Conference misery::feline

    Sounds like roundworms.  Next time you see one, scoop it into a plastic
    bag and drop it off at the vets.  They will be able to identify the
    critter and start your cat on appropriate meds.
    
    The cat will usually begin throwing up when the infestation is bad, and
    that is why you are seeing them in the vomit.
    

    
    re -1, you're right. He's at vet for full set of tests and they found
    roundworms (plus an enlarged kidney but that's old news). How do you
    stop cats getting roundworm, or do you just have to wait for symptoms
    each time and get vet prescribed medication. Like, where do these
    things come from?
    

    Sometimes when a roudworm infestation is really bad, one round of meds
    isn't enough.  The vet will want to recheck the stool when the
    medication is done, and if eggs or worm are present prescribe a second
    round of meds.  This has to be monitored carefully cause the medication
    is actually poison -- enough to kill the eggs/worms -- but not the cat.
    
    Some people worm their indoor/outdoor cats every three months under the
    supervision of their vet, as a precaution.  If your cat hunts rodents
    or comes in contact with the infected feces of another cat, it can
    contract roundworms.
    

    If your cat is an outdoor cat...you will probably always have
    a Roundworm problem.   Roundworms are caused from eating infected
    critters...like mice.   But Roundworms can also be spread from
    cat to cat via the feces or if your cat steps in a infected area
    outside, gets eggs on the paw, and then licks the paw.
    
    Sandy
    
    

    
    Thanks, I guess I'll get him checked every 3 mths..

    
    Btw, are are humans at risk for any animal parasites?
    

    Absolutely.  There is a note in this file somewhere (entered by Jo I
    think) about one type of tapeworm that can actually be fatal to humans. 
    Toxoplasmosis is another example.  Ringworm, although not a parasite
    but a fungus, is another example.  I've read about others  (and can get
    more info if you are interested). 
    
    To get tapeworm for example, you would need to ingest a flea that had a
    tapeworm larvae at a particular developmental stage.  If a someone was
    to eat soil infested with roundworm eggs, they could be infested.
    
    However, I'm not trying to encourage paranoia here.  I've never
    personally heard of anyone contracting a parasitic infestation from
    their pets (although I do know people who got ringworm from their
    pets).  In general, one should always use good hygiene (wash) when  
    handling animals, litter, etc. of animals known or suspected to have
    parasites, and remember to cleanup yards, dog runs, etc. too.
    
    Sue B. + 3

    This isn't really about roundworms, but I don't know where else to put
    this.
    
    I took my kittens to the vet on July 20th to get their vaccinations and
    they were also wormed (given StongidT).  But over the last week or so,
    I've seen a lot of those "rice" worms on their behinds and in their
    stool.  Is this because the worms are dead (I've never seen one move),
    or do the kittens need to be wormed again.  
    
    I was really starting to worry because Lasher didn't seem to be playing
    very much, and he's sort of skinny even though I see him eating quite a
    bit.  Both cats had teary eyes for a couple of days after the vet visit
    and were sneezing a lot, but I called the vet and they said that was a
    normal reaction.  The sneezing seems to have stopped, and I was
    relieved (but irritated too) that Lasher began to play more last night
    (and all night long!).  Both cats have shiny coats and eat and drink a
    lot (probably normal for kittens). 
    
    So do I need to worry, or are the worms coming out a sign of recovery?
    
    Best,
    Michelle
    

    Occasionally my cats have a small amount of the sneezes after their
    vaccinations.  My vet said a small amount was normal.
    
    I thought the worm medicine basically dissolved the
    egg cases or worms (the "rice" wouldn't move whether dead or alive
     -- it's just an egg), so my guess is you should call the vet and ask.
    

    Michelle,
    
    I've always thought that the rice things that stuck to their behinds
    were tapeworm segments.  You might check with your vet to see if the 
    medication he gave them covered tapeworms as well as roundworms.
    If I remember correctly, my vet gives Droncit (??) for tapeworms
    (although my memory is not the greatest when it comes to this stuff).
    
    Jan

    The rice segments on the hinny is usually a sign of Tapeworm!  I
    would also call your vet because it is very possible that the cats
    have both types of worms.  I have never heard of that medicine...
    for tapeworm we have used Droncit or Cestix (sp??) and for Roundworms
    we use Nemex II liquid.  I'm sure there are other types on the 
    market...but I would just verify with the vet that the one he gave 
    them is for Tapeworms as well.
    
    A few years ago I had taken in a stray (who me???) and it ended
    up that all my cats and my house got infested with Roundworms.  I kept
    medicating them per the vets orders...but they get getting them back.
    It wasn't until we did a total thorough cleaning of the house
    (curtains,rugs,bedspreads,furniture) that we resolved the problem.
    Yuck......we worked so hard and wash litterboxes daily!!
    
    Per my vet...sneezing/coughing could also a sign of worms.  Other
    signs include throwing up (sometimes with visable live worms), diahrea,
    and loss of energy.
    
    Also please remember that stool samples sometimes do not show
    worms...it is not 100% accurate.   If you suspect worms..you
    might have to have the vet look at more then one sample.
    
    Worms...yuck!!! 
    
    Sandy
    
    

    Thanks for the advice!  I will definitely be calling the vet today.
    
    The strange thing about this is that the worms really started showing
    up after they had their vaccinations and worming.  That's why I thought
    maybe I was seeing the dead worms being eliminated (the rice on the
    hinnie).

    With Roundworms it sometimes takes a few doses of the medicine
    spread about 5 days apart.   For Tapeworm I normally just give
    them one pill and that does the trick!  Of course Tapeworms are
    caused from fleas...so you might have to take care of the flea
    problem or else the tapeworm will come back.  
    
    I have seen very large squiggly roundworms and tapeworms...so I think the
    rice segments you are seeing are eggs.  Can somebody else confirm
    this??
    
    Sandy
                                                  

    If I remember correctly, my vet treats roundworms with two
    treatments (shots) a week or two apart.  For tapeworms, it is a 
    one time pill I give them (or pill and 1/2 depending on which 
    kitty; dosage is usually determined by kitty's weight).
    
    I still firmly believe that the rice-type things on the butt are
    tapeworm segments.  I've actually managed to catch them while
    they are still freshing and moving before they've become dry rice
    thingies.
    
    Jan
                  

    I called the vet; she said those rice segments are tapeworms which the
    cats get from fleas.  I told her that my cats don't have a flea problem
    and she said it just takes one and that the kittens could get tapeworm
    from nursing a mother with a flea problem (my kitties have been away
    from their mommy for 4 months, though).  But they did have fleas before
    I got them, bathed them and dipped them.  Even now, they have one or
    two when I comb them (time to be dipped again).  I did get some worm
    capsules from the store and gave them the two day dose, but it didn't
    seem to help at all.  I think I'll take the box in and ask them if that
    stuff is any good.  If so, they may not be able to give them anything
    else so soon?  But I think I'll get the kitties vaccinated for rabies
    (apartment requires it), so the trip won't be a waste.
    
    Michelle

    Michele...I never worm my kids with the stuff you can get
    at the store.....I just don't trust it.   I'm sure that if you
    bring in the box...the vet will know whether he needs to do
    it again or wait awhile.
    
    You might want to consider treating your house for fleas too....
    Did you know that a fleas spends more time in your rugs then
    they do on the cats?  I know...I'm probably totally bumming you out!!
    
    Because I have many indoor/outdoor kids...I am constantly trying
    to stay on top of flea and worm problems.   Alot of work...but
    they are worth it.
    
    Sandy

    Hi Sandy,
    
    I have treated the carpets for fleas; Sprinkled it with Borax and left
    it overnight before vacuuming.  I should probably do it again;
    although, I was thinking that once a month would be enough (it's only
    been about 2 weeks).
    
    Maybe I'm kidding myself about the flea problem, but I didn't think I
    had to worry about it that much because I only ever see any when I comb
    the kittens and even then I only get two per cat at most.
    
    Looks like the babies are going to get a batch and a dip this weekend. 
    Oh, well, at least they don't mind the hair dryer!  :^)
    
    --Michelle
    
    P.S.  The vet said the StrongidT that they received is for roundworms.

    Michelle,
    
    I don't trust the store-bought worm stuff either.  I prefer to have
    the vet take care of it.  That medication is basically a poison to
    the worms and I want to make sure I don't harm my cats with it.
    
    I think the borax treatment thing I have says to put the borax down
    and leave it for a couple of days then vacuum and throw the bag away.
    I'll search my account for it and if I find it I'll send you the full
    set of instructions Jo Ann sent me.  The instructions are pretty funny
    because Jo Ann has insterted her commentary on the process here and
    there.
    
    Jan

      The thing about the borax treatment is that it only kills the eggs
    by dehydrating them.   If you a live infestation of adults they will
    have to killed with a bomb.  The borax will take care of preventing the
    next generation......
    
     denise

    That'd be great, Jan!
    
    re: -1
    I knew that, but I thought it couldn't hurt to put the Borax down that
    soon.  Especially since I don't know the life span of a flea or the
    length and specifics of their life cycle.  Anybody out there know what
    it is??
    
    And, I can't stand those bomb things!  They just seem so.... 
    unsanitary... spraying chemical fumes all over your furniture and
    everything!  Noxious!  And I don't think they would work unless they
    penetrated every little nook and cranny.  That's the thing about the
    Borax: you can't really sprinkle it everywhere (like under the coach)
    so it's probably not 100% effective.  Can you ever *really* get rid of
    fleas?  Or do you just reduce the population to a manageable number?
    
    Best,
    Michelle

    I hate noxious bombs too, that is why I just use the borax.  If you do
    the vacuuming religously and keep applying the borax, and throw the
    vacuum bag out each time, you don't have to use a bomb to kill the
    adults since you will just be sucking them up with the vacuum. :')  I
    usually just suck up the adults.
    
    The life cycle of a flea is about three weeks so you have to do the
    borax, vacuum up and toss the bag, borax, etc. thing for longer than
    three weeks to get them under control.
    
    This has been working for me since we got our dog.  I have actually had
    less fleas since we got Annie instead of more.  I expected more since
    she is in and out.
    
    Jo

since I started treating my yards and patio, religeously, I haven't had to
do anything in the house to control fleas.  The secret for us was to
spray the yards, front - back - and sides, once a month during all but the
coldest months of the year.  If I keep the yard infestation down, I don't
have fleas on dog or cats.

    Re: what are the little rice things....
    
    They are (as someone mentioned) actually segments that the tapeworm
    living in intestine has "shed", they are called proglottids (sp? -
    trying to remember from biology), and they are chock full of eggs by
    the time they exit the animal.  
    
    They in themselves are not the worm (although you will see them wiggle
    around).  The tapeworm itself can be much (MUCH) bigger than those
    little segments.  When I found out how big tapeworms really are (in
    biology lab and at the shelter), I was pretty grossed out knowing that
    my cats had those.
    
    Tapeworms usually do not cause severe effects in adult cats, but
    occasionally can result in malnutrition.
    
    Good luck getting rid of the worms and fleas.  I've heard fleas in the
    greater Mass. area are horrible this year.  We haven't had to bad of a
    time in NJ so far (fingers crossed).
    
    Sue B. + Smokey, Spike & Trouble 

    A flea solution I've used with a great deal of success is a mixture of
    salt,liquid dish soap and water. Once a year I apply this mixture to
    our basement floor. I usually neglect to do it till there's a flea
    problem though. The soap acts as a wetting agent which drowns most
    adults and larvae. The salt acts as a dessicant and dehydrates any that
    come along later on.
       This year we got caught off guard and have some infestations so I'm
    thinking of trying water with a high salt concentration on the carpets.
    I'll also be trying to introduce my 7 fur faces (8 if you count and
    indoor bunny) to brewers yeast and garlic.
       I did have a question in regards to outside treatment. What do you
    normally use?? I have chickens which are free roaming and 8 hutch
    rabbits so I'd have to be very careful about out of doors pesticide
    applications.
    
             Bob

>       I did have a question in regards to outside treatment. What do you
>    normally use?? I have chickens which are free roaming and 8 hutch
>    rabbits so I'd have to be very careful about out of doors pesticide
>    applications.
    
you should talk to an agricultural expert in the case of free-range fowl
like chickens which forage off the ground.  I know that with my dog, I
can allow her to roam in the backyard after the yard dries -- however, she
does not root around in, or eat, the foliage in the yard...nor does she eat
insects....unles, of course, she gets bored and one looks interesting..but,
hey, she's a dog - and they don't look interesting if they are dead.
I use a standard kennel and yard spray approved for environments where pet 
animals will reside.

IF you cannot treat your yard, you can win some of the battle by spraying the
bottom three feet of the outside of your home, including around all door
and windows.  Then treat the inside well, once....and keep up the non-toxic
treatment of carpet and floors with borax thereafter.  I believe dry borax
on the carpets would be kinder to the fabric than salt water -- but, perhaps
it would be wise to check with carpet manufacturers to be sure.

One thing I do know....flea control demands you treat the environment AND 
the pets - and keep the environment clear after that.

    Bob,
    
         Try the Agway in Northboro; ask for Bob who is the "chicken
    expert".  I'm sure there must be some treatment that is non-toxic to
    chickens, as they can get fleas and mites too, as can the rabbits.
    
         I wish I could advise you, but my chickens are free-roaming within
    a small barn, and are only exposed to the outdoors behind hardware
    cloth.  My rabbits are in the cellar but are in cages about 3' off the
    floor; so far no fleas.
    
    					- Andrea

         I may go to Agway. I frequent the one in Northboro. I'll likely
    pass on the outside applications unless there's something organic
    available. Treating the foundation however wouldn't compromise my
    no chem attitude too much though.
    
               Bob

    How do you know that you have really gotten rid of the roundworms?  I
    know you can test later but could use some more input.  Also, how do
    you clean your house to make sure the things are really gone? How would
    you know if YOU actually have them? Yucchh, it gives me the creeps!
    Karen

    yuck...I've been there!!!   The only way to truly tell if your
    cats is rid of Roundworms is to take another stool sample to the
    vets.  How many treatments have you given your cats????  If it
    is a bad infestation...I'm sure you'll need more then one treatment.
    
    When we had a bad roundworm problem we use a bleach/water solution
    throughout the whole entire house.   We washed curtains/afghans/
    bedspreads/catbeds/rugs/furniture etc.   We also washed out the
    litterboxes entirely with bleach/water every day for about three
    weeks!!  We also stayed on top of scooping...every time one would
    go...we would go check the stool and scoop immediately.
    
    Alot of work.....good luck!!
    
    Sandy
    
    

    Well... this seemed to be the closest topic to my question..
    
    Does it ALWAYS mean that a cat has worms if they run their butt across
    the carpet??
    
    H

    No.  It may mean that there is a problem with the anal sacks.
    
    Jan

    My vote is also for the anal sacks.  You can express them
    yourself if she/he needs it.  Have the vet show you how or
    feed a higher fiber diet.
    Karen

    Or, like me, you may just have a weird cat :-).  Red 
    occasionally "scoots" across the rug.  He usually needs
    his anal glands expressed about once a year.  Given the
    expression he gets on his face when the vet does this,
    I'm not sure I'd want to try it at home....;-) We've had
    him checked umteem times for worms, I've brought him to
    the vets several times for "scooting" only to find
    perfectly normal anal glands and no worms.  My vet, finally,
    gave up and told me, "I think he just likes the way it feels."
    Only my cat.  Anyway, that's how he got his nickname,
    "Pooperkitty" :-)
    
    Mary-Michael

    I also have a "scooter" and for no apparent reason, medical or
    otherwise.  After a couple of "emergency" trips to the vet to find no
    problem, we now just sort of watch him to be sure he's clean when he
    scoots.
    
    I guess as the last noter's vet said, he just likes the feel.
    

re .34:

Perhaps that's the "down" side of having nice carpetting?