Conference napalm::commusic_v1

    I saw a Herbie Hancock electric set where he played the Y one,
    exclusively (good Japanese marketing, huh?). It csounded brilliant,
    but the trouble with MIDI is you can't tell what it was hooked up
    to. But he certainly had no trouble getting his technique round
    the thing.
    
    Richard.

RE < Note 1801.0 by HAMER::COCCOLI "one size fits all" >

	The KX-5 does have velocity, but not aftertouch (pressure).  I believe
Yamaha (there, I said it) is the only one to implement a breath controller port,
so you're kind of stuck with what they offer.

	The KX-5 uses mid-size keys, which I think means that they are 
regulation width, but have a short axis.  Brad, our beloved moderator, has one
of these, so I'm sure he can better comment.

	Another controller to include is the R-word's (ha!) Axis-1, which DOES 
implement aftertouch.  I don't know anyone personally who has had one of these,
so I can't comment on it.

	Dan

    Don't forget the Casio AZ-1 (which I think has/had full sized keys),
    and the humble Yamaha SHS-10 which has small keys, velocity sensitivity,
    no aftertouch, built in sounds and rhythms and only costs 70 pounds (I
    bought one just to get around the old "DX7 only transmits on channel 1"
    problem). 

    Depends whether you want cheapness or bells and whistles (come
    to think of it, the SHS-10 has both bell and whistle sounds :-)

    Cheers,

    Derek.

There is also the linc.  It was reviewed in keyboard within the last 
7 or 8 months (I believe),  They are giving one away as part of the mega-
keyboard giveaway (KEYBOARDs).

Chad

    Uhm - {blush} - beloved aside, the KX5 does indeed implement channel
    pressure (not poly pressure). 

    The (37) smaller keys aren't really that big a deal ... but I suppose
    that's a function of how tied your chops are to full sized keys. I
    didn't have a whole lot of trouble, since they're the same *width* as
    full-sized keys, but not as long. 

    The KX5 is limited to transmitting on *either* channel 1 or 2 (but not
    both).  It has portamento on/off (and rate), as well as a mono/poly
    switch (these only work with Yamaha synths - I guess implementation is
    non-standard).  There are 3 xpose pushbuttons (oct down/normal/oct up).
    32 patches are selectable by bank/number, where bank = A thru D, and
    number = 1 thru 8.  The "guitar neck" has a ribbon-type nylon surfaced
    pitch bender, a mod wheel and a volume wheel, neither of which are
    spring loaded (don't "self-return").  There is also a sustain button on
    the very end of the neck.  And, like Dan said, the famous breath
    controller plug on the neck side.  (BTW - I have a breath controller
    and find it quite useful.) 

    As far as I can tell, the thing is limited to battery power only (it
    takes 6 AA cells - I use rechargables).  It's pretty efficient in terms
    of power consumption - one kind of slick thing they did is to force
    power-off if the MIDI OUT port has nothing plugged into it (or if the
    cable plugged into the OUT port is not plugged into an IN at the other
    end). 

    I like mine for leads and showing off, but it's not too usable for
    comping and "general playing".  I think they listed for around $575
    new, and I'm not sure if they even make them anymore.  I got mine
    used and broken for a song, and rebuilt it.

    Did I answer the question in .0?  &*}

-b

    The Lync LN4 is a very nice strap-on controller.  It has velocity and
    aftertouch and a very fast "feel" to it.  Also has 2 controller wheels,
    2 programmable buttons next to the wheels, and a slew of patch-change
    buttons.  Only needs one cable (power-in combines with signal-out),
    and the base unit is a rackmount (yo dB!)
    
    It's pretty abuse-proof.... and supposedly the guys who build them
    graduated in the same class as me (from RPI).  :-)
    
    	-Bill

    Only Guitar Shop has LN4's cheap (518-371-1232).  They're in Albany
    NY, take all plastic, and they ship FedEx Next-day air if requested.
    

RE < Note 1801.5 by DYO780::SCHAFER "Brad - back in Ohio." >

>    Uhm - {blush} - beloved aside, the KX5 does indeed implement channel
>    pressure (not poly pressure). 

	That's funny - the literature I have from Yamaha states that it is only
velocity sensitive.  But I'm sure you know better seein's how you gots one.

	Dan
 

    I have an AZ-1 (casio....gawd the 'worst' C-word)
    
    Great unit. INCREDIBLE PRICE. aftertouch, and programmmable
    buttons AND wheels. Worth picking up as a 'just-in-case-my-XXXX-dies'
    backup controller.  
    
    Real size keys. Sorry. Cant find anything wrong with it. Lynx is
    fine, and cuter (???) but costs almost THREE times as much.......
    
    come on, dudes.....so its the C-word......sheesh...
    
    good is good, great is better.
    
    ron
    

    The LN4's I saw were going for six...
    

    re .3:  Eh, what?  My SHS-10 has velocity sensing?  Haven't noticed it. 
    Where did you read this?
    
    	Eirikur
    
        

    RE:5
            Yes, Monsieur Schafer, you have indeed fully answered my KX5
    question. The small size keys don't really bother me since the only
    kbd i'm using right now is a cz-101. Actually I don't even use that
    since my midi guitar came along. 
        The KX5 sounds good except for the limited choice of transmission
    channels. I *want* that breath controller capability. 
        The Lync price is *too* high for what it is.
        The Casio? I'll have to try it. 
                                  
               Rich_who_has_a_two_week_old_baby_girl
               and_is_sick_of_changing_diapers_already!
    

    
    ok. at 'six', the LN4 is still 3 times the C-word AZ-1.

    If you shop.
    
    I dont like the AZ1 body shape as much. True enough.
    But if price is a factor......
    
    rr
    

    ok..ok.. I'll look into the LN4 too.......

    Looks like Casio has discontinued the AZ-1...so much for that!

    Velocity sensitivity on an SHS-10 - ridiculous !!

    What kind of incompentent buffoon would even suggest such a thing ?!

    (Embarrassed blush)

    OK, so maybe it isn't touch-sensitive. At least it's cheap !


    Humble cheers,

    Derek.

         Oh well......I could'nt justify a keybd. that did'nt make sound.
    got me a K5 instead. Thanx for the help!
                                                   Rich C
    .

    I'm up in 8500 training in Bedford. Found a local guy in B-town
    willing to sell his KX5 for $300 including an incredibly heavy flight
    case. Seemed like a good deal. Can't wait to get home so I can plug
    it into something!. 
    				Got_one_anyway_Rich

    I thought there was a more recent discussion on KX5 controllers, but I
    couldn't find it.
    
    I was playing around with several things last night (while researching
    "portamento") and found out some very interesting things about my KX5.
    
     1.	It *does* xmit active sensing messages (contrary to a posting I
    	made earlier/elsewhere in this conference), and I can find no 
    	way to disable them.  8-(  In other words, it can cause some
    	problems if it's shut off during a performance.
    
     2.	It always transmits a bunch of MIDI-gibberish when powered up.
    	I didn't spend a lot of translating it, but it looks like a
    	patch change command (based on the front panel settings) and
    	PITCH BEND (?!).  If I post it, does anyone want to have a go
    	at decrypting it?
    
     3.	It always transmits junk when it's powered off.  Again, I wrote
    	down the stuff, but didn't work hard at xlation.  It still looks
    	like pitch bend info to me, and it causes my MKS70 to crash and
    	burn.
    
     4.	I couldn't find a serial number on it *anywhere*.
    
    Comments and/or ideas?
    
+b

Re .-1
    
>     1.	It *does* xmit active sensing messages (contrary to a posting I
>    	made earlier/elsewhere in this conference), and I can find no 
>    	way to disable them.  8-(  In other words, it can cause some
>    	problems if it's shut off during a performance.
>    
>     2.	It always transmits a bunch of MIDI-gibberish when powered up.
>    	I didn't spend a lot of translating it, but it looks like a
>    	patch change command (based on the front panel settings) and
>    	PITCH BEND (?!).  If I post it, does anyone want to have a go
>    	at decrypting it?
>    
>     3.	It always transmits junk when it's powered off.  Again, I wrote
>    	down the stuff, but didn't work hard at xlation.  It still looks
>    	like pitch bend info to me, and it causes my MKS70 to crash and
>    	burn.
>    
>     4.	I couldn't find a serial number on it *anywhere*.
>    
     

	I have owned two kx5's.  I also have  a few friends who own kx5's.
All of the kx5's seem to exhibit the above mentioned behaviour.  Certain
kx5's also freak out Ensoniq EPS's and VFX's.  The problem is
definitely related to active sensing.  Solution: Spend $80 bucks
on a Pocket Filter, and filter out active sensing.  


					Mark...

    I wonder if it's worth calling Yamaha to see if they have a ROM update
    that *eliminates* active sensing and MIDImush.  I hate the thought of
    spending $100 on a stupid filter.
    
+b

    I couldn't find a note on the SHS-10...I though there was one somewhere.
    oh well...
    
    I was playing around with my nephew's (surprised my brother-in-law that
    the thing could actually be *played*) and was wondering about the
    control buttons on the handle.
    
    Do the sustain, portamento and vibrato switches send over MIDI?  I
    assume the pitch bender does...
    
    						Brian

Yes, the vibrato button does send something.  I think it actually sends a
hard-coded mod-wheel value, because my SGUs respond to it without my having to
do anything.  I think I have tested the sustain, too.

BTW, the pitch wheel is programmable for polarity via something really obscure
in the manual.  I assume that the bend interval stuff is local only.

	Eirikur

    
    
      The vibrato sends the max (127) on modulation. The pitchbend wheel
    is *not* local only, but works over midi quite smoothly.
      I picked up one for $39, disabled all dangerous neck-switches
    (like the start/stop), painted it black and glued on a few doll heads,
    cat's eyes and small plastic sheep.  Definately the strangest keyboard
    known to man.   
    
    
    
    RichC