Conference hydra::amiga_v1

    
    I was planning on doing this as soon as my copy of DEC STD 70 arrives.
    I'm interested in printing pics on an LCP01/LCG01 color printer here
    at work.  This is a high quality (and high $$$) color (ink jet?)
    printerwhich is just sitting here in our Learning Center.  Absolutely
    no one is using it and the demo prints look very good.
    
    Just last week I posted a note in the LCP01 notes file for advice
    on which graphics protocol would be best for me to try to go to.
    For lack of any better suggestion I decided to order DEC STD 70
    which someone in this notesfile suggested as the reference for color
    sixel.
    
    regards,
    
    steve mcafee

    
    
    	One way to convert IFF to SIXEL is to use the LA50 print driver.
    
    	You can copy the LA50 driver to your Amiga and select it.
    
    	There is a PD program that will re-direct the printer output
    	to a file. I think it is called CMD ( I'll find it tonight ).
    
    	You then use any Amiga program to print the picture.
    
    	The printer output file will be in SIXEL format.
    
    
    
    			Steve Peters
    

    RE .1
    The LCG01 
    *supports UIS(VAXstation II/GPX interface),ReGIS,GIDIS,NAPLPS,and
    Color Sixel graphics protocols.
    I am not in the least familiar with these protocols,but for those
    of you that are ....
   
    
    

    re: .2
     CMD??? Where is it? It must of slipped passed me in this conferance.
    
    ...rich

Either:

Directory WJG::DUA1:[AMIGA.USENET]

CMD.SH;1            


or:


Directory MVCAD3::USER0:[AMIGA.USENET]

CMD.SH;1            

    re: .5
    
    I a bit rusty. Is CMD.SH some sort of compressed format? If so,
    what programs on the VAX and/or the Amiga do you use to decode it.

    Thanx, Rich
    

    
    
    	The xxx.sh files are in shar format. this is the format many
    things are sent over the usenet in.
    
    
    
    Another place 
    
    	mvcad3::user0:[amiga.ff95]cmd.arc
    
    
    
    		Steve Peters
    

    Many Thanx... Rich

    		I tried during the weekend the idea suggested of
    capturing the LA50 driver output, which would be a sixel output.
    
    	Well, after I created the file using the Graphic Dump utility
    of the WB and capturing the output, I uploaded the resulting files
    for viewing in my VT220. No success. When I do a "$ TY FILENAME",
    I get an error saying file record is too long. 
    
    	Has this worked for somebody ? What did you do ?
    Thanks for your help.
    
    Miguel A.

    
    
    
    	RE .9
    
    	First a VT220 can't display sixel files. You must have a graphics
    terminal VT125/VT240/vt241/VT330/VT340/vaxstation....
    
    Second the problem is the Sixel file doesn't contain <CR> so VMS
    thinks it's all one very long line. The solution is to insert 
    <CR> every 80 characters. Sixel will not print them and VMS will
    be happy. I have a VAX program to do this. I'll see if I can find
    it.
    
    		Steve Peters
    

re: -.1

I'll post a quick (25 line) pascal program to do just that if anyone is 
interested.

Robb

    		
    		Re: 10 & 11
    
    	Yes, I'm interested. Please post the programs to add the CR's
    to the sixel file.
    
    	Thanks.
    Miguel A. Alvarez

Extract, compile ($ pascal) link, and run this....

This is just a quick hack, so send me mail if you have any questions...

Robb
------------------------------------cut here-----------------------------
{ VMS pascal program to add a <CR> every 80 characters to a file }
Program AddCR(input,output,inp,outp);
Var
  Inp,outp:text;
  i:integer;
  input_file,output_file:varying[60] of char;
  ch:char;

Begin
  Write('Enter Input file name -> '); Readln(Input_file);
  Write('Enter Output file name -> '); Readln(Output_file);
  Open(inp,Input_file,OLD);
  reset(inp);
  Open(outp,Output_file,NEW);
  rewrite(outp);
  i:=0;
  while not eof(inp)
     do begin
        read(inp,ch);
        write(outp,ch);
        i:=i+1;
        if i>79
           then begin
                writeln(outp);
                i:=0;
                end;
        end;
   Close(inp);
   Close(outp);
   End.

    
    	Robb,
    
    		I compiled and linked, but when I try to run it I
    get the following error.
    
    
    ______________________
Enter Input file name -> nagel.six
Enter Output file name -> nagel.sixcr

%PAS-F-ERRDURGET, error during GET
  
File "INP"  Filename "DISK$USER:[MALVAREZ.SIXEL]NAGEL.SIX;1"
-RMS-W-RTB, 63431 byte record too large for user's buffer
%TRACE-F-TRACEBACK, symbolic stack dump follows
module name     routine name                     line       rel PC    abs PC
                                                           0000756D  0000756D
                                                           000029E9  000029E9
ADDCR           ADDCR                              25      00000125  00000381

    Thanks for your help.
    Miguel A. Alvarez    

oops, I forgot about the maximum record size deal with pascal.....

If you change the Open  statement in -.2 from

Open(inp,Input_file,OLD);

Open(inp,Input_file,OLD,record_length:=32675);

you'll be able to add carriage returns to files that have up to 32675 bytes
long [pascal rtl maximum], but your file is twice that size.  I'll get back to 
you when I find the complete solution.


Robb

    Please upload the compiled program!

    Maybe it would be easier to write a C program for the Amiga side
    of things that would convert the file before transferring it to
    the VAX?  That way, stuff like max buflen probably (I hope, at
    least) won't matter.  The files are probably small enough that two
    copies could exist on a floppy, or the <CR>ed version could be
    written to ram before DLLing.

    regards,
    -jim

VMS 'C' doesn't seem to mind huge record lengths, so a working version
can be found at...

mtblue::sys$userj:[Pfister_Rob.amiga.addcr]addcr.c,addcr.exe

Robb

(I'm not a 'C' wizard, but I think it could also run on the Amiga as-is)

            	I tried Robb's new version of ADDCR and it works !. After
running ADDCR on my capture file from LA50, I can just "TY filename" and
see the picture on my VT240. Thanks Robb.

	Miguel A. Alvarez
	

    
    I'm still waiting for a copy of DEC STD 70 so that I can read up
    on color sixel.  Apparently this is at the printer and it might
    take several weeks.  If someone has this lying around and wants
    to photocopy the necessary pages and mail them to me I'd appreciate
    it.
    
    steve mcafee
    Mail Stop:  LM02/E02
    DTN 296-5841

    I have it working now too. However, it isn't what I expected. Sort
    of a poor man's display compared to CRICKET.SIX_VIDEO. However,
    here's how to do it, thanks to Rob and Miguel:
    
    Needed:
    
    o  LA50 printer driver
    o  CMD for the Amiga
    o  ADDCR.EXE for the VAX
    
    1.  Go into Preferences and set the printer driver to LA50 and the
        printer port to SERIAL. Then hit the next Preferences screen and 
        select NEGATIVE image and GREY scale.

    2.  From CLI, run CMD as follows:
    
        RUN CMD SERIAL filename.SIX    where filename is the file where
                                       you'll send the printer output
    
    3.  Again from CLI use VIEW to display your IFF file. I used VIEW
        because SHOW won't permit a GRABbit screen dump from the keyboard.
    
    4.  Once the picture is displayed, do a screen dump. With GRABbit
        its CTRL-ALT-P.
    
    5.  Give the dump a few minutes to work. Then run your terminal
        program and send filename.SIX to your VAX.
    
    6.  Once the file is on the VAX run ADDCR.EXE. This program will
        prompt you for an input name (filename.SIX) and an output name
        (like filename.VID).
 
    7.  Now do  TYPE filename.VID and you'll see your picture appear.
        Well almost -- for one reason or another you'll see a slightly
        enlarged view encompassing approximately the upper left 3/5
        of the  original Amiga screen.
    
    Hints:  Make sure your terminal is set to monochrome. You can even
            display the picture while logged in using Liebow's VT2xx
            terminal emulator.
    
    Have fun.
    

    This might be another topic but...
    
    While addressing the technique of getting an IFF file to a sixel
    file (Amy --> VAX or Printer),  there is also a need to go the other
    way  (Sixel/Gidis/Regis --> IFF).  With GTOR and RETOS we can get
    most any format to some type of sixel. 
    
    There arte literally thousands of pictures out thers on the net
    that would make an ideal clipart collection on the Amiga for
    presentations, newsletters, whatever.  Is it at all possible to
    do something like this.  Ideally, a "super utility" on both the
    VAX and Amy;  On the VAX, to convert IFF to ANYTHING...  On Amy,
    to convert ANYTHING to IFF.
    
    Just a thought from a crazy person...... (drool..)
    
    PS:  If someone came up with such a beast, I volunteer to find/convert
    the pictures and supply them on-line (bribe..)  ;^)
    
    -john-
    

    re: .21
    
    If a person has an IFF file to be converted to SIXEL, would IFF_SIX
    work?  Doesn't that convert an IFF file to sixel format?
    
    If it does, then I don't understand the reason for the other steps.

    
    	Mark

    This sounds like a job for Leo Schwab!
    

Regarding waiting for DEC STD 70, you should be able to get all the information
you need by reading pages 231-237 of the VT330 programmer referrence manual
volume 2.  I'll copy these and send them off to you.

    RE: .23     The IFF_SIX program, as noted by the author, only handles
                one plane -- in other words no shades of grey or color.
                Basically a Pagesetter type black on white (or vice
                versa) line drawing.

I'd think the better way to approach this would be to write an
IFF viewer for a GPX workstation.  (HAM is a gotcha tho) that way
you'd get a better quality display to work with. Once a picture
is in UIS form you can use the tools already written to convert
to your favorite device.  (In specific, I am refering to the VWS
RENDER tool).  When I get ahold of the IFF specs, I'm gonna try to 
hack together the code to do that.  For going sixel->IFF, you could 
use grabbit with a VT2xx emulator....


Robb

    
    re: .26
    Well, let me ask you this then.  I have Logistix. I would like to
    print the graphs on my LA75.  I am satisfied with B&W as long as
    I get the graph.  Would using GRABBIT to store the file in IFF format
    and then using IFF_SIX to change to sixel in order to print on the
    LA75 work???  I hope so because I just bought GRABBIT because I
    thought it would.
    
    Mark.

    
    	RE .28
    
    	For IFF_SIX to work the IFF file must only have two colors. I
    wrote the program to work with PageSetter. To make sure this will
    work load DPAINT or other paint program and select two color mode.
    load in the picture and view it. If it looks O.K. save it and send
    it.
    
    		Steve Peters
    

    
    Thanks to whomever suggested the VT330 manual.  I found someone
    who has a VT340 and the manual does seem to have enough on color
    sixel for me to go by.   Unfortunately now that I've seen it, I
    have to agree with the suggestion to go to UIS format.  The basic
    problem with color sixel is that bits are still clumped in vertical
    groups of six and only two colors can be specified for the six bits
    either background or the currently set color.  With carriage returns
    I can possibly do a single row of pixels at a time, but it's going
    to make for a very slow picture.
    
    So where can I find the specification for the UIS format?
    
    regards,
    
    steve mcafee

    Do you really want to mess with UIS format?  Isn't it being obsoleted
    by DecWindows as we speak?  On the other hand, I don't know enough
    about DecWindows to know what the replacement for UIS format will be -
    perhaps some aspect of DDIF?

	Paul

    Besides, how many people have access to VWS???  Sure would be nice
    to have a generic tool...
    
    Will smokey display a regis/sixel file?
    
    

    re: .32
    Yes, it will display sixell files.

    
    I've written a IFF to color sixel translator.  It needs some work
    on the color map translation.  I haven't tried it on an amiga but
    it runs under VMS.  It doesn't do HAM yet.
    
    It's in ANT::LIB1:[SMCAFEE.PUBLIC]CSIX.ARC if you want to try it.
    Let me know if you have any problems.
    
    - steve

    I put another version of the IFF to Color Sixel translator in
    ANT::LIB1:[SMCAFEE.PUBLIC]CSIX.ARC.
    
    I've gotten some pretty good pics on both the LJ250 and the LCG01
    with this.  Runs on a VAX and still doesn't do HAM.
    
    - steve

    There are also a few mandelbrot pics in that same directory (*.ILBM).

    - steve

Just a few questions about CSIX.

	I'm using an LJ250 and getting a picture of the form
                 -----------------------------------
                 |  -----------------------        |
                 |  |                     |        |
                 |  |                     |        |
                 |  |                     |        |
                 |  -----------------------        |
                 |                                 |
                       .
                       .
                       .
                 |                                 |
                 -----------------------------------

  1. Is there any way to center the output  -> ?
  2. I'm not that familiar with the LJ250, is it normal for it to ocassionally
     slam up against the end stops? In printing BEAUTY.ILBM, it sometimes hits
     the end stops before printing the next line.
  3. Any thoughts on how difficult it would be to rotate the image 90 degrees
     and enlarge it to fill the page?
  4. Can you imbed Sixel output in a text file to make illustrated documents
     ( thinking of using Digiview to provide graphics to make manuals ) 

Any comments or corrections of misconceptions gladly accepted.

Dick

    re: -.1
    
    Since I haven't peeked at the source code to CSIX, I can speak with
    great authority :)
    
    I'd think it would be pretty easy to rotate a picture 90 degrees,
    and scale it (integer times).  
    
    If you read in the IFF bitmap as a two dimensional array, all you'd
    have to do is write it in column order, rather than row order.
    
    Robb

>    < Note 1074.37 by SPIDER::LONG >
>  4. Can you imbed Sixel output in a text file to make illustrated documents
>     ( thinking of using Digiview to provide graphics to make manuals ) 
>
>Any comments or corrections of misconceptions gladly accepted.
>
>Dick

 	Yes you can, in fact I just did it a few moments ago, with a
    drawing I created in my Amiga. But you need DOCUMENT. This is a
    DEC product, so you should be able to install it over the network.
    
    Sorry, I don't know where to find it. I'm just a recent user, still
    learning. But I'm sure somebody in this conference will Know more
    about it.
    
    BTW. Does anyone have the documentation for CLAZ ?? (the IFF to
    postscript converter). I have the executable, but somehow I managed
    to erase the doc file. Thanks.
    
    Miguel A. Alvarez

    
    Yes we could easily rotate and scale the image.  I've had that in
    mind, but just haven't had a chance.  Note that for the LCG01 this is not
    a problem since it can rotate and resize automatically.  I've gotten
    some really nice pics from the LCG01.
    
    I'll look at adding a qualifier to center the image.  Shouldn't
    be too difficult to add some white space in front of each line
    of the picture.
    
    The LJ250 slamming up against the end I believe is when it is picking
    up more ink.  This doesn't usually happen unless you have a pic
    which requires a lot of ink.
    
    I have sent mono sixel files into DOCUMENT many times and I don't
    see why it wouldn't accept color sixel.  However, I'm not sure if
    DOCUMENT supports the LJ250 so you would have to do greyscale images
    and send it to an LN03.

    - steve mcafee

DOCUMENT is at:

	CLOSET::KITS_:[DOCUMENT.V10]DOC010.*

However, this does not include LN03 support (fonts) - that another $1000.00
- yes - $1000.00

It does have TERMINAL, POSTSCRIPT, LINE_PRINTER etc..

DOCUMENT is fantastic. I've used it for specs. Draw some nice pictures
with SIGHT/GRED include them in a spec and the boss will love you!


John

In DSRPlus you can

.control characters
.rl "file.six"
.no control characters

to include pictures in a Runoff file. Looks good on a LJ250 but I haven't
worked out the fonts for the text on this printer.

	Dick

    RE: .41

    I'd suggest qualifiers to specify horizontal and vertical offset
    rather than centering (or, at least, in addition to).  This allows
    a user more precise control over placement, especially when the
    picture contains white space that would cause a simple centering
    algorithm to put the picture in what the eye perceives to be the
    wrong place.

    -jim