Conference moira::parenting_v3

    
    Frankly, I don't have a problem with keeping a kid late for not doing
    homework or for needing extra help.  But I do have a problem with the
    school not providing transportation--especially for a kid who is told
    he/she MUST stay for detention.
    
    I would call the principal and explain that I work--and that arranging
    alternate transportation is not possible at 3pm.  I would ask if it
    would be possible for the school to provide a late bus--or something.
    I would not permit my child to stay late at school without pre-arranged
    transportation.  It gets dark too early and there are too many crazies
    out there....
    
    Bonie
    
    

    I personally think that this is a good idea.  It sounds to me like the
    teachs are taking a proactive approach to a piece of the current 
    education "problem" (i.e. students not learning what they should).
    
    I agree that there should be some alternative transportation provided;
    however, I can see that the lack of transportation might be impetus
    for the parents to get involved in the situation and ensure that the
    homework is completed on time.
    
    Carol

    I agree with Carol, the lack of transportation gets the parent
    involved.  They should be anyway.   It is very inconvenient for
    parents, yes, but this litte "catch" will give some parents the motivation,
    perhaps, to work with their kids more than they already do.  Detention 
    for not participating in homework assignments sounds like a good idea to 
    me.  I think this discipline tactic that the teachers came up with is a 
    good thing.
    
    Nancy 

    Time to get the school board involved.  I don't have an issue with the
    detention, just the no transportation situation.
    We were threatened with it once.  The difference was the note idicating
    that the child was staying had to be signed by the parent.  In the only
    time they tried to pull the stunt, I refused permission to allow them
    to do it.  I pay enough money into the system then to be made to leave
    work earily for their fancies.
    ed
    

         I agree with .2 and .3.  It is about time that schools force
    parents to be more involved with their child's schoolwork.  I hope a
    policy like this comes to my town's schools.
    
    Diane
    

    You can't force parents to be involved with their child's
    schoolwork.  In all likelihood the kids who need the involvement
    the most will be sent to detention with notes that say "Johnny
    will be walking home after detention is over."
    
    And by the way (I learned this a couple of weeks ago and have been
    dying to find a semi-relevant place to include it) did you know
    that the reason schools in this country adapted the midafternoon
    closing (rather than the long lunch and late afternoon pattern
    more common in Europe) is to allow the kids enough time to walk
    home before it got dark?  It's an adaptation from rural schools
    where distances precluded most kids going home for lunch. 
    
    --bonnie

    -1,  Well hopefully the parent who writes notes like "jonny will be walking
    home after detention is over" will get sick of writing these notes
    after a while and notice that something isn't working and maybe
    the kid will eventually get sick of walking home everytime he screws
    up.
    
    Nancy

I think I agree with .0, particularly if it's for a single offense.  If it's 
for a consistent pattern, then maybe, but I'd still say no.

The students will certainly need self-discipline when they hit seventh grade.  
But I doubt that detention results in self-discipline; in fact most punitive 
measures have the opposite effect, IMO.

And I don't think it's good policy to lump together kids who misbehave, kids 
who don't hand in homework, and kids who need help.  The three groups are 
substantially different.

While I don't agree with the program to begin with, if a school has such as 
program, I don't agree that the school should provide transporation. If a 
student consistently does not turn in homework, it should be no suprise to the 
parent (both because the parent should know, and/or because the teacher should 
have sent a note home or requested a conference).  Having to pick the child up 
is inconvenient for sure, but I don't feel that the school should prevent 
inconveniences that are avoidable.  As a taxpayer and parent, I would object 
to the school incurring an extra cost.  The money should be spent on a more 
worthwhile program.  If it MUST be spent, then that's another reason not to 
have it.

Clay

    
    Clay,
    As a taxpayer and parent, I would INSIST that the school provide
    transportation to a child who is put on detention--and I think
    detention is a good idea!
    
    If the school relies on the parents to pick the child up--who is to say
    the parent(s) will show up?  Some parents are not responsible
    people--others may be very responsible, but may have car trouble, may
    not be able to get out of work on time, may not be able to get out of
    work at all (not everyone works for DEC--and lots of people work by the
    hour or have non-understanding managers).  I think it would avoid a lot
    of unnecessary problems if the school simply provided a bus on certain
    days for detention and extra-help activities.
    
    If the school kept my child for detention and didn't provide
    transportation--we live roughly 3-4 miles from school.  My child would
    be walking home alone, at dusk, in a semi-rural area---no way!  If
    something happened, the town would be liable--and personally, I would
    rather pay a little extra for kids to have safe, reliable
    transportation home after school--than to pay later--in both guilt,
    heartache, police searches, and lawsuits.
    
Bonnie
    
    

    Well, some parents cannot just *leave* at 3:00.  I am a secretary in
    MRO, and while I would surely not have a problem with leaving, it would
    cost me two hours pay, (unless I wanted to use my vacation time...)
    
    The school should have a late bus.

    	I always hated the idea of "homework" when I went to school. To me
    if a teacher was good, he/she could teach a class without having to
    give homework. One of the best teachers I had never gave home work.
    Instead he used practical examples in everyday life to illustrate
    problems and how to solve them (the subject was math.)

    	Later on in high school I had a physics teacher that did the same
    thing. One day we made boomerangs to show how airflow creates lift! 

    	If a child does not do homework, and cannot get by without doing
    it, then it will be reflected in the child's grade. 

    	As a taxpayer I don't see why I should have to pay the salary of a
    teacher who stays after school to watch children who don't do homework.
    The same goes for unruly kids, expel them instead of keeping them after
    school! If a child needs help, then the parent should get involved to
    help the child. 
    
    	If my son comes home with a note about not doing homework which,
    means he has to stay after school, I would ask/quiz him about the
    subject. If he knows the subject comfortably, I would not make him stay
    after and would refuse to allow the school to force him to. If he did
    not know the subject I would make sure he did the homework.

    The inconvenience should be to the *child*, not the parent, and it
    should not compromise the child's safety (walking home is NOT an
    option, assuming the child lives far enough from the school to be on
    the school bus route).
    
    Long ago and far away in Middletown, NJ, the high school had detention
    and a "late bus" network, which also served the intramurals crowd. 
    Grades were the medium for reflecting/punishing incomplete work;
    parents could avail themselves of P-T conferences to the extent that
    they wanted to participate in the child's education :'J  and detention
    was reserved for inappropriate classroom behavior (spitballs, shooting
    rubber bands, in the hallway without a pass  :'O ).  Believe me, having
    to be on school grounds a nanosecond longer than necessary was
    incentive enough.  The late bus didn't make it fun.
    
    I wouldn't sign the permission slip either... and if there was no
    signature line, I would inform the perpetrators of this program that
    we will not be participating in it (so sue me).
    
    Leslie
    

    There is a signature line on this form informing me of the change in
    policy.  It says:  Please sign to indicate that you have seen this
    notice.  It doesn't seem to be asking my permission for anything.
    
    6th graders cannot be expelled.  Children who *cannot* behave need a
    special program.  But that is another story.  
    
    I already have a reputation as a troublemaking parent with this school. 
    I have gone in to meetings there with a Child Advocate from the Office
    for Children several times in the past.  When the school's budget
    infringes upon my child's rights to an education, I am ruthless.  I
    know they do not have enough money to supply afterschool
    transportation.  But I am a single parent in an hourly paying job and I
    don't think a missing homework assignment is a major enough crime to
    cause me to forfeit two hours of pay.  There is no way my child would
    walk home.  Sure, it's less than two miles, in daylight, and her little
    legs are strong enough (through years of physical therapy) to carry her
    the distance.  But she is my daughter, my responsibility, and she walks
    no where alone.
    
    Every night I go over her homework with her, to make sure it's all
    done.  But it is much too easy for her to have forgotten to write one
    assignment down, or to have forgotten one book she needs.  "Let the
    punishment fit the crime"  This punishment is too extreme.
    
    Wendy

    
    Wendy,
    To me, a child's safety is an important issue to make a stink over.  If
    you cannot lost time from work (if it's an issue of whether your kid
    stays in detention for forgetting to bring in her homework or whether
    she doesn't eat that night because you've lost two hours pay for
    picking her up after detention...).  I would certainly make a stink
    over it.  I would refuse to have my child participate in the detention
    program--unless transportation could be provided.
    
    But this does not have to be adversarial.  Why not explain your
    situation to her teacher or principal, and suggest that since your
    daughter cannot spend time in detention at school--that you are willing
    to put her in "detention" at home?  Ask that her teacher notify you of
    any time detention is necessary.  Tell her teacher that you will put
    your daughter on "detention" at home--I bet they will be fairly
    receptive to that--especially if they understand you cannot take time
    off from work to pick her up after a school detention.
    
    Does this sound ok to you?  I would try and pick up my child from a
    detention at school--but if I couldn't, I wouldn't let her stay late
    without any transportation.  I would assure the teacher/principal that
    the issue would be dealt with at home.  I would make them see that I
    respect their opinion and that I respect their interest in my child.  I
    would not overlook the fact that my kid either didn't do, or forgot her
    homework.  But I would not compromise my childs safety--and I would
    forbid the school to do so--in writing.
    
    Bonnie
    
    

>   Every night I go over her homework with her, to make sure it's all
>   done.  But it is much too easy for her to have forgotten to write one
>   assignment down, or to have forgotten one book she needs.  "Let the
>   punishment fit the crime"  This punishment is too extreme.

Detention for a SINGLE missed assignment?!?!  I agree with you completely.  
You are being a responsible parent.  Detention for chronically missing 
homework MAY have merit.  Detention for a single missed assignment is IMO it 
totally unreasonable.  Have you clarified that?  It's not just for kids who 
CHRONICALLY miss homework?  

re: .14

To me, "detention at home" should be an option for EVERYONE, not just the ones 
who are unable (or unwilling) to pick up their children.  In fact a restricted 
time or quiet time at home, that is reserved for homework ought to be standard 
procedure.  There does not need to be any of the punitive aspect of "detention".

re: .9, cost of transportation

Detention, without transportation, has little monetary cost attached to it.
I assume the teachers don't get paid extra, and the operating expenses for 
the room are probably a pretty trivial cost.  So the only debate to me
is whether it's an effective program or not.  We simply disagree on that one, 
but IMO both positions have merit.

However, once you bring in the expense of transportation, you change the 
discussion dramatically.  Since most schools these days are operating on a very 
tight budget, then the detention program would have to compete for school 
budget dollars with other programs.  Now we're no longer just debating whether 
detention per se is good or bad.  Now we're talking the detention program vs. 
school crossing guards, magazine subscriptions for the library, playground 
equipment, etc. So IF detention is a good idea, and IF transportation is an 
essential element of it, then you have to show that the value of the detention 
program is more than the value of the other programs with which it competes 
for funds.  I contend that would be very difficult to show. If I were in a 
school district that, for budgetary reasons, had just canceled an activity or 
program that one of my children were really enthused about and/or benefitting 
from educationally, and you proposed busing home kids who have to stay after 
school because they don't turn in their homework, I would be positively LIVID. 

If you have to do it, I LIKE the idea presented in .12 about having intramural 
activities after school.  That was a high school, but I see not reason why it 
couldn't be extended to elementary.  Extend the school day for _all_ kids.  
Kids who don't do their homework MUST go to a "study hall" -- others can go 
voluntarily; kids who need help with math get help from a math specialist; 
others get to go to band practice or school play rehearsals or play basketball 
in the gym.  Then the monetary cost of detention drops back to near zero (of 
course the extending the school day for _all_ kids has cost attached to it.  
But the additional cost of detention is minimal).   I also like the positive 
aspect -- participation in the other activities is reward for doing your 
homework, as opposed to attendance at "detention" is punishment for NOT doing 
it.  

Clay    

I find this fascinating ...  

My first reaction was "What's the big deal?"  Detentions were as much a part
of my school life as cleaning blackboards and so on ... not that I spent too
many detentions, but there were a few ... usually for slow progress ... or
arriving late.

Then it occured to me that the big deal was the responsibility that parents
are taking today for their children.  We've had part of this discussion
before in other notes, but I have walked a mile to school down dark busy
country roads.  I have cycled 3 miles to school down similar roads in rain,
snow, sun, wind .... you name it.  You could only take a bus if you lived over
4 miles from school.

I have NEVER had the privilege of riding in a bus to school.  Rarely, and
then usually in only the most foul weather have I been able to get a ride
to school.  Ask most people who were brought up in England and they'll tell
you a similar story.

To those children who went by bus, they were excused detentions, but had
extra homework to do in its place, and other punishments as well.

It's all a matter of attitude.  I feel that we over-protect our children.
I know I am to some extent doing the same thing to mine, but they walk
about 1/3 mile to school and they are 9 and 6, and I have no problems
whatsoever with that.  They could have up to a 15-20 minute walk and I'd
have no problems with that either.

Now, the value of detentions is another matter altogether ... I have seen
some totally wasted detentions:  "You will sit there ... no doing tonight's
homework ... after 30 minutes peace and quiet, you can go home"

It's amazing to see history repeating itself ... I wonder when the cane and
strap will be brought back ??? :-)  Said he very much tongue in cheek!

Stuart

    I don't like the idea of homework in the first place.  It teaches
    kids to be workaholics who can't separate work from home life. 
    
    I've seen too many recent college grads deal with their first job
    by plunging in, working long hours, working from home in the
    middle of the night, acomplishing a great deal in the first year
    or two, and then burning out almost totally. And it's not
    surprising.  After spending most of their lives working a couple
    of hours or more in the evening on things that have to be done for
    school, rather than on developing their own interests (watching TV
    counts as an interest for purposes of this discussion), they've
    had it thoroughly drilled into them that the institution that
    dictates their day can also make demands on their after-hours
    behavior. 
    
    So they never learn to pace themselves.  
    
    --bonnie

Bonnie,

I certainly understand what you are trying to say, but the typical school
child attends school for 5-6 hours per day ... some less depending on the
school.  There is not enough time there to actually teach all that we
require of kids by the time they leave school, given all the faddish elements
in teaching too.

In parts of Europe, kids go to school for a full work day, with about 7
hours of lesson time, and maybe the odd "free period" in a week.  Then
these kids come home with homework too.

I had about 6 teaching hours per day when I was in school, and from the time
I got to high school, 1-3 hours homework per night was perfectly NORMAL.

Don't think, however, that I condone all that homework, but, I think that 
there has to be a happy medium, and that some is not a bad idea to provide
re-inforcement.  By the time kids get to high school, the messages go totally
crazy, for most of the high school kids I know have a multitude of free
periods during the week ...  How do they use this time ?  Loafing around.

It would have been impossible to get through University without doing home
work.  I think the whole schooling system would have to be re-vamped to
ensure that we don't give these crazy mixed messages.

Stuart

    re: .18
    
    I know it's normal, Stuart.  I had the same amount of homework as
    you did.  I'm saying that it's not wise, or realistic.
    
    So much of the school system's effort is going to teaching kids
    things that are at best useless and at worst actively
    counterproductive.  How often in your work life do you stay up
    until all hours cramming for a multiple choice test?  It's a lot
    more likely to be an oral presentation, or a joint project with
    several people.  In most schools, if you do a joint project, it's
    cheating.  There are lots of ways to demonstrate mastery of a
    subject other than passing a multiple choice exam -- or even an
    essay exam.  
    
    And I think detention for not doing homework is going to reinforce
    the idea that work -- and for elementary school kids, school is
    their work -- is and should be unpleasant drudgery.  And one thing
    I've learned over the years is that people will go to great
    lengths to avoid anything that's perceived as too much unpleasant
    drudgery.  
    
    I originally assumed that the detention was only for kids who
    chronically forgot homework, but if it's for even one missed
    assignment, it's excessive.  It doesn't even sound like the kids
    will do the homework in the detention.  
    
    --bonnie

    Parents must not be forced to leave work especially in these times to
    take their kid home who is held over for detention.  If they are sick
    or there is an emergency that is one thing. For me to come home from
    work 45 miles away to take my kid home from detention is unrealistic.
    There would be some hell to pay for it from me it it happened often.
    If I had the impression that the teacher was doing it on a 'whim' the
    school system would hear from me... either to provide transportation
    or find another way to enforce their discipline.  Of course I would 
    work on it from the home end too. Perhaps a Saturday detention instead
    of weeknight detention?  I dare say Johnny wouldn't put up with THAT
    long.  Yes, the parents are and should be responsible for their kids..
    but 'the system' should accept realistic problems the parents face too.
    
    Jeff

    Someone should warn bonnie randall that some zealot has been entering
    notes here using her name.  Fortunately, the imposter lacks bonnie's
    clear common sense, so few will be fooled.  :^}
    
    .17 focuses on the concern that homework causes workaholism.  I have
    rarely heard the assertion that America's teenagers are a bunch of
    fevered workaholics, or that our society suffers from an epidemic of
    this disease among adults.  This is a real problem for a small number
    of people, but it surely is not caused by homework.  Indeed, as .19
    points out, boring homework is likely to turn people into
    anti-workaholics.
    
    .19 argues that homework which doesn't impart or enhance useful skills
    is rather useless, if not worse.  I'm quite inclined to agree.  But my
    conclusion is that one should encourage useful homework, not banishment
    of homework.  I also deny that the actual situation is anywhere near as
    grim as bonnie suggests; it certainly hasn't been in my experience.  I
    never in my life "stayed up until all hours cramming for a multiple
    choice test" (occasionally to my detriment!), and that isn't "homework"
    in the sense under discussion, anyway.  Often homework is preperation
    of an oral presentation, or equivalent; and many schools accept,
    encourage, and from time to time require collaboration on projects.
    
    Most of the skills vital for both "academic" success and for a rich and
    productive adult life cannot simply be poured into kids (or adults) by
    a teacher in a classroom setting; they must be honed by independent
    individual effort.  I have in mind everything from elementary
    arithmetic to enjoyment of great literature to ability to gather
    information about a topic, think coherently about it, and marshal
    conclusions in coherent and persuasive writing and speech.  Such skills
    will not be mastered without "homework."  Now, to be sure, "homework"
    need not be done in the home, and some does get done at school, during
    "study hall" or the like.  But there simply isn't anywhere near enough
    free time between 8 and 3 at school to do enough independent
    "homework."  Most kids could probably get it done between 3 and 6, but
    prefer to do other things then, leaving homework for the evening.  It
    is scarcely a form of involuntary servitude.
    
    It is sometimes that case that homework assignments are insufficiently
    interesting or challanging.  I have never seen a case where I thought a
    student was being harmed by excessive quantity of homework.  I am
    appalled at how common it apparently is that students are harmed by
    an insufficient quantity of homework.
    
    		- Bruce

    Over the years I have had a number of "run-ins" with schools/teachers
    and processes. Over that time, I've heard numerous parents complain
    about school/teacher processes, but who also believe they must defer to
    school/teacher processes. THEY'RE YOUR KIDS, NOT THE SCHOOL SYSTEM'S!!
    My .02 cents would be to simply inform the school that you do not think
    the policy is wise, and that you will not under any circumstances allow
    your child to participate in it. 
    
    If anyone lays the blame on your doorstep (parents should make sure the
    kids do homework, parents should....), respond by saying "Thank you for
    recognizing that all such matters are for the parent to decide....and I
    decide no detention for my child." I think too many schools/teachers
    talk two different songs: how can they at one hand say that parents
    aren't taking responsibility, but on the other hand try to usurp that
    responsibility by making decisions about what is to happen to the child
    after the end of school hours? 
    
    If you are opposed to a school/teacher process or decision, my input is
    to "Just Say NO!!".
    
    Mike
    

    RE: .4
    
    You can also look at the lack of transportation another way.  I pay
    enough money into the school system already without having to subsidize
    "special transportation" for school detainees.  I'd rather see my tax
    dollars spent on substantive education *not* a taxi service for those
    in detention.  
    
    If the students want transportation, than can do their homework/be
    cooporative.  Both students *and* their parents need to take the
    responsibility here.
    
    Former teacher, current taxpayer, and working parent,
    LZP
     
    
    

    Maybe I have a weird perspective on things, but one thing jumps out and
    hits me. What we have is a child who has, for whatever reason, not
    completed an obligation. Yes, whether we are "for" or "against" doing
    homework, the fact remains that it is an obligation, as the system is
    currently structured. So this child has chosen to not complete his
    homework (or forgotten....let's remember that forgetting is not a
    really good excuse in "the real world"). 
    Everyone is so worried about transportation and the value of detention
    and the value of homework (all valid concerns) that no one seems to
    remember that here is a child who has "broken the rules". Should
    discipline not be administered? Some kids are very bright, and will not
    fail is homework is not completed, so that is not discipline. Some kids
    will fail and don't care one whit if they do (and some of their parents
    don't either). The question is.....do you feel some action should be
    taken if a child doesn't fulfill obligations? If "yes", than who should
    decide on the actions? The parents? Ideally, I'd say "yes", but many
    don't get that involved or don't see it as a big deal. But it is a big
    deal. If the kids gets the message that its ok not to do the homework,
    if he can slide by without doing it, then what incentive is there to do
    it? And what keeps him from generalizing into the work world? How many
    dollars are lost by companies with employees who just "slide by", not
    giving there best, just doing enough? How many of you know people that
    never seem to be able to complete their obligations on time, if at all?
    And how many of you are the ones who end up cleaning up after these
    folks?
    You say no detention for a first offense. ok...then when? The second?
    Third? tenth? Will everyone agree? Why *not* the first? If more
    children were made accountable the *first* time, there might no tbe as
    many second times!
    So, if not able to reliably count on all parents to discipline
    consistently for failure to complete obligations, then who should do
    the disciplining? Obvioudsly the school felt it had the responsibility
    to step in. It must be perceived as quite a problem for this to be
    implemented. 
    I will leave out if I agree or disagree with the method chosen for the
    discipline. All your concerns surrounding trnasportation are
    particularly valid. My concern is the apparent lack of realization that
    the child and parent have a lot of control over whether discipline is
    even *needed* in the first place, by just fulfilling the expected
    obligations! If they both ensured that the homework was done, then no
    one would need worry about who will pick up Johnny from detention,
    because Johnny won't *get* a detention!
    
    --dave--

    RE: .24

    	With all those "obligations" when does a child have a chance to be
    a child? When do they get time to foster their imaginations? To play
    and dream? 

    	When one grows to adulthood alot of these cannot be done any more,
    or are pushed aside to deal with responsibilities. Let the children
    play, the time for that is very short with respect to ones lifetime.

    	BTW, telling someone to do something does not necessarily mean they
    are obligated to do it. If I tell you to jump off a bridge are you
    obligated to do it? 

    re .24: Bright kids who don't do all their homework may not *fail*, but
    unless there's something wrong with the grading system, their grades
    *will* suffer.  If they're so bright ;') they'll notice that, and
    they'll be able to project the effect down the road (grade point
    average... getting into the college of choice...).  Then again, they
    may be *so* bright that they "get" it all without going through the
    homework exercises, in which case they need further stimulation (a more
    in-depth course of study) - not punishment for understanding the
    lesson!
    
    Also... the children of people who do not excercise their right to be
    disciplinarians.... are NOT MY PROBLEM!!  I see a parallel here
    with Big-Brotherism and drug testing, for example.  "Those <label>
    people won't stop using drugs/shirking homework obligations, so We-
    the-Government/-the-School-System will test blood weekly/detain chldren
    at their parents' inconvenience and expense!  We-the-<whatever> can do
    that because if they're not doing drugs/completing their assignments,
    they have nothing to worry about!!!"  Nothing but civil liberties
    infringements.
    
    Leslie

    Personally, I agree with .24.  As a parent I consider it a child's
    obligation to do an assignment.  Just because a child has an
    obligation/responsibility that doesn't mean they can't be imaginative,
    creative, have fun, and be a child.  GEEZE!  The two are not mutually
    exclusive.
    
    No...just because someone tells you to do something doesn't mean you
    have to do it...but you should be prepared to accept the consequences,
    whatever they may be.
    
    Homework can be used in a very positive way and is not just a mechanism
    for keeping a child occupied.
    
    If more parents took their children's work seriously, this discussion
    would be moot.
      

    Good grief ... now detentions are infringements on civil liberties are
    they ?  I don't want to dig any deeper into this part of the subject,
    but we can carry this civil liberties argument to some incredible
    extremes ... so I don't think it should be any part of this.
    
    What should all boil down to is this ...
    
    There are only so many teaching hours in a day ... not enough to
    provide time for independent study and revision, so homework is
    set by teachers.
    
    Now, the homework is done by some and not done by others.  Typically
    from my days at school, it was the people who could have used the
    homework the most who most often 'forgot' to do it.  These were also
    the children of parents who were never seen at Open Houses, or Meet
    the teacher evenings etc.
    
    So, someone should ensure that the homework gets done.  Applying the
    law of Natural Consequences unfortunately produces its consequences
    a little too late -- the night schools would be bursting!
    
    So, how does the school ensure that it gets done ?  Notes to parents
    aren't exactly effective ... they get lost or ignored.  So, detention
    makes some sense.
    
    Now, the problem of transportation is a result of modern society ...
    it certainly wasn't the same problem in days gone by.
    
    As to the argument about homework not letting kids be kids: we are not
    talking about the kids putting in 12 hour days here ... in fact, for
    most kids, we are not even talking about them putting in 8 hour days
    ... school and homework included.  The advantage of homework also is
    that it can be scheduled for after supper, so the kids get a chance to
    play outside after school.
    
    Stuart

    It'm me again.  With some more background on ths particular case.
    
    Every day I have been asking my daughter "Do you have homework?  What
    is it?  Is it done?"  Nearly every day I have seen her working on
    homework.  Once or twice she had forgotten to bring home a necessary
    book, so that homework was not done that night.
    
    A few weeks ago I was called in for a meeting with her teacher,
    occupational therapist, and the principal.  The teacher told me she had
    been doing NO homework what so ever.  This cannot be, I said, I saw her
    do homework.  It seems the homework I saw her doing was for another of
    her teachers.  But I had no way of knowing if she was fulfilling "her
    obligations" if no one told me.  A system is now in place where she has
    a notebook to write down all her assignments, and what books are
    needed, and I check it over at night, and her teacher checks it over
    the next day.  So many days/weeks of completed assignments and she
    bakes cookies with her therapist in OT.  Due to the aftereffects of the
    removal of a massive benign brain tumor at a young age, my daughter has
    to work longer and harder to get the same amount of work done as the
    rest of the kids in her grade.  Getting her homework done has been a
    problem, yes.  We are working on it.  One night we went to visit a
    friend and she did her homework over there.  She left her math paper at
    the friend's house.  We redid it together.  It took two hours.  I
    thought that was really excessive.
    
    So, I know there's a problem.  So we are working on it.  So she misses
    one assignment.  BIG DEAL!  The overall trend is improving.  Why are
    they imposing more pressure?  I wish they would not wait so long to
    tell parents there is a problem.  I have no problem with taking time
    off to go to meetings at school.  I attend a weekly meeting at my son's
    school.  I think better communication between school and home is the
    answer.  Not this approach of shocking the parents with an
    inconvenience that makes them angry in the hopes that they turn this
    anger towards the kid and MAKE the kid do the work which may or may not
    have any relevance to their life today, tomorrow, or ever.
    
    Thank you for letting me vent.  I need to call the school to discuss
    this, but I needed to calm down first and it has taken a couple of days
    for me to even get my story out here.  Whew, I feel better now (except
    for this migraine)
    
    Wendy 
    
      

    In this situation detention is certainly going to be
    counterproductive.  I mean, it sounds like the kid's trying her
    hardest!  What more do they want?  Blood?

    I was not suggesting that the child shouldn't do her homework.  I
    was suggesting that perhaps the teacher and the school system
    could come up with an alternative way of allowing her to
    demonstrate that she was learning what she was supposed to learn. 
    Especially given what .29 says about her daughter's difficulty
    doing conventional homework.  

    In general, I think the teachers and the school and the parents
    should come up with a better system of skills teaching, one that's
    more flexible and takes into account that different children learn
    best in different ways -- some are theoretical, some learn by
    doing, some learn by listening, some need to work together, some
    need to work alone.  There isn't any one right way.  But most
    every school system finds a way that works for some of the kids
    and then tries to shoehorn the kids who don't fit that style into
    the pattern they've decided on (usually for the best of reasons). 
    
    Children whose learning style happens to match the system are
    likely to have positive school experiences, while children who
    don't match can wind up with problems even if they're normal,
    intelligent children who are trying their hardest to meet
    obligations that don't make any sense to them. 

    I was a B+/A- student, but I was branded an underachiever because
    my interests were creative rather than rote, and called a
    troublemaker because I wouldn't follow directions when I saw a
    better way to do the assingment.  In 11 years of school I got
    exactly one opportunity to demostrate mastery by a method other
    than writing a factual paper or passing a test -- and I went to
    one of the best schools in my state.
    
    If thinking that learning opportunities ought to be tailored to
    the student's needs rather than to the convenience of the subject
    matter and the school administration is radical, then yeah, I
    guess I'm a radical.  But I don't see why hundreds of thousands of
    children a year should be put through the kind of misery the
    basenoter's daughter is going through.
    
    --bonnie

    I agree with the noter a couple of notes ago that this point is
    moot....only I agree for a different reason. I think that if the parent
    objects to a school/teacher process, then that parent has the right to
    make the final call. If you want to participate in the detention
    program, fine. If not, fine....the "punishment" should be reflected in
    lower grades. (This, I believe, also reflects the "real world" -- if we
    do poorly at our jobs, the "punishment" is poor performance reviews and
    poor salary actions -- we are not forced to stay after work.)
    
    As far as handling homework goes, I like the system that my children's
    school uses: parents need to sign homework before it is returned. I
    participate in this because I think it is a good idea....but if for
    some reason I didn't think it was a good idea, I would raise those
    objections to the school and I would consider myself the final call. I 
    believe the overriding lesson that I want my children to learn (by my 
    example) is that if we believe the process is really wrong/overly
    harsh/objectionable for some other reason, it is our lives and we make
    the final call (and we suffer the final consequences of that call).
    
    

re: .29

I'm glad you provided the additional information.  It helps us understand the 
issue a lot better.  While the discussion in here has been very interesting, 
I'm sorry if we "cluttered" the discussion too much.

I agree completely with Bonnie in .30.

Kids need to be stretched and need to be challenged, but if done improperly, 
I think that the homework _itself_ might start to be punishment, let alone 
adding detention for not getting it done.  I think most of the comments up to 
this point (certainly mine) have assumed that the homework wasn't getting done 
because the child and/or the parent were negligent.  If it's due to a learning 
disability, or a different learning style, that changes the picture entirely.  
I think 2+ hours of homework is a lot for a sixth grader.  

Have you enlisted the help of a doctor who specializes in Learning 
Disorders?  Perhaps such a person might be able to make suggestions to which 
the school would be more receptive. 

And finally, I don't agree with the analogies of detentions for homework with 
what happens in the workplace.  Or maybe I should say that sometimes the 
analogies are accurate and that's unfortunate.  Turning in homework is not the 
"obligation" in a school.  If there is an obligation, it is _learning_.  
Punishing a child for not doing homework is like "disciplining" a salesperson 
for making poor presentations -- without regard to whether s/he sells anything 
or not.  

Clay

    
    
    A view from the other side ... two years ago, when my daughter was in
    the sixth grade (sixth grade in our town starts middle school, so it's
    a big transition), she decided she didn't like her Language Arts
    teacher and didn't do any of her homework.  This teacher's policy was
    to take a point off a child's average for every missing homework
    assignment.  She never notified me that homework was not being done.
    You can imagine my shock when Jill brought her first middle school
    report card home and had failed Language Arts.  This child had no
    problem learning and had never brought home less than a B before in
    elementary school ... and now, a 55 !!!!
    
    Needless to say, the teacher and I had a nice little chat the following
    day and got the situation under control, but I was furious that the
    first I even knew that there was a problem was when she brought her
    report card home.  I would have appreciated a 'detention' for many
    missing assignments at least as a signal that there was a problem, but
    this teacher doesn't give detentions, just fails 'em.  I don't agree
    with this policy, but it did work.  Jill always did her homework for
    that class from then on.  The teacher did keep reminding the students
    what missing homework meant, but I don't think they understood or
    believed her.  They sure did after that first report card. BTW, I was 
    only one of about 12-14 parents up there that next day.
    
    Well, she's in the eighth grade now, at another school (our town has a
    separate school for eighth graders to prepare them for high school), and
    she just got her first detention ever yesterday ... for fooling around 
    in study hall.  The principal let it be known at Open House that he saw
    no problem with keeping them late and it didn't have to inconvenience
    parents either.  These kids are walking/biking all over town on
    Saturday, so are perfectly capable of walking home from school when
    they have misbehaved and have gotten a detention.  He was right, as far
    as my daughter goes.  She does trek all over town .. to her friends,
    shopping, etc. and I would be a hypocrite if I said she wasn't safe
    walking home from school if I let her walk the same roads on the
    weekends.   Next year, when she's in high school, we get the option of
    morning or afternoon detention, so we can drop her off early on our way
    to work.
    
    BTW, I completely agree that one (or even several) missing homework 
    assignment is NOT grounds for detention, but I don't necessarily agree 
    that detention itself is wrong .... or that pre-teens and teenagers 
    are necessarily at risk by walking home from school.
    
    Kathy                                                 

    Parents signing the homework sounds workable (but can you say
    "tedious"?), though I think an easier way would be having a signature
    line on a pink slip of some sort - first warning, second warning etc.
    from teacher to parent, the ultimatum being that if the poor
    performance/behavior doesn't stop, it will be reflected in the child's
    GRADES.  (The more I think about detention, the less of a raison d'etre
    it seems to have.)
    
    I think homework is AN obligation, not the only one, of the child to
    the school/learning process.  I think grades (should) reflect the
    child's progress in that learning process, so completion of homework is
    a factor in computing grades.  I don't see why the issue of homework
    should be extracted and given a penal system of its own!--which
    *punishes* the child and *parent*, and which is not related to solving
    the problem!
    
    Of course I think learning disabilities and differing learning styles
    should be addressed, and homework redefined or eliminated as needed in
    those cases--but once adjusted, then still incorporated in the grading
    process.
    
    As far as civil liberties go - yes, an infrigment, albeit very modest. 
    But it's the camel's nose under the tent.  The deal is, school is x:00
    to y:00, and our tax dollars pay for it and for transportation if the
    child lives z miles from school.  Detention without transport, as
    discussed in this string, to me means the school is breaking the y:00
    agreement, and they do not have my permission to require my daughter to
    participate in that detention.  In our case, Alex would have to cross
    two major highways and travel probably four miles; this at 4:00 or
    4:30, when night starts to fall in New England for most of the school
    year.  NFW!!
    
    Anybody care to start a string discussing how we all feel about
    homework in the early grades (if any, how much? starting at what
    grade?)?
    
    Leslie

    			DETENTION NOTICE
    
    Beginning today, any teacher with students who fail to complete
    homework assignments, will be required to stay after school and
    think about what teachers can do to make homework more exciting,
    and what can be done to tailor homework assignments to the abilities
    of the individual children.
                                
    During detention the teacher will help detained students get their
    missing homework done and, after the detention period, the teacher
    will drive the student home.
    
    This detention notice is recognition of our school policy that we
    feel our teachers share in the responsibility for getting homework
    done, and that when children fail to get their homework done then,
    the teacher has also failed.
    

    I didn't mean to give the impression that my daughter has a learning
    disability.  There has never been any indication of that.  Her problems
    are all physical.  She has to put more physical effort into writing. 
    In younger grades she was always given extra time for taking tests. 
    But she is getting stronger now.  It is still a big effort on her part
    though.
    
    Thanks for all the input.  I purposely didn't mention the specific
    details at first because I wanted general imput to begin with.  Then I
    added more information to focus more on our particular problem.
    
    Wendy

    I am only to reply 15, and have to answer now!  In Palmer MA at Quaboag
    school they have detention for misbehavior and missed homework. 
    However, the student gets what is called a pink slip for every
    incidence.  5 pink slips for missed homework is detention.  
    
    Now I work 45 minutes from the school, I am also an hourly paid
    employee. If Amy got a detention I would have to leave work 2 3/4 hours
    early.  That adds up!  I don't expect Amy to get a detention for missed
    homework, however, you never know what may happen.
    
    One thing that Amy's teacher has done (3rd grade BTW) with students
    that don't get their homework done and it appears the parents don't
    care and refuse to allow the child to stay late, is the child cannot
    go on recess until homework is done.  This has been vey effective with
    one boy in the room.  The students can also opt to stay in for extra
    study time if they feel the need.  Amy was having some difficulty with
    a section of math and chose to stay in at morning recess with her
    teacher for extra help.  Yes Ron and I can help her, however, she chose
    her teacher's help this time.
    
    Kim
    

The additional info definitely puts a different light on the situation of
the base noter anyway, although the policy was an across the grade policy,
so it sounds as if the school is having problems with more than just the
base-noter's child.  What is definitely required here is rather more
tolerance from the teachers -- and yes it is definitely worth pushing back
in this instance ... not because of most of the issues that we've been
discussing up till now in this note, but rather, because of the particular
needs of the child.

Regrettably, I don't know of any school system that is really good at taking
the individual students' needs into account.  Even when you let the teeachers
know about certain things like learning difficulties and you get them to
understand and include the details in a school file that the next teacher
might read, you run into the teacher who decides of their own accord that
this is just and excuse.  I just don't know how to cope with that apart
from meeting with the teachers concerned and readjusting their bone-head
thinking.

Still, one then does have to be sensitive to the fact that sometimes kids
do take advantage of situations like this and take advantage of special
treatment -- at which point, in my eyes anyway, they are more deserving of
the detention than any other child.

Time to give the teachers what for ... Good luck!

Stuart

re: .36

Wendy,

While I admit that I assumed that the problem was neurological, I don't think 
"learning disability" needs to exclude physical impediments.  Would that 
aspect of her difficulty be alleviated by her doing the work verbally, but 
have you do some of the writing -- or is using a keyboard a possibility?

Also, different "learning style" doesn't necessarily mean "learning 
disability".  It only becomes a disability if the parent and the teacher don't 
recognize the style or are unwilling or unable to work within its bounds.  
In fact (if learning styles aren't entirely genetic), I wouldn't be suprised 
if your daughter developed a learning style suited to her situation -- for 
example in which she processed images mentally rather than physically.

re: .37

Losing recess seems a lot more reasonable to me than detention.

Also, three cheers for Amy.  One of the reasons I object to lumping kids 
having problems with kids who are being punished it the stigma that can get 
applied to innocent parties.  That took a lot of maturity on her part to 
overcome.

Clay

    
    RE: 35
    
    Come on now, no matter how much effort a teacher puts into the
    assignments, there will always be some kids who will refuse to 
    participate in the learning process.  Some assignments by nature
    will not be exciting, but that shouldn't negate their worth.
    
    As for the teacher driving the kid home, lets be real.  Why should
    they be put at risk for a lawsuit, by transporting kids if by some
    chance they were involved in an accident?  That is not part of their
    contract and nor should it be.
    
    When are people going to take responsibility for their own kids and
    stop blaming everyone and everything else for their problems.
    Schools are there to assist in the learning process, they are not
    a replacement for the role of the parent in teaching discipline and
    morality.
    
    Sue (A former teacher who got sick of being the parent to 110 kids)
    

Re having parents sign all homework assignments:  how does that differ from
mandatory drug testing?  And I'm not talking about civil liberties here ... 
I think that's stretching it when applied to homework and detention in the 
public schools.  No, I'm just talking about plain trust.

I don't have a school-age child, so I can only relate to this in terms of 
myself when I was that age.  I did my homework, and I did it without being 
pressured by my parents, and I was an A student.  If I had been forced to 
get parental signature on my homework anyway, then the satisfaction of 
shouldering that responsibility myself would have been taken away.  The 
message would have been "You are not trusted", and there was absolutely no 
basis for not trusting me because I *did* my homework without getting 
signatures.  But in that case, following the rules is not rewarded with 
trust; it is rewarded in the same way as not following the rules.

Why punish all children in order to get the few rule-breakers?

Steve

    We know that all children have differing learning styles and they
    all need individualized help.  Children who are having difficulty
    keeping up with the class, because of neurological or psychological
    or home-based or school-based problems, need more help - not arbitrary,
    non-individualized harassment, and certainly not harassment that
    will extend to the parents and cause still more emotional and
    home-based disruptions - including the loss of salary and time away
    from job.

    Carroll School, in Lincoln, Mass, has a learning disabled population.
    It has children who had difficulty keeping up with their homework
    and classes in their local schools and were often classified as lazy
    or needing more discipline.
    
    When my son got to Carroll, after 4 years in his local school, he
    was a basket case.  He had been seeing the school psychologist for
    two school years and a psychiatrist outside of school.  
    
    His biggest problem was with output.  He just can not complete anything
    in the same time as other children.  Even at Carroll School he has
    been measured as taking 40% more time than other learning disabled
    children - so his output problem in the local public school was
    relatively more severe. He'd spend hours at night doing homework
    which teachers admit took other children, on the average, a half
    hour to do.
    
    The amount of homework he had to do in the public school was
    unreasonable, but the teachers kept insisting he had to do it all
    to keep up.  Because we, as parents, and Chris, as a student, are
    conscientious, the work did get done, the quantity of homework handed
    in did not suffer - but Chris certainly did.
    
    At Carroll, a school filled with children who have had difficulty
    getting homework assignments done, Chris has done a major turn around
    - and a large part of that turnaround is due to the educator-based
    approach to homeowrk.
    
    In our first visit to Carroll we were told - DO NOT HELP YOUR CHILDREN
    WITH THEIR HOMEWORK.  DO NOT CHECK THAT THEY ARE GETTING THEIR HOMEWORK
    DONE.  
    
    The reason for this advice is that the teachers at Carroll want
    to know two things - 
    1..how well does the child (as opposed to the
    parent/child team) do? 
    2..how much homework will the child do when left to his/her own
    devices.
    
    At Carroll, the teachers feel it's their responsibility to understand
    what each of their children can do, to get the children to want
    to do their homework, to assign homework that will not overwhelm
    the child.
    
    At the start of each school year the teachers use a series of "rewards"
    for getting work done, rather than "punishments" for not doing
    homework.  In Chris's case, the rewards system, coupled with the
    individual tailoring of homework expectations to what Chris could
    do, resulted in an almost miraculous turn around - psychologically,
    and in his own desire to do homework.  He has been at Carroll for
    four years and he is now in a pattern of coming home, sitting down
    and getting his homework done before he'll do anything else.
    
    Now, there are some students for whom the rewards and tailoring
    do not work.  For these children there is a three step process.
     In step one, they don't get the rewards.  If this doesn't work,
    they are kept in AT RECESS to get their homework done - under the
    assistance of a teacher.  If this doesn't work then, and only then,
    are the parents brought into the issue - with notes going home.
     If the rewards, no recess, parent's notes process fails, then the
    parents and teachers get together to formulate an individual plan
    to help the child get his homework done.
    
    No where in the Carroll process is there even a remote suggestion
    that the child is lazy or that the parents have failed to teach
    proper values to the child.  Indeed, the process assumes that learning
    to be responsible for homework is simply one more skill children
    must learn, and they will not learn this in an environment where
    threats, punishment and creation of home-based problems are a normal
    part of the educator's approach.
           

    
    I really like .35, teacher detention.  I do go over my son's homework.
    I've seen everthing, but one common theme is lazy teachers.  Last year
    my son brought home a homework assignment that had so many mispelt
    words on the part of the teacher that it was crazy.  An for me to find
    misspelt words!  I'd expect a language arts teacher to be able to put
    these things into properly spelt memo to students.
    
    I see also teachers giving assignments that are pre-lesson work.  They
    would ask the student in topics such as math, to work problems that
    were of theories not taught in class yet.  I bet some students are
    capable of doing it.  And a lot more are fustrated becasue they can't.
    
    homework could be exciting.  or it could be dull.  If a student doesn't 
    have the foggest idea what or why he is doing something, its hard.
    
    Where do I find those teacher detention slips?
    ed
    

There was a series on incompetent teachers in the NY Post several years ago.
I remember one homework assignment on "opposites" where the teacher asked
what the opposite of "frog" was.  According to the teacher, the answer was...





			toad.

re: .42, .43

Thanks for clarifying.  I read .35 as being heavily sarcastic, but I had the 
background of things you had written here and in other notesfiles.  There were 
no clues to the degree of seriousness with which the recommendations should be 
taken.  Sarcasm and "reducio ad absurdum" type arguments don't work 
particularly well in NOTES.  

.43 is one of the most informative and thought provoking notes I have seen in 
here in a long time.  I'd like a clarification, though.  Carroll School is a 
private school, correct?  And when you say it "has a learning disabled 
population", do you mean that a part of the total population is learning 
disabled, or that the entire population is learning disabled, and therefore 
they specialize?

re: .40

I agree with the gist of .40.   I don't think that all assignments can be made 
"exciting", any more than I expect every assignment that I get at work to be 
"exciting".  But I also have to note that the program described by .0 was 
evidently created by the TEACHERS.  So they have to accept the responsibility 
for making it work, and for the controversy that comes out of it.

There are many parents, who take a lot of responsibility for their own kids, 
and who do not blame everything and everybody else for for their problems.  
Sometimes, when parents do this and the result is that the school has to do 
something a little out of the ordinary for the child, the school becomes 
resistant and uncooperative.  To SOME school officials and SOME teachers, for 
a parent to "take responsibility" means to support everything that the school 
does, and never question what the school does or doesn't do -- even if the 
results are not helpful, or are even harmful, to their children.  So to the 
extent that .40 uses the general term "people", I resent the generalization.  

There are also a lot of teachers, like, I suspect .40, who care(d) deeply about 
the children, and who get extremely frustrated at the lack of support they get 
from the parents of the children -- that the kids don't come to school ready  
to learn.  I'm sure most of them would like nothing better than to personally 
help every child that needs help, but they have neither the time nor the 
resources to do so.  

Would the teacher's time REALLY be better spent in a detention room with kids 
"who refuse to participate in the learning process", or with kids WANT to 
participate, but need help?  

Clay

RE .40

You make valid points about teachers having to be parents to attempt to
teach responibility and morality to children, but, let's be honest, teachers
have filled this role for more generations than one can remember.  Yet,
today, parents scream that the teacher has no right to take those steps
which convey a sense of responsibility, such as forms of punishment for
unmet responsibilities, on the one hand, and yet on the other many parents
do little or nothing at home to compensate.

"You teach my kid ... I expect him to get straight As ... but don't you dare
do anything to take corrective action for his behaviour, even if his
behaviour messes up his marks and / or the marks of others.  Oh yeah, and by 
the way, if he doesn't get straight As, you, the teacher, are directly 
responsible."

It just does not make sense.  It's like telling someone to build a house
and taking away some of his tools.

At one time, teachers stood totally in loco parentis during the school day.
With that came a number of problems, and now, as these things go, the
pendulum has swung too far the other way.  One day, we'll find some happy
mediums ... I hope.

Stuart

    Carroll School is a private school, approved by the state, for learning
    disabled students.  While it is a private school, about 50% of its
    students are publicly funded - that is they are sent to Carroll
    with funding provided by the local public school.
    
    All of the Carroll population is learning disabled and, generally,
    on the way from, or back to, a public school setting.  About 1/3
    of the children each year "graduate" back into their local public
    schools.  By the time they have finished at Carroll the children
    are more aware of their own learning styles, much more likely to
    be advocates for themselves, and their parents have also been trained
    (I sometimes think Carroll spends as much time and effort training
    the parents as they do the children)

    I think that I gave the wrong impression a number of notes back when I
    said that parental signing of homework was required by the school. Yes
    it is, but it is not as a replacement for singling out individuals to
    punish; rather, it is a method of helping to involve parents in their
    children's homework.
    
    The school that my kids go to is in Lowell, Mass. It is called the City
    Magnet School, somewhat of an alternative education public school. It
    began approximately 10 years ago, and is based on the entire school
    (grades K-8) being a micro-Society. The city put several million
    dollars into refurbishing the building with classrooms and "society"
    rooms. The school has a constitution, a legislature, a kids-run judicial
    system, a marketplace, a newspaper, etc. 
    
    Students in the school have jobs (legislators, tax collectors,
    publishers, business managers). The school has a currency, which
    students earn through their jobs.  The basics (reading, writing,
    arithmetic) are taught around "real-world" topics. They don't have
    English, they have publishing; they don't have mathematics, they have
    economy, etc. 
    
    The school has blossomed over the past five years (by the way, my
    daughter is in the 8th grade and has been at the school for 3 years; my
    son is in 1st grade and has been there 2 years). The success rate for
    the school is incredibly high, with students graduating 8th grade at
    (based on standardized testing) an average of TWO FULL grade levels
    above the national average. Attendance is very high at the school.
    
    The interesting part of this whole story is that the school is an 
    inner-city, 40% minority/60% majority mandated school (these ratios
    reflect city population) -- attributes that people typically associate 
    with "avoid that school at all costs".
    
    The school has been the subject of a number of national PBS segments
    (15 minutes on the MacNeil-Lehrer report earlier this year; one of 4
    nationwide schools featured on a 90-minute PBS special on education in
    September). 
    
    Now, what does all this have to do with the topic?? I felt I needed to
    provide some extra data on why I followed the requirement of
    reading/signing homework each night -- its because the school system as
    it is set up now is working and good for the kids. 
    
    
    My initial input was that the parent should make decisions about what is 
    right/wrong for the child, and the parent should act as the final say in 
    all matters. A noter a few notes back asked, in effect, "when are parents 
    going to start taking responsibility for their kids" in relation to parents
    complaining about the way teachers were handling discipline. Well, I
    would assert that parents complaining IS taking responsibility -- they
    are telling the school system how they expect their children to be
    managed. Responsibility means working your hardest to make sure that
    your children are raised in the environment and with the rules that YOU
    THE PARENT feel are best for that child.