| T.R | Title | User | Personal
Name | Date | Lines |
|---|
| 8514.1 | | HYDRA::SCHAFER | Mark Schafer, SPE MRO | Thu Jan 23 1997 14:51 | 3 |
| 8514.2 | | DECCXL::MARIO | | Thu Jan 23 1997 20:44 | 17 |
| 8514.3 | | GERUND::WOLFE | I'm going to huff, and puff, and blow your house down | Fri Jan 24 1997 16:18 | 9 |
| It appears to be *all* public conferences. I used the web page
to search for Wolfe and it turned up just about every notes
conference I've ever been in (i.e. just like Jeff Michaud's
"find all the notes you ever write" web thingy).
I used the http://cosmo.tay.dec.com:82 URL but I believe
this is the same thing a franchised partner would see. Pretty scary.
Pete
|
| 8514.4 | | DECCXL::MARIO | | Fri Jan 24 1997 19:55 | 329 |
| These are the notesfiles visible from http://cosmo.tay.dec.com:82
alpha_osf_ift
pwdoswinv5
pwdos4
digital_unix
old_ultrix
windows_office
postscript_printing
decstation
ask_ssag
ucx
decpci_v2
alphanotes_v1
decwindows
motif
windows-nt
ultrix
internet_tools
old_decwrite
pwv50ift
decnet-osi_for_vms
hub_mgnt
snagwy
decpci_v3
vmsnotes_v10
excursion
comp_os_vxworks
connection
mswindows
c_plus_plus
comp_realtime
rdb_60
nt-developers
vms-for-mac
vmsnotes
ibmpc-93
decnsr
ibmpc_shareware
linkworks
sable
windows95
ibmpc-92
all-in-1_v24
all-in-1
decnis
ibmpc-94
europc
dec_fortran_alpha
mailbus
mailbus_400
dce-products
decc
decpc_portables
magtape
dnu_osi
vxt
terminal_servers
netview
infoserver
objectbroker_development
netware
ansi_printing
ibmpc-95
linkworks_v3
decforms
os2
decnetvax
decwrite
teamlinks_windows
vaxc
ada
mailworks-vms
alphastation
ase
visual_basic
sco_unix
pwosf
seal
cluster
microvax
sql_services
maconline
cma
pathworks_v5
decc_bugs
open3d
wps-plus
mailworks-unix
hsj40_product
msaccess
cda
fortran
ws_pc_solutions
turbolaser
fuse
ipmt
pwnt
advfs_support
decfax_vms
dec_fortran
multi_media
macintosh
odbc_rdb_driver
decc_alpha
dsm
alphanotes
calypso
decquery
x500
terminals
pwultrix
decterm
decplan
unix_printing
alpha_migration_tools
objectbroker
vms_posix
vtx_technical
decdesign
phigs
wfw
imaging
laser
pathworks_netware
mikasa
x25_osf
lsm
sns
old_fortran
multia
dec4wnt
atm
decladebug
common_brouters
pascal
hsz40_product
x
math
ultrix-beginners
osf
dce-program
marketing
optical
postmaster-v2
gateways
ultrix-mail
msg_solutions
ultrix_mls_plus
temip
ms-exchange
oracle_on_unix
system_census
pw95ift
jensen
cde
decdecision
rdb_50
image_services
bb
linux-users
vaxeln
wanrouter250
bookreader
decnet-vax_extensions
vuit
netrider
full_sail
ews
postscript
multimedia_services
old_decnet-ultrix
teamlinks_toolkit
ultrix_sql
macintosh_office
osi_appl_support
phasev
lnx_apo
dec_mls_plus
visual
dns
dec_pascal_bugs
cobol2
realtime
gnu
pc_multimedia
decpresent
smsat_shc
mailbus_v1
sun_users
deccxx
mipsco
lat
hpc
vaxnotes_bugs
decadvantage_support
osf1-port
isdn
kap-users
astronomy
cdrom
sw-raid
avs
gksnotes
sna_support
dtm
axppci
fortran-vax
cohesionworx
decevent
latmaster
mswindows_examples
poly-perf-sol-unix
mobilizer
ninja
dxml
vme
vxworks
accessworks
decsystems
dbintegrator_gateways
rtrnotes
hsd30_product
rdbaccess_rms
dw-mail
hsm-4-unix
dec3000
pc_program
java
content-retrieval
scanners
ultrix-disk-shadow
sco_support_europe
ultrix_tools
decdfs
hsd05_product
pwos2
perf-advisor-osf
cobra
x400mail
server_works
pwrks_wan
jensen_vms
decspin
decreport
triadd
decrti
banyan
mac_programming
ultrix_tuning
ultrix_crashes
arpa_internet
decnet-ultrix
modular
decnet_sco
multimedia_database
wgw
xdesktop
appletalk
apce
dec_rpc
kav30
mmtrain
x400-support-information
20-20_discussion
cbr
vaxdsm
decelx
benchmarking
upgrades
rdbaccess_oracle
f90_alpha_osf
decalc
osf_tuning
benchmark
decraid5_ift
adv_file_sys
ultrix_striping
decmate
tyee
vida_db2
languages
fax
x500_deploy
dectest_risc
neural-networks
dasl
mailbus_update
setld-ultrix-lps
termcap
decadvantage_general
internal-case-users
linden_tech
rdbstar_dec
ada_toolshed
pci64_pci164_plus
rad_jad
clones
x-terminals
xdps
ole_v2
oracle_for_dec
futurebus-plus
cscma_esd
sco-unix
dce-technical-consulting
decmessageq
intel_sco_options
xsite
iex
iez11
omg
srcnotes
alpha_examples
pagemaker
ai
uniface
dsm_for_ultrix
vaxeln_ada
all-in-1_documentation
i18n_standards
ultrixinfo
dsm11
graphics_examples
natural_language_computation
borges
|
| 8514.5 | | VAXCPU::michaud | Jeff Michaud - ObjectBroker | Fri Jan 24 1997 20:45 | 11 |
| > I used the http://cosmo.tay.dec.com:82 URL but I believe
> this is the same thing a franchised partner would see. Pretty scary.
This appears to really be another front end to COMET, whose
top-level home page is at http://comet.alf.dec.com/
Or you can get to it from:
http://vaxcpu.zko.dec.com:8080/other
which has pointers to it and other related search sites, including
mine which Pete was plugging for me :-).
|
| 8514.6 | can you please clarify what is/is not to go in notesfiles? | SMURF::BAT | Segui la tua beatitudine | Mon Jan 27 1997 14:09 | 51 |
| > A Franchised partner is one who does a significant amount of business with
> Digital and qualifies to see a level of product information, futures and
^^^^^^^ what level?
> technical details not available to Certified partners. Currently, the one
> source of information Franchised partners have access to that Certified
> partners don't is read-only access to Digital product-oriented notesfiles.
> This is an important point for all engineers or others responding in internal
> notesfiles to know - our Franchised partners now read those files so
> please keep that in mind when crafting your responses.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ keep what in mind?
I was discussing the implications of the above statements with
a colleague and we discovered that we had completely different
interpretations of what it meant.
I thought it was a request to "watch your language", that is,
to not use in-house slang, remarks, or abbreviations with which
privileged partners might not be familiar.
My colleague took it to mean that we should take care to filter out
discussions of product information that might affect business issues.
Knowing what precisely that filter is supposed to do is the
question. He felt that discussions of problems with the product,
i.e., product quality, would be taboo, as they might affect
business issues.
He also pointed out that any mention of a customer name or
identity in conjunction with a product problem (which we sometimes
do when it is helpful in discussing the problem), would also be taboo,
as that would enable one customer to learn about another's
business.
So which interpretation is correct? What exactly are
we supposed to "keep in mind" while crafting responses?
And what are we to do about all our "old" notes? In our
group we have some notesfiles that were at one time
"Digital Confidential" (restricted to need-to-know users
only) that have, since the product shipped, been downgraded
to "Digital Internal Use Only" (unlimited access to Digital
employees.
We are with this notice being told that they are now
again being downgraded to "Digital Internal and Franchise
Partner Use Only" -- are we to go back and remove all
arcane language, references to customers or what?
What sort of non-disclosure agreement have the Franchise
partners signed to which we are to be parties?
|
| 8514.7 | this approach is wrong | GERUND::WOLFE | I'm going to huff, and puff, and blow your house down | Mon Jan 27 1997 15:32 | 14 |
| After having seen the initial web page my perspective of what this
really is is very cynical. It seems like a cop-out way of providing support.
IOW, we do such a poor job of supporting third parties, ISV's, franchised
partners, whatever, that we have to resort to giving them direct access to our
internal notes conferences to relieve the support burden. All of a sudden
we are "empowering" them to support themselves. While this might seem
like a good idea on the surface I feel it's incredibly naive,
potentially damaging, and totally inappropriate in general.
There were more appropriate attempts in the past to do this sort of
thing (remember ISVnet?). I can see why those might have failed/or did fail.
I think a better solution would be work toward fixing an ISVnet style approach.
Pete
|
| 8514.8 | | QUARRY::neth | Craig Neth | Mon Jan 27 1997 16:10 | 45 |
| >While this might seem
>like a good idea on the surface I feel it's incredibly naive,
>potentially damaging, and totally inappropriate in general.
In particular, the amount of old, incorrect, and extraneous information
in the particular notes conferences means that any 'search' performed
will likely return contradictory or just plain wrong information. (And
'Search' is the only interface provided)
And on another thread, who picked these conferences? Many of them seem
completely inappropriate for publishing to external partners. For example,
there are conferences like "Windows" and "Windows95" included in the
directory. Who in Digital has authority to speak for these products?
Those conferences were created as informal, users-helping-users conferences,
not as support forums with engineers from the product monitoring and answering
questions. (Another good one is 'maconline', which solely consists of
descriptions of Macintosh freeware/shareware and pointers to the (internal
to Digital) archive that contains the copies of those files.)
>There were more appropriate attempts in the past to do this sort of
>thing (remember ISVnet?). I can see why those might have failed/or did fail.
I think ISVnet is still somewhat alive - the occasional note still shows up
in those conferences, but the volume has gone *way* down from the early days.
The other problem with this setup is that the real power of the notes
conferences to begin with was the ability to ask questions. That ability
is removed, so the only thing they can hope for is that somebody has asked
exactly the right question about the right stuff and that it was answered
(correctly).
*******************************************************************
FWIW, several of us have been asking these questions 'offline', and the answer
that keeps coming back internally is that what we can see from the inside is
different than what these partners can see. I have a Digital Business Link
account, but it refuses to let me into this area - it says my client is not
allowed access. Has anyone in here seen it from the www.partner.digital.com
side?
|
| 8514.9 | | GERUND::WOLFE | I'm going to huff, and puff, and blow your house down | Mon Jan 27 1997 18:37 | 8 |
| The "right" answer to a problem like this is something like
the Microsoft Knowledge Base system. A database front end to FAQ's, bugs,
etc. I believe we have a system like that inside Digital (TIMA?) but
as an internal use I've never seen it/used it. What is Digital's
equivalent to that? What's wrong with it that we would have to
resort to making these internal conferences accessible in this manner?
pete
|
| 8514.10 | contact for questions/issues w/this page | SMURF::TAPPAN | | Tue Jan 28 1997 20:22 | 10 |
| The person responsible for the web page is Joanne Falco. We've
requested that she provide answers to the questions raised in this
note. If you would like to contact her directly she is at:
DTN: 227-3475
Internet Address: FALCO@MAIL.DEC.COM
Title: WEB Site Manager
|
| 8514.11 | base note is incorrect | SMURF::TAPPAN | | Wed Jan 29 1997 19:52 | 14 |
| Jo Anne sent the following update.
Hi -
Sorry that I haven't replied to you earlier - I was out of town at a
conference. Will send you a longer message tomorrow with
more detail. But at this time, since you're getting hammered with
questions, the bottom line is:
no partner can read ANY DIGITAL NOTEs files.
We removed them from the external web site back in mid-December.
Jo Anne
|
| 8514.12 | additional info on partners access to notesfiles | SMURF::TAPPAN | | Wed Feb 19 1997 18:37 | 161 |
|
Sarah,
Thank you for your final posting, Note 8514.11 in the unix notesfile.
I'd like to take the opportunity to provide further information on the
use of NOTEs within the Technical Support Web site and would appreciate
it if you would post this updated reply in the file for me.
Thank you,
Jo Anne
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
NOTEs contributors,
Thank you for taking the time to contribute to the unix notesfile and
provide your comments and concerns in regards to the use and
availability of NOTEs to DIGITAL's franchised partner community.
There seems to be some confusion about what information is made
available, on what sites and to whom. My purpose here is to attempt to clarify
this for all readers. In doing so, I'll reference selected NOTEs in
this file.
I am not the correct person to respond to comments made about
the "right" or "best" way to provide customer support, so will not
address those concerns noted.
In reply to:
Note 8514.3
Partner interaction opportunities w/ Tech Support
GERUND::WOLFE
>I used the http://cosmo.tay.dec.com:82 URL but I believe
>this is the same thing a franchised partner would see. Pretty scary.
Note 8514.4
Partner interaction opportunities w/ Tech Support
DECCXL::MARIO
>These are the notesfiles visible from http://cosmo.tay.dec.com:82
Please allow me to clarify some urls:
http://cosmo.tay.dec.com:82
- is the SBU Technical Support Web site
- is an intranet site
- is an internal DIGITAL-only web site
- only internal users can access it
- no partner access is allowed
- no external users have access
- managed by the Technical Support Group
in TAY2-2
http://www.partner.digital.com
- is the Partner Support Web site
- hosts the below web site & others
external to DIGITAL's firewall
- is an internet site
- is an external-to-DIGITAL web site
- internal and external users can access it
- only partner access is allowed
- requires an individualized, by person,
partner password to access certain closed
areas
- managed by the DIGITAL Business Link
in MRO, no relationship to the
Technical Support Group whatsoever
http://www.partner.digital.com:9003
- is the url for the external Technical
Support Web site (it is the external
version of cosmo.tay.dec.com:82
- is not an exact copy of its internal url
(look at contacts, products, pricing, tools)
- is an internet site
- is an external-to-DIGITAL web site
- internal and external users can access it
- all users require a password
- externally, the only non-DIGITAL users
allowed are partners (not the world)
- is a closed area
- requires a partner password to access
- managed by the DIGITAL Business Link
in MRO
Given this, "non-DIGITAL employees" are not allowed into the
web area, http://cosmo.tay.dec.com:82. There is nothing scary here -
partners cannot access this area.
As to NOTEs themselves.
The decision to release a certain subset of DIGITAL NOTEs files only to
our 5 Franchise partners was made in Q1 FY97 (mid calendar year 1996).
They were to be made available via the external DIGITAL Business
Link url (:9003) and are accessible only by a unique, by individual,
partner password (i.e., not a common group p/w). The rest of
the external world cannot access these files.
The process and content for releasing the NOTEs files was reviewed
according to Corporate Security and Internet policies, reviewed by
the Security organization and the Internet Program Office and approved
by [more than] the required Vice Presidents (2) [only 1 is required]
and the Legal department. Additionally, each Franchised partner
signed a newly-created Corporate non-disclosure agreement, specifically
tailored for web site access to the external technical support web
site available
However, due to some additional non-disclosure concerns which later
surfaced (December 1996) about companies named in the NOTEs files, ALL
NOTEs files were removed entirely from the external Technical
Support Web site (:9003) in December 1996. They are still available,
of course, to internal employees on the internal url of this site,
http://cosmo.tay.dec.com:82
Therefore, currently, no user (internal or external) can access
any NOTEs files from outside of the firewall, using the DIGITAL
Business Link (DBL) url of http://www.partner.digital.com
We cannot speak to the "other web sites on the DIGITAL intranet"
[internet] which are available via http://www.partner.digital.com
Please contact Carol McGrath in MRO with reservations about information
on this DIGITAL Business Link web site. We can speak, however, about the
other web sites available via the Technical Support Web site's
two urls:
internal url (cosmo:82)
- links are made both to internal and external
DIGITAL sites
external url (:9003)
- links are made ONLY to external DIGITAL sites
- this external site does not point to any
internal-only DIGITAL web sites (i.e.,
das@dec.com, zko@dec.com, pko@dec.com)
I hope that this helps to clarify the differences among the
urls rom which a user can glean technical support information
and possible access DIGITAL's NOTEs files.
Please feel free to follow up with us at any time with comments
and concerns you may have and again, thank you for voicing your
feedback.
Regards,
send comments to ---> webmaster@cosmo.tay.dec.com
|