Conference hydra::dejavu

    I used one on a semi-medical problem.  It helped _some_, but it
    didn't do the job by itself.
    
    One word of caution: you should always look for a copy of whatever
    message is being subliminally delivered.  If the message content
    isn't supplied, I wouldn't touch the tape with a ten-foot pole.
    
    Steve Kallis, Jr.
    

    RE: .0
    
    I have seen no evidence that such tapes work whatsoever.  I can't
    even see how they work in *theory!*  It's something akin to using
    a conventional mike to detect ultrasound.  "Subliminal suggestion"
    is just so much marketing hooey.
    
    
    John M.

         On the other hand, John, they may work in ways which
    you will not allow yourself to accept.  It is fairly clear to
    me that you do not believe in much beyond the conscious
    mind (except unconscious, while sleeping, for example, or
    dead, no conscious!)  So that limits the potentials for you
    in your reality.  I believe that since there are many, many levels
    of reality (in mine, at least) that it is entirely probable that
    subliminal messages do work.  I further believe that they don't
    work as well as working with the conscious mind.  I think that
    focus has much to do with it.  In other words, there isn't a great
    deal of focus on the subliminal if you are involved in a myriad
    of activities.  If you are intensely, consciously focused on something,
    then I believe the subliminal has a more difficult time "penetrating."
    I think that the best method to change the sub-conscious mind is
    doing it consciously, not sub-liminally.  (One way is via mediatation.)
    So, for me it's a YES, it works.  But I would add that there are
    probably better methods.
     
    Frederick
    

    HI.
         I can't really substantiate this without some research, but
    I've heard and read in several places that there is some evidence
    that it works.  Back in the 50's, some movie theaters were flashing
    messages on the screen that were one or two frames long -- a person
    couldn't consciously understand them because of the brevity of the
    message.  The messages would say things like "Drink coca-cola" or
    some such thing aimed at increasing sales at the refreshment stand.
    My information is that it worked, and that regulations were created
    to prevent this from taking place.
         Then, far more recently, there was some news about stores playing
    Musak with subliminal messages telling people to be honest, not
    to steal etc.  Make of that what you will.
         Then there's always Vance Packard's book "Subliminal Seduction",
    I think it is called, about visual ads in magazines that are created
    to affect readers subconsciously, helping to motivate them favorably
    towards a particular product.
         The conscious mind isn't the only part of us that perceives
    the outside world.  I would be really interested, also, in seeing
    what kind of reliable information there is about wether subliminal
    tapes work.  I haven't seen anything that would cause me to simply
    dismiss the idea out of hand.
         There are subliminal tapes that you can buy at book stores,
    for instance, that cost about $10.  Then, there is also one of those
    amazing TV only packages that purports to change your life for only
    $300.  I bought one of the $10 dollar ones, as a result of being
    sold by the ads for the $300 package.  I used it fairly faithfully
    for a while, along with some self-programming.  I'm not sure which
    did it, or whether it was a sort of placebo effect, but after a while
    I was obsessed by the idea of being successful.  From that I learned
    that I can become obsessed by about anything I choose to be obsessed
    by, if I keep focusing on it, using whatever means are available.
    Make of that what you will.
    
                                           Mike

    Hi.
    RE [-1]      
        Forgive my spelling ignorance; it turns out a wether is a
    castrated male sheep.
                                    Mike

    Re .2 (John):
    
    >I have seen no evidence that such tapes work whatsoever.  I can't
    >even see how they work in *theory!* 
     
    But John, if you could _see_ it, it wouldn't be subliminal, now,
    would it? :-)
    
    The theory, though, is easy.  Your subconscious mind can pick up
    things you don't _consciously par attention to.  And on that,
    
    In .4 by Mike,   
    
    >I've heard and read in several places that there is some evidence
    >that it works.  Back in the 50's, some movie theaters were flashing
    >messages on the screen that were one or two frames long -- a person
    >couldn't consciously understand them because of the brevity of the
    >message.  The messages would say things like "Drink coca-cola" or
    >some such thing aimed at increasing sales at the refreshment stand.
    >My information is that it worked, and that regulations were created
    >to prevent this from taking place.
     
    These things are substantially true.  Actually, the pictures involved
    were of popcorn and hot dogs; after doing the subliminal flashes,
    there appeared to be a significant increase in concession sales
    in the items displayed.  Some cheap horror films were reputedly
    given subliminal pictures of skulls and other "scary" stuff to make
    them seem more frightening than the astory would indicate.  The
    concern about subliminalization was so great that legislature was
    indeed passed to prohibit it from being introduced into films.
    
    >     Then, far more recently, there was some news about stores playing
    >Musak with subliminal messages telling people to be honest, not
    >to steal etc.  Make of that what you will.                   
    
    This was done primarily in supermarkets and, according to reports
    on national television, the "shrinkage" [shoplifting rate] reduced
    by about 30 percent.
    
    >     Then there's always Vance Packard's book "Subliminal Seduction",
    >I think it is called, about visual ads in magazines that are created
    >to affect readers subconsciously, helping to motivate them favorably
    >towards a particular product.
     
    Actually, the book's title was _The Hidden Persuaders_.  _Subliminal
    Seduction_ was written by someone else.  [<Blush> I forget his name.]
    It was more sensationalistic and claimed, among other things, that
    Ritz crackers had tiny words printed on them, saying "Sex," which
    were supposed to make them taste better.  The same author also wrote
    _The Clam-Plate Orgy_, claiming that the picture of a plate of fried
    clams in either a Howard Johnson's or Friendly's menu, was retouched
    to suggest a _menage-a-many_ sexual encounter, in order to sell
    more clams ...
    
    The problem with using subliminals is twofold: first, you have to
    be sure that the hidden message is benign, which means you'll have
    to review it consciously.  Second, some people think all they need
    is the subliminal, and without any other help, the problem will
    be solved.  That's wishful thinking.  At best, it's an aid.
    
    Steve Kallis, Jr.
    

    I have heard recently from some friends in college (at the
    resume-writing point, that is) that you can actually buy paper for your
    copy machine which has "weak watermarks" or some such which are
    invisible (unless you are looking at them), but subliminally say "yes!"
    or "hire me hire me hire me" or some such.  Sounds interesting, and we
    had a good chuckle over it, especially considering it probably costs 10
    times more than regular paper. 
    
    -Jody

    This reminds me of a Saturday Night Live skit with a man who walks
    into an office, has a normal conversation with his boss, all the
    while saying "vacation" under his breath after every sentence. Needless
    to say, his boss suggests he take a vacation...the man speaks with
    the boss's secretary on his way out, again a 'normal' conversation
    except he says "hot sex" under his breath after every sentence.
    I'm sure you can guess the rest... ;-)
    
    -Amy.

< Note 662.6 by ERASER::KALLIS "A Dhole isn't a political animal." >
     
>    Actually, the book's title was _The Hidden Persuaders_.  _Subliminal
>    Seduction_ was written by someone else.  [<Blush> I forget his name.]
>    It was more sensationalistic and claimed, among other things, that
>    Ritz crackers had tiny words printed on them, saying "Sex," which
>    were supposed to make them taste better.  The same author also wrote
>    _The Clam-Plate Orgy_, claiming that the picture of a plate of fried
>    clams in either a Howard Johnson's or Friendly's menu, was retouched
>    to suggest a _menage-a-many_ sexual encounter, in order to sell
>    more clams ...
    

The author's name is Bryan Wilson Key.

In my previous incarnation as a copywriter, I once attended a lecture by him.
He VERY DEFINITELY believes in his theories of subliminal suggestion in 
advertising -- unfortunately, it's his own rabid fanaticism that destroys his
readers'/listeners' ability to give much credence to his ideas (interesting
though they are in theory).

When he starts ranting about the death's heads (skulls) airbrushed into just
about every ice cube in every whiskey ad published, he really gets beyond the
pale. One of his major theories is that people who drink liquor -- even just
socially, not necessarily alcoholics -- really have a death wish, so they are 
attracted to subliminal images of death symbols in these ads.  Of course, he 
may be right (although I personally doubt it, having worked in advertising for 
years) but it's impossible to either prove or disprove.

Also, it would probably help his case if he brought a little humor into his 
scenarios, but he is so ABSOLUTELY serious about these theories.  And come on, 
you have to admit, the sight of hundreds of tiny copulating (whether you 
believe they are or aren't) clam-figures on a plate at Howard Johnson's IS 
just a *little bit* hilarious, don't you think?!

Having said all that, I DO believe that subliminal messages, ESPECIALLY 
auditory ones, are real and can be very effective (stress-reduction tapes,
for example) -- I just have to take Bryan Wilson Key's subliminal advertising
theories with a very big (and probably skull-shaped) grain of salt!

Now back to read-only (this topic just hit one of my favorite subjects, that's
all!)

Mary Beth

RE: .3 (Frederick)

    > On the other hand, John, they may work in ways which you will not
    allow yourself to accept.  It is fairly clear to me that you do not
    believe in much beyond the conscious mind (except unconscious, while
    sleeping, for example, or dead, no conscious!)  So that limits the
    potentials for you in your reality.  < 

Yes, and in somebody's reality, Margarate Thatcher is a pine beetle.  If
we are going to discuss this from a standpoint of "alternate realities,"
why even bother?  Anything in such a system is possible, though not provable,
including the razor clam on your left shoulder.

I will agree with you that subliminal techniques do not work very well;
especially when they attempt to ascribe to the so-called subconscious mind
superhuman powers.  I want to laugh when I hear rumors that some publisher
has hidden a naked woman on the front cover of his magazine, revealable
only through X-ray photography, or that a sped-up taped message gets through
to the subconscious (speeding up a tape alters not only the frequency of
the output, but the formants; making the information useless as communication).

FWIW: I read _Subliminal Seduction_ a few years back and put it in the same
class as _Chariots of the Gods_.

John M.

    Re .10 (John):
    
>I will agree with you that subliminal techniques do not work very well;
>especially when they attempt to ascribe to the so-called subconscious mind
>superhuman powers. 
 
    Or whern not?  Some pretty interesting things can take place with
    people just under hypnosis, including insensitivity to pain.  Is
    that "superhuman"?  I suspect not.
    
    It may be that some are more receptive to subliminals than others.
    The "average" human is a statistical model that virtually all of us
    deviate from.  For instance, my wiofe is a superb dancer; I'm a
    dub.  She says, "Feel the rythym; go with it."  My attempts to
    do so practically make her double over with laughter.  She's more
    sensitive to that than I.
    
    > ............  I want to laugh when I hear rumors that some publisher
    >has hidden a naked woman on the front cover of his magazine, revealable
    >only through X-ray photography, ...
    
    So would I!  These days, why not just show the naked woman?
    
>FWIW: I read _Subliminal Seduction_ a few years back and put it in the same
>class as _Chariots of the Gods_.
 
    Oh, that's not fair!  There was no pseudo-archeology in SS.  Nor
    any humor in it, either.
    
    Steve Kallis, Jr.     

    While working in California as a hostess for a cable TV interview
    program, a guest on the show who happened to be a Dentist practicing
    hypnosis in his office, put one of his clients under hypnosis right
    on the show.  He then inserted a very long (ouch) needle in her
    lip after suggesting to her that she would feel "very little pain"
    and would bleed "only slightly."  I was right there, folks, and
    saw for myself that the suggestions worked.  In went the needle
    without a single whimper or twitch on the part of the victim, and
    when the dentist removed the needle, there was no blood to be seen.
    At first I was skeptical, but after examining the needle, I could
    see that it was all very real.
    
    (I still prefer novacaine, however)   - Joella
      

    1) That hypnosis can be used to very effectively block pain in
       many people is unquestioned.  It is not used more often simply
       because for most people, initial induction takes quite a bit
       of time for sufficient depth, and even then may or may not work
       for that person.  It is highly effective but not very efficient.
    
    2) That hypnosis can be used to decrease bleeding, speed healing,
       decrease the liklihood of infection and contriwise cause inflamation
       and blistering has been demonstrated repeatedly.  It can even
       be used -- apparently quite easily -- for sometimes dramatic
       breast augmentation (OK you adolescents, stop that sniggering;
       this is serious).  Well documented, multiply medically witnessed
       cures of the (symptoms) of several serious *genetic* skin disorders
       have been reported.
    
    3) This doesn't really say anything, one way or the other, about
       "subliminal" suggestion; particularly the more outragous and/or
       silly claims.
    
    4) In any case, I couldn't really take "your" dentists demonstration
       as showing any of this.  There is a relativly easy "fakir" trick
       identical to this.  If a fine needle is inserted *between* the
       muscles of the tounge, lip or cheek there will be little or no
       bleeding and the pain is somewhat less than for an ordinary
       injection.  With fine enough needles this can be done easily
       "into" other parts of the body (as in acupuncture) and with some
       skill through limbs.  The mouth region is easy because its thin
       and the muscles are easy to feel.  I have seen this done, but
       never had the nerve (nor am I likely to, the danger of infection
       if nothing else seems to high to risk it) to try it myself.
    
       I'm not saying that the dentist used this technique -- I don't
       know.  He may have just ignorantly chosen that site for its
       drama.  On the other hand it wouldn't have been the first time
       that a "cooked" demonstration was used for a real effect because
       it is easier or more reliable.  So, if I was skeptical of this
       capability (I'm not, I've demonstrated it less dramatically myself)
       then this demonstration would leave me no less skeptical.
    
    
    						Topher

    RE: .14 (Topher) 
    
    > If a fine needle is inserted *between* the muscles of the tounge, lip
    or cheek there will be little or no bleeding...< 
         
    
    ??? The tongue is a single muscle.
    
    John M.  

    I don't know about skulls in ice cubes in whiskey ads, but I have
    identified nude women and X-rated scenes in ice cubes in liquor ads. 
    
    I also, during a consumer education class, saw a picture from a
    magazine, advertising something (I forget) with a picture of an
    attractive woman in a bathing suit.  Then there was a long dissertation
    by a doctor, explaining that there were tell-tale signs that the person
    in the bathing suit was actually male.  His observations were correct,
    and some of his claims could be verified experientially. 
    
    Once this was determined, someone did an experiment with it, to
    determine if the transvestite was more attractive to average males.
    They took a copy of this ad, and a copy of a similar ad with a "real"
    female in it.  Gave these ads (one at a time) to a group of men, along
    with a questionnaire.  The questionnaire asked them to rate the woman
    in the picture for attractiveness.  Then asked them if they would like
    to go on a date with her.  If yes, what would they like to do with her
    on the date.  As the subliminal advertisers had hoped, the response to
    the transvestite was more positive (i.e., "she" was perceived as more
    attractive), and more sexual (more wanted dates, more indicated wanting
    to do sexual things on the date). The conclusion was that many of these
    things take advantage of suppressed or "kinky" feelings that most
    people have. 
    
    Elizabeth

RE: .15
    
    Quite right.  I was speaking loosely (that'l larn me :-).
    
    The tongue muscle is considered to be a single muscle.  It has
    two parts, however, seperated down the middle by some fibrous
    connective tissue.  You can feel this with your fingers, particularly
    on the underside.  A fine needle can be inserted between the
    muscle and the connective tissue with little pain or bleeding.
    
    I saw some documentary footage somewhere showing an Indian fakir
    apparently with a small trident thrust through his tongue.  A
    similar trident was then shown -- the three headed spear part
    was simply a fake -- a cap which slipped over the needle after
    the needle was thrust through the tongue.
    
    						Topher

    RE: .13
    
    Thanks for all your input on this.  I'd like to add, however,
    that the dentist (and his client) claimed that hypnosis was the
    sole pain-killer used during the removal of all four of the clients
    wisdom teeth.  Granted, I didn't witness this, but if the suggestion
    to "bleed very little" and "feel very little pain" worked in that
    kind of operation, then surely there's more than trickery at work
    here.   I'd be interested to hear of more instances where hypnosis
    was used in medical applications -- think what it could do for
    a hemophiliac, for example.
    
    					- Joella
    
    

    
    Topher - you may want to write to Frederick's catalog and see if
             there are some possibilities there.  (;^)
    
    But the big question is:
    
    	           	Is 'llehctiM nhoJ' satanic?
    

RE: .18
    
    As I said, this is done with hypnosis quite routinely.  Whether
    or not this dentist with this patient was demonstrating this effect
    on the program or had extracted wisdom teeth using it, wisdom teeth
    have been extracted using just hypnosis.
    
    Hypnosis is used routinely to reduce the amount (frequently to zero)
    of anasthesia needed.  Chemical anasthesia is kept on hand in any
    legitimate usage in case it is needed.
    
    Its use in minor surgery, childbirth, occasionally in more major
    surgery and otherwise for the relief of pain and tension, is so
    common it can only be described as routine.
    
    Other uses exist but are less common -- I already mentioned its
    use as a substitute for breast augmentation therapy, and it is
    quite effective in the removal of warts and otherwise encouraging
    normal healing.  I also mentioned its use in curing "crocodile
    skin" a genetic skin disorder caused by the absence of oil glands
    (this has been very well documented but I have yet to see an
    explanation beyond, "maybe it has something to do with circulation").
    
    The idea about hemophillia is interesting, and might help as a
    sort of first aid, but probably no more.  The reduction of bleeding
    seems to be by local, temporary reduction in surface circulation
    until clotting can seal the wound.  Since the hemophiliac doesn't
    clot bleeding would probably start as soon as the hypnotic
    concentration was broken.
    
    					Topher

    Hi, all:
    	For what it's worth, I've tried one of those $10.00 tapes with
    interesting results.  In the first place, this one is not 100%
    subliminal.  One side is straight hypnosis, ie: you can hear exactly
    what's being said.  The other side is music, allegedly reiterating
    the suggestions contained on the hypnosis side.  Let me begin by
    explaining that I picked the thing up on a whim, and was *highly*
    skeptical of it.
    	In the first place, I decided to sit down and see exactly what
    hypnotic suggestions were being given.  I put on the head phones,
    drank a cup of iced coffee, and started the tape.  It started with
    some general information, warnings about listening to it while driving,
    etc., and then...the end, wake up, & some final suggestions.  Well,
    I looked at the tape (45 minutes/side) & decided that I must have
    been too tired, & next time I wouldn't listen to it after work.
     Well, I'll make a long story short - I haven't heard the entire
    tape yet, and I've had it for over a month.  Anyway, the rest of
    the story...
    	I had been working late for the past several weeks, & going
    to bed long after my wife was asleep.  As per the instructions,
    I had been listening to the tape prior to retiring, although she
    was unaware of it.  Sometime later, my wife came home with a big
    jug of spring water - very uncharacteristic, explaining that she'd
    just been in the mood for water lately & didn't like our tap water.
     In fact, she had been drinking water at work instead of coffee.
     When she mentioned it, I realized that I hadn't been drinking much
    coffee at work myself, and I've always been good for 6-10 cups/day.
     I really didn't give it much thought until I was awakened by my
    daughter one night, while the tape was still running.  After seeing
    to her needs, I restarted the tape.  I had never conciously listened
    to this part of the tape befure, but the suggestion was made that
    you drink two or more quarts of water per day.  "In fact, you are
    finding that nothing but water really satisfies your thirst. - you
    find that coffee, tea, carbonated beverages, and alcohol have no
    attraction for you...".
    	Finally, I lost just under 20 lbs in one month of using the
    tape (oh yes, that's its purpose).  Now, there was admittedly a
    desire to lose weight, or I wouldn't have even tried it, but I believe
    that it did have some effect.  I've loaned the tape to a *very*
    skeptical friend, & am awaiting his impressions.  (I'm interested
    in seeing if he is able to stay awake when listening to it).  I'll
    keep ya posted.
    					joe
    
    	

    re: .22
    Would you give me the name of the tape you bought and where?
    
    A friend of mine gave me a subliminal tape a few years ago: Positive
    Thinking.  Like your tape, one side is a hypnotic side and the other
    side is music.  I used to play the hypnotic side before going to
    sleep but would always fall asleep on it.  The music side I play
    in my car going to work once in a while.  I find that when I listen
    to the tape (either side and whether I fall asleep on it or not) I
    feel full of energy and feel like nothing is impossible.  Would 
    appear then that this tape is working for me.
    
    In the past year and a half I have put on between 20 and 25lbs.
    I am desperate to get back to my normal weight but can't seem to
    be able to shed these unwanted pounds.  I bought a subliminal tape
    through a TV add but what I don't like is that the instructions
    say that we should listen to the tape *all day long*.  There is
    no hypnotic side and no music; you only hear the sound of the ocean.
    There is no way I can walk around at work with a walkman all day
    long so I don't know how effective this tape will be.
    
    LW

    re.23
    Sorry for the delay in responding to your inquiry - I haven't been
    into notes for a week or so.  The tape is called "Subliminal Weight
    Loss", and is produced by POTENTIALS UNLIMITED, 4606-44th. St. SE.,
    P.O. Box 891, Grand Rapids, MI 49518.  The ISBN# is:
    	0-87082-235-7.  I have seen this company's products sold at
    various health food stores, including the Alchemist, on route 85
    in Hudson, and at the GNC store at Shopper's World in Framingham.
     I was a bit put off by some of the other subjects advertised in
    their promotional brochure, included with the tape, but this one
    seems to work.  I think the cost was $10.00, so I figured it was
    worth the gamble considering the stakes, ahd haven't regretted it.
     Lots of luck.
    						joe
    

    re: 24 and others
    
    I picked up Denise Linn's Weight Loss on Tuesday when away on business,
    so didn't have a chance to hear it until Tuesday evening, but noticed
    that on Wednesday I didn't feel hungry or want to call in to my
    usual cake/chocolate shop.  I also have the tape mentioned in .24 
    and listened to it last night.  
    
    It is long, 42 minutes, so I decided to listen to it at night and
    to Linn's in the morning, which is 20 minutes.  When I drive to
    work I listen to the subliminal music tape from .24.
    
    I have never had tea or coffee, and always drink water (apart from
    alcohol).  Honestly I have not been hungry during the day, and as
    I follow the Fit For Life plan I eat only fruit in the mornings.
    Since Tuesday night, I have been wandering over the shopping centre
    thinking about what to buy for lunch - only to come back to work
    and have fruit with almonds.  Then I have a small dinner of vegetables
    or whatever.  I am drinking more water and feeling great.  
    
    This is not like me usually.  Rachel Welch move over!!!!
    
    I'll try to enter here before I go on hols at Easter and tell you
    if it still works.
    
    ...dale

    re: .24 
    thank you for the info.
    
    The tape I bought through the TV commercial is from Joe Land company.
    I could not listen to it all day long as suggested but I played
    it on my way back and forth to work.  I too have noticed some 
    differences; one, I have the desire to be more active ( I used to
    come home and be the best couch potatoe you could find; now I am
    coming up with all kinds of things to do and can't wait to get going
    on them), two, I don't feel like munching at night (it used to be 
    nightly event), three, my urge for "cookies" is gone (it has always
    been my downfall)so is my urge for ice cream (I bought a half gallon
    a week ago and it's still in the freezer!!!).  Unlike the other
    tapes mentioned it doesn't make me drink more water.  I never have
    more than 2 cups of coffee a day and this hasn't changed either.
    But my clothes are not as thight as they used to be so I guess these
    tapes do work.
    
    Lorraine
    
    

    I have listened to tapes made by a few different companies, none have
    worked until recently. I got a catalog in the mail from a company called
    mind communications. They have tapes for several differnt topics, some
    for self improvement, breaking bad habits, exercising , etc. I
    purchased one to improve goal setting, all i can say is that it seems
    to work for me. You can pick from five types of music, they also print
    the messages on the cover. 
    
    I listen to it at bed time, it is very relaxing. If anyone would like
    the address let me know.

    re. 27
    
    	Yes, I'd like to know the name of the tape and how you purchased
    it.  
    
    	Do you have any ideas why this tape should work for you and
    the others didn't?

    
    
    I have used subliminal tapes by Joe Land.
    I used both the weight loss and the stop procrastination and both
    have worked.  When I used the weight loss tape I didn't really see
    any dramatic weight loss but however there was a big,big difference
    on my eating habbits.  I use to eat a lot of junk food/sweets.
    
    I would have a candy bar,cookies,pizza and chips,soda every night
    without fail,but after listening to the weight tape I went for 3-4
    months without any of the above..
    
    This all happened after about the 2-3 weeks of listening to the tape.
    I also ate a lot of salads and fruit while listening to the tape.
    Also from listening to the tape I had a desire to exercise.
    (which I hadn't done for a long time.)   These must of been some
    of the affimations(sp!) that were on the tape.
    The tape seems to make you more aware of whats good for you and
    whats not. It teaches you to eat right and by eating right you loose
    weight ???
    
    The stopping procrastination tape was good also.
    I started to do things when they had to get done and not put them
    off until tomorrow(tomorrow never comes). They reccomend this tape
    be used along with the weight loss tape.
    
    I think they worked like they were advertized to.
    
    You may think otherwise,but thats up to you.
    
    
    	Wayne.

    "Greetings and welcome.  Welcome to truly an exciting 
    experience ..."
    
    ROLL::BEFUMO - I have the same tape you do, and have had
    some good luck in using it.  It's a very uplifting tape,
    full of positive suggestions and affirmations of self-
    improvement.  The problem I have with it, though, is that
    after using it a few months, the suggestions became old hat
    and I became immune to them.  I'm now looking for a new
    tape with perhaps slightly different suggestions, maybe
    a different voice -- something to make it fresh again.
    
    With regard to other tapes mentioned here, I don't think
    I'd buy a tape that didn't let me hear the suggestions
    being made to my subconscious mind.  I'm a skeptical
    sort and would, I think, resist any suggestions given to
    me in a "sneaky" way.  Also, I think it's risky to let
    someone mess with your mind without your knowing what it
    was they were doing to it.  (Gosh, with subliminal tapes,
    I guess you NEVER really know what the subliminal messages
    are -- scary.)
    
    On a funnier note ... I had thought my purchase and use of
    this particular tape was unknown to my boyfriend, until one
    evening at dinner, after we were all through and I had pushed
    my plate away with food still remaining, he made the following
    comment:
    
    	"I see you've left food on your plate.  Feel good about it?"
    
    Regards,
    
    Joella
    
                    

    re. .30
    
    Hi Joella,
    
    	I enjoyed your note... I have the same tape so I know
    what you're talking about.
    
    	Can you be more specific about what your results were ie.,
    what changes in your behavior/weight did you see?  Did you
    play the tape every night before you went to sleep?
    
    	I've played the tape occasionally when I get home from
    work.   I also like the images and visualizations he leads
    you through.  I find the tape relaxing but I haven't lost
    any weight.  I'm wondering if it's because I'm not following
    the directions exactly.
    
    
    
    

An article in the New York Times today (Aug 14, 1990,  page C1)
cites evidence that "subliminal" tapes cause subjective changes
vbased on the label, rather than the content of the tape, but that
there was no "objectively" measured change in behavior.

For example, a person who listened to a tape that had messages
to increase self-esteem, but that was labelled as a tape to
improve memory, was likely to report having improved memory,
but would have no measureable improvement in either memory
or self-esteem.

The article also describes some other current results and conclusions
of cognitive psychologists and psychoanalysts.

/bruce