Conference napalm::commusic_v1

re. < Note 1980.0 by CURIE::DECARTERET "I81B4U" >
>                       -< How do I get my MT32 to work? >-

    Second things first..

    The MT32 drum sounds live on MIDI channel 10, so changing your keyboard
    send channel to number 10 will give you access to all of these sounds.

    I'm not entirely sure what your problem is regarding accessing the other
    MIDI channels - why do you want to do this ? All of the MT32's sounds
    are available on (say) MIDI channel 2, just by selecting the sound group
    and then the sound. Unless you want to do fast sound changes in mid-song
    then you shouldn't need to swap channels at all. If this is your requirement
    then I'm afraid I don't have a solution, other than the obvious and somehow
    inevitable one of upgrading your keyboard (you could maybe take the MT32
    back and swap it for a D10 - same sounds but with a keyboard, or even a
    D20 - same sounds, a keyboard and a sequencer, or even ....)

    Welcome to the wonderful financial merry-go-round of MIDI :-)

    Cheers,
    
        Derek.

    > While I was purchasing the MT32 in the store, the man selling it to
    > me told me (in fact, I think he showed me) that you can play up to 
    > 8 sounds through one MIDI channel.  
    
    Sounds like a misunderstanding.  Probably a confusion around the
    terms "sound" and "MIDI channel".  I'm not even completely sure
    of the question that's being asked - I think it was different
    from the one .1 answered though.
    
    You absolutely can not access 8 different sounds simultaneously on one MIDI 
    channel.  The only way to get 8 different sounds simultaneously
    is to use 8 different MIDI channels.
    
    I'm not familiar with the HP-450 but my impression from what you've
    said is that it is only capable of transmitting on one channel
    at a time.
    
    I'm not sure what the demonstration the salesman gave you was, but
    if you heard two different sounds together, chances are he was
    playing it on a keyboard capable of transmitting on several channels
    simultaneously.
    
    	db

    Surprize, Surprize. In order to really utilize the MT32, you really
    need a sequencer (there goes a few hundred more dollars). The D110
    (the MT32's big brother) can have all of the Timbres assigned to a
    single channel (handy for layering things, but can quite easily become
    a jumbled mess). The MT32 also has, what I would call, a crippled
    equalization section. Part of this relates to the inability of the
    system to seperate things on enough outputs (you really only have 2,
    left & right). This is not hard to overcome. If you are only ever
    connected to your sterio, then there is not much problem. If you plan
    to hook up to a P.A. system, you need some additional equalization to
    fix it (see the other MT32 note - I'm sure that this has been
    discussed).

    In summary, start looking for a sequencer. The MT32 can do wonderful
    things for you (it has it's limitations, however). I'd suggest either
    a Roland MC-500 (or one of it's many variations) or an Alesis MMT-8.

    If you go with the MMT-8, I'll gladly share some of my sequences
    (specifically for the MMT-8 and MT32) via the cassette tape interface
    (around 60 or so songs of various vintages). Feel free to send me
    Email if you have anything to ask about my set up.

							    Jens
    

re: 1980.2 

	It turns out that you ABSOLUTELY CAN access multiple
	sounds from a single MIDI channel. We'll maybe you can't,
	but sombody with the capability of writing a system 
	exclusive message at the MT32 can!

	Internally, the MT32 has 8 parts. This corrosponds to
	the 8 buttons on the front panel. By default, part
	1 responds to midi channel two, part 2 to midi channel
	3 etc. As was said before, the 32 percussion sounds
	are available as different midi note numbers on
	midi channel 10.

	With a simple system exclusive message, it is possible
	to modify a location indicating the midi channel number
	that each part will respond to. So, it is possible to
	make all eight parts respond to midi channel 5 for example,
	by changeing the parameter to a 5 in the memory of each of
	the 8 parts.

	I do this as a form of cheap layering. I have an example where
	I set up 3 different organ sounds, each as a seperate MT32 part.
	I adjust the volume (via midi control change 7) of each part
	to acheive the desired "mix" of the three sounds. I then thru
	out a system exclusive message to change all 3 parts to respond
	to a single midi channel number.

	Then, I set up my el-cheapo PSR40 Yamahog keyboard than can only
	transmit on one mid channel at a time, to send on the midi channel that
	the 3 parts are set up to respond to. I then get a very fat layered organ
	sound, that is a combination of three sounds.

	You can do quite bazzar effects by layering two entirely different
	sounds to respond top the same channel, like chimes and keyboard.
	Supposedly, this is also conservative of partials, but I don't
	understand how.

	I use a MC300 sequencer to control the MT32. But there are other
	options that you could use. Some keyoards allow you split the keyboard,
	transmitting on different midi channels from each part of the split.
	You could set it up that the left hand played a bass guitar, while the
	right played piano. 

Rick

    Y'know, as I wrote my message, I though "gee, I'll bet someone'll
    dredge up with some obscure SYSEX feature to do it.
    
    Anyway, I get the impression that JD is new at all this and might
    not understand what all this stuff about SYSEX is.
    
    Basically, what this means is that there are some MIDI messages (SYSEX
    is short for System Exclusive) that are specific to the MT-32 (no other
    unit understands or generates them) that would allow you to do this.
    
    However, the essence of what I said is still true.  If all you have
    is the HP and the MT, you can't do it because you don't have anything
    to generate those MIDI commands.  Generally speaking, you need a PC or
    a fairly sophisticated sequencer that will allow you to manually type
    in those codes and faithfull transmit them on command.
    
    	db

    Another thing you can do to get multiple timbres on one channel
    is to do zoning (i.e. all notes from C1 to C3 play "bass-patch",
    C#4 to C7 play "violins", etc.)
    
    Most Oberheim hardware supports this concept...
    
    	-Bill

    I went back to Daddy's and talked to the guy and he said that the
    keyboard I tried it on at the store did allow up to 8 MIDI channels
    to be transmitted at the same time.  That does me a lot of good.
    That's one of the reasons I purchased it, was because of the layering
    of the sounds, but I guess I'll have to spend more on a sequencer.
    I was also wondering about the possibility of a D110, D220, or a
    D550.  Well, not the D550, that's a bit too expensive, but does
    anyone have some impressive prices on either a D110, D220 or a
    sequencer, new or used??  Thanks for all your help....
    
    JD

    re: .6
    
    The MT-32 doesn't do splits or zoning.  (To the very best of my
    knowledge).
    
    	db

> < Note 1980.7 by CURIE::DECARTERET "I81B4U" >
>     anyone have some impressive prices on either a D110, D220 or a
>     sequencer, new or used??  Thanks for all your help....

What's a D220? Never heard of one. Any info would be appreciated.

I have a  D110 and am very happy.  Do a DIR/TITLE=110 for more info than
     you could ever  use.    I  use  it  in a Macintosh based sequencing
     environment.  Should be  able  to  get  a D110 mail order for about
     $600-$700. It is a fantastic source for percussion sounds.

/Mitch

	I'm not sure about how much extra functionality
	you get with a D110 over an MT32. From my current understanding,
	its something like...
		rack mountability,
		multiple outputs (8?)
		some kind of rom interface?
	(I'll have to do a DIR/TITLE=110 as previously mentioned.)
	
	I used to think I was gonna look at D110's, but now I am starting 
	to lean toward the U110.

	The U110 multi-timberal SAMPLE player. (6 channels?, multi-outs?)
	I heard a quick demo at	Daddy's Salem, and it sounds like a 
	great improvement over the MT32, with much of the same functionality.
	You can add
	additional sampled sounds thru roms, (Up to 4) which are
	immediately available for use (no loading). You CAN'T sample
	with it, but can only play pre-sampled sounds. Some of the drums
	are great. You typically get 3 ot 4 drum sounds of a particular type
	(eg; snare, bass), and there are some hot variations.

	Latin percussion you have to get from a rom. ROms are supposedly
	about $60.

	Anyway, if you go in for a demo of the D110, ask to see the U110.
	I believe that it was about $800, so it is close to a D110.
	I'm leaning  heavily that direction myself.

	Anyone else seen a U110, and have opinions?

    
    
    	Someone I work with who does a one-man band thing in Italian
    restaurants had one for about two weeks and traded it back in for
    credit. He's waiting for the Roland W10(?),their answer to the M1.
       Seems you end up spending a lot more than $800 for the U110,since
    to fill up the rom slots its another $240 approx. And you can't
    sample!.
    				Rich

Just fyi, a  dir/title=110  will point you to both the d110 and the u110
     notes.  I have both and have reviewed thier good/bad points there.

The u110 is great for a more acoustic sound.  The d110 is great for more
     a more synth type sound.

/Mitch

    re. 10
    
    Rich, I saw the Roland unit last night at Daddy's. It's called the
    W-30, and the demo sounded great. 
    
    Mike D

    
    
    	I heard that it's like the M1, but it samples also.
    A killing machine.

    
    Rich, I started a new topic for it.

    The best way to get the most from an MT32 is to use voice editor
    software on a PC - e.g. Steinberg Synthworks running on an Atari.
    This allows you to access a lot of fearures on the MT32 which can't
    be accessed via the front panel. There are several different types
    of reverb and delay available and you can define a 'configuration'
    which is essentially a patch of eight sounds. Each configuration
    specifies sound, panning, midi-channel, volume etc.etc. The patch
    can be stored as a PRO-24 pattern and inserted into a song so that
    the MT32 is loaded with the relevant patch at the right time in
    the song. You can also specify what sounds go into the drum kit
    along with reverb on and off for each sound and pan position. The
    new drum kit can then be transmitted to the MT32. All patches can
    of course be stored on floppy or hard disk. There is also sound
    creation and alteration in the program which makes editing sounds
    a lot easier. There is even  AI-based sound creation where you can
    mix different sounds together to get new (and usually very strange)
    ones. 

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Note 2095.1                      MT32 DEMOS ????                          1 of 1
VOLKS::RYEN "Rick Ryen 240-6501 AET1-1/A6"           11 lines  23-AUG-1989 09:53
                                -< I doubt it. >-
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	I have some documentation on MT32 internals. I have not
	seen anything to suggest that there are demo's included
	in the design. I would think that if there were, Roland would
	have put a prominent control on the front panel. Why hide it?,
	since demo's are mainly a sales tool, and have little other use.
	Unless, maybe it didn't work very well.

	Then again, maybe they were discussing a different version of 
	MT32 than I have.

Rick

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Note 2095.0                      MT32 DEMOS ????                         1 reply
CESARE::PIOVANO                                      31 lines  23-AUG-1989 05:16
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    
    			Demo Program on MT32 ?
    
    Few days ago, I've read on a musical magazine, the characteristic of
    MIDI module Roland MT-32, which I've purcased some months ago.
    
    In this article, is mentioned the ability of MT32 to run 5 ( five !)
    DEMO Program, built on it by Roland. Naturally, this feature is not
    described anywhere on MT32's documentation supplied with the unit.
    
    Anyone know anythings on that ? Is the truth ?
    
    And if yes, in what mode can I bring out these DEMOS programs ?
    
    ---*
    
    There is others features of MT32 not described on its stringated
    manual ?
    
    I had discovered, not discussed in the manual, the ability of MT32
    to use other midi channel, rather than the default setting, without
    using Computer, but via front Panel.
    
    many thank's for any help and suggestion.
    
    Gianmario  [ poor musician in North-Italy ].
    
    Ciao.
    
    
    

    Gianmario,

    Can you post the name(s) (and publication dates) of the magazine(s)
    that mention the MT-32?  Thanks (gratsi?) !

    
    OK, STEWART ( I' dont know your name ...)
    
    	The publication is an Italian Magazine which report the
    	ROLAND GENERAL CATALOGUE 1989.
    
    	This Magazine is "TUTTOSTRUMENTI" , supplement on
    	"FAREMUSICA N.98", MAY 1989.
    
    	If you are interested, and your Italian is fluenty ( Hi! )
    	I can send a photocopies to you ( Via internal Mail, I think..).
    
    	Or, if you are interested to a (some) product(s), I can
    	take to you a translation of article(s).
    
    	Ciao.
    Gianmario
     

>    OK, STEWART ( I' dont know your name ...)
    
	My first name is John.  I suppose this is the kind of information
	NOTES' personal names were intended to provide...

>    	If you are interested, and your Italian is fluenty ( Hi! )
>    	I can send a photocopies to you ( Via internal Mail, I think..).
    
>    	Or, if you are interested to a (some) product(s), I can
>    	take to you a translation of article(s).
    
	Thanks for the offer, Gianmario.  Maybe you could summarize the
	good stuff and post it here for the benefit of all?