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Conference misery::feline

Title:Meower Power - Where Differing Opinions are Respected
Notice:purrrrr...
Moderator:JULIET::CORDES_JA
Created:Wed Nov 13 1991
Last Modified:Fri Jun 06 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:1079
Total number of notes:28858

755.0. "FELV questions" by MTCLAY::DOUGLAS () Mon May 02 1994 08:57

    I've read all the FELV notes in here but still have a few
    questions.
    
    My sister, who has a 10 month old indoor only cat, did not 
    get the cat vaccinated for FELV since she felt it was at low 
    risk for the virus. She had the cat cat spayed last month and
    within 2 weeks it was sick. She brought it back to the vet and 
    found out it has Feline Leukemia.
    
    She asked the vet if it was possible that the cat got it 
    while at the hospital being spayed. The vet said no, they
    are very careful there. The vet said the cat may have contracted
    it as a kitten since it was born ferral on a farm.
    
    I just find it odd that this very healthy cat got spayed, and BOOM, 
    it's sick. My sister is broken-hearted, having no children, this
    is her little girl.
    
    The vet went on to tell my sister, that she should not get another
    cat for 6 months after her cat dies because the virus can linger
    in the home.
    
    Question 1): How can the vet presume the cat did not get FELV
                 at the hospital since they DO NOT test every cat
                 that comes in? They don't wear gloves in between
                 handling animals, so I could see how it could pass
                 from one animal to another.
    
    Question 2): Does she really have to wait 6 months to get another
                 cat?
    
    Question 3): What precautions must I take when I go over and visit
                 the cat? (I have 2 NON-vaccinated cats also).
    
    Question 4): What will be the symptoms as the cat gets sicker?
    		 (she already seems a little blind, and is loosing weight,
                  she also grooms constantly, and stays in one spot all
                  day like she is lost?)
    
    Thanks, Tina
                                            
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755.1JUPITR::KAGNOMon May 02 1994 10:2924
    Tina,
    
    I know it sounds fishy to you, but the chances that FeLV was caught at
    the vet is highly unlikely.  Often times the FeLV virus lies dormant in
    the bone marrow, and a stress on the immune system will cause it to
    surface.  Going under for the spay as well as the surgery itself, could
    very well have triggered the disease active.
    
    FeLV is contagious with *consistent, prolonged* exposure.  A healthy
    cat is unlikely to contract it by sniffing a sick cat's nose or using
    the same litter pan (or food bowl) once or twice.  These are some of
    the findings of previous studies conducted on the disease.  I would
    follow your vet's advice and wait before adding another cat, or you
    could be setting yourself up for more heartbreak.
    
    Also, the chances that the vaccine could have prevented this is also
    unlikely, so please don't let your sister kick herself for not having
    it done.  My guess is that since the disease was discovered so young in
    life, it was harboring right along.
    
    Please send your sister my regards.
    
    -Roberta
    
755.2SOLVIT::KIRBYC::KIRBYMon May 02 1994 11:118
    My sympathies to your sister.
    
    FWIW, I've been advised by a knowledgeable person _not_ to have my 
    indoor cats vaccinated as it can be harmful or even fatal.  Does
    anyone have any information supporting or contradicting that assertion?
    
    
    Cheryl
755.3JUPITR::KAGNOMon May 02 1994 11:3811
    Cheryl, I have heard that if the cat has FeLV lying dormant in their
    bone marrow then the vaccine might activate the disease, but there is
    no supporting evidence to my knowledge to justify it.
    
    Some cats have reactions to the vaccine which could be fatal if not
    aggressively treated directly after symptoms occur.  This is why many vets will
    have both you and the cat wait at least 15 minutes to a half hour in
    the office before sending you on your way.
    
    -Roberta
    
755.4What to do ?SALEM::SHAWMon May 02 1994 12:268
    
    
    So what is the bottom line, Shall indoor only cats be vaccinated 
    for FeLV or no?
    Could an occassional supervised stroll outdoors (on leash) call for 
    need for vaccination?
    
    Shaw
755.5I vaccinate all my indoor cats for everythingPTPM06::TALCOTTTue May 03 1994 09:0921
  Let's just say they get out one day and get in a tussle with a FeLV positive
cat...  In fact, my situation was close. I had an indoor cat that I finally
started letting out after several years. She was bitten in a fight and
contracted FeLV. Turns out the FeLV vaccine had been overlooked in my requests
over the years to "Vaccinate her for everything" visits to the vet. 80% of FeLV
positive cats die within 2 years. TJ lasted about 15 months. She was fine up
until the last month when she experienced rapid weight loss and had difficulty
breathing. It often becomes a quality-of-life kind of decision. It's hard to let
go, but just as hard to see them suffer. The day I went home early to take her
in to be put to sleep, she'd already passed away.
  Where I work, all known FeLV cats staying in the hospital are placed in
isolation and areas they come in contact with (eg their cages, exam tables, etc.
are bleached and then disinfected with Roccal). We also wear smocks when
handling them and scrub up with a dinsinfectant that kills FeLV after contacting
them. Exam rooms that have had FeLV cats in them get bleached and we don't use
them for other cats for the rest of the day. The Dr's are also pretty good about
washing up between clients as a matter of course. There's always a chance
things can get transmitted at the vet's, but a solid effort is made to minimize
the risk.

						Trace
755.6MAYES::MERRITTKitty CityTue May 03 1994 10:2029
    There is no bottom line when discussing this disease and no 
    matter what vet you talk to...they all have so many differences
    of opinions.  I have dealt with many Feluk positive cats at our
    shelter, read many articles and talked to multiple vets regarding 
    this subject...and have come to my own conclusions.  These are just
    my opinions:
    
    I personally do not feel the virus is "caught" that easy...and I know
    multiple positive cats that are well over 10 years old.  The key
    is for them to lead a non-stressful life, feed them good food, and
    if they do get a cold make sure they are on antibiotics right away.
    I do feel young cats that are diagnosed were born with it...so I
    wouldn't blame the vet.
    
    I feel you can take multiple precautions by washing your hands after 
    touching a positive cat, washing their food bowls with bleach/water
    solution, keeping them confined or around other positive cats, feeding
    them good food and keep their live with as little stress as possible.
    
    I do not feel the virus can "live" outside the body for more then a 
    few minutes....so I wouldn't worry too much about visiting her.  Just
    take precautions and wash your hands and if you feel a need...just
    change your cloths before you pat your cats.
    
    Good luck...and again these are just my opinions. 
    
    Sandy
    
    
755.7MORE ON FELV SHOTSCSLALL::MHOLMESWed May 04 1994 16:105
    I just took "Tigger" to the Vet to have his booster shots, and she told
    me that if he is an indoor only cat he does not need a Felv shot.  She
    said she has three indoor cats and does not vaccinate them for that.
    
    Marilyn
755.8...POWDML::MCDONOUGHThu May 05 1994 14:0480
      After reading through the various replies, I pretty much agree with
    most of what's been said, except that I am a LOT surprised at vets who
    say that indoor cats don't need FeLV vaccinations!
    
      I've had three FeLV+ cats in the past 15 years. All three have since
    died...2 within 3.5 years of their birth, and one lived almost 14
    years. All eventually did die of the effects of the disease. While the
    one who lived for 14 years probably had a lot of 'old age' factors that
    caused her demise, she did develop the symptoms near the end.
    
      The first kitten that we lost to FeLV was a newborn that was found
    abandoned. She was tested, and tested negative and was immunized.
    However, without any warning she began to show the symptoms...hiding,
    refusing to eat, wanting to be left quietly alone...and the rapid
    weight loss and unsteady gait. When she was tested (blood test) she was
    found to be in the advanced stages of the disease.
    
      The second one--my little "Cookie", was tested positive and we did
    know this when we took her in. She lived happily and disease free for
    almost 3.5 years, and she also developed the symptoms wihout warning.
    We did everything we could in all three cases, but when it gets to this
    stage there really isn't much hope.... The average that our three has
    lasted is a few weeks after the symptoms became obvious...
    
      When we lost the one who had tested negative, I was very upset, and I
    called Tufts School of Veterinary Medicine, and was courteously
    connected with the Chief Vet. He spent about 3/4 of an hour with me,
    going over the various aspects of the disease, and where the Vet
    community is and is trying to go in deffeating the problem. What it
    really boils down to is pretty simple....and I believe that this is the
    most probable reason why so many Vets actually give so many different
    messages: THEY DO NOT FULLY UNDERSTAND THE DISEASE! The Vet said that
    they believe that it is similar to human AIDS, and there is another
    disease that is called Feline Aids that is in the same area, but
    totally different in it's origin and course.
    
      He went on to explain that a cat MAY harbor the disease in it's bone
    marrow and never test positive...yet the virus IS there and can develop
    into full-blown FeL at any time. This carrier method for the disease
    has been passed from the mother cat to the kitten. We are fairly
    certain that our cat had this form of it...
    
      He also confirmed what another reply stated: If a cat has tested
    POSITIVE, a trauma of almost any sort CAN trigger the virus to
    attack...such as spaying, neutering, an injury, etc. While it is not
    certain that this will happen, it is not recommended that a cat tested
    FeLV+ be spayed or neutered. 
    
      Immunizations can and do provide immunity to the disease....in around
    80% of cats taht receive the vaccine. Around 20% of cats are NOT
    immunized when they get the vaccine...they reject the vaccine and
    remain susceptible to contracting it. However, there is no way to
    really KNOW whether the vaccine has become effective and the cat is
    actually immunized. The traumatic and negative way that you find out
    which cats are NOT actually immunized only can be found by the cat
    actually contracting the disease and exhibiting the symptoms...not a
    test that anyone would want! Tufts went on to state that if the
    immunization DOES take effect, the immune cat can live without any real
    danger in close proximity with FeLV+ felines without any worry.. I am
    pretty sure we have 2 that are immunized, because they both lived
    side-by-side with all 3 of the ones we lost to the disease.
    
      The Tufts vet went on to explain that there is much studying
    currently underway, but the answers are not there at the present time.
    Some really strange things have been found...such as cats who have
    contracted the disease who are not knowingly exposed to it---which is
    why I am concerned aobut Vets telling anyone not to have their indoor
    only animals vaccinated! How do you know if one of your cats HAS the
    latent form of the disease in it's body?? He also told me--as did my
    own Vet--that even cats that test positive should get the immunization.
    It has been discovered that in some cases if a cat that tested positive
    receives the immunization, it seems to trigger the cat's own immune
    sytem and they actually have fought the virus and won...and later
    tested negative! Giving the vaccine will NOT hurt a cat, and it MAY
    just do what is required to help it in a few cases.
    
       We give all three of our current FeLV- tested cats the vaccine. So
    far, none of the current 3 have had any adverse problems...
    
       John Mc
755.9thank-youMTWASH::DOUGLASTue Jul 26 1994 07:349
    Thanks to all of you who have given support here. I have given
    these notes to my sister to read so that she could be more informed
    about this dreadful disease.
    
    She had to put Ceira down last weekend. The poor kitty finally had
    lost her will to live and it was time.....
    
    Thank you,
    Tina
755.10MROA::DJANCAITISwater from the moonTue Jul 26 1994 13:007
    Tina,

    My sympathies to your sister and you on the loss.

    I'll put Ceira on the Silver Lining list.

     Debbi