Conference napalm::commusic_v1

    1. You will probably not find the drum machine useful as a sequencer
    even for bass lines.  The programming interface will be bizarre,
    at best; you will have to know (or specify) the mapping from drum
    voices (e.g., snare, kick, low tom, hihat, etc.) to note numbers,
    and program the bass line in terms of those voices.  Almost all
    drum machines use a "pattern/song" sequencing model, so the limitation
    on number of notes will be dependent on:
    
    	the number of patterns available
    
    	the maximum song length
    
    	the disposition of patterns within the song
    
    	etc.
    
    Given the typical resources provided by most modern drum machine
    sequencers, I doubt you will have to worry about this as a limitation,
    unless you intend to program really off the wall bass parts.
    Note that you will probably *not* be able to use the sequencer to
    play both drums and bass at the same time.  Note that you will also
    be limited in all likelihood to a single note duration; you will
    most likely *not* be able to play notes longer than the step resolution
    of the drum machine.
    
    2. All three machines can be controlled from any MIDI keyboard.
    
    3. The Kawai is not unique in being able to receive and respond
    to MIDI velocity.  All three machines are so capable.  You should
    check to see whether, for example, the last velocity received controls
    *all* voices, or just the one corresponding to the note number in
    the MIDI message containing the velocity.  All the drum machines
    will send velocity as well, but you are unlikely to be able to
    program more than a few different velocities from the drum machine's
    programming interface, corresponding to a few "accent" levels. 
    The sequencer and programming interface in most drum machines has
    been tailored quite specifically for drum parts, and is not generally
    applicable without some limitations and pain.
    
    4. Most drum machines allow storage of additional patterns and songs
    and sometimes additional sounds via cartridges or memory cards.
    I don't know the details with respect to the specific machines you
    mention.
    
    
    In my opinion, you are choosing a drum machine for the wrong reasons.
    If you want a sequencer, get a sequencer.  Drum machines are not
    very good as general purpose sequencers.  They are meant to be used
    as, uhm, drum machines.  Get one that sounds good to you.
    
    len.
        

    I own a Kawai R-50 and am very pleased with it.  I listened to the
    Roland and the Alesis HR-16 among other candidates and went with
    the Kawai for reasons which are laid out in the R-50 note (103?).
    I have not heard the 3rd machine you mention, but on the basis of
    personal experience would heartily recommend the R-50.
    
    On your questions:
    1) I have not used my R-50 as a sequencer and don't know if you
    can.  I have a PC based sequencer and use the R-50 basically as
    a rhythym machine.
    
    2) Yes, I do play my R-50 through MIDI from sequences if I have
    all of my MIDI channels set up correctly.  This can also be done
    interactively (real-time) in addition to as part of a sequence.
    
    3) I know that the R-50 will respond to VELOCITY when "slaved" to
    my K-5 keyboard, but I have never tried it as part of a sequence.
    It seems like it should be able to, though.
    
    4) The R-50 has two additional chips which sell for about $130 US.
    One includes various rock and fusion sounds (ATOMIC SNARES, TOMS
    and KICK, ORCHESTRAL HITS, FINGER SNAPS and THUMB BASS).  I have
    heard this one and like it and I believe it is the chip used in
    the R-50e.  The second includes jazz sounds and I have not heard 
    this one.  There is a device from DRUMWARE which will supposedly
    allow one to mount all three chips in a R-50 and switch between
    the three from an external lever.  Unfortunately, this brings the
    total price of the machine from a reasonable $400.00 or so to about
    $800.00 US, once you have all the chips and switching involved.
     
    Hope that helps,
    Bill

    
    Thanks for the comments Len . I'm not buying the drum machine 
    primarily as a sequencer .I need a drum machine first and thought 
    that being as I don't have a sequencer that if I got one that 
    could fill the roll as sequencer as well (however primitivly) 
    then that would sway my choice as to which machine I might get. 
    My note probably doesn't show my priorities in that respect.
    
    I really am very naive when it comes to drumming (or music in 
    general for that matter) .You know how it is when your first
    learning about something and the danger is you pick up things
    the wrong way and you get whole concepts wrong .Maybe you could 
    explain a couple of things to me Len ..
    Can you explain to me the relationships between the tempo of a 
    song in beats per minute and the timing in 4/4 time etc.
    I don't understand how it all fits together (probably something
    to do with not reading music).
    What does a drummer mean when he talks about 4/4 and triplets and
    sixteenths and stuff.
    What is a pattern in regard to drum machine lingo.
    It's very hard to compare drum machine specs when you don't 
    understand patterns and stuff and there arn't any books available
    (well not in the wilderness in Ireland anyway).
     I've loads more questions but it's going home time here ..
    
    Thanx..
    steve
    What does a drummer mean when he says sixteenths or triplets etc.
    
     
    
    What is a pattern as regards drum machine language ? 
    
    
    

    I'll answer your basic questions here and send you a copy of my
    "Drums and Drumming for the Musically Literate NonDrummer", which
    is extracted from note 103 of DREGS::MUSICV2.
    
    A pattern is, well, a pattern of drum sounds that occurs in a song.
    Usually a pattern corresponds to a bar of music, although patterns
    may sometimes be shorter or longer than a bar.  For example,
    a song might consist of:
    
    	intro
    
    	verse 1
        
    	verse 2
    
    	chorus
    
    	bridge
    
    	verse 3
    
    	chorus
    
    	chorus [fade out]
    
    Typically, the drum parts for each of the verses will be very similar,
    and the drum parts for each of the choruses will be very similar,
    though possibly different from the verses.  The intro and bridge
    may be different, too.  Suppose each verse is 12 bars long; each
    of these 12 bars will be very similar, in fact most of them will
    be the same, except for fills, probably in the last bar.  So, each
    bar of the verse, except the last, is the same *pattern*.  Suppose
    we call that pattern "1".  Suppose we use a different fill for each
    instance of a verse.  Then in terms of patterns, the verses look
    like:
    
    	verse 1		1 1 1 1   1 1 1 1   1 1 1 2
    
    	verse 2		1 1 1 1   1 1 1 1   1 1 1 3
    
    	verse 3		1 1 1 1   1 1 1 1   1 1 1 4
    
    where 2, 3 and 4 represent the patterns with the different fills
    in them.
    
    Now, suppose the choruses are 8 bars, and exhibit the same behaviour;
    then they might look like
    
    	chorus (1)	5 5 5 5   5 5 5 6
    
    	chorus (2)      5 5 5 5   5 5 5 7
    
    where 5 is the pattern common to all choruses, and 6 and 7 are the
    patterns with the different fills for the end of the chorus.
    
    Now suppose the bridge is 12 bars long, but the drums play a pattern
    two bars long, again with a (predictable) fill at the end.  The
    bridge would then look like this:
    
    	bridge		8 9 8 9   8 9 8 9   8 9 8 10
    
    We need the intro; assume it's 8 bars long and has its own fill at
    the end:
    
    	intro		11 11 11 11   11 11 11 12
    
    Finally we need the [fade out] chorus for the very end; it might
    have more frequent fills:
    
    	chorus [fade]    5  5  5 13    5  5  5 14
    
    So, all together, we've got 12 patterns, used various times by the
    80 bars of the song, thus:
    
    	intro		11 11 11 11   11 11 11 12
    
    	verse 1		 1  1  1  1    1  1  1  1    1  1  1  2
    
    	verse 2		 1  1  1  1    1  1  1  1    1  1  1  3
    
    	chorus (1)	 5  5  5  5    5  5  5  6
    
    	bridge		 8  9  8  9    8  9  8  9    8  9  8 10
    
    	verse 3		 1  1  1  1    1  1  1  1    1  1  1  4
    	
    	chorus (2)       5  5  5  5    5  5  5  7
    
    	chorus [fade]    5  5  5 13    5  5  5 14
    
    Now, not all songs will have this structure, but this is just an
    example of how patterns are used, bar by bar, to build up the drum
    part to a song.  These patterns (1 - 14) might differ in the drum
    voices used, the rhythmic pattern, the placement of accents, etc.
    
    I've got to run.  If somebody else hasn't answered the rest of your
    questions, I'll try to get to them later.
    
    len.
    	

Think of the sequencer as a machine which causes sounds to start and stop
at specific times. These sound events could be called "note on" or "note off"
events (in MIDI). The choice of which sound occurs is usually related to the
drum machine "pad" (button) to which it is assigned, and the MIDI note number.
How loud the sound is relates to the velocity factor (how hard it was hit on
a real drum). The decay factor determines how long the sound persists before
it dies out. The tuning of the instrument relates to pitch.

Most of the drum machines have a "high resolution" mode which provides
96 ticks per beat or 384 beats per measure (bar) in 4/4 time.

The time signature:

4  the top 4 means four counts (beats) per measure
/
4  the bottom 4 is the fractional part which means that a quarter note = 1 beat

Most common time signatures are 2/4  3/4  4/4  6/8. Their are many others used
in all styles of music.

You can place a drum "event" on a clock "tick". The quantization or resolution
that you select determines how many ticks per beat are available for drum
events. Think of a drum event as one hit of the snare, one kick on the bass
drum, etc. Flams are very fast repeated hits on the same drum, such as the Toms.
A fill usually involves playing on several of the drum or percussion
instruments that don't occur regularly during a verse, or at least varying the
pattern. Tempo is the overall speed of the song (how fast the clock ticks). The
measure is divided into fractional parts. The different types of notes
represent these fractional quantities. Notes can be "tied" together to form
combinations (like adding fractions) which are not available by a single note.
A triplet is a way of "squeezing" 3 notes (or drum events) into the time usually
alloted to 2 notes.

The sequencer in the drum machine is synchronized to a clock, either internal
to the drum machine, or external to MIDI or tape sync.

The clock: 384 ticks per measure (some machines have only 192 ticks)

|----------------------------- 1 measure -------------------------------------|
BEAT 1		    BEAT 2		BEAT 3		    BEAT 4
96 ticks	    96 ticks	        96 ticks	    96 ticks
1/4 note            1/4 note            1/4 note	    1/4 note
1/8 note  1/8       1/8       1/8       1/8       1/8       1/8        1/8
1/16 1/16 1/16 1/16 1/16 1/16 1/16 1/16 1/16 1/16 1/16 1/16 1/16 1/16 1/16 1/16
32 1/32 notes
64 64th notes
etc.

quarter notes are 96 ticks long
8th     notes are 48 ticks long
16th    notes are 24 ticks long
32nd    notes are 12 ticks long
64th    notes are  6 ticks long

8th  note triplets are 32 ticks long per note
16th note triplets are 16 ticks long per note
32nd note triplets are  8 ticks long per note

If you "dot" a note, you add one half of its value to the note.

dotted quarter note = 96 ticks + 48 ticks = 144 ticks

This is the same as tying a quarter note to an eigth note, although it
appears different on the music.

dave

    Tempos:  
    	
    		Sometimes you'll see the sheet music has a quarter
    	note (filled oval with a flagpole, but no flag), an equals
    	sign, and an integer (like 104).
    
    		This means that there are that many quarter-note times per
    	minute.  If the integer was "104", that would be 104 quarter
    	notes per minute (or as is sometimes said, 104 BEATS per minute)
    	120 beats per minute is 2 beats per second (pretty quick!).
                 
    		Drum machines and sequencers often read tempo out 
    	directly in beats per minute. 

    Actually, 120 bpm is a medium rock tempo.  80 bpm is a slow dance
    tempo, and 160 is really cooking.  Some referents (from the good
    old days): Roy Orbison's "Oh Pretty Woman" is around 125 bpm,
    most 12/8 feel "redundant piano triplets" (thanks, Mr. Zappa)
    ballads are about 80 bpm (with triplets in 4/4), and Danny and the
    Juniors' "At The Hop" is about 160 bpm.
        
    The highest tempo (beware, it can depend on how you count) I've
    ever run into was some Van Halen (Dave era) tune that checked in
    at 220 bpm.
    
    len.