Conference napalm::guitar

Tell your 'friend' to go for a Charvel dude !
;)

You knew I'd say that.

Also, Ibanez and BC Rich are EXCELLENT guitars... To me versatility is the key.  
A guitar that can have zillions of different tone configs is important to me.  

I always felt there were two types of guitar connoisseur...  There the type that 
wants a guitar for each sound (s)he wants, and ends up with a Gibson for the 
Gibson tone...A Fender for the Fender tone, and Rick for the Rick tone etc...

Then there is the guy who wants like one or two guitars that can emulate them 
all of the above with reasonable accuracy.  Not that either type is bad, because
the only way to get a Gibson tone is to own a Gibson; Bulldawg will attest to
that...But a Gibson will not emulate a Fender ya know ?

Just jc's $.02

    Personally I like my combo.   1 Strat and 1 Les Paul hey, it works
    for me...
    
    
    Don

      Ditto... If you got a strat (or strat clone) AND a Les Paul (or a
    LP clone) then you got all your bases covered. I prefer neck-thru
    style strats (like my BC) because I like sustain and I try to avoid
    that "too thin" strat sound. Heritage is supposed to have a decent
    LP clone, and the Epiphone version is somewhat cheaper. BC Rich
    has been thru some recent changes (see 1144.*) and I'm not sure
    what the future holds for them. There's tons of info elsewhere in
    this conference - happy hunting!
    						-mOoB- (TGIF)

    Les Paul. The Charvel is too much like a strat. 
    But I wuldn't say that all the bases are covered, 
    beside I don't like Gibsons. But a mahogany guitar for sure.
    
    

    How about putting 2 humbuckers on a strat type? :-)  Seriously, a
    friend of mine has a Zion Turbo (which is a strat copy) with 2 Seymour
    Duncan JBs on it.  Talk about unique sounds!  This guitar can get clean
    and/or nasty with the best of them.
    
    Mike

    
    Something else to consider???:
    
    I'm looking thru Charvel catalog and they have Fusion series which 
    is bolt-on, 24 fret, ***24 3/4" scale*** neck on strat body style.
    I would love to find out how this guitar would sound.  Haven't seen
    one, yet.  The Custom models have hum/single/single and the Deluxe have 
    hum/single, and both of these models' single coils are the "double 
    blade" type.  The Deluxe models only has one volume knob, pickup 
    selector, and NO tone knob, while Customs do have tone knob.
    Musician's Friend has these for $649-Custom, $549-Deluxe, w/case.
    
    I, myself own Ibanez RD340(my "main" guitar), RG440, Epiphone LP, and 
    I am in process of putting together another "Jackson Style" 8) with
    neck and body ordered from Stu/Mac.  Each one of these guitars have
    distinct sound, though.  Even my Ibanez' don't sound like each other
    at all(I think); 340 sounds more "modern" while 440 sounds more
    "vintage" and they both have splittable humbuckers/single/single.
    
    If I was in your friend's shoes, I would buy an LP next, then maybe
    a Ibanez, then a Charvel, then a BC, then a Steinberger, then a Kramer, 
    then a ..., then a..., then... the...th...t...  8)
    (Life of a bachelor guitar player, you know?   ;-)    )
    
    J.  who_likes_charvel's_old_logo_better
    
    

    Re 5  maybe right, if you like a strat then you'll like 2 more
    
    the most amazing stratclone i played was a kramer with 1 hum and 2
    singles stock SD coils. Something about the body was knarley resonant!
    
    Has anyone considered how badly we are all brainwashed by Les Paul |-) 

    Your *friend* needs an Ibanez RG550 ... maple neck with Humbuckers
    (for raunch), a single coil in the middle (for Strat attacks), a
    locking trem for bombs .... yep, that's what you need, 'scuse me,
    that's what your *friend* needs ... playing an Ibanez will make
    you HATE your guitar ... unless you already own one ,,,,
    
    
    			777Scary

    I'd take a different tact and suggest that your *friend* (have no idea
    why we are treating this as a euphemism) pick a guitar that lends
    itself to a different kind of approach and sound -- but one that makes
    sense for his music.
    
    You mentioned an ES-335, clearly lends itself to a different style of
    playing than a strat, but has plenty of range itself (B.B. King to
    Larry Carlton).  That sounds more interesting to me than a strat clone
    with humbuckers.  If that is the direction your friend is going (see,
    I'm still using the euphemism), I'd suggest a look at the Heritage
    H-535.  I went shopping for a Gibson in January and fell in love with
    Heritage instead.  Made in Kalamazoo by craftsmen who didn't follow
    Gibson to Nashville, it seems much better made (workmanship and wood)
    than new Gibsons -- with a sound and feel that seemed more like the
    better "Vintage" models.  I don't know whose pickups they are now
    using, but they have definitely cleaned up their act in that department
    over the last couple of years.
    
    Just a dissenting voice,
    
    - Evan
    

RE: .9

I agree... I got my Ibanez RG550 Friday.  I love it.

    Yeah Pat - Tell your *friend* to grab Coop's RG550 and give it a
    whirl with your Kitty Hawk ..... yeah, that's the ticket.  You don't
    mind letting your *friend* use your Kitty do you ?  What kind of
    friend are you ?	8^D
    
    				Scary

    
    	Sorry about the *friend* thing - I was in a weird mood that Friday.
    Thanks for the ideas.  I kinda feel like the ES idea would provide more
    diversity.  I already got a strat clone (and it IS an Ibanez!) with the
    splittable humbucker and 2 singles.  It is real nice Scary, but I still
    play the strat most the time... 
    	
    	Speaking of ES's, what are the basic differences between the ES335
    and the ES335-Studio version?  AMS says the studio model has no F holes
    or pickup covers, and it costs $599 (vs $1069).  Also, what is the neck
    scale?
    
    I love this conference!
    -pat

    Go for the ES, Patman.......I wanna borrow it already....no
    presumptions here, just wishes!  |)
    
    Steve D.
    
    P.S. Danny Weber can fill you in on the Gibson specs.....

    
    
    
    	I'm in the minority, but I'll fire anyway.  My "other than a Strat"
    is a Tele style with a single coil in the rythmn position and a
    humbucker in the bridge position...  I used a Fender re-issue and a
    Seymour Duncan Jeff Beck model on which I wired a coil tap.
    
    	I get squeaky clean Tele sounds PLUS the humbucker sound of a Les
    Paul.. really kind of fills in the ultra-highs and lows that my Strat
    misses... I especially like this guitar since I installed the gold lace
    on my strat (they tend toward the bass side).
    
    
    Steve

    After reading in here I'm at least not thinking anymore my
    5 guitar quiver is too many! ;)  I need at least 3 dozen more! haha

    
    All anyone really needs is a Danelectro, one pickup, every conceivable
    sound you'll ever need, and I only paid $10 for mine...

    re: .14  
    
    Thanx, Steve :-).
    
    Check note 1132. I think there was some mention of these guitars.
    
    Danny W.

    
    I agree with everything thats been said about Ibanez in this
    note.....Pat, theres no such thing as too many Ibanez's!!!!  I think
    you would love to own my RG560....its better than an RG550, its got a
    higher number.  No, really man, its yours....all you have to do is buy
    it from me....:^)
    
    And its not pink, either ;^)
    
    Dave

    A bddy of mine (thanks Mike ...) lets me use his RG570 as a backup
    guitar when I gig out ... for some reason it has a hard time ever
    making it back to his house !
    
    				Scary

The differences between the 550-560-570 lines are basically cosmetic
and in the pickup configs....

The 550 has a Humbucker - Single coil - Humbucker layout  
with a plastic pick guard and a maple neck.

The 560 (I think) is a Humbucker-Single-Single with no pickguard 
and a rosewood fretboard.

The 570 (I think) is the same as above with active electronics.

Did I get that right ??

They *all* have scrawny necks that need lots of attention...But play great
between setups.   :)

jc (Who loves his 550, buts had to tweak the truss rod already, but 
    doesn't mind)

    
    Thats right, my 560 has a humbucker in the bridge position and 2
    single coils, and a rosewood fretboard.
    
    Dave

    
    
    	The  570 has a different pickup config  Humbucker-single-humbucker.
    
    	I don't think they have active electronics.
    
    	M
    	 B

    How'd this become an Ibanez notes file??   Sheesh you guys!
    
    Pat, I KNOW what you want....we'll talk.  |)  8)
    
    Steve D.

    I'll only say it once. 
    
    Ibanez is CLAIMIN' !!!
    
    -Dave

    I agree they can claim a wicked bad tuning/action buzz if you're not
    careful!

Claimin' ??

What the hell is that ?

RE: -.1

Thin necked guitars are very sensitive to change in the atmosphere 
(i.e. Humidity)...  The RG550 I got from Buck was in need of a 
truss rod adjustment from hell (could be from being shipped across
the country!).  There was absolutely no relief to the neck, and was 
buzzin' around the 1st string 1st fret.  I fixed it, and haven't seen 
a change yet.  I also raised the action, Buck is the only guy I know 
who likes the action lower than me !  ;)  

The 550 plays great though, and is a real attention getter !

Here's a trick...  Go to Shipping and Receiving and swip some Silicate 
Desicant packets and throw them in your case.  The work GREAT !

jc

>Here's a trick...  Go to Shipping and Receiving and swip some Silicate 
>Desicant packets and throw them in your case.  The work GREAT !
    
    What the heck do those Nutrasweet packets do anyway?  Are they odor
    eaters or what?

They suck the moisture out of the environment...They keep your wooden guitar
from getting water logged.  Most computers and stuff are packed with them in 
there.  If you work for DEC there is a zillion of them.  They all say:
"Do Not Eat" on them.  I guess they'll get into your belly and suck up all
the liquid...  

Hm... could be perfect for those long nights of beer drinking...

jc

    
    Last night I got out my tres amigos polishing kit and cleaned up my
    strat and my ibanez...
    
    
    
    
    
    I spent more time polishing the strat  ;^).
    
    
    -pat (headed for ES-ville)

But ya can't teach 'em to play Metallica on an ES...

:)

    Why would anyone want to learn Metallica?   ;^)  sorry Coop....had to.
    |)
    
    Bulldawg (asbestos suit ready)

Cuz it takes talent to play Metallica...

jc 

(who sez: speed and dexterity blows away measures and measures of whole notes)

Psssssssttttt....Backatcha...   ;)

    Metallica is for frustrated Stravinski listeners!

Stra who ??

;)

jc (Who sez emotion and speed in one killer package = Metallica)

    RE: "Takes talent to play Metallica"....
    
    So Coop, are YOU gonna learn some?    8)
    
    Sd

Naa-nee-naa-nee Boo Boo, dude...

I already know some.  Lots, in fact.  I call it Frayed Ends Of Sanity !

;)

jc (who sez: Metallica IS clapton at 78 speed...It's all a front.  :)

    I played an Ibenez the other day, big deal.
    

<<   I played an Ibenez the other day, big deal.
    

There's a fairly ambigous statement!

RE: -.2

I played a BC Rich for 4 years...  Big deal.
The Bich was a nice axe, but so isn't the Ibanez...

Toenail, you pickin' fights again ?

Agagagagaga...
;)

    
    
    	I need professional help, now.  I just spent a while at my local
    Fender dealer playing Strat pluses and they absolutely blow my
    home-made strat away...  I'm getting tired of trying to make my
    Stew-Mac strat sound like a Fender.... <sigh>...
    
    	Ummmmm..... Deeeeeear, I'll be needing ummmm... 650 bucks for a new
    guitar please.....

Bull-pup sez: $600 is more like it.

Go for it dude !

jc

    Has anyone seen the Hybrid strat (from Warmouth parts) living at Mr.
    C's yet??  Birdseye Maple neck/fingerboard, and a curly maple body,
    both with a *fine* satin finish...NICE!

    Yea I saw that strat and it's AWFUL expensive .
    You could get the parts and put it together cheaper.
    I must say the wood grain is tremendously gorgeous, but
    I wish it had chrome hardware.
    The neck is also set into the body so about 1/4" of the neck ( not
    fingerboard ) sticks out of the neck route cavity, OK for pulling up,
    I guess. Must be bright as the sun in the Gobi Desert, all maple!
    
    Oh BTW you guys I meant I played an Ibeniz it was 850$ and I
    didn't like it, it was OK but didn't send me into space or
    anything.  What REALLY surprized me is it seemed to have a 
    nut spacer already installed!  
    
    
    
    What kind of Bich did you play, a bolt on ( jap imitation )
    or the neck-thr? How waws the neck? Mine is shaved, and therefore
    delicate ( I don't like to even take it out of the house anymore )
    but stock BC's have a neck too thick for my taste.
    What kind of wood was it made out of?
    
    ( so do LesPauls, but some sound Excellent, so i don't care )

     
    re; .41
    
    Hey, Steve !  How did your Stew Mac guitar turn out?  I'm in the 
    process of putting one together (bought body and neck; both Jackson 
    style) with EMG 81, Floyd Rose (managed to recess this).  So far, 
    I just have to wait for the grover tuners ($32.00!!!) to arrive, and 
    I can't wait!  (I had to order new tuning pegs since I bought a 
    reverse headstock neck ;)  )  The rest of the guitar is painted, 
    assembled and sitting pretty in the stand (I wouldn't boast of the 
    paint job, I'm not a painter!).  
    
    So did ya like your project?  Didya? Didja?  Huh?  Didja?  Didja?
    
    J.

        Re Strat prices...
        
        Someone mentioned $650 and then someone else said $600.
        
        My G&L  Skyhawk  was  listed  at  $875, on sale for $650;  hard
        haggling got them  down  to  an even $500 for the guitar and an
        excellent case, with a  couple of sets of strings thrown in, so
        it looks like they're really  flexible  about prices these days
        if you're prepared to push it.
        
        FYI/FWIW
        
        Andy
        

    I bought a primo used one Saturday for $300.  Back to basics !
    
    
    				Scary

    
    
    
    	Coop... thanks...
    
    
    	J.
    
    		I've had a mixed experience with Stewart Macdonald.  Their
    customer service is excellent, and I've felt like they are really
    concerned about my being satisfied.  The first guit I built was a tele
    copy, rosewood neck, and it cam out beautifully... the sound from this
    guitar is really excellent, and it represents a value to me.  (however,
    read on...).  I've had a different experience with the Strat that I've
    just built.. Same stuff, rosewood neck, and Lace sensors.  This guit
    sounds really muffled tone-wise, I know that it's the neck (finally)
    but i don't know why.. It just sounded like shit, the way I had it and
    I've spent a lot of time trying to make it sound like a Strat..
    frustrating......   BTW, I liek playing Clapton, SRV, etc.. so a littel
    extra bass ain't a problem, knowhatimean???
    
    	So, after a lot of thinking, I've gone an laid away a deluxe
    standard strat (standard with lace-sensors).. I don't whammy anyway, so
    I left off the roller nut and all that other stuff.  I had to play a
    few, to find the one I wanted.. and I guess that's the issue for me,
    when I mail order, I'm taking a chance that the guitar I build could
    sound like crap... what the heck, the tone thing is mostly black magic
    anyway, right.
    
    	I've had a GOOD, experience with SM, but I'm winding up selling
    both guitars to finance my Strat... and over the long run, I would have
    spent a lot less if I'd just gone out and bought a real Fender, and
    that's part of the deal.
    
    	BTW, the tele is still a cool sounding guitar, and I really wish
    that I didn't have to sell it, but it's economics!!!!  <grin>... I'll
    admit it, half the fun is waiting for stuff anyway...
    
    
    
    Steve

    I've got an Ibanez Saber and a Fender Strat, and my Ibanez is number
    one. It's got the wickedest thin neck for holding those contortions.
    I've got the action on mine set fairly high as I like to play that
    dynamic clean sound, so I've had very few problems with adjustments.
    
    The first one I got had a problem with it, the truss rod topped out
    before I got enough bow ( and I need quite a bit ) but wurlies replaced
    it for me with only minimal stupid gestures.
    
    I don't use the diving bar a whole lot, but the nut locks help the
    thing stay in tune (I knock other guitars out of tune in nothing flat).
    
    
    Anyways, avoid those club necks with hi tech gizmos. I've been
    unimpressed by many a new offering. At high volume, sustain isn't your
    biggest problem, anyhow. Ibanez makes the best feeling guitars, IMO.
    
    						John.

    
    
    
    	Did anyone ever just buy a guitar (in my case, the process is more
    a "plead/lay-away" if you know what I mean) without having any idea
    that you were going to??   I did....  
    
    	I was coming back from visiting my layaway (my new strat, deluxe
    standard) at an out of town music store, and stopped in my local music
    store to visit my guitars that are on sale (so I can pay for the
    Strat.. you guys still with me??).... and there was an Aria Pro II
    TA/60 guitar... it looked good, it played good, it did everything good. 
    This guitar is a bolt on neck copy of an ES-335, black with gold
    hardware, white bindings etc.   and plays as good as any guitar I've
    seen.  I couldn't think of a good reason not to buy it so.. I did. 
    Sheesh.. I don't know if I want a gibson type guitar... but I got one. 
    The price was $250 (cash today, grin, the guy knows I've got no cash)
    or $300 lay-away... sooooo.. I laid it away (but I got to take it home)
    is this making any sense???    What I want to know is:
    
    Has anyone heard of these guitars???
    
    
    How bad did I get screwed on this deal....??
    
    
    
    Steve

Every Aria I ever played was nice...Real nice.  Steve Dandrea had a 
LP copy by Aria, and his was nice too.  

I think the price you paid was fair...

jc (Who is familiar with creative financing  :)

    As jc said, I had an Arai Pro II Les Paul copy.  It was black with gold
    hardware and a Kahler locking trem.  Nice playing axe, but I never
    really "loved" the tone.  It can't touch the tone of my Gibson Les
    Paul.
    
    Steve D.

> I had an Arai Pro II Les Paul copy.  

I have one of these also! It was the first guitar I bought, back in 1979. 
Its actually quite a nice guitar. True, it doesn't sound quite like a LP, 
mainly I think because of the pickups. But I still like it a lot!

I'm thinking of raising the action on it way up, and using it as a guitar to 
play slide on.....

Alan S.

    
    
    
    	Alan, I was surprised to hear you say:
    
Its actually quite a nice guitar. True, it doesn't sound quite like a LP, 
mainly I think because of the pickups. But I still like it a lot!
    
    
    	Because I was expecting you to say that the bolt on neck made the
    difference in tone... and (hey, I'm learnin') that the pickups are
    pretty much the same..    Why wouldn't neck through vs. bolt on be the
    biggest contributor to the difference???  Please don't feel like I'm
    trying to be a disagreeable SOB, I'm just curious (being... ahem....
    the new owner of a gibsonlike guitar myself)..
    
    
    Thanks,
    Steve

    Well for one thing, Steve, Les Pauls aren't neck-thru, they have the
    necks glued in (I know, big fornicating deal).  Just a nit...
    
    A friend of mine had an Aria 335 copy a few years ago.  It was this
    totally sick Green sunburst color, but it played nice (after I worked
    on it many long hours for him) and sounded pretty good.  He paid $100
    for it...
    
    He since sold it, but I wish I had it now!
    
    Greg

    
    RE: .48 
    
    Yeah, Steve!  Part of it is waiting for the parts!  But if I had things
    to do over again, I'd go out and buy another guitar.  Only thing is
    that I had this Kramer Focus 4000 Rhodes V with Floyd on it(paid $120)
    and I was trying to sell that.  Well, no takers!  So instead of having
    a guitar that I didn't use, I figured that I'd build one with mostly
    parts off the Kramer.  So far, I've invested about $280 on all the 
    necessary parts!   I think I did OK...?
    
    J.

    My first electric was an Aria pro II LP copy. To this day I don't know
    why I ever sold it. I had got used for $100.00 and it was just plain
    nice.
    
    rj

re: Steve

> Because I was expecting you to say that the bolt on neck made the
> difference in tone... and (hey, I'm learnin') that the pickups are
> pretty much the same..    Why wouldn't neck through vs. bolt on be the
> biggest contributor to the difference???  

Well, first off, thanx to Greg for saving me on this question! (I had no idea 
how much the bolt-on vs. neck-through would be!)

The main reason I mention the pickups is because the Les Paul I have is a 1970 
Deluxe model, and comes with those classic 'soapbar' pickups that many people 
talk about, and I think that is one of the major reasons I love the guitar. 
These things sound killer! 

The Aria pickups probably *are* fairly similar to the standard LP humbuckers 
nowadays. I'll bet Aria sounds a lot more like recent LPs than my older one.

Alan S.

Why does eveybody think that the wood and neck is so important to tone ?
Granted a heavy guitar sustains more than one made of Balsa...But if you 
ask me, the tone comes from three things:

Your amp/effects
Your fingers
Your pickups

Differences in woods would be VERY subtle in comparison to the above items.
All the hype about glue-ins, bolt ons and neck thrus...Bah-humbug !
I think neck thrus are nice, but not for the tone...I like the way they
are nice and smooth around the heal...

IMHO, Gibsons sound like Gibsons because of the pickups.  Fenders sound 
like Fenders because of the pickups...Rickenbackers sound like Ricks cuz 
of the...wait a sec...  ;)

jc

Actually I disagree a bit on tone.

Strats made of alder sound radically different than strats made of ash (to me)

If strats were neck through or glued rather than bolt on they'd sound 
considerably different too (IMHO based on a custom neck through strat I once 
played)

Rosewood necks sound different from maple necks. Ebony too...

Pickups and amps make the most radical difference in sound of any componant
but wood is definately important.

dbii

    
    I'm with Coop!  Someone else playing on my set up doesn't quite get 
    the same tone as I do.  I remember reading an article on Ed VH, and
    he said that Ted Nugent really digged the tone out of Ed's setup, and
    Ted plugged in, it still sounded like Ted's tone...
    
    My Ibanez is a bolt-on, and also *ALOT* lighter than my Les Paul, but 
    so far, I have had no problems with sustain!  Once I brought a tape in
    for my instructor to listen to, and he asked me what type of compressor
    I was using.  He was amazed when I told him that I wasn't using one!
    Personally, I think the sustain I get out of the Ibanez is largely 
    due to the Floyd Rose; it's density, springs(vibration?), and the 
    lock nut.
    
    I think that the finger board has alot to do with the tone, also...
    
    J.

Yep.  Scary has the Scary tone, Bulldawgs got the Bullish tone, I've 
got the sick "I'm gonna blow any second" tone...  ;)  I pinch so many harmonics
that I could make a Cello sound like a Tele.  Agagagaga... sounds like a piglet
on the way to the slaughter house.  ;)

Yeah, dbii I feel that wood does make a diff, but it's not nearly as 
drastic as FX, Amps, and the way you play.

jc

    
    With the new effects processors...you can take a "sears" and make it 
    sound good.  I agree that on guitars, the wood makes a difference
    to the tone. I think that guitars, need less low end, so they have
    a cutting edge sound.  The lighter the wood, the less they sustain the 
    low end.  Unless you like the murky Gibson Les Paul sound (heavy axe)!
    
    I would think that wood would (no pun intended) make a difference on
    BASSes also, because of the depth needed to give a BASS a deep
    presence, even while shouting out high klanky high end.
    
    I use a Guild Pilot BASS, and even though it plays great, sounds great
    with active electronics and all, it doesn't have the mid to low tone that 
    I used to get from an old Ibanez I used to play (passive electronics) that
    weighted *500* pounds. 
    
    But one thing that I've noticed is that the sound of the strings does
    'pass' through the body of the guitar...have you ever tried....
    Putting your ear to your guitar body (I usually do the top horn)
    and hit your strings....try it.  
    
    Ron.

	We've been thru this before!

	There are a bezillion variables.

	Let's go back to the other rathole - the one about why I play
	my wife's SG very differently from the way I play me Rick. ;-)


	I personally think every single guitar is different and part
	of the adventure is exploring a particular piece of wood,
	learning what it can teach you, and moving on to the next. I've
	always had a fondness for SGs and the variations are incredible.
	I think I've unearthed what it is that gives me the creeps about
	synthesizers. I like the woodyness of it all.

    I think one rosewood neck and one maple neck covers the portfolio
    nicely. Other tonal variations can be made with out board processing.
    Fer example, various pickup variations can be done with comb filters.
    
    							John.