Conference moira::parenting_v3

    Well if he's been like that all along and it didn't bother you
    before, you will probably feel the same towards him as you did prior 
    to being pregnant.  When my wife was pregnant she was extremely
    sensitive.  Especially the third time.  I had to be especially
    careful about how I joked with her etc., after her pregnancy she
    was back to herself again, usually within two weeks.
    
    In my opinion, your husband could help you out a little.  I work first
    shift, my wife works second.  With three kids she doesn't always
    have the time to scrub the floor, or clean the bathroom, so I do it.
    After the kids are in bed, and she's at work I usually try to have
    one 'project' lined up, do a load of laundry, vacuum the rugs,
    etc.  
    
    It's a two way street, 50%/50%.
     
    Good luck,
    Tom   
    

    I'm hoping not to draw too much fire, by suggesting what you are
    feeling is probably very overactive hormones.  Good Lord I remember
    having a complete hissy fit, because he wouldn't change the channel
    from a movie *I felt* had too much violence, killing, and blood.  I
    think I had seen the movie pre pregos and it didn't bother me then.
    
    I too went through a phase, with both pregos, almost identical to
    yours.  I went on a complete "deepender" because he hadn't picked up
    the terry bathmat after his shower.  He hadn't done it a single time
    since we'd been together, so what set me off that time?  When I was
    pregos with AJ we were living with my inlaws, and his younger sister,
    and I had a fit one morning because she hadn't capped the tootpaste,
    and hadn't shut off the curling iron (mine-she had borrowed it) before
    leaving for work, and those gawd awful cigarette butts in the bathroom
    ash tray almost made me nauseated!
    
    Try to sit back, and adopt an attitude of "if I ignore it, either he'll
    do it himself, or it won't get done at all, and no one's going to drop
    dead because it didn't get done!" It's not a life threatening danger,
    so ignore it.
    
    Enjoy the last few weeks!
    Lyn

    Your husband probably hopes it goes away too, so he can continue
    not contributing his share peacefully.  Unless, you want to keep
    up the extra housework yourself anyway, but without those angry
    feelings.

    
>>    It's a two way street, 50%/50%.

   No disrespect intended, but for me, I've had a different outlook on
   things since I started believing that it was really 100%-100%.
   Now, this is just us, perhaps, but if we both try to give it 100%,
   things just seems to go more smoothly.
   
   btw... re: .0 ... hormones and mood swings not withstanding... a
   little *non-confrontational* communication can go a long way in
   many cases...  

   - Tom

    
    I can relate to this one....I'm 10 weeks away and my husband is
    a paramedic...he works 24 on and 72 off.  I come home and the coffee
    table looks like he had a party on it...glasses, dishes, etc.
    His reply...I'll get to it...just probably not when you want me
    to...He will get his own dinner...and do dishes, occasionally.
    
    I blame my hubby's problem on his mother...she did everything for
    him...but he's trying...he even helped me clean out the cabinets this
    weekend....it's just that I let him get away with so much before
    baby....He has made some progress...but bottom-line...I can only
    change me not him....he'll always be the 'slug' I married...I tend
    to think that his mother taught him...men's jobs are more important;
    therefore, when they get home...their day is done...she's even
    apologized to me for creating a monster...
    
    I love his most recent line....I'll help alot more when the baby
    comes....(yeah right!)
    
    I think what's happening to us is our priorities are changing;
    hormones or not.  We are willing to make sacrifices in our life for
    our children but why aren't our husbands?  I talk to him about
    how I feel and how scared sometimes I feel that 'I can't do everything'
    after the baby is born...I think he realizes his impact on me and
    is really trying...Why should we 'HAVE' to go back to the way things
    were before the baby?
    
    I agree with a previous note....talk to him...maybe he will
    understand...worse comes to worse...the housework doesn't get done,
    the meals don't get cooked and then they have to fend for themselves!
    and that's not such a bad idea...
    
    Good luck...we have our hands full, huh?
    
    Kristen
    

    My husband was very helpful when I was pregnant with my son.  He did
    almost all of the house cleaning and would being in the groceries when
    I when shoping.  He would put away all the stuff that had to go up high
    in the closets and would get them out when I needed them.  
    
    As for when the baby was born.  He was also a big help then too.  He
    would change him, and feed him at night once I stopped nursing so that
    I could get some sleep.  He is still a big help and my son just turned
    2 last Monday.  
    
    Maybe you should take him to one of you doctors appointments and have
    you OB suggest that he help you out around the house.  Cause I know if
    you do to much lifting and reaching you can pull a muscel, cause it
    happened to me and I had to stay in bed for a day or so till it heeled.
    
    Hope things change once the baby is born.  You never know a new baby
    might do some good for him.
    
    Liz

    
    I have to laugh when I see women describe their husbands "helping."
    When Steve and I got married I use to thank him for "helping" with the
    dishes, cooking, cleaning, etc.  Even though we all talked about
    husbands doing their fair share I guess I still really thought that
    everything was my responsibility.  Well, about the 4th or 5th time I
    thanked Steve, he finally got angry and said he wasn't "helping", it was
    his responsibility as much as mine.  
    
    Well, since Stephanie's arrived (10/18/91) he's even more "helpful",
    and I agree that children make it 100%/100%.  There's no time for any
    less effort.  I guess I really am lucky.
    
    Just another perspective.
    Bev

Ditto, Ditto .3 !!!

It's a lot easier to do more than your share -- and less stressful, too! --
when there's just you two adults in the house.

You add a newborn baby -- you add broken and shortened sleep, much more
responsibility (and not always timely to your schedule!), lots more work
... and a big bundle of love and joy brought into your hearts -- but the 
reality remains! -- all the added work, stress and lack of sleep WILL 
wear you down!

I strongly believe you had best optimize on communication skills and
delegating domestic chores and "family" responsibilities and priorities
BEFORE the baby comes along -- as AFTER the baby is DEFINATELY NOT the time
to start getting things "into a controllable, manageable" fashion.  It
JUST WON'T WORK THAT WAY!!!

I also agree with a previous noter ... a lot has to do with your husband's
upbringing.  Jim's folks did not believe in separating domestic tasks
and responsbilities based on "sex"!  Jim does dishes, vacumns, can reheat
leftovers (and cook when he has to!), changes the beds, runs errands,
spends lots of time with Juli, maintains a house! ... took Juli to his 
campus office EVERY DAY (while I worked fulltime) ... and finished his 
PhD studies (and Juli just turned 2)!  Jim "backpacked Juli" from 2 weeks 
of age until 13 months of age (when he returned to DEC fulltime).

I had to bend, too ... Jim/I spend laborous hours agreeing on just what
"HAD" to happen and "WHEN" ... we then took the chores/tasks that each of
us didn't mind doing and then distributed the ones we didn't like amongst
ourselves.  I had to learn not to nag when Jim didn't get things done 
"when I wanted them done", but to let him do his chores when he wanted to
(even if he was putting away the vacumn when company arrived!).  I also
had to learn to let go (things weren't going to get done as often or as
well as they did in the past) ... AND Jim's standard is less then mine.
But we both learned to move into an acceptable grey-area standard, communicate
and "work together" (in more ways than one!).

So, for us, several things happened ... we HAD to communicate, we had to bend,
we had to BOTH "do more than we ever did in the past" and do things we've
NEVER had to do in the past ... and toss away scorecards (I washed the
dishes last night, it's your turn tonight!!!, nag, nag, nag!)!  Pitching
in and "both working", so the "family" can enjoy time "together" was our
ultimate goal.

Working "together" is the key here ... and working out the details before
the baby is highly suggested.

My two cents,
Dottie

    I am not so sure as the others might be that some of this change
    in attitude can be attributed to hormones. Although I admit that
    pregnancy DOES change me (I get absent minded and messy!), I have
    a feeling its more than just that in your case. You are probably also
    frustrated that you cannot do as much as you wished because of your
    size. Finally, you think, this is NOT all MY job! 
    I also agree with those who say its easier to do the job yourself
    than to cause stress between you. I do it too sometimes. Although
    my husband is willing to do whatever he can to help, he will not thing
    of doing these things himself (he doesn't SEE what needs to be done)
    but when I ask him to do a chore he does it.
    
    You must make a decision though, do you think you will be happy if
    after the baby is born your roles are unchanged? The baby will present
    even more work, under more stressful conditions. If you think it is
    time to share the work and responsibility, try making him more a part
    of the pregnancy; as another suggested, take him to the doctor with
    you (to me this is essential, and we ALWAYS do it). Are you attending
    a prenatal class together? Have you discussed things like baby's needs
    together (clothes, furniture, DIAPERS).
    Let him know you are BOTH going to be parents, and need to share in all
    that implies. If not, be prepared to go at it alone, as you have up 
    to now. Don't think much will change, if at this stage you feel he
    is not helping you enough, unless you start seriously discussing the 
    issue with him.
    
    Monica
    
    

    Let me come to the defense of the men here.  I know many fathers who
    take part in the upbringing of the children as well as contribute to
    the upkeep of the house.  We may not do it to your specifications, but
    that does not make it the wrong way or less.  I would say that, from
    the couples I know, ment who do little or nothing are very much in the
    minority.  Another phenomenon I have seen is that women don't want to
    let go of their chores, and (as been expressed in here) he doesn't do
    it as well as I do.  This may be a defense mechanism on the mother's
    part that eith the man may do it better than she did or that this job
    is her territory and maybe a feeling of not being needed.  Now, I'm not
    saying that there aren't parisites out there, but I am saying that they
    are on both sides of the street and that most things can be worked out
    with a little tiime and effort.  Lastly I would say don't try and run
    your home like a business, as it is not.  Be flexible, work together,
    and talk to one another and when you do talk to one another remember
    how much you love one another.
    
    Mike

    I don't think we wish to turn this into a battle of the sexes!
    
    >>>I would say that, from the couples I know, ment who do little or
    >>>nothing are very much in the minority. 
     
    I would have definitely to agree on that, Mike -- I don't think these
    previous comments are there to belittle the joint responsiblity of 
    rearing children and keeping house that most couples share. Most
    of these comments are centred around the basenote, where the person
    percieves an unequal division. 
    
    Monica
    
    
    
    

I'm sure you are probably realizing that some changes should have come a long
time ago (it's difficult to change something after it has been "working" that
way for a while), but in light of an upcoming child, it is a perfect time to
start thinking about a new division of responsibilities.

You do not have time to do all of the cooking.  Therefore you will encounter
more eating out costs.  From now on he should plan to eat out more, or find
another alternative.

You do not have time to clean all of the time.  Therefore you will hire a maid
at a cost of $x per week.  If he doesn't like it perhaps he can suggest another
alternative.

Buy paper plates, utensils, cups, etc..... (Environmentalists will shiver at
this thought) and just throw them away after meals.  This might bother him, or
might not.  If it does, suggest that the eating utensils don't jump from the
table back into the cupboard, and you no longer have time for the steps between.

Keep in mind that this comes from one who feeds, cleans, dresses, drops, picks
up, pays all bills, balances check book, files tax returns, keeps track of
insurance claims, remembers birthdays, grocery shops, handles doctor 
appointments, and works 55+ hours per week - (kids are 2.5 and 1) -
AND brings in more than 50% of the household income.

We do have a maid, boys to cut the grass, and he does a few of the things I
despise (feeds dogs, picks up dog poop, takes out garbage, fixes most things).
So other than a few times when my stress level is high, I don't feel too
unequal about it all.  I cook once in a blue moon, and if we eat at home he
usually "cooks" (t.v. dinners, or on the grill).

Let us know what - if anything - changes.  And how you did it!

Kristen

    I agree with Kristen - this is the time to put some changes in place.
    
    We got a housecleaner when I got pregnant.  I was adamant.  I
    physically was unable to hold down a full time job where I was on my
    feet all day teaching, and spend my weekends doing heavy cleaning.
    After the baby, we retained the housecleaner.  I have recently scaled
    her back to once a month (from twice a month), because I can manage the
    quick cleaning needed in between.  But it's still very important.
    
    We've discussed division of labor in some other note.  A number of
    valuable points were made.  Try making a list of everything that
    absolutely must get done on a regular basis, including frequency and
    duration of the task.  Then see what tasks your husband will assume. 
    Some men are happy to food shop, some will cook, some will clean up the
    dishes if you cook.  See what he's least averse to doing, and go along
    with that.
    
    When my husband refused to understand the stress I was under, I finally
    had to tell him that my DOCTOR insisted I get more rest.  I told him
    the pregnancy was at risk.  Maybe I fibbed a little, but our marriage
    sure was at risk!
    
    Time to bring in the heavy artillery, sad to say.  Can you get your
    mother-in-law to talk to him?
    
    Good luck,
    Laura

    Please check note 327 on division of labor.
    
    Laura
    (set moderator cap/on)

    This topic brings up something else.  How do you let your mate suffer
    the consequences without yourself also suffering, if that's possible?
     For instance, this woman's husband may manipulate his wife into
    thinking she's asking too much.  He may not want to change.  What's
    her recourse short of divorce?  The basenoter seems to imply her
    grievnesses to be blamed on herself, by way of her condition, already.
    
    I hope she will stand her ground.  I'm finding that very hard to
    do myself.  

    
    SRATGA::SCARBERRY_CI brought up a good point in .15.  I am the one who
    is suffering if my husband does not do his chores.  Leaving his dirty
    socks in the middle of the living room floor drives me crazy.  Instead
    of asking him 5 times and waiting 3 hours for him to pick them up, I
    rather just pick them up myself.  He does say that I am asking too much
    because I want things to be done immediately when I ask.  
    
    For the past five years we have been living together, I think he has 
    changed all he can change.  Now he irons his shirts!  In his parent's 
    house, he doesn't even know where the drinking glasses are.  The maid
    will bring him water when he wants it.   
    
    Oh well, going back to the reason why I started the base note.  I knew
    that would be the way he was going to be when I married him, I am just 
    amazed with the anger I have caused by these little things, because I 
    don't remember I have ever been so angry before.  Thanks for all the
    replies.  I do feel better knowing other people had experienced the
    same thing during their preganancies because of the physical changes,
    the hormone, or whatever.  I really don't expect my husband to change
    after the baby is born.  We have had many talks, he says he will do
    whatever I ask him to, but the chances are, he will take his time to
    finish things I will get done in couple seconds.  I don't want to keep
    my expectation too high, and I don't want my marriage to suffer because
    of house work.  If he does help out, it will be a pleasant surprise.
    

    To the basenoter, I had/have the same problem. My husband came from a 
    family where the mother did  everything.  Although I have seen my
    father-in-law do some things like mow the lawn and the shopping
    sometimes.  But my mother-in-law did everything for the boys, my
    husband doesn't even know how to wash a dish.  We have a 7 month old
    daughter and although he is a great father, he never once woke up to
    feed her when she was a newborn, or even helped me with the housework
    when I came home from the hospital.  I had my mother stay with me for a
    week.  But he is a wonderful father!!!!!  But I still have the problem
    with doing everything, I get so mad sometimes that I have to leave the
    house for a few minutes.  I don't yell in front of my daughter.  So my
    opinion is if your husband is like my husband, don't expect him to
    change at all!!!  But try and talk to him.  Make a list of all the
    chores and try to divide them equally among you both.  I tried this
    too, but it didn't work.  Maybe it will work for you.
    
    Good Luck!
    
     

    re: .0
    
    I understand how you feel.  I have two kids.  During both  
    preganacies, I had the same feeling toward my husband.  Both  
    times, the feeling lasted even after babies were born.  But things
    did better gradually.  First, I became less emotional.
    Secondly, as the kids get older, they get more attach to their 
    father.  And I see a big change in his attitude.  He still
    doesn't help out the housework.  But he now plays with the kids
    so that I can be free to do the chores.  We have a live-out
    nanny.  By paying a little more, our nanny will also do light
    housework, which is a big help.  We both learned to
    compromised.  He became a less (or not at all) picky eater.
    I learned that children also mean messy.
    
    I am sure things will get better.  Right now, please cheer
    up and enjoy your final moment of preganacy.
    
    Wendy

    My husband and I are both pretty lazy and not the neatest of people. 
    However, I can't stand a dirty house.  When I was pregnant, my husband
    did his share of work (did before I was pregnant too, and now also)...
    like vacuuming (never dusting) and some cooking.  My biggest complaint
    is that he *never* puts his dishes in the sink or rinses them off. 
    Many times I come down in the morning only to find last night dishes on
    the counter NEXT to the sink (never in it) and rarely are the dishes
    rinsed out (orange juice is the worst).  Anyway, my point is that he
    won't change.  He takes great care of our daughter and lets me have
    Sunday mornings all to myself (he and Jackie go out) to do what I want
    (sleep or clean or whatever suits my whim).  I've mentioned to him more
    than once about his dirty dishes (or whatever) and he looks at me and
    apologizes (only to do it again).  I've become a little more picky
    about how clean my house is since Jackie was born, but it's not the end
    of the world.  I wasn't as bad during my pregnancy because we had
    someone come in once a week, but God knows, other pididilly things set
    me off.  I wouldn't worry about these feelings.  Do let him know how
    you feel, otherwise how is he really to know.
    
    Sorry if I rambled a bit here.
    Mary