Conference tallis::celt

You think teh Arabs had it bad. You should read
the latest SAS book, The Nemesis File.

Simon

    Still no comment about the Sinn Fein death squads blowing up women and
    children, but you have time to regurgitate more anti-british
    sensationalist crap? Speaks volumes.
    
    Laurie.

RE:                      <<< Note 1588.0 by GYRO::HOLOHAN >>>
    
>> New SAS series: Thanks a lot, UTV

    [childish rhetoric snipped]

>> Next week on UTV: SAS: The Soldier's Story tells the heroic tale of how a
>> mere nine SAS men trained and equipped a crack squad of Ulster commandos to
>> take out terrorist training camps in Dublin and Monaghan in May 1974.
    
    That's what the British Army, and in particular the SAS is supposed to
    do with cowardly murdering terrorists. I don't understand the problem,
    from a *normal* person's perspective; that is one who does not have a
    severely diseased mind, and a warped sense of right and wrong.
    
    Terrorists, be they Irish, Arab or Martian (and I note your puerile
    chum fails to say exactly what flavour of terrorist we're talking about
    here) live outside the law, and ply their trade undercover. They force
    their will on the majority by means of force and intimidation, and all
    governments have a responsibility to stop them. If a few get topped,
    tough, they shouldn't be doing it. After all, if the Sinn Fein death
    squads regard merely being British as a crime worthy of a horrible and
    violent death, not to mention the even worse crime of going shopping
    with the wife and children on a Saturday afternoon, why shouldn't a
    legitimate Government regard the murdering of innocent civilians as
    something they should attempt to stop?
    
    You have a problem with that?
    
    Get a life.
    
    Laurie.

    .0
    
    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
    
    
    Absolutely clueless. You've been blown out of the water with your 
    pro-child murdering terrorist stance and you desperately, so desperately 
    try to switch attention away from the fact that you're wrong with a load 
    of meaningless twaddle.
    
    
    
    CHARLEY

    Hey Mark,
    
    Big Boys Games...Big boys Rules
    
    Shaun.

And the SAS really are big boys, so they really do Rule.

Simon

    >And the SAS really are big boys, so they really do Rule.
    
    And if they get caught then they get it in the neck like Capt Robert
    Nairac, okay?
    
    Disband the SAS, disband the Barmy, disband the IRA
    

    Kevin,
    
    I think its a tad unrealistic to ask a government to dispand its Army.
    The SAS is just an elite division of that Army, and similar such
    divisions can be found in any countries army.
    
    Now whether the SAS have a negative reputation or not is more the fault
    of those controlling the SAS rather than the individuals themselves. I
    am not for disbanding the SAS because they do what they are trained to
    do, and that is Kill....however I would prefer they were restrained.
    
    It is rumoured that the SAS were 'out of control' in NI and I tend to
    agree but the fault for that lack of control lies more opon the
    doorsteps of those in command of ground forces than the individual SAS
    members who simply interpreted their 'loose' commands.
    
    I'm neither defending the SAS or implying that any individual SAS
    members have never exceeded their briefs...in fact the tragic case of
    the farmers boy returning to an IRA arms dump (that his dad previously
    reported to the RUC) being shot by an SAS surveilance unit springs to
    mind. The arms could have been deactivated and thus there is no way
    that the official excuse "we felt threatened as the boy put his hand in
    the cache" can have any weight.
    
    Yet...the Army is trying to supress a terrorist organisation. The best
    means of supressing such an organisation is by the exhausting use of
    surveilance techniques et al. The SAS are specialised in such covert
    techniques and it is thus inebitable that they were sent to NI.
    
    To summate, I would dearly prefer more stringent control over such Army
    units so as to avoid the unnecesary death of innocent civilians...yet I
    am a realist and I can understand that the scene created in NI by the
    IRA leaves little room for small boys rules.
    
    
    All of the above can only apply to legitimate armys, by that I mean
    Armys belonging to recognised democraticaly elected governments.
    
    Shaun.

  Shaun,
    As much as I have disagreed with Kevin in the past, he's right.  All
  of the groups should be disbanded.

>    The SAS is just an elite division of that Army, and similar such
>    divisions can be found in any countries army.

  Yes, just like the SS was an elite division in the German Army at
  one time.

>   Now whether the SAS have a negative reputation or not is more the fault
>   of those controlling the SAS rather than the individuals themselves.

  And I thought we all bore responsibility for our own actions in this
  world.

>   Yet...the Army is trying to supress a terrorist organisation. The best
>   means of supressing such an organisation is by the exhausting use of

  No the best means is one that doesn't cause any further bloodshed, that
  is to sit down and talk with your enemy.  Even the British can't 
  continue to refuse to recognize the democratic mandate of Sinn Fein.
  They had 42% of the Irish Nationalist vote.  Why aren't they allowed
  to sit down at the peace table, so this war can be ended?

>...yet I
>   am a realist and I can understand that the scene created in NI by the
>    IRA leaves little room for small boys rules.

  This same logic can be used to justify the Irish Republican Army
  bombing's of England.

>     All of the above can only apply to legitimate armys, by that I mean
>   Armys belonging to recognised democraticaly elected governments.


  "legitimate army", that's a good one.  So, was the Iraqi army illegitimate?
  Is the Chinese Army illegitimate?  Was the American Revolutionary Army
  illegitimate?  You're a pip.

                       Mark



[Posted by WWW Notes gateway]

       <<< Note 1588.9 by NETRIX::"holohan@zko.dec.com" "Mark Holohan" >>>


>  No the best means is one that doesn't cause any further bloodshed, that
>  is to sit down and talk with your enemy.  Even the British can't 
>  continue to refuse to recognize the democratic mandate of Sinn Fein.
>  They had 42% of the Irish Nationalist vote.  Why aren't they allowed
>  to sit down at the peace table, so this war can be ended?


  But they had 15% of the overall vote..or is this figure  not important?


  Stuart

    Well said Simon, yet another example of double standards and hypocracy
    I think.
    
    Shaun.

    1588.9
    
    >Yes, just like the SS was an elite division in the German Army at
    >one time.
    
    Yes it was. What's that got to do with it? Why is it 
    that when you lose an argument you call everybody a nazi? Sad.
    
    >And I thought we all bore responsibility for our own actions in this
    >world.
    
    Yep. And the I.R.A. are the ones responsible for continuing the
    violence.
    
    >No the best means is one that doesn't cause any further bloodshed, that
    >is to sit down and talk with your enemy.  Even the British can't 
    >continue to refuse to recognize the democratic mandate of Sinn Fein.
    >They had 42% of the Irish Nationalist vote.  Why aren't they allowed
    >to sit down at the peace table, so this war can be ended?
    
    a/ Why talk with someone that refuses to stop bombing cities.
    
    b/ 85% of the Irish population do not want Sinn Fein. A weedy attempt
       by yourself to disguise facts.
    
    >This same logic can be used to justify the Irish Republican Army
    >bombing's of England.
    
    There has been no action against Republican paramilitaries for 21
    months. For 21 months the IRA have shot, killed, maimed, bombed. 
    Nothing justifies the IRA bombing England. Only cowardice.
    
    Your "boys" have screwed it right up for themselves. Gerry Adams has
    shot himself in the foot. They have no place in negotiations.
    
    
    CHARLEY

    Well said Charley.
    
    Laurie.