Conference noted::equitation

    Marianne, I'd suggest *at least* getting a vet health
    certificate within 10 days of departure. As far as shots, the health
    certificate should say what ones the horse has had. I'd want to
    have *all* shots done and have recent (ie. within a couple of months
    minimum) Coggins test. The Coggins is pretty much required in most
    states but the time frame might vary. Most private carriers won't
    get stopped but a big or commercial rig might be more apt to (you're
    better off being safe than sorry!)
    
    Good luck and I hope all works out!
    
    Linda

    If it is a reputable shipping company they will know what the animal
    requires.  Be sure you have a coggins...
    Give me a call when he arrives.
    
    GOOD LUCK
    

    Hi Marianne,
    
    Your new horse sounds like he's absolutely beautiful !! congrats!!
    
    Well, from experience, you most definitely need a current coggins
    test and have it with you when transporting the horse. As far as
    any shots, I don't beleive any are mandatory for transportation. But, 
    it would be wise to have all his shots updated before transporting 
    him. Make sure you do this at least 1-2 weeks before transport.
    He may be one of those horses that gets muscle stiffness or just 
    plain sick from shots and you wouldn't want him to travel if 
    he wasn't up to snuff.
    
    good luck, Tina
    

    Thanks for the replies. At present he's just information.....
    meaning I have little elves keeping hold of him until I can 
    find out definately that he is available and obtainable. I
    really won't know for sure for another week or two, then I'd
    need to decide right away in order to get space on the trailer
    thats going out around the 23rd of the month..... will post a
    note when I find out for sure!
    
    -M-
    

    I AGREE WITH   RE.4  THAT YOU SHOULD GET ALL THE SHOTS. IT IS GOING
    TO BE A LONG AND TIRING RIDE THE THE ANIMAL AND THEREFORE HE WOULD
    BE MORE APT TO PICK UP SOMETHING ON HIS TRAVEL...THE OTHER THING
    IS TO REMEMBER THAT IT TAKES THE SHOTS ABOUT 14 DAYS TO BUILD UP
    IMMUNITY IN THEIR SYSTEMS, BESIDES THE STIFFNESS THAT SOME OF THE
    HORSES GET.
    
    I ALSO REMEMBER MY VET SAYING THAT MOST STATES REGUIRE A NEG. COGGINS
    DONE AND IT MUST BE WITHIN 30 DAYS.
    
    I WOULD AGREE ALSO THAT THE CARRIERS SHOULD KNOW WHERE THIS IS THEIR
    BUSINESS, YOU COULD ALSO CHECK WITH YOUR LOCAL VET. FOR THEY HAVE
    TO DO HEALTH CERTIFICATES ON ANIMALS LEAVING MASS. FOR OTHER STATES.
    
    GOOD LUCK, I HOPE THAT YOU GET THIS BIG GUY....HE SOUNDS REALLY
    HANDSOME, AND HE IS JUST MY HEIGHT....I LOVE TALL HORSES.
    
    

    A negative coggins test and health certificate are both required
    to transport horses from state to state. 
    
    The coggins test must be done within 6 months of the date of transfer 
    for some states, but for most states the test is valid for a year.
    However, please note that when the Vet draws the blood sample for
    coggins it is usually sent to a state approved lab to be tested. 
    In NH. the results are sent by the Lab via mail to the horse owner.
    I usually recieve the results approx. 10 days after the Vet draws
    the sample. I believe if you let the Vet know that you need the
    results ASAP for transporting the horse, that he can send the sample
    out air mail, alert the Lab to it's urgency, and call them a few
    days later to get the results over the phone. Once he has verification
    that the result was negative, he can write a note (kind of a waiver)
    declaring the horse has been tested and found to be negative..this
    should be permissable enough to transport the horse. Decide where
    you want the results send (Vet or farm in florida, or your address
    if you do as described above). You may need that piece of paper
    later in the year to transport your horse again. I might add, that
    it only costs me $10 for this test.
    
    Health certificates are usually required for transporting a horse
    or insuring one. The Vet has the certificate required to transport
    horses, and insurance companies usually supply their own form for
    insurance purposes. These forms usually ask for a brief medical
    history such as the last dates of shots and worming. Then, they
    concentrate mainly on the current health of the horse in question
    as found through an examination. After examining the horse, the
    Vet may complete the information on the certificate at his office
    and forward the certificate back to the farm within a few days.
    It would be wise as a previous reply suggests, to get this started
    at least 10 days ahead of time to give the Vet a little time to
    make out the certificate. Some vets will do it the same day.
    
    The minute you know the status of the horse, I would arrange for
    the farm to have the Vet out immediately to draw the coggins and
    do the examination for the health certificate. You could also have
    him given his spring shots if he hasn't already recieved them. If
    you have a couple of weeks before transporting...consider having
    the following administered also:
    
    Strangles - This will require a shot and a booster if the horse
    has never had a strangles shot before. Older vaccines required a
    series of 3 shots, but the newer ones only require 2. The shots
    are usually administered 3 weeks apart, but when this wasn't possible,
    the Vet has administered the 2 shots 2 weeks apart. It is effective
    for one year. My vet administers this one whenever one of my horses
    is going to come in contact with other strange horses at a stable, show,
    or due to transporting during the year. There can be side effects
    with this one (swelling in location of shot, stiffness, or mild
    discomfort). My horses have never had any of these symptoms.
    Read about this one in the notes files. Never administer this to
    a pregnant broodmare! (in case you ship one in the future)
    
    Potomoc Fever - The vaccine is finally available for this illness.
    Cases have been reported as far north at Conneticut. Since your
    horse is coming from Florida, you might check into this one. I just
    sent a horse down to Delaware and she was given this vaccine with
    her spring shots. It consists of a shot and one or two boosters.
    Time constraints probably won't allow you to consider this one.
          
    The spring shots you should consider are:
    
    Flu and Rhino - These shots are only effective for 2-3 months, but
    they will protect your horse against viral respiratory diseases.
    If your horse is going to be in contact with other horses during
    transportation, a vaccination against influenza is highly recommended.
    Rhino is often very mild in horses aged 4-10yo..so unless your horse
    is young(under 4) or older(over 10), this one may not be warranted.
                               
    These ones are up to you to decide:
    Tetanus - This disease causes paralysis and is almost inevitably
    fatal. This bacteria is present in high numbers in horse manure,it
    is found in areas contaminated by fecal material. This vaccine (toxoid)
    is effective for 1 year. Boosters may be administered if your horse
    suffers a severe laceration and/or deep puncture wound. What if
    this happens during transport? If your horse has had this one within
    the past year...it can wait until you get him home. 
    
    Encephalitis - Eastern, Western, Venezuelan. This vaccine is effective
    for 6 months. It is carried by biting insects. It is a disease of the 
    Spring and Summer. It should be administered 2 weeks before insect
    season, and again 6 months later. 
    
    As far as I know, none of the shots are mandatory. For my Filly
    I sent to Delaware she had the following done:
    
    Coggins Test
    Health Certificate issued
    Tetanus, Flu, Rhino, Strangles, and Potomac fever shots.
    
    Regards, Nancy
    
                  

re: .9, Potomac Fever

>    Cases have been reported as far north at Conneticut. 


	 I heard  last fall that there were Potomac Fever cases reported
     in Massachusetts.

    How about shoes vs. no shoes during long distance hauling?  I'm 
    going to be shipping my two guys out to Colorado in the middle
    of February, but I had my shoes pulled at the beginning of winter
    before I knew they were going to be moved.  Does this make a 
    difference during hauling?  Do the shoes give them any better 
    worse footing in a trailer? 
    
    Thanks!
    
    \Caroline

    
    	There probably isn't anything scientific... but I would think
    that you're better off hauling (especially long distance) barefoot.
    If for any reason the horses scramble it seems like they would do
    less damage to themselves if they were barefoot.  And, since they
    get the best circulation when they're barefoot, it makes since that
    a long distance haul might be less stressful (on their circulation)
    with no shoes.
    
    	Just my sort of logical mind thinking... like I said nothing
    scientific.
    
    	h
    

    Barefoot does seem to be better.
    
    Also, when I haul my horses myself, I ship them without legwraps.
    I must be the only person in the free world who does this, but I
    find that wraps and bandages interfere with circulation when the
    critters can't move for a long time.  But then, I'm doing the
    driving and I know how my horses behave.  If it's a new horse,
    bad traveller,  or a commercial shipper, I wouldn't recommend this.
    
    					-maureen
    

    Maureen...
    You are not the only one who ships without wraps.  I have seen more
    accidents with wraps because they have started to come undone.  The
    only time we have shipped with wraps is when we have a scrambler that
    gets banged up a lot or a real tough loader (wings around from side to
    side).
    We have had horses shipped from Kentucky and Illinois with no wraps and
    no problems.
    As far as the shoes go...I prefer barefoot for the same reasons.  They
    also have less chance of slipping on the mats, etc.
    
    

    
    
    I always ship a horse long distance barefoot.  They seem to be able to
    maintain their balance better and don't scramble around in the trailer
    as much.  The comercial shipper that I used in July, 1988 would not let
    me ship my mare with leg wraps.  I loaded her in the van with the wraps
    on and then took them off.  She made it to Colorado without a scratch
    after a trip of 1000 miles.
    
    Pat 

    	Another vote for shipping w/out wraps (from a died in the wool
    	leg wrapper of 20+ years)...  found that what they really need
    	is all the variables reduced which can cause shipping problems,
    	and wraps were one.  I have used bell boots and splint boots
    	on those who were potential candidates to step on themselves..
    	
    	I always believed (and Dr. Bob Orcutt was the one who told me
    	so but of course it was in 1960 sometime...) that they needed 
    	the support... but I've noticed that Dr. Bobs horses get off 
    	the commercial carrier at the shows with no blankets, sheets 
    	or leg wraps......
    
    	
    
    

    Thanks for all the information!  I thought they might have better 
    footing that way.  The only time my older horse ever seem to slip
    in the snow is when he has shoes on - even WITH borium on them.
    I won't be leg-wrapping them either.  I'll double check with the
    shippers about any other suggestions they might have.  I'm going
    to be using All State based out of Colorado Springs and I know they
    use climate controlled vans for 4-6 horses.  What weight blankets
    should be used?  Mine are used to wearing their winter blankets now
    and I don't want to take the chance of them catching cold while 
    going across the country.  
    
    Thanks again everyone!  I can't wait to get out there! :-)
    
    Caroline

    	
    	Caroline.. I think it would be worth a call to All State to
    determine what 'weight' blankets you should send your horses on
    their trip with.  You need to be concerned w/them being too warm
    as well as too cold... I imagine that the inside temp of the van
    is contingent upon the number of horses making the trip, the out-
    side temp, how much ventilation, etc etc... and the shipper knows
    his/her vehicles better than anyone.  Sure to be worth the call.
    
    	Let us know how it goes...
    
    	smiles - holly
    
    

    
    	If shipping with a commercial shipper - is there any difference
    	in WHERE your horse is placed in the van?  I mean, is the ride
    	better in one spot over another?  (example - middle of the 
    	van vs. the end or front)  We may be faced with relocating
    	soon and one of my horses is 35 and I want him to travel well.
                                   
    	I seem to remember something about shipping in EQUUS but I can't
    	seem to find it.
    
    	Susan
    

    Hi Holly!  :-)
    
    I will be calling All State to finalize more of the details and I'll
    be sure to ask them a lot of these details.  They sound like a really
    nice bunch of people and seem to give a lot more personal treatment
    than some of the other ones I called.  I guess I'm just being a 
    worried mama... -)  I want my guys to travel safe and happy and not
    get the sniffles on the way!  :-)  
    
    I'll be sure to let you know how it goes.  
    
    Thanks to everyone for all their advice! :-)
    
    Caroline

    
    	In regards to Kathie Nickerson's recomendation of Nation-Wide
    	Horse Transportation - is it:
    
    	Nation-Wide Horse Transportation
    	PO Box 5368 - Dept EQ
    	Colorado Springs, Colorado 80911
    	(719) 635-1888 
    	(719) 392-1888
    
    			????  I would like to make sure before I call...
    
    	Thanks for the pointer.
    	Susan

    Hi Susan, I got information from them as well when I was looking
    for commercial haulers.  I have all the info at home, so I'll 
    look it up tonight and can let you know if this is right, unless
    someone else knows off the top of their heads.
    
    \Caroline

    If you want info on All State I have that with me today and they
    seem like really nice "personal touch" people.  They are based
    out of Colorado Springs.
    
    Their info is:
    
    Reese's 
    All-State Horse Express
    P.O. Box 60400
    Colorado Springs, CO 80960
    (719)392-1234
    
    I can let you know the prices they quoted me to take my guys from
    Massachusetts to Colorado Springs if it will give you some idea of
    their prices.  
    
    \Caroline

    I'm asking this for a friend....this seemed the closet topic
    (moderator, please feel free to move it to someplace more
    appropriate...)

    Liz is planning on buying a horse, however she is also planning on
    moving to Montana (from New Jersey).  She has been taking lessons
    (English - jumps 3' or a little more) two or three times a week
    for a while.

    The question is:

    Should she buy the horse in NJ (where she has an instructor she trusts 
    to help her pick and choose) and then ship him/her out to Montana, or
    would it be best to wait to move, build up a rapport with someone
    out there (she knows no one out there, but she has scoped out someplace
    to keep the horse), and then get her horse.

    She would like to get the horse as soon as she can.

    Comments/advice??

    Thanks,

    Sue Barrett

    ps. I've been an RON ("read-only noter") in here for a month or so
    - you guys are great!  I started taking lessons (English) in
    November after not riding at all for 5 years.  Before that I took
    lessons for a couple of years.  Now I find I am completely hooked
    on this sport and these animals.  I can't afford my own horse yet,
    but hope to get one someday....

    If it were me I would wait. If she bought a horse and moved it, and
    then discovered it was a poor choice it would be most difficult to
    return the horse or sell it since no one knows her in the new place.
    Every horse I have ever sold I keep tabs on, and if someone found it
    did not work out I want the option of getting it back. I would not be
    willing to pay cross country shipping to do this.
    Sandy
    

     
    re: .24
    
    This is a toughy. 
    
    It kind of depends on finances, goals, abilities, and exact location
    she is moving to. 
    
    Colorado and Montana are not too different as far as availability of
    horses and instructors in the jumping/dressage realm.
    
    1.  Horses in Montana are generally much cheaper to purchase than back
    East.  And there are some EXCELLENT horses available.
    
    2.  However, finding horses with QUALITY jumping or dressage experience
    may be hard to find (and expensive) because there just aren't the number of
    qualified instructors as back East.  And the sources of jumping/dressage
    type horses is not as strong as back East (not as many sporthorse 
    breeders, racetracks...)  
    
    I would check out the area to where I was going to see what was
    available as far as horses and instructors and if they fit in with my 
    goals.  I.E., would I be able to find a horse in the area to fit my 
    immediate needs?  If not, where would I have to go to get a horse to
    fit my immediate needs?  
    

    Depending on budget - you can always get something up in Canada.
    I know a lot of people who buy horses straight off the ranch in Montana,
    but for very good known quality - there are several places in Alberta.
    Calgary is only 3 hours away from the border.  If you need any help
    up here, let me know and I can get a whole bunch of names - in most
    disciplines.  I may not know them personally but I may know someone
    who does.
    
    Linda

    
    I agree with the reply that brought up goals. If your friend wants
    to compete in whatever discipline, then I'd wait to build up a rapport
    with a new instructor. Coaches and training is very important.
    
    If your friend is a pleasure rider, I'm not sure it matters as much.
    However, a pleasure rider might want to go with the local scene.
    
    One thing - there are good horses everywhere, some disciplines are
    harder to find in different areas and the prices vary but their out
    there
    
    Nancy
    

    Re: the last few

    Thanks for your advice, I will pass it on to my friend, along with
    all the tips on long distance hauling.  She and I really
    appreciate it.

    -sjb