Conference hydra::dejavu

  Please be careful of what you create with these seminars.  They sound very
much like EST and Lifespring.  Lifespring was a seminar very much like what
you are referring too.  It was paid for by Dec. here in the Colorado.  After
a few people asked some important questions it was terminated.  Be careful.
What you do for your own personal growth is a great thing.  What is promoted
as an officialy supported corporate educational opportunity and turns out to
be a self help program may cause some trouble.  
  I am sure that you and all the other people have greatly benefited from this
program.  I don't benefit from it at all.  If it were a valid educational
opportunity in line with your job type I wouldn't be concerned.  I am concerned
because this idea of Dec paying for self help programs means that there is less
money for pay raises for honest workers, for valid Gift Matching and employee
recreation on the jobsite that are benificial for all employees.  Why does it
cost so much?? Could it be because the leaders of these seminars know that
corportaions have money???  Why couldn't it cost $100-$200 so you could pay
for it out of your own pocket?  Would you pay for it out of your own pocket?  Is
it that important to you?  How much would you pay out of pocket for it?  If this
program is that important then pay for it yourself.  Something earned has more
impact than something blindly given to you.  After the emotional high is over
please be honest with your self.  

Mikie, Co. Sp.

Quite independently, in the past, almost any kind of "educational" 
expense could be paid for by an employer and be tax exempt under 
section 127 of the Internal Revenue Code.

That section of the code was due to expire on December 31, 1985, 
and was not expected to be extended.

Such a course would almost certainly be classified as "Knowledge/
Perspective Broadening" rather than "Career Related", "Job Required", 
or "Critical Workforce Needs".  Consequently, payment for it would 
be viewed as taxable income and you would wind up paying taxes on
it.  Depending on your tax bracket, the taxes on the $1200 for the 
two courses could add up to a significant amount.

I agree that while such courses may broaden your perspective on life, 
they probably don't do much to improve your workplace productivity, and 
as a stockholder, I'd just as soon see the company's money better spent.

Tom

Ooooh!  I stuck a nerve here...

RE: .1

	Why shouldn't DEC pay for Self-Help programs?  If it helps the 
employee to be more productive, recognize opportunities, be more
organized, I'm all for it.

	Not taking your comment personally, I was an honest worker before
the workshop, and still am after.  The workshop only helped me to see that
honesty pays off in more ways than one.  I could say that I was not an
organized person before the workshop, and still not one now, changes don't
happen overnight.  I now recognize that I can do a better job by being
more organized, and am working towards that.

	Before the workshop I would just about say, "I have no problems.
I don't rob people or have any hangups."  Now I say, "I have problems,
and am doing something about it or am not doing something about it."
A problem I have is no organization, and distractions, both which prevent
me from giving 100% towards DEC.  Before the course I would say, "So,
it never was one of my strong points."...now I say "Yea, I see that and I
am doing something about it."

	DEC didn't reimburse me for taking the course.  At first I was
upset, but now my opinion is "Why be so upset about them not paying for it,
did I get my moneys worth?"  Now it isn't even that, it's beyond the money
that I paid.  It is worth that price and beyond.  I found out that they wouldn't
pay for the Basic and I went ahead and paid for the CPI.

RE .2

	I would have to say that the emotional high at the end of the course
was a great time at that moment, but looking back, now, I recognize it as a good
time; a week after the workshop I thought cheap thrill.

	Note, that I am recommending the workshop 3 months after having
taken it.  I, and other people around me have recognized a change for the
better in me.

Dan

I'm a graduate of Actualizations must be about 9 years ago, and like Dan,
I didn't really experience any tangible changes in my life afterwards
except for my attitude towards myself and life and believe me, that has
been quite signifigant. I'm not sure I can adequately explain the workshop
to somebody who has not experienced a workshop - kind of like trying to
explain Mexican food to somebody who has never eaten it. There is
something that happens when a group of people are gathered together for
growth that cannot be linearly explained. All you can do is observe what
happens. The AMA essentially denies that accupuncture works because they
cannot explain it. They ignore the fact that it does work (from personal
experience I know it works).
What I like about workshops such as these is that they give you tools to
go back into the real world and improve the quality of life for all those
around you, as opposed to some groups that teach you should drop out, give
them all your money, and teach that the real world is evil and should be
avoided.
I also have a problem with the financial end of workshops, and fortunately,
DEC paid for my original workshop 9 years ago. But since then, having
experienced what happens, I'm willing to pay for them myself, and if you know
how cheap I am, that's really something to get me to say that.
I've done workshops from about 4 other groups since then, and I've found that
the Insights group produces a great workshop and it's now $100 I believe.
Also, Stuart (from Actualizations) is a smart enough person to make more
money in the world of business so I don't believe he's in it for the money.
From personal experience with small businesses, all people see is the money
being raked in the front door, but they never see it being raked out the
back door for expenses. They really add up. Now I'm sure it's not a non-
profit organization, I don't think it's a ripoff, either.
So in the interest of brevity, let me just say that I highly reccommend
workshops such as these, and it doesn't really matter which - sort of like
feeding yourself at a Mexican restaurant vs a French restaurant. You get
filled up either way but different. The different workshops have different
flavors. No, I haven't run across a Baskin-Robbins workshop yet.
If anybody should be interested in any more details, they are welcome to
call me or stop by.
	-Paul dtn 226-6170

By the way, my nodename has nothing to do with the moonies - it has to
do with airplanes in case you were wondering.

Re .5:

Whoever would have thought otherwise?  Mooneys _are_ airplanes; aircraft with
a single wing spar and empennage ("tailfeathers") that looks like it's on
backwards.

Re previous:

There's a dilemmas here.  In one sense, a company-sponsored program like
the one described can be argued for on the grounds that anything that
improves performance, attentiveness, health, and efficiency makes the em-
ployee a better worker.

Not incorrect, but taken to its logical extreme, then, excercise programs,
and even vacation tours (as opposed to vacation salaries) could equally
be justified.

Somewhere, someone has to draw a line.  If ACTUALIZATIONS helped, and you
are willing to shell out $1,200 or thereabouts, great; otherwise, I think
it's a call by the sponsoring agency (in this case, Digital).

Steve Kallis, Jr.

			"Actualization" is a psychological term, and the seminar
		sounds like something psychological, not parapsychological
		(despite the apparent "experiential" approach - quite common in
		modern psychology, actually).  Then again, there's no psychology
		file . . .
				<_Jym_>

    
    
    DEC used to have an internal group that ran courses simialr to the
    Actualizations courses described here.  The group/course line was
    called CORE, the courses were Individual And Organizational
    Effectiveness and Increasing Individual Effectiveness.  I have heard
    nothing about them in a few years.  Has anyone else taken them?
     Has anyone taken them who has also taken Actualizations or similar
    programs?  I would be interested in hearing comparisons.  Does anyone
    know what happened to this program?
    
    
    /Rita
    
    

    I took Individual & Org Effectiveness in the fall of '81.  I also
    have not seen it around recently.  I don't know for sure, but it
    may have been axed in the general cost-cutting that has taken place
    over the last two years.
    
    I never took Actualizations, but based on my own experiences with
    CORE and reports of other people's with Actualizations, CORE tended
    to focus more on the practical aspects of relating to yourself and
    other people, with the idea in the background that the ideas could
    (should?) be implemented in your working life.
    
    I liked CORE very much; it was what started me along my own road
    of self-investigation.  I learned a lot about myself in that week.
    
    Marcia

    Do you know of any Actualization courses that will be happening
    in Mass or NH area this year.  If so, when?
    
    Thanks,
    peace

    CORE Groups are still alive and kicking at Digital!  To set the
    record straight, a CORE Group is not a day-long or week-long seminar.
    It is a small group of people who get together to discuss their
    beliefs and philosophies - where they come from, and where they
    are heading.  It concentrates on Valuing Differences - your own
    as well as those of the people around you.  These groups continue
    to meet on an indefinite basis.  Thus, a high level of commitment
    is required.
    
    If anyone is interested in joining a CORE Group, (you have to be
    there at the beginning, but they can form at any time), call 
    Wanda Hackett (DTN: 276-8888) or Linda Johnston (DTN: 251-1092) 
    
    
    
    					- Sarah
    

    If interested in joining a CORE Group, please call Wanda Hackett
    (DTN: 276-8888) or *Carol* Johnston (DTN: 251-1092).  I am sure
    that they will be happy to provide any additional information you
    need.

    CORE was a management development program offered by DEC back in the
    late 70's early 80's.  As I remember it the first course was five days,
    the second course was three days and there was a follow-up six months
    later, they were all off site, overnight programs.  After having been a
    wife and mother for a number of years plus holding a "job", it helped
    me realize I was a "person" in my own right, not just here on this
    earth for everyone else.  My "job" became a career, I worked towards
    what I wanted, I earned a college degree, I set goals and achieved many
    of them - the program just made a world of difference in my life, not
    to say that I might not have done these things anyway but the program
    did give me direction.  I am sure my attitude and apptitude improved
    for the better both at work and at home.
    
    It has been discontinued for a number of years but similar programs and
    courses have taken its place.   I recommend these courses especially
    for people that are unsure of themselves and I endorse the company
    paying for them because the company certainly benefits from the
    results.
    
    Pat
    

    
    
    RE: .13  Pat
    
    I agree.  The CORE workshops were wonderful and assisted me along
    my own path of growth also.  Who led the workshops you attended?
    
    Carole

    Hi, it was so long ago I really don't remember, I think the woman's
    name was Carol and the man had a beard, that is about all I remember.
    
    Pat