Conference misery::feline

    
    My cat doesn't seem to have any of these problems and no I don't
    brush his teeth, but I would like to know if cats have 2 sets of
    teeth like humans do, losing their baby teeth to be replaced by
    adult teeth.
    
    Anyone know?
    
    

    I brush my guys teeth twice a week.  I use the little cat 
    toothbrushes I got from the vet, with GelKam on them.  The
    first GelKam flavor they hated;  the current one, 2 out of the 3
    think is a treat.  Unfortunately I can't remember off the top
    of my head which flavor is which.  This brushing does seem to 
    help.
    

    Cats do have baby teeth and adult teeth just like humans do.  The baby
    teeth fall out at about 5 months of age and are replaced by the adult
    teeth.
    
    Jo

    If I find a tooth around the house from one of the cats (when they 
    were kittens that is...) I save them in a little memento box I have.
    Wiskers too! I know, I know. I'm nuts! I must be to be living with
    these crazy critters! ;*)
    
    Bonnie

    Bonnie:
    
    No, your not crazy.  I started a "baby" album for each of my three -
    all their kitten photos complete with baby teeth and wiskers - I've got
    both of Gino's, and one each from Pippin and Stitch (teeth) with the
    date that I found them.  I've gotten some strange looks from people,
    especially when they read the little notes under each flick.
    
    Giudi

    We have, in a special antique music box, a whisker and a shedded claw
    that belonged to Tiki II, found about a week or so after he died.
    
    Also, my hub found something that I thought was lost forever...the
    first photo we ever took of Tiki, when we got him as a little kitten. 
    He was curled up in my hub's jacket, looking at the camera with that
    unforgettable Tiki-face, like he was saying, "Hey, lay off...I'm trying
    to sleep here."
    
    Oh, how I still miss that attitude.
    
    K.C.

    About a week after Ting died I found a wisker and a shedded claw as
    well.  These went into his photo album.  I remember holding these two
    little physical reminders of him and crying then worse than the day
    that we put him down.  Months later I was able to look at these
    precious fragments and smile.
    
    Giudi

    
    	Even though I'm not generally superstitious, ever since my
    	mother informed me that `finding a cat's wisker is good luck', 
    	I have kept every one I find in a little box...Alond with the
    	tooth my horse broke off (his), but that's another story!
    
    	Sherry
    

    ...about the gingivitis.
    
    Could it be caused by something in the house?  Perhaps the fact that
    the dog drinks from the same water dish?
    
    Should I seek a second opinion on the bacterial gingivitis diagnosis?
    
    Jo-Ann

    Bonnie,
    
    You're not weird (if you are, that makes two of us weird folks).  I 
    keep the cat whiskers I find.  My cats are kind enough to leave them
    right on the tinted class of my coffee table or dining table where I
    can see them easily.  Except Onyx, all his whiskers are black and as
    hard as I try I can't find any of them.  I carry the white ones I do
    find in the coin part of my wallet.  I want to carry my good luck 
    around with me instead of leaving it home.
    
    Jan
                                         

    Last time I took my cats to the vet, the vet recommended that I bring 
    them in to have their teeth cleaned.  Not for any specific problem, 
    just as preventive maintenance.  I've never heard of preventive
    dentistry for cats.  Does anyone know if this is really necessary?
    
    Christine

    My cats have their teeth cleaned when there is sufficient tartar
    buildup or inflammation -- did the vet really say that neither or
    these were present?  Maybe you misunderstood him/her....
    

as cats live longer (due to better vet care), the health of their teeth for
the long run is much more important.  We feed cats food which appear attractive
to us....and virtually all canned food is soft, with no "chew" to it at all. 
Preventative maintenance is necessary.  You can avoid some of it by feeding
a quality dry kibble ONLY, but even then, there can be tartar buildup that
will threaten the health of the teeth...and a toothless cat cannot get
dentures.  If your vet recommends a cleaning, then the gums may be inflamed,
or tartar buildup may be very bad...either way, the cat's teeth are endangered.
If you have more questions, I'm sure your vet will be happy to explain things
to you.


P.S.  I tried brushing Hana's teeth - we decided the regular vet visit was
easier on both of us...she almost chewed the end of my finger off!

    I have noticed an alarming trend in veterinary medicine.  Over the last
    few years, at this time of year, vets have been recommending "preventative"
    teeth cleanings.  This time of the year also happens to be the slowest
    for most vet offices.  Before I put any of my cats under anesthesia for
    teeth cleanings, I am going to consider a few things:
    
    1) Are the cat's teeth really in need of cleaning?  Is there noticeable
    tartar buildup or inflammed gums?
    
    2) Is the cat healthy enough to undergo this surgery without risk?  Are
    his/her kidneys and liver functioning normally (this can be checked
    by doing a blood panel)
    
    3) Is this vet recommending this surgery based on the current state of
    my cat's health, or on the current state of his practice's balance
    sheet?
    
    Jo

    My three have a cleaning (without anesthesia) once a year when they go
    in for their shots and physical.  My vet started this from year one -
    gently checking their mouths and chipping off the tartar.  Last year we
    thought that Gino (a real fidget) might need to have a special
    appointment (he really gets a build up) but Scott took his time while I
    assisted in holding him and we got it all done.  I would feel a bit
    aprehensive about anesthesia especially as they get older.  I'm very
    happy that we're able to do it this way.
    
    Giudi

my vet offers free dental exams at this time of year...traditionally the
slowest season for the practice.  When we go in with the cats, she weighs
and performs a good exam of body, eyes, nose, and then spends some time on
the mouth.  If the tartar can be removed manually, with minimal stress to
the cat, it is done right then and there.  If the cat's teeth warrant it,
then we schedule a teeth-cleaning.  She doesn't really put the cat totally
under when doing the teeth, she just makes him/her very sleepy and easy
to manage.  After hearing so much about other vets' practices...I feel very
blessed to have Dr. Lee in my corner.  

I think it is a good idea to have the teeth examined at least once a year.
If the vet recommends a cleaning, he/she should be able to SHOW you why
by indicating the tartar buildup on the teeth...if there is no clear
evidence that a recommended cleaning is necessary, I'd find another vet...
one I could trust to care about my animal first and foremost.

	Last week at the vet, I was told that T.K. needed to get his
	teeth cleaned.  I've been told this for the past three years
	but have ignored the warning because I am petrified of having
	him put under for this.  I would hate to lose a cat to
	anethesia just because he was getting his teeth cleaned.  I
	asked if T.K. could be sedated instead but was told no because
	they put a tube down his throat during the procedure so that
	he can breath.

	I do not want to have this done, however, I was shown the
	tartar buildup and bleeding gums and finally believe the vet.
	I always thought that they were trying to get extra $$ from me.

	The previous reply indicated that her vet does not put the
	cats under for this procedure.  Well, my vet does and I would
	rather not use him if that is his only alternative.  Can
	you and anybody else recommend vets in the Milford MA area
	that do not put the cats under for a teeth cleaning?  Is
	this tube down his throat really necessary?  The job will
	probably be extensive since I put if off for so long but
	surely there is another way to do this!

	I'm so scared about this.  T.K. is so special to me and I would
	be devastated if I lost him because of this!  Bandit also needs
	this procedure, however not so much as T.K. and I plan to do
	them on separate dates to spread out the cost, and also so there
	is no chance of losing both my cats at once.

	Am I being overly paranoid about having my cats put under?
	They are both about 5 years old and have been knocked out
	for neutering/declawing.

	Thanks for any reassurance and tips!

	Karen


	

    My cats are anesthesized when their teeth are cleaned.  The vet
    decides when it needs to be done by checking their teeth at their
    normal checkup time;  he always shows me where the problems are
    with tartar buildup or inflamation.  Personally, I think that
    delaying treatment of dental disease can cause unnecessary
    pain to the animal as enamel erodes, exposing nerves, etc.
    

    Karen, I can really relate to your feelings.  A friend died from
    anesthesia, and it is very frightening, but the odds of the same thing
    happening to a cat are enormous!  Some people have a problem with this
    because of the *unknown*.  My vet lost one of her own cats because of
    anesthesia and she is VERY sensitive to this procedure.  She was the
    one that reassurred me over and over that it was ok.  She also
    suggested that they take x-rays beforehand to make sure there were no
    complications.  This was a year ago so I'm not quite certain of all the
    details but I didn't opt for the x-rays ahead of time.
    
    On March 1st of last year, I gave in.  Bill dropped Pasha off at the
    vet that morning for his teeth cleaning (while I stayed home with the
    flu).  I was miserable all day and it turned out to be worse once I got
    the call from the vet.  Pasha had stopped breathing from the
    anesthesia.  Fortunately, my vet was able to revive him!  They took
    x-rays and found tumors in his lungs.  Because of his going in for a
    cleaning, we were able to find and follow the underlying disease and
    watch for signs.  Pasha died just a few days before my birthday and
    Christmas.  It was lousy timing but at least I was am thankful for
    knowing up front what was going to happen and therefore had the
    opportunity to cherish what little time we had left together.  
    
    If a dentist were to tell you over and over that you needed  certain
    dental care, wouldn't you have it done?  The odds of something
    happening to your cat while under anesthesia are so rare that you
    needn't worry.  Chin up!

re: anesthesia.  Yes, my vet just makes mine dopey...but then, they aren't
really nasty about fighting treatment, either.  I would rather the vet be
very sure not to inflict damage and would not hesitate to allow Dr. Lee
to put the gang under if she feels it is needed.  The key is to have a vet
who knows how to deal with cats.  I am also wary of anesthesia and I bet
almost anyone of us knows of a situation where a cat has been lost, or come
very close to death, from anesthesia -- HOWEVER, this is due to inexperience
on the part of those administering the drug to the cat in most cases, rather
than a failure of the drug itself.  The drug is necessary, and protects your
cat from damage and pain caused by struggling to avoid treatment...the
procedure to protect the teeth is necessary, and if you vet works with cats
all the time, the knowlege of how to anesthetize a cat is there.  You should
discuss your worries with your vet so he/she will know you need to have more
information, and frequent updates to be comfortable.  The odds against a 
competent, experienced vet having any problems with a young cat (and 5 is
young) are so great --- you are much more likely to end up in a collision
with a 747 - while you are driving your car!

    re: .14  You hit the nail on the head Jo........

    Karen,
    
    I know exactly how you feel.  I've known for a while now that Amelia
    needs to have her teeth cleaned and I've been avoiding the issue
    because I'm worried about the anesthesia.  I'd be very upset if
    anything happened to any of my cats but, Amelia...she is very special 
    to me and I'd be devastated if I lost her.  I'm sure the vet is right 
    about the need.  When I look at her teeth it is very obvious.  When my 
    tax return comes in, I'm going to have it done for her.  Although, 
    I'll probably set up an appointment with the vet to discuss everything 
    first.  I want to find out if there is any alternative to completely
    putting her under.
    
    Jan

    After Van Gogh has his major surgery the surgeon told me that
    VG has very bad teeth and I should consider having them cleaned
    within two months.
    
    There is no way that I will put the big guy through this at this
    time.   In the last two months he has already been put under
    anesthesia twice, the first time it was for 2 hours and the second
    time it was for 2 1/2 hours.
    
    Maybe I'll consider down the road a bit...but I will not put
    him through this right now...we have both been through enough.  
    
    Sandy

    Pearl and Zeno get their teeth cleaned every year.  Pearl almost had
    one extracted, but didn't need to after all. They *HATE* going under
    and are extremely grumpy when I go to pick them up.  Pearl is always
    mean to Zeno after they go to the vets, for whatever reason even for
    only shots.  I think he must smell different or something. Or maybe
    she's just a big meany.  Zeno is always an angel :-)
    
    shannon
    

    When we adopted Mr. Miyagi he was scared to death of every thing
    and everyone.  It took us 6 + months to win his confidence. When
    we finally got him off to the vets his teeth were in terrible shape.
    He was only 6 years old and had to have the MAJORITY of his teeth
    removed. The vet said he must have been suffering terribly as many
    of the teeth were eaten almost through.  Show's what neglect can
    do to an animal. This cat was an inside only cat, well fed, loved,
    had toys to play with but NO MEDICAL care.
    
    I encourage all to have your cats teeth checked very well EACH YEAR
    when they go for their check ups. Neglect can cause a lot of problems.
    
    Mr. Miyagi would love nothing better than to eat the Iams but he
    can't gum them and doesn't have the teeth to chew them. He just
    sits in front of the bowl and licks a few of the morsels on top
    and looks bewildered. 
    
    Barbara & her 3M's

    If you're afraid of anesthesia, ask your vet about ketamine.  Ketamine
    is also an anesthetic, primarily used by vets, but it doesn't knock the
    animal out - just puts them in a half-sleep.  It's short-acting -
    usually only 15 minutes or so, which is all the time the vet needs to
    clean teeth.  Of course, since the fur-face isn't completely under,
    there's the slight possibility that the vet will get bit!
    
    So, ask your vet about ketamine...
    

    RE.25
    
    Poor baby!!
    :-(

re: .26

yes!! that's the stuff that the vet uses!  Couldn't remember the name.
She only uses heavier meds if the cat is real problem.  Luckily, my oldest
two are pretty good about teeth - now, when The Flash comes up for deep 
cleaning, I'm afraid we won't be so lucky.

				D

    Re: .26
    
    Ketamine is usually the first step in any anethesia process.  They give
    an injection of ketamine to tranquilize the animal, and then intubate
    them, and then give them the big guns (anesthesia).
    
    If your cat has kidney or liver problems, I would think carefully about
    putting them under any anesthesia.  Those organs help the body rid
    itself of the anesthesia after the surgery is over.
    
    Jo

    I spoke to a vet this weekend at the Vallejo cat show and asked her
    what she recommends when doing dental work (i.e. cleaning) on cats.  She
    suggested before getting the cats teeth cleaned that a blood screen be
    done so that the vet is aware of any potential problems, especially
    if the cat is 5 years or older, or over weight.  She also recommended
    that a certain type of anesthetic be used.  I may butcher the spelling
    here but the one she recommended is "isoflourine".  She says it doesn't
    knock the cat out as deeply and they come out of it much quicker.
    
    She also recommended using "cat" toothpaste on the teeth regularly.
    She says even if you can't actually brush your cat's teeth that dabbing
    some of the toothpaste on the teeth with your finger and just leaving
    it there will still help.  The peroxide in the toothpaste will help
    fight the bacteria in the mouth.  I had no idea that this bacteria that
    accumulates can get into the system and cause other problems.  She 
    mentioned that a cat can be healthy for years and then get sick and
    if that bacteria has found its way into other areas of the cat's system, 
    there can be other problems/complications down the road that can 
    compromise your cat's health for years to come.
    
    Well, I've decided...when my tax refund comes back I'm taking Amelia in
    for a checkup/blood screen and talking to my vet about getting her
    teeth cleaned.  She's going to have it done as soon as it can be
    arranged.
    
    Thanks to this vet from the Vallejo show, I've also got my cats back
    on a feeding schedule.  
    
    For the record:  It's not that I think this vet is so much  better 
    than other vets, or even my own vet; it's that I had a chance to sit 
    and talk directly to this vet and ask questions in a non-stress 
    (i.e. no sick kitties in the office) setting.  I was able to formulate 
    exactly what I wanted to ask her.  I'm sure if I'd planned an appointment 
    with my own vet I could have gotten good information from him too on 
    both the dental topic and the weight control topic.
    
    Jan

    I entered a note about Isoflourane in Feline_V1 and it's use in spaying
    and neutering cats.  I think it is keyworded.
    
    Many vets do not have Isoflourane yet, since it is expensive to get set
    up for it.  Check with your vet.
    
    Jo

    (Believe it or not) most of THE FIRM is good enough at the vets office
    during their annual checkups that the vet can just do the cleaning
    with kitty totally concious. In fact, the biggest proble we have
    experienced is that the dental instruments are made for righties, and
    since the vet is a southpaw, she had to contort herself to use the
    thing at the correct angle. Of course, some vets don't want to try to
    scale on a concious cat (fear of being bit).
    
    Deb
    
    

    
    Deb, Bailey will let Scott scale his teeth and will let me brush his
    teeth so I just ordered a double end scaler to do a light scaling when
    necessary.  In a previous life I was a dental assistant so I have to
    confess I like teeth whether they are in felines or humans!  I used to
    work for a southpaw so I know what your vet is going through with those
    contortions!
    
    Marlene
    
    

    Marlene,
    
    the vet has told me that a couple of hygenists work on their cat's
    teeth (I was really freaked out by this). Another vet suggested that I
    could learn to clean my cat's teeth (and offered to teach me), but
    seeing the contortions that Dr. Stadmore went thru, since I am left
    handed too, I didn't want to attempt it as I'm afraid I'd hurt the cat
    (and get bit in the process).
    
    It sounds to me like it is time for the makers of veteranary dental
    implements to value differences! 
    
    
    Deb

    
    Deb, if you really want to try to clean your cat's teeth I would talk
    to your dentist and see if any of the dental supply houses they deal
    with carry instruments for southpaws.  I received the scaler yesterday 
    and was not impressed with the quality so I am going to speak to my
    dentist about getting one through him.  The Bales just sits in my lap
    his head stays back and I can scale his teeth.  Trying to do this with
    Callie would be another story.  Maybe sometime when I feel adventurous
    I'll give it a try... :'D
    
    M
    
    
    
    

    Oh, yes... about 4 years ago on my 3 cats.  If I remember correctly,
    it's a fairly easy procedure to do, but they must be unconscious.  I
    forget the cost, but by having 3 done at once, I got a "group
    discount".  It really isn't that bad and I don't remember them being
    in any real discomfort.  It probably feels to them what a good teeth
    cleaning feels to us.
    
    Mary
    

    I need some advice on fangs.  Skeeters fangs are pretty long and lately
    I've noticed that she has some brown gunk on her fur right below the
    teeth.  I'm hoping to get everyone into the vet in 2 weeks to have
    their teeth cleaned and a thorough checkup.  While their teeth are
    being cleaned can Skeeters fangs be filed down?
    
    Karen

    I would also be interested in the answer to this.  Lea has "fangs" as
    well, but they suit her personality!  :^)  I never thought about having
    them filed down.  

    Your comment about the "brown stuff" reminds me of men with food in
    their beards or mustaches...  

    Believe the brown stains are food stuff/enzimes.  Our Saint Bernard
    has these in the folds near his mouth where food got stored if we
    forgot to do a through cleaning after he ate. Proxide on a Q-tip will
    help lighten the area and over time will take care of it completely.
    
    File his fangs down, Ouch?
    
    Barbara

no, fangs cannot be filed down..they are teeth!  You wouldn't get your teeth
filed down without getting them capped (expensive, but possible for a cat
or dog -- however, only necessary if damage has occurred).  I think all
cats get the "vampire look" as they get older....Hana has her fangs peeking
out of her smile these days too.  If the appearance of the fur under the
fangs bothers you, I'd suggest you talk to the vet about what options you
have for cleaning the stain....I know hydrogen peroxide is okay for dogs
(in weak solution with water), but I'm not sure about cats.  Your vet can
guide you on this one....and, please let us know!!

			D

    
    Dian is right, fangs are teeth but, and as with human teeth they can be
    adjusted for proper occlusion.  Just like us other problems could arise
    from improper occlusion including recession of the bone causing loss of 
    teeth which could  effect the dietary habits of a feline and ultimately 
    their overall health.  I personally would not "adjust" a cats tooth 
    simply for esthetic reasons.  It's one thing to do it to improve your
    cat's health it's another thing to do it to have a more "attractive"
    look.  
     

    The teeth being so long isn't what's bothering me.  It's the brown gunk
    right underneath the teeth that is bothering me.  It just started
    showing up a couple of days ago.  
    
    Karen

    Shoot, sometimes my writing leaves alot to be desired (re .43).  
    
    I guess what I'm wondering is that the
    teeth being so long is causing the brown gunk to appear and would
    filing them down be an answer.  I didn't stop to think it would be like
    filing our teeth down until I saw all the responses.  I know I wouldn't
    want *my* teeth filed down.  
    
    Karen

    Has anyone out there in kitty-land ever taken the loved one(s)
    to the Lancaster (Mass) Animal Hospital to get their teeth cleaned?
    
    My Tabs is scheduled for a cleaning there in May, and I'm trying to
    get a "feel" for their (the hospitals) reputation performing this
    procedure.
    
    Signed: a concerned(?) cat lover!

    Regarding reply .45...
    
    If you have any information to share about the Lancaster Hospital in
    particular, please do a send/author and mail the comments directly to
    the author of .45 rather than entering them here. 
    
    General comments about teeth cleaning and vets offices can be added to
    this topic as usual.
    
    Jo

Speaking of teeth, how old is a kitten when it gets its second teeth?  We
got our Beast from the humane society with an estimated age of 7 mo.  Seemed
pretty small for the age.  Also noticed the final stages of its fang teeth
comming in.  Now two months latter he's much bigger and friskier.

> Speaking of teeth, how old is a kitten when it gets its second teeth? 

I believe that they start losing the teeth between their fangs at about 4 
months, and their fangs around 5-6 months.  Simon's an August baby and his 
12 fronts all were replaced in December, with his fangs falling out starting
around New Years.  (My other three followed a similar time frame, but I don't
remember dates, exactly)

    Kittens teeth between 5-6 months of age.  This is the best indicator of
    a stray cat's age, the condition of the teeth.
    
    Jo

    Today was Amelia's trip to the vet for her teeth cleaning.  When I 
    loaded her into the carrier this morning and then put food down 
    for the other cats...she was really pissed.  She kept trying to dig
    her way out of the carrier.  I felt bad but told her it was for her
    own good and that I didn't want her to eat and then get sick while
    under anesthesia.  When we got to the vet I noticed she had rust 
    marks on her head from where she tried to head butt the carrier door
    open.
    
    I dropped her at the vet and almost cried as I left.  Logicially, I
    knew that she would probably be fine but I still was worried.  The
    vet assistant was very understanding and told me she'd remind the vet
    of the mildly elevated liver enzymes and that Amelia was very special.
    As my eyes teared up she reminded me to drive carefully and told me
    I could call after 1:00 for a status report.
    
    I called at 1:18pm (I'd have called sooner but I was in the car coming
    back from lunch at 1:00).  I told them who I was and that I wanted to 
    be sure Amelia was okay.  The same vet tech answered and was not
    surprised that it was me.  She put me on hold to go check on Amelia and
    when she came back on the phone she said the vet told her that Amelia
    had "flown with flying colors and was coming in for a nice landing"   
    
    YAHOOOOO!!!  
    
    I'm sooo excited and I feel much better.  And, my eyes are tearing up 
    as I write this.  What a relief that this is over now.  I'm told I 
    should call back around 3:30 to see if she can come home today or if 
    they'll keep her overnight.  You can bet I'll be on the phone promptly 
    at 3:30 (barring work getting in the way).  I sure hope I don't have to 
    do this again with her any time in the near future.
    
    Jan           

    Just to let you all know, Amelia ended up having 4 teeth pulled;
    one on top and 3 on bottom.  They were pretty bad according to 
    Dr. Leland at The Cat Hospital.  Having 3 less teeth doesn't seem
    to interfere with her eating at all.  She never chews her food
    anyway, just swallows it whole.
    
    I was instructed to give her soft food for 2-3 days.  Boy were
    the other cats jealous that she was getting the soft canned stuff
    and they were stuck with the same old dry stuff.  So, last night
    I gave everyone 1/2 of a can just to make them feel better.
    
    Amelia is on Clavamox twice a day to help avoid any infections
    where the teeth were extracted.  I had also asked them to check
    her ears and clean/flush if necessary.  Her left ear has always
    been a problem since she had a severe case of earmites as a kitten.
    True to form, her left ear was a problem.  Apparently it had become
    infected.  The vet could not see inside well enough to see what had
    cause it.  Amelia did not show any signs of having trouble with her
    ears so I didn't know there was a problem.  She's on antibiotics
    twice a day for the ear now too and will be rechecked on Saturday
    to be sure everything is okay.
    
    I feel bad that I could not afford to get her teeth cleaned sooner.
    Possibly she would not have had to have 4 teeth pulled if I hadn't
    been so broke and so afraid of losing her that I put it off for quite
    a while.  I feel a bit like I let her down.  I'm not a bad mom, I'm 
    just a broke one.  I've put over $200.00 into vet care in the last
    30 days and I know I still need to get Carrie and Bailey's teeth done
    too.  To top it off, Onyx's annual shots/checkup comes up in June or
    July.  What's a mom to do?  
    
    Jan
       

    You can only do what you can do. Too bad we can't put them on our
    health insurance. 
    
    ng

    What's a Mom to do...enjoy the furfaces and give them the best
    you possibly can!!!!!
    
    I just went through a similar experience with Van Gogh.  I was
    told he needed teeth work last December...but considering he
    already went through a major operation, I owed big bucks to
    the vets, and I feared putting him back under...I procrastinated 
    and procrastinated until he spit out a piece of tooth last week!!
    Guilt Guilt Guilt!!
    
    So last Saturday he also had his teeth cleaned, a tooth
    extracted...and while he was under they also flushed his
    ears!
    
    Sandy

    I got curious last night and went back and checked my receipt to
    see how I was charged for Amelia.  I was pleasantly surprised to
    find that I was not charged for the 4 extractions (unless they were 
    included in the dental scaling charge - they weren't listed in the 
    separate category allowed for them).  I also was not charged for 
    dthe ear flushing they performed.  
    
    Here is a sample of what I paid for.
    
    	Anesthesia	$25.00
    	Dental Scaling	$50.00
    	Fluid Therapy	$10.00--(I think this was supposed to help flush
        Injections      $10.00   the anesthetic from her system since she
        Clavamox        $ 6.00   had mildly elevated liver enzymes)
    	Gent. Otic      $ 8.00--(For her ear infection)
                       -------
    		       $109.00
    
    This is actually better than I expected.  I was expecting $125 to 
    $150.	
    
    Well, I had everyone open their mouths and show off their teeth 
    last night and it is definite.  Carrie will be next.  However, I
    have to plan this expense so it may not happen until August or 
    September unless I suddenly inherit bunches of money.  Hopefully,
    she will be okay until then.  Guilt is a terrible thing to deal
    with when you're really trying to do the best you can for them
    and find that you should have done more or should have done it a 
    little sooner.
    
    Jan

    Mr.Miyagi's breath smelled so bad it would knock you over. When he
    finally got to where he trusted us enough off to the vets he went.
    He was 6 years old and never had shots or dental work done. His first
    visit was $75.00. That included is shots, general check up, some blood
    work, Felv. testing, and the vet tried to scale his teeth. One piece of
    tartar was huge and as she was pulling it off she showed me the tooth
    underneath was nothing but rot. About a month later he had almost all
    his molers extracted to the tune of $174. He was find after a few days
    and believe me getting those rotten teeth out did him a world of good.
    His coat and personality improved even more.
    
    He is so wonderful. We love him a lot.
    
    Barbara

    I looked elsewhere for assistance but found nothing..here's the
    problem:   My 13 year old cat, Scuff, is losing his teeth.  I'm to
    blame for not getting his teeth cared for often enough, but, now
    I am faced with what/how to accomodate his need for eating.  His
    steadfast diet has been Fancy Feast; Cod, Shrimp,Sole or Seafood Feast
    (one can in the AM, another in the PM) and semi-moist food snacks. 
    This is where I think I went wrong, we used to give him Tender Vittles
    late at night (11:00 pm).  The vet told me TV's has a large sugar
    content and it probably didn't help matters.  I have since switched to
    9-Lives semi-moist food, he doesn't seen to mind.  
    
    Scuff has only one fang left in front (a lower one), the upper fangs
    have been gone for about a year, one fell out due to an infection, the
    other he lost in a fight w/a neighbor cat, I just noticed the lower one
    missing this weekend.  He is getting frustrated that he can't pick up
    the snack food, if I feed it to him one at a time he can eat the
    semi-moist stuff.   I began giving him an antibotic the vet gave me.
    What/how do I accomodate his challenge of being fangless?  Has anybody
    else had to deal with this issue?  I have three others at home that do
    not seem to be headed in this direction.  Any/all help appreciated!

    my Mitties is missing most of her teeth, but you'd never know it.
    Shes' about 17 or so, we've had her for about 4 years.  she already
    was missing her teeth then.  she just eats soft moist canned food
    mainly, but will devour chicken pieces as well.  she just has trouble
    cleaning the plate, the food has to be forked up into a pile for her 
    as she eats, as she does not seem to be able to pick it up when it
    gets flat on the dish.  One of my other elderly kitties is also
    starting to go through this too.  they adjust....
    
    denise

    I've got two problems.
    
    First .. last night I got silver back from my sister-in-law.  She told
    me that it seemed as if Silver's teeth had been bothering her, so she
    stopped giving her dry food thinking she couldn't eat it.  Well, I
    looked at her teeth, and they were a mess.  I brought her into the
    vet's this morning and they gave her a steroid shot and gave me some
    clavamox to give to her for 10 days.
    
    Question .. if her teeth are that bad (bloody and everything),
    shouldn't I make an appointment to have her teeth cleaned as well?
    
    
    Second Problem .. PITA.  Her breath had an "odor" to it for a couple of
    weeks.  Last night she shook her head and let out a "yelp".  Since
    then, she hadn't been able to shut her mouth and wasn't able to eat
    this morning.  She was drooling all over the place.  I brought her into
    the vets this morning as well, and they've kept her.  The vet opened
    her mouth and showed me these two BIG swollen areas in the back of her
    mouth.  Could be bad gingivitis, some type of growth or what?  They're
    putting her on antibiotics to try and get the swelling down and on
    fluids because she can't eat (poor baby!!).  She seemed to be "chewing"
    on the swollen parts.
    
    Any ideas what this could be and what could be the treatment if the
    swelling doesn't go down after antibiotics?
    
    Thanks for your help.
    
    Holly
    

    Holly,
    
    they like to get the infection out of the way before doing a cleaning.
    As for the bloody gums, try giving the cat some vitimin C (either a
    shot or in something like a pettab multi-vitimin).
    
    Deb

    Holly,
    
     Poor PITA! I hope she is doing better! When I had to bring Finnigan in
    to have a tooth pulled (and one sealed) they had me put him on
    amtibiotics for four days before they did it. It was to make sure there
    was no infection before the surgery, and t oget it in his system, to
    prevent any infection after the surgery. He was on it for six more days
    after I brought him home. He's doing great though!
    
     Please let us know how they both are doing!
    
    Love,
    
    Yonee
    

    Holly...
    
    Van Gogh is going through some dental problems right now as well...they
    put him on Baytril for 10 days...and then we are going to discuss what
    he needs done with his teeth.    I guess they like to get the infection
    out before they do the actual work on the teeth.  As a matter of fact,
    back in December I had an abscessed tooth and my own dentist put me
    on Antibiotics before he would touch the tooth!!
    
    Good luck ...don't you just hate when they are sick or hurting..it
    breaks my darn heart!!!
    
    Sandy

    Yeah, I really hate it Sandy.  I went to see PITA last night and she
    looked pretty pitiful.  Poor baby still can't close her mouth and still
    can't eat.  The vet said that the swelling has gone down somewhat, so
    that's good.  
    
    I just called the vets.  She still hasn't eaten anything.  The swelling
    has gone down somewhat, but her gums are still quite swollen.  I'll be
    calling again around 2:00 to talk to the vet.
    
    Silver on the other hand is doing much better.  She isn't as lethargic
    as she was on Sunday when she came back home.  She's not drooling
    anymore at all, and I don't see any more blood.  The bumps on her body
    are almost gone, but the ones on her head and tail are still there. 
    Hopefully we'll get them cleared up soon. 
    
    Best of all, we've found a home for her!  A very nice noter who just
    happened to be in my building has agreed to take her as soon as she's
    better.  What's even nicer is that she IS a DEC employee and I'll at
    least be able to get updates on how my baby is doing.  THANK YOU NANCY!
    
    Holly
    

    I just got off the phone with the vets a little while ago.  She says
    that the swelling in her mouth is going down VERY slowly.  They're not
    QUITE as red as they were, and aren't QUITE as swollen as they were,
    but they're still pretty bad.  Dr. Mulcahey has been made aware of her
    situation as well (she is being treated by Dr. Moss), so BOTH vets are
    watching her.  They will be keeping her at least through the weekend. 
    It doesn't look like they'll have to lance her gums just yet, as the
    swelling is going down.  She still can't eat, and can't close her mouth
    fully, however she's not drooling as much as she was.  
    
    I'll be going to see her tonight again, and bring her favorite bed with
    me.  
    
    My poor baby.  
    
    Holly
    

 Holly,

I hope Pita gets well soon!!

Hugs,
Laura    

    Holly,
    
    do they think that a hot compress might help at all? I've done that
    myself back when I had impacted wisdom teeth, and I did it once to
    Jimmy when he had an infected tooth and I had to wait until morning to
    being him into the vet (of course, Harry is a real sweetheart, so he
    made it easy for me to do).
    
    Hope Pita feels better,
    Deb

    Deb ...
    
    I'm not sure if the hot compress would work on PITA.  The gums on the
    INSIDE of her teeth are swollen (near her tongue), not the outside.
    
    Sorry I didn't make that clear.
    
    Holly
    

    I went to see PITA last night, and she looked 10 times better than she
    did before!  I guess that the majorproblem was that she had an infected
    tooth that they pulled yesterday afternoon.  After they pulled the
    tooth, the swelling in her mouth went down considerably!  It's still
    swollen a bit, but not NEARLY as bad as it was.  She still had not
    eaten anything yet, so I decided to intice her a bit and go and get a
    slice of turkey at the store next door.  
    
    She GOBBLED down the turkey.  I couldn't get it into her fast enough. 
    The vet says that if she continues to eat, that I can probably bring
    her home tomorrow.  However, I'm going away for the weekend (no real
    choice here), so I've asked her to keep PITA over the weekend.  This
    way I can be sure that she gets her medicines, and is getting the
    proper care.  Everyone at Central Animal hospital seems to love her. 
    They said that a while after they pulled her tooth, she was in a MUCH
    better mood, and even rolled over to get bellyrubs.  Those of you who
    met PITA at the Christmas party last year KNOW how much PITA loves
    belly rubs! (-:
    
    Holly
    

    PITA came home last night!  And here's something funny .. she's so
    happy to be home that she's gone into heat! (-:  hahaha!  Luckily,
    she'll be going BACK to the doctors soon to take care of that problem.  
    
    She is feeling much better than she was.  She'll still be on
    antibiotics for the next week, and she needs to go back to the vets
    next tuesday to have her mouth checked again.  She still has the
    growths in her mouth.  Next tuesday they're going to check them again
    and see if she needs to have another shot or needs to have them
    removed.  
    
    Thanks everyone for the well wishes for PITA.  Looks like they've
    worked!
    
    Holly
    

    Glad to hear she is home. I know how exhausting it can be when you have
    a sick cat at the vet.
    
    Deb

    PITA went back to the vets last night to have her teeth checked. 
    They're still quite infected even after being on clavamox for more than
    1 week.  They gave me another type of antibiotic, and I have to bring
    her back next week.  If they're not cleared up by then, they'll have to
    put her under anasthesia and clean and polish her teeth.  Poor baby!
    
    Holly
    

    Holly is the new antibiotic called something like Antirobe!!  
    
    Van Gogh was originally on Baytril for his teeth infection, but
    that didn't seem to help, so they switched the medicine
    to Antirobe and I saw a BIG difference in VG.  Of course
    he still needed to have his teeth cleaned/polished and
    some removed...but now that this is done...the old man
    is back to himself again.   And he can still eat Dry food!!!
    
    Did you know a cat has 30 teeth???   That is two more then
    humans...that amazed me!!!!
    
    Good luck with Pita....
    
    Sandy

    Sandy .. that sounds like it.  I'm not sure if the name is that long,
    though.  It's Anti<something> aquadrops.  I'll check tonight and put in
    the name tomorrow.
    
    Holly
    

    Yes, the name is Antirobe Aquadrops.  According to the product
    circular, it can cause diarrhea and/or vomiting.
    
    According to one of the vets we go to, Antirobe is usually not
    prescribed to kittens < 9-10 months old because it can have detrimental
    effects on tooth development.
    
    Carl

    Are they actually drops...Van Gogh had pills which
    were white/yellow small capsules!!!
    
    Hmmmm...maybe that is why is stool is looser then normal
    and I thought it was because we had changed his diet
    when he wasn't eating good!!!!   Thank god he took his
    last pill yesterday!
    
    Sandy
    

    The product circular for the Antirobe Aquadrops says it comes in two
    forms, drops (as does Amoxydrops) and capsules.  We have always used
    the drops to avoiding the pilling problems.
    
    Carl

    
    Most antibiotics can have as a side effect loose stools.  The job of a
    good antibiotic is to kill bacteria.  A lot of "good" bacteria live in
    the gut and help digestion.  When an antibiotic kills it does not
    discriminate between good and disease causing organisms.
    
    Some times (check with your vet or pharmacist) you can feed a little
    live culture yogurt or sour cream to the cat to help combat the
    problem.  BE SURE TO CHECK WITH THE VET, (sorry to shout) but some
    antibiotics must NOT be taken with milk products.  Also some cat can
    not digest mild products.  Kitty parent knows best!
    
    Feline Helpful,
    
    Sue & crew.

    Well, Ladies, just to mention it, but erm... humans have 32 teeth.
    
    Not all humans... some never get the last four. 
    For the last 4 do not come out at anyone, and also then
    in ages over 20 or more. (We call them 'wisdom teeth' for that reason)
    
    Just my 2 cents. (4?)
    
    ;~)

    I read the notes in this stream and I'm still confused on
    when you know they need their teeth cleaned.   Should they be
    cleaned regularly, after a certain age.
    
    Our two Cats were 9 in march, they eats only dry (currently, Iams
    lite, before, Science Diet)   My husband and I looked at
    Merlins teeth and the very back ones look yellow.
    He doesnt seem to be in any pain with them, but we
    also didnt have a lot of time to look (merlin's choice, not ours)
    
    We are in France, and while our Vet is nice, he doesn't give
    me the same confidence as our US vet.  At merlin's check up
    he couldnt get merlin to open his mouth and said,
    "I'm sure they are ok"   
    I would also NEVER have him pet the cat's under anything
    stronger than a tranquilizer.  He is our second vet here, and
    while friendly they seem to have a much different feeling towards
    cats than dogs.,  He thought 9 was VERY old for a cat, and 
    was surprised at their good health.  (our US vet said that
    he wouldnt be surprised if they lived to be 16-18)
    
    I just want to do the right thing by them.
    
    any help on what to specifically look for on the teeth would be helpful
    
    thanks                                             
    l

    Indications that your kitty is having dental problems may be
    drooling (my Sneakers drools when he's happy, but he was drooling
    all the time) and reddened gums.  Also, if they're having a hard
    time eating dry food, they may be having dental problems.
    
    Most cats don't need their teeth clean routinely - I think only
    if you're noticing problems, or if your vet recommends it at their
    yearly checkup.
    
    Pam
    

    Also, a good indication that they need their teeth cleaned is that they
    have BAD breath all the time.  Not just after they've eaten.
    
    Holly
    

    Does anyone know why a cat might suddenly start griding their teeth
    while they are eating?  My cat is older, she just started this
    behavior, and I gotta tell you, it's an awful sound, it's like nails on
    a chalkboard!  She eats only wet food (Science Diet K/D) and I'm pretty
    sure she's missing some teeth (she's a messy eater, the food falls out
    of her mouth all around her but that's nothing new).  She is on
    medication for her liver problems - she's taking prednisone and
    cephalaxin.  I only mention this because the grinding started right
    around the time she started her second round of antibiotics.
    
    Caren

    Gee, I am sorry I took so long to read this note!  
    
    You have probably taken her to the vets by now but that is what I 
    would suggest.  In an older cat it could be that the tooth could have
    broken down or cracked and is now scraping up against another.
    
    Has the vet ever checked the mouth before?
    Karen