Conference moira::parenting_v3

    I am *not*...repeat *NOT*...willing to turn this into a punishment
    note, but, since asked....
    We ask our children to do something *once*. A second request is
    accompanied by disciplinary action, *every time*. Consequently, we
    rarely have to ask more than once. By not "meaning" it the first time,
    and by asking over and over, your are training your child that he
    needn't do it the first time, because he *knows* you will ask him
    again! So, since he'll get a second chance (and maybe a third, etc.),
    what is his motivation to comply the first time?
    
    Try asking once and then having consequences for a second time.
    (whatever consequences are in you home...time out, withholding
    priveleges, spanking....whatever). Being that he is five, I would
    explain to him first what you will do. Something like this...
    "Pete, we both know how tiring and annoying it is to each of us, when I
    have to ask you more than once to do something. So, from know on, I'm
    only going to ask you once. If you don't do it, you will get (fill in
    the blank...time out, no TV, spanking, etc.). Do you understand? Good."
    
    Now, the essential part here is you *MUST* carry this out *every* time
    he doesn't comply. And this is *HARD*! And often inconvenient. But
    essential. He will, obviously, test these new limits fairly often to
    begin with, but if you stick with it, life will be a whole lot more
    pleasant for both of you!
    
    Good luck!
    
    --dave--

Are you talking about one instruction or a list of instructions?  The inability
to get past the first item in a list of instructions is very often a symptom
of attention deficit disorder (ADD).  Check out ASABET::LEARNING_DISABILITIES.

    re: -1
    
    This is also very common for five year olds!  
    
    -sandy
    

    I'm talking about one instruction at a time.  It's just general stuff. 
    Nothing that I'm too concerned about.  
    
    For example. I'll say "Pete, put your sneakers on".  He'll kinda putter
    over to where the shoes are but on the way, he'll stop and finish his
    milk, see a pencil, decide to draw a little something, rearrange the
    magnets on the fridge, and completely forget what he started out to do.
    Innocent stuff like that.  
    
    Linda
      

    My son is 4.6 and I'm so happy it's not just him.  I didn't have this
    trouble with my daughter.  I was beginning to wonder.  I know what you
    are going through.  I've started to say, I only say things once and so
    when I find my self on the 3rd request that's the line I use and he
    begins to respond rather rapidly.  I've even picked up his toys and
    "thrown them away" (hid for later retrival) and that doesn't seem to
    get him to move on the first or second request.  I guess I have to
    start looking for other consequences.  Anybody have another suggestion?
    

    
    
    .1 seems to be the most logical.
    

    It sounds like a "who's in control" issue. Kids will always
    test. I agree with .1. I believe children thrive on structure
    and want to know what the limits are so don't feel guilty 
    about laying down the law!
    
    Alice

    ALL,
    
    My five year old boy is the same !!! Is it just boys ? He does not seem
    to do it to be naughty, he just GETS DISTRACTED !!!!!!
    
    

    .1 could have been verbatum instructions from the psycologist we *used*
    to see when we thought we were dealing with hyperactivity.  Turns out
    IT'S THE AGE!  She said 4 to 6 is when a lot of "testing" is done.  She
    emphasised that under no condtions does he get a SECOND chance.  He
    either does it the first time, correctly, or there is discipline taken. 
    He just doesn't get a second chance.  She suggested that if you
    anticpate resistance to some request that you give a warning of couple
    to 5 minutes, like "in 5 minutes I want you to go brush your teeth and
    get ready for bed", or even set an oven timer and tell him when the
    timer goes "ding" that meal time is over.  He'll go hungry about once,
    take it from this mom!
    
    Doing things this way I often feel like a real louse, but sometimes ya
    got to do, what ya got to do!
    
    Hang in there!
    Lyn
    

    I vote with .1 also, it is typical of the age, and he/she is testing
    you, but it is time to set consequences for actions. A child of that
    age is old enough for some kind of discipline if they ignore parental
    requests.
    
    It drives me *nuts* when I see parents in the supermarket who
    say 'susie'johnie' don't do that, and then totally ignore the
    child when they go right ahead and do what they've been forbidden
    to do.
    
    As the now mother of 4 teenagers and one young adult, I can say
    from  my own experience and that of friends and aquaintances, that
    you will have a much worse teenage period (tho it will still be hard)
    if you accustom your children to ignoring you until they are darn 
    ready to respond as perschoolers. 
    
    Bonnie

    
    What age does this start working, or should you try?  My 2 1/2 yr old
    does the same thing.  Ask him to do something, even "come here, we have
    to go now"  is either ignored, or "huh?"  I know he knows what I mean.
    I'm not sure if he is to young to have consequences?  Sometimes it will
    work if I am trying to put his shoes on and he is watching Sesame St, I
    will say "If you do not let me put your shoes on I will turn the TV
    off.  He responds pretty well with that, but only if it is something he
    is doing right now.  Future consequences are beyond his thoughts....
    
    

    AHHHH.... I've been going through the same thing with my 3.5 year old.
    
    She's been turning me into my mother, it's depressing.  I always said
    I'm not going to yell at my kid like my mother yelled at us.  Guess
    what,  easier said than done.  I'm trying really hard to come up with
    other ways.
    
    Katie is the same way, I'm constantly repeating myself with her to pick
    up her toys, get dressed, brush her teeth.  I'm sure with her it's
    partly "who's in control" and lack of interest.  I'm having a hard time
    dealing with this mostly because of her age.
    
    This is what we've come up with, please give me clues if I'm going in
    the right direction.
    
    I started a chart, days of the week.  I drew at the bottom a happy face
    and a sad face then there is a total column at the end of the week.
    Every time she doesn't do something (reasonable) the first time we ask
    we draw a sad face, when she's good listens, etc she gets a happy face.
    If she get more happys totaled at the end of the week she'll get
    "rewarded". If there are more sads than no reward.
    
    Does this sound like a good plan for a 3.5 year old?   She's become
    very strong willed.  Her old "punishment" was time out.  She just gets
    up and won't time out.  If any talk about a "spanking" comes into the
    picture she says we're bad girls/boys and we should get a spanking. 
    
     

    I think a week is too long a time period for that age. Try giving
    her a small reward for more smiley faces after each day.
    
    Bonnie

    re. 12
    We also don't allow "fresh talk", such as telling us that we are bad,
    etc. If spanking is what you choose (let's not get into whether it's
    right or wrong here!), then I would stick with it. In our home, sassing
    us would automatically earn the punishment that had been promised. We
    firmly believe children should respect their parents and that's part of
    it. We don't tell them we hate them, they're "bad", etc....I won't
    tolerate them saying it to us. That's part of being a family. Ifyou
    can't treat those closest to you with love and kindness, there isn't
    much hope for the rest of the world.
    
    I agree a week is way too long. A day is fine with 3.5, or you might
    even want to start with half days.
    
    Re. the reply about the 2.5 year old...we have a 2 yr. old, and he
    certainly can understand that there are consequences for his actions!
    And he, too, gets disciplined after being told once, as long as we are
    sure he heard us (which we are careful about). He is the type who won't
    do what he's told until you stand up, and then he runs and does it. In
    our home...that's too late! If we have to stand up, then he gets the
    disciplinary action, whethter he then is doing the required activity or
    not. We simply explain (and trust me, he understnads quite well!) that
    he didn't do it the first time, and so he gets "his medicine" so to
    speak. When applied consistently, it really works. Our personal pet
    peeve is the running away or ignoring when told to come here. That one
    could be so dangerous, if he were in a situation where it were
    literally a matter of life or death for him to obey. (like in a parking
    lot, the side of a road, sharp tools, etc.). It meets with the toughest
    discipline.
    
    Good luck! Take control now, and then it's easier to allow more freedom
    as they get older. It's much harder to do it in reverse!
    
    --dave-- 
    

    I too think that rewards once a week are much too long to wait.  The
    way we handle rewards, in this case we reward AJ if he's had a good day
    and not had any toileting accidents, it first check his backpack bag,
    in the parking lot of daycare, and if he has no soiled underpants he
    gets a piece of sugar free bubble gum for the ride home.  Once a week
    if he's had a good day (on Thursdays usually which is Mom and AJ
    together night) I take him with me to workout, and after I get through
    working out we get permission from the staff to allow him to swim in
    the pool with me.  This is a real special treat, since kids are really
    only allowed during "family swim time" which is another night.
    
    For those of you not familiar with our situation, AJ has had some
    surgical problems at birth making his toiltet training a little
    delayed. These were the suggestions given us by the psycologist who
    deals with toileting problems.  So far this works like a charm (knock
    on wood of course).  He clearly said daily rewards, as opposed to once
    a week rewards.
    
    Lyn
    

    It works!!  I tried the approach of saying it once or consequence and
    my 4.6 year old really has started to move now.  It's like magic.  I
    told him Friday night what we were going to do and he said OK.  There
    were a couple of times I did have to say "How many times do I speak?"
    and he would say "once" and scoot to do whatever was told.  He also got
    the time out chair a couple of times, a little spanking, the tv shut
    off and grounded from nintido (all depending on what was going on).
    
    The cutest thing was when I shut off a tv program he really wanted to
    see because he hadn't cleaned his room when I told him too earlier was
    he ran upstairs and I heard him moving (the tornado had hit!) I went up
    to do a check before he got the tv back again, the stuff he couldn't
    fit in the toy box went under his bed!  Well what can I say.  The room
    was clean!  I told him I would let it go this time but on tomorrow he
    had to clean out under his bed!  (mostly just his books that he didn't 
    want to put on his shelf).  I NEVER saw him move so fast to clean a
    mess like this.  SOOO, I think it's great.  I don't get upset and if he
    does, he'll learn quickly so he won't need to get upset either.  Thanks
    for the suggestion of speaking once and then taking action.
    
    Mary
    

	One other point which was mentioned in passing when (I believe it was) 
Dave was talking about dealing with his 2 year old, but could stand to be 
stressed:  Make sure that you have their attention.  

	Katie, who will be two in 3 weeks, is pretty good about reacting the 
first time.  The times she's most likely to not move on the first time, are 
when she's engrossed in something.  If I'm in doubt as to whether or not she's 
going to hear me (like when she's watching Pooh Bear :-) ), I start with 
"Katie, look at Mommy." When I have eye contact, I tell her what it is I wanted 
her to do.   

Tracey

    
    My almost 6 yr old daughter is the same. I usually have to remind
    her 2-3 times before anything gets done. I sometimes calls her 
    "scattered-brain". If I am really serious, I stand there until the
    job gets done, getting rid of the distraction (TV, toys, etc)
    as well. But once I get her attention, she finishes the job.
    So, I take it as a phase and that she doesn't mean to annoy me
    or ignore me. I don't think punishment or disciple is called for
    in this case - getting rid of the competition (for attention)
    works better.
    
    
    
    
    Eva.  

    Our almost 6 year old is the same way sometimes - MUCH better than he
    used to be, but as .-1 notes, the problem is usually something else
    attracting his attention - usually TV.  He gets once - MAYBE twice (if
    I'm not sure he heard me the first time) to do whatever, before the
    distraction is removed (TV OFF until the desired activity is complete). 
    If *I* have to turn the TV off (or whatever to remove the distraction), 
    it stays off (or isn't allowed) for the rest of the night.
    
    Seems to work, and we hardly ever have to resort to the 'rest of the
    night' stuff.
    
    He's better now then last year, so I guess they grow through it.
    
    Good Luck!