Conference rdvax::grateful

I first saw Slipknot at the Sit N' Bull in Maynard in early 1987, I think it 
was March. They were pretty good but the Sittin' Bull was the Pits. Next I met 
Bruce in April or May of '87, I had several dozen Alpine Valley tickets and he 
needed some so we hooked up for lunch. After that I saw them a few more times 
in a few more places and did lunch with Bruce several times. He mentioned that 
Slipknot was looking for a manager. I said that I knew someone who managed a 
couple of Reggae bands and might be interested in picking up another act. Well 
I set up several meetings between these two and my friend Bill never showed 
up. Finally I told Bruce that if he wanted I could do the booking/management 
but he woud have to show me what to do. 

My first show as an official band personnel was the Christmas party at Molly's 
in 1987. The funny thing was that they were giving out door prizes based on 
your ticket stub. Well I won 2 out of the 3 door prizes. I think it was fate. 
Since then I've booked all the shows and been to most of them. We're looking 
forward to a great year in 1991...

Geoff

    I first "heard" about SlipKnot from reading this file.  I'd say that
    was around August 88.  I first saw/heard them perform in November of
    1988 at the Whitehorse.
    
    I was with a buddy (George Scontsas) and we were impressed.  Song
    selection and musicianship was excellent.  After the show I was bummed
    to find out that the 'Knot would not return to NH until the next Feb. 
    Well I kept that date in my mind and started to get a group of people
    to attend the FEB 25, 1989 date in Milford.  Another great show and a
    lot of fun.  
    (OLD NEWS ALERT) The best thing about it is that was the night I met my
    future wife.  
    
    Last Friday's show was just three days short of being exactly two years
    since the fateful meeting.
    
    Probably seen them 7 times total.
    
    
    Marv
     

    	The 1st time I went to see Slipknot was about spring '87 at
    Sit-n-bulls (I say this 'cause I seem to remember them from one time at
    the Cut-Off in N'boro years before). I went up to Bruce and said Hi and
    asked if he was a DECie (before DEChead was coined) soon enough more
    DECies came in (Bob White, Seth, Charlotte, and a few others) and of I
    went into the great world Knotheadness ! Shows at Chets,Mollys (X-mas
    party), some basement in Boston, a school gym on NYE, Barry's backyard,
    N'boro F&G slip-in-out bashes, Texas w/Buddy Cage (in worcester center), 
    across the Street for the Centrum when the Dead where in town !! 
    The Blueplate,the Whitehorse Inn,N. Uxbridge w/Buddy Cage !!!
    Margaritaville on rt20, Fog & Rachie's Wedding !, the Cove and some
    places I can remember........not only have I had a great time dancing
    and listening to great music, I've also meet some of the most
    friendlies people anyone would want to meet ! I've seen a few band
    members come and go and come back (John the Bass player for one)
    two drummers,3 keyboard players, 3 bass players and Bruce & Barry just
    go with the flow ! so many special guest have also joined the band from
    time to time, Buddy Cage is one of the best treats, he seems to turn
    the band up a few notchs. And after all this fun I only have one show
    on tape :'( 11-11-89 at the Blueplate I believe this was Jack's 1st
    show as a full time member......and I also have a tape of Bruce &
    Berry's show on WCUW 3-8-89......
    
    Chris

    Well...
    Most of the time I just read this conference quietly without
    saying too much, but I thought I should put in a mention on
    this topic, since it looks like I can beat you all!

    I've known Bruce for a few years and I first saw Slipknot
    back in December (I think) of 1984. It was a show at some VFW
    hall in some forgotten town. About all I can remember about
    it is they did a nice version of "I shot the Sheriff". I do
    remember that it was a fun evening though. At that time I
    hadn't ever seen the Dead so a lot of the music was pretty
    new to me. Since then I've seen Slipknot a bunch of times.
    One memorable occasion was in the basement of an MIT dorm
    around 1985 probably. About 20 people watching! We had
    difficulty finding the place so we just wandered round the
    campus till we heard Bruce's unmistakeable blues wail.

    More recently family obligations have kept me from seeing
    them as often as I'd like but I aim to get there again one day 
    soon.

    ...Robert

    
    My most memorable Slipknot show was in a grammar school gymnasium on
    New Years Eve ... we DECheads partied down with some very intense
    junior high schoolers :-)
    
    Coz managed to get one to dance with her.
    
    It was one of those nights you never forget. :-)
    
    mary

  I first saw Slipknot about 1 1/2 to 2 years ago at the Whitehorse. I't
was a fryday night and I brought along a couple of friends, one being Matt,
the other neither Matt or I have heard from him in quite sometime. 

  There weren't too many people at the show that night, but it was still
a high energy night. Half way thru the first set Matt and I looked at each 
other and said "Tomorrow night?" "You bet!" And I've been hooked ever since.

  Shawn

    My first Slipknot show was January 26, at Sir Morgan's Cove (I know
    the exact date because after that night I tacked their schedule
    to my office wall).  Geoff the basenoter introduced me to this Grate
    band.  I met some wonderul people there, I especially remember Paul.
    Paul and I chatted most of the night, he filled me in on the bands 
    original songs and gave me some back ground about the band.  I forget 
    the keyboardists name but I do remember being pleasantly surprised when
    I heard the beautiful music he made with his flute.  I haven't been 
    able to make it to any of their other shows since then but I'm hooked
    already, I can't wait to see/hear them again this Saturday at Sir
    Morgans.  I look forward to seeing all the people I met there the
    last time.
    
    Joyce

    Joyce
    
    	That'd be Mark Munzer
    
    	An excellent keyboard man, good floutist, an all around pretty cool
    dude.
    
    						/
    
    PS If only Mark could hear me talk about him like this. I always give
    him sh*t when we talk to each other. /??
    

    I am listening to Slipknot for the first time right now.  From the
    Blueplate 2-16-91.  Thanks for sending the tapes Geoff.  If I ever make
    it out east I will have to check these guys out.  Good tunes!!!
    
    Scottg

Don't remember exactly when in 1987 I saw 'em first;  I think it was July-
September time frame.  I remember seeing them at the Hitching Post with NO
COVER !!  I may have seen them before that at the VFW Hall in Hudson (1.15
bud in cans!!)...

Must have seen them about 30-35 times.


About the Sit 'n' Bull.  I've read about the horror shows in grateful old.
about slipknot @ the bull.  The Bull changed hands a while back; not sure when.
The new owner is Ted;  don't know his last name.  They now book a lot of TOP 
acts and seem to be very cool about it.  Was Ted the owner back when ya'll
played there?  Or, was it a guy named ED?  I think ya'll should try again...

>      <<< Note 135.10 by BIODTL::FERGUSON "Is it just a waste of time?" >>>
>                     -< Hitching post or Hudson VFW, '87 >-
>
>Don't remember exactly when in 1987 I saw 'em first;  I think it was July-
>September time frame.  I remember seeing them at the Hitching Post with NO
>COVER !!  I may have seen them before that at the VFW Hall in Hudson (1.15
>bud in cans!!)...

	Hey JC all these shows were in 1988, I know because I booked them all. 
The one in Hudson was the first time I saw them as a 4 piece. A good show even 
though the place was empty...

Geoff

    my first was a Chet's show...  couldn't tell you tell month or year...
    i do recall it was a friday night...  
    
    hmmmm...   where's my Knotbase I???  i could at least narrow it down a
    bit!  can't be much more than 100 or so friday night Chet's shows! :^)
    
    i went hoping to meet some DECheads as i had been in the file as a
    read-mostly for some weeks at that point...  i succeeded in meeting
    fog, although i didn't know it was fog...  and also billetier and Jules
    (but i didn't know it was them either!)...
    
    didn't REALLY meet them (as in introducing each other, shaking hands 
    and proceeding to mercilessly destroy brain cells) until the first
    DEChead camping trip...  since the first camping trip was in the spring
    of 1988, then my guess as to when i "slipped" in to being a knothead
    would be early 1988...
    
    					da ve

  <<< Note 135.12 by STRATA::DWEST "Dont Overlook Something Extraordinary" >>>

>    hmmmm...   where's my Knotbase I???  i could at least narrow it down a
 
:) :) :)

I first experienced Slipknot at a private outdoor party that the
good Captain (at the time he always signed off Captain Fejj) so
kindly provided tickets for (well with a few bucks anyhow :)

This party was right on a lake somewhere near Marlboro/Hudson area
which I don't know too well.  I think it actually was someones b'day
sparty.  The year might've been 87.  Nice summer day - Rae and I and
Gilligan went out there for some acoustic and electric Slipknot.

Now I usually catch em (or try to catch em) when they play the Whitehorse
(which I missed this past weekend...)

good fun!
bob

	I'm not positive, but I think I first saw Slipknot in '87 at
	the Blue Plate, though it seems like it was longer ago than that.
	When Mindy and I moved back to the Worcester County area in '87, 
	after living around here during the college daze from '77-81 or so
	and seeing many amazing Southpaw shows at the 'Plate, we were drawn 
	back the old Blueplate.  As soon approached the door of the plate,	
	Tiny greeted us much to our amazement.  We hadn't been there in over
	6 years and he was still in his familiar spot, but how he remembered
	us was pretty amazing to us!  What a character!  

	I don't think Geoff was the manager of the band at the time...  
	I remember talking to Bruce at the plate and saying that if the 
	band is called Slipknot then when are they gonna do Help->Slip->Frank ? 
	;-)   He said when he figures out the complexity of Slipknot the 
	song!  Well, not too long after that we got our first of many great 
	HelpSlipFranklin's! ;-)   

	I haven't seen Slipknot for a while now, since, hmmm, Sir Morgan's
	a year (?) ago, BT (Before Timmy ;-)...  and I sure would like to
	see and hear 'em soon!  

	Ken

Just caught my firs Knot show (with Buddy Cage!) a couple of weeks ago in 
N. Uxbridge.  Only caught the second set because I drove from Hartford CT. 
to a friends house who lives near there and I84 was glare ice.  What a drag.
Took us 3.5 hrs. to go what should have been about 1.5 hours tops.  The set
was grate though!  Ran into Chris F.and Adam S., I think they were the only 
other DECheads there.  Phyllis, weren't you suppose to be going to Lisa's 
that night and then to the show?  I'm sure you must have ran into the same
mess on I84.

Chuck

>other DECheads there.  Phyllis, weren't you suppose to be going to Lisa's 
>that night and then to the show?  I'm sure you must have ran into the same
>mess on I84.

	Yea they did Chuck, what a bummer!  Actually, they got off 84 in
	Farmington and bypassed it completly with 91 and the Pike ... turns
	out they were only a little over an hour later than I expected them.
	(still way to late for Nicks, unfortunately - they definitely looked
	liked they needed some tunes when they got there! :-)  I felt so bad 
	though, what a hassle for them!  Especially considering how many 
	times I have driven that road back and forth between school
	and home and never had such a bad trip (with the mere exception for 
	that time I got caught in the tornadoe...)

Lisa

My first Slipknot adventure was in October of 88 at the Whitehorse.  Only
caught the first set, but really enjoyed it (didn't know Lisa at the time ;^))
I knew Bruce looked familiar but couldn't figure out why...later on I found
out he used to work in the same building I did!


Anyway, I was still married at the time and my now ex was less than enthused
about Dead and Dead related anything, so I didn't see them much after that
'til I moved out.  Don't know how many shows I've seen since, but they just
keep getting better and better..






Jim

re < Note 135.13 by LANDO::HAPGOOD "Leroy says, 'keep on rockin'" >

>This party was right on a lake somewhere near Marlboro/Hudson area
>which I don't know too well.  I think it actually was someones b'day
>sparty.  The year might've been 87.  Nice summer day - Rae and I and

	Hey, I remember that!  I was there - I didn't know to many other
Knotheads, but I recognized a few from the Sunday "Grateful Dead Night" 
scene then happening at Molly's.  The mosquitoes were real bad that night.
I'd seen Slipknot before that party, though - can't remember just where.

	Josh

My first show was at the Sit and Bull - must have been at least three
or four years ago.  I didn't know anyone from the file at the time but
I met up with the band and we ate at the fish place in Maynard ( I
remember meeting Bruce and Barry who I liked).  I remember meeting
Charlotte there but I can't recall anyone else.  I had a pretty good
time but felt a little weird since I hadn't been following the dead
much at the time (at least since college)...

I remember dancing a lot which I liked and I enjoyed the music but the
bad scene was a little weird for me (I'm not a drinker).

john

>I remember dancing a lot which I liked and I enjoyed the music but the
>bad scene was a little weird for me (I'm not a drinker).


The Bull does tend to get rowdy at times.  Right Heidi?


Hmm,.,  I know I saw the Knot in '87 ... may have been the 'Plate...  I just
can't remember too well.......

I can't remember exactly but it was sometime in mid '87 at the Blue Plate. 
Bruce and I both worked at HLO and met due to GRATEFUL.  Don't know how many
times I've seen them since.

		Dave

	Re: John H. at the Sit'n'Bull and dinner w/the band... I was there..
	I remember it was a pretty good dinner!

	josh

That's right Josh.  Thanks for reminding me.  Do you remember how long
ago it was?

I guess I've seen about 15 slip shows since then.  I especially like
the outdoors ones!

john

    RE: .1
    
    Hey Geoff ... I won the other door prize that night !  Tapes of
    Copenhagen.  Wasn't that show billed as Slipknot's Tenth Anniversary
    and I remember that the Spoonman played with them.
    
    I can't remember when i first saw the 'knot.  Pretty sure it was '87
    - did they play a PITW that summer? 
    
    funny how things all run together :-)
    Carol

    
    ... see how everything leads up to this day...

      As Mr. Burns was saying in the Thank You note, I had the pleasure
    (except for the speeding ticket) of seeing my first Slipknot show this
    past Sat. at the Whitehorse.  I just can't figure out what took me so 
    long to go see them.  Just call me a believa...two thumbs up from this
    new Knothead!  If you've never seen them before, GO! and if you have,
    I'll be seeing you at some future shows...
    
       Wonderful Help, Slip, Franklin's by the way...  :-)
    
                  DaveB.

    I went to the Whitehorse Saturday also........really liked them and it
    was nice to be able to get that close.  My son is a follower of the
    Dead.....some of my friends think he's nuts....but he loves the music
    and the shows...travels all the way to Albany just to stand in line
    for a bracelet!!!! I think his dream is to see the Dead in California.
    
    He wants to take me to a "Dead" show.....and I think I should take him
    to a Knot show.....
    
    If I ever seem uptight to him, he always says...."you need to go to
    a Dead show, Mom!"  So now when he appears tense, I'll tell him he
    needs to see Slipknot.  
    
    I ENJOYED!!
    

    -.1
    
    maybe you should BOTH plan on slipping into summer this may???
    
    				:^)
    
    					da ve

Hi All.

   Well, I haven't seen Slipknot yet.  But I hear they're playing at the White
Horse in Milford, NH this weekend (is is both nights, or just Saturday?)...

I was wondering if anyone could tell me what the band is like?  Covers?
Originals?  What they play?  Personally, I want to go anyway, but I may want 
to bring someone who would want to know what to expect.  Some people just don't
like surpises! :-)

Thanks much!

Dave

	Slipknot plays a variety of tunes from bands of the 60s and 70s.  Off
the top of my head:

	- Grateful Dead, it seems that if their crowd contains lots of
		deadheads, they'll play more dead.  

	- Allman Brothers, great In Memory of Elizabeth Reed

	- Eric Clapton

	- The Band

	- New Riders of the Purple Sage

Ah... hmm... Adam Seigel can probably tell you more.

re <<< Note 135.30 by TLE::WEISS "No way I'll crash, this is a *BEER* truck!" >>>
                        -< It may be this Saturday... >-

>Hi All.

Hi Dave; love that name!

>   Well, I haven't seen Slipknot yet.  But I hear they're playing at the White
>Horse in Milford, NH this weekend (is is both nights, or just Saturday?)...

They're playing Sat. night at the White Horse; Fri. night at Sir Morgan's 
Cove in Worcester MA.

Slipknot schedules are posted in topic 84 ....

- iko
  Dave

    Dave!!!  :^)  
    
    i would suggest trying to hit the friday show if you can...  rumor has
    it that there's a rilly neato-spiffy-cool-groovy-far out acoustic
    opening act...  :^)
    
    of course, it is just a rumor, and the newspapers have been wrong
    before...  ;^)
    
    					da ve

No Man!  It's me, *Dave*....

:-)

One of these days I've gotta put that Cheech and Chong bit on my answering 
machine... (but I digress)

> i would suggest trying to hit the friday show if you can.

Milford is *ALOT* closer to Nausea, than Worm-town is...

> rumor has
>   it that there's a rilly neato-spiffy-cool-groovy-far out acoustic
>    opening act...  :^)

I'll listen to some Neil Young on my way over to the show on Saturday, instead..
:-)

Dave

Hi y'all...

   Made it to the White Horse on Saturday Night for my 1st Slipknot show!

Grate stuff!  Had a grate time!  Awesome tunes, good dancing.  Forgot to get on
the mailing list, though.  Whoops...

Next time, I'll find someone else to be the designated driver!!!

Later...

Dave

p.s.  Hey, wasn't it someone else's 1st that night???

Re -1  Hey, where were you?  There was a bunch of us hanging around.






 Jim

Tim grady, where were you?  I honestly didn't think I'd recognize you since our
1 meeting a year or two ago has faded from memory.  I kept asking the dozen or
so decheads that were there "is he here yet?".  Anyway, I got an interesting
introduction after the show was over and I was saying goodbye - Dave Mallett
from the UK!  Nice meeting ya!

adam

    I was sitting by myself towards the back.  I'm not a dancer - two left
    feet, so I just sat back and ordered one Sam Adams after another and
    had a grate time listening to the band.  I also spent some time trying
    to figure out just which group were you DECheads, and I think it was
    probably a bunch of people right across the aisle from me - but I'm not
    at all sure....
    
    I didn't mean to be anti-social or anything - it was a bit awkward
    introducing myself, so I just hung out.  I really enjoyed the show,
    especially the second set.  
    
    tim
    
    P.S. Hint: I was wearing an Indigo Girls tour shirt.

Let's all wear name tags next time!

	----------------------
	|  HELLO my name is  |
	|--------------------|
	|Dave "Vampire" Clark|	
	|--------------------|
	|    I'm dead!       |
	|____________________|

RE:           <<< Note 135.38 by SMURF::GRADY "tim grady @ZKO3-3/U14" >>>

       
   > P.S. Hint: I was wearing an Indigo Girls tour shirt.

  
     Hey, I remember seeing the shirt!  I was wearing a Dead Sox shirt!




    Jim

I was wearing a Slipknot t-shirt and long-john undershirt. Standing in my 
usual spot by the soundboard.

Geoff

>     Hey, I remember seeing the shirt!  I was wearing a Dead Sox shirt!

Hey, Jim, I remember seeing the Dead Sox shirt.

Anyways, I spent the 1st set standing between the stage and the bar.  I was
standing next to my (somewhat overdressed) friend with long blond hair, and a
short miniskirt (it was a she, BTW :-) )
Then during the 2nd set I was either at that same place or on the dance floor.
I was wearing a gray striped sweater in the beginning and just a gray t-shirt
after it got too warm...

Too bad I didn't meet more of you...Next time!

Dave

    that Tim Grady is a shy one, ain't he???? %^)

RE: <<< Note 135.42 by TLE::WEISS "No way I'll crash, this is a *BEER* truck!" >>>

>Anyways, I spent the 1st set standing between the stage and the bar.  I was
>standing next to my (somewhat overdressed) friend with long blond hair, and a
>short miniskirt (it was a she, BTW :-) )


 Now her I remember :^)   :^)




Jim

re:< Note 135.44 by CSLALL::HENDERSON "Got some things to talk about" >

>RE: <<< Note 135.42 by TLE::WEISS "No way I'll crash, this is a *BEER* truck!" >>>
>
>>Anyways, I spent the 1st set standing between the stage and the bar.  I was
>>standing next to my (somewhat overdressed) friend with long blond hair, and a
>>short miniskirt (it was a she, BTW :-) )
>
>
> Now her I remember :^)   :^)

Me too. 8^)

adam

Geez, if only everyone would wear the required uniform!

	SHIRT, Type T, Style DEChead, Version 2, Design AllAlongClocktower !

;^)

- Dave who was wearing a black Steal Your Face 25 Years Dead non-regulation T

RE: Adam, Jim:

 > Now her I remember :^)   :^)

 > Me too. 8^)

Yup, she was wearing black and white...I'm the guy with the dark hair/beard
that was standing next to her.  Although I suspect *I* didn't get a second look...

:-)
 
Man, you go out to a bar with a well-dressed woman and no one even notices you!

Sheesh...

(stealth) Dave

:-) :-) :-) 

>Yup, she was wearing black and white...I'm the guy with the dark hair/beard
>that was standing next to her.  Although I suspect *I* didn't get a second look...

	Yeah, I remember her.  Honestly can't say I noticed you, though.  :-)

Mark

    Well, by the descriptions so far, I can see that my theory about which
    group of people were the DECheads was completely wrong.  Which I think
    is hilarious.
    
    I remember the Dead Sox shirt - but not the person in it - sorry, Jim. 
    It's funny, though, because I had a completely different person
    identified as my idea of who you were...boy was I wrong!
    
    Oh, well.  Next time I'll just arrange to meet everyone explicitly
    before the show.  In general, I've found that everyone I've been
    talking to in GRATEFUL for years now turns out to be different from
    what I expect when I meet them.  Most times, I expect them to be
    taller, except for Lisa, of course. ;-)
    
    tim
    
    

    re:last one by T Grady.....the downfall of notesfiles!!!!
                          rfb

	yeah, sometimes it is a downfall to not be able to see the
	other person you're conversing with - facial expressions add
	alot to a conversation...

	on the other hand, I kindof like meeting y'all as personalities
	first...sometimes outward appearances can make ya interested
	in some not-so-interesting people and not interested in some
	real-real-interesting people...
	
	and on the other hand (do I have anymore left?), once I DO 
	meet someone in person, then whenever I read one of their
	notes I can actually see that person's face and their
	expressions...

	Debess

Tim, you met the clone I used to send to the boat ramp.  I am really much much
taller that that.

:-)

I remember when I was first meeting the DECheads.  I felt kinda weird going
up to people and asking, "do you work for digital?"  

once you meet one, you'll meet more, and more, and more, and more...

RE:     <<< Note 135.52 by LEDS::MRNGDU::YETTO "child of countless dreams" >>>


>Tim, you met the clone I used to send to the boat ramp.  I am really much much
>taller that that.


 Right.






 Jim

RE:           <<< Note 135.49 by SMURF::GRADY "tim grady @ZKO3-3/U14" >>>

       
   > I remember the Dead Sox shirt - but not the person in it - sorry, Jim. 
   > It's funny, though, because I had a completely different person
   > identified as my idea of who you were...boy was I wrong!
    
    
     I'm much better looking and I sure don't look my age, right?



 
     :^)   Jim    
   
        
    

    right
    

  

    of course not Jim, no way do you look 51...

   ...er, 41. 8-)


 Shawn

Re:     <<< Note 135.55 by CSLALL::HENDERSON "Lets disconnect these cables" >>>

>     I'm much better looking and I sure don't look my age, right?

	It's those Henderson genes you have to thank.  Right Phyllis?

			:-)

RE:     <<< Note 135.58 by LEDS::MRNGDU::YETTO "child of countless dreams" >>>


>	It's those Henderson genes you have to thank.  Right Phyllis?


        Unfortunately for my brother it looks like I got the best of 'em :^)

Re:     <<< Note 135.59 by CSLALL::HENDERSON "Lets disconnect these cables" >>>

>        Unfortunately for my brother it looks like I got the best of 'em :^)


		That would be unfortunate....



		IF IT WERE TRUE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  :-)

RE:     <<< Note 135.60 by LEDS::MRNGDU::YETTO "child of countless dreams" >>>



>		That would be unfortunate....


>		IF IT WERE TRUE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  :-)


   Which you *know* it is  :^)

    
    Henderson jeans, maybe. ;-)
    
    

>           <<< Note 135.49 by SMURF::GRADY "tim grady @ZKO3-3/U14" >>>
    
>    Oh, well.  Next time I'll just arrange to meet everyone explicitly
>    before the show.  

     Good idea! Except that for me, I'm usually too crazed before a gig to say
much of anything. I do remember staring at Tim, nodding hello, and thinking
"why can't I remember his name?" - then it came to me during the first set...
And also saying hi to Jim and seeing Bill Taylor and at first not being sure if 
it was him (hi Bill) and just wondering how much of my brain really is left....
So for else I didn't see or recognize, thanks for coming the show(s) the last
few years (oops, wrong note:-})!

Bruce
    

Actually it's pretty easy to identify Bruce at a Slipknot show.  ;^)

    yeah, hes the one with a fender straped to himself :')

    Fortunately I have found the DECheads to be quite a sociable lot and its 
    rather impossible to write in here very much before someone like da ve 
    walks into your office and introduces himself...
    
    					jon