Conference moira::parenting_v3

    Sue,
    
    You really should see your doctor.  It could be something beyond you or
    your partners control, that could easily be fixed with medication, or
    some other method.
    Until you do visit your doctor, you won't know why your not getting
    pregnant.  On the other hand, some people are physically fine, and
    follow all of the "right" guidelines (if you can believe that we have
    it done to such a science), and it takes months for them to get
    pregnant.
    
    My advice, see your doctor soon..
    
    
    Good Luck
    
    Kristin
    

    Might be that you are trying to hard.  My husband and I went through
    this with our second child.  I wanted a baby so bad that I nearly made
    him have a heart attack! ;-).  Finally, we cooled off for a bit and
    then tried again and it worked.  It took us about 6-7 months before
    I conceived.  I was ready to go to the Doctor to see if something was
    wrong - didn't have too!!
    
    So - I would take a break and if it makes you feel better, go and see
    your Doctor.  It wouldn't hurt.
    
    Denise

    Statistically, a couple of healthy people in their twenties who are
    "doing things right" have about a 20% chance of conceiving in any given
    month.  (The odds drop as you get older.) 
    
    Doing the magic with statistics (I got this out of a book, so don't
    ask me for the mathematical contortions) this means that about 80%
    of the couples who are "trying" will succeed within 6 months, 90%
    will succeed within a year, etc.
    
    If you're concerned, see your doctor by all means.  But you may just
    be part of the 20% statistic that takes longer than 6 months, luck of
    the draw.

    
    Ditto to .3  When we first started trying we were sure there was
    something wrong... after seeing a doctor we found out that I had
    a slightly low sperm count, but he believed that was due to to much
    trying... ( practice makes perfect! ;)
    
    ... when we stopped worrying about it and decided to leave it in
    God's hands it just happened... it took three years.  At the time
    it was tough but today we're grateful we had those years to grow
    up together in... I think God knew something we didn't.
    
    Don't get discouraged, everyones different, and it could just be
    something you need to relax and not worry about.. ( A friend once
    told me his wife stood on her head after every try! )  
    
    Once our first son was born we figured that because it took three
    years to have him... birth control wasn't something we needed to
    worry about... besides she was breast feeding! WRONG! Thirteen
    months later my second son was born!... so much for that theroy!..
    
    By all means see your doctor... its the only way you'll find out
    if there is something to worry about.  But don't think that 5 months
    is a long time when it comes to trying to make a baby... I have
    friends who took five years and even then she got pregnant a few
    weeks before they adopted a child... once the pressure was off things
    happen naturaly.  Good luck.

    Don't get too discouraged.  My husband and I tried for 9 months.  I
    went to see my doctor and she told me to 
    
    	1) go buy my husband loose fitting boxer shorts
    
    	2) make love once per day every other day for the middle ten days
           of my cycle
    
    She also said that if we've been trying for less than one year it was a
    little bit premature to be concerned.  Well, the advice (or something)
    worked because we were pregnant the following month!  It still amazes me, 
    though, how difficult it can be to get pregnant after all of the effort 
    put into avoiding it.
    
    Good luck!
    

    Well, I did see my doctor, and he said about the same as .5.  He
    asked me to come back in 6 months if I wasn't pregnant yet.  I hope
    every month, so I'm hoping I won't have to go back - for that reason
    anyways!
    
    He did mention one thing that I really didn't notice.  He said that I
    was ovulating around day 12, and not day 14, even though I'm on a 28
    day cycle.  I'm sure we hit that too, but we'll try again.  He also
    mentioned that I ovulate when my temp. starts to come down.  I thought
    it was when the temp. started to rise.
    
    Thanks for all the replies,
    Sue

How old are you, Sue?  If your biological clock is ticking loudly,
then you should consider seeing an infertility specialist in the next
couple of months.  If you still have lots of time, don't worry about 
seeing a specialist until after a year of trying.  If I remember correctly,
80% of heterosexual couples are able to get pregnant within a year if
they do not use contraceptives.

The suggestion about the boxer shorts is a good one, too.  Does your partner
wear close fitting underwear?  Does he use hot tubs a lot, or hot baths,
or really hot showers?  I'm not sure how much showers affect this, but 
if the man's groin is kept too warm, you won't have as many sperm.  Therefore,
make sure that he wears boxer shorts instead of (jockey?) shorts, and no
hot tubs.

Good luck!  Keep us updated!

        Carol

    I was reading over the weekend that men's sperm count goes down in
    the summer, apparently due to the heat.  
    
    This sounds off the wall but it was a report from a serious
    scientific research team. 
    
    --bonnie

Regarding infertility specialists, there's usually a wait of several months
to get an appointment.

Has your husband's semen been analyzed?

    I know this sounds ridiculous, but RELAX!!  It was the month I QUIT
    trying to become pregnant that I conceived AJ.  The other thing that
    always gives me a clue that ovulation is occuring is a definite pain in 
    the lower abdomen for a couple hours.  I remember the month (practically 
    the day and hour!) that we conceived AJ, I thought I had appendicitis.  
    Glad I didn't pursue a bunch of lab tests of Xrays!
    
    I'm curious how the doctor determined when you were actually ovulating,
    since it sounds like he's taking a basic wait and see attitude.  Have
    your tried to ovulation kits, like First Response or Q-Test?
    
    My sister actually quit her part time job because the stress was
    contributing to her infertility, sucess the next month!

    From what my Doctor has told me they don't consider anyone who hasn't
    tried at least one year to have a problem.  I went thru this a year or
    so ago.  The doctor I had seen at that time asked me how long I had
    been trying and I told him a year and he said fine we'll proceed with
    temp. taking etc.....  I got pregnant that month.....  Now that I'm up
    for round 2 - my new doctor said wait a year if your still not pregnant
    come back unless of course you are in pain or having other problems...
    
    I had got some advice the last time when I got pregnant - it was to
    curl up afterwards.....as stupid or funny as it seems it work for the
    woman who told me and it worked for me..

    I'm almost 30, but I don't feel like I have to get pregnant by a 
    certain time.  I'm finally in a happy relationship, and would love 
    to start a family.  I did buy one of those ovulation kits, so I'm
    hoping it works.  They're pretty expensive.  Has anyone out there
    had any experience with them?
    
    Sue

    Has anyone had any experience with the ovulation kits?  How long 
    did it take to get pregnant using one of these kits?  

        
    I used the First Response Ovulation Predictor kit with my last 2
    pregnancies.  My first son was conceived with no problems.  But when
    I tried to get pregnant again I had a problem with miscarriages and 
    was diagnosed  with a low progresterone level.  In order to go on 
    progesterone therapy I needed to start the dosages when I ovulated.   
    So I used the kits - I got pregnant my first try each time and kept 
    both of those pregnancies!  I've got two more little boys to show for 
    it...making the grand total 3 boys!
    
    I have suggested the use of kits to two of my friends who were
    concerned about conceiving and they have had good luck with them too.
    
    Wishing you luck,
    
    -dorothy

    I used the First Response Kit, from time they came on the market. 
    Acutally the first two were compliments of my OB who had two "samples"
    and knew how desperate I wanted to become pregnant.  The next two I
    actually had to got to the factory (made by Tampax in Palmer MA) and
    get them, since they hadn't yet hit the shelves yet.  The price...BIG
    BUCKS!  acutally the price has dropped about 25% from then to now, but
    still at twentysomething a kit, I still question if it's worth it.  My
    kit tests never showed anything, unfortunately my problem was a Ludeal
    Phase defect (hormone imbalance) which for some reason doesn't release
    the hormone needed to change the color in the little test tube.  The
    other complaint, beside cost, is unless you can function REAL well
    first thing in the morning the many steps and critical timing can be
    tricky.  Maybe someone else has tried the other brands and find them
    easier.
    
    Good luck, and keep trying!
    Lyn
    

    My doc tells me there's a new kit in testing for FDA approval that
    will be LOTS cheaper and easier to use.  It's supposed to be able
    to detect the hormone levels from your saliva, and he says it should
    cost about $1/day (compared to $5/day for the current test types).
    He said it should finish the approval cycle by the end of the year.
    Keep your fingers crossed...

    I'll apologize if I offend anyone but let's thing a little lighter on
    this one.
     Picture this  you and hubby are both up and been through the shower, 
    More or less functioning, you've done you test and the little vial 
    turns BLUE!  OK so what do you do now "Hello Boss, I'm going to be 
    a little late this morning because....
    (you fill in the blank with creative ideas!)
    
    How about picturing this scenario with a little one already in the
    house and awake!
    
    Lyn
    (maybe this belongs in parent Lite?)
    

    Well Lyn, I don't know exactly what people tell their boss, but I
    do know that couples that are working quite hard to become pregnant
    often do have to drop everything when the clock strikes (so to speak).
    I know of one person in particular who had to leave work periodically
    to go home (or wherever :-)) and give it a try.
    
    Carol

    Back to the ovulation kit discussion:  I understand that Clearblue
    Easy (Clearplan) has a "pee-on-a-stick" (excuse the vulgarity)
    ovulation test on the market now.  I used their pregnancy test
    and found it very easy to use.  A pharmacist friend of mine recommends
    Clearblue Easy because it shows you when the test is complete.
    
    Loving thoughts & prayers to all who want to get pregnant!
    
    Kate

    Yes, the Clearblue Easy is by far the simplest one to use.  You
    just, as Kate said, pee on the absorbant end of the stick, cap it,
    and wait 3 minutes for the result.  No mixing or timing involved.
    The cost is comparable, about $25/5 tests.
    	Linda

    Has anyone used the Clearblue Easy with success??  I just bought a 
    kit that was recommended by a friend.  It was Ovukit.  The kit cost
    $54.00, but you do get 9 days.
    
    

    Going back to the trying to get pregnant note.  Here's a little story:
    
    Friends of mine had been trying 7 years!!!**!! and were desparate to
    have children, finally one arrived.  After a short period they decided
    that they would try again for another but werent going to be upset if
    it didn't work as they were over the moon with their little girl. 
    Because they weren't trying that hard and not stressed about it.. guess
    what happened, she fell straight away for TRIPLETS!!!!  They have given
    up now they think four is enough, especially seen as they only wanted
    two in the first place.
    
    The morale of this story is relax, don't get wound up about it.
    
    I have to admit I was one of the luckier ones, I fell in two months and
    I put it down to having the attitude if its gonna happen it will happen
    and didn't get worked up about it.
    
    Good luck and relax.
    Barbara
    

    .22 > The morale of this story is relax, don't get wound up about it.
    
    As others have suggested in the past, that's a fairly unfeeling and
    irresponsible suggestion.  Most couples with long-standing infertility
    have organic problems that require medical intervention.  Relaxation
    won't help, and may be beyond their power, anyway.  The anecdotal fact
    that some few couples get pregnant after "giving up" proves nothing,
    except that getting pregnant is somewhat chancey and mysterious.  Have
    you researched the frequency with which couples "relax" with no effect?
    
    Certainly the example cited proves the opposite, anyway.  Something
    like this:  If you keep up your desparation for a full 7 years you will
    be blessed with not just one kid, but four, in two pregancies!
    
    		- Bruce

>    As others have suggested in the past, that's a fairly unfeeling and
>    irresponsible suggestion.  Most couples with long-standing infertility
>    have organic problems that require medical intervention.  Relaxation
>    won't help, and may be beyond their power, anyway.  The anecdotal fact
>    that some few couples get pregnant after "giving up" proves nothing,
>    except that getting pregnant is somewhat chancey and mysterious.  Have
>    you researched the frequency with which couples "relax" with no effect?
>    
>    Certainly the example cited proves the opposite, anyway.  Something
>    like this:  If you keep up your desparation for a full 7 years you will
>    be blessed with not just one kid, but four, in two pregancies!
>    
>    		- Bruce


I don't think that is what .22 meant by her reply.  There are quite a few
couples whose problem is stress in trying to become pregnant.  I would say that
if you have been trying for less than a year and you aren't getting pregnant,
that stress might be the factor.  Relaxation is the cheapest therapy.  Try that
first.  Most fertility drs. won't even begin treatment until after a year of
trying anyway.  There is quite a % of people that will tell you that once they
relaxed, they didn't have a problem.  I can personally attest to that. 

So let's not accuse each other of insensitivity.  There is validity to both
courses of action. 

Actually, RESOLVE, the organization that specializes in infertility problems,
has been quoted as saying that telling someone to relax actually creates
MORE stress on them.

Infertility is naturally stressful if you want a child.  When someone doesn't
get pregnant and they have been trying less than a year, that may be perfectly
normal since only 80% of heterosexual couples are able to conceive in a 
full year.  Like Bruce said, though, many of the folks are not able to
conceive due to a physical problem, and telling them to relax not only
puts more pressure on them ("Relax!  Relax!  I've got to relax!") but
also puts added guilt on them.

I don't think that anyone is accusing anyone else of trying to hurt someone,
but for those of us who have been infertile, or who are infertile, those
well meaning words can be very painful.

         Carol

I was just saying that there seems to be many people who discount stress as a
factor.  They shouldn't.  Many, many couples who do 'relax' get results.  Many
are people I personally know.  I think a lot has to do with how they are told to
relax.  If they are told to relax in a way that makes them feel stupid, it isn't
right.  But it isn't always bad advice, just be tactful about the approach. 

It would probably be more helpful if the couple is told how to relax using a
technique that the advisor has used successfully.  If the advisor hasn't had the
problem themselves, granted, they should keep their mouths shut.

   re 
        <<< Note 360.25 by CSC32::DUBOIS "The early bird gets worms" >>>
                        -< "Relax", Stress, and Guilt >-

>get pregnant and they have been trying less than a year, that may be perfectly
>normal since only 80% of heterosexual couples are able to conceive in a 
>full year.  Like Bruce said, though, many of the folks are not able to
   
   
   I think that in this sense, heterosexual couples is somewhat of an
   oxymoron. The rate for non-heterosexual couples must run close to 0%.
   
   q
   

    I think what Carol meant was as opposed to single women or lesbian
    couples who are trying to get pregnant through insemination.
    	Linda

<    I think what Carol meant was as opposed to single women or lesbian
<    couples who are trying to get pregnant through insemination.

Yup.  The only stats I've read have been for hetero couples.  I would imagine
that the stats for a woman trying to conceive through AI would be higher,
since the donor has already been tested for sperm count and mobility.

         Carol

Revisiting the assertion that "stress" can cause infertility, and couples
should "relax" - I believe this is false, and that saying this to people is
misleading and insensitive.  Please do not rely on anecdotal evidence,
which is generally worthless.  If you can cite medical evidence, please
correct me.

I looked the matter up in "The New Our Bodies, Ourselves," which has a fine
section on infertility and its treatment.  In the section on "causes" they
list approximately 50 different underlying problems that can lead to
infertility;  all are organic.  Stress is conspicuously absent.  Indeed,
they explicitly say: "You may be told that your problems are all in your
head.  This kind of attitude is not helpful at all."

		- Bruce

re .29:

    That's "motility," not "mobility."


re stress:

    Telling someone who's upset or under stress to relax is almost always
    counterproductive.

    I did not mention this in .30, but subsequent mail I've gotten makes me
    think I should.  I had several years' experience dealing with
    infertility, and thus have considerable personal exposure to its
    causes, treatment, and impact.  I've also discussed the problem with
    several other couples who have shared it.  I've also had the good
    fortune, subsequently, to experience unassisted and uncomplicated
    conception.
    
    			- Bruce
    

I think I read it in Ann Landers:

If stress causes infertility, there wouldn't be so many teenage pregnancies.

    I used the Clearblue Easy Ovi kit once and it worked!  We had been
    trying for almost 2 years and I was predicting my fertile days
    differently that the Clearblue Easy kit did.  After having my husband's
    sperm count tested and finding out that "every other day sex" did not 
    give his body enough time to rebuild - the doctor suggested every third
    day instead and also the consistency of the sperm was wrong (too thick
    to travel upstream) - the doctor suggested 1000mg of Vitamin C daily. 
    For some reason, Vitamin C works to thin out the sperm and believe me
    it worked!  Our little angel is due January 11, 1991!
    
    Ellen

re .34:

I believe that there's a 72-hour window during which an egg can be fertilized.
So if you had sex every third day, unless the first time was before ovulation,
the next time was too late.  In any case, congratulations.

    The 72-hour window is, of course, the "lifespan" of the sperm.  But,
    the egg can only last 24-hrs.  So, planning is tricky.
    
    -d

    
    	I have a question regarding temperature taking. When is it that you
    actually ovulate? When the temperature goes down, starts going up, or
    when it actually peaks? I've read several different versions in a few
    books. Thanks for the help.
    
    				Wendy

    Wendy,
    
    Here's my understanding.  In a normally functioning body, you ovulate
    at some point in time before your temperature rises.  A temperature
    rise does *not* guarantee you are ovulating, although lack of a
    temperature rise is a very good indication that you don't.  
    
    My doctor does not use the temp charts (thank God -- freedom from the
    blasted thermometer!), as his experience indicates that they can be off
    by as much as three days.  He says they are good for contraception but
    considers them to be in the "nearly useless" category for trying to get
    pregnant. 
    
    Other doctors violently disagree with this.  The only thing I've heard
    pretty much universally is that, when your temp peaks, ovulation is
    past.  Statistically, your chances are best if you have intercourse
    when the cervical mucus is thinnest, which should occur 24-36 hours
    BEFORE ovulation.  
    
    Beth

    This note is being entered on behalf of a noter who wishes to remain
    anonymous at this time. 
    
    If you wish to respond anonymously, you may send your reply to me with
    an indication of which entry you are responding to, and I will remove
    your name before forwarding the message to the noter.
    
    --bonnie, parenting co-moderator
    ************************************************************************

    I'd like to hear some experiences from women who have gone off the
    pill.  I've stopped taking it for about a month now after being on it
    for about 3 1/2 years.  My husband and I have been using an alternate
    method and plan to do so for a few months before trying to conceive.

    What I'd like to know is what some women experienced after going off
    the pill.  Did your period start up right away or was it some time
    before it started?  Did you experience any specific symptoms after
    going off the pill?  Any problems?

    I realize everyone is different, but the benefit of others experiences
    would be appreciated.

    *A

    
    I didn't have any problems coming off the pill, after being on it for
    about 8-9 years. EXCEPT for the pain of my menstrual cycles again. All 
    the time on the pill I never had bad cramps...but as soon as I came off
    of it..they came right back. Reminded me of being back in highschool 
    (before the pill) when my Dad used to have to come pick me up one day a 
    month from the nurses office, because my cramps were so bad.  
    
    I had no time lapse between going off the pill and my first mentrual
    cycle..right on time...as usual.  Although in the 5 months we've been
    trying I had 2 cycles where I was a week late...(never late before).
    Oh, and its a heavier flow now too.  We too used other forms of BC for 
    the first 3 months after goin off the pill. The dr said that was a good 
    time frame for me (being my cycles were not delayed etc).
    	
    Good Luck,
    Chris
    

    I went off the pill after being on it for about 10 years.  I had
    one normal cycle and then two weeks later, I was pregnant.  I was
    not trying to get pregnant at the time, it just happened.  I guess
    I was too niave and believed I wouldn't get pregnant that quick
    after being on the pill for so long.  I have a normal, healthy 6
    month old boy.
    
    Lori B.

    I'd been on the pill 10 years.  First cycle after going off was 10
    weeks long; second cycle was 6 weeks; normal 28-30 days thereafter.
    I've heard that's not uncommon, and much depends on how your body
    functioned before you went on the pills.
    
    Good luck!
    Beth

    
    My cycles went back to "pre-pill-taking" normal. I was on the pill
    for 4 years. My natural cycle is 35 days and the pill put me on 28 
    days cycles. The periods are heavier like they used to be. I lost 
    about 10 lbs in 3 months since the pill make me gain very easily.
    The pill changed my metabolism quite a bit. Basically, I feel like 
    my normal self again, thank god. I was sooo happy that I could get
    off the medication.
    We didn't used any alternate BC since we wanted another kid, but 
    we weren't trying hard to be pregnant either. I was pregnant after 
    4 months of non-trying. 
    
    
    Eva.

    
    I went off of the pill right after Thanksgiving.  I never did 
    start my cycles again, because while the Dr was trying to right 
    them (at end of Jan.) I got pregnant :-)
    
    Bev

    My experience was quite different from the previous replies.
    
    I was on the pill for over 4 years.  After stopping, I didn't get my
    period on my own for 10 months.  Just to make sure everything inside was
    alright, every 3 months I would go for a pregnancy test and a shot of
    hormones (after the negative prego. result) that would bring on my
    period.  That first period on  my own felt so good.  My doctor 
    explained that I just had left-over pill hormones in my system that
    took a LONG TIME to subside.  No concrete reason why, just that it
    happens sometimes.
    
    Then, like Chris, it was like I was back in high school, period-wise.
    Back to super heavy, crampy, irregular cycles that were 'normal' for me,
    and still seems to be after having two kids.
    
    FWIW,
    
    Donna
    

    I TOOK myself off!  
    
    In the Fall of 87 I started to experience some problem with irregular
    spotting and so the doctor kept changing doses.  Then in Feb. of 88 I
    started to experience major, MAJOR heavy bleeding while on a business
    trip! 
    
    Right then and there, I decided it was the pill and would take it never
    again.  I've been off it since Feb. of 88, but we used alternative
    methods since then 'til most recently.
    
    One D&C later, nothing has changed; I still have problem with what they
    call breakthrough bleeding and sometimes 15 days of what is considered
    "regular."  
    
    At the advice of some wonderful noters in here, I'm now ready to go to
    a new doctor.  I finally have an appointment this month.  
    
    Moral of this story:  I will never trust the pill again and will never
    suggest it to anybody.  
    
    P.S.  We are trying to conceive, too.
    
    Rgds,
     

    Not the "norm" but here's how it happened with me...

    Several years ago, my then gyn told me, after extensive testing, that I
    would have to be put on a regiment of hormones in order to get pregnant
    as my ovaries weren't ovulating.

    The summer of 1989 I had a routine physical which resulted in an
    abnormal pap smear. My new gyn found that I had a "cervical displacure"
    which was treated with a procedure in which he "froze" the cervical
    opening. This was done in November of 1989. On February 23, 1990 I
    discovered that I was pregnant. 

    The doctor swears that there is no medical link between the cervical
    freezing and my getting pregnant. I suspect there is as I was the
    third person that year, that had been trying to conceive and was
    unsuccessful until after this procedure was done.

    I am now the proud mother of a 3 1/2 month old baby boy. Thank goodness
    for the little quirks of fate that have been bestowed upon me!! My
    little Daniel is the best thing to happen to me, besides meeting his
    Dad, of course.

    Best wishes to a successful child bearing endeavor!!!

    Norma

    I'd been on the Pill for about 10 years, on and off, usually for
    periods of about 2 to 3 years at a time. During those periods, I
    could have set my watch (28 days and 3.5 hours) to when I was due
    to start each month, but the flow would get less and less as time
    went on. This last time I had gone to a new doctor for a renewal of
    the prescription; he, already having been previously scandalized by
    the medical advice of my last doctor, could not believe that I, as a
    know migraine sufferer had been put on the pill. Stroke! he said. No
    more pills! he said. So, we actually just used condoms and the rhythm
    method for a while. 
    
    The very first month I was off the pill, on the 14th day, I felt some
    peculiar cramps -- pin point pain on either side of the lower abdomen --
    like my ovaries were huffing and puffing after the long rest. I felt
    this the second month too, and then it went away. The time between
    periods became a little shorter and less reliably timed, (I was more
    achy too, with PMS for the first time). 
    
    In August, we decided to try and start a family; did not use a condom
    on the 14th day, and sure enough, some hours later, that same peculiar 
    set of cramps. 14 days and a pharmacie kit later.......baby under
    construction. 
    
    Monica
     
    
    

    
    I just had to reply to this note after SEARCHING everywhere for it.
    Particularly reply .11   about "curling up" after having sex.  My
    husband and I have been trying for 6 months, and I was trying to follow
    everything they say in the books (boxer shorts, no hot tubs, staying in
    bed for 20 mins afterwads...etc..)  And one of them being "prop a
    pillow underneath your buttocks after sex".  Even my own doctor told me
    that one.  Well, after reading .11, I figured we'd try a different
    approach this time...(being as this was our 6th month of attempts, why
    not!)...and I tried to curl up a bit afterwards, instead of the pillow
    trick...  
    
    And it worked!!!!
    
    I'm not saying it had EVERYTHING to do with us getting pregnant...but
    whatever it was I'll take it!!!!   I did everything else the same as the
    first 5 months except that....so...MAYBE!
    
    Chris
    (its going to be one LONG HOT SUMMER!!)
    (But I sure am smiling!)
    
    
    

    I went off the pill over ten years ago, and changed to an IUD;
    copper-7, (How come you find out you've got an infertility problem
    *after* years of fooling around with contraception?)  Anyway, for me
    stopping the pill was for health reasons, my blood pressure was
    skyrocketing, and of course the constant bloat in the middle.  Within 2
    months of coming off the pill my BP was well within normal range, I had
    lost 15 pound in pure fluid weight and one of the scariest side effects
    had vanished, cyanosis (blueness) around my mouth and fingertips when I
    was overtired, was gone.  The monthly cramps and bleeding were more 
    intense, but that was minor compared to the major side effects I had to
    deal with.
    
    My sister was on the pill almost 10 years, and had trouble conceiving. 
    He doctor felt her inability to conceive had something to do with the
    extended period of time she took the contraceptives.  Who knows
    anything is possible.
    
    Just my 2 cents worht!
    

    In the last few years my adversity to "the pill" has grown.  So has my
    dislike for my EX-GYN's question at every annual, "So, you need your
    prescription renewed..."  And before I could answer, it was written.
    Another time a comment was made about unwanted pregnancies.
    
    Perhaps this man felt he was on a one-man crusade.  But I really didn't
    like his attitude that all women of child bearing years who were not in
    the business of starting or adding to a family should be on the pill.
    
    Two years ago I started to experience some abnormal cycles.  I kept
    trying to blame it on the pill, and did not believe that the pill
    should be taken for extended periods of time.  My doctor said that was
    my old-fashioned catholic upbringing... something to that effect. 
    Ahhem.  I could go on... but that's in the past, and I'm looking
    forward to a bright future.
    
    Thanks to some many wonderful suggestions in here, I now have a new GYN. 
    Thank you for all of you who wrote me with recommendations... I have
    met a new OB/GYN this week - highly recommended through the readers of
    this conference-- and I agree with all the comments.
    
    We are now on our way towards discovering what is causing the unusual
    cycles-- and all the other issues concerning conception.  I am thrilled
    to have alot of good company and unseen "friends" here-- who have shared
    their experiences.  It certainly makes it alot easier to understand
    alot of things!  
    
    .50 ---> I agree with you wholeheartedly about contraception and
    infertility.  
    

re: .29

> The only stats I've read have been for hetero couples.  I would imagine
> that the stats for a woman trying to conceive through AI would be higher,
> since the donor has already been tested for sperm count and mobility.

Actually, the stats are much lower for AI, cause the freezing process does
a bit of damage to a certain % of the sperm...

Waky, who tried 36 times before it "took"

<Actually, the stats are much lower for AI, cause the freezing process does
<a bit of damage to a certain % of the sperm...

I agree.  I wonder if it is better for fresh sperm, though, which is what
I used.

<Waky, who tried 36 times before it "took"

I'm impressed with your determination!!!!  We have tried 4 times in the last
7 months, and it has been a real pain (no! not *more* stress!).  :-}

       Carol

    
    This is probably not the perfect place for this question and is 
    undoubtedly a rathole...but I was wondering :-) ...does anyone who 
    has researched AI techniques have statistics as to the percentage
    of males vs. female offspring where AI was used for conception?
    
    Based on reading I've done, I'd speculate that there are more boys
    conceived through AI than girls but wonder if there are any figures
    to back my suspicion.
    
    Carol

    At the Fenway Clinic in Boston the ratio has been closer to
    fifty-fifty.  Out of something like 36 pregnancies, 19 were boys.
    (approximate numbers)
    	Linda

Several of the books that we have read (5-6 years ago) said that the figure
was around 80% boys if you used frozen sperm and 50% if you used fresh.
My doctor does not agree with the 80% number (but I don't remember what
figure he gave).

      Carol