Conference moira::parenting_v3

    After I delivered my baby and then the placenta, the doctor checked
    the placenta out quite carefully and in addition (and this is kind
    of gross), she reach into my uterus to clean out anything else that
    was left.  She said that part might be painful for a minute (which
    it wasn't) but she said doing it that way was quicker and less 
    painful in the long run as opposed to pushing on the stomach daily
    (or whatever it is they do that I'm not really sure of).
    
    I didn't think the bleeding or cramping you explained your sister
    feeling seemed out of the ordinary - until the massive bleeding,
    of course.
    
    Anyway, the doctor should have checked out the placenta carefully.
    By the sounds of it, it was very obvious it wasn't all there.  
    
    I'm glad to hear your sister is getting better.  
    
    Donna

    This happened to an Aunt of mine about 20 years ago.  I haven't heard
    of it since then, but I'm sure someone else will reply to this note
    that it happened to them.
    
    What a story!  I hope your sister recovers soon.  It must be hard for
    you, being pregnant yourself.  I know I hated to hear the horror
    stories while pregnant.  You can make up enough of them yourself!
    
    When I delivered Gina, the doctor spent plenty of time getting the
    placenta out.  And as .1 said, he looked at the placenta to see if it
    was all there.  Since I didn't look at it, I don't know what is meant
    by that.
    
    Best wishes to your sister,
    
    judy

    When our last son was born (and being the naturally curious type), I
    noticed the doctor examining the placenta and asked what he was looking
    for. He is a natural born teacher, and readily explained how they look
    for tears, pieces missing, etc. To me, it was not especially obvious
    that it was "all there", but he felt confident it was. I know he spent
    a good five minutes examining it. The doctor who delivered our first
    two kids also did the same thing. As an aside, I was amazed at how huge
    the placenta is! It would seem to me it would be plenty obvious if 2/3
    of it was left inside!
    
    --dave--

    	I spoke with my sister (Pat) last night after getting a message on
    my answering machine from another sister saying that Pat was doing very
    poorly.
    
    	She is still suffering tremendously and additional surgery is still
    not out of the question. Apparently the infection has spread to her
    entire pelvis area and she is very weak and is not clear headed. Her
    biggest concern is the newborn (she also has three older children) and
    that he is not getting his mother's attention.
    
    	It is just overwhelming to think that my sister may be dying
    because of this act of stupidity.
    
    				Wendy

         Your sister will be in my thoughts and prayers.  I hope she comes
    out of it soon.  Keep us posted.
    

    I got chills when I read your base note.  Something similar happened to
    me 18 months ago after my second son was born and it still difficult
    for me to think about it.
    
    I was so happy about Andrew's birth.  My first delivery was C-section
    and I really wanted a natural birth experience.  After he was born I
    was so eager to see him and hold him that I tried to ignore the
    placenta delivery (since everyone said it was so insignificant after
    childbirth).  This was hard to do since the midwife was having obvious
    difficulty and I was very uncomfortable.  It wasn't minutes later,
    before I even had a chance to hold Andrew, that I was being rushed to
    the operating room.  I was hemorrhaging uncontrollably.  The OB/GYN
    didn't know what was going on nor how to stop it.  In the chaos of the
    operating room I heard my stats constantly reported - and they were
    dropping.  "I'm dying" I thought.  And then I remembered the image of 
    my newborn son staring into my eyes and I knew I had to hang on - that
    I wanted to be around to raise my two sons.  I went into shock.
    
    Two hours later I awoke totally disorientated.  Gradually I came to
    understand what had happened.  I lost lots of blood - more than half.  
    The Dr had performed several DNC's with no results.  He was considering a
    hysterectomy when he found a dimple in my uterus.  He popped it back in
    place and the remainder of my placenta came out.  The bleeding stopped.
    
    It was a difficult experience for me, and in many ways more difficult
    for my family who could do nothing but watch while it happened and
    while I recovered.  There were no clear answers to our questions - why
    did it happen, why did it take so long to resolve, etc.  I realized then 
    that the people we entrust our lives to are only people who, unfortunately,
    are prone to error.  I've responded to doctors differently ever since,
    by trusting my gut alot more. 
    
    I sincerely hope that the worst of it is now over for your sister and that 
    with time she will heal both physically and emotionally.  My heart goes
    out to you as you worry and wait.
    
    

    
    It happened to a friend of mine--similiar to what happened to Emily in
    the previous note.
    
    The placenta simply did not come out--and before anyone knew what was
    happening--my friend started hemoraging--and they actually lost her
    blood pressure!  She was given general anasthesia and numerous D&Cs
    were performed.  The placenta finally came out.
    
    The worst part, I think was that my friend was out of it for a good 2
    days afterword--but despite this and despite being unable to nurse for
    a good 3 days--she was able to develop a healthy nursing relationship
    with her baby that lasted a full year.
    
    Actually, the worst part was the scary part of course.  But I mean in
    terms of the worst part for the baby.
    
    I think it speaks well for the MDs who have saved the uterus of both
    Emily and of my friend.  Many MDs would just go in and do a
    hysterectomy.
    
    Bonnie
    
    

    
    
    Keep us informed, Wendy.
    
    Your sister has my thoughts and prayers as well.
    
    
    					Darlene

    	I spoke with Pat yesterday and she is doing much better. I hadn't
    realized that the infection had actually gotten into her blood, that is
    just not a good sign. But she's a fighter and she's literally clawing
    her way back.

    	With the wisdom of one who has come so close, she told me that for
    a few days following the surgery, she really "felt bad" (she was also
    critical on those days). For those days, she thought of nothing save
    getting from one minute to the next. On either the third or fourth day
    following the surgery, she woke up and still felt bad but "something
    had changed". She told me that she felt lighter, felt a sense of peace
    and knew that she was going to be better. (I knew exactly what she was
    talking about because I have also felt that "shift" when I was in a
    critical situation, which probably helps to explain why this whole
    episode affected me so deeply) 

    	She is currently at home and she recognizes that this is something
    that the entire family needs to heal from and she also recognizes that
    it is going to take time. She started talking about her terror during
    the entire incident and how she literally watched the blood pour from
    her body and could do nothing to stop it. She has snapshot memories of
    trying to wipe up the blood from the bathroom floor but not being able
    to because there was so much. She also said that from the time they
    decided to go to the hospital until they time they arrived, she soaked
    through 10 towels (not pads) and through her gown and all over the
    hospital table. She told me that all she could do at that point was to
    apologize to the nurses for making a mess. (you've got to cope what
    everway you can) She says that she still can't talk about what
    happened to anyone without starting to cry.

    	She has a lot of healing to do both physically and emotionally (I
    think we all do) but she is well on her way. I've told her about the
    well wishes I've been receiving and the stories of something similar
    happening to others and she is very thankful and grateful for the
    information and concern.

    	The whole episode still brings tears to my eyes and I wasn't even 
    the one going through it. I can only imagine what she is going through.

    	Thank you all for your concern, both my sister and I appreciate it.

    			Wendy 

    
    I am so relieved that your sister is better. It must be a relief for
    the entire family. I hope that she is able to have help at home right
    now so that she can let herself heal, along with her older children,
    newborn and husband. 
    
    Just a piece of advise - if she is pursing this potential malpractice 
    legally, please advise her to find an attorney who specializes in this 
    area. She can probably get a referral from the local Bar Association.
                                                   
    

    Speaking about the plecenta remindes me that nine years ago
    when my twin grandaughters were born my daughter-in-law told
    me that they tell from the plecenta whether the girls are 
    identical or not.  Has anyone out there every heard of this?
    As it turned out Erin and Meghan are identical and have
    a little sister who is five years old.
    Betty
    

    Pardon my ignorance, but I don't understand why having part of the
    placenta remain after delivery causes uncontrollable hemorhaging (sp).

    The placenta is the organ by which a fetus receives food and blood from
    the mother.  It is a direct link to the mother's bloodstream.  If a
    portion of the placenta is left it is like an open wound with a
    continuous blood flow.
    
    With my second child I had a condition where the placenta actually grew
    into the wall of the uterus.  There was no way it was going to come out
    on its own so I had a D&C while on the delivery table.  At that I bled
    very heavily for 2-3 weeks (enough to lose 20 lbs!).  It is an
    extremely unpleasant experience.

    	My husband asked the same question, my best explanation is that the
    placenta acts as a closed loop for circulating blood tot he baby, blood
    goes through it and is returned to the mother, the blood never leaves
    the body. If the placenta is ripped then the circuit becomes open and
    blood flows freely and sometimes uncontrollably from the body to the
    outside. Because of the richness of blood vessels in the placenta there
    is a potential problem of lots of blood leaving.

    	I don't understand why it took so long for the hemorrhaging to show
    up in my sister, unless the initial pressure inside the uterus helped
    to stem the blood flow (remember they left a lot in) and with the
    swelling from the infection, it just might have acted as pressure until
    the body could literally hold back no more.

    	It does make one very concerned.

    	On a somewhat related note, knowing that these things can happen,
    has anyone stored blood in advance of delivery in the event that
    something went wrong. Marc is the same blood type as I am and wants to
    make sure that there are a few units of "clean blood" available should
    an occasion similar to this occur. Is this something that is suggested,
    or are we just being paranoid?
    
    			Wendy
    
    
    

    My husband is type O and he stored blood and was ready to give more
    when I went into labor.  Whole blood doesn't last long and giving blood
    while pregnant is not a good idea.

    Wendy:
    
    My husband & I asked about his donating blood to be set aside for my
    use if something should go wrong during delivery.  We were told that
    they wouldn't allow the husband to donate the blood in case there were
    any genetic abnormalities.
    
    The explanation given to us is that if I were to receive his blood and
    then we were to have another child, any genetic abnormalities would be
    multiplied.
    
    Of course, they also tried to reassure us that the chances were slim
    that I would need blood. 
    
    - Terry
    

    .16, I really don't understand what your doctor meant.  I could
    understand not wanting to use someone's (your husband's) blood if it
    were infected, or the wrong RH factor, but in case he had genetic
    abnormalities??
    
    I could maybe even understand it if said genetic abnormalities made it
    impossible for your system to tolerate his blood... but to extrapolate
    the abnormalities into a future pregnancy seems really outlandish to
    me.  How does his (genetically abnormal) blood affect the genetic
    makeup of your eggs??  And if he's genetically abnormal, it's all of
    him (including sperm), not just his blood, so the chances of a
    genetically abnormal child should remain the same for all pregnancies. 
    Clarification, anybody?
    
    Leslie

re .16, .17

I found the comment in .16 incomprehensible, too; but I speculated that the 
idea might have been something like this:

	In an Rh problem, the child may inherit the father's blood type (Rh+),
	which is incompatible with the mother's blood type (Rh-), to the
	extent that once she has become sensitized (typically in an earlier
	pregnancy, also with an Rh+ fetus), she may begin producing anti-RH+
	antibodies, which will attack the fetus's Rh+ blood.

	Thus, you would never transfuse an Rh- woman with her husband's
	(or anyone else's) Rh+ blood.

Of course, you can test for Rh factor before giving a transfusion.  But
(although I've never heard of this) there might be a concern that the same
sort of problem might crop up in other ways.  That is, once you give a
woman a transfusion of her husband's blood, you have sensitized her 
(vaccinated her, in effect) against any factors in his blood which are
incompatible with hers.  Then, if any subsequent child inherits those
factors from the father, you have set the stage for an Rh-like problem.

	-Neil

RE: .16

I was wondering too.  The only thing I can think of is the Rh factor.  If the
woman is Rh negative and the man is Rh positive, then her blood would become
sensitive to Rh positive blood.  That would effect future pregnancies.

I find this interesting, because I looked into donating my own blood for storage
just in case.  The midwives (and supervising doctor) were willing to allow it,
as long as I did it before the last trimester.  I asked the hospital blood bank
director about it too, and he convinced me that, statistically, the risk of
HIV infection would be small.

In addition, since I am affected by the Rh factor situation (I'm Rh-, my
husband is Rh+), I had the Rhogam shots to prevent sensitivity in possible
future pregnancies.  Perhaps they can do that after transfusion too, (although
I don't remember any mention of that in the Rhogam pamphlet). Rhogam's a blood 
product...

    
    
    RE: .16
    
    I'm confused too.  Does this mean that we should not give/receive blood
    from anyone?  The statement sounds as if no differences exist between the
    blood type and RH factor, that no one would want to receive blood
    because their genes would be compromised.
    
    				
    				  

    I stored two units of my own blood before delivering my son. As long
    as your OB or midwife gives the OK, it is considered routine. You 
    plan for a couple of weeks between donations. I'd say I did the first
    one at due-date-minus-six-weeks, then another two or three weeks
    later.        
    
    Lucy
    

There are other blood factors, like Rhesus, that can cause "blue baby
syndrome".  Some are more rare and of more consequence than others.
One that comes to mind was one that we had fun with for our second was
called Kell.  Somehow somewhere my wife became sensitized to it and
thus there was a lot of concern in case the baby was Kell + 

We were told that there are rarely Kell reactions like Rhesus, and that
while they are usually far less severe, occasionally problems occur.

    
    Re: back a few
    
    I thought that a womans blood volume increases as pregnancy progress'
    for the purpose of having the extra volume to compensate for
    loses due to the birthing process. If this is true is it wise for
    the mother to 'donate' her own blood for the occasion? Will the body
    compensate for the reduced volume? What are the potential problems
    if after giving blood you deliver early (without enough time for the
    body to replace the blood removed)?
    
    Curious ...
    
    Doug.

    
    I asked my OB about my donating blood "just in case."  He told me that
    the most they'd allow me to donate would be 1-2 units since, being
    pregnant, they want to keep my blood level up.
    
    He also told me that he would never transfuse me for just 1-2 units--if
    I need a transfusion (which he said was very unlikely), it would be for
    far more than that.  He basically didn't recommend me donating--and
    assured me that the blood supply is safe.
    
    

    Sorry, 	

    	I just don't buy that the blood supply is entirely safe. Every once
    in awhile on the news you hear about people who are *still* getting
    aids from contaminated blood. I used to work in a medical laboratory
    and human error alone accounted for many false results. I, myself, was
    responsible for reporting a positive blood culture on a baby who was
    negative because someone had switched the blood vials (a mistake that I
    never did again).

    	I also have a friend who just last year got hepatitis from a blood
    transfusion. There are so many blood borne conditions that are not even
    tested for.

    	Whenever I have to go in for surgery, I always donate my own blood
    and I have signed statements all over my medical records indicating
    that I refuse to accept blood bank blood (I also make sure that friends
    who are O+ are available for emergency transfusions).

    	Sure the blood supply is safer than what it was and perhaps someday
    it will be very safe, but if it can be avoided, why take the chance?

			Wendy

    
    Gee--thanks for making my day.  Am undergoing surgery (c-section) in a 
    few weeks--my doctor tells me I can't donate blood "just in case" and 
    you're telling me the blood supply isn't safe...
    
    Now what?
    
    

    Well, first thing I'd do is to try to determine some statistics on how
    many c-sections have actually required transfusions during or as a
    result of the surgery.  That to make me feel more confident about the
    procedure ... use that to weigh against the safety of the blood supply.
    
    Otherwise, what about having family donate blood for you, will the doctors 
    allow you that  ?
    
    Mind you if it meant life or death on the table for  want of a
    transfusion, I'd take a risk on the blood bank.
    
    Stuart

    FWIW, I didn't receive any blood during or as a result of my C-sec. 
    Although I was billed for "blood work," the doctors assured me that it
    was just ($75 worth of) analysis, etc.  They could have been a LITTLE
    MORE SPECIFIC on the bill, don't you think?  This was January '85, and
    they didn't start screening for AIDS til 4/85, so you can imagine how I
    reacted to the invoice (whaddya mean, `pay us for possibly infecting 
    you'?).
    
    Leslie

    
    Yeah, I don't think transfusions are at all common with c-sections--I
    didn't get or need a transfusion when I had my section w/ Hannah.  I'm
    just concerned with a "just in case" scenario.
    
    Bonnie
    
    

I realized it was a just in case ... but I was just thinking that it is
easy to get a little overwhelmed with worrying about it when maybe that
"just-in-case" is maybe 1 in 1000 -- which could well be less than the
risk of complications from general anaesthesia.

Yes, it is cause for concern ... again, some hard stats on the risks from
the public blood bank would be helpful ... after all there are hundreds
of transfusions daily, but how many of these people come down with aids
or other serious problems ?  The problems make news ... successes don't.

Stuart

    I had asked if I shoul donate before my c-section 'just in case', and
    they said it was absolutely unnecessary, and that my Dr had NEVER had
    to give any blood from a c-section.
    
    Why won't they let you 'just in case'?  Ask your Dr how many (if any)
    women he's had to give blood to for a c-section.  I'd be surprised if
    it was as often as 1 in 1,000!
    
    patty

    I have heard that the blood supply is *very* safe, but not *100%* safe,
    and probably never will be. *very* safe because the (supposedly) only
    Aids infected blood that gets through is that in which the donator was
    infected withing the last 6 mos. After that, it shows up in the
    screening. When donating, you are also given every opportunity to label
    your own blood "do not transfuse", anonymously (through bar code
    labels). I guess the theory is that you may have second thoughts once
    you give the blood, and decide you're not sure if you're a "safe" donor
    or not. I would think that would also cut the risk some. Of course,
    there is always the human testing error factor mentioned in a previous
    reply, and that is why it will likely never be 100% safe.
    
    All in all, given dying from too little blood, or using the blood bank
    suppley, I'd choose the blood bank supply any day of the week!  I
    believe the person who replied saying that you wouldn't get a
    transfusion for just 1 or 2 units is correct. Therefore donating your
    own 1 or 2 units would just not do. Better to have friends and
    relatives lined up "just in case" if you are really concerned.
    
    I know when my mother-in-law had open heart surgery, they told her that
    only about 1/4 of all patients need a transfusion! I found this
    amazing! I mean, they are operating on the *heart*! She ended up being
    one of the ones who did need a transfusion, and being in a far away
    city from family and friends, had to get blood bank blood. They did not
    even consider a transfusion till she was down by 3 units, and did it
    when she was down by 4 units. And then they only gave her 2 units. As
    her doctor put it, "you are much more likely to die in a car accident
    on the way home from the hospital than from Aids from those 2 units of
    blood"!
    
    Wendy,
    I hope your sister continues to recuperate quickly.
    
    --dave--

    Dave, (.32)
    
    This is kind of a nit, but in the example of your mother-in-law,
    she was transfused (at whatever point) with 2 units. So if I had
    2 units of my blood stored before my child's birth, it might work
    out the same way for me. This is the reason I decided to bank my
    own blood last time... haven't decided yet for the next one.
    
    Lucy
    

    I just wanted to add a couple thoughts here, in the case here arn't we
    discussing a need for blood that arose after she had been discharged
    from the hospital after delivery?  Blood donated in anticipation of a
    delivery is frozen until needed, and if not used within 48 hours is
    then discarded.  If this were the case, by the time you went home with
    the baby your pre donated blood would likely not be available,
    hopefully used to someone else's benefit, or perhaps discarded.
    
    When AJ was having his many surgeries I too was extremely hesitant when
    the surgeon told me he was placing XX number of units on "standby" for
    the surgery.  I made it quite clear to the surgeon that I wanted a
    blood donation used only as a last resort.  
    
    There are other options, AJ and I have different blood types, but the
    same RH factor, so I would be compatable to donate to him.  There is
    also something called "synthetic blood" I'm not sure what's in it, but
    from my EMT training as well as one of the DEC Valuing Differences
    things, we learned that this type of blood is acceptable to whichever
    religion it is that forbids blood transfusions.  Maybe "synthectic
    blood would be a safe option?
    
    FYI, whenever you donate blood an extra vial or two is drawn, this vial
    is the one used to test for AIDS, Hepatitis, and other blood diseases.
    It would seem almost foolproof since the labels are the same ones used
    on the blood donation bag at least that's the way I see it.
    
    Lyn

    	It would certainly *seem* almost foolproof but you are not figuring
    in human error and incubation time for certain diseases. You could have
    been exposed to AIDS, have the active virus, give blood and still not
    *test* positive for six months even though you harbor the virus.

    	I'm not trying to scare anyone. In fact the blood supply is
    certainly safer than its been before, but I also agree that blood
    should *only* be received in a life or death situation and *after* all
    other avenues (relatives, stored blood, saline) have been exhausted.


	We were at the midwives yesterday and we asked about giving our own
    blood (Marc is compatible) to keep in storage. The midwife suggested
    that we contact the hospital directly and that it would not be a
    problem for both Marc and *myself* (!) to donate. She agreed that it
    would be a good idea and she also agreed that blood bank blood should
    be avoided if possible.

    	The giving of blood seems like a wise decision as one of the things
    we discovered yesterday is that my hip muscles which had been
    previously surgically cut twice seem to be pulling too much and could
    very well tear apart during delivery. (our family has a very
    interesting medical history). Should this happen, I would have to go in
    for orthopedic surgery immediately following the birth. With chances
    like that you can BET that there will be at least 3 pints of our blood
    waiting for me. If I don't use it, then the blood supply will be 3
    pints safer for someone else.

    	Again, your mileage may vary, I am *very* biased about laboratory
    procedures and the possibility of human error. I spent too much time in
    a lab and know what goes on and how much error is "allowed" in a normal
    result.

    			   Wendy

    
    When I delivered Courtenay last year, I asked to view the placenta.
    Like .3 I was amazed at how huge it was.  The doctor also placed her
    hand inside to check to see if it was all out and then took time, I
    don't remember how long as I was examining my baby, but she did take
    a long time viewing it and with her hand inside me.  (It wasn't
    painful!)  I hope your sister will be able to have additional children
    (if she wishes to).  Keep us posted on your sister's recovery.
    
    Rose Marie

    	As an update, I spoke to my sister yesterday and she says that she
    is doing very well and that she "is completely over this whole
    episode". In the next breath she said that if they (my midwives) did
    not check my placenta after I gave birth, that my sister was going to
    fly up here to check it out herself. I guess that in some regards she
    will always have some remaining fear about what happened. But she
    sounded strong and healthy.

    	On a related note, another one of my sisters (I have millions of
    'em) gave birth to her baby, Ethan, on Saturday morning. Although this
    was her first baby, from start to finish the entire delivery took only
    four hours. Apparently fast deliveries are not the greatest thing as
    Peg says that she is pretty torn up, needed an episiotomy, and badly
    bruised her hips? She doubts she will ever walk in a straight line
    again.

    	Curtis and Ethan are the 8th and 9th grandchildren respectively.
    One more to go this year and then I think that our family will take a
    breather from our private little population boom.

    				Wendy

  >> 	On a related note, another one of my sisters (I have millions of
  >>'em) gave birth to her baby, Ethan, on Saturday morning. Although this
  >>was her first baby, from start to finish the entire delivery took only
  >>four hours. Apparently fast deliveries are not the greatest thing as
  >>Peg says that she is pretty torn up, needed an episiotomy, and badly
  >>bruised her hips? She doubts she will ever walk in a straight line
  >>again.
    
    I know how she feels, Wendy.  My first (and only, so far) labor
    and delivery was a total of 2.5 hours from start to finish and
    the bruises were INCREDIBLE!  But you know, one day you wake up
    and it just doesn't hurt anymore.  The day I got home from the
    hospital I couldn't even remember what it was like to feel "normal",
    but as soon as I forced myself to get up and move around (I went
    out shopping the next day) I began to feel great.  Tell her that
    before she knows it, she'll be back to her old self again.  Well,
    *almost* :-)
    
    - Kathryn
    

    I know how she feels, too!
    
    I had a lot of damage after my second delivery, 6 hours with an
    8 lb. 13 oz. baby.  He was facing forward, so besides the damage
    of the swift labor I had bruises on my bladder from where the baby
    kicked me coming out.
    
    I did *not* bounce back as well as Kathryn.  I had to stay just
    about flat for a week to get the heavy bleeding under control. 
    Even one flight of stairs would start it again.  One of the
    bladder bruises was right on the muscle that controls the opening;
    it was a good six months before it quit hurting during urination.  
    Bowel movements were hell for about three weeks.  I wound up
    taking an extra week of vacation before I went back to work.  
    
    Getting up and around did help the soreness go away, but only
    within the limits of what my body was ready for.  And this was
    unusual for me -- after both #1 and #3, I bounced right back,
    could have gone back to work within a week.  But after that quick
    brutal labor (and I don't think all short labors are this bad) I
    had to take it easier. 
    
    --bonnie

    I know what your sister means. Last June 5th I delivered my second baby
    very quickly. I was in the hospital 10 minutes when he was born.  My OB
    did not make the delivery so a doctor who was on the maternity floor
    waiting for his patient to delivered my son. ( I clearly remember
    delivery the placenta when I had my first son four years earlier.) The
    delivery was very normal.  Actually he was rather small.  He weighed
    6lbs. 13 oz.  Then the doctor starting pulling the cord that was still
    attached to the placenta inside.  Well the cord broke off and he told
    me that the only way to get it out was for him to go inside of me and
    pull it out.  Well, he laid the birthing bed down flat at went inside
    to pull and pushed from the outside with his other hand.  Well, my
    husband said he has never heard anyone scream so loud.  Well I wrenched
    up off the bed.  Then the doctor tells me that he couldn't get the
    placenta to lay still.  He went in again, and again I wrenched.  I'm
    your talking about a man with his hand up inside of my cervix...After
    that I was bleeding a little heavily and he told me that I needed
    stiches...I said from what?  He tore me with his hand.  Then the ****
    proceeded to stich me without anything.  After he finished and the
    nurse cleaned up everything, I told him..."NOW I KNOW WHY I GO TO A
    FEMALE OB/GYN"
    
    About four weeks after the delivery I was still having serious back
    pain.  When I went in for my six week re check my doctor could'nt find
    any problems from the birth, but told me if I kept having problems to
    see my family doctor.  Well a few nights later while feeding the baby
    in the middle of the night, my left leg went numb.  I called the doctor
    the very next day.  Went and saw him and he immediatly sent me to an
    orthorpedic (sp) surgeon.  It was then determined that I had two
    herniated disks in my lower back.  This was caused by the wrenching up
    off the bed.  After six months of physical theraphy and lots of
    exercise, my back is still about the same.  
    
    So tell your sister I can relate big time about how important it is to
    ge the placenta out.  But tell the doctor to let you push it out.  I
    will be much easier on you.  
    
    lillian
    
    PS:  I glad everything turned our ok for your sister.  What we woman go
    through to have babies...even though we love them so much.