[Search for users] [Overall Top Noters] [List of all Conferences] [Download this site]

Conference moira::parenting_v3

Title:Parenting
Notice:READ 1.27 BEFORE WRITING
Moderator:CSC32::DUBOIS
Created:Wed May 30 1990
Last Modified:Tue May 27 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:1364
Total number of notes:23848

1129.0. "Daycare change in admin OR respect for adults" by JAWS::TRIPP () Fri Sep 06 1991 15:03

    Last week a notice was sent home from my son's preschool/daycare.  It's
    a full-time situation for him.  The notice was to inform the parents
    that the lead teacher/director has resigned, and would be replaced by
    two women, whose names were given in the letter.  It said the Preschool
    teacher would remain the same.  And along with this was an invitation
    to a farwell party for the departing teacher.
    
    This week I have met one of the two teachers, my husband has met what I
    believe to be the other teacher, and my son has encountered what
    appears to be a 180degree change in attitude.
    
    My son tells us he is required to call ALL the teachers by Ms., Miss or
    Mrs. [LAST name], now we're talking about 3 to 5 year olds here.  I do
    have a problem with this starting with the last names are tongue
    twisters for adults, let alone preschoolers, and the change includes
    the preschool teacher who remained and has always been called by her
    FIRST name.  
    
    I agree with teaching kids respect for adults, but why not 
    Miss [firstname], and I feel that a sudden change from a familiar
    firstname to suddenly calling  the remaining teacher Miss [lastna
    firstname to a new strange way of calling the teacher must be difficult
    at best.  After all, nothing about the teacher has changed, only the
    directive of the new administration has.  Oh yes, the children are now
    being called by their "real" names not the familiar nicknames.  My "AJ"
    is now being called Andrew, complete with a new name tag with "Andrew" on
    his Cubby.  The kids seemed stressed that what used to be their friend
    of say Katie are now being required to call classmates by "Katherine",
    Jimmy became James and so on.  It's so unfamiliar to them.
    
    The other thing I notice when I picked him up is that everything has
    been labeled, the gerbil has his name on the cage, everybody knows what
    his name is,  the other objects have labels on them and so on.  Now
    c'mon the kids know what the objects are called, why the labeling?
    
    Oh my son was threatened with expulsion yesterday, according to a
    conversation my husband had with the teacher, because he didn't clean
    up the bathroom after using it.  Seems what I believe happened is that
    he had an "accident" and in an attempt to clean up after himself, in a
    preschool way, made the mess worse.  The teacher is adament that she
    CAN NOT leave the room to tend to him in the bathroom while other
    children are there. (The bathroom is literally accross a  foot hall)
    Case in point, the other night I picked up my son and the teacher wanted 
    me to see a craft he had done that day which was in the "craft" room.  
    She made all the chilren stop their play and come accross the hall so I 
    could see my son's craft, without her leaving the children alone. 
    I will be having a discussion with the teacher to see if I can clarify 
    what exactly happened, and if a threat to expell was really made.  She 
    seemed to make it clear that her job was to "teach the children and 
    administer the school", not clean up after them.  I say baloney, she 
    ought to be a friend to these children first, and adminster SECOND.
    
    Am I being harsh in my observations?  Is this new adminstrator/teacher
    turning my son's preschool into a Military Academy? should I be 
    looking for another daycare?  Opinions please?? He's been there a
    little over a year, and has another year til he goes to Kindegarten,
    and has the option of spending the other half of his kindegarten day
    at the same place, they offer this to parents.  Some of these kids are
    in kindegarten now, and have been there since they were 3.
    
    Lyn
T.RTitleUserPersonal
Name
DateLines
1129.1Respect, shmrespectICS::NELSONKFri Sep 06 1991 15:2017
    Is this administrator an ex-drill instructor for the Marines?? :-)
    
    I think switching from calling kids by their nicknames to their full
    names is Mickey Mouse.  I agree with you, I seee no reason why the
    children can't call the teachers "Miss <firstname>."
    
    I'd get some more facts before making a final decision, but I do
    believe that if I were in your shoes, I would be considering another
    daycare situation.
    
    And FWIW, "respect" has nothing to do with what you call a person and
    everything to do with how you feel.  I went to Catholic school, and
    while I behaved properly -- it was Sister This and Father That -- I had
    feelings of respect toward maybe a grand total of four teachers.  In
    other words, I was (for the most part) well-behaved, but I feel that
    respect is something you earn.  As far as I was concerned, damned few
    of my teachers earned mine.  Just MHO.
1129.2POWDML::SATOWFri Sep 06 1991 16:0616
I think that everyone should be called what they want to be called, whether 
it's "Miss <Lastname>" or "AJ", unless perhaps it's vulgar or offensive.  

The labels seem like a reasonable, may even a good teaching tool.  After all, 
isn't the way that we learn vocabulary? -- that is seeing a picture of a 
gerbil, and seeing "gerbil" beside it?

Teaching kids to Clean up after themselves is a good thing, but threatening 
with expulsion is no way to teach.  

My guess is that the last name thing and the labels would go unnoticed were it 
not for the regimentation.  I agree with you that seems a bit extreme, and not 
a great environment for kids.  

Clay

1129.3Too HarshCSC32::DUBOISSister of SapphoFri Sep 06 1991 16:5813
Sounds scary to me, especially about the "cleaning up" part.  My daycare
"teacher" said that she is cleaning all day long (after snacks, shaving cream
that they play with, etc, etc).  You just can't expect preschoolers to do a 
good job of cleaning up after themselves.  Sometimes they do, sometimes they
don't, even when they are *trying*.

The nicknames thing sounds really weird.  I would have a *long* talk with
the regular teacher and find out all I could, then have a talk with the ones
making the new rules.

Let us know what happens!

      Carol
1129.4.1, .2 & .3 - what they said!JAWS::WOOLNERPhotographer is fuzzy, underdeveloped and denseFri Sep 06 1991 18:0217
    I think <firstname> or Miss <firstname> is a reasonable format for
    preschoolers and Ks, but I wouldn't even object to Miss <lastname> if
    there was a little room for phasing in to the new format.  Alex's
    kindergarten used the Miss Firstname format last year, but during the
    summer they decided to change it to Miss Lastname--gently, slowly, with
    a lot of humor (the teachers even had a hard time switching over!). 
    And I think Miss A$#@%^%^$# (alphabet-soup) should consider being
    called Miss A. or Miss Firstname.
    
    I feel strongly that the *child* should decide which variation(s) of
    his or her given name should be used by the school.  
    
    This new regime really does sound rigid, harsh, militaristic... but
    maybe the administration doesn't realize it's coming across that way. 
    Let us know what they say!
    
    Leslie
1129.5That's not *MY* name!BCSE::WEIERPatty, DTN 381-0877Mon Sep 09 1991 14:069
    ... speaking of nicknames ... my sisters fiance' (of long ago) was
    named Albert, but nicknamed Buddy from the day he was born.  His first
    day of school they were reading off names for attendance, and the
    teacher kept calling "Albert?"  "Albert <lastname>?" and repeating it,
    and he was sitting there thinking WHO is this ALBERT kid!!  I wish he'd
    hurry up and speak up!!
    
    Buddy never knew his name was Albert ... (-:
    
1129.6an update, after parent/teacher meetingJAWS::TRIPPMon Sep 09 1991 16:3566
    Just wanted to bring you up to date on this situation, folowing a
    meeting I had with the teacher and her supervisor, who aparently also
    fills in as a teacher occationally.  The meeting, first with the
    teacher and eventually included the other supervisor/teacher was, to
    put it mildly "heated" at times.  The focus of the problem first seems
    to be a "superior" attitude on the part of the teacher, secondly as I
    had stated in some notes earlier this year my son still has an
    occational toileting accident, (stool not urine), and the message I
    clearly heard was although the previous lead teacher had allowed it to
    go on, and the handbook of the center states that children will be
    given 30 days to adjust, and MUST be accident free, period, and that
    they, the new administration will no longer tolerate it.  Sort of an
    odd play on words here, I question if they planned on "expelling" him,
    they said emphatically NO, but "he would be asked to leave" if the
    accidents occured.
    
    I clearly go the idea that the new people are positively paranoid about
    being sued, even to the extent that if there is even one student still
    at the center they cannot leave the VERY room the kids are in at the
    moment, not even to tend to a child in the bathroom, only a few feet
    away.  If this is the case shouldn't my son have someone go to the
    bathroom with him?  They also want a letter from my son's doctor stating 
    what his problem is, and what treatment is being given, I say if
    they're going to "split hairs in the law", then I don't even have to
    conform to this request citing "Patient confidentiality" and I even 
    offered to set up a four way concall between the teacher, supervisor, 
    me and the doctor, but that wouldn't do "because it isn't in writing".
    They refuse to recognize that the previous teacher, the doctor and I had a
    concall in just last June, act as if the call didn't happen since the
    teacher aparently didn't make any note in his record, but did relate to
    the other teacher the context of the concall, and up til now things
    have been going fairly well.  They want the contact made with the
    doctor immediately, and won't even wait until my regularly scheduled
    apointment with him in just under two weeks.
    
    I was also informed that Mass laws allow a one to 12 ratio for daycare,
    my belief is that is was one to SIX, when was the law changed.
    
    I am at this point wondering if they have the right to "ask him to
    leave" since the patterns have been set for over a year now, and
    nothing has changed except the administration?  I wonder if just a
    casual conversation with a lawyer might help me realize if we have any
    rights in this situation.
    
    The teachers still continue to demand being called Ms, Mrs. Miss
    Lastname, even to the extent of wearing sticky nametags, as if the kids
    can actually read them anyway.
    
    During the conversation it was implied that if he has a physical defect
    then it automatically equates to a mental delay, and they also
    requested I have him tested (retested is more like it), and when I told
    them I had had him tested just a little over a year ago, and he was
    found to be about a year AHEAD intellectually, both women looked a me as 
    if I were making up stories.
    
    Needless to say my weekend didn't start out too well, and I am rather
    upset at the new administration, and just don't know which direction to
    go with this.  I'd be curious if they loose any children with the new
    teachers.  Kind of funny how the old teachers used to wear short,
    slacks, coulotts and casual clothes and not be afraid to clean
    bathrooms, and even mop floors (I had observed this several times),
    these new ones wear "office attire", and seem offended at cleaning
    bathrooms.
    
    What's this mother to do???
    Lyn
1129.7Why are you fighting to stay there?TLE::MINAR::BISHOPMon Sep 09 1991 16:509
    Lyn, given that this is a private outfit, and so you don't _have_
    to send your son there, why don't you just switch to some other
    place you like more?
    
    Going to a lawyer may satisfy your desire to make the center suffer,
    but the cost to you and your family will be greater (in both money
    and time) than any benefit you'll get.
    
    		-John Bishop
1129.8KAOFS::S_BROOKMon Sep 09 1991 17:187
    The easiest way to give these folks the message that their attitudes
    are up the creek is to abandon the place.  How do other parents feel ?
    If they are anything like as up in arms as you are, then you can be
    sure that you won't be alone in leaving them.  In which case, they'll
    fairly quickly have their just deserts for an intolerable regimen.
    
    Stuart
1129.9Why stay??? Well......JAWS::TRIPPMon Sep 09 1991 17:3818
    Why do I stay there?  Well my first knee jerk reaction was, in fact to
    pull him out and look for something else, but wouldn't that be a major
    disruption in both our lives?   And realistically what would
    that prove?  The center always has opening for kids, so what's one more
    opening more or less? They do basically have an excellent curiculum,
    some great side trips, and camp during the summer at no extra cost, Second,
     he's been there over a year and hasreally made some good friends.  (A 
    couple are DEC families) and third I don't want him to think that if a 
    situation gets bad that mom's going to come to the rescue and pull him out
    and put him somewhere else. What happens next year this time in Public 
    schools if he doesn't like his new teacher?  And finally they have been 
    very understanding, well the old adminstration, if I need to skip a week's
    tuition and pay two weeks next week, and in fact have allowed me to only 
    pay for the days he actually attends, which includes not paying for 
    holidays, and also have, in the past, given me a slight decrease in 
    tuition when I was having some severe financial problems. But all that 
    comes down to  you get what you pay for, I guess.
                       
1129.10try to work togetherCNTROL::STOLICNYMon Sep 09 1991 18:3432
    
    
    Would it help to consider some of the new regimentation as a
    preparation for the type of routine that AJ will find in kindergarten
    next year?   Perhaps some additional rules, more formal name-calling
    is appropriate for his age group - he's 4+, right?  
    
    It sounds like there are some benefits of this arrangement that make
    it worthwhile to you.   Then, I think it comes to a point of choosing
    your battles wisely.   Were it me, I wouldn't sweat the Ms. lastname
    stuff, but would definitely take issue with trying to change the names
    that the kids go by!   
    
    As far as the toileting accidents are concerned, looking at this with
    a give-and-take attitude, what can be done to help the teachers deal
    with this?    What would they like to see happen? (besides the obvious -
    no accidents!)  What role can AJ play?   If he makes a mess trying to
    clean it up, is it better to ask him to inform the teachers pronto 
    when he has an accident?   You made mention of Public school next year
    - have you researched how toileting accidents are handled in the
    public school system?   Maybe there is a precedent or procedure there
    that you can make your current aware of in addition to preparing a 
    path if this "problem" still exists next year.
    
    Another perhaps off the wall suggestion, is there any way to make
    AJ regular - that is to say, to make his movements fall during his
    at-home time so that daycare won't have to deal with it?   
    
    Carol
      
    
    
1129.11teacher/kid ratio changes with ageCNTROL::STOLICNYMon Sep 09 1991 18:376
    
    As regards the daycare ratio, I'm not sure of the exact numbers,
    but I do know that the age of the children affects the ratios. 
    Perhaps, at age 4, the ration is 1 teacher to 12 children.  
    Kindergarten will probably be 1 to 20, right?
    
1129.12PERFCT::WOOLNERPhotographer is fuzzy, underdeveloped and denseMon Sep 09 1991 18:567
    The private kindergarten Alex went to kept the ratio at 1:10 (3
    teachers, 30 kids), but I'm not sure what the ratio requirement is.  We
    never ran into a problem with kids being escorted to the bathroom
    because Alex's daycare and K classes always had more than one teacher;
    they "spelled" each other for recess, bathroom etc.
    
    Leslie
1129.13More ratiosBCSE::WEIERPatty, DTN 381-0877Mon Sep 09 1991 19:545
    The private school that Chris goes to, the ratio is 1:10, ages 3-6ish.
    I think it's 1:5 or 6 for under 3, and 1:3-4 for 'in diapers' or
    infants.
    
    Patty
1129.14How does AJ feel about all this?ICS::NELSONKMon Sep 09 1991 23:278
    I guess that only you and AJ and your spouse/SO can decide if
    staying in the present situation is right for you.  Has AJ said
    anything as to whether *he* likes it or not?  He's bound to miss
    a favorite teacher, but some kids really enjoy a fairly strict
    regime.  You never can tell.  I would go by how AJ feels/behaves
    both at the center and at home.
    
    Good luck, let us know what you decide.
1129.15Juli's daycare ...CALS::JENSENTue Sep 10 1991 11:4045
    Don't have time to read all the responses, but expect to by tomorrow!
    
    As for Juli's daycare, all the teachers are addressed as Mz, Miss,
    Mrs...  However, when Jim/I are talking with the teachers, we do call
    them by their first names and have asked both the teachers and kids
    to refer to us by our first names (and they do).
    
    As for cleaning ... the kids are expected to put away their lunch
    boxes, hang up their coats, hats, etc. ... and all toys must be put
    back on the shelves (2-3X), bikes lined up, trash in the barrels, and
    sleeping bags in pillows.  The teachers wipe up the tables and chairs
    and they have a fellow come in nightly to clean the numerous bathrooms,
    floors, public areas (teachers rotate on cleaning up the kitchen).
    Stage_1 kids (15 months - 2+) are assisted (mostly in diapers
    anyways!), but the older kids are expected to go to the bathroom
    themselves AND clean up their own accidents (themselves, their clothes
    and any puddles ANYWHERE).
    
    Although the daycare rabbit has a name (Tuxedo), there's no name tag.
    No one or nothing is really "labelled" (except when they go offsite on
    field trips).  Kids are called by their "nicknames", although if they
    have both an American and a non-American name, the instructors do use
    ONLY the American name.
    
    I am extremely pleased with Juli's daycare.  We noticed a BIG
    difference in her attitude and behavior after being in this center for
    only 2-3 months!!!  She asks rather than demands, uses words like
    "please" and "thank you", waits her turn, SHARES (this was a big
    achievement!) and is much neater (both with toys and food).  The
    "structure" has helped Juli (and us!). 
    
    The center is stern on some rules (ie. taking a nap, food manners,
    behavior - no hitting, yelling, fighting), let flexible on others
    (ie. nicknames, activities, etc).
    
    I do know that every daycare center is DIFFERENT, not to mention that
    daycare centers vary from home care centers.  You may want to scout out
    some other centers which is more in line with you/AJ's needs (every kid
    and parent is different, too!).
    
    Good luck ... I know it's very important that both you and your child
    enjoy the daycare arrangements ... his development depends on it and
    your sanity depends on it!
    
    Dottie
1129.16SRATGA::SCARBERRY_CITue Sep 10 1991 16:1118
    I see no reason why you can't seek out a new daycare.  You need
    to weigh out the pros and cons of the present situation against
    a new one.  
    
    I don't think your child will be messed up by going to a new place
    unless this was something of a habit.  Jeez, my family packed up
    and moved plenty of times.  But, you mentioned that you didn't want
    to come to his rescue when things go bad.  As the adult in this
    matter, you will know when to act on his behalf.
    
    I think the labeling is a great idea.  Helps children to read. 
    This formal name thing for children, however, I don't understand.
     For most people, your name-as in what you are called for the most
    part, is what you are-is how you relate.  Why should someone, big
    or small, be brow-beaten into accepting something that unfamiliar.
     But, I do agree with proper respect for the teachers.  I guess
    to what extent is something you will judge and eventually pass onto
    your son.
1129.17Today's developments....JAWS::TRIPPWed Sep 11 1991 14:4848
    OK, here's the "latest development in this miserable saga.
    
    I picked AJ up last night, he had obviously had an "accident" sometime
    during the day, he had his spare shorts on.  He was also positively
    "burning up" (he had 103 temp when I took it at home), and was just
    miserable, and talking like his throat hurt terribly.  Teacher didn't
    bother to tell me about his day, until she had asked if I had contacted
    the psycologist, which I told her I hadn't, and actually at this point
    I don't plan to until I see him at a regular apointment in a week and a
    half.  The she informs me that he's been listless and just acting like
    he doesn't feel good "all day".  I contained my rage and simply said
    that I would be contacting his pedi immediately after we got home.  I
    also made it clear that historically when he starts having (stool)
    accidents it's usually a clear sign that he's coming down with
    something, usually a cold.  I also got the sense he's being made to
    look "different" to the other kids, and not being treated the same. 
    Some of the kids made comments that sounded like "oh good AJ's leaving
    now" which hurt me terribly.  AJ also said something last night that
    his "best friend" won't play with him anymore. He seemed deeply upset
    about that.  He also seems to not really want to go to "school" lately.
    I'm hearing things like "Today's not a school day today, right mom?",
    and this is only the beginning of the week.  The way I see it, he's got
    at least 14 more years of school in front of him, I don't want him to
    start kindegarten with a horrible attitude towards school.
    
    So today he's home with Strep throat and the fever is still high.  His
    dad took "the morning shift" and I'm leaving at noon so his dad can go
    to work this afternoon.
    
    I have also made a decision to move him out of there as quickly as I
    can.  I'm exploring both permanent and interum options.  Which may even
    include asking his previous home daycare provider if she'll take him
    until I can find something more "academic", like a center.  It may cost
    me more money, but I think it's worth it in the long run.
    
    I have also just made an appointment to have him reevaluated by the
    developmental people at UMass Medical.  His previous evaluation showed
    him to be ahead intellectually, and at this point I guess I'm the one
    who needs to know his intellect hasn't slipped, and that his speech is
    in line with his age.
    
    I think at this point, I need recommendations (off-line of course) for
    new daycare centers in the Northboro, Marlboro or Shrewsbury area.
    We would still like to keep him near where we work (MRO) and where my
    inlaws live (Northboro).
    
    
    Lyn
1129.18Right decision, IMOTANNAY::BETTELSCheryl, Eur. Ext. Res. Prg., DTN 821-4022Thu Sep 12 1991 10:2218
Lyn,

I think you've made the right decision.  I wish with my son I'd recognised the
"signs" earlier that there was a problem with his regular school.  He was
being physically abused by his teacher (treated differently, yanked out of
his chair by the hair, daily "punishments") and never said a thing.  His
grades got worse and worse and in conferences with his teacher we got messages
like "Dirk doesn't seem interested" (No wonder!).  By the time the teachers had
changed, it was past hope.  We only found out from him 4 years after it had
occurred that the abuse had been going on and by then the teacher had a
mental breakdown and been "retired".

We changed schools but I fear that permanent damage may have been done to his
self-esteem, curiosity, and desire to learn.

It is truly so difficult to be a parent and protect these children we love.

Cheryl
1129.19CAPNET::AGULEThu Sep 12 1991 11:2213
    Lyn,
    
    I think you made the right decision also.  As if a physical delay
    relates to intellect...sounds like the teacher has a real serious
    education problem, does she really have one (education)?
    
    I would almost say, that if you know the other DEC families that have
    children enrolled there, I would set up a meeting with them to discuss
    the goings on, what is she doing to other kids self-esteem?  
    
    GOOD LUCK!  
    
    Karen
1129.20A few thought.HDLITE::FLEURYThu Sep 12 1991 11:4918
    Lynn,
    
    I have just caught up with the replies here and I have a suggestion. 
    You need to find out the credentials of the new "administrator".  There
    are strict guideline and requirements for that position.  Also, the
    treatment of your child would NOT be deemed acceptable by the Office
    for Children.  Such a drastic change in the care provided warrents
    attention by the OFC in my opinion.  It sounds like the new
    administration is more concerned about paperwork than caring for the
    children.  I will look up the regs for you regarding the ratios for
    Mass.  If you want to light a small fire under them, ask whether they
    consider their behavior regarding your son's medical problem
    discrimination.  If they are truely concerned about lawsuits, they
    should pay attention to that!!
    
    Keep us informed,
    
    Dan
1129.21Good luck!ICS::NELSONKThu Sep 12 1991 17:241
    Good luck and God bless, Lyn!!  Hugs to your husband & AJ.
1129.22Support in your direction...DPDMAI::CAMPAGNATransplanted NorthernerThu Sep 12 1991 20:0113
    I support your decision to move him-the sooner the better ! And I
    second the noters suggestion to contact the Office for Children - I
    would imagine that it is against the Center's own internal policies not
    to call a parent when a child is obviously ill - Strep Throat and 103
    degree temp - I would not have been able to contain my rage !! And
    isn't Strep contagious, so that by failing to call a parent for a sick
    child, they have negligently exposed the rest of the class ?? This
    administration is not very impressive from where I sit.....
    
    Good luck,
    
    Leeann
     
1129.23Heavy artillary? !!!!!!!!!!!!CALS::JENSENFri Sep 13 1991 14:1566
I hope you don't skew and BBQ me for this  ... but here goes!

WOW!!!  Calling in the heavy artillary?  I have a 2-year old who attends a
daycare center, so I know where you're coming from ... but I'm not totally
sure I understand your feelings (or reactions).

Yes, I'd be upset if Juli were running a fever and showing signs of strep.
But I must also say (as a PARENT!), fevers occur and spike within a moment's
notice ... and I'm sure many even go UNnoticed.  I remember (not too long
ago), Jim got a call (while attending a meeting) that Juli was "a little
under the weather ...".  Needless to say, he wasn't aware of the situation and
didn't respond until 2 hours after the call ... Juli was now comfortably
resting!  (I was offsite.)  Juli's head instructor knew Juli was "showing
signs of illness, but NOT critically ill", so they gave Juli liquids, rocked
her, pampered her, cleaned her up and patiently waited for us to get back to
them.  As soon as Jim found out, he contacted me ... we decided that "I" would
handle it, I waited out her "nap" and then took her to the doctor's office.
They gave her special treatment and handled the situation NO DIFFERENTLY
than I would have and Juli survived just FINE (yes, she had a fever and an
ear infection, got her Rx and went back to school in two days)!

Had they NOT contacted me, yes, I would be upset, but I would take up the
issue with the Director (probably after first having talked to Juli's head
instructor).  I would NOT be calling the Department of "whatever"!

I also "listen" to their feedback.  I HEAR when they say Juli had a bad day.
I HEAR when they say Juli could use a little re-enforcement on this or that.
Jim/I "value" their feedback.  If we disagree, we DISCUSS it with them.
I have tremendous respect and trust in Juli's instructors ... afterall, they
have Juli during the prime-hours of 5 days weekly ... they are molding her
intelligence, emotional stability, social skills, behavior, physical and
motor skills ... and if we WERE NOT HAPPY with them, Juli would NOT BE there!
She'd be in a center that she was happy in and we were happy with!

The center uses "Ms, Mrs. Miss ..." and I have NO problem with that and I
have no problem with their schedules, expectations, disciplinary actions,
contacting us, evaluations of Juli, feedback/suggestions.  Jim/I see it
during "unexpected" visits and through day-to-day interaction with Juli's
instructors.  I "see" it in Juli's behavior AT HOME.

I know it's both difficult and emotional to watch your child being "attacked"
... you believe s/he doesn't deserve this and no one has the right to do this.
Unfortunately, everyone is DIFFERENT ... our personalities, behavior and
expectations may not always "meshly nicely" with the world we "share" with
others.

Try to understand the changes and fully evaluate if it's REALLY the "changes" 
which are affecting you and your child ... or perhaps if it's more
the result of differences in your parenting styles and child's personality
which isn't necessarily a good "fit" for you/your child with the "new 
management and environment" of this daycare center.  These recent changes
may be escalating and fueling your reactions to "situations" (behavior
complaints).

I'd also heavily think about WHY I'm calling in the heavy artillary and
WHAT I expect to accomplish from this action.

If you can't work through this with the center, than by all means, find
one more fitting to your needs ... there are plenty out there!  (of course,
like you mentioned, if price is driving the selection criteria, you may
not have as many options available to you from which to choose).

I hope this didn't come across harshly ... it wasn't meant to.

Just my two cents!
Dottie
1129.24and when the relationship does break down ...CALS::JENSENFri Sep 13 1991 14:3911
Another thing that crossed my mind ... and I forgot to mention in my previous
note is the fact that once a relationship breaks down, no matter how hard
you try to "make it work", it just isn't the same anymore.

The center's staffing will be walking on "egg shells", YOU will be walking
on egg shells!!! ... and every future irritation will become more sensitive.

Sometimes changes are best ...

Dottie
1129.25An Update....MCIS5::TRIPPMon Sep 23 1991 16:4849
    Just an update to the happenings of the last few days, I have shifted
    AJ to a new "all age" daycare center in Westboro. (Thanks for the tip
    Tracy!).  He spent Friday there as a trial, and all weekend he kept
    asking me if "today's a school day", such music to this mother's ears!
    
    As I queried several centers and home daycare situations I realized
    that the expectations of the New administration (old daycare) was
    unrealistic.  I really thought he was some kind of out of control
    monster, who had "socially unacceptable" toileting habits.  Everyone I
    talked to from adminstrators to teachers, and even other parents gave
    me reasurance that there's not an awful lot "wrong" with his behavior
    and occational toileting accidents.
    
    The scenario went something like, I went out at noon to talk to a
    couple centers, I had called a few home providers as well.  I saw the
    center in "full action", lunch time, followed by quiet time and was
    pleased with what I saw.  I was up front with the staff that he may be 
    a handful, and may have toileting accidents.  The staff seemed
    unbothered by either.  I agreed to leave him Friday as a trial for
    everyone, and was again pleased by the morning routine, and how quickly
    he settled in.  He came home happy, confident, with an almost empty
    lunchbox, he had "rested", not napped, but this is OK with them.
    
    I have also called the Office for Children and made a formal complaint. 
    Among my complaints was to check the possibility that there may be lead
    paint in the very old building housing the old daycare, their caring
    (or lack of) while he was in the bathroom, the teacher to child ratio.
    The woman who took the report though 1 to 12 was "a bit high", and also
    I asked them to check out the policy with disabled children, and the
    refusal of the old center to accept children with disabilities.  
    
    I picked up AJ Thursday night and was greeted with a letter from the
    teacher's supervisor *demanding* I provide them, on letterhead from the
    psycologist, a letter explaining what his problems included by a
    certain date or he would be asked to leave the center "because we
    refused to cooperate".  I told the teacher without opening the letter
    that whatever it said didn't matter as AJ "wouldn't be coming back
    anymore".  They do require a two week notice, but decided it was best
    this way, since it appears they really didn't want him anyway.
    
    The teacher had the nerve, (or was it ignorance) to ask my reasons for
    withdrawing him.  I simply looked at her and told her that it should be
    obvious, and left.
    
    I just want to thank everyone, both off-line and here, for all the
    support and suggestions I received, and I will post periodic progress
    reports!
    
    Lyn 
1129.26KAOFS::S_BROOKMon Sep 23 1991 17:1315
    First of all, well done!  Sometimes, when you are in the middle of a
    situation like this, it is easy to forget what the situation really should
    be like.  After all is said and done, you were paying for a service
    that they were not willing to provide, and that there are people out
    there who are.
    
    It really does sound like this old daycare has forgotten their
    'raison d'etre' (reason for being) and want to set up an environment
    almost stricter than a school!  
    
    Stuart
    
    
    
    
1129.27Glad you're doing ok!GEMINI::NICKERSONWed Sep 25 1991 16:1311
    You have definetly done the right thing for both your son and yourself. 
    The new administrators of the old daycare obviously thought they were
    running a business only when, in fact, a daycare should simulate, as
    closely as possible a warm, loving environment.
    
    Will you get any reports on your complaint?  I'd be interested in
    hearing what the results are.
    
    Hope your son continues to do well in his new daycare.
    
    Linda