Conference misery::feline

    one suggestion that I have is with the dry food; if your cat's teeth
    are hurting, you might want to just sprinkle the food with water to
    just soften it a bit (you can also put it in the microwave for about
    30-45 seconds after sprinkling it also. It will make the aroma of the
    food come out, and if the cat is having trouble chewing, if will make
    it less paiful to eat.
    
    I'm glad to hear that your cat is doing well,
    Deb

    I have one 12 year old kitty who has had multiple teeth problems.
    When they are really bothering him...I can tell by the way he
    chews is food because it seems to fall out of his mouth or he
    takes his time trying to chew on both sides.   At one point
    his teeth bothered him so much...he just stopped eating completely
    and that was when we had to take him to the vets.
    
    He was put under...had his teeth scraped...and had 7 teeth removed
    and he is a much happier cat because of it.   He has no problem 
    eating dry or wet food now.
    
    Glad to see your kitty is doing so well with his kidney problem.
    
    Sandy

They basically rot to the point that they just fall out.
From time to time a Dr. will bring a cat in for a regular exam out back
and while there we may spend a minute picking the worst of the buildup
off. Doesn't happen too often, though.  And there's always the risk
you'll be picking at a pile of tartar and the tooth comes out, too -
not the kind of thing you want to do! You could ask your vet if it's
worth bringing your cat in for the day to let them see how much they
can clean off without using anesthesia. Another possibility is to
just sedate him and scrape a bit that way. With a cat that age you have
to be careful about overstressing them - heart attacks and all, you know.
Might be your Dr. will tell you they don't think it's worth the risk.

						Trace

    I just had a blood panel done on Amelia.  I thought it was to
    see what was going on with her ear.  Apparently the vet has
    decided that she needs her teeth cleaned and was checking to
    be sure she'd be okay under anesthesia.  I think there was some
    miscommunication there because she called yesterday to tell me
    that Amelia had a couple of slightly elevated enzymes that could
    be related to kidney function but that she'd be okay under 
    anesthesia to have her dental work done.  They'll just be sure to
    give her extra fluids.  Oh, and BTW, while they have her under for
    a teeth cleaning, they can culture and possibly flush out the ear.
    Whoa!  Wait a minute.  When did the prime focus go from treating 
    her ear to dealing with her teeth.  The only time I remember talking
    about her teeth was when the vet mentioned her teeth were looking
    a little dirty.
    
    I have a followup appointment the Friday after Thanksgiving with the
    vet I usually see.  I'll check with her to see what she thinks is
    best for the ear and if she really feels the teeth need to be worked
    on at the same time.
    
    I was thinking a culture of the ear would be the first thing that 
    should be done at this point.
    
    In any case, if you're thinking about putting a cat under anesthesia
    for dental work, I highly recommend doing a full blood panel first
    so that the vet knows what he's dealing with and what extra steps 
    might need to be taken (or if it should be done at all).  BTW, Amelia
    is 8.5 years of age.
    
    Jan

    Jan,
    My anatomy class is too many years behind me, but my dog had a
    persistent eye infection that would not go away, no matter what the
    antibiotic or treatment.  He then developed a sinus infection.  Come to
    find out, both the eye and the sinus infection were caused by an
    abscessed tooth, which could not be seen by a quick dental exam.  the
    x-ray showed the problem.  Could be Amelia is having ear problems
    related to a tooth problem?  I seem to recall that the mouth, sinuses
    and ear canal are all inter-related.  I may be WAY OFF here, however.
    I see your point about bringing her in for an ear problem and they are
    worried about the cleanliness of her teeth, but maybe they'll find
    something?  Fingers crossed for her...
    Sarah

    Jan...I kind of agree with Sarah because I went through many
    tests with Rio to find out what his nasal problem was (he snorts
    and sounds stuffy) and they told me it could be related to
    ear, teeth or nasal problems.    
    
    What I would do is talk to your normal vet...explain your money
    situation and work out a plan on what to test for first...so
    you don't spend unneeded money!!
    
    Sandy
    
    

    Sarah and Sandy,
    
    Thanks for the replies.  I understand where the new vet is coming
    from on the teeth thing but the way she detailed the plan out to
    me conflicts with the phone message I got from her explaining how
    it was okay to do dental work on Amelia.  Somehow she switched 
    focus on me between Saturday and Monday.
    
    I am definitely going to run all this past Dr. Leland and see what
    she thinks is best.  The new vet also mentioned allergy as a reason
    for the resistance of the ear problem.  I want to investage all the
    reasonable paths and hope my finances will permit getting to the 
    bottom of this.  I'm still trying to get my apt. deposit back and if
    I do, I can use that money.
    
    I talked this over with my cat club (most of the members are breeders)
    and they felt, like I do, that the culture is the next thing to do.
    Then maybe the x-ray (and dental work since they have to put her out
    for the x-ray anyway).  We'll see what happens.
                            
    Jan

    Jan
    
    It's funny you mention allergies because after all the tests they
    have done on Rio, which included Xrays, teeth check, nasal smear,
    and tested for all types of infections, they really can't figure
    out why he snorts and sounds nasaly!  Their comment was "we know
    what it is NOT (no tumors or infections) so it could be allergies.
    They don't believe it's food allergies....because that normally
    effects the skin so it could be something environmental.(grass, dirt
    etc)   Since he is eating fine, acting fine, and shows no other 
    sickness symptoms....we're kind of sitting back and monitoring
    right now.
    
    He's funny because when he's mad...he snorts just like a pig!!
    
    Sandy  

    sandy;
    
    one of my kitties named screamer - i have had him since he was one day
    old and he screamed so as a baby - has a nasal problem similar to what 
    you were saying about your rio.  i took him to my vet and he had tests
    and they found nothing really wrong.  they thought it might be the
    beginning of feline ashma (sp?).  my linus has ashma and i bring him
    every 6 to 8 weeks or so for a shot for his. the last time i brought 
    screamer along and they gave him a shot and it seems to have cleared
    it up and helped his breathing.
    
    jeane
    

    Thanks Jeane for the info...what type of shot do they give cats
    with Asthma and are there any side effects.  It would almost be
    worth giving Rio a shot...just to see if it takes care of the problems.
    
    We have come to the conclusion...he really snorts when he is excited
    or mad..but most of the time is breathing is normal.
    
    Sandy

    sandy;
    
    it is some kind of cortisone/predisone combo. it increases the
    appetite for about 2 weeks they eat like pigs!!!!!!
    
    linus also sleeps for about 2 days after because the heavy breathing
    and wheezing that starts when he is due for his next shot really tires
    him out (also he was a stray on his own for awhile so he is a little 
    overweight - all mine could afford to miss a couple meals).
    
    jeane
    

Hi,

I am in need of some advise.  

I have written before about my cat being diagnosed with kidney disease and so far so 
good!  It has almost been a year since he was first diagnosed.  I appreciate so much 
everyone's advise, comfort and support...and I now I need some more.  

I took Chico to the vets recently for a check-up and the vet seemed very pleased
with his progress.  In fact, much to my surprise, he said he really hadn't expected
Chico to last as long as he has.  Since May he has lost 1 lb. He's 8lbs right now.
The knowledge I have gained from this file along with what I have learned from the
vet have really helped me know what to do to help prolong Chico's life.

The vet has suggested that we bring Chico in for his teeth to be cleaned.  He noticed
that Chico has a lot of tartar build-up and beginning of gingivitis.  I have noticed 
that Chico has a hard time chewing his moist food - luckily, he eats it all but I can
tell that it hurts him to chew because he makes a lot of noise and the food falls out
the sides of this mouth when he eats.  This procedure will require using anesthesia.  
The vet explained that they will do some preliminary blood tests prior to giving him the
anesthesia to make sure that everthing looks ok.  They will use an anesthesia called 
isoflourane (sp.) which is the safest around and will put a cathedar (sp) in him to flush 
his system with plenty of fluids during the procedure and will also help flush out the 
anethesia more quickly after the procedure is done.  The vet will stay with Chico 
throughout the procedure to monitor him.  He explained the risk involved and said that 
they have been successful with other geriatric patients.  

The vet said that Chico's heart sounded good, his kidneys felt good and his coat looked
good - so he seems to be as healthy as he can be given that he has chronic renal failure.
I have thought and thought about whether or not to have Chico's teeth cleaned plus I have 
talked it over with my family.  I know that the bacteria in the tartar build-up can 
cause other problems and it's probably better to have his teeth cleaned now rather than
when a problem develops and we're forced to deal with it.  Besides, if he develops other
problems, he probably won't be as healthy and strong as he is now.  

Does anyone have any advise, words of comfort?  I am worried sick and know I'll be a basket
case the day the goes in for this procedure.  I just don't want to ignore his teeth and have
other problems develop and then kick myself for not having them cleaned.  The doctor seemed
confident about the procedure and he did not pressure me at all - he just explained the pros
and cons and suggested I think about it.  He did  mention that they have been successful with
other kitties in the same situation as Chico. 

Many thanks,
Michele and Chico    

    My 17-year-old Kitty, JFCL, has had kidney problems for the last year
    or so.  I just took her in to the vet this morning (along with the
    kitten) for her regular shots.  Luckily, the special kidney-diet food
    is helping, and she has gained back some of the weight she lost.  And
    her teeth are Ok this time so the vet didn't want to do any dental work. 
    She had a few teeth removed two years ago.  She's in good shape for
    such an old lady as she is.  She had a hernia a few months ago where her
    spay scar is (probably from rough-housing with the kitten!) and had to
    have surgery for that (everyone thought it was going to turn out to be
    a tumor, of course), but she tolerated the anaesthetic just fine.  The
    fur on her tummy has not completely regrown even yet.  It is scary to
    have to have an operation done on an older animal, but I think you
    should probably do it, especially since the kitty is clearly having
    trouble with the teeth.  It sounds like the vet will be very carefully
    monitoring your kitty to make sure he is recovering OK.
    
    /Charlotte, JFCL, and Melody the coon kitten

    I just went thru this with one of my cats last month.  Jack was
    diagnosed with kidney problems two years ago.  He was given 6 months to
    two years to live and he's still going strong thanks to the special
    kidney diet.  Your vet's procedure sounds just like the one my vet
    followed.  Jack came out of it just fine.  He still chews funny and
    makes disgusting noises but his breath is now tolerable 8')  Jack will
    be 16 years old in the spring.
    
    Diane

    
    
    	For lack of a better place to put this....  I have a strange
    	question.
    
    	Sasha went in yesterday to have her teeth cleaned.  They, of
    	course, put her under to do this procedure.  They had to
    	pull a couple teeth and she has gingivitis so she's on some
    	antibiotics.
    
    	The sheet that I got telling me not to give her a lot of 
    	water etc said that the 'grogginess' of the anesthesia could
    	last for up to 24 hours.  Well when I picked her up she was
    	far from groggy.  Usually she just sits in the carrier whining.
    	When I picked her up she was rubbing up against the ceiling of
    	it and against my fingers when I'd put then through the caging.
    	This morning she's *begging* for affection.... not necessarily
    	all that odd as she's an affectionate cat anyway but.....  she
    	was being affectionate to CHLOE !!  She and Chloe have pretty
    	much hated each other from the start.  Every now and again Sasha
    	would give her a few licks on the forehead but other than that
    	it's hissing and growling and batting.  Today she's nudging her
    	head under Chloe's chin!  I think Chloe had just as a surprised
    	look on her face as I did.
    
    	*Why* would she be doing this?  Is it an after affect of the
    	anesthesia (she hasn't been under since her spaying when she
    	was 6 months old. She now 8 years old).  Or is she just ecstatic
    	that her teeth are clean?  =)
    
    	I'm not worried about this at all, just curious.
    
    	Thanks!
    
    	JJ
    

     JJ,

     could be

     (a) she's feeling better now that her teeth are clean
     (b) an after-effect of the anaesthesia (sp?)
 OR  (c) it's a case of "please, please, I'll be good, I'll be nice,
		I like you, don't-do-that-to-me-again, please !!!!!!!!"

     in any event, take advantage of it while you can !!!

     Debbi

    I've noticed that how groggy my cats are depends on when in the day the
    operation was done.  I leave them in the am on my way to work, and
    sometimes the vet operates right away, other times things get
    commotional and its early afternoon.
    
    Blackie, my new 7 month old kitten, was in the holy terror stage when
    he recently went back in for altering.  When he came home he was an
    affectionate little angel.  I think he thought he was in jail for
    bad behavior and had been released :-)
    
    

    JJ...maybe she is no longer in pain so therefore she
    is treating Chloe better.
    
    Let's hope it stays this way...
    
    Sandy

  JJ,

Sophie also behaved differently after anesthesia.  Her first time, she was very
fiesty (and MAD that she'd been "abandoned").  She was also very affectionate 
with me; she wouldn't stop head-butting so I could write the check for the vet.

Her second time was more "normal;" she was groggy but she was also affection-
ate with the kittens -- the kittens that she hisses at all the time!!  They 
were all very concerned about her, hovering over her and sniffing at her, 
probably lots of kitty sympathy we couldn't understand, and she just ate it 
up.  Of course, she's back to her usual hissing self, but they'll never be 
afraid of her again.

You know, I'm very curious about the language they use.  An awful lot of 
communication goes on that is either silent or beyond human hearing range.
I never realized until we went to a multi-cat household how different the 
vocalizations can be also.

Gotta love 'em.

			SQ

    JJ,
    
    Do you know what kinds of meds were used for pre-anesth, induction, and
    genereal anesth?  Some of the drugs they use are known to cause
    temporary personality changes.  It's nice to have the change be nice 
    instead of aggressive.  Maybe I can sign up my pets for some of that!
    8^)
    regards,
    liz

    I would imagine the same kinds of affects could occur in kitties as
    humans or anyone else.  It is a medical fact that anesthesia can 
    cause a variety of personality changes in humans, most are temporary,
    luckily.  The changes could be to something quite different than the
    person was  before, talkative, quiet, violent, passive, grumpy, high,
    etc.  you get the idea.  So, ya, it probably affects other mammals 
    as well.....

When some dogs come out of ketamine/valium anesthesia, they see the room spin
and you get to watch their heads wag back and forth for like 20 minutes as they
try to follow the rapidly rotating room. Has a nice side effect of convincing
them they don't want to try getting up and walking around for a while while the
stuff wears off (we usually keep animals coming out of anesthesia out with us
in the surgical prep area so we can make sure they come out of it okay).

And every once in a while we get one that trashes like crazy and you end up
diving on them with a blank to keep them from getting hurt as they wake up.

						Trace