Conference moira::parenting_v3

    
       I forgot one and I had to ask my kid what it was.
    
      - shut off all my lights
    
    Mike
    
        Is their anyone else out there who set up responsibilites?
    

>        Is their anyone else out there who set up responsibilites?
 
Mike,

We certainly do, and I'd guess that most do.  What I find intriguing about 
your system is that he repeats them.  Seems to me that's helpful in getting 
him to remember them, unprompted, and without something that he needs to 
refer to, such as a list.  I assume that, as some of the "responsibilities" 
become rote, that you would revise the list.

I think that it's important that responsibilities ought to be things that the 
child has control over.  If the child is physically capable of keeping his 
pants dry, and just needs a way to help him think about it, then it seems to 
that this is an acceptable method of potty training, as well as teaching 
responsibility.  If there is a physical problem, then I think that making 
keeping pants dry a "responsibility" could create a problem.

Clay     

    Just a personal thought, to use this with a little caution.
    
    In our case we kept drumming into AJ's head NOT to have toileting
    accidents.  It has gotten to the point that noting else is important to
    him.  So when other issues crop up, he doesn't think them as important
    as not having an accident.  A typical morning conversation, after a bad
    day at preschool is ME: What are you going to do today, referring to
    the incident yesterday whether it was not listening, jumping around,
    some recent major infractions like kicking and sassing back.  AJ's
    answer:  I'm not going to have any accidents today. (forgetting that
    what he really needs to think about is his behavior.
    
    Another thing that tends to get to me, is when we pick him up, we ask
    how was your day, his usual answer is "Mom I had no accidents".  Yes
    I'm pleased about that, but would rather hear what he created.
    
    We do have certain "common sense rules" like say excuse me to
    interrupt, or if you burp, wait your turn, knock on the bathroom door
    don't just barge in, let mom and dad know where you are at all times,
    and if you make a mess you are the one who will clean it up.
    
    Lyn

    
    
              Another thing we taught our son at 2.5 years old was to
    know his first and last name, where he lived, his phone number and
    if mommy and daddy got hurt call 911. He learned it all in about 2
    weeks, and every once in a while we ask him these questions to make
    sure he remembered them.  We got the biggest kick out of it when he 
    knew all his personal data about himself and about getting hurt, now
    we just got to teach him his numbers on the phone!
    
        -Mike
    

    I don't want to offend or make light of all this, but as I read this it
    all seems to remind me of something out of "puppy training 101"! :-)
    
    How often do I speak in one word commands, Sit! Stop!  NO!  Don't!
    
    They tell me this too will pass....BUT WHEN!! ??
    
    
    Lyn

    Our kid's very first responsibilies were safety related:
    
    1. Always buckle seat belts (and car seats with help from parents)
       and remind others to do the same.
    
    2. Always lock car doors.
    
    3. When crossing the street, always look right, then left, then
       right again.
    
    They felt important and in control with these responsibilities.
    
    

    
    Along with the common sense ones, and ones regarding safety, at around
    age 3 we started letting the kids help set the table, clean their
    rooms. It paid off too; Jason is almost 18 and as soon as he finishes
    dinner he cleans his place at the table and as soon as everyone else is
    done he cleans off the rest. Michele makes her bed almost as soon as her 
    feet hit the floor and she is 16 1/2.
    
    Trudy 

    Mike,
    
    Here is what we do.  Alyssa (4 yrs) was having a bit of trouble this
    past summer controlling her temper, whining, etc.  So I made up an
    allowance chart.
    
    Down the side of this chart were these words:
    
    Whining        (no whining all day)
    Toys           (must pick up all toys and put them away neatly)
    Teeth          (must brush her teeth every morning and every night)
    Bedtime        (must give mommy and daddy a kiss goodnight, 
                    and stay in bed, not get up 6 times and cry)
    Eating         (must finish all food off her plate)
    Listening      (must pay attention when spoken to, and really listen)
    Sharing        (must share with other children)
    Fighting       (no being a wise guy and provoking any fights)
    
    
    She would get a star for everything she did good at that day.  If she
    was bad, we would take a star away.  She had to get 5 stars for each
    subject a week.  If she got at least 5 stars a week for each subject,
    then she got $1.00.  Half of that she could spend at the icecream man,
    or buy anything or save it.  The other $.50 had to be put in her piggy
    bank and she couldn't touch it.
    
    This worked wonderfully.  I had tried everything to get her to behave. 
    But this system really worked and she remembered what she had to do
    everyday to get that star.  I would also let her put the stars on the
    chart, so that was fun for her.
    
    
    
    

    Re: -1.  I really like this system, but the only thing on your list
    that bothers me is the one about having to finish all the food on her
    plate.  There are a lot of overweight adults (myself and my husband
    included) that probably had this drummed into their heads as kids.  We
    both try very hard _not_ to make an issue with Marc about eating. 
    We figure he has a right to eat how much he feels like.  I admit it's
    hard, especially when we've put some effort into preparing it, but
    sometimes we throw out his entire meal.  (I'm sure there are a lot of
    notes elsewhere about this topic).  We do, however, insist that he come
    to the table... whether he eats or not is up to him.  We also do not
    allow him to throw food on the floor.

I see nothing wrong with making a child clean their plate if they put the food
themselves on their plate and at 4 years old, I think a child is old enough
to decide how much they will eat.

My parents did this with us and I also do it with my children.  They are also
expected to try everything AND we accept if they don't like it.  If they don't
like something I let them go several months before they're expected to try
again.  After three years of periodic "trials", my older son will now eat 
Brussel sprouts.

Letting them put their food on the plate themselves also assures that the can't
complain if the meat touches the potatoes or they didn't want sauce or
whatever.

ccb

    Oh, yes, I see...  well, Marc is only 2, so he's not ready to put his
    own food on his plate yet.  I try to give him choices, when possible,
    like do you want eggs or oatmeal for breakfast.  He's getting clever,
    though, and saying an entirely different thing sometimes.  Sometimes,
    he actually says, "just nothing"!

    I think the chart is wonderful! In fact I have printed it, and plan on
    taking it home with me, and seeing if it can help us get a handle on
    the recent "battles of control" we've been dealing with.
    
    as for the cleaning of the plate issue, we use the term loosely.  The
    plate doesn't have to be scraped clean, just don't try to get away with
    leaving half of the food on your plate, and you milk (it's usually just
    a regular sippy cup =6oz I think) MUST be finished.  Earlier this week
    we didn't make him clean his plate, but he had finished him meat and
    veggie, and left maybe a couple tablespoons of mac& cheese.  We did
    praise him for eating *all* of his supper.
    
    Lyn

    What I mean as far as "finishing all your food", I mean this:
    
    Alyssa will take 2 bites of everything and then say she's full, then
    1/2 hour later, she'll want a snack.  We do not pile food on her plate.
    She's a very light eater, so we put only enough food for her.  We know
    how much meat, vegetable and potatoe she eats, so that's all we give.
    
    We don't scold her for not finishing every bite.  What the chart is for
    is to teach her that she can't have snacks, etc, if she doesn't eat
    enough of her supper.  If halfway through she says that she's full, we
    tell her she should take "2 more bites of meat and 1 more bite of
    noodle" and she does!  So she gets a star!!
    
    I would never force my child to eat, but I will restrict her from
    getting snacks if she doesn't want to finish her supper.
    
    Gail

         I also have a rule of no dessert if you don't finish your supper. 
    My kids are not forced to finish their dinner, but if half an hour
    later they claim they are starving to death, I just gently remind them
    that they should have finished their supper and no you can't have a
    snack.  After a day or two of this, they learn quickly to eat when they
    have the chance!!
    
    Diane
    

    
    Kevin, 4 years old,  is a very light eater and underweight. (He
    didn't inherit that from me ;{ ). When I pick him up
    from the sitter's I get a report on whether he ate his meals or
    not.  If he did eat his lunch then a small snack before dinner is
    okay IF supper will take an hour or so to get ready.  With a six
    month old too, I don't think it's fair to let Kevin go hungry because
    Mike needs my attention for the first hour or so when we all get 
    home. A glass of Whole milk is required.
    
    The rule in the house, eat all (majority of your supper) and you
    may have a snack after supper.  He loves microwave popcorn or ice
    cream as a treat once we be together as a family in the evening.  
    My husband gets home to late 7 - 7:30 PM or so for us to have 
    supper together. We try to re-enforce the positive and it works
    for the most part for us.

    Just two comments - don't tie money in with food or chores...
    		      - and dont make them eat all the food on their plates...
    
    1st - money should be given to children who are old enough to use it,
          not as a reward for a job well done, but so that they can learn
    	  to manage it and appreciate it.  They should get their allowance
          regardless of how they've behaved.  However, if they fail to do
    	  chores etc. then you do them for them (while they watch you work)
          and then you charge them for your services.  Another example of 
    	  teaching kids the value of money is when mom and dad buy kids
    	  their clothes.  For example, shoes!  You buy the basics and if 
    	  they want more expensive brand names they can use their allowance 
    	  to pay the difference!  Great teaching method for value of money.
    
    2nd - As others have suggested - let the kids determine when they are
    	  full (at the table).  Its their body and they need to learn how to 
    	  'run' it.  Kids are smart if something is bothering them they 
    	  will figure it out on their own.  An example of this is when kids
          learn to put on their own shoes.  Parents get all bent out of sorts 
    	  (at least I used to) when they see their kids with thier shoes on the 
    	  wrong feet.  IF it hurts their feet they'll let you know and then
    	  it can be fixed.  Kids need to learn that their body will tell
    	  them when its full (assuming a heathly normal body).  What I
    	  think we all try to do is make sure that they are eating properly
    	  and the old ploy of 'I'm full' is just a way of getting sweets
    	  and goodies.  Like the wife and I have learned kids are smart and 
          sugar tastes much better than veggies.  Let'um go a little bit
    	  hungry - its a wonderful teacher and kids wont starve...just be
    	  firm when it comes to snacks.  
    
    	  Something we have done is we take leftover food (from their
    	  plates) and store it in the fridge.  If they say "I'm hungry" 
    	  all we have to do is say "oh, well you can finish your supper".
    	  What suprized me was that they do eat it.  This substituted
          snacking for real food.  Works great too!
    
    The wife and I got this advice from a child psychologist who happens to
    have kids of her own (the advice she gives today is different than what
    she used to give - due to learning from her own child-rearing
    experiences).  Her motto was "...if what the child wants to do (eg -
    dress for school in clothes that don't match, wear shoes on the wrong
    feet etc.) AND the activity will NOT harm them either physically, 
    spiritually, or emotionally..." then let the kids do it.  If the kids
    make fun of them at school - they'll learn how to match clothes real
    quick (it wont be mom and dad matching stuff - the kids will KNOW how
    to do it)...if their feet hurt they'll move their shoes onto the right
    foot and etc. etc. etc.  
    
    Oops, back to the topic - we give our kids chores too.  The wife has
    each chore listed on a sheet of paper which is placed in their slot 
    on the work 'calender'.  No stars or anything - they just get to file the
    chore away when its done.  Some chores are weekly and some are daily. 
    The kids get to swap chores too.  They take the trash from inside the
    house outside to the cans, each has a 'dishes' night, vacume, pickup
    family room etc.  Pickup their room, make their beds, put dishes away.
    I cant remember what else we have them do.  By-the-way, this gal we
    heard lecture said not to remind the kids of their chores - just set a
    deadline for when has to be completed.  Then if the deadline passes
    and the chore is still not done you can go to school and embarress them
    in class when they have to go home to do it or you can wake them up at
    11:00PM to get it done.  They soon learn that its better to do the
    chore before the deadline... :-)  Of course that puts the pressure on
    us parents - so you have to set deadlines that you can live with.
    
    David

    RE: base note
    
    I don't know many kids who wet their underpants on purpose at night.
    I think when the bladder is strong enough they will be ok.
    
    Kate