Conference lgp30::christian-perspective

    Sure we can all get along but it takes both sides to want to.
    
    		Alfred

    "Yes we can get along.  We are all God's children"
    
    "By the way, Rodney, why were you speeding along at 100 MPH, trying to
    kill yourself and taking as many as you could with you?"

"Can we all get along?"

At one time, I'd have been able to supply an optimistic response to this
question.  At one time, I believed that all the barriers could be overcome.
At one time, I believed that all that was really needed was a good dose of
education and heaping helping of unselfishness.

I failed to accurately predict the degree of resistance in people's hearts,
how much people covet the status quo, and how little they're willing to give
up for the benefit of someone else.

Certainly there are outstanding exceptions, but that's the problem - they're
exceptions.

I no longer believe that we could all get along, even if we all became
Christians - perhaps even *especially* if we all became Christians.  As
it is, I'm pessimistic that the old ways will be replaced by more old ways
and that the wounds will heal over before the infection is cleared out,
so that in time we'll have another mess on our hands.

Pax,
Richard

    If you look at Rodney King and see a thief, a drug addict, a dangerous
    man, then how can your heart be converted to love him?
    
    Even if you are unselfish, he may be an enemy of the social order.
    Just like the cops who beat look like an even worse enemy of the social
    order for they did their beating in the name of preserving law and
    order.
    
    If you look at Rodney King and see the face of Jesus, believing that we
    are all God's children and Jesus is God and the Son of the Father, then
    it is possible for your heart to be converted to love him.

    Richard, you are such a pessimist!

    Actually, when I look around me at the world, I am often inclined to
    agree with you, but I must admit that much of me still wants to believe
    in the spirit that lay behind Rodney King's poignant plea.  I want to
    believe that people have within themselves the ability to get along.  I
    think it *is* a difficult goal to achieve, and probably won't be
    achieved, if ever, for a long time to come; but I also believe that
    humans have within themselves the capability for reconciliation just as
    they have the capability for conflict.

    I do believe positive changes are possible.  Without some kind of hope,
    what is the point?  Why work for justice if justice is unattainable? 
    The spirit that urges us on, even in the face of seemingly impossible
    odds, is what has made the visionaries of the world seek to change the
    world; and sometimes those visionaries, who we now honor, were
    successful in their endeavors, although sometimes they did not live to
    see the results themselves.  Remember John Woolman?
    
    If you seek after that which is just, and right, and true, maybe--just
    maybe--you'll take us all one step closer.

    -- Mike

> "Can we all get along?"  Rodney King's asked perhaps the most haunting question
> of the Los Angeles riots.
  
        We all want to "get along" -- but on our own terms.

        Others are willing to "get along" with me -- as long as I
        agree to their terms.

        Bob

    re 2
    
>    "Yes we can get along.  We are all God's children"
    
>    "By the way, Rodney, why were you speeding along at 100 MPH, trying to
>    kill yourself and taking as many as you could with you?"
    
    Yes, and by the way, LAPD, WHY were you beating one of "God's children"
    like that?

    re: 3
    
>I no longer believe that we could all get along, even if we all became
>Christians - perhaps even *especially* if we all became Christians.  As
    
    That's the problem in the first place!  A few folk become socalled
    "Christians" and sought to change the world...."NONE, no not one,
    sought God the Father"....Christianity (following Jesus Christ) is not
    the answer!  Didn't Jesus teach that we should follow the Will of God,
    his Father?  Why aren't called "Followers of the Will of God"?
    
    Jesus said, "I came not to bring peace but a sword...to set you at
    variance with one another."  and as followers of Jesus that seems to be
    exactly what has come about!
    
    Playtoe

    RE: 10
    
    Of course, I'm somewhat pissed at that sort of talk about Rodney "How
    can we love him", when all the while those four police, whose records
    are no better for violation of laws/policy...it's an insult to black
    people all over the nation.  It's a BAD attitude for any who say it and
    it is a BAD attitude for this Nation to take in regards to Rodney...and
    if you want to HIDE the note because you perceive it as a PERSONAL
    attack and not an opinion of that sort of thinking, that's ok...it's
    typical of the whole affair!  The Nation has REFUSED to face the real
    issues all along...and resent anyone who raises the real issues...no
    problem.
    
    I tried to be as nice as possible about it, but that's as nice as I can
    put it...it's a bad attitude is the bottom line.  
    
    Playtoe, In the Spirit of Truth

Mike .5,

	Can't remember where I saw this:  A witness carrying a placard
urging unilateral disarmament parades outside the Pentagon.  An observer
says, "You know, you're not going to change the world by doing this, don't
you?"  Undaunted, the activist replies, "I do this not so much to change the
world as to prevent the world from changing me!" :-)

	This is where I frequently find myself these days.

	I see a small breakthrough now and then, but I'm afraid that the
changes are coming too little and too late.  But I'm not going to give up,
if only to prevent the world from changing me. ;-}

Peace,
Richard

   I'll put aside that charge that I have a BAD attitude and tie it into
    what I think the question asked by King has to do with our Christian
    faith.

    But first, I'm going to offer these as facts that were not disputed by
    King's own lawyers, that King was observed speeding by the California
    Highway Patrol, he was followed and failed to pull over for 8 miles and
    at speeds of 100 mph.  Once off the freeway, he ran stop signs and
    traffic lights.  King knew that if apprehended for speeding and driving
    while intoxicated while on parole, he might be returned to prison.

    As a Christian, I wouldn't do that.  As a Christian I wouldn't beat a
    man on the ground with a baton if I were a policeman, King didn't
    require that for his apprehension.

    I've made the judgment that the police acted improperly.  Does being a
    Christian mean that I should be angry and hold a vendetta?  We can get
    along with each othe

<<<    As a Christian, I wouldn't do that.  As a Christian I wouldn't beat a
<<<    man on the ground with a baton if I were a policeman, King didn't
<<<    require that for his apprehension.

   
    For myself as a Christian, I wouldn't judge another human being 'till
    I'd walked a mile in his shoes.  You as who you are having lived your
    life with your unique set of experiences would not do what Rodney did. 
    However, you are not Rodney and have not lived his life with his unique
    set of experiences and therefore do not have any idea if you would have
    done what he did if you were him.  As a Christian, I say 'Judge not
    lest ye be judged'....
    
    Ro
    

    Mt 7:1 "Judge not..."
    
    The context is important.  I'm not judging King, Powell, or Powell's
    jury for salvation.  I saying that, knowing what I know from news
    accounts, I wouldn't have beaten King with a baton.  Knowing what I
    know from the news accounts of the trial, as a juror, I would have
    voted for conviction.
    
    And you need to follow your own advice a bit:  How do you know that
    I've not had to make decisions regarding the use of force to subdue a
    violent individual?   The measure that I use I expect to be used on
    me. (Mt 7:2)

Can we all get along?

What ever happened to the 10 commandments?

"YOU SHALL NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS AGAINST YOUR NEIGHBOR"?

But before you can do this the 1st commandment is necessary.

"I AM THE LORD YOUR GOD, YOU SHALL HAVE NO OTHER GODS BEFORE ME"

EXODUS 20:1-17


Waiting for the rapture,

Ralph

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Note 490.9                    Can we all get along?                      9 of 16
SWAM1::DOTHARD_ST "PLAYTOE"                          18 lines  14-JUL-1992 11:30
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    re: 4
    
    When I look at Slavery and the Indians and discrimination and racism in
    this country...how can we love those responsible for it?
    
    Rodney didn't cause the riot...LAPD did and the System did...and if you
    support their position then YOU are directly involved with not only
    this situation today the whole series of events since the beginning of
    this country...but don't think I really care about that such that I'd
    personally retaliate or advocate anyone else to do so, because as a
    Follower of the Will of God, I KNOW Our (and I'm saying there's only
    ONE God) Father will not be mocked...and He will visit the iniquity of
    the father upon the children even unto the fourth generation...and
    guess what this is the Fourth generation out of slavery!
    
    Playtoe