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Conference hydra::dejavu

Title:Psychic Phenomena
Notice:Please read note 1.0-1.* before writing
Moderator:JARETH::PAINTER
Created:Wed Jan 22 1986
Last Modified:Tue May 27 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:2143
Total number of notes:41773

459.0. "What's Right With New Age Thinking" by TOPDOC::SLOANE (Bruce is on the loose) Fri Aug 21 1987 19:23

I guess I'm almost a total skeptic regarding a lot of what I read in 
DEJAVU. For example, in the past few days there have been several notes 
about both Uri Geller and the 100th monkey syndrome. 

Geller has been exposed several times as a very clever magician but 
complete charlatan. The 100th monkey syndrome has no basis in fact, 
and the potato washing was learned from monkey to monkey with no 
quantum leaps.

On the other hand, people have much stronger emotional and 
spiritual feelings than most want to admit. Unfortunately our 
culture glosses over and denies this. Successful family life or 
group living satisfies most of these needs, but most people, 
if they are truly in touch with their inner feelings, have strong 
needs for a group cohesiveness beyond that. 

I think what a lot of people are seeking in DEJAVU (maybe me, 
too) is to get more in touch with their feelings and emotions. 
I found the excerpts from Peck's book fascinating, and certainly 
relevant to my life and to what I see going on in other's lives. 
(On Peck's spiritual scale, I'm about stage III point 4. Maybe 
I'll make it to IV.)

Much of both the Black and Indian movements of the past several 
years has been an attempt to gain spiritual and emotional unity 
- group cohesiveness, in part - through sharing, as a group, 
deeply felt emotions. This creates a sense of common goals, needs, 
and belonging that goes beyond the immediate family, and may lead to 
lasting feelings of inner contentment and a sense of purpose.

This is the type of experience that many people were seeking who 
participated in activities during Harmonic Conversion. They came back 
from their experience spiritually refreshed and rejuvenated. They felt 
part of something larger than themselves. They no longer were 
isolated, alone and vulnerable, but now see themselves as an integral part 
of something greater.

This is the good I see that comes out of such events. It is too bad 
that such natural, human experiences are so often explained away in 
supernatural or mystical terms. 

Carried to an extreme it leads to religious fanaticism: the emotional 
experience becomes so all pervading that logic and reason are 
lost. Iran and the Third Reich are examples, but there are others. 
In Iran, the group emotional experience has clouded reason, and 
is leading the country, and maybe the world to chaos.

-bs 
T.RTitleUserPersonal
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459.1Wish I had said that...DECWET::MITCHELLWeeding in the Age of FlowersSat Aug 22 1987 00:438
    RE: .0
    
    Here Here!  (or is it hear hear?)
    
    Consider our viewpoints converged.  ;-)
    
    
    John M.
459.2Please also see 418.169NEXUS::MORGANWelcome to the Age of FlowersSat Aug 22 1987 06:271
    
459.3AKOV76::FRETTSShine your Spirit!Sun Aug 23 1987 00:2514
    
    RE: .0
    
    > This is the good I see that comes out of such events.  It is too
    > bad that such natural, human experiences are so often explained
    > away in supernatural or mystical terms.
    
    I think this is where the misunderstandings are coming in.  To many
    people, what some might call supernatural or mystical experiences
    _are_ natural, human experiences.  All we want to do is share them
    - not defend them.
    
    Carole
    
459.4YODA::HOPKINSMon Aug 24 1987 15:089
    re -1
    
    Thank you Carole, I couldn't have said it better myself.
    
    Peace,
    
    Marie
    
    
459.5Spiritual Cycles?NATASH::BUTCHARTTue Aug 25 1987 18:3375
    Given an assumption (mine) that the spiritual urge is as natural 
    as all other human urges, is it also possible to hypothesize that 
    there are times when it is easier to access and to obtain satis-
    faction for it?  And that if such a time is squashed or overindulged
    it results in a distorted perspective?
    
    To "get physical" for a moment:  I need to eat for my physical body
    to survive.  It is much more satisfactory and my body uses the 
    nourishment _much_ more efficiently if I eat only when my body 
    signals "Hunger!"  If I ignore the "Hunger!" message I eventually
    get so depleted that my perspective becomes distorted and I cannot
    function any more.  All I can think about is food.  When I am close
    to a "shutdown" state and I finally get some food the whole universe
    seems rosy.  "Food makes _everything_ all right," I think to myself 
    from a blissful digestive stupor.  And of course, that statement 
    is not true; food doesn't _always_ make _everything_ all right 
    (neither does sleep, sex, exercise, work, play, any and all natural
    human urges.)  It is only true for me at that time because I ignored 
    the urge for so long that its satisfaction became of paramount impor-
    tance to my continued functioning.  
    
    So what happens next?  Usually, the next time I feel even a _teensy_ 
    bit hungry, I rush out to gorge myself.  But instead of bliss I end 
    up ill--bloated, gaseous, headachy--"Yuck," I now think to myself, 
    "what I need is to fast," and I swear off food "forever"--or at 
    least until I become so hungry that I must eat or expire. [:-)]
    
    Is it possible that many of us have experienced our spiritual urges 
    in close to this fashion?  I know I have.  And what I am seeking, 
    when I use the term "New Age" is some sanity, some balanced way 
    of incorporating my spiritual urges into my mundane life.  Based
    on my long and complex experience with food (it was no coincidence
    that I chose that for an example) I am trying not to let my long
    starvation for some form of spiritual expression cause me to "gorge".

    But many others I know, who base their life patterns on some sort
    of "binge/purge" cycle in their relationships, work, diet, play,
    and yes, spirituality are not having such an easy time finding such
    a balance.
    
    The concept that I find intriguing is this:  just as there are 
    natural cycles within us that govern our "best" times to eat (when 
    hungry), sleep (when tired), drink (when thirsty), make love (when 
    desirous), work (when bored), play (when stressed or stale), relax 
    (when tense), is there also a cycle for the spiritual urge and its
    satisfaction?  Is it just barely possible that for some reason such
    a time is active for many of us?  
    
    I honestly have no concrete idea what would govern such a cycle, 
    but it is an interesting idea.  It is also possible that such a 
    cycle is entirely unique to each individual (just as sleep and 
    appetite patterns are), but that times like the Harmonic Convergence 
    are so potent and touch so many because many people's natural
    "spiritual appetite" has been denied for so long.  I've been reading 
    of life breakthroughs, both material and spiritual, for years; they 
    come at different ages to different people in all kinds of guises.  
    So it sounds intuitively nonsensical that one particular time is 
    _the_ time for satisfying a spiritual urge.  But seen in the context 
    of a spiritual (and possibly emotional) desert in the lives of my
    many acquaintances I can empathize completely.

    After all, if you were in constant physical hunger and heard of 
    a giant free food bash thrown by the city of Boston, wouldn't you 
    go, perhaps be obsessed with going, feeling that it was the only
    thing that was going to keep you alive?
    
    I am not trying to trivialize people's spiritual urges by "lowering"
    them to the level of a physical appetite.  If what I've just written 
    comes across that way, I apologise.  I happen to feel that our 
    physical urges are in no way lowly or unworthy, and am "elevating"
    them, if you will, to the level of a spiritual urge.  I am trying
    to say that they are, in some way, equivalent, that if natural cycles 
    govern one they may also govern the other.  Other ideas?
    
    Marcia
459.6cyclic thoughts ;-)ISOLA::NISAll you need is loveWed Aug 26 1987 12:5129
    I think there is something to it - Spiritual Cycles - and I can
    certainly appreciate the picture (or parallel) of eating (Food;-).
    
    I think it is time for "eating" spiritual food, most of the awaken
    time we spend. Some inner/external states might be difficult for
    spiritual growth, like when one is tired, drunk or drugged in some
    way.:-) 
    
    On a larger scale, say in a society, there might be cyclic phenomenon,
    that influence the possibility for common spiritual "meals". Some
    societies might indeed at times make it very difficult (even for
    individuals) to have any digestable food. But then again, in a special
    way - the harder it is to get or find the food, the stronger some
    or the hungry ones seems to become. It is difficult to speak
    objectively of what is good and bad external circumstances for
    "eating".
    
    Ironically at times when it is easy - when there are many groups
    and movements towards the "kitchen" - it can be very difficult for
    the individual to destinguish food and poison.
    
    Some external cycles might influence the common possibilities, much
    similar the way fashion could influence the market for textiles.
    
    In general I think the timing is very individual, one has to realize
    ones own desire and needs, then "shopping" on the basis of this
    list may be very beneficial.
    
    Nis
459.7Helpful in Strange WaysMOSAIC::R_BROWNTue Jun 21 1988 17:2910
    Marcia:
    
       Your entry in .5 was very thought provoking to me -- though not
    in the context of this subject. It has caused me to think of certain
    seemingly unrelated problems in my life; I have suddenly realized
    what may be a common pattern behind all of them. This reply is just
    to say thank you.
     
                                                   -Robert Brown III
    
459.8A Return Thank-youNATASH::BUTCHARTThu Jul 14 1988 17:3011
    I'm in the process of catching up on my reading and even thinking
    of writing after a  long "vacation" from most noting in general.
     What a happy synchronicity that I chanced across this reply today!
     I have recently conceived of some important work I would like to
    do, and have felt forlornly convinced that even if I undertake it
    I will have no effect.  Your reply seems an assurance that I will
    have a positive effect, even in ways that are unknown to me.  Thank
    you so much; I reread .5 and my word, it's almost a year ago that I
    entered that!  
    
    Marcia
459.9What is New Age, Anyway?VITAL::KEEFEBill Keefe - 223-1837 - MLO21-4Fri Nov 10 1989 23:1767
    The following was written by Jack Clarke and appears as a reprint in the 
    current issue of Connecting Link. Clarke is also the author of "Life After
    Grief: A Soul Journey After Suicide" and he also writes music and book
    reviews, plus articles for Body, Mind & Spirit magazine and other
    publications

			What is New Age, Anyway?

It's people taking conscious responsibility for their own lives, not blaming 
others for their problems.

It's people who deliberately decide to learn and grow.

It's people that don't have to be right, except for themselves.

It's people seeing problems as lessons, perhaps in a long series of lives and 
lessons.

It's people who believe we are what we think we are, and can change ourselves 
by changing our thinking.

It's people that feel they can change the world by changing themselves, not by 
trying to change others.

It's people who search for strength from the universe by going inside 
themselves.

It's people that recognize love doesn't have to have strings attached.

It's people loving and knowing themselves in order to better know and love 
others.

It's people who see others as not better than nor less than, but rather 
different than, themselves, yet part of the same whole.

It's people that choose their own path rather than follow dogma.

It's people honoring your right to your own path, not theirs.

It's people who realize that now is all we have, since yesterday is just a 
thought and so is tomorrow.

It's people interested in owning themselves rather than things.

It's people who see joy in life rather than pain, having experienced enough 
pain already.

It's people curious about extra sensory perception and all it implies.

It's people in all tasks of life, from business persons to flower essence 
healers, psychologists to UFO investigators.

New Age is not a new religion with a hierarchy of priests and rituals, seeking 
converts, though some new agers choose some ritual.

New Age is not often gloom and doomers, though many are concerned about 
ecology, the economy and other forces that affect our world.

New Age is not a movement based on guilt, anger, fear or hurt; it is a journey 
toward the love that is God.

New Age is not allegiance to one master; it is learning from many masters in
the quest for oneness of God.

New Age could not become a cult because of what is said above.

New Age is not just humans doing, it is humans being.