Conference cookie::notes$archive:cd_v1

You CAN hear it!

But, it isn't quite as dramatic has between a LP and a CD. CX and the 
LaserVision medium goes a long way towards CD sound but, remember, it's
still stored in analog format on a video disk.

Of course, you can always get the combined player just announced for around
$ 1200.00. I've seen several reviews of it and judging by both it's specs
and the reviews comments, it's going to be a winner.

If I didn't already have a LaserDisk player from it's first year, I probably
would have waited for the combined player.


Ray

Some LV discs suffer from some of the same problems that have been reported
on CD discs.  In some cases, the original recording was poorly done.  The
most obvious example in my collection is Joni Mitchell's Shadows and Light -
lovely video work with an amazing amount of tape hiss.

The other major problem, lack of CX encoding on new discs, seems to come
from some distributors saving a little money.  CBS/Fox is the major villain.

Overall, I've been very pleased with my first generation LV player and my
60+ discs.  I'll probably be even happier when the new digital audio LV
discs start showing up on the market.

-- Ward

Let's also be sure that we understand what it is we are comparing when
we do compare LV to CD.....

If the best Laser videodisc is compared to the best CD, we are comparing
an analog sound track stored on a digital medium in analog form (the LV)
to a digital sound track stored on a digital medium in digital form (CD).

Now, it is undeniably true that a digital-digital CD cannot be surpassed
by anything else on the market today....but that is not to say that ALL
CDs are like that.  I have many CX encoded Laserdiscs that are absolutely
clean and noisefree, while I have heard some CDs that are simply re-issues
of the analog tape masters.  Those CDs are not worth the current cost of
a CD.

Ray ( .1) makes a valid point, when comparing a vinyl record to a GOOD
CD, the difference is almost impossible to miss.  But, when using the CX
encoding on a Laserdisc, the difference is far less noticable.

I too recently purchased a CD player (a Sony CDP-111) and have nothing
but praise for the machine and format!


				Jeff

     Please tell me more about this 'combination' LV and CD unit.  I had
this great idea of combining rock audio with MTV in order to sell CDs to
teenagers.  This would didtinguish the CD market from the LP market and,
for the rest of the world, drive down the cost of CDs.  Eventuallly the
evolution of the market could produce something like the BSO on the new
"VCD"
     Does the combination unit use 5 in. or 12 in. platters?
     How do they store the video, analog or digital?
     How do they perform the a/v separation, or do they send the mixed
signal to the TV?
     Who makes them and where can I get the review(s)?

     If these are reasonable units, I guess I'll have to rethink my idea.

Well...

Pioneer makes the player that the mags are currently reviewing. This month's
Stereo Review, Ovation and most other's, I imagine, have reviews. Each and
every one of them have raved about it!

It plays 5, 8 and 12 inch disks. CX built in for the LVs and the CD section
is supposedly extremely good. I'll look up the reviews and enter selected
comments into another reply.


Ray

  My first impression was "Boy is it ugly!!!"

  Reading on a bit further..  it will accept both 12-inch and 8-inch video
  disks in either CAV or CLV format and the 12-cm (4.7 inch) CD.

  The article did mention that the video disks could be made with a digital
  (CD format) soundtrack.  Apparently the reviewer had a disk with both
  analogue and digital soundtracks although I don't think such disks are
  generally available (yet!).

	..Paul

     Thanks for the leads....I read the Stereo... review and my impression was
that it was a MECHANICAL marriage rather than an integrated system.  I suppose th
that all the pieces are in there for what I want to do:
 
     How can we make a million dollars by combining (integrating) CDs with MTV?

 Can the video and audio signals be combined on the same compact CD style platte
r so we can have million-seller VCDs?  That's the only way that I see the cost
of CDs coming down...now when a teen walks into a record store, they can get 1
CD or 2 LPs for $16.  No contest!!!  The sound quality is so awful that putting
it on digital media only amplifies the shit.  BUT if you could sell the awful
videos that the rock stars claim are neccessary for a hit record today  THEN 
they would spend the money for an enhanced product which delivers something 
that they're consuming now but on the MTV channel operators schedule, not theirs
And, from everything I've read, they really DO SPEND lots of money.  So, HELP
me get a piece of it (should be enough to share).

RE: .6

There are a number of Japanese LV discs with both analog and digital sound
tracks.  These are clearly labelled with the words "digital audio" in
italics.

The Instant Replay (Waltham, MA) stocks most Japanese music discs
including the following with digital audio:

    King Crimson, Windham Hill Artists (3 volumes), Vivaldi: Four Seasons
    (jazz version by Larry Coryell and Kazuhito Yamashita),
    Midnight Session (Milt Jackson & others)

-- Ward

RE: .4 and .7

Pioneer is already marketing 8" LV discs for $10.99 (list price).  These
15-20 minute discs usually contain 3 or 4 videos.   Some (or all) of these
discs are marked in video cassette format by Sony as "Video 45's".

I imagine that it is only a matter of time before the 8" LV discs get
digital audio tracks.

-- Ward

Re: .9

I thought the 8" discs were all digital audio?  If this isn't true
and they are capable of digital sound (which I think I read about
the Pioneer) then I wonder how they figure out if the disc has a
digital or analog soundtrack?  It would be nice if they could add
digital audio to the 12" discs as well.  I might just buy one of
the combo players if some competition develops to bring the price
down.

					    -Dave

RE: .10

Currently the 8" LV discs have an analog soundtrack.  They are also all in
standard play (CAV) format.  For some reason, digital audio is currently
only available in extended play (CLV) format.

Digital audio IS available on some new 12" LV releases.  See the LV notes
file (RSTS32::SYS$NOTES:LASERDISC.NOT) for more details.

Most LV discs are encoded with information that allows newer LV players to
setup for appropriate playback.

-- Ward