Conference hydra::dejavu

    Once or twice I did this.  When I was about 18.  I wanted to see
    how creative I could be.  Worked up a number of colorful alien
    landscapes.
      Actually, it's sort of a power trip, but it's fun while you're
    young and relatively undisciplined.
    
    Steve Kallis, Jr.
    

I have been doing this for as long as I can remember. It IS very
entertaining, rather like directing and acting in a play all at the
same time. The way I induce it (only on weekends, or you *will* be late)
is after I wake-up, I hang onto to the dream I was having and go back
into a very light sleep, still not intouch with the outside world, but
self-aware. At this point I have a semi-conious control over the dream. 

Of late though I have been trying to achieve a state of "lucid dreaming".
This involves coming to complete awareness, while still completely asleep.
This is a very strange feeling, and I have only succeeded twice. I have no
idea at this point how to induce it.
    

    	In Carl Sagan's 1980 science book, THE DRAGONS OF EDEN, he stated
    that one can ask questions of the "presence" which is watching you
    in your dreams - referring to the ability to be able to both
    participate and observe your self in dreams.  He said that subjects
    who asked the "presence" (subconcious?) "Who are you?" and similar
    questions received answers like "Who do you think I am?"
    
    	Is it the subconcious one is referring to in these dreams? 
    I do consider being able to act on your own in these dreams a form
    of "concious" manipulation.
    	As for me, the only times I am ever able to "control" dreams
    is when something bad is about to happen to me - then all I do is
    "escape" it by being jolted awake.
    
    	Larry
    

	There seem to be at least two ways of doing this. 
	Better put: I've succeeded in two of them.

	First, dream then wakeup and try to continue the 
	dream. I find this reasonably successful but not
	very impressive. 

	Second , within a dream I became concious I was in 
	a dream and shortly therafter it burst (like a bubble)
	I guess you have to play by dreams rules. I did this
	when I was in grammar school. I remember pinching 
	myself to see if I was in the dream (the old cliche)
	and realizing I was. 

	On a similar vein, I saw a book in a dream and wrote
	the title down. (This was after spending the entire day 
	practicing Yoga and the evening reading Richard Bach)
	At any rate the first word in the title was Reality
	and the author was Richard Feyman. The title appeared
	to be two or three words, if three words the second
	would be a preprosition. (any thoughts?)

	John who_believes_dreams_are_nothing_more_than_shelved
	     thoughts_reappearing_but_hopes_otherwise.

    	I have always been intrigued by the old Chinese story of a man
    who had a dream about a butterfly.  When he woke up, he wondered
    if he was a man dreaming about a butterfly, or a butterfly now dreaming
    he was a man.
    
    	This leads to my big question:  Are dreams a separate reality?
    I am not asking if they are real, I am asking if they are a complete,
    separate reality, and in our sleep we are somehow able to reach
    this reality.
    
    	Larry
    

    I seem to recall having had at least two lucid dream experiences.
    Don't recall anything about the dreams, though!  :-)
    
    Just last weekend, I picked up a book titled 'Lucid Dreaming'. I
    believe I got the reference from this conference.  Anyway, there's some
    interesting info in this book.  One of the things described is some
    tests run in sleep labs on lucid dreamers.  The subjects would be given
    a task to perform.  Upon realizing that they were dreaming, they would
    signal with a series of eye movements (picked up on the instruments),
    then signal again just before and after completing the task.  That's
    as far as I've gotten in the book.  For those interested in the topic,
    I suggest getting a copy!
    
    Kak

    
    
    - Dreams control is simple, provided the subject has enough personal
      power ( read Castanedas' books ) so that he can focus his " second
      attention " ( or WILL, according to G.I. Gurdjieff ) on the task
      of dreaming...-

RE: .6
    
    The book is "Lucid Dreaming" and is by Stephen LaBerge.  LaBerge
    is quite enthusiastic (to say the least) about lucid dreaming. 
    He sees its potential for 1) Scientific research, 2) Entertainment
    3) Problem solving 4) Self therapy and 5) Spiritual advancement.
    
    LaBerge, although mostly scientific in orientation is quite open
    to what other paths to knowledge have to say about the subject.
    
    If I haven't previously recommended this book in this notesfile
    I do now (if I *did* then I do again :-).  Anyone interested in
    the potentials of the mind should read this book.  There may be
    parts which don't talk to you (either too "scientific" or too
    "spiritual") but I think that there is something worthwhile here
    for practically everyone.
    
    					Topher

    Heres one we can all think about!  This guy that my father knows
    kept having a dream over and over that the IRS was after him!  This
    guy had about five dollars to his name at the time!  Well after
    a week or so of these same dreams he had a dream of five numbers!
    In the morning he gave a buck to his room-mate and asked him to
    play the numbers in mega bucks.  His room-mate explained that he
    needed six numbers!  he told him to throw the sixth number in!!
    HE WAS THE WINNER OF 4 + MILLION THAT SATURDAY NIGHT!!
    
    PAY CLOSE ATTENTION TO THOUGHS NUMBERS YOU DREAM!!  I DO!

    I did this often as a child and my children are also able to do
    it.  In the midst of a nightmare I would (within the dream) announce
    that this was "only a dream and can't hurt me" and then the dream
    would change and go on to something else.  I would much prefer to
    have dreams about five numbers and wake up 4 million dollars richer
    though :-)
    My boys and I have also communicated with each other during dreams
    when they were small.  Jason dreamt he was lost and trying
    to find his way home while I dreamt he was lost and I was trying
    to find him.   My ex was awake with an allergy induced asthma attack
    and heard Jay (who was about five at the time) come into our room
    at 3 in the morning because he heard me "calling him".  His father
    asked him what he was dreaming and woke me and asked me what I was
    dreaming.  His father is a VERY practical man who dismisses anything
    out of the ordinary as rubbish so he (believe me) was a reliable
    witness.  There have been other instances similar to this one 
    involving my younger son.  He was "rescued" during a nightmare once
    by a big brown dog.  Later that week we were at a party and someone
    was talking about having their dog put to sleep.  We agreed to take
    her and when we went to pick her up she looked exactly like the dog that
    Ben described as his rescuer.  In the past I have often dreamed
    things that happened later.  I believe dreams to be far more
    important than our society and culture credits them to be.  I think
    we still have a lot to learn about them
    
     
    
    
    

I've been a serious dreamer for many years, and I've had very few lucid
dreams. I beleive there are things one can do to promote them, although
there is no guaranteed way I know of to induce them.

The first step is to take your dreams seriously. Try to remember them, and
when you succeed in remembering them, write them down. Try to figure out
what they mean, and if they suggest you take some action in waking life,
consider doing so (if it is an appropriate action.)

3 steps to figuring out dreams:

1. Literal references. Sometimes when you dream that your car broken it
really is broken, or it may be about to break, and the dream is warning you
to get it fixed. Do so.

2. Symbolic references. If your car really is in good condition, this could
be a symbolic reference to something else being broken. Look for puns and
associations to see what it points to. For instance, if you associate your
car with commuting it could be that your dream is suggesting your work life
is broken, and you should look for a new job.  Do so.

3. Self references. Sometimes you'll dream about people or things that have
no literal OR symbolic reference. These are probably references to parts of
yourself that are personified in the dream. E.g. your car might represent
your "drive" to get things done, or your desire for travel. For the purposes
of lucid dreaming I find self-referential dreams a good omen. It means that
the waking life is under control enough so that purely internal forces can
get some attention.

Having done this for a period of time, you will have acheived good
communication from the dreaming to the waking self. Now you need to get
communication going in the other direction, from the waking to the dreaming
self. The way to do this is to send a message to the dreamer directly before
going to sleep. I'm sure the participants in this conference have their own
techniques and jargon for this, but what works for me is to reach a state of
relaxed concentration and tell myself "tonight I will dream about x" or "I
need an answer to problem y, let the solution come in a dream."

There's one particular kind of dream that for me always comes as a precursor
to lucid dreaming, but doesn't always lead to lucid dreaming. This is the
falling/flying dream. In the dream I'll find myself falling (off a bridge,
building or whatever) and it will occur to me in the dream "I don't have to
keep falling, I can just start flying." Which I proceed to do. Often this
experience is so exciting it wakes me up, but if I can do it several times
over a period of a week or so I get used to the feeling, and I can stay
asleep, flying. THEN is when I realize I'm only DREAMING that I'm flying,
which is when the dream actually becomes lucid.

Sweet dreams, dreamers.
Don.

    The hard part about lucid dreaming is to first learn to bring back
    the non-lucid dreams.  As one begins to pay attention to them they
    will become more lucid, more real.
    
    Perhaps discipline is first and formost in importance, followed
    by desire.  Sometimes desire outstrips discipline altogather though.
    For me it was the sense of adventure that really made it for me.
    Since then I have lost interest and gone on to other things.  This
    is where discipline should pay off, but like I said, not really
    interested now.
    
    May I offer some advice on "bring the information back"? Upon waking
    lie peacefully and mentally pull the dream back.  It is sorta' a
    willing it to come back.  Then, as you are waiting, explore the little
    hints that come to you.  After a while you should be able to
    reconstruct some of the forgotten dream.  Also since dreams come from
    altered states of consciousness it helps to stay in a light or
    semi-altered state of consciousness.  I feel it by the feeling that
    "things" don't matter (_obviously_ I can sleep late in the am).
    Writting down the dreams you can pull back is _very_ important. Why?
    Because only by those can you reconstruct your individual dreamscape.
    Mine are in cities, living in apartments (I own a home), dealing with
    lowlife type characters lately too.  I have a fair idea now where I
    live, and play in my dreamscape.  I have favorite areas and
    not-so-favorite areas.  (Last night someone ripped off my pickup, boy
    was I ever pissed.  If I ever catch them...) Believe it or not,
    it looks just like good old anytown anywhere USA.  But you won't
    know until you write it down and study it.
    
      Mikie?

    Well, it seems this is a subject of interest among we dreamers,
nocturnal that is. Since writing the base memo, I have payed more attention
to my dreams upon awaking. I have always pondered the "flashy" dreams, but
tended to find only slight interest in the spotty or loosely constructed
ones. It's interesting to me to find that there seems to be more significance
to the looser ones, and I now pay attention to all of them, whatever they
may be. I recently had one in which my dog could talk, without moving it's lips.
Pretty good trick huh? The dog told me that she had to leave me soon and I
awoke in a start, as she is precious to me as most pets are. Well, I didn't know
what to make of it, at first thinking that this was some psychic indication
that perhaps she might die soon. When I left for work that morning, she appeared
normal, but I was still concerned. Returning home that afternoon, she was gone.
Not dead, gone. Well a search of the neighborhood ensued and within about ten
minutes I had found her. Pretty weird! I wonder if she was contemplating escape
all along and I picked up on it while sleeping. (She sleeps in the same room)
  As far as controling my dreams, I still haven't been able to do it, maybe I 
just need more practice. I don't feel that this activity would be anything more
than recreation though, since the understanding one might derive from a dream
is a product of the subconcious mind which has a remarkable memory, and
is very objective. Manipulation would be a concious effort, and would be
idealistic in it's approach. I can manipulate them slightly, but I am more 
working more from memory of the dream than from a random stream of conciousness.
I have rambled now I see, so nuff said!

I have a vivid memory of controlling one dream.  I was having a bit of a night-
 mare, where I was being chased by a pack of rabid dogs.  I tripped and fell,
  and the dogs were all over me.

So I said to myself, "This isn't real.  This is a dream.  This is just Cheryl
 crawling on top of me."  And I wake up, and sure enough, Cheryl was crawling
  on top of me.


Then I woke up again, and she wasn't really there.  Bummer.
 <_Jym_>

RE: .15
    
    Just some nits.
    
    "the generally accepted theory ..."
    
    There is no generally accepted theory of dreams.  There are a group
    of theories which apply practical application to dream interpretation,
    the psycho-analytic theories of dreams.  Freud originated
    psycho-analytic dream theory, and it was developed and/or modified
    by his followers such as Jung.  (By the way, I don't disagree with
    psycho-analytic dream theory, although I think that it is incomplete;
    I just wished to point out that it is generally accepted only among
    a particular community who form a community in part because they
    generaly accept it).
    
    Jung himself pointed out that dream symbolism and content is, in
    broad outline, rather mallible.  He noted that while his patients'
    dreams, as reported durring psycho-analysis, tended to conform to
    his theories of archetypes, Freud's patients dreams just as clearly
    conformed to Freud's sexual symbolisms, and Adler's patients similarly
    followed Adler's theories (which I am not familar with).  All this
    without any deliberate, conscious directing on the part of the
    therapist.
    
    The NLP people (Neuro-Linguistic Programming; a system of techniques
    which I find a lot of good ideas in, but which I do not generally
    believe as valid) talk about useful lies.  Most of their theories,
    they say, are lies -- there is no truth in them.  Nevertheless they
    work, which is what counts.
    
    What this boils down to, is that you should find a system of dream
    interpretation which "feels good" to you, and use it.  If it works
    then it represents a useful "personal truth" for you.  You should
    keep in mind, however, that that does not make it a universal truth,
    i.e., one that will work for all people, or which will necessarily
    be the right starting point for you in a different context.
    
    					Topher

    I understand that researchers have determined that *everyone* dreams.
    Until I heard this I always contended that I did not dream because
    I have *zero* recollection of any of my dreams.  I do know that,
    at least sometimes I dream, because on rare occasions, I have suddenly
    awakened and realized that it was the sound of my own voice that
    woke me - apparently I called out as a result of some dream action
    but have never been able to recall the dream even tho' I tried at
    the moment.  What can one read into such a situation???
    
    						Bill
    

    There is *something* which prevents us from remembering our dreams
    clearly.  That something is obviously more effiecient in your case.
    
    A psycho-analytic theory would say that it is a mechanism of
    "repression", i.e. that you are actively avoiding confronting the messages
    that the dreams carry.
    
    Other theories say that forgetting dreams is a normal function,
    perhaps to avoid confusion between dream-reality and external-reality,
    and that you are simply better at it than others.  In this view,
    failure of the mechanism is handy, in that it gives us a view of
    the depths of our mind which is difficult to get otherwise, but
    that a lack of such "leakage" doesn't say anything one way or the
    other.
    
    Others (notably Crick of DNA fame) feel that the barrier
    against remembering dreams is important and that its penetration
    represents a less than optimal state.  He would say that you are
    exceptionally healthy in this regards, and you are better off keeping
    it that way.  I should say that Crick represents a very small minority.
    
    There are many techniques for starting to remember your dreams.
    The simplest is to simply start a dream diary even though you have
    no dreams to remember (a dream diary may be written or spoken, which
    ever is more convenient for you).  The very first thing you should
    do upon awakening is to free associate into the diary.  Record whatever
    images, phrases, events, memories, etc. come to mind.  These will
    tend to be associated, at least partially, with your last dream.
    These free associations are interesting in their own right, even
    if they are not dream related, and in time you will find that you
    are remembering dream fragments and even whole dreams.  All this
    is *most* effective when done when you wake up "early" before going
    back to sleep.  Not only are you more likely then to have awaken
    from a dream, but this process seems to make dreams that follow
    more vivid (you may even find yourself experiencing lucid dreaming,
    though lets take it one step at a time).
    
    Good luck.
    
    				Topher

    Re: .15
    
    I have many dreams (much many of them) that just seem to be 
    emptying the garbage can of the day's trash.  But I also have dreams
    that repeat themes, and dreams that show new themes being born.
    And the interesting thing is that the old themes don't ease off
    and make way for new ones until I've consciously addressed them.
    
    You probably don't have an incredibly boring subconscious.  But
    if it keeps harping on the same themes, maybe your conscious mind
    should start listening.  You know how little kids will repeat the
    same thing, over and over, until they feel sure the adult is truly
    listening to them?  (And usually that adult will do so only to tell
    them to cool it.)  What you may need to do in order to activate
    other dream scenarios is to show your subconscious that you take
    its current messages seriously; at least write them down, perhaps
    reflect on them, think about the symbols and the action and what 
    they might mean to you, personally.
    
    Anne Faraday's books on dream interpretation and control make an
    interesting point.  She says that she did not begin having lucid
    dreams (where she was consciously able to "direct" the action) until
    she had spent a long "apprenticeship", so to speak, faithfully
    recording the messages her subconscious was sending her.  If I reflect
    on it, that's fair; the subconscious is probably reluctant to
    relinquish its "control" over the content of dreams until your
    conscious has demonstrated in good faith that it's interested in
    what the subconscious has to say.  (I can just imagine the subconscious
    muttering to itself ("D____d ego controls everything else; why 
    should I let it control the only thing I've got going?") :-)
    
    Marcia

    Re: .18
    
    Along with Topher's suggestions, you might try having someone wake
    you up when they notice you appear to be dreaming...or, you could
    have a radio wake you up earlier than normal, just for the purpose
    of trying to catch yourself in the middle of a dream.
    
    Sweet dreams!
    
    Jerri

RE: .20
    
    Steven LaBerge in his book Lucid Dreaming (see note 10.31) provided
    another perspective on why recording your dreams seems to help in
    attaining a lucid dream state.  Briefly stated, it seems logical
    that one would have to learn to be conscious of ones dreams while
    awake before learning to be conscious of ones dreams while asleep.
    
    					Topher

    One of the things that has shown up in my dreams for years is houses.
    There are even several "common" ones that, when I see the action
    is taking place in one of them, I think to myself "oh, here I am 
    again."  The meager information I found on the symbolism of houses 
    in dream interpretation books didn't feel right.
    
    And one day, after years of noticing and recording "house dreams"
    I suddenly hit on the idea that I'm an introspective, self-reflective
    sort of person, always building (get it? nyuk, nyuk) on my philosophies
    of life from my experiences and trying to make constructs from combos
    of new and old information.  It made sense that this pattern of
    thinking would somehow be represented in dream scenarios.  When
    I went back and tried interpreting my "house dreams" along the lines
    of "what set of mental constructs and beliefs do the details of
    this particular house represent?" I was very successful.
    
    Bathrooms for you may be another instance of the same type of thing--
    not that they represent to you what houses do to me, but that they
    symbolise some abiding mental habit or thought pattern or concern
    that might be subtle because it's so pervasive.
    
    Maybe you can get started by thinking, on a totally boring, mundane
    level just what bathrooms are for:  cleaning up, shedding waste,
    hiding, doctoring (we keep all our first-aid supplies in ours) come
    to (my) mind.  Then "feel out" if any of those concepts have special
    relevance for you.
    
    Marcia

re: .25, .26

Didn't one of Jung's classic dream interpretations have to do
with a house as a metaphor for the human personality?  In
fact I seem to recall he built his last house (the tower by
the side of some Swiss lake) as an external representation
of his "inner life" of the mind.  Maybe someone else recalls
more of the details?

    Reply 17 contains some of the best advice I've ever heard about 
    interpreting dreams.  In addition to Jung and Freud, Gestalt
    Therapy has a dream interpretation theory.  Another method I found
    interesting was Edgar Cayce's.  

    Mike

    I had a particularly interesting dream control incedent a few years
    ago.
    
    I had been trying to have some control over my dreams without any
    success (basically because I had no idea how to). Anyway in this
    dream I was walking along some railroad tracks (along a section
    in Natick in which I spent my youth) and suddenly realized "I'm
    in a dream"! Yippee! now for some fun! The first thing I did was
    to move my arms, look at my hands, Make sure I had complete control
    of myself as I am in the "real" world.  I did.
    
    (Before I go further I should probably describe my surroundings.
    There were two sets of tracks, I'm walking along one and the other
    is to my left. The track area is sunken so there are hills on both
    sides and it's also wooded on both sides.)
    
    
    The first thing out of the ordinary I notice is a sheet blowing
    in the wind off of a sign up ahead. It catches fire on one corner
    and as it burnes up, the light from the flame gets more and more
    intense until it burns out completely in an incredibly bright pinpoint
    of light.  I keep walking.
    
    Next there is a train on the other track coming towards me.
    but it's not really on the track it's floating about three feet
    in the air running along the track. It stops a couple of feet in
    front of me and shifts to it's right off the track and stops.
    I suddenly feel like I should run and look to the woods on my right
    but feel as if there's something evil in there and that's what they
    want me to do.
    
    I continue walking past the train and then decide to climb the hill
    on the right a bit and just watch. Another train is coming along
    the track that I was on, passes by me, then stops.
    Then a truck comes into view on the same track as the second train
    traveling at a very high speed. For some reason I know that he will
    stop before he hits the train so to really test my dream powers
    I decide to make him collide with the train. So with total
    concentration on the truck I follow it with my eyes and at the point
    that he was going to stop(I could feel that point) I carried it's
    motion forward (another ten feet or so) with whatever power that
    was, into the train. Now at the moment of impact the train opens
    up and allows the truck to pass thru.
    
    I'm startled at first and then laugh at my foolishness because I
    only controlled one aspect of the reality and the rest was still
    under it's own control. 
    
    Next a police officer is aproaching, I remember that I should wake
    up cause I have to go to work, start to do so, remember it's Saturday
    as the dream world is fading. Try to get back but it's too late,
    I'm awake.
    
    
    What fun!
    
    paul

I'd like to share an insightful dream (for myself) that I had, which
had a real twist.  I had been reading some notes in this notesfile 
about getting answers from dreams, in addition to reading the Silva 
Mind Control book.  

One night I decided that I really wanted to get an answer from my 
dreams that night.  I wanted an answer as to why I had been feeling 
so much confusion and disorientation in my life.

So I began to meditate and told myself that I would remember my dream,
understand it, and get my answer.  Here's what I dreamed:

I knew I was going in search of my answer.  I was in a complex of small
buildings with many rooms and tunnels.  At first, I found myself in
a room filled with people.  They were all busy talking and doing
things.  I decided, "No, my answer is not in here"...so I left that
room and began walking down a wide hallway that was quite long ahead
of me.  But, a small hallway to my left with a room off of it caught 
my attention.  I figured that my answer was probably further down the 
wide hallway but since this was just a dream and I felt I would get my 
answer sometime soon anyway, I decided to have a little fun exploring.

This is one of the few times I've realized I was dreaming and had
fun with it.  What a great feeling of freedom!  Anyway, I turned
left into the small hall, and then immediately left again into the
room off of it.  A wide flight of steps descended down into what
looked like someone's study.  As I slowly walked down the steps, I
figured it was important for me to notice everything and really
look around.  There were honors and badges and pictures and strange
emblems all over the walls.  At the foot of the stairs was a large
desk of dark wood with a large-backed chair behind it.  There were
so many things in the study and they all seemed very interesting.

I was excited and wanted to take it all in as quickly as possible.
I think I began having fear that the dream would end and I was
having a good time.  The room continued around to the left and
then back behind the staircase.  As I walked around that direction, 
a large, old, brass bed came into view and to my horror, an old man 
was sleeping in it!  His things were all around the room.  I was
scared about being there with him and snooping around while he was 
sleeping and I feared that I would wake him up.

As I stood there quietly, wondering what to do, he began to wake up.
I quietly turned and left as quickly as possible, hurrying back up
the stairs and out of the room...  and the dream ended.

Awake, I noticed it was just about time to get ready for work, but
I layed there thinking about the dream.  I was disappointed in
myself.  Why had I lost track of the purpose of my dream?  Why
hadn't I woken the old man up, since he obviously was part of my
dream and maybe would have been the one to give me my answer?  Why
hadn't I stayed and talked to him?  I sat there feeling frustrated.

I explained all of this to my husband.  Since it was all so real
and felt so natural to me, I pondered the idea of whether or not I
could return to the dream the next night and go back and talk to
the old man.  Perhaps he was a wise old man that would tell me
something really wonderful.

My husband, who is also my very best friend and mentor, said,
"Maybe you got your answer."  I was confused about this at first.
Then as we talked, I realized some things about myself.  Since I
have the attitude that I can get "answers" anywhere (which I've said
many times as many of you know), I may ignore them when they're in
front of me.  Since I don't think I need to search, I may take that
to an extreme and not even SEE.

This doesn't mean I need to search...it means I don't need NOT TO.
Resisting something has always caused me to go flying off in the
extreme other direction.  Then when I become aware of being at the
other extreme, and being aware of BOTH extreme positions, I can try 
to be a little more balanced between the two...where things flow much 
better.

To me, the dream demonstrated that I had been feeling confused 
because I wasn't hanging around (mentally) to see things and get 
answers for myself.  It was an extreme position I was taking in 
comparison to my "searching" some years ago.  

I still believe the answers are all around...but I need to keep my 
eyes open and desire knowing them, to see them.

Fun dream!  I'll have to do that again!

Jerri

For you dream control freaks, you gotta see the movie, "Dreamscape"
starring Dennis Quaid.  It's 3 or 4 years old, usually found in the
Science Fiction section of the video rental store.  

It's about people who have the ability to enter other people's
dreams, and become one of the main characters in that dream.

- J	            - Jim
< Note 235.7 by TROPIC::SANTIAGO >
                             -< Tales of Power... >-

    
    
    - Dreams control is simple, provided the subject has enough personal
      power ( read Castanedas' books ) so that he can focus his " second
      attention " ( or WILL, according to G.I. Gurdjieff ) on the task
      of dreaming...-

In reference to .-1:

   I have seen (and recorded on VCR) "Dreamscape". Though it is an 
interesting (and fun) movie, I don't consider it pertinent to the subject 
of dream control (except maybe in the "Snakeman" episode, where Senoi 
methods are BRIEFLY mentioned -- and not too accurately described).

   The movie is a combination adventure and psychological fantasy which 
explores the implications of the ability to enter another person's dreams. It
is not an exploration of the implications of dream control. To be perfecly 
honest, it is very frightening to me, because I really wouldn't want anyone 
I didn't know poking around in my dreams. I don't care how good they are or 
whether or not their intentions were good.

   By the way: I don't consider people who are "into" dream control to be 
"freaks". In fact, it is those who ignore or are unaware of their dreams who
are the freaks. 

   Dreams are one of the primary channels of communication between the conscious
and subconscious minds. To be aware of them is to be aware of a large part 
of yourself. A person who can control and/or direct them is a person who is 
not only in touch with his/her deep mind, but who has its cooperation on a 
deeper level than most others. In other words, dream controllers are more 
balanced and integrated than most others.

                                                      -Robert Brown III

    
    
         This may never be read being that the note is rather old, but
     I really can't resist. I am new to this conference but am very
     interested in the subject matter. As far as controlling dreams
     I as well did rather skillfully as a kid. Not to be funny but I
     spent countless nights on "Lost in Space" remember the show with
     Will and the robot etc....I would dream I went there,(which ever planet
     they happen to be on at the time), I would walk up to there dinner
     table sit down they would say hello, we'd talk etc.. then I'd wakeup.
     But the most fun was going back the next night and picking up where
     I left off night after night I would settle in and concetrate for
    a short time and within minutes I would be walking back in, I always
    entered from the "outside" And usually Will would be the first one
    to see me and he would great me like i had come back from somewhere
     This all made it seem so realalistic, it was great..the memory
    has got me smiling from ear to ear while I'm writing this..
    anyway had to tell someone who would'nt look at me like I was purple.
     I have'nt really been able to do that since I was about 10 or so
      but I have'nt really tried.
    
     sb
    

    
    
    RE: .33  sb
    
    Kids are magical!  All we need to do is reconnect with that
    magical child who is still very much alive inside us.  Happy
    dreaming!
    
    Carole

    re: .33
       
         Most people who use notes have all the notes in that
    conference "up-to-date" (by either having read all of them
    or by 'SET SEEN/BEFORE=1-2-89' (e.g.) therefore we get to
    see every new note that gets entered, no matter what its
    number.  Soooo, most of us will have seen (if not read)
    the note you just entered.
         You do not have to fear this crowd too much in regards
    to whatever your dreams are...I think most of us, no matter
    how staid or dignified our appearances may be, have dreams
    that are strange, wierd, childish, etc., etc.  Yours sound
    rather benign and very friendly to me...I'll trade you for
    some of mine.  ;-)
    
    Frederick
    

================================================================================
Note 1006.2                       crystal shops                           2 of 2
LOWRID::KELLEY                                        6 lines  21-MAR-1989 14:43
                               -< DARE TO DREAM >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                  
    Who do I go to to get my dreams interpereted.. and how can you remember
    them??
    

================================================================================
Note 1006.3                       crystal shops                           3 of 3
USAT05::KASPER "In the eye of a storm hope is born"  15 lines  21-MAR-1989 16:03
                     -< Nothing to with crystals, but... >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

re: .2 (LOWRID::KELLEY)

   Maybe the moderators will want to move this but...

   The best person to interpret your dreams is you.  It takes some time
   to learn your personal 'dream language' but it pays off.  

   The best way to increase your recall is to start by writing them
   down as soon as possible upon waking up and trying to apply what
   you have learned from them in your daily life.

   There are a number of good books that can help.  Try to stay away
   from 'dream dictionaries'.

   Terry

    Remembering dreams is a learned skill.  One way to begin is to keep
    a journal/pad and pen/pencil by your bed where you can find it in
    the dark.  When you wake up from a dream, chances are you'll only
    be partly awake.  DON'T turn on the light, it'll wake you up
    completely, and you may forget some of what you've dreamed.  Find 
    your writing materials and write down as much as you can in the
    dark -- it'll look awful in the morning, but you'll be able to read
    it.  The more you do this, the more of your dreams you'll remember.
    
    When you interpret your dreams (and I agree with .3 -- you're the
    best one to do it), try to internalize each element, that is, think
    of each character, each part of each scene, each action, as a part
    of yourself.  Even/especially the bad parts -- this does NOT mean
    that you're capable of doing or being all the horrible things in
    your nightmares, only that these things are indicators of where
    you are at this time in your life.  At first, try to find the time
    to write or speak your interpretations aloud and read/listen carefully.
    I suggest that you'll learn a lot about your real inner self as you
    practice.
    
    Good luck.

    
    Re.38 (Knighting)
    
    How about using a cassette recorder to speak/mumble the dream into,
    as opposed to a pad and pen?
    
    Anyone ever tried this?  (I haven't.)  
    
    Cindy

    It's worth a try.  I think talking would wake *me* up more than writing,
    but if it works for you, that's the important thing.
    
    One other thought.  Don't try too hard to connect your dreams with
    specific events in your life (unless, of course, there are obvious
    correlations, such as dreaming you've won the lottery and waking
    up to find your bed is full of money -- if this should happen, I
    get $500 a word for dream advice 0,-).  I've found that dreams are
    more likely to tell me how and why I am the way I am than what's
    going to happen, although there's convincing evidence that that
    happens too.
    
    						Gary

re: .39 (Cindy)

    Yep. I use a small recorder (mini-cassette)  it does work better
than trying to write them down.  I seem to understand my mumbles better
than I understand by scribbles.  The catch is getting them down on paper
before you collect hours of recordings.  I try to transcribe them weekly.
Also, in using a recorder, I find I collect more detail than when trying
to write them down. 

A am also working on a symbol database (MSDOS) that I can use to research 
how the various symbols are repeated and used in my dreams.  So far I have 
collected two years worth.  

Terry

	There was once a queen of the island of Madagascar named 
	Ranavalona who issued a curious edict: she forbade anyone 
	she knew to appear in her dreams.  

	Those who disobeyed this order were immediately executed.

	Kinda makes you hope reincarnation doesn't occur.  =8-)

    I read someplace of other that high doses of vitamin B6 would make
    your dreams more vivid. It works! If I take too largea dose, I just
    wake up instead of dreaming. If you try it, get a bottle of 100 mg
    available at any drugstore. I have tried up to 700 mg. The mechanism
    seems to have something to do with the metabolic pathway for dopamine
    being enhanced. Since these doses are so much higher than the bodies
    RDA (>2 mg) long term use is not recommended. The mind compensates
    eventually anyway. The effect seems to be potentiated by vigorous
    exercise. Take some about 1/2 hour before jogging or weightlifting.
    I do this late in the evening without interfering with my sleep.
        I am one of those individuals that has a night time consciousness
    that is almost totally disconnected from daytime. I spite of working
    off and on with dreams over the years, I can wake from a very vivid
    dream and hardly be able to remember it at all. Once in a long while
    I will have a lucid dream. In the last one I took off flying, which
    reminded me that it had to be a dream. I continued on out of a long
    pedestrian tunnel only to wake up.
    	One of the best books I ever saw on dreaming was titled The
    Dreammakers. One of the authors last names was Corriere. another
    was Hart. I lost my copy and its been out of print for about 10
    years. Laberge, Faraday and other authors of books about Lucid dreaming
    don't seem aware of this book.
    	After taking LSD back in the 60's I had occasional dreams that
    I took to be OOBE's. I finally concluded that they were just dreams
    with a sensation of movement in the body. I would try to open my
    eyes to see where I was but everything would be dark! Just like
    the back of my eyelids. Actually my interest in dreams is a result
    of this type of problem. I am one of those people who don't consciously
    visualize(or punctualize!) except in dreams. Oh well 
    
    					Peace be upon you,
    						john turner

    re: .43
    
    Has anybody else had experiences using B6 vitamins for vivid dream
    inducing? It sounds interesting.  One thing I've found helpful for
    doing this (without taking anything) is getting into a centered, calm
    state of mind/body before going to sleep, as opposed to plopping into
    bed dead tired and sinking like a stone into sleep. Maybe doing some
    affirming or 'programming' (no, not on a VAX!) in that state.
    When I don't wake up too fast and then take some time trying to recall
    even small, insignificant parts of the dream or feeling that remains,
    it ususally stays with me.  My dream-self likes it when I give it some
    sincere attention and take it 'for real'. Even though it may not have
    been very lucid or vivid, it then becomes much more meaningful and
    alive.
    Any other helpful hints on lucid dream inducing anyone would care to 
    share?
    "No don't wake me, please don't shake me, leave me where I am, 
     I'm only sleeping..." - John Lennon
    |^)
    paul
   

    
    Taking B6 in doses greater than 50mg/day on an ongoing basis (unless 
    under a doctor's supervision for a specific ailment such as Carpal
    Tunnel Syndrome) runs the risk of doing permanent nerve damage.
    
    60 minutes did a report on this a couple of years ago.  A woman had
    been taking 500mg. for a long period of time and developed symptoms
    minicking MS.  After she stopped taking them, the symptoms subsided,
    however it was too late - some permanent nerve damage was done.  In 
    addition to this report, my neurologist said the same thing about
    taking no more than 50mg. per day.
    
    I put something on this in the MEDICAL conference - if you'd like to 
    have it put it here, let me know and I'll go dig it up.
    
    Cindy
             

    
    
                I, after about six weeks of daily B-6 (50 to 100mg.) in-
    gestions, have discontinued its use. Why? I felt I was loosing sleep.
    That is to say that I developed insomnia. Also, as was mentioned a few
    notes back the increased dreaming had leveled off and of late decreased
    to level equal to before I started the experiment with B-6. July 13 was
    the last day I took 50mg. I'll wait a week or so to see if the insomnia
    goes away. If it does I may continue but at a smaller doseage. I truly
    love to dream but, alas, am one of thoes folks who don't dream (or 
    don't remember what they've dreamed).
                 re: .46 
                 I would like to read the info you entered into the other
    notes file. I'm still on the fence about taking the B-6 again.
    
    
                             Later,
                              Mark
    
    

    Paul .45,
    
    Some things I've found helpful regarding lucid dreaming:
    
    The first thing that helped me a great deal was when I realized the
    importance of crystallizing my intention - before entering any new 
    area of study or experience.  (For when a person enters a new area 
    with the primary intention of entertaining oneself as opposed to 
    seriously approaching it is an opportunity for healing and growth, 
    the results from each can tend to be quite different.) 
    
    I also came to recognize that sleep is just another state of consciousness
    and that dreaming has an extremely important role in maintaining
    and/or improving one's well-being on all levels:  physical, mental,
    emotional and spiritual.
    
    In the dreamworld much useful information can be shared with you. 
    It becomes a matter of becoming conscious enough during the dream state
    to direct your activity in the dream and sometimes the dream itself
    without necessarily 'waking up'.  There are several books written about
    lucid dreaming, and I haven't read any, but still they might be helpful
    in assisting one to gain a better understanding the process.
    
    Jung did a lot of good work with dreams and the dreaming process and a 
    man by the name of Jeremy Taylor is well known as a person having a
    great deal of expertise and understanding of dream state, incorporating
    much of the work Jung did.
    
    My recommendation to anyone is to clarify your intentions and then
    study accordingly.  If lucid dreaming is meant to be a tool for
    personal growth for any particular person, I believe it will become
    fairly evident.  The universe has a way of guiding us exactly to what 
    we need when we need it.  
    
    I would not recommend taking any substance such as mega doses of vitamin 
    B6, to induce lucid dreaming.  Imho, it can be rather counter-productive 
    to use anything other than the power of one's own mind and heart for an 
    undertaking such as this.  There are no short-cuts to wisdom. :-) 
    
    Hope this is helpful as a start.
    
    Peace,
    
    Karen.*

          <<< HYDRA::DISK$USERPACK02:[NOTES$LIBRARY]MEDICAL.NOTE;2 >>>
                       -< Medical Questions and Answers >-
================================================================================
Note 39.10                  CARPAL TUNNEL SYNDROME???                   10 of 49
FDCV13::PAINTER                                     319 lines  20-JUL-1987 18:23
          -< Article on B6, CTS, Asthma, PMS and Sickle Cell Anemia >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

{From Nutrition Action Health Letter, Vol.13, No.9, October 1986, pp.1,4-6}

B6 - Vitamin and Drug?
----------------------

By: Bonnie F. Leibman

Two things are known for sure about vitamin B6:  More Americans 
consume less-than-recommended levels of this vitamin than any other, 
and excessive doses can impair the nervous system.  But in between 
feast and famine, vitamin B6 may have unforeseen abilities to treat 
health problems such as premenstral syndrome (PMS), asthma, sickle cell 
disease and carpal tunnel syndrome (CTS).  In each case, more research 
is needed, but the preliminary evidence is quite promising.

To understand clearly how B6 can be used to treat disease, it's 
necessary to step back and review a few basics.  First of all, what 
happens when people get less of the nutrient than they need?

The year was 1952.  In hospitals in Texas, Arkansas, and then other 
parts of the country, otherwise healthy babies were turning up with 
convulsive seizures.  Physicians noticed that the infants had one 
thing only in common: each had been fed formula that contained too 
little B6.(1)

The severity of the infants' response to a deficiency of B6 underscores 
the vitamin's importance.  Over 60 of the body's biochemical reactions 
won't happen without it.  Some of these biochemical reactions are 
crucial in synthesizing and altering amino acids, the building blocks 
of protein, which explains why people on high-protein diets may need 
more B6.  The vitamin also helps the body make a component of red 
blood cells, as well as serotonin, a chemical that carries messages 
throughout the brain.

When adults are deprived of B6 for weeks or months, they become 
confused and depressed.  Their skin, mouths, and tongues become 
inflamed, they get lesions at the corners of their mouths, and they, 
too, may develop convulsions.  But these are obvious symptoms of 
deficiency, caused by diets that contain very little of the vitamin, 
or by drugs that impair the body's ability to absorb or use B6.  
Recently, scientists have begun to question whether less-severe 
shortages can also cause health problems.

B6 and the RDA.  According to estimates by the U.S. Department of 
Agriculture (USDA), half of all Americans get less than two-thirds of 
the Recommended Dietary Allowance (RDA) for B6.  No other nutrient 
has as poor a record.  But since only biochemical tests can diagnose a 
true deficiency, it's too early to say how many people are actually 
getting too little B6.

Some scientists argue that the problem lies not with B6 but with the 
RDA.  Dr. Robert Reynolds of the USDA Human Nutrition Research Center 
in Beltsville, Maryland, says bluntly, "The current RDAs are 
unrealistically and unnecessarily high for many age groups.  The 
incidence of B6 deficiency is very rare in the U.S."

But other experts think the RDA is not too high.  Dr. James Leklem of 
Oregon State University notes that the margin of safety between 
current and dangerously low levels of intake is small.  "The average 
intake is probably about 1.5 to 1.6 milligrams," he comments.  "Much 
below 1.3 milligrams, you run into the possibility of long-term 
consequences, such as nervous disorders, disease or an immune system 
that isn't operating at it maximal capacity, especially in the 
elderly."

Leklem believes that researchers won't know how many Americans are 
deficient until studies look carefully for health problems in people 
who are getting marginally low levels.  To play it safe, shoot for the 
RDA.  For those who think they don't eat enough B6-rich foods (see 
chart below) a daily too-milligram supplement won't hurt.

Women in particular are more likely to run short on B6, because they 
usually eat less food than men do.  Also, pregnant and breastfeeding 
women, and women on the pill may need extra B6 (see additional article 
below).  What's more, a preliminary study suggests that middle-aged 
(and presumably older) women may need slightly more than young adult 
women (2).

But the real excitement about B6 is the recent research which suggests 
that doses well over the RDA can be used to treat disease.  For 
certain disorders, which are not caused by any deficiency, the vitamin 
seems to act as a drug rather than a nutrient.  When B6 is used in 
this way, it is administered in relatively large amounts of 50 to 200 
milligrams a day.  But is that much B6 harmful?

Too much of a Good Thing.  In 1983, Dr. Herbert Shaumberg and 
colleagues at the Albert Einstein College of Medicine shocked 
consumers and scientists when they reported that high levels of B6 - a 
water-soluble vitamin - could cause nerve damage. (2)  Seven adults 
taking 2,000-6,000 milligrams of the vitamin daily for two to 40 
months developed unstable gait, numbness in their feet and hands, 
clumsiness, and nerve degeneration.  Fortunately, the damage was not 
permanent.

Since then, both Shaumberg and Dr. Gareth Parry, of Hahnemann Medical 
College in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, have seen similar symptoms in 
people taking only 500 milligrams a day. (4,5)  One of Parry's 
patients claimed to have taken only 200 milligrams, but Parry is not 
convinced that this level is dangerous.  "I'm currently advising 
patients (with PMS) not to exceed the 100 milligrams," says Parry, 
"but I'm not convinced 200 milligrams is unsafe."

The memory of B6 toxicity is still fairly fresh in consumers' minds.  
To keep it there, the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) should 
require a warning on the labels of supplements containing more than 
100 milligrams per tablet.  But the specter of nerve damage shouldn't 
close the file on B6.  On the contrary, new research on PMS, asthma, 
CTS, and sickle cell disease hint that B6 may help treat these 
seemingly unrelated health problems.

Sickle Cell Disease.  One in every 350-400 black babies born in the 
U.S. has sickle cell disease.  For these people, life is literally a 
series of crises.  A crisis occurs when some part of the body, often 
the abdomen, fails to get enough oxygen.  The lack of oxygen can cause 
excruciating pain that may last several days.

Scientists have traced the defect that causes sickle cell to 
hemoglobin, the resident protein of red blood cells that carries 
oxygen throughout the body.  In sickle cell sufferers, one of the 
hundreds of amino acids that make up the hemoglobin molecule is 
replaced with a different amino acid.

When the abnormal hemoglobin is surrounded by too little oxygen, it 
forms a long crystal that elongates the cell into a sickle shape.  
Sickle-shaped cells are more likely to break open, leading to anemia.

Recently, Dr. Clayton Natta of Columbia University and USDA's Reynolds 
noticed that patients with sickle cell disease had too little B6 in 
their plasma (the fluid portion of the blood).  When they gave five 
patients 50 milligrams of the vitamin twice a day for two months, the 
sickest patient had much shorter, much less severe crisis. (11)

A few clues don't add up to a cure, but they do pave the way for 
future studies.  In fact, NIH is now seeking proposals for studies to 
investigate the link between sickle cell and several nutrients, 
including B6.

Asthma.  "We just stumbled onto it."  That's how Reynolds describes 
his and Natta's discovery that B6 may also help asthma sufferers.  
While running routine tests on apparently healthy "controls" to use in 
their sickle cell study, the researchers found that several had 
extremely low levels of B6.  Surprisingly, all had bronchial asthma.

Intrigued by their findings, the pair looked for earlier scientific 
reports linking B6 and asthma.  Sure enough, a 1975 study found fewer 
asthmatic symptoms in 76 children who were given 200 milligrams of B6 
a day for one month. (12)  So Reynolds and Natta ran a trial in which 
they gave seven asthmatic adults 100 milligrams of B6 a day.  The 
patients reported fewer, shorter, and less severe attacks. (13)

Reynolds acknowledges that their discovery was "a serendipitous 
observation, with no placebos and no controls."  However, the exciting 
results have spurred them to embark on a large-scale, well-controlled 
study that will be completed in two years.

Carpal Tunnel Syndrome.  In the center of your wrist is a tunnel 
formed by bones (on the bottom and sides) and a tight band of fibrous 
tissue (on top).  Inside the tunnel is a nerve and several tendons 
that connect the arm muscles to the fingers.

Minor injuries, such as falling backward on your hand, or years of 
continual strain produced by an activity such as typing, can cause the 
tendons to swell.  Swelling compresses the nerve, making the 
sufferer's hand and fingers tingle or feel numb or painful.  Many 
people with CTS lose the ability to button their clothes, eat with a 
knife or fork, or use a pencil.

Dr. John Ellis of Mt. Pleasant, Texas, was the first to suggest that 
B6 might improve CTS. (14)  But some neurologists have criticized 
Ellis for not doing the standard electrical tests that objectively 
determine whether a patient's nerve has healed.

However, Dr. Allan Bernstein, a neurologist with Kaiser Permanente in 
Hayward, California, recently completed a study, not yet published, 
that did include electrical tests.  "After four months on 150 
milligrams of B6, 30-40 percent of patients improved without any other 
treatment," Bernstein reports.

Ellis says, "Unless there is beginning of atrophy or muscle weakness, 
a CTS patient may benefit from three months of 50 to 100 milligrams of 
B6 daily."  If the hand muscles have started to weaken, the patient 
should have surgery as soon as possible.

Premenstral Syndrome (PMS).  Irritability, anxiety, headaches, and 
depression - those are just a few of the problems that many women 
experience during the week before their menstrual period.  Several 
studies have concluded that B6 alleviates the symptoms in about half 
of all sufferers.  But these studies were "open" trials, in which the 
women seeking treatment were told they felt better.  More recent 
trials have shown that up to 70 percent of women said they felt better 
after taking a placebo. (6)

Results of double-blind studies - in which neither the women nor the 
researchers knew who was getting B6 are mixed.  In some studies B6 
made a difference; in others it didn't. (6,7-10)

In short, the jury is still out on B6 and PMS.  Currently, researchers 
at the National Institute of Health (NIH) are signing up women for a 
new trial.  Chris Hodge, a social worker with the Menstrually Related 
Mood Disorder Program, suggests that several earlier studies may have 
found B6 to be ineffective because the women tested didn't actually 
have PMS.  In an upcoming study, the women will be more carefully 
selected.  They will take up to 200 milligrams of B6 or a placebo for 
nine months, and rate their moods daily in a diary.

* * * * * * 

The recent, unexpected findings about B6 make it one of today's most 
talked-about vitamins.  If the research that's now in progress 
supports the results of there early studies, B6 may turn out to be one 
of our most important nutrients.

FOOD SOURCES OF B6
------------------

FOOD* (serving size)		B6 (% USRDA)
--------------------		------------
Beef liver (4 oz.)		81
Potato w/skin, baked (1 large)	35
Chicken livers (4 oz.)		34
Banana (1)			33
Turkey, light, skinned (4 oz)	32
Chicken breast, skinned (1/2)	26
Ham, fresh (4 oz)		26
Raisin Bran (3/4 cup)		25
Light tuna in water (3 oz)	21
Lentils (1 cup) 		18
Broccoli (1 spear)		18
Kidney beans, canned (1 cup)	16
Ground beef, lean (4 oz)	15
Wheat germ, toasted (1/4 cup)	14
Raisins (1/2 cup)		9
Whole wheat bread (2 slices)	5
Milk (1 cup)			5
Apple (1)			4
Peanut butter (1 tbl)		3

Footnotes
---------
1 - J.Am.Med.Assoc. 154: 405,406,1954.
2 - Am.J.Clin.Nutr. 42:226,1985
3 - N.Engl.J.Med. 309:445,1983.
4 - N.Engl.J.Med. 311:986,1984.
5 - Neurology 35:1466,1985.
6 - J.Intl.Med.Res. 13:174,1985.
7 - Acta Obstet.Gyn.Scand. 64:667,1985.
8 - Lancet 1:1177,1972.
9 - Practitioner 228:425,1984.
10 - Infertility 3:155:1980.
11 - Am.J.Clin.Nutr. 40:235,1984.
12 - Ann.Allergy 35:93,1975.
13 - Am.J.Clin.Nutr. 41:684,1985.
14 - Proc.Natl.Acad.Sci. 79:7494,1982.
15 - Am.J.Clin.Nutr. 32:2257,1979.
16 - Lancet 1: 7809,1973.
17 - Am.J.Clin.Nutr. 32:2249,1979.
18 - Am.J.Clin.Nutr. 34:1731,1981.
19 - Am.J.Clin.Nutr. 41:21,1985.


FOR WOMEN ONLY - P. 6
--------------
Women Taking the Pill:

In the 1970's, researchers like Dr. Avanelle Kirksey of Purdue
University were concerned that the estrogen in oral contraceptives
might deplete the body of B6. (15)  But today, manufacturers are
adding less estrogen to oral contraceptives, so Kirksey's concern is
abated. 

Still, women taking the pill who frequently feel depressed may find a 
B6 supplement of five or 10 milligrams a day helps.  A 1973 study 
showed that 40  milligrams a day alleviated depression in pill-users, 
but lower levels may now work because the newer oral contraceptives 
are weaker. (16)

Pregnant Women:

Blood levels of B6 drop during the last six months of pregnancy.  
While some decline seems to be unavoidable, Kirksey thinks too big a 
drop isn't healthy.

She and others have found lower Apgar scores in infants of mothers who 
had relatively low blood B6 levels during pregnancy. (17,18)  The 
Apgar test assesses heart rate, muscle tone, and other indicators of a 
newborn's physical status at birth.

Kirksey recommends a daily prenatal supplement with 10 milligrams of 
B6.  Women should avoid excessive doses of B6 - or any other vitamin 
or mineral - during pregnancy.

Breastfeeding Women:

Most breastfed infants get less than the RDA of B6, but scientists 
can't agree on whether this is a problem (some think the RDA is too 
high). (19)  However, Kirksey points out that it's very difficult to 
determine just how much B6 an infant needs.

"We know that B6 is extremely important in the early development of 
the central nervous system," she explains.  "We see more deteriorating 
cells in the brains of animals whose mothers are deficient in the 
vitamin.  But we literally can't look at the brain structures of human 
infants."

Until researchers find out more, Kirksey recommends breastfeeding 
women continue to take a prenatal supplement of 10 milligrams.  Don't 
go overboard, because the supplements of 100 milligrams can impair 
breastfeeding.  Parents of bottle-fed infants needn't worry, because 
formulas provide "quite accurate" levels of B6, says Kirksey.

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                  Cindy,
                       Thank you for entering the B-6 information. It was
    most enlightening. I still have not taken any B-6 since July 13 and 
    the insomnia, though lessened in intensity, is still present. This may
    be due to it being hot and stuffy in my bedroom. I will wait at least
    another week and then perhaps take about 10mg. on occation at first.
    I was suprised to find out that many of the foods I eat on a regular 
    basis contained B-6.
                       The reason I chose to take B-6 to begin with was
    that I wanted to gain insight to myself through dreaming. I started
    to keep a dream diary. Each morning upon awakening I would jot down
    any dream bits I remembered. This was dificult as I can barely see 
    straight in the morning, it hurts to keep them open. initially all I
    got were fragments. Then, after a while whole dreams would stay with
    me, then the progress halted and I was back to just fragments. Soon
    my dream diary had page upon page of "I have impression of having 
    dreamed last night but no details". I soon gave up on the diary. When
    I started taking B-6 the same sequence took place (ramp up, steady 
    state, ramp down, nothing). It is almost as if I defeat the process
    of trying to learn from my dreams. 
                    The same sort of thing happens when I meditate. I'll
    begin to weave a scene and just as I start to make progress I realize
    that *I'm doing IT* and poof its gone. How very frustrating."Ah, to 
    sleep perchance to dream."
    
    
                                Later,
                                 Mark
     

    What have  I done to this discussion! Taking vitamin b6 for more
    than a few weeks produces a falling off just like described in .51
    I intended the use of B6 to be more of a slight kick to produce
    better results for someone on the verge of a break through. 
    
    	Incidently, somewhere I read that during certain phases of the
    moon dreams are more vivid. I won't say which lest I cause results
    by suggestion. However, has anyone else noted any relationship?
    
    	Several years ago I ran across a man who sold a machine that
    applied small electric pulses to the body to enhance the vividness
    of dreams. Sounds dangerous to me. At any rate he refused to answer
    my inquiries. Maybe the spirits of his electronic ouiji boards warned
    him away! He might have gotten into legal trouble with the post
    office. 
    
    	Anyway dream recall is enhanced if a person is awakened during
    the dream. It might be possible to modify an EMG biofeedback device
    to pick up the signals resulting from rapid eye movements connected
    with dreaming. A vibrator attached to the arm could alert someone
    that they were dreaming, allowing them to enter a lucid state. I
    believe that some variation of this was used by Steve Leberge in
    his lucid dream reseach.
    
    				nuff said for now,
    
    				john turner

    
    
       RE: 235.52
    
                 I haven't taken any B-6 since my last entry, but did 
    notice a definite increase during a particular phase of the Moon. I'll
    not mention which phase either. Quite happily I did gain the insight I
    was looking for. I don't plan to take any more B-6 because of the side
    affects. I'm instead taking an approach/attitude of allowing myself to 
    dream rather than making myself dream.
    
                              Later,
                               Mark
    
    

Good advice Karen.  Intent, I have found, is the key.  There is no need to
"induce" recall or lucidity in dreams if one is serious about learning from
them.  It is no more, imo, than communication/dialogue between your 
conscious mind and your subconscious.  If in a conversation with a friend, 
the friend discovers you aren't listening or believes you have no serious 
interest in their contrubution they will usually quit talking.  The same with 
dreams, in a way, except that when there is no conscious interest in working 
with dreams they do continue but aren't brought into consciousness.

In working with my own dreams I found that a simple affirmation of my intent
at bedtime was all I needed to enable recall of my dreams.  In the three years 
I did the work I recalled and journaled about 3000 dreams.  During that time 
when my interest waned so did my recall - when I got serious again my recall 
came back (at times I would recall and record four or more lengthly dreams a 
night and there were occasional lucid dreams as well).  During this process and 
through working with what I had recorded I learned a great deal about myself, 
my limitations, my motivations and gained some very useful knowledge concerning 
my own growth and potential.  For me *very* useful stuff!

Terry

	I remember someone telling me that for a therapy
	series, his/her analyst said to just look in
	the mirror at night and tell yourself, out loud,
	that you're going to remember your dreams, and it
	worked.  Maybe repeat it a couple-three times.

    Last night I had a new experience in dream control.  I had been reading
    Notes for a while before I went home, and at some point my dreams
    started reflecting some of the things I had been reading about.  One
    began to turn nightmarish and the usual techniques of going back over
    it and changing it were not working.  So, in the dream I reached down
    to a keyboard and pressed NEXT/UNSEEN and wiped the whole thing out.
    I didn't have any more bad ones...
    
    Ellen
    

    
    
    RE: .56....
    
    That's great!  I love it!
    
    Carole

    :-)