Conference hydra::amiga_v1

    What do color splitters go for? 
    
    ...Rich
    

I have one, too, and am very happy with it.  It costs around $80.

    $85 at the Memory Location.

    Can one of you explain to a novice what this actually does ?
    
    Thanks, Bob

    If I get it right, it looks like that you can use Digiview to
    digitize video from your home video camera of even a VCR. 
    Previously, there was a requirement to use a black and white camera
    and a color wheel. The camera does not come with Digiview.
    
    What I believe a color splitter does is to split the composite video
    signal up into a red, green, and blue signal.
    
    Question: What are the logistics for using the splitter? ie Are
    there three connector that you play swap the cables with or is
    there some sort of a switch?

    
    ...Rich

    Pretty simple ...
    
    1. Plug VCR (or other device) into Color Splitter.
    
    2. Plug color splitter into DigiView.
    
    2. Plug Color Splitter into monitor.
    
    3. Plug Power cord into Color Splitter.
    
    Digitize by doing three passing (changing RGB switch position on
    front of color splitter). If you have perfect vision, the process
    is automatic (no switches) and takes 2 seconds for color and about
    1/30 sec for b&w.

    so all I need is a VCR with a reasonable freeze frame that will
    last for at least 2 seconds + Color Splitter + digitizer, right?
    
    Any recommendations for a VHS VCR with a good freeze frame for this
    kind of application?
    
    -dave

    I use a Sony EV-S1 8mm VCR with motionless still frame. That is
    how I captured TROI.ARC on pauly"amiga"::
    
    DigiView takes about 20 seconds for each of the three colors.
    Perfect Vision only requires 2 seconds. 
    

   I use an RCA HQ VCR (with three heads; i.e. nothing special)
   that has a motionless still frame, and get
   good results.  
 
   Obviously, you can also digitize directly from a video camera.  However,
   the resulting image seems to be grainier than an image obtained with
   a color wheel.  On the other hand, using the color splitter is
   so much easier than using a color wheel, I'll probably never use the
   color wheel again.  

   -- Joe Meyers

    Yet another option is to get the Frame Grabber, it digitizes color
    in 1/30th of a second in its frame buffer, then it takes up to 48
    seconds to transfer the data to the Amiga trough the parallel port.
    I bought one (got tired of waiting for a toaster) and all the people
    I showed the pictures to were quite impressed.  The only thing these
    devices are bad for is that they show how bad your video equipment
    is.  My camcorder is 4 years old and the resolution only at 230
    lines, that's why sometimes the pictures sometimes have the "jaggies".
    Next purchase is a high resolution BW camera (I can't afford a Hirez
    color camera)
    
    
    Jean

    
    I can attest to the high quality of the Frame Grabber results. 
    I saw a few 'grabbed' images at the Software Shop that actually
    were better quality than most of the better DigiView stills that
    I've seen.  There seemed to be no HAM fringing.
    
    Ed.

    interesting.  So the options are:
                   1. digitizer + color splitter + video source with
                                                   freeze frame
                   2. frame grabber + video source (doesn't need freeze
                                                    frame?)
    Prices?  latest Amigaworld ad from Create Computers
    has Perfect Vision for $170, Color Splitter for $80 = $220
    has Framegrabber for $480
    
    So 2 seconds vs 1/30th of a second costs $260.  I guess it's
    a question of is better quality worth $260.  It sounds like the
    output of the $220 setup is quite good.  Or are there things
    that you can do with the digitizer/color splitter that can't 
    be done with a Framegrabber or vice versa?  
    
    Either way, it's starting to get close to my toy budget price.
    
    -dave

    My Sony V9 color camera does a noticeably better job digitizing
    through DigiView with the color splitter than the Panasonic 1410
    with color wheel.
    
    What framegrabbers are all you folks talking about?
    
    Paul
    

    Re -.1,
    
    	The one we are talking about is a product called "Frame Grabber"
    and it is made by Progressive peripherals and software.  It can
    do real time video digitizing in color, from any NTSC composite
    video source.  The only thing this device does not do is capture
    multiple SUCCEDING frames, as I pointed out transfering a HAM picture
    can take up to 48 seconds, so real time succeding frame capture
    is out.  This last thing is only bettered by LIVE, but at the expense
    of lousy color, and even then only at 12 frames/sec.
    
    	The software included with frame grabber can do time lapse,
    Il'l try to upload some animation soon, so you can see the
    possibilities of the device.
    
    	As for cameras, I'm sure that the Sony CCDV9 would be better
    than my old Zenith, but even so, the horizontal resolution would
    not match a good BW camera.
    
    	So far I'm still in the experimentation phase, and lighting
    seems to be my biggest problem (as well as time, money....)
    
    Jean
    

    A while ago I invested in a Super-VHS camera/VCR/monitor.  These
    devices don't use NTSC, and so provide about 400 horizontal pixels,
    about 60% more resolution than can be broadcast from a U.S. TV station.
    I am currently waiting for a frame grabber+genlock that can input
    Super-VHS format.  Such a device should be capable of capturing
    a low-res Amiga image (320 horizontal pixels) in color.
    
    There are signs that the industry is aware of this market, but nobody
    is actually delivering product to stores yet.  System Eyes knows
    that if they can find such a box I'll buy it.
        John Sauter

    You can take a look at mtwain::user:[macdonald.iff]super.iff
    
    This is a poster digitized using a Sony V9 color camera, SunRize
    color splitter, DigiView interface, and ambient light (e.g., desk
    lamp). It's 320x400 HAM.

    Now how does how does all this compare to LIVE! (mail order
    price of $260)? It appears that LIVE! does not need a color splitter.
    I LIVE!'s picture quality the same as Digiview?
   

    Does anyone know of a source for the Sunrize Colour Splitter in
    the UK (PAL compatible)? The only colour splitter I've seen advertised
    is the Rombo VIDI-Amiga RGB Splitter - anyone got this one - at 70
    pounds.
    
    So what gives the best results :-
    
       (a) Digiview with colour wheel
          
    or (b) Digiview with colour splitter
    
    Thanks in advance,
    Barry.

    re: .18
    
    >    So what gives the best results :-
    
    >       (a) Digiview with colour wheel
    
    >    or (b) Digiview with colour splitter 
    
    The color wheel with the hires black and white camera gives the
    best picture, but you have to have an object that you can put in
    front of a stationary camera to use it.
    
    The color splitter allows you to take your camcorder or whatever
    and create your pictures anywhere, then bring them home, freeze
    frame them in the VCR and digitize them.  Since your VCR or camcorder
    usually have less resolution than the black and white camera,
    naturally, the results are not going to be as good.  With S-VHS
    or Hi-8 you theoretically should get almost as good results, but
    I haven't been able to get even acceptable results from my S-VHS
    machines.  I have to take my S-VHS footage and dub it to VHS to
    get the color splitter to work.
    
    Terry
    
    

re: .18

The hires b+w camera recommended by Digi-View (the Panasonic 1410) does have
far better resolution than most color camcorders, but I've experienced 
better overall results using the splitter with the color camera.  I believe
the problem is with the filters used in the color wheel.  Mine are made out
of cheap cellophane-like material mounted in a cardboard wheel.  I think
that they ruin the optics.  Also, the dyes used in the filters are quite
dark, and I find I have to open the camera iris wide-open, even with a
well illuminated subject.  The result is an image which is not as sharp as
the same image scanned in b+w, and inferior color saturation.

    re: .20
    
    > the problem is with the filters used in the color wheel.  Mine
    > are made out of cheap cellophane-like material mounted in a cardboard
    > wheel.  I think that they ruin the optics.  Also, the dyes used in the
    > filters are quite dark, and I find I have to open the camera iris 
    > wide-open, even with a well illuminated subject.  The result is an image
    > which is not as sharp as the same image scanned in b+w, and inferior
    > color saturation.
    
    Are you using florescent lights?  The cellophane lenses are made
    to work with florescent, where the old plastic lenses used incadescent
    lighting.

    re: .20
    
    Thanks for the info, Peter. I agree that digitizing with the filters
    does give a grainy appearance to the picture which is not apparent
    with black and white. It seems I have a few options open to me :-
    
    (a) Get better filters (and possibly better lighting)
    
    (b) use red,green and blue lights (has anyone tried that yet?)
    
    (c) get a colour splitter
    
        The third option is the favourite at the moment as it allows me
        to digitize direct off my VCR freeze-frame or my Sony TR55
        camcorder.
    
    Barry.

>    (b) use red,green and blue lights (has anyone tried that yet?)
    
    Yes, I use a small halogen desk lamp to illuminate flat objects such as
    photographs.  Because the light source is small I can hold the filters
    over it instead of the camera lense.  This gives a small quality
    improvement.
    
    Peter

re: .21

Yes, I am using florescent light.  I used to get better results with the
old plastic lenses and incandescent light, until I accidently dropped and
broke it!

I also have problems with 'hot spots', when digitizing photos with glossy
finishes. I suppose this could be remedied with an expensive rig which
holds a pair of lights off at an angle on each side.  Any tips on this?

BTW, the color filters can also be used for viewing stereo-digitized images.
Anyone else tried 3-D digitizing?

    RE: .21
    
    Hmmm ... if the DigiView filters are designed for use with fluorescent
    lighting, then why does NewTek sell a copystand with incandescent bulb
    holders?

    re: .25
    
     Those are suppose to hold round flourescent bulbs.
    
    							Ed
    

    I bought a nice color wheel from the Memory Location, it gives good
    results when I use the BW camera with my framegrabber.  The reason I
    use a BW camera is that the resolution is a LOT better than what my
    color camera (camcorder) gives, like 500+ lines for the BW camera vs
    250 lines at the most with the color one.
    
    Jean