Conference quark::mennotes-v1

    My daughter was almost 4 years old when her father and I separated
    (soon to be divorced).  She didn't visit him for 6 weeks (her wish). 
    She decided after that point that she would visit (sleep over there on 
    weekends).  She and her father were not close even when he was with us,
    it sounds like your story is different.
    
    I can see now (over a year) that my daughter is STILL VERY CONFUSED.
    She keeps asking if her father and I will get remarried, and if we can
    go live with him.  She gets very upset when I tell her no and explain
    why (to a five-year old, this makes no sense believe me)...a friend
    gave me a book to borrow entitle Dinosaur's Divorce, that book has
    proven to be somewhat helpful.  I can give you the author if you're
    interested.  
    
    The time you are giving your daughter should be helpful, although I
    understand it is painful for you.  In all honesty it wasn't like she
    didn't want to see him because I had degraded him during that 6-week
    separation she had from him.  I think they get overwhelmed and feel
    torn.
    
    If you want the author to the book, send me mail and I will get it for
    you.
    
    Robin

I'm not sure if you're looking for a response, but maybe just
a reply that someone read, and is trying to understand how you 
feel will help.  

I'm not a BIG contributor to this conference, but your note touched
me.  I've got two kids, and a good marriage.  I can only imagine
the sting you feel when facing this..  

And your right, this could be hurting hurt, if not more, than certainly as
much as this situation may be hurting you.

Take care...

/r

    
    You have my simpathy. I just got my confirmation today from my divorce.
    It feels weird. I was married for five years. I'm sure you've gone 
    through the "I wonder if it's worth leaving my child stage". I have
    a two year old son. I love him more than words can describe. I stayed
    for a long time because I couldn't leave him, but I figure it'll 
    hurt him more to see us at odds later. I don't know how old your
    child is, but I do know that she's disappointed in you but
    she loves you. Just let her figure out how to tell you. HANG IN THERE.
    There is light at the end of the tunnel!

    I know the pain you're going through; it does get better....with time
    and understanding.  Your daughter is angry with you because she loves
    you .... she, too, doesn't know how to deal with this situation,
    therefore you must take the initiative.  Every situation is different,
    I would consult a counsler and ask how I could best communicate with my
    daughter -- talk it out and listen to what you're saying.  After it
    becomes clear and  somewhat less emotional for you, you can then talk
    with your child.  It's going to hurt in many areas for a while, many
    facets of life, but you will survive and you will become stronger in
    some areas.  You must try and find a way to communicate with your child
    and rebuild that bond of trust.
    
    May God give you a special blessing in your time of need.
    
    Best,
    
    Romy
    
    

    re-.0
    
    I also separated from my wife in March 91. No kids, but it's been
    rough all the same. Time does "heal" as the other noters have stated,
    but time also "marches on", to keep the cliches in order. As long as
    you continue to show your daughter how you feel and love her in spite
    of how *she* feels, I believe that, eventually, maybe things will turn 
    around for you both. All my hopes for you and yours...
                   

    Count me among the lucky ones that divorced without kids, too...  
    Hell, I'm having a b!tch of a time dealing with the fact that I had to
    give my ex my dog because I couldn't find a place to live that would
    let me keep him!  So I can only imagine what it's like to have your own
    flesh and blood in between the two of you...
    
    All the good vibes toward you, dude, and hope things work out... 
    Having the courage to write the basenote is probably a very good sign
    that you have the strength to work it out, given time...
    
    Dave 

    Hang in there, show her your love, give her  lots of love,
    
    i have my daughter in therapy, which should help down the line
    
    Take good care
    
    Jim
    

    I've been struggling to maintain a relationship with my children since
    the divorce... it's been three years now.  And things are worse than
    ever.  Their mom is leveraging them against me...irrefutable fact...
    
    Last week I received a letter from my 15 year old daughter which, in
    essance, said "dad... get out of my life."  
    
    Last night I called her and told her I wasn't ready to do that.  I told
    her I loved her, and hope that some day we can work things out.  (that
    someday will occur only after she leaves home, and the influence of her
    mom.)  I also suggested that if I were to "get out of her life" things
    would NEVER resolve.  I told her I intended on "being here" for her,
    even though "here" is more than 2000 miles away... and I would continue
    to keep in touch, as closely as she would allow.
    
    I am also employing the service of an attorney in Texas who will file
    for a motion to modify my divorce decree... the section which says I
    have full, unlimited access is worthless... it's going to be changed to
    state specific dates of visitation, and then if "mom" refuses to
    deliver the kids to me for visitation (which is what she is effectively
    doing), I'll go for custody.
    
    I'm through being hurt by this crap... time to load the guns!
    
    tony

Going for custody when your 15-year-old wrote a letter saying leave her alone?

I can well understand anger and a desire to modify the decree to get
(guaranteed) visitation rights, though.

DougO

re:      <<< Note 632.10 by FMNIST::olson "Doug Olson, ISVG West, UCS1-4" >>>

>Going for custody when your 15-year-old wrote a letter saying leave her alone?

    I knew this would happen... problem with not telling the WHOLE story... 
    
    explanation... the custody suit would ensue only if the ex intervenes
    with the new visitation stipulations... 
    
    of course a 15 year old can make her own decision... however there
    are other (younger) children also involved... and THEY should/can not
    make that decision.  The custody suit (unlikely, to say the least)
    would address them (at the least).
    
    It's a very, very complex issue, and I probably should not have even
    replied because the whole story (including her side) could not be
    adequately told in this forum...  
    
    but, I am hurt and angry over what has happened, and THAT is what
    motivated the reply.
    
    
    tony
    

Re:       <<< Note 632.11 by CECV01::BEAN "Attila the Hun was a LIBERAL!" >>>


>Going for custody when your 15-year-old wrote a letter saying leave her alone?

>    I knew this would happen... problem with not telling the WHOLE story... 


     I would not have even replied. 
    
     A 15 year old or any other child can be taught to hate, people are 
    taught to hate all the time, all of your knee jerk bigots are taught to 
    be that way. When a child feels this way without reason it is mostly 
    because of the custodial parent. And it is all the more reason that proves
    the custodial parent is not being responsible and most likely neglectful 
    in other parenting issues. Teaching a child to hate because you hate is a 
    very dangerous lesson to teach a child. 
    
     It is very unfortunate and illegal to alienate a child from a 
    parent. And denial of visitation even when the child is reluctant is
    often is grounds for change of custody wins in the sate of NH.

     My heart goes out to you.
 
    
    
    

    I wrote a very long note about my experience with divorce and how it
    affected my daughter.  I thought it might help, but then thought again.
    
    Maybe it is just better to tell you that, yes, it hurts.  Other people
    have felt the pain, including children.  We do get through it.  Please,
    help your daughter through it as best you can.  Stick with her.  Keep
    in touch with her.  It is not a decision that your daughter made.  She
    is not going to understand why it is necessary.  
    
    Whatever you do, don't give up on her.  She needs you now more than
    ever before.
    
    I can't tell you how happy I am that I fought hard for my daughter. 
    She is the most precious thing on this earth, to me.  I see her
    half-time now and she and I have a wonderful relationship.
    
    Send me a note if you need some support.  I will be here.
    
    Mark

    I agree, you must stick with her.  My husband has 3 daughters from his
    previous marriage.  He left the marital home and his X did create a lot
    of trouble for him - but he never gave up on them, even when they wrote
    him nasty letters, put the phone down on him etc.  He said that even if
    they gave up on him as a dad, he would never give up on them as his
    children.
    
    It has certainly worked, his eldest daughters a now closer to him than
    their mother and his youngest, aged 14, spends lots of time with us and
    talks about living with us when she is older.
    
    Don't keep away from her for too long 'cos then she will feel you don't
    want her.  Call her, even if it is a painful - please keep in touch. 
    Your ex may not be causing trouble, but if she is trying to convince
    your daugher that you don't love and want her, if she doesn't hear
    anything from you - she might end up believing her mother.
    
    Good luck - it's a painful time, I've been through it too.  It really
    will get better.

    I have joint custody of my two kids, 11 (boy) and 8 (girl) years old. 
    I moved out in March 1990. Fortunately, one thing my ex and I did agree
    on was mediation.  We have a mediated contract which we now need to
    take to lawyers. (Lynne Halem in Newton was our mediator; she's great).
    Both my kids are in therapy; and I am too.  I cant stand my ex, and it
    gives me great pain to have to deal with her.  But the kids are doing
    OK.  Maybe you could somehow manage to get to work things out through
    therapy, and work out a mediated contract with your ex.  The lawyer
    route will only bring much more pain, cost more money, cause more pain
    to the kids, etc.
    
   					 Good Luck,
    
    
    
    					Peter

    Peter,
    
    	Get use to it. You can never divorce the children and there will
    always be that rift between the opposing camp and yourself. 
    
    Good luck