Conference lgp30::christian-perspective

	  "And when you pray, you must not be like the hypocrites; for
	they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and at the street
	corners, that they may be seen by men.  Truly, I say to you, they
	have their reward.  But when you pray, go into your room and shut
	the door and pray to your Father who is in secret; and your Father
	who sees in secret will reward you.
	  "And in praying do not heap up empty phrases like the Gentiles
	do; for they think that they will be heard for their many words.
	Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before
	you ask him."
					Matthew 6:5-8

	  "The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, 'God, I thank
	thee that I am not like other men, extortioners, unjust,
	adulterers, or even like this tax collector.  I fast twice a week,
	I give tithes of all that I get.'"
					Luke 18:11-12

    The quotes seem to suggest that motivation and one's opinion of oneself
    in relation to others might be important.
    
    Richard

  In addition to the verses Matt 6:5-8,Luke 18:11-12 mentioned in .1 some others
that show what can make prayers unacceptable to God are..

 NWT Prov. 28:9 "He that is turning his ear away from hearing the law-even his
                 prayer is something detestable."
 NWT Mic. 3:4 "At that time they will call to Jehovah for aid, but he will not
               answer them. And he will conceal his face from them in that time,
               according as they committed badness in their dealings."
 NWT Jas. 4:3 "YOU do ask, and yet YOU do not receive, because YOU are asking 
               for a wrong purpose, that YOU may expend [it] upon YOUR cravings
               for sensual pleasure."
 
 In contrast some scriptures to help understand the right method and things 
to pray for are..

 NWT Matt. 6:9-13 Model or Lord's prayer  "You must pray, then, this way:
                  "'Our Father in the heavens, let your name be sanctified.
                  Let your kingdom come. Let your will take place, as in
                  heaven, also upon earth. Give us today our bread for this
                  day; and forgive us our debts, as we also have forgiven our
                  debtors. And do not bring us into temptation, but deliver
                  us from the wicked one.'" 
 NWT Matt 26:41 "Keep on the watch and pray continually, that YOU may not enter
                 into temptation. The spirit, of course, is eager, but the flesh
                  is weak."
 NWT Ps. 25:4,5 "Make me know your own ways, O Jehovah; Teach me your own paths.
                 Make me walk in your truth and teach me, For you are my God of
                 salvation. In you I have hoped all day long."
 NWT 1 Thess. 5:17,18 "Pray incessantly. In connection with everything give 
                       thanks. For this is the will of God in union with Christ
                       Jesus respecting you."

    There is no wrong way to pray.  
    
    There are simply better ways to pray.
    
    Within every prayer there is at least a tiny thought of love.  Some
    prayers contain more thoughts of love than others, but this is part of
    our growth process.  The Holy Spirit hears the part of our prayer that
    is loving and answers that part.
    
    Ruth

for .1 - .3

	Quotations from a history book written down from an oral history won't
cut it.

for .4

	Her view is closer to the intent of .0.


What is the intent of a prayer?  This is what must be asked.  If the intent is
constructive, supportive, uplifting (i.e. loving) then it is a good prayer.  If
the intent is destructive, selfish, degrading then it is not a prayer at all; it
is an expression of self-centeredness. 

    .5  Quite astute.
    
    Richard
    

    re: .5

    yes very astute...even adroit!

    Any thought of turning toward a higher power (no matter how small that
    thought is) is prayer.  Even a prayer that is filled with completely
    negative thoughts (i.e.  "Lord kill my enemies) still has a tiny seed
    of Love within it because of the very idea that "Lord" (higher power)
    exists.

    I think the Lord hears those prayers like this:

    What human prays:     "Lord kill my enemies"

    What Lord hears:      "Lord blah blah blah"

    And the Lord smiles and says "Ahah!  This human knows I exist! "

    Ruth

> Title: What is the intent

> for .1 - .3
>	  Quotations from a history book written down from an oral history won't
> cut it.

 
 The intent was to show what God's Word says about prayer. This is not simply a
history book. It is written for our instruction 2 Tim 3:16,17 under direction of
the holy spirit. If you don't beleive what God's Word says then there's really
no sense in praying to it's author.
  
  robin

Robin,

	Please see note 716 for why I make this statement.  I do not condem,
belittle, or degrade your faith.  Peace to you.  Please do read about how the
current bible came to be.  There are excellent biblical scholars who have
written on what or what is not the current "word of God."  I have read texts
that have changed considerably over the centuries.  Also the "instructions" are
different between the westeren Roman Catholic bible and the Eastern Orthodox
bible to my knowledge;  and I don't mean just local language.  It is the spirit
of God that must be sought after, not just "instructions."

Base topic:

	Can a prayer for the death of another ever be considered good?  I do not
think so.  So can it be considered a prayer?  My answer comes in two parts. 
According to our current definition of the work "prayer" (i.e. a petition to
God, an address to God, and entreaty to God) the answer is syntactically such an
entreaty can be considered a "prayer."  But it is the intent of such an entreaty
that is judged by God.  So for .7 I'd say I couldn't agree.  As to what God
hears I really don't know, nor could I guess.  It is, an act of faith to even
pray...  and that is all that I'm certain of.

    May the Holy One bless the Czar -
    
    
    and keep him far away from us.
    
    L