Conference napalm::commusic_v1

	I've looked into it a little, I would like to make my Poly-61 Midi'd.
  As far as I've seen, some places will do it for me for around $200.00.
  Then there was one place, (either E.U. Wurlitzer Framingham, Ma. or
  Union Music, Worcester, Ma.  I can't remember) where someone mentioned
  a "kit" I could buy for around $100.00 that I could do myself.  I'll have
  to check again.

-Tom

EUW mentioned the Korg Poly-61 kit to me too for around $100. However,
installing it involves drilling holes in the cabinet. This is not for me.
I didn't bother converting because I only use the Korg now for one string
patch that I haven't been able to duplicate on my Roland Super Jupiter.

BTW, if any of you Poly-61 owners want to trade patches with me, send mail.
I have some truly excellent strings. Also, a solo violin that fools most
people when backed up by orchestra or piano.

	Drilling holes wouldn't bother me in the least, I've done worse
  sabatoge to better things.  Besides, I'm not really using it now as it
  is, this would give me some more use for it.  Actually, trading patches
  as you mentioned would probably give me more incentive too, I could use
  some good strings.  But I have one question...  How would you trade a patch
  without MIDI, just copy down all the parameters ?   While were on the
  subject, does MIDI allow you to exchange patches ?

-Tom

RE: .-1

MIDI will allow you to dump all the parameters for a specific patch,
provided of course, that the manufacturer built in a system exclusive
message to do so.  If a synth has 64 patches, you will have to send
64 requests for data dumps to the synth to read all the patches out
of it.

Obviously, before MIDI-ing a non-MIDI synth, you should use the tape
interface on it to save the current patches, performing the upgrade
could cause the synth to wipe out it's own memory.  After the upgrade,
you would reload the patches from tape, and then you could dump them
through MIDI to a computer disk.

-Dave

Trading patches via tape seems to me the only standard way. Although MIDI
allows the transmission of patches, how they are stored on disk is up to
the computer. I don't have a computer patch program for my Korg, let alone
one that can read patches off any old disk from any old software.

Ted

Also, typing the numbers in a mail message isn't bad for a few patches.
The Korg doesn't have that many parameters. The Roland Super Jupiter is
a different matter. A single patch has from 60 to 100 parametes, depending
on how complex it is.

Ted

What's the Poly 61 architecture look like?  Would it be worth creating a note
summarizing the parameters of the various synths collectively owned by the
Computer Music notes community?  I'm interested in adapting Poly 61 patches to
my Poly 800.  Ted - I've got an MKS-80 too - does the fact the you have
5 (!) MC-64s mean you have a zillion (well, 5 * 128 is a lot) of you rown
MKS-80 patches?  I'm just starting to explore the possibilities of mine,
so I havne't got much to swap, yet.

len.

Poly 61 parameters (from memory so correct me if wrong)

Oscillator #1 (VCO1):

    Range:		16, 8, 4 in feet (pipe organ terminology, gak)
    Waveform:		triangle, pulse, pulse with LFO modulated width
    Pulse Width Mod:	0 to 7

Oscillator #2 (VCO2):

    Range:		16, 8, 4
    Waveform:		off, triangle, square
    Interval:		minor third, major third, fourth, fifth (from VCO 1)
    Detune:		0 to 15

Filter (VCF):

    Cutoff:		0 to 63
    Resonance:		0 to 15
    Envelope follow:	0 to 7 (?)
    Key Follow:		off or on

Envelope:

    Attack:		0 to 15
    Decay:		0 to 15
    Sustain:		0 to 15
    Release:		0 to 15

Low Freq. Oscillator (LFO):

    Frequency:		0 to 63
    Delay:		0 to 7
    VCO Modulation:	0 to 7
    VCF Modulation:	0 to 7	


No, I don't have 5*128 patches. One of the RAM cartridges I use for my
Roland TR-909 drum machine. I have one cartridge for classical patches,
one for jazz, and one for rock. The fifth cartridge has the 128 patches that
came with the MKS-80. There is some crossover between my cartridges (like my
pianos are on all three). I have made about 100 patches myself. You might say
I'm fond of overkill.

Ted

The Poly-800 looks a lot like an updated/slightly modified Poly-61.  Soon as
I get a chance, I will create a new note for synth architectures and post
replies for th eones I know about - Poly-800, CZ-101, Juno-106, Chroma
Polaris and SuperJupiter.  If other folks with other synths take the time to
post what they know, we'll have a nice library of synth specs for reference
purposes.  Incidentally, Keyboard magazine has started publishing patches;
the latest issue features patches for Poly-800, CZ-101 and DX-7.

Anybody ever bought patches through the mail?  Was it worth it?

len.

I bought some DX-7 patches through the mail.  They were pretty
expensive, but sounded good.  Since then I got a large number
of DX-7 patches along with my two TX-7s, so I now have more
than I know what to do with.
    John Sauter

Re .10 - which of the many purveyors of patches did you get them from?
I'm wary od sending off a check to some yoyo in a garage who knows less
about synthesis than I do but has more chutzpah.

len.

re: .11-The patches I bought were from Bo Tomlin's company.
I met him at a demo in Nashua, so I respect his ability.
    John Sauter

    This seemed the appropriate note to place this query under.  Recently
    picked up a used Yamaha CP-30 in great condition at a good price.
    
    What are my chances someday of converting this baby to issue midi-out?
    (At least the key up/down events, maybe velocity too.)  Ever hear of a
    company offering such a kit?  How about hints where I could get
    schematics for the unit?  
    
    thanks to all,
    michael hyde

    >>>                    -< Yamaha CP-30 midi upgrade? >-
    
    I don't know exactly what a CP-30 is but I have a Yamaha PF-15 fitted
    up with the Forte Music MIDI-mod.  With installation it cost about
    400-500$US.  Expensive but has worked without any problem for a number
    of years.  It gives velocity on and lets you do a simple split (into 2
    adjacent MIDI channels).  It also added a MIDI IN to let me drive the
    (lame) piano sounds from another MIDI controller like a sequencer.
    
    Forte makes MIDI-Mods for lots of things.  Maybe they make one for the
    CP-30.
    
    If you can find the notes about Yamaha PF15 from a year or 3 ago, there
    is more information.  If Forte doesn't still advertise in the usual
    magazines (or isn't listed in the manufacturer's topic), I could dig
    out the address that was valid when I got the PF15 upgrade.
    
    Hope this helps...
    
    - John -

I don't know what a CP-30 is like or how it compares to a CP60M, but Sam Ash has
been selling the CP60M (Electric Piano with MIDI out) for $499.95 plus shipping.
(I don't know if they have any left.)  Is it really worthwhile to spend that 
much to add MIDI to the CP-30?


								John

    I used to have a CP30 (my first electronic instrument).  I *loved* the
    touch of the thing; it's probably the best feel of any "unreal" piano
    I've ever played.

    (For those unfamiliar with the CP30, it was Yamaha's 1st offering in the
    eletric piano world - a stereo box with 4 different tones per channel
    that could be combined in a variety of different ways, detuned, vibrato
    mods, etc.  A very nice box, and much more flexible than the Rhodes
    (but without the "classic" Rhodes sound).  I bought one of the 1st 500
    made back in 1977.)

    At one point I checked into a MIDImod for the CP30, because I liked its
    feel so much. Forte was the only company that made any retrofits at the
    time, but they did not make any for the CP30; in fact, no one has made
    a mod specifically for the CP30.  According to Forte, you would have to
    install the mod for a real piano (costing mucho bux - like $1k!). After
    much vacillation, I opted to sell mine instead {sniff}.

    Basically, you're out of luck unless you want to spend a ridiculous
    amount of money.  Sorry for the slow response.

-b

    Forgot to add - the reason no one made the mod is because the keyboard
    was "pre-digital", according to Forte (meaning there was no common buss
    for note-on/off/velocity paths, presumably).  Later pianos (like the PF
    series) had a single tap-in point where Forte got controller info from.
    The CP series wasnt't quite that nice. 

    If you're interested, there's a guy in Toledo named Ned Ludlum (Toledo
    Music Service) who used to service these things - in fact, he and
    another guy wired a PolyMoog into the same chassis as the piano. Quite
    a mess of wires - don't know if he's still down there or not, but he
    would have the schematics and what not.  He was a *great* guy to deal
    with. 

-b