Conference lgp30::christian-perspective

    A cult is something other people join.
    
    Richard
    

    Also see topic 226, "The Cult Note."
    
    Shalom,
    Richard
    

re Note 1099.1 by CSC32::J_CHRISTIE:

>     A cult is something other people join.
  
        That reminds me of "subjective is what other people are".

        Bob

    My understanding is that a cult is a church that denies the deity of
    Jesus Christ and is usually founded by a leader who claims to have
    direct revelation from God contrary to the bible...or claims to hold
    the role of messiahship.  This would fit well in the Jim Jones church,
    or the Branch Davidians, or the Moonies.
    
    -Jack

    A cult is magical and suspicious of rationality?.

    IMO, a cult is like opium.  In World War 2, the Japanese invaded China
    and gave the local children candy that was tainted with Opium.  It was
    sweet and pleasant to the mouth but in the end it was dangerous,
    meaningless, and made the children even more hungry.  
    
    Drugs are definitely magical...and then the sobering reality.
    
    -Jack

    
    From Websters.
    
    cult: 1. a system of religious worship or ritual 2.a) devoted
    attachment to, or extravagant admiration for, a person, principle,
    etc., esp when regarded as a fad. b) the object of such attachment 
    3. a group of followers; sect
    
    jeff

So, according to the definitions, most of you *are*
cult members.

The American Heritage Dictionary also adds:

A religion or religious sect generally considered to 
be extremist or bogus

which is probably closest to the popular usage of the
term. 

Steve

    
    I believe when present-day orthodox Christians use the word cult they mean
    those that have formally departed from orthodoxy and into heresy.  From my
    knowledge of those groups considered psuedo-Christian cults they always 
    have started with an idea held and promoted by a persuasive, charismatic
    person.  It seems the allegiance to the person most often overshadows
    the allegiance to the idea or that the two are inseparable.
    
    Certainly there are non-Christian cults all over
    the world.  That Japanese cult that has been terrorizing their country
    comes to mind.  I don't recall if there is a religious component to the
    cult or not.  And then there's that group called the Solar...something
    who all committed suicide simultaneously in Canada and Geneva this
    year. And even Stalin, Lenin, and Hitler are cult figures.
    
    jeff
    
    

    Christianity <> religion

    Christianity is a religion.
    
    Shalom,
    Richard
    

    Nope, it's a relationship.

    Christianity is not a relationship alone.  Christianity is a religion.
    Why be ashamed or shy away from the fact?
    
    Richard
    

.12 OUTSRC::HEISER "Maranatha!"

    Nope, it's a relationship.

Then you do not have "A belief in and reverence for a supernatural power
recognized as the creator and governer of the universe"?

Steve

    
    Born again Christians are in a positive relationship with God and practice 
    the Christian religion.  So, there's both relationship and religion.
    
    jeff

Also see topic 469, "Relationship versus Religion."

Shalom,
Richard

    
>    Born again Christians are in a positive relationship with God and practice 
>    the Christian religion.  So, there's both relationship and religion.
    
>    jeff
    
    I want to add to my own comment that the converse of the first
    statement above is also true.  Unbelievers are in a negative
    relationship with God, destined for hell, and follow a religion of
    sorts themselves.  The following passage from the Paul's epistle to the
    Ephesians is rather direct on this point:
    
    "And you hat He quickened who were dead in trespasses and sins; wherein
    in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according
    to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in
    the children of disobedience; among whom also we all had our
    conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh and of the mind;
    and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others"
    
    The unbeliever is not sick, as some might suggest, but dead!  All lost
    sinners are dead, and the only difference between one sinner and
    another is the state of decay.  Our world is one vast graveyard, filled
    with people who are dead while they live.
    
    Man's spiritual death began with his disobedience to the will of God. 
    God said, "In the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die"
    (Genesis 2:17).  Satan said, "Ye shall not surely die" (Genesis 3:4).
    Because they believed this lie, the first man and woman sinned and
    experienced immediate spiritual death and ultimate physical death. 
    Since that time, mankind has lived in disobedience to God.  There are
    three forces that encourage man in his disobedience - the world, the
    devil, and the flesh.
    
    The world, or world-system, puts pressure upon each person to try to
    get him to conform (Romans 12:2).  The unsaved person, either
    consciously or unconsciously, is controlled by the values and attitudes
    of this world.
    
    The devil is "the spirit that now worketh in the children of
    disobedience."  Because of Satan's demonic associates and his power
    over the world system, Satan influences the lives of all unbelievers,
    and also seeks to influence believers.
    
    The flesh refers to that the force that encourages the unbeliever to
    disobey God.  The flesh is that fallen nature that we were born with,
    that wants to control the body and the mind and make us disobey God.
    
    Thankfully!, this is not the end of the story.
    
    "But God, who is rich in mercy, for His great love wherewith He loved
    us, even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with
    Christ, (by graced ye are saved;) and hath raised us up together, and
    made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus.  For by grace
    are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves; it is the gift
    of God: not of works, lest any man should boast.  For we are His
    workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath
    before ordained that we should walk in them."  Ephesians 2:4-10
    
    Here Paul focuses on God's love.  When God's love is related to
    sinners, it becomes *grace* and *mercy*.  God is "rich in mercy". and
    in "grace" and these riches make it possible for sinners to be saved. 
    In His mercy, He does not give us what we deserve; and in His grace He
    gives us what we do not deserve.  And all of this is made possible
    because of the death of Jesus Christ on the cross.  It was at Calvary
    that God displayed His hatred for sin and His love for sinners.
    
    He quickened we who believe.  He made us alive, having been dead.  He
    exalted us.  He keeps us.  And He works in us and through us.
    
    I praise God for His love as demonstrated in my own life by His mercy
    and grace in raising me from the death of my disobedience unto new,
    abundant life.  Won't you be raised?  Come out of the graveyard!!!
    
    jeff
    

quite a sermon reverend!


andreas. 

    Andreas, spiritually speaking unbelievers are dead.  Man is a triune
    being made in the image of God (body, soul, spirit).  If you neglect
    your spiritual side, you are 2/3's complete.

>   Andreas, spiritually speaking unbelievers are dead.  Man is a triune
>   being made in the image of God (body, soul, spirit).  If you neglect
>   your spiritual side, you are 2/3's complete.

good lord, this _could_ just explain the low regard for unbelievers. 

would spiritual atheists, buddhists or what not be 2/3 complete also?
not following your logic, right?


andreas.

>would spiritual atheists, buddhists or what not be 2/3 complete also?
>not following your logic, right?
    
    no they would have a spirit, but which one is the question.

> Man is a triune being made in the image of God (body, soul, spirit).  

btw mike, which would be the missing 1/3? the soul or the spirit?



andreas.

    re: the first
    
    the first what?
    
    re: missing 1/3
    
    the spirit.  soul is your mind/will/emotions/personality.

      There is another school of thought which is that man is a _unit_
      and things such as soul, spirit, flesh, etc. describe man
      from different perspectives.  But, says this school of
      thought, you can't break man up into separate components
      and have them 'live' apart from each other.
    
      For example, the existence of the 'spirit' of man requires
      the combination of 'dust of the earth' and God's breath of
      life.  If one were to destroy a man's brain, that man would
      lack 'spirit' or 'soul' as the brain is required in order
      for man to think.
    
      I believe in the above.                    
    
    						Tony

    
    I think the accurate context of our existence is that there is a material
    and an immaterial which makes up the whole.  
    
    jeff

      God took the dust of the earth, breathed into it the breath 
      of life and man became a living soul.
    
      Genesis somewhere.
    
    						Tony

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Note 1154.84               did jesus die as a virgin?                   84 of 90
CSC32::J_CHRISTIE "Ps. 85.10"                        14 lines   6-OCT-1995 15:56
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.79

>    Yup.  That's one of the main reasons why I'm involved in Cult
>    Awareness.  The more I learn, the more I reduce the myths about others 
>    and confirm my own standing in Christ.

I've seen what passes as "cult awareness" where Jim Jones, the Unification
Church, and the Branch Davidians get thrown in with Jehovah's Witnesses,
the Mormons, Seventh Day Adventists, and Roman Catholics.

This is hardly education.

Richard