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Conference kaosws::canada

Title:True North Strong & Free
Notice:Introduction in Note 535, For Sale/Wanted in 524
Moderator:POLAR::RICHARDSON
Created:Fri Jun 19 1987
Last Modified:Fri Jun 06 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:1040
Total number of notes:13668

542.0. "Toronto Vs. Ottawa" by BRADOR::HATASHITA (Hard Wear Engineer) Fri Jan 10 1992 21:25

    Here I am.  It's been three years since I moved to Ottawa from Toronto
    and I still miss T.O.  
    
    When I first moved here all I could think of was that I had moved
    from the centre of the country to some boondoggle, backwater, hicktown
    of a giant beaurocrat-ridden dinge hole.  I like it a little better
    now.
    
    This is why, in my mind, Ottawa just doesn't cut it:
    
     	1) The downtown curls up and goes comatose on the weekend.
    	2) The dance bars play country and disco rag music.
    	3) The closest thing to culture in this town is the goop growing
    	   under my shower mat.
    
    In comparison to Toronto, Ottawa is "The City That Fun Forgot".
    
    On the other hand; I went back to Toronto and discovered that:
    
    	1) Sitting in traffic is still a drag.  Even when you know all
    	   the shortcuts.
    	2) There are more destitute people on the streets than there
    	   are politicians in Ottawa.
    	3) I still dislike yuppies who wear expensive shoes in the snow.
    
    What do you think?
    
    Kris
T.RTitleUserPersonal
Name
DateLines
542.1Ottawa has it!COVERT::COVERTJohn R. CovertSat Jan 11 1992 02:491
Where can you ice skate outdoors for several miles in Toronto?
542.2Toronto has it, tooBRADOR::HATASHITAHard Wear EngineerSat Jan 11 1992 15:574
    Take your skates to Nathan Phillips Square and go around the rink
    about 600 times.
    
    Kris
542.3Nathan Phillips don't cut it!TROOA::MSCHNEIDERvi.... the editor from hell!Sun Jan 12 1992 11:017
    Ottawa is a certainly beautiful to look at thanks to the NCC and all my
    tax dollars.  Of course its entire reason for being is to house our
    federal politicians in isolation from the rest of the world.
    
    re. -.2  Skating the canals is fabulous ain't it!  Did that last
    February and it made me love Ottawa in the winter, despite the cold and
    snow.
542.4POLAR::RICHARDSONSick in a balanced sort of wayMon Jan 13 1992 09:267
    Re. Kris

    If you're expecting to find culture in bars and dance clubs.... stick
    to yogurt! If it's night life you want, go across the river. Just don't
    do it under the affluence of incohol.

    Glenn
542.5KAOFS::S_BROOKMon Jan 13 1992 12:1218
    To live in Toronto, you have to be a millionaire, or live out in the
    sticks.  To take advantage of Toronto's "cultural centres" (concert
    halls etc. downtown) you can't live out in the sticks.  So what it
    boils down to is for Mr Joe Average (married with family), he cannot
    really regularly enjoy those advantages of Toronto.
    
    It takes 30 minutes to go from Kanata to Orleans.  It takes 30 minutes
    to go from the 401 & Yonge to Pickering in the middle of the night,
    any other time it's 3/4 hour minimum.  Toronto is close to a nightmare.
    
    Toronto has more destitutes, more drugs, more violence .....
    
    Toronto is a great place to visit, but I wouldn't want to live there
    again.
    
    Stuart who spent 4 years in Toronto and was more than happy to return
            to Ottawa!
    
542.6KAOFS::S_BROOKMon Jan 13 1992 15:4617
    Moved by moderator ...
    
================================================================================
Note 543.0                  Toronto vs Ottawa...Yawn!                 No replies
BRADOR::DAVY                                         10 lines  13-JAN-1992 12:51
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Hey Kris,
    
    Speaking of Toronto vs Ottawa. Just imagine! When the Ottawa Senators
    begin their NHL season and the play Toronto and win......you'll have
    one more thing to complain about...............
    
    Yawn.......!
    
    
    Bruce D.
    
542.7I'll take Ottawa...KUTIPS::LACAILLEHalf-filled bottles of inspirationMon Jan 13 1992 18:1016
	I do not like big cities...period.

	I grew up in Montreal, which I find much more fun to visit
	but that not under discussion here, is it.

	I almost had to move to Toronto, but one trip scared me off
	for good. Occasionally, I get sent there for a course, and
	am always happy to get out of there.

	Ottawa itself, is not where I would live, but the nice thing
	is, I live in the country and can get to anywhere in the
	cities of Ottawa, Nepean, Orleans or Gloucester within an
	hour. As well, I bought a house and can still afford to live!

	Charlie
542.8Works for me!OTOU01::BUCKLANDQuality is not a problemTue Jan 14 1992 11:2517
542.9BRADOR::HATASHITAHard Wear EngineerTue Jan 14 1992 13:2723
>    I don't know what you define as culture but I find the ballet and opera
>    at the NAC really enjoyable.
    
    Me too, Bob.  But that's all there is.  The NAC.  Maybe the Ottawa
    Little Theatre.  The choice is too slim. 

>    Then there's the museums, the market, Hull ...
    
    Culture in Hull?  There are sights in Hull (boy are there sights) but I
    can't call the Museum of Civilization cultural.  :-)
    
    I think that the cost of living in Toronto is an urban myth.  I find
    the cost of living in Ottawa to be higher.  Gas prices, clothes prices,
    grocery prices are all higher in Ottawa.  As far as living downtown: I
    rented a very large, beautiful old duplex within five minutes of Yonge
    Street for less than I'm paying for a smaller (about 2/3 the size)
    duplex  in the Glebe (downtown Ottawa).  And I'm told that rent has
    come down in Toronto since I was there.
    
    On the other hand, I needed a lock, deadbolt, and alarm system in
    Toronto.  I get by with less here.
    
    Kris 
542.10KAOFS::S_BROOKTue Jan 14 1992 15:1730
    For a family, unless you've got double income, you cannot rent or
    buy in downtown anywhere (except maybe Carleton Place!).  You've
    got to live out in the 'burbs.  And for that, Toronto is a darned
    sight more expensive, unless you want to live in Barrie, Guelph
    or Oshawa, and then you face mammoth commuting bills, and then
    getting to things "cultural" is as long as getting to work!
    
    You've also got to properly compare apples with apples and not
    apples with crab apples if you are going to compare prices for
    accomodation.  Find a place like the Glebe in downtown Toronto
    (for safety as well as style and so on) and then compare prices.
    
    Food and gas are more expensive in Ottawa ... no doubt, but you
    can afford to insure a car here ... and companies will insure you
    here.  I was told last year, that in spite of 1 clear years
    driving and no tickets in that time, that were I to move to
    Toronto and look for insurance ... a) I'd be lucky to find a
    company willing and b) I'd be paying almost double what I am
    paying in Ottawa.  Home and contents insurance is also significantly
    higher in Toronto.
    
    Most people commute far less in Ottawa, so their travel costs work
    out lower in spite of higher gas prices, and we spend far less time
    sitting in traffic jams wasting time and gas.
    
    Over all the cost of living for a family is probably lower here.
    
    Stuart
    
    
542.11BRADOR::HATASHITAHard Wear EngineerWed Jan 15 1992 01:2111
    My car insurance went up when I moved from Toronto to Ottawa.  It was
    an unpleasant surprise.  It only went up by about $20/year though.
    
    The place I rented in Toronto was in the Annex.  The place was nicer
    but the neighbourhood wasn't.  I figured that should cancel out.
    
    I dunno.  I've spoke to other displaced Torontonians and they say the
    same thing about cost of living being higher in Ottawa.  But you're
    right about the traffic.
    
    Kris
542.12re: Higher insurance ratesKUTIPS::LACAILLEHalf-filled bottles of inspirationWed Jan 15 1992 14:0713
	Kris,

	Either - 1. you are getting shafted, or 2. The insurance company
	found out about a traffic violation when you changed addresses.

	Toronto is notorious for having higher insurance premiums as
	compared to Ottawa.

	Charlie

	ps Could be that you weren't driving to work in Toronto and
	you are here??
542.13SIOG::EGRIWed Jan 15 1992 14:327
    I'm a Montrealer living in Dublin, Ireland. Could any of you supply
    some numbers when speaking of things like rent or gas/petrol prices or
    car insurance so I can put everything in its proper perspective?
    
    Ta very much!
    
    Ted.
542.14Some dollars and senseKAOFS::S_BROOKWed Jan 15 1992 15:3112
    		Ottawa		Toronto
    
    Gas		48		58		cents per litre
    
    Car Ins.	400		600		$ per annum
    
    House Ins.	250		325		$ per annum
    
    Avg. House	160000		240000		$ average house in area
    						  (purchase price)
    
    
542.15OTOU01::BUCKLANDQuality is not a problemWed Jan 15 1992 16:066
    re: .-1
    
    Think you've got the gas prices a-about-f unless you know somewher I
    don't.  ;-)
    
    Bob
542.16Oh, Canada, we pay our tax to thee...KAOOA::HASIBEDERTrekkie DECieWed Jan 15 1992 17:1016
542.17$1.09/USgallonCOVERT::COVERTJohn R. CovertWed Jan 15 1992 17:302
Hehehehe...  I paid 28.7 cents (ok 32.8 CDN) per liter for my last fillup
down here in no-tax land.
542.18H0H 0H0!POLAR::RICHARDSONSick in a balanced sort of wayWed Jan 15 1992 20:528
    Well, up here the taxes are worth it! Our Prime Minister doesn't barf on
    planet wide television, and you don't have the Grand Canal!

    Live Free and get taxed to death!

    I am a jelly doughnut!
    
    Glenn
542.19KAOFS::S_BROOKWed Jan 15 1992 21:0514
    re .15
    
    You are indeed correct ... the gas prices are head about face.
    
    What is so very galling is the fact that in the Valley (i.e.
    Carleton Place etc.) gas is about 52.9 and is consistently lower
    than Ottawa, while the oil companies say that our costs are
    higher than Toronto because of transportation costs ... hahahaha
    Gas is shipped bulk to Ottawa and then distributed through the
    Valley and they pay LESS than we do ??????  And worse is that the
    Ontario and Federal beauracrats believe this codswallop!!!!
    
    Stuart
    
542.20Competition from more smaller stations does itCOVERT::COVERTJohn R. CovertThu Jan 16 1992 10:592
Gas is cheap (US$0.99/USgallon) in Anchorage, but expensive (US$1.59/USgallon)
in Valdez, right next to the oil terminal.