Conference napalm::commusic_v1

    It IS an intriguing concept, and looks affordable.  However it requires
    a DSP board, plus DISK.  LOTS OF DISK.  IMNSHO, the disk investment
    required to do any kind of audio-MIDI hybrid piece would cost more than
    a high quality multitrack AND SMPTE interface.
    
    Anyone have the numbers ?
    
    karl

    
    You can do this today with a DigiDesign board.  They're *NOT* cheap.  I
    think the board is around $800.
    
    DigiDesign sells a 4 track recorder (software) that work with this
    board.  They are working on another board with more DSPs and therefore
    more tracks.
    
    Disks for MAC are getting cheap.  Find the cheapest SCSI drives you can
    and get Silver Lining and you're up!  DigiDesign also supports 2:1 and
    4:1 compression. 8 minutes of 4 tracks on 45MB tape cartridge.
    
    Here's their address;
    
    DigiDesign
    1360 Willow Road, Suite 101
    Menlo Park, CA 94025
    (4150 688-0600
    
    -Ed
    

    The newer Macs (the LC and the IIsi, not sure about the Classic) have
    audio input hardware as standard equipment.  It isn't up to
    professional standards, but for practice, etc it should be enough.
    
    Digitization is 8 bits, 22k per second.  This is for compatibility
    with the audio *output* that has been a part of every Mac from day one.
    (which was an 8-bit D/A clocked by the screen's horizontal refresh
    clock).  Even the alert beeps are played through this hardware.
    
    Now there is an application: selling customized musical "beep"
    recordings.  (See, you can take *any* recording in this format and
    make the system use it in place of the system beep, and other sounds
    for other events like boot, disk eject, etc.)
    
    If you have an older Mac you can get the same audio input capability
    by buying a MacRecorder from Farallon (about $170??).

Maybe I'm confused, but we are talking about 8-bit right?  I'm nearly positive 
you can do approximately what is described now with a freeware program on 
the Amiga called MED. Four channels of sequenced sampled sounds on Amiga 
can play along with eight channels of MIDI. Generally people just play short 
samples like a cheap 4 channel 8-bit sampler, but I have heard long samples 
played and know of freeware programs that can record as much as you have 
disk space for to a garden variety Quantum SCSI disk. I, without a hard 
drive, haven't tested it. I'm sure the  Audio Trax program has integrated 
the sychronization of long samples better than what is current available 
for the Amiga.  

The Amiga has a very active group of people, mostly in Europe, pushing
the limits of the Amiga's 4-channel 8-bit sampling capabilities. There
are hundreds of "tracker modules" (songs) and samples available on the nets. 
Some are very impressive except they all suffer from the low sampling rate.
The digitizers do not come built in to the Amiga, but they usually cost
less the $100. Some hackers are also getting 8 channels when they turn
off multitasking. 

I guess I'm saying, if 8-bit is enough, then the Amiga freeware community 
has already "signal[ed] the beginning of the end to tape recording in 
home studios".  Ever since I started downloading tunes to play on my Amiga 
It has been easy to imagine the day when it would all be just bits and bites.

BTW.  This is why the recording comapanies are nervous about DAT etc.  
Imagine a pirate bullitin board with the top 100 "albums" free for 
downloading!  Personally, I enjoy having access to music that would otherwise
never make it past conservative recording companies, or would normally
require expensive studio time to produce.

BTW2. These programs/tunes are discussed ad nauseum  on the usenet conference
comp.sys.amiga.audio. I've heard the newer Ataris can play some of the
tracker modules too.

Dave

Re .3:

You're right, Bill, you're confused. You see, *everyone* knows the Amiga isn't
a "serious" computer- it's 8-bit capabilities have habitually been compared to
dedicated 16-bit samplers and then described as inadequate and/or "suitable for
games." The Mac, on the other hand, is well-known for being a real cutting-edge
tool, and so when they bring out 8-bit capabilities, it truly represents a
major breakthrough in audio and multimedia for computers. Now do you
understand?

Now, if I can find several helpers to pry my tongue out of my cheek, I'll be all
set...uuuunh! mmmmmph! Seems stuck....

Cheers,
	Bob

    Sounds to me like the Amiga is to the Mac as Digital is to IBM ...
    
    Steve

    
    The DigiDesign stuff is 16-bit and samples at 44.whatever Khz. CD
    quality.  Please keep the Amiga vs. Mac noise to a minimum.  We're
    supposed to be talking about computer music here.
    
    I get the feeling that it won't be long till we get decent digital
    Multitrack (16 or more channels) recording and synthesis on cards.
    *THIS* is what I've been praying for.  No more screwing around with
    unexpandable and unupgradable synthesizers.  Open systems for the 
    music business.
    
    OK, I'll get off my soapbox...
    
    -Ed
    

I noticed that the announcement for Audio Trax in Electronic Musician
says it accepts IFF samples which is the Amiga sampling standard. This
allows the program access to the hundreds (thousands?) of Amiga samples 
already out there. So if you Mac owners get this thing, check out the
Amiga archives. You can get pointers through the BOMBE::AMIGA conference
or, perhaps, some Amiga fanatic can help you out ;-}

Also re:
> Now there is an application: selling customized musical "beep"
>    recordings.  (See, you can take *any* recording in this format and
>    make the system use it in place of the system beep, and other sounds
>    for other events like boot, disk eject, etc.)
 
I have a sample of the HAL line from the movie 2001: 
"I'm sorry Dave, I can't let you do that."  I have had this replace
the Amiga system beep. I've heard lots of samples to go along with
disk insertion, including the "ahhhee" from Crystal Quest and various
munching sounds. I also have a sample of the the "I've fallen down
and I can't get up" ad line, but don't know where I'd use it yet.
This stuff can be a lot of fun. 

I also saw a recent ad for a sample recording/editing program that
claimed up to 88 seconds on a floppy. I assume this is at best stereo
and more likely mono. I haven't seen long sample recording to floppy 
available PD yet. Even at 8-bits, four tracks at a time of this could
eat up some disk space in a hurry.

For example, "I've fallen down..." weighs in at 68900 bytes
Dave

    
    		Hello , I'm reading your articles and I'm a little
    
    confused what concerns the trax sequencer. I have a flyer here over
    "Trax 2.0" desktop midi recording studio &  they talk about 
    64 multi-channel tracks recorder !
    Is it the same trax , or is this another one ?
    
    Sebastian M ( Brussels)