Conference moira::parenting

    
    First of all, drop the child off and leave!!  Don't hang around saying
    a thousand goodbyes.  IT makes it much worse for the kid.  When my wife
    babysat, there was this one mother who would keep saying "Goodbye, I'm
    leaving" over and over until the kid finally noticed then started
    crying.  Must be some kinda security thing where mother's need to know
    they're wanted or something!
    
    Second, if the child is crying when you leave, it won't last.  Every
    kid my wife watched that would cry as the parent left was stopped and
    playing with toys by the time the parent made it back to their car.
    
    
     Chris D.

    My oldest went to daycare part-time (2 days) when he was a little over
    three.  He did NOT adjust well.  He cried all day!  He did not ever cry
    when I left him off - he was being such a trooper or my sake.  He was
    fine in every other way in the evenings and weekends, but spent most of
    the day crying at daycare.  I pulled him after 6 days (three weeks).  I
    was temping and my husband was unemployed (soon to be employed again)
    so we had another option short-term.  Soon after, a friend said she
    would be doing daycare at home - would I want to bring the boys.  We
    jumped on the chance - she knew the kids, they knew her, she was also
    my oldest son's sunday school teacher.  It was fine for a short period. 
    She started in early October and by December she was telling me that my
    oldest was not adjusting well - he was being destructive to her things
    (which she never told me about as it happened) and to the other kids. 
    At that time my husband changed his shift to accomodate him - he began
    working nights.  My job was full-time now (I started back because my
    hudband's first offer fell thru and we needed the medical, etc).  I
    spent time talking with the pedi at the first sign of trouble back in
    September - he told me to hang in there, my son would adjust.  I
    disagreed - I felt I knew my son better and I didn't want to make his
    life miserable for him.  Now in December, my kids went to Jeanne's
    part-time - 2 hours a day.  We bought a house in NH and moved away from
    Jeanne (and she moved to Washington, so the arrangement was over).  As
    my son got older, he got better adjusted and accepted the way things
    were.  As long as he thought he was "visiting" for a few hours, he
    could handle it.  He is very much a family-man and didn't like being
    away from his parents.  Now he is a 7 year old in school - loves every
    minute of it and begs to go on Saturdays!  I feel the decisions we made
    were right for our family - I am glad we did not listen to the pedi's
    advice, but chose our own way.
    
    You will need to make your own decisions because you know your child
    best.  You will receive lots of personal testimony here - which will be
    a big help (unfortunately, I didn't know about notes back then).
    
    Good luck with your decisions!!
    -sandy
    

    Funny you should mention Creative Years daycare.  My husband, who used
    to be Mr. Mom is going out into the working world soon.  I called
    Creative Years to find out how much they were, etc.  They wanted
    $100.00 for my 21 month old and $95.00 for my 4 year old!  Why work if
    it's going to cost that much!  I know some places have a second child
    discount, but not this place.
    
    The lady at the daycare center said that the 2 yr olds have lunch at
    11:30 and nap at 12:00, and the 4 year olds have lunch at 12:00 and nap
    at 12:30 until 2:00.  I asked "What if my child doesn't want to take a
    nap?  Is she going to have to stay in bed the whole time?"  And the
    answer was no.  They take them out of the napping room and let them
    play with quiet toys until 2:00.  The price of the daycare includes
    breakfast, lunch, and snacks but does not include diapers and wipes.
    
    I'm still trying to find a daycare or home provider that will let my
    children play outside if nice (my last provider wouldn't let them
    outside if there was a breeze), teach them songs, games, etc., won't
    punish them if they don't want to take a nap or eat all their lunch (my
    last provider did this).  So needless to say I've had rotten luck with
    daycare.  As soon as I am upset with the daycare provider, I remove my
    child and get a new one.  
    
    My problem is that my 21 month old has been home with Daddy since she
    was three months old.  I have a feeling she's not going to like going
    to someone else.  Especially if I take them to a daycare where they
    seperate the ages.  I think she'll be fine as long as she can be with
    her sister.  Once seperated, who knows what will happen.  I'll just
    have to keep interviewing the sitters and find one I want my children
    to stay with.
    
    Gail

Well ...

Jim/I flex-houred until Juli's first birthday.  From 12-17 months she went
to a homecare provider (next door).  That seemed to work out fairly well
(in the beginning) because Juli knew her and played with the care provider's
kids regularly.  So we didn't experience ANY "severance anxiety".

With time, what we did experience was Juli's frustration (and consequently
behavior problems).  Juli needed more challenge (arts/crafts, games),
more structure (schedules, naps, etc.) and really thrived by being with many
other kids.  Jim usually does the daycare run (dropoff and pickup) and
Juli seems "rarely" to mind his leaving (often demands that he leave NOW!).
With me, she's more clingy.  I allow a little extra time to play with her
and her friends at daycare and then "quietly bow out" (not sneak away, but
just take advantage of the moment to split while Juli's playing or enjoying
herself).  She'll notice I've left and might call out my name, but rarely
cries or screams (I can hear her from the parking lot -- if she's outdoors).

The kids are "encouraged" to nap, but if all else fails, they are allowed 
quiet time.  I'm glad my kid takes a daily nap -- she needs it AND I NEED IT!
As for eatting, I do not believe the center pushes the kids to eat, but the
kids do tend to be led by what the other kids are doing -- so they eat in
response to the other kids eatting  (and napping!).  Juli has learned a lot
at the center, but also is allowed a fair amount of "free play", too.

When comparing daycare centers, it was important to Jim/I to address their
activities, student/teacher ratio, schedules, discipline practices, child
evaluations ... basically we were looking for a "learning" center 
environment rather than a "free-spirited" daycare environment.  We particularly
wanted to be sure that Juli would be with a group fo children on her level
of age and development for a "fair amount" of the day, yet mixed with all the
other children a "part" of the day.

So, as the previous noter stated, it's important to for you to evaluate and
understand what type of "care" you want and pursue a homecare provider or
center that can meet you and your child needs ... as every parent/child have
different needs and expectations as does another parent/child.  And there are
plenty of opportunities out there, so you shouldn't have too much trouble
finding a good fit.

As for the cost of care ... I believe your numbers are on the LOW SIDE!!!
We pay $138/week at Juli's center and if our second adoption comes through
in September, we'll be moving both children to a different learning center
and we'll be paying about $260/week.  But I believe Jim/I are giving Juli
quality care and with it usually comes a price.

Hope this helps.

Dottie

PS:  Juli does not attend a "chain"-type daycare center ... but one thing
     to know if you're interviewing them (e.g. Children's World, Kindercare,
     etc.) is that although they follow "guidelines and procedures", 
     they can vary from center to center (depending on management, funding,
     clientel, etc.).  So although I may not have liked the ABC center in
     Thistown, I may be impressed with the ABC center in Thattown.  One
     benefit is that if you travel or move, your child can attend a different
     center "at no additional cost"  (not sure how they work the tuition
     transfer ... must be via management).  It's a benie if you're a travelling
     Mom!!  (I think it was Kristen Cox who mentioned this a year or so back.)

We have just recently gone through this as well.  This is Nicole's third week
in her new daycare situation.

Nicole just turned two at the beginning of May.  She had previously been
with a home daycare provider since she was 4 months.  Because of the addition
of too many younger children I decided to move her to a different environment.
I also felt that she needed more interaction with children that were her own
age.

I agonized over this decision.  While I was not completely happy with her
home daycare situation, it had become comfortable for both of us.  I kept
thinking, "Is the situation really bad enough to move her" and "what if
the new situation does not work, then what".  Did I really want to put her
through what I felt would be a terrible transition.

The end result is that the new daycare center is working out very well (After
one week, she came home knowing all the words to three songs). But it
could have gone easier.  Because I was apprehensive, I think Nicole picked
up on those feelings.  The first week, I went with her every morning and
spent an hour or two until I could break myself away. (She only went 1/2
days the first week).  The last day that week, I just dropped her off in the
care of one of her teachers.  Well, that was her best day of the week.  Yes,
she did cry when I first left, but it only lasted a couple of minutes vs
the on and off crying that she experienced the first couple of days.

This is her second week of full-time care at the new center and she loves it.
She asks to "go to school", sings her songs, talks about all the "new" kids,
sometimes gets a little upset when it is time to leave daycare for the day,
and no longer cries or clings when I drop her off in the morning.

I think what helped was for us to keep talking very positively to her about
the new daycare.  Asking her about it, telling her what she would be doing,
talking about the "new kids" she could play with etc.

Looking back, this transition could have gone easier if I had not been so
apprehensive about making the change.  

Barbara

    My son started at 18 months and didn't have any problem with it. he
    seemed to enjoy it until about 3rd or 4th grade. At that point I stopped
    the day care.                                     

    I think a lot of the child's reaction is to the actual care giver.  For
    us we notice that he reacts much more positively to the "younger"
    preschool teachers.  I talking about the ones who usually have some
    sort of degree in early child development, who have been only out of
    college for a few years.
    
    AJ's current teacher is a middle age woman (I'd guess 40ish), and he
    has had some conflict with her, simply because she is a little less
    flexible and "bouncy" than the other teachers in the preschool center.
    I realize that as he progresses through regular school not every
    teacher is going to be young and bubbly, so I'm not even considering
    this as a problem.  He will just have to adjust.  However I have
    mentioned this problem to the director of the center, that they may
    just be a "chemistry conflict" between AJ and his teacher, and could
    explain some of his discipline problems.  The discipline problems seem
    to be completely absent on days when the teacher is out, or during the
    part of the day when he is being cared for by one of the other
    "younger" teachers.
    
    By the way, last week most of the preschool took a field trip, parents
    were encouraged to come along.  So I did.  I arrived with AJ at his
    usual arrival time, and spent about 2 hours before the bus came just
    playing "fly on the wall" during song and story time.  Let me tell you
    I saw a this class in action, and was impressed at the amount of
    learning these kids get in a day.  I also saw a couple of the kids
    arrive and experience separation anxiety, the tears and clingy things. 
    What I can vouch for is that literally by the time the parents had hit
    the parking lot the kids really were happy and engaged in some sort of
    activity.  
    
   Sorry to ramble.... Does this help to relieve any "mommy anxiety"??
    
    Lyn

    Looks like we may have to move our kids to a new daycare center
    at the beginning of September.  Our kids will be 4 and almost 2 then.
    I don't worry about the 4 yr old.  I think he may enjoy the changes.
    I do worry about the 2 yr old.  This will be her second daycare 
    center in 3 months.  She just started at the current center 3 weeks
    ago and just started to enjoy it.   It was a big adjustment for her.
    Before this, she was home with a nanny.
    
    I would like to make the transition as smooth as possible for her.
    Any suggestions are greatly appreciated.
    
    Wendy
    

I was just wondering why you switched to Daycare after having a Nanny ??

I have a nanny with my 6 month old, and I love it.  The cost is really equivalent
to a good Daycare (from my experience).


					---Sue.

    Re: .9
    
    I switched to daycare from nanny due to several reasons.  My
    biggest reason is my daughter was bored at home.  She needed
    interaction with children at her age.  Although, I also have
    a 4 yr old, but he was attending nursery school and was only home 
    3 afternoons.  Therefore, most of the time, she was the only child in 
    the house.  My ideal solution is to have her attending daycare center 
    2 days a week.  However, my nanny didn't want to work part-time.
    Another reason that I picked daycare is stability.  I had 3 nannies
    for my daughter (she was home from birth to 21 months) 
    and **6** nannies for my son (he was home from birth to 15 months).
    I am tired of uncertainty.
    
    Hope this answers your question.
    
    Wendy

    While we try to find Ilona a full-time slot at a daycare center, we are
    considering placing her at Applewood, a local center, on Mondays,
    Wednesdays, and Fridays, and keeping her at her current home daycare
    setting for Tuesdays and Thursdays.
    
    Does anyone have experience in placing a toddler certain days in one
    setting and other days in another?  Is it too confusing?  Did it work
    out?
    
    Also, I am concerned that she will greatly prefer the center and be
    unhappy for the days at the home daycare.
    
    Thanks,
    L
    

At one time or another, both of our children were in two different daycares, 
with no major problems.  

We switched once because we thought it best that Lara be in one place, but 
were unhappy with the place we picked, and went back to the two places.  I 
guess that means that I think one good place is best, but two good places are 
better than one bad one.

In our situation it was Monday thru Wednesday one place, and Thursday and 
Friday the other.  I seems to me that it's better to have only one changeover 
during the week, but I have no experience to back that up.

I don't understand why you are concerned that she may prefer the daycare 
center.  I forget how old Ilona is.  If she greatly prefers the daycare 
center, it may be an indication that she is ready for a more structured 
pre-school environment.

Clay

    Laura,
    
    When Marc turned 2, we changed his schedule from full-time at the
    family daycare to Mon-Tue at a center; Wed-Fri at the family daycare. 
    We kept this schedule for about 9 months, at which time we gradually
    converted (over a period of a month) to full-time at the center, where
    he still goes.  We referred to each day as either a "school day" or
    a "Robin day" (and weekends are "staying home days").  He didn't find
    it confusing at all.  It always seemed, however, that special events at
    the daycare center (field trips, holiday parties, etc.) seemed to
    always be on a day Marc didn't go. 

    The reason I'm concerned about her preferring the center ("school") is
    because I'm trying my darnedest to get her in there full time and so
    far, no luck.  What I'm really afraid of is that she will find the
    family daycare quite lacking by comparison and become unhappy about
    going there at all.
    
    'course putting her into a center is going to deliver a knock out blow
    to our budget, but what the heck. ;-)
    
    L
    

    Laura, I don't know what the specifics of your situation are, or what
    Ilona's personality is like, but in our case, it takes Marc a VERY
    LONGGGGG time to get used to new situations and people (probably a few
    months until he really feels comfortable).  Consequently, when he
    started going to the center last year, he consistently cried every
    time I dropped him off, made me carry him in, etc.  Going to Robin's
    house, on the other hand, was (and still is), like going to a favorite
    aunt's house.  Since he'd been going there since he was 4 months old, 
    it's almost like a second home to him.  He just strolls right in and
    makes himself at home.
    
    I'm glad we started with the split schedule.  Switching cold-turkey to
    full-time at the center would have been too much of an adjustment.  I
    think it was the right time for us to start at a center, also.  He's
    had the opportunity to be around other kids, and do a lot of things
    that Robin doesn't have the facilities for (crafts, field trips,
    swimming, big playground).  On the other hand, still spending 3 days a
    week at Robin's gave him the freedom to just hang around the house and
    "be a kid", doing whatever unstructured things came up.  I thought he
    still needed that at age 2.
    
    I think you should take advantage of the opportunity to send Ilona part
    time to the center (although maybe make the days there sequential, just
    for continuity sake), and see how it goes.  I didn't feel Marc needed
    to be in a center full-time until he got closer to 3.

    I don't know how it's like in the us,but I have kind of a problem with
    my daughter.the "problem" is regarding some "habbits" that as far as
    I know she had taken at the center she goes to.The first one is:if she
    doesn't get it NOW (IT can be food,a toy,etc)-she screams her head off.
    The other thing is that when she's tired,or sad,she just put her little
    head on the floor,and stays there until we come and pick her up.The
    first (screanig) is a pain,but the second (head on the floor)makes me
    want to cry since it makes me feel so guilty.Have you ever paced those 
    things? what do you do?
    Rivka_who feels guilty enough as it is...
     

    Mitchell...10 mos does that too.  
    
    The screaming:  I think they are learning independence and get
    frustrated so they let it out the only way they know how.  In my
    daycare Mitchell is the only one who does this.  He's only there
    2-3 days a week.  I just think some children get 'strong wills'
    very early....I hope it's not of sign of what's to come.  Usually,
    we'll ignore it or say "Mitchell stop it" very stern.  Gets his 
    attention and he usually quits.  He's really bad when you try to
    take something out of his mouth that he shouldn't have.
    
    The laying head down:  Mitchell does this and I think its because
    he plays so hard his body finally tells him to lay down and rest
    a minute.  He likes to fight his sleep...because he learned he
    could.  When they're small infants they don't know how to resist
    the desire for sleep.  It is so hard when they can't talk.
    
    I wouldn't worry about this nor would I necessarily blame the day care.
    I think it is normal.  Hopefully you'll hear from other parents with
    similar experiences.
    
    Kristen

	Rivka,

	My daughter is only 6 months old, and already fusses occasionally
	when she can't get something (like the trash can that looks so
	inviting but is six inches beyond her reach/mobility).  She
	doesn't go to a daycare, so I think it's just personality.
	(I have no idea where she'd ever get a temper from  ;-)  )

Karen

    Tyler has been in daycare since he was 4 months old (will be 4 in Dec.) 
    He has been in KinderCare for about 5 months now.  I love their
    programs and he actually counts and understands numbers very well now.
    
    Yesterday His teacher told me he was hitting her and he would have to
    be removed from school if he didn't stop.  I gathered from the
    conversation that he was realy beating on her.  I asked her why she
    didn't give him time-out or something.  I don't think she understood
    the question because she doesn't speak English very well, I'm not sure
    of her nationality.  I then talked to the administrator and she said if
    he didn't stop he would have to be removed.
    
    Tyler doesn't hit me but he has hit my mother and friends at times but
    mostly playing.  I understood that at school he would get realy mad and
    then hit his teacher for taking something away from him.  I had a talk
    with him last night and asked him not to hit his teacher again.  I
    don't know how much a 4 year old can understand from a conversation
    like that.  
    
    Virginia

    .19> Tyler... will be 4 in Dec. 
       > His teacher told me he was hitting her and he would have to
       > be removed from school if he didn't stop.
       > hit his teacher for taking something away from him.
       > ... she doesn't speak English very well
                 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    
    Well if I were three years old and my teacher took something away from
    me but couldn't speak English well enough to understand a simple
    question *from another adult*, I probably would be EXTREMELY
    frustrated.  I probably would not get an explanation from this teacher
    that was satisfactory to my three-year-old sense of fairness and would
    probably therefore pitch one helluva fit.
    
    If I were Tyler's parent, I'd be pounding pavement looking for a
    daycare with teachers fluent in English, since preschool is thorny
    enough without a language barrier!  But if he's "short" in that
    classroom (about to move to a higher level class), I guess I would have 
    another talk with the director, to determine if, in the meantime, Tyler 
    could have one of the other preschool teachers as his primary teacher.  
    I know some daycares have 2 teachers in the room and assign half the 
    kids to one teacher, half to the other.
    
    Leslie   

    Thanks,
    
    At this school/daycare, there are I think three teachers.  One in the
    morning, then the `main' teacher in the afternoon, and one comes in
    around 3 to take over and do the `daycare' bit.  This teacher that said
    he was hitting is the 3rd shift teacher.  I did talk to the director
    and she said the teacher had not said anything to her about it but
    sometimes things like that aren't always told to her.  The teacher
    hasen't said anything more about it since that day and Tyler has stoped
    hitting my mother.  Maybe he did understand some of that talk we had.
    
    Thanks again,
    
    Virginia