Conference moira::naturism

	I wonder what people's reaction to this report is.  Personally,
	it seemed to me that Ann Goodwin did not have a particularly
	open mind (for what that's worth) and chose to broadcast from
	the "these folks are not to be trusted" viewpoint.  The report 
	consisted primarily of her own subjective feelings projected onto the
	crowds she was with.  In particular, she seemed rather obsessed
	with the so-called sexual angle and almost managed to make everyone
	sound like a sexual pervert of some kind.  Well maybe I'm overstating
	it but she certainly sounded like she considered the whole thing
	an unnecessary exercise in bad taste.  It was more negative than
	most broadcasts of this type I've heard.  (She should have interviewed
	Lee Baxandall, wasn't he there?)  What do other people think?

>In particular, she seemed rather obsessed with the so-called sexual angle and
>almost managed to make everyone sound like a sexual pervert of some kind.
>Well maybe I'm overstating it but she certainly sounded like she considered the
>whole thing an unnecessary exercise in bad taste.

It seems her report turned negative when the cross-dresser did the strip tease.

A strip tease at a naturist convention, as well as people wearing seductive
clothing, seems pretty out of line to me.

If there weren't dopes like that hanging around amongst the naturists and
creating a sexually charged atmosphere, there might be a lot less skepticism.

/john

I wonder if others present at the gathering knew Ann Goodwin was doing a story 
about the naturist, then took the opportunity to put themselves in the "light" 
and ending up making a mockery of the nudist scene?  

I still believe there is nothing sexual about getting together with a bunch of 
nude people UNLESS your motive is to be sexual.  And I agree with John that 
Ann's tune changed with the cross-dresser's actions.  I wouldn't be comfortable
in a strange environment, where I was new to the activity of nudism, and then
have a striptease performed when it was not the time or place for it.  I've
watched a few in my time, and every one of them had sexual connotations.  If
you are in to that sort of thing, fine.  Just don't perform it at Naturist 
gatherings because someone will always take it and "run" with it, reporting
it to the world that nudist are sex crazed maniacs.  It just isn't true!  This
is a excellent example [very sick and in poor taste, in my opinion] of how the 
actions of a few get blow out of proportion.

We all have to be aware of how our actions might affect other people.  Then 
those people rally against us (who prefer to be without body covering some of 
the time).  It is not a true `free' country yet, so let's do our part to make 
it more free for everyone (and not make a**es of ourselves in the meantime!).

Judy

    T'warnt Like Attika in 1988!
    
    If this was this year's Eastern Naturist Gathering (ENG) and that was an
    accurate description of what was going on and how things looked, I am
    glad I didn't go.  
    
    However, for some reason, I think that description was not accurate ...
    possibly it was unfair.  Professional (and I use the term with tongue
    in cheek) media persons seem to dwell on the negative or just don't
    cover events at all.  If they Pre-attitude a negative, they could
    attend a church social and come out with something nasty in their
    print demeanor.
    
    I was absolutely enthralled at the way everyone behaved at the 1988
    ENG.  I am sure I would have been at the 1989 event, also.  I am sure
    that there were many other things going on there:
    
    o Art Exhibits
    o Sports: Tennis, baseball, (Even Bocci, because I brought my set!)
    o Entertainment: We had a gong show.  The Audience was a bit rowdyish,
    but it was in the spirit of good fun.  The winners were illustrated in
    CWTS, but even I (The WASP, Remember?) laughed at the winners.  Funny,
    but nice funny if you know what I mean.
    
    o Dancing:  In 1988 the Gentleman half of one couple was a great
    dancer.  He could do any dance from way back when to tomorrow!  His
    wife, sweet thing, was crippled.  She could hardly walk (But she did,
    by golly ... and we all loved her).  She didn't dance, but HE did! 
    Almost every lady in the place danced with him.  She was happy to see
    him make the place happy.  Yes, I blinked a little when I saw him dance
    with someone else the first time.  But when you watched the dancing and
    watched his dear wife, you know you were experiencing one of the nice
    and wholesome parts of Naturism.  Words don't do it justice, so I'll
    stop.
    
    I suppose THAT would have made some real horrendous copy in a textile
    magazine.
    
    Taint what you see, It's the Taint that you bring with you! (Hey, I
    didn't know where that sentence was going when I started!  I'm glad I
    said that!)
    
    A PFFT to those who say Naturism is dirty.  Was that a four-letter
    word? Well so be it.
    
    Stan/
    

On reading this story, I concluded that either

    the Gathering wasn't anything like the nudist experiences that I've had, or

    the reporter was fitting her experiences into a bunch of preconceptions

    -- or maybe both, of course.

Let's face it, there are lots of people in this world who are never going to be
naturists; and forcing one of these people into a naturist experience with the
expectation that they'll love it, once they know what it's really like, isn't
going to do anyone any good.  It sounds like the reporter might have been one 
of these people.

I suppose it's a common feeling that all eyes are on you, the first time you
take your clothes off, but I've never seen a beach or pool where it was
actually true.  But this report simply asserts, "Getting out of the pool I 
feel dozens of eyes watching me."  I can't tell whether that's an acknowledg-
ment of her own insecurity, or whether she really thought that everyone was
watching her.

I can imagine a female-impersonator-striptease at a nudist event as a parody,
a joke about people who get up tight about other people taking their clothes
off; but I can also imagine that the final effect might not be that simple.

As Jay reminds us from time to time, nudists are human, too, with all the
normal human sexual instincts hidden away somewhere.  I've never been to a 
nudist dance, so I can't begin to guess whether "the atmosphere was charged 
with sexuality" and the men were clearly excited by the cleavage the women
were revealing, or whether the reporter was just incredibly uptight.  I have 
a suspicion that the people at the dance couldn't give us a definitive answer, 
either.  (But any naturist knows that "tight stretchy numbers unzipped far 
enough to reveal a generous amount of cleavage" are more arousing than simple 
nudity... it makes one wonder.)

By the way, did anyone notice the veiled hints of perversity, with some people
bringing their children along to watch these hot, sweaty bodies dancing in an
atmosphere charged with sexuality?

	-Neil

    
      Well....., I'd definitely agree that Ann's article is one-sided,
    and is trying to persuade the reader that EVERYTHING she saw was
    inappropriate.  But, if that's the case, then why was she there
    in the first place ?  Was she forced to go and do a story ?
    
      As jay pointed out, her style catches your attention immediately,
    perhaps that's why she wrote it that way, to grab a person's 
    attention.  I think she'd do well, if she wrote stories for Penthouse.
    
      In my own personal opinion, I believe that Ann secretly enjoyed
    herself while she was there.  I assume that she was naked also,
    as one part of her article metioned about all eyes being on her
    when she got out of the pool.  Did someone force her to take her
    clothes off?  Ann's style demands immediate negative reaction from
    the reader, but I think underneath all the words, she enjoyed herself
    very much.  Hmmm, maybe she'll become a regular.
    
    Darrell
    

It is easy (for me, anyways) to get in the habit of thinking that people 
who claim to dislike of the idea of nudism would be  converted if they could 
just experience it -- if their misconceptions were dispelled, if they knew 
what it was really like, etc.

This is probably true for many people, but I think that this report was a 
valuable reminder that there are many people who *won't* like social nudity, 
even if they try it -- maybe even if they try it a lot.  It doesn't matter if
we think their reasons are simple personal preference or deep subconscious
repressions.  

The important thing is to respect everyone's right to their own personal 
choices.  (Obviously, we hope that they will respect ours as well.)  I should
no more expect everyone to share my taste for naturism than I should expect
them to share my tastes in music, literature, or anything else.

I don't think it does anyone a service to assume that someone who claims *not*
to have enjoyed a nudist experience must be deceiving us or herself.

	-Neil

(By the way, in response to a particular comment in .7, the reporter says that
she put her clothes back on when she got out of the pool, and kept them on for
the rest of the weekend.)

    Woops !  I missed the last part about her putting her clothes back
    on after she got out of the pool.
    
    Neil, please try not to be so critical.  Whether or not she enjoyed
    herself makes no difference to me, I was just giving my own personal
    opinion (interpretation), of how her story came across to me.  It
    doesn't mean that I don't respect her attitudes or morals, if they
    are in fact her real feelings towards naturism.
    
    Darrell
    

    re: .10
    
        What's a "pubic tonsure"?
    
    Frederick
    

    RE: .11
    
    >>What's a "pubic tonsure"?
    
    Assuming that this was not a typo in Baxandall's letter and was
    meant as written then from the Scribner-Bantam English Dictionary
    the following definitions are offered:
    
    		Pubic [from LATIN, pubes, groin, pubic hair] situated
    adjacent to the genitals
    
    		Tonsure [again from LATIN, shearing] the act of cutting
    the hair or of shaving the head, the part of the head left bare
    by such shaving, to subject to tonsure.                
    
    
    
    	I'll let you decide if Baxandall means what is implied by the
    two word used together, or if it was a typo!!!!!
    
    
    			Dave....
    

    I just read .0, and I think this Ann Goodwin passes more gas than sound
    judgement. I am trying to imagine her reaction if no one had looked
    at her. Silly fuss.
    
    Reminds me of a line from Satanic Verses: When the camera approaches
    you want to get further away, until it turns direction and you need to
    chase after it. ( or words to that effect )
    
    The only thing worse than having people look at you is not having
    people looking at you. ( Sounds like something Oscar Wilde might have
    said )
    
    							John.