectively sail away from TDC suggests superior boatspeed on most
    points of sail.
    
    In leg two (1st down hill leg) it appeared that TDC had superior off
    the wind performance as they pulled back about 30 seconds to get within
    12 secs of TNZ... however as this feat was not repeated on any other
    leg, it appears that the TNZ story after the event about problems on
    that leg may have accounted for the brief reversal of form.
    
    The good news is that New Zealand appear to have a very good chance of
    winning the Cup... The bad news is that if they continue this
    domination the regatta will be over by next weekend!
    
    (mind you.... a trend of 1 is perhaps a bit early to be making such
    bold predictions.... but it certainly looks promising....)
    
    No one here will be underestimating the potential for a reversal
    tomorrow, and we all know that if anyone can Dennis can.... but
    nonetheless we hope like hell that this time he gets beat well and truly!
    
    
    Glen  with_good_reason_to_be_feeling_a_little_more_confident
    
    

    I'm confident too, Dennis has New Zealand exactly where he wants them !
    They were smart to keep the delta down to 2 minutes or so, if they had
    stretched it out to 4 then DC would have really been in control!

    Team NZ isn't beating Dennis, they are beating Paul. In an interview
    on S&S, or is it Young America, Dennis said that both he and Tom Widden
    give Paul suggestions, but Paul has the final decision what to do. It
    sounded as though Paul was feeling the AC pressure, and several times
    chose his own decision (which was in error). 
    
    I would like to see DC at the helm, but as he said, "Paul got us here,
    and we trust his decisions." I wonder if DC has graduated from skipper
    to manager.

    Re. The Dennis/Paul thing.
    
    I noticed the other day in the Mighty Mary race, that Paul was ignoring
    the advice from DC and TW and so, at one point DC dispensed with the
    discussion and simply said "We're tacking"  everyone jumped and there
    they were tacking.  DC has clearly taken the role as "the other
    tactician", but his strength is also in being able to pick the best
    people available.  Just because he doesn't steer doesn't mean that he
    is not in charge.

    TDC won the start (that's if you believe crossing the line slightly
    ahead, but to leeward, is "winning"), but within 2 or 3 minutes and in
    light airs which should be favourable to TDC Team New Zealand again
    showed their superior boat speed and ponting ability.
    
    At the first mark TNZ rounded 39 seconds ahead, and then at the 2nd
    mark extended this lead to 50 seconds.
    
    Dennis/Paul/Tom (or whoever Dennis wants to take the blame for losing
    the AC) will be pretty concerned about the apparant all weather-all
    conditions superiority being displayed by the black boat.
    
    Still a long way to go, but I suspect real estate values will be
    appreciating around the harbour in Auckland at this juncture!
    
    Glen.
    
    

    Final margin in favour of TNZ was 4 minutes 14 secs.
    
    Glen
    
    

re: .554

I think there's a basic misconception here.  The rowers are used as grinders.
Grinders don't trim.  Trimmer's trim.  I would certainly include trimmers in
my 1/2 of the crew that are sailors.  I'd also probably include the mastman
and perhaps one other forward to keep things organized in the front half of
the boat.

re: TV coverage

There was an excellent film covering the PACT '95 campaign on Channel 2 in
Boston Sunday.  It was directed by Ted Bogasian (sp?) and was a joint
production of the San Diego PBS station and WGBH and covered everything from
putting together the syndicate to designing the boat to training, right up
to the deal giving Conner's the boat.  It was obviously a bit superficial
given the amount of ground that they covered in 90 (60?) minutes, but it
was a very good recap of their entire campaign and had some great footage 
including:

	- on board footage as their training boat got holed by Ville de Paris
	  in a training match
	- a bunch of footage shot at Goetze showing the techniques used to
	  construct the hull
	- details of the construction techniques used to repair the hull
	  after the mini-tornado

and lots of other very interesting stuff.  This guy obviously signed in blood
for the project, because he appeared to have complete access to everything
the syndicate was doing long before any of it became public.

I'm sure it will be shown again and it's definitely worth keeping an eye
out for.

Tom

    Is there any tv coverage of results etc other than on cable / satelite
    t.v.? 
    
    It's going to be a long time before cable comes to my neck of the
    woods. The only A.C. coverage (defender series) that I have seen is
    from a brewpub in Manchester one evening.
    
    Does anyone know of any results etc vis the evening sports coverage in
    the Boston / N.H. area?
    
    Any VHS tapes of the races would be appreciated, too.
    
    Thanks,
    
    Bill
    
    
    

    
    re: light winds should be better for TSS
    
        what I've heard is that the mermaid was supposed to be better as
    	the wind built up to 12 or 13 kts.  According to someone I met who
    	presumed to know (and who actually rode aboard MM), MM was designed
    	for the heaviest winds, the mermaid for moderate winds, and S&S for
    	the lightest winds.  This is why I was doubly surprized that Dennis
    	decided to jump boats in May, but I'm sure he knew what he was
    	doing.
    
    re: race 2
    
    	you know, as bad as that race turned out, bad luck was also a major
    	factor.  Cayard had a pretty excellent start...  and given that the
    	wind had oscillated way above the expected 275, Whidden was
    	expecting the wind to come back to the left.  They got a big 
    	separation to what seemed to be the preferred side of the course,
    	but then it turns out that the slight shift right I talked about
    	decided to fill in early.  
    
    	had the weather cooperated, TSS would have been sitting on top of
    	black magic on the first leg, and we might have had a very
    	interesting covering duel as the faster boat (eventually) tried to
    	pass.  luck is still a big factor, and TNZ got lucky in race 2 in
    	addition to being faster.  luck + faster + no big mistakes == big
    	win for TNZ...  don't count Dennis out just yet
    
    /jim
    
    	

re .558                                             
       <But emotionally it hasn't been an easy transition for
    <him or the Pact 95 crew. "It's a great shame the sailors can't be with
    <the boat; it's our spirit. The hurt is deepest with the sailors," Marshall
    <said. "It has been difficult for me to not have our team on the boat.
    < But I'm proud to be part of (Conner's) team.
    
    
      Sort like Bobcat Goldswath saying
    
    "I lost my job last week. Well, I didn't actually lose it, it is still
    there, but someone else is doing it..."
    
    
    <Tom Stark said earlier this year its costs about $10,000 a day to sail
    <an IACC yacht.
    
    Guess I can stop carping about being over $1500 on my refurb budget this
    year.... ;>)
                             
    
    Guess I better get that depth sounder and the last 4 months of sailing
    magazines shipped over to my Brother in law in Auckland. Gotta start kissing
    up if I want a good view of the next AC cup race......
    
       john
    

    Team New Zealand had their 3rd consecutive "luck break" to again
    convincingly beat TDC off San Diego to take out a 3 to zip lead in
    America's Cup '95.
    
    This "luck" is so strong that yesterday they scored the largest winning
    margin ever in America's Cup history, and so far in the series have not
    crossed behind TDC on any leg of the course.
    
    With TDC requiring 5 wins from the remaining 6 possible races to secure
    the America's Cup for the SYDC, TDC will wanting some "luck" of their
    own soon in order that they can break out of this poor performance zone
    they appear stuck in... (refer earlier note using the Rugby analogy
    about luck breaks)...
    
    Tomorrow is a lay day, but if this "luck" continues for Team New
    Zealand, the contest could be all over by Saturday (West Coast US
    time).
    
    Glen.
    Thinking_about_organising_a_champagne_breakfast_at_the_yacht_club_for_Sunday
    Morning (NZ Time.... with Race 5 Live on TVNZ)...
    
    

Re. 567

In France, we are unlucky when racing for the America's Cup (hum!!!!), but we
have the chance to benefit of a full coverage of all the races, only for the
final phase...

It's quiet early in the morning (at about 1 hour) but with a simple video tape
recorder, It's wonderful...

Moreover, it is on a public channel!

Sophie

    
    re: .-2
    
    	you know, just because you're good doesn't mean you can't be
    	lucky, too.  I didn't see the last race, but it doesn't sound
    	like luck has been much of a factor... or maybe when you're that
    	fast it just looks like luck comes your way more often.
    
    	know of any good bed & breakfasts in Auckland?
    
    /jim
    

    Isn't Paul doing the driving and calling the shots?  Won't he
    technically be the loser even though the syndicate is Team Dennis
    Conner AKA Team S&S?
    
    Brian