Conference moira::parenting

    Ah yes, the horrid pink stuff that stains your entire house (not to
    mention all of your clothing). Spencer is on it right now for a mild
    ear infection (as is his Dad for the same complaint). Spencer hates,
    it, spits and gags, just like any normal child would. (his Dad isn't
    doing much better ;-) )

    	We have been able to hide the drug in his cereal during meals
    (didn't work with just fruit, he could taste it and refused the food).
    The problem with hiding it in food is that you have to make sure that
    they finish all of the food, this can make for some rather looooong
    dinner hours.

    	When no one has any patience, Marc holds Spencer's arms at his side
    (while the baby is on his back) and I put the medicine in his mouth
    with a dropper, of course Spencer usually cries and yells but this only
    helps to get the medicine down. Often I will hold my finger between his
    gums (and those two little razor teeth) so that he has to swallow (kind
    of like giving a pill to a cat). When Spencer gets a cold he is usually
    on 4 medications at one time, I must say that we have gotten pretty
    good at this.
    

    	Giving medicine is no fun, there are usually tears and lots of hugs
    afterwards, I just keep in mind what the consequences of *not* giving
    him the medicine would be and it gives me greater resolve to do what
    needs to be done.

    				Wendy
                 

    
    A 17 month old *might* be convinced to take her medicine if she
    were allowed to do it herself.  This worked for us but our son
    is rather independent and really into doing everything himself.
    We use a medicine spoon - the kind with the hollow handle.  Only
    took him a couple of tries to do it well without spilling.  He'll
    even take those nasty infant vitamin drops if he can do it himself.
    
    Just a thought,
    Carol

    Russell (20 mo.) also hates tylenol, et.al.  We had similar problems
    where he will gag (and used to vomit) any type of medicine.  We also
    keep a supply of Feverall suppositories in the house, so I know how you
    feel. Russell usually gets at least 2-3 ear infections a winter, so
    we've been through the medicine bit.  

    Russell is wary of Robertussin, or Tynelol in his water or milk, but he
    doesn't seem to mind us putting in the Sulfur he usually gets.  Russ is
    allergic to Penicillin, so he gets Sulfermethox(something) twice a day. 
    For a while, we would put the Sulfur in 1-2 oz. of water and get him to
    take it before he had his morning bottle, and again before dinner.  If
    there was any left, we would mix it in with his normal bottle.  Right
    now he's on a preventive dose of the sulfur, and we just add it right
    to his morning milk.  I think he's just gotten used to it.  My dr said
    I could mix the medicine with milk, juice, whatever, so maybe you can
    find something your daughter will take.

    I've tried to give it to him straight, but it's too much of a struggle. 
    If you can get the dropper over to the side of their mouth, in deep
    along the cheek, they are "forced" to swallow the stuff.  But I usually
    can't get him to sit still long enough for that.

    Hope this helps...
    
    marianne
    

    Lisa,
    
    I had the same problem with my son who had repeated ear infections for
    a couple of years.  He also spit his amoxicillin out (I don't blame
    him-it tastes horrible), so since he is a chocolate milk lover I hid
    his medication in a few tablespoons of his favorite drink.  I added a
    bit more chocolate than unsual to mask the taste.  If your daughter 
    likes strawberry you could try Strawberry Quik.  I have heard of people
    trying pudding, ice cream and even Jello to "hide" it in, but I had
    the most luck with the choc. milk.  
    
    Hope this helps!
    
    Linda 

    
    Michael was sick for most of his 4-5th mos...one cold after another and 
    was on 4 different meds at one time (one being the awful "pink" stuff")
    Seemed it would never end. He hated taking his meds, but there was no
    choice, and we just had to hold him down and got for it.
    
    Well, since that time, he now takes any meds like its candy! I guess
    maybe having been on them for so long, he got used to it, and now no
    longer complains. Thank god!
    
    Chris
    

    My daughter has had 3 ear infections since she turned a year old. She
    is now 20 months. She had no problem taking the liquid amoxcicillan.
    The 3rd time the doctor prescribed chewables, at 17 months she took
    those just fine. My question for the basenoter, Does your child have
    many teeth? If so the chewables may be the way to go. They are not that
    hard and some kids prefer them over the liquid. Children associate
    medicine with being liquid on a spoon. I just give Danielle a tablet
    and she pops it right in her mouth and the job is done.
    
    
    Sandy

    I haven't read all the other replies, but the few times I have had
    trouble getting Stephen (20 mo) to take his medicine, I have layed him
    down and slid the dropper way back between his cheek and gum and give
    it to him.  After a few times doing this I can get it down him first
    try.  You have to be quick.  The doctor told me if you do that, they
    have to swollow it.  Then I hand him some water to get the taste out of
    his mouth and tell him what a big boy he is for taking his medicine.
    
    Most of the time I am very fortunate and he will take it without any
    problem.  He really likes to take it himself.
    
    Kathy

    We experienced the same type of thing with Shannon -- she would not take
    any oral medication.  Not only would she fight, scream, spit it out,
    she would vomit the entire contents of her stomach !!!  We tried all
    the above suggestions (different spoons, "hiding" etc. to no avail).
    
    Finally, she had to take amoxicillin for an ear infection. 
    Luckily she was in the hospital when it was prescribed so I asked for
    (and got) syringes to measure up the dose, and she seemed to do best
    when she sat up, and I inserted the syringe to the side of her mouth
    EVER SO SLOWLY while Dad encouraged from the sidelines!
    
    I haven't had to give her any other medication since, but I have kept
    those syringes for the future!  
    
    perhaps it is worth a try
    
    -beth

    
    When my kids were little, I laid them on the diaper table and pressed
    both cheeks with a hand to form an "O". Then, I poured the medicine
    with a dropper or medicine spoon into the mouth and held the mouth
    position until they took a big gulp.  They need to gulp in order to
    take a breath. I then gave them some water followed by a pinch of sugar. 
    
    The process might sound a little harsh,  but it is swift. Adding it to
    regular food ruins its taste and the kid knows about it anyway. My kids
    only complained (spit, gag etc.) till the sugar. That seems to take
    away the aftertaste.  BTW, I myself wash down any medicine with water 
    and a pinch of sugar.
    
    My 4-year old takes medicine with no problem at all. The 2-year old
    can sometimes be fussy. When I cannot convince her, I still use the
    above method.
    
    Pam
    

If they hate one antibiotic, they may love another.  See if the doctor will try
changing to another one.  (Elise hates amoxillin, but loves bactrim).

The lying down and pinching the cheeks works very well, but make sure the kid
knows the medicine is coming so they don't inhale.  Use a dropper for this
method; you can control the flow better.

Also - try making stupid noises and pretending the spoon or dropper is an
airplane, etc.  Most of the time they're so fascinated by the silly noises, they
open right up.

The only other thing I can say is that you have to choose your battles and
unfortunately, this is one you have to win.  Just keep plugging away.
They figure out it's going to happen whether they like it or not, and actually
become a little more cooperative.

    Thanks to all the parents who have replied! (I LOVE this notesfile!)
    Yesterday, I printed out all the replies and discussed them with my
    husband (he's the one who has to give 2 of the 3 daily doses by
    himself). As we have already tried hiding medicines in juice, water,
    applesauce, etc., we decided not to do that with the amoxicillin. As we
    have always given her medication with a oversized medicine dropper, we
    decided to try the 'between the cheek and gum' method described by 2
    parents. The difference was that we used to just put the dropper way
    back in her mouth on her tongue. Well, the new method worked GREAT! 
    Caroline still wasn't happy about been held still with her head slightly 
    back, but, after trying to wait as long as possible she did finally swallow.
    There was only a minimum of tears as it was over so quickly. The 'pink
    stuff' didn't get all over the 3 of us as she really couldn't spit it
    out. We'll see if we all continue to do so well over the long weekend.
    Now it makes me wonder if in addition to the taste or consistency of
    the medicine, that the dropper on the back of the tongue might have
    also contributed to her excellent gag reflex! Thanks so much for all
    the tips and encouragement!
     

I was severely anemic when I was in my teens and had to take an iron tonic
which tasted worse than awful.  And I was reasonable, I knew I HAD to take it.
The doctor suggested putting it in orange juice which I did.  To this day I
will seldom drink orange juice because it still tastes like that iron tonic.

Be sure you don't hide the medicine in something that you really want them to 
like (like their milk :-).

ccb

    My sister works as an RN in Boston City Hospital, and gave us this tip
    for kids who are still on a bottle. She said they rarely put meds in
    the kids bottles or food, because then the kids *must* finish it all,
    and that can be a worse battle than just swallowing the meds! What they
    do is take a bottle nipple (nipple only, crosscut ones work the very
    best), measure the meds into the nipple, and let the child suck it out
    of the nipple. We put Jake on his back on the changing table, and tip
    his head back ever so slightly, so that the nipple is level (otherwise
    it runs out when they first start to suck on it). He was very surprised
    by it the first time, but swallowed it without a fuss. Takes him 1 - 2
    minutes, tops. Most "regular" nipples (as opposed to Playtex shape, or
    orthodonitc ones) hold exactly 1 tsp. when filled level full, which is
    most convenient! Oh, he was on Augmentin, not Amoxicillin. He's been
    through Amoxi, Bactrim and Augmentin within 7 weeks, and still can't
    seem to shake this ear infection. Not looking forward to the next ear
    check, as I don't think the augmentin got rid of it either (he still
    bangs his ears and pokes at them).
    
    --dave--

Along the same lines of .13, if you want to put the medicine in the bottle,
just make 1 small bottle of say an ounce with the meds in it, and give that
to the baby first.  Then give the rest of the formula separately.  That way,
you don't have to worry about having the baby finish all the formula since
s/he's already gotten it all.  They used to use that trick on my daughter
in the NICU since she didn't always finish her bottle, but we had to be sure
she was getting her meds. Finishing a bottle has never been a problem for my
son, so we could just put his medicine in a full bottle and be assured he
would drink it down.

My 5 month old son has had TWO ear infections already, and he would not 
take the medicine at all, so we gave it to him in his bottle, and we gave
him the bottle with the medicine first, and measured about 3 ounces in the 
bottle to make sure that he would take it all, and be hungry enough so he would 
not complain.  I called the doctor on this, and he said that it was fine to
put it in the bottle, but he had to take the entire bottle.  He seems to be 
better, he just finished his 10 day supply
yesterday, and I am praying that he doesn't get it again!!

    My 9 month old doesn't like medications either - we give Feverall
    sprinkle caps mixed in food - you could try the amoxycillin that way.
    
    

    My son must have a strange sense of taste!  He loves his liquid
    vitamins and the amoxycillin!!   I can't figure it out but I guess
    I'm pretty lucky 'cuz he never puts up a fight.  We give the medicine 
    to him with a dropper and he'll suck on it until he gets the last drop.
    He seems to think it's a treat and I guess we kind of reinforce that by
    saying things like "would you like to have some medicine now?" 
    I think in the future we'll have to be sure to make the distinction
    between medicine and candy, but he's only 19 months old so for right
    now we just let him think of it as a treat.   And something else we do
    is hold the bottle and let him dip the dropper into the bottle himself.
    Then we help him fill it up and he puts it in his mouth by himself.  We
    do this at the kitchen table so if it dribbles the mess is easy to
    clean up.   I know when he was younger we had a struggle getting him to
    take medicines like Tempra, and I'm not really sure when it changed -
    I don;t recall doing anything specifically to get Matthew to take it
    but I know we act like it's something really good (saying, uuummmmm,
    and yummy) and he follows our lead!      I don't know if this is of
    any help to anyone!!!   It works for us!     Lila
    
    
      

    re: a few back, instead of just using the nipple, I had purchases a
    nipple contraption before AJ was born.  I think it held an ounce total
    and had nipple that kind of stretched over the neck of this thing.  I
    think it was made by (oh good grief I can't remember the name) the
    people who make baby things like the padded spoons, they use a blister
    pack with a blue and white checked pattern on the card.  For me it was
    just short ofa miracle.
    
    Second thing we did was to ask the pharmacist for a syringe without th
    needle, some will, some won't it all depends on what kind of
    relationship you have with the pharmacist, sometimes the pedi's office
    can provide you with one, or a commercial one is sold with the medicine
    droppers.  FYI 5cc's equal a teaspoon, we still measure this way and
    he's over 5 now.
    
    We take a very "matter of fact" attitude when giving medicine, always
    have.  Here it is, not bribing nothing.  I still maintain it's all in
    the attitude.  He may protest a little some of the extremely bad
    tasting medicines (bendryl liquid aparently has a strong taste for
    example) but will still take it.  As he got older we explained that
    this is the medicine that will make your "boo boo in your ear" or
    whatever feel better.  I guess he can be reasoned with, on occation.
    
    Good luck, I do know this is not pleasant, especially when the poor
    little guy doesn't feel good to start with.
    
    
    Lyn

    My daughter (21 months) just had a bad reaction to Immodium AD.  I want
    to let you know so that you are on the alert if this happens to your
    child.  I will tell the doctor's office next time I speak to them.
    
    We gave her the dose (1/4 tsp) recommended by the doctor for persistent
    diarhea.  
    
    It seemed to constrict her throat.  She coughed a lot after taking it
    and her breathing was somewhat labored.  The first time this happened
    she vomited after coughing awhile.  The daycare provider got really
    scared.  I tried this medicine one more time and she had the same
    reaction.  After about an hour her breathing had improved enough that I
    felt safer in putting her to bed.  I checked her several times during
    the night and she seemed fine.  
    
    We gave her Immodium AD last month without this bad reaction.  It
    really cought the poor daycare provider by surprise.
    
    This reminds me of a similar reaction I had once to some artificially
    sweetened hard candies.  I have not reacted this way to Immodium AD,
    though.
    
    Now we are using Kaopectate for Ilona.
    
    L

    After seeing a program a year ago about the misuse of Immodium in
    India and how it is supposed to work, I don't think that I would
    use it for diahorrea.  Basically the stuff slows the digestive tract
    from working and inhibits muscular action along the digestive tract.
    In India, because it's only available in adult formulation, kiddies
    are often overdosed, and die because there digestive system totally
    stops, leaving rotting food in the intestines.  It is shocking.
    
    Kaopectate is far preferable ... and in the UK now, they prefer to
    use electrolyte balanced drinks.
    
    Stuart

    My guess is that probably the medication that because Immodium stops the 
    bowels from moving their contents, which in a sense causes paralysis of 
    the bowels, probably caused paralysis of your daughter's esophogas.
    
    Yes it is dangerous.  Might even be worth calling poison control to get
    their expert opinion on what to do if there were to be a next time.
    Did your pedi tell you to use this on your small child?  I think if he
    did  I'd push back a little and tell the pedi of the adverse reaction
    your daughter had, she might not be the first or only child to react.
    
    We always had good luck with Kaopectate or good ol' Pepto.
    
    Lyn

We used Immodium with Elise during one illness.  After 3 days of vomiting and
diarrhea, we needed to do something to stop the fluid loss, after the vomiting
stopped and she could retain liquids.  The pediatrician recommended we use it, 
but only for one day, and no more than 3 doses total.  If it 
took more than that to slow the diarrhea, we would try other things.

The side effect we observed was thirst.  It made her extremely thirsty, to the
point of her asking for water every 15 minutes or so.  Now, granted, we were 
using it because of possible dehydration, but the effect was dramatic.  Since
we couldn't let her drink all she wanted (feared the vomiting would start again),
she sipped continuously for hours.

The few times my husband has used it, he has also been very thirsty.

Pat

    Elise, my pedi's rule of thumb to prevent dehydration while having
    either vomiting or diarrhea is to drink one ounce, and only one ounce
    per hour of a clear liquid, preferably apple juice, gateraid, or flat
    gingerale.  (one ounce is roughly one of those little plastic cups that
    comes with the childrens' tylenol and other meds. 5cc's = one tsp, so
    you need 15cc's) I was told that if the child can't keep even that much
    down, after 5 hours of trying then a trip to the ER for replacement
    fluids is likely in order.
    
    As for the probable cause.... there have been a lot of people out this
    week with a real nasty stomach bug, it seems to get into the house and
    run through the whole family.  It's been making people miserable for
    two to three days.  Might just be a bad bug, don't feel guilty over a
    little tub or pool water.
    
    By the way we have a frappe maker, like the ice cream shops use.  It's
    a real quick easy way to "flatten" soda in a hurry. I would imagine a
    blender or even food processor might do the same thing.
    
    Lyn

    My husband has the same reaction to maraschino cherries, some mints, and
    almond extract.  
    
    We watch the brand of toothpaste we buy, and he avoids gum and other
    foods or medicines with these type of flavorings.  I know he can't use
    Pepto Bismol because of this.
    
    Luckily, I haven't noticed it in Gina.
    
    judy  

    My husband and I are having difficulty (GREAT difficulty) administering
    medication to our 13 month old.   For his first two ear infections he
    was on amoxicillian and he'd spit it right back.  Then he went on 
    suprex (Suprax??) and we'd fight to get that in him.  (Luckily Connor
    is pretty healthy so it's not like this is a daily thing but its
    trouble when it is needed).  Even trying to give him Tylenol or Tempra
    is a struggle.  It literally takes the two of us to administer
    something.  
    
    Also, like the note in 249, we also have trouble getting him use to the
    toothbrush.  Basically whenever he see's us approaching with the brush
    or something that appears to be medicine he gets lock jaw and slaps his
    little hands over our mouths as if to say.."No way".  
    
    Do any of you have any helpful hints?  We've tried putting the medicine
    on a teaspoon also but he just slaps it away.  He's a pretty
    independent little guy.

    
    Patrick is on a maintenance dose of the pink stuff, has been for
    several months. He's very good about it now, but we've had our moments
    8^).
    
    I've found the best time to give it to him has been just before
    bedtime. It has become part of the routine, and I think this is what
    has made it a non issue. If it becomes a routine at a certain time then
    it's less of an unknown to them.
    
    We always gave him the medicine in a teaspoon. When he would fight,
    the technique I'd use is, one hand on the spoon, the other hand on his
    forehead, tilting his head back a little. The object is not to put a
    head lock on him 8^) but to steady his head from shaking side to side
    (the 'no' shake). Once he was steady he would open his mouth and give
    in.
    
    Chris
    

    We used logic also.  After many months of liking his medicines,
    Nathan all of a sudden decided he did not like any (pink was a major
    food group in our house his first winter) antibiotics.  We explained
    that he would take his medicine, and that was that.  Would he like to
    take it friendly-like, and maybe get a treat and definitely loves, or
    would he be forced to take it, with angry parents and unhappy tears. 
    Once given the choice, he knew what he wanted; this phase lasted bery
    little time!

My soon to be 4 year old (BOD 3-17-98) suddenly needs to take iron pills twice
a day.  Unfortunately iron does not come in a chewable form.  It comes as pills 
(like adults take), liquid or capsules.

How do you get a 4 yr old to swallow a pill?

The capsules would be great because I could cut them open and sprinkle them in
just about anything, but they are expensive (CVS had 60 caps for $13.00).
That's a one month supply.

Liquid iron cannot be mixed with milk and Kyle is not much of a juice drinker.
It's milk or water, and I'm sure water won't camouflage the taste.  Plus my doctor
said I'd need to buy tons if I choose liquid form, and liquid is more expensive
capsules.

So I bought 100 pills for $4. They are the same exact ones I have taken in the past.  
They don't taste bad, they are just chalky inside and make you gag (I chewed one
to see what Kyle would be getting, normally I swallow mine whole).

Forget trying to put it in a spoonful of ice cream, pudding, applesauce, 
or yogurt.  This is a 4 yr old we are talking about.  He swallows the food,
then pulls out the pill and hands it back to me.

So my solution is to give him 1 life saver (candy) and 1 iron pill and have him 
chew them simultaneouly.  Then he quickly gulps down some milk when it's over.
But candy at 7:30AM is not my ideal for starting the day, even if it is only 1
piece.  Then we do this routine again after dinner.

Does anyone else have a healthy method of getting actual pills into kids?

PS:  Iron is absorbed much faster when taken with vitamin C so Kyle eats a
     kiwi or an orange after his iron pill.  Kiwi has twice as much iron as 
     an orange!

    Personally, if it means getting the pill down, I'd go with the candy at
    7:30 in the morning.  The other option is to have him practice swallowing
    whole using M&M's (at a time when "candy" is allowed 8^) ).
    
    -sandy
    

    
    My son Michael, 14 months, has been on Synthroid since he was 10 days
    old.  Synthroid only comes in pill form so we had to figure out how
    to give this baby a pill!  In the very beginning we crushed it into
    powder and gave it to him on the end of our finger.  He has no problem
    taking the pill.  What we do now is break it into 4 pieces and put it
    in applesauce.  So, my suggestion is try breaking it up into smaller
    pieces and put it in something.  Sometimes, Michael finds it in the 
    applesauce and chews it with his front teeth.  Maybe the whole pill
    is the problem.
    
    I'm interested to see how you make out because I'm not sure what the
    future will bring for us in taking his pill.  He will have to take
    it everyday for the rest of his life. 
    
    Good luck!
    
    Kelly

    I've had good luck in the past asking the pharmacist for 
    suggestions about giving medication to kids. This is the 
    way I learned the trick about dripping eye drops into my
    son's eye as he lies on his side. Maybe your druggist has
    some ideas on this one, in addition to the noters'.
    
    Lucy

    
    
    I had to take iron pills when I was a kid too.  The
    way that my Mom got me to take them was to take a 
    piece of cake or donut and chew it up, just when 
    I was about to swallow the food I popped the pill
    in my mouth and swallowed it down with the food.
    
    It worked for me.  
    
    Good luck,
    
    Jeanne
    
    

    
    How about powder form in chocolate milk?

    Is there anyway he can take a multivitamin with extra iron, 2x a day? 
    At least those are flavored like candy.
    

    My son had a reaction to the pennicillin in the liquid form. (Dye made
    him hyper) so we switched to pills.  Jason was 4 1/2 at the time.  What
    worked for us was for Jason to put the pill as far back into his mouth
    without gagging, then I gave him a cup of water or juice and a straw. 
    When he sucked in the liquid, the force of it pushed the pill down his
    throat.  This worked on the first try 99.9% of the time.
    
    Donna

    I realize this is late, but I've been quite behind in notes...
    
    I wondered if Orange Juice or even grapefruit juice might help disguise
    the taste.  I know they use this method for people who have to take
    other disgusting things, including mineral oil.
    
    I also have seen a "pill cup" in the CVS, Brooks and other types of
    drug stores.  It's a plastic cup, with a kind of pocket built into the
    top of it, you put the pill in the pocket, fill the cup with (whatever)
    kind of liquid, and just take a drink.  Supposidly the pill and the
    drink hit your mouth at the same time, and you swallow them both
    together.
    
    I also wonder if, since you are having him chew the pill, did you
    consider the new life savers "gummies".  It's life saver candy in a
    "gummy bear" type of consistency.  I personally think they're horrible,
    but kids seem to think differently.  For that matter how about fruit
    dinasauers instead of the gummies, or wrapping the pill in a piece of 
    "fruit by the foot" which all the kids seem to love.  There's something
    about citrus flavors that do a good job of masking bad flavors.  Lime
    Sherbet might be a solution too.
    
    If it's iron he needs, I seem to remember the pharmacist carries,
    behind the counter but NOT prescription, Ferris-Sulphate tablets. 
    These are a generic version of iron, quite inexpensive, and I remember
    the tablets being fairly small, say about the size of a seudofed
    tablet.
    
    Can you tell I've been packing too many school lunches lately?
    
    Lyn