Conference cookie::notes$archive:cd_v1

    I have the three listed below.  I haven't listened to many of
    them recently, but my impression was that the ProArte was the
    best of the group.  It had the Atlanta Symphony and Chorus
    conducted by Robert Shaw.  The Phillips was a favorite I had on
    vinal, unfortunately it developed bit rot (must be too many
    cosmic rays up here :-).
    
Beethoven, Ludwig Van:

    	Symphony No. 9 in D Minor, "Choral"
		Denon 38C37-7021 (C)
		Philips 410.036-2 (C)
		ProArte CDD-245 (C)
    

    If you are a real nit for accurate rhythmns, held notes that are
    help long enough, and really clean attacks, then the DG copy is
    for you. I went to BCD, and previewed the 9th. To avoid my prejudice
    toward Herbert Von Karajan (I'm a big fan of his, and wanted to
    give the other conductors a fair shake) I had my brother cue them
    up on the CD played in the store without my seeing the version he
    was playing. It didn't take me long to figure which was which. The
    places I listened for in the 9th are all in the final movement. They
    are: 1) The Baritone solo 2) The Choral Fugue and 3) The end. 
    
    I listened to the Robert Shaw recording, a recording Bernstein made
    (the label escapes me) and the DG recording with Von Karajan
    conducting. Comments: Bernstein almost always rushes things. Bernstein
    considers himself an authority on Beethoven, and that may be so,
    but he still rushes things. Robert Shaw, who is noted for actually
    getting intelligible lyrics out of a large chorus, was really close
    to the mark, but lost it on the symphonic end when he let the strings
    actually get out of synch with the winds on the final rising scale.
    (Listen carefully, you cannot miss it. If you miss it, then it's
    to your benefit not to have such a discriminating ear) This leaves
    the DG recording.
    
    Von Karajan and the Berlin Philharmoniker are tight. Really tight.
    In an echo-proofed room, one of their cutoffs could produce a near
    perfectly vertical falling edge on an oscilloscope. It is this accuracy
    that really comes through in a large scale piece. The soloists are
    great. They check their personalities at the studio door, and actually
    blend well during the brief quartet toward the end of the movement.
    The chorus is excellent and their pronounciation is great (does
    it help that they speak German as a native language? :^) The recording
    is engineered well too. The DG engineers, while not the 'be all
    and end all' of recording engineers, are nonetheless among the best
    in the world. Consequently, years of experience recording this
    particular orchestra has paid off in producing an all around great
    recording of this piece. My one criticism of the whole recording
    is the forces involved. Von Karajan used the complete orchestra,and
    chorus to record the piece, as opposed to the forces specified by
    Beethoven. One can argue, however, that Beethoven probably would
    have appreciated a really large, and loud orchestra.

    Note: the Berlin Philharmoniker under Von Karajan is not the only
    orchestra I'd recommend. If you by discs by artist, rather than
    label, I'd reccommend the following groups as 'you cannot miss with
    these guys' groups.
    
       The Academy of St. Martin in the Field - Neville Marinier cond.
    
       The Cleveland Symphony Orchestra - George Szell cond.
    
       The Chicago Symphony Orchestra - Sir Georg Solti cond.
    
    pre-CD guys (available only in lo-Fi or no-Fi)
    
       The NBC Radio Symphony Orchestra - Arturo Toscanini cond.
    
       The Boston Symphony Orchestra - Charles Munch cond.
    
       No, I don't like Bruno Walther. Serge Koussevitsky (sp?) did well
       with the BSO too.
    
    David
       

    Begging your indulgence, but since this is a note about Beethovens
    9th...
    
    I have a friend (sure you do) who WANTS the version of the 9th with
    the chorale parts done by instruments.  He insists that there is/was
    a version used for either the opening or closing of the Olympics
    that had brass? where the voices normally are?
    
    Anybody out there heard of this?
    D

    The Chorale-tune (often referred to as "Ode to Joy") from the Ninth
    symphony has been bastardized any number of ways -- look in 3/4
    of all modern church hymnals, for instance.  I've never run across
    a bastardized version of the entire symphony though, and suspect
    that the "Ode to Joy" is what you have in mind.  I've got a brass
    quintet arrangement/bastardization, and I'm sure recordings of such
    things exist too.  I don't happen to know of any (mental block?).
    
    			George

    re: .3
    
    May not be exactly what your friend had in mind, but the soundtrack
    to A Clockwork Orange had a synthesized 4th movement.  No real voices, 
    but W. (I think this was in the Walter days) Carlos did an intriguing
    job of creating vocal textures.
    
    dq

Another good version of the 9th is the DGG recording by Karl Bohm (no
unlauts on this keyboard) and the Berlin Philharmonic.  I much prefer
Bohm to von Karajan.

My favorite version was an old 1958/9 version by Fritz Reiner and the
Chicago Symphony.

Dirk

    Don't need em (the umlauts, that is). Just stick an 'e' after the
    vowel in question - Boehm, for example. Perfectly Kosher.
    
    wrh
    

*< Note 856.7 by JANUS::HUDSON "William Hudson, REO-G/F2 DTN 830-3101" >
*                           -< An Umlaut Substitute >-
*
*    Don't need em (the umlauts, that is). Just stick an 'e' after the
*    vowel in question - Boehm, for example. Perfectly Kosher.
*    
*    wrh
    
Not if you are a purist!

[;^}

Dirk

Purity has nothing to do with it.  Putting the "e" in there really is
quite acceptable.  German language newspapers do it all the time,
especially on capital letters.

    Oh but you see the software delivery people in field offices only
    have vt100 - won't want them to use anything the customer might
    have after all that would destroy all the fun of on  the job discovery!

    
    Re: .2 note    I own two copies of the 9th, Herbert Von Karajan
    & the Berliner Philharmoniker and Robert Shaw & the Atlantic Symphony.
     I agree that Karajan's version is a little more precise, but I
    find that when I want to hear this symphony I almost always reach
    for Shaw.
    
    Is it possible for a conductor like Karajan (who is often accused
    of sacrificing emotion for the sake of precision) to lose the emotional
    content of such a great work?  I don't know, but the Shaw version
    always gets me a little higher.
    
       Marty
    

    The Fritz Reiner recording of the 9th is out now on an RCA Papillon
    CD. The sound is just barely acceptable--the old shaded dog version
    is much, much better. But with the CD you get no surface noise,
    and you don't have to get up twice (once to change the record and
    once to turn the second record over)--but you also DON'T get the
    filler: Beethoven's first symphony. But it is a good performance.
    (My favorite is the one on London Stereo Treasury conducted by Ernst
    Ansermet with Joan Sutherland--a very, very young Joan Sutherland
    at the absolute peak of perfection. But if you don't have first-class
    equipment to play records on, don't bother to buy it--you probably
    won't hear anything but surface noise.)
    
    Jack Truslow
    

    Has anyone heard a new 9th conducted by Roger Norrington?  Have
    read good things about it in both the Globe and the Times.  It's
    on Angel or EMI.

    To answer my own earlier question (thanks to a fortuitous Christmas
    gift) -- and because others may be interested:
    
    Roger Norrington's 9th on EMI is excellent.
    
    It uses original instruments, and looks very closely at the tempos
    written in the score -- the notes claim that other performances
    take major liberties with the musical pace.  The performance works
    outstandingly, and is also an interesting counterpoint to more
    traditional performances.

    
    re:  Roger Norrington's 9th
    
    I read a review in [I think] the Boston Globe a few weeks ago of
    this work.  
    
    They raved about it.   Especially the adherence to the tempo as
    originally intended.
    
    -Don-