Conference 7.286::sports_90

    re -1
    	I also don't agree with teams padding their early schedules
    with patsies, but the way the present system works I think a 
    coach would be foolish to not do it.  Scheduling 10 patsies a
    year puts most teams 1/2 way to that 20 win mark that in my 
    opinion signifies a "good" year.  20 wins would certainly get
    any major conference team in the NCAA's, or at least the NIT
    which translates into cash for the univ. and the conference, 
    along with job security for the coach.  
    
    Jimbo

    Syracuse can beat any team in the nation *including* Georgetown.If they
    will is another story.They have the talent to win it all this year,I
    just don't know if Jim Boeheim is the right coach for SU.I think this
    team is lacking the discipline that Georgetown has.But whether you like
    it or not this team potentially has *3* all-americans on thier team.

    Ramon Ramos was in a very bad car accident over the weekend and
    has suffered brain damage.
    
    The don't even know at this point if he'll live. 
    
    JoSH

    
    They discribed the crash in the paper on sunday.  600ft sliding
    sideways, 40 ft through the air, then rolled over 8 times for another
    200ft before being thrown from the car.  must have been doing 150MPH 
    to cover that kind of ground...  nasty, very nasty.  
    
    

    The doctors are giving him a 50/50 chance of survival as of
    last night.  They don't know how much brain damage he has
    sustained.  The report I heard said that no drugs/alcohol
    were involved......
    
    Claybone

    And, it has been said that  alchohol or drugs were not involved
    in the accident.  Very nasty one indeed.  Amazed that he survived
    at all.
    
    JD

    I saw a picture of the car...it was crunched big time.
    
    He got tossed from it....oddly enough, that's probably the only
    reason he's alive. He never would have survived if he stayed inside
    the car.
    
    It really depressed me to see that.
    
    JoJ

re:  patsies on the big guys' schedules

Reasons:

	-  need wins early
	-  need time (without pressure of super competitive games night after
	   night) to work team, including reserves, into a cohesive unit

Also, many of the patsy games are at home (vs. local schools) which takes
pressure off the kids with regards to school work (remember, they have
1st-semester finals in December).  This is significant, as there are
many schools that want to eliminate b-ball in the 1st semester.


Joe

    
    Syracuse 129  --  C.W. Post 70

    
    There's also another reason why some of the smaller schools "BEG"
    to play the likes of Syracuse, Georgetown, etc! ($$$$$$$)
    A school like Cornell (who has no real B-ball program to speak of),
    gets a good portion of the gate for their athletic program.  A ticket
    to a nonconference Syracuse game costs about $10.00.  The dome can
    seat about 34,000.  As you can very well see, even a showing of
    24,000 is a lot of money.  I'm an SU fan, but a number 1 rating
    doesn't mean a thing.  SU's first big test will be against Pitt
    at Pittsburg.  I think they'll win, but it'll be a close game.

    
    Same old story... Georgetown plays 10-15 free wins before they
    hit division I schools.  What a joke.  I wish the NCAA would
    limit the number of games a division I school can play against
    division II, division III and high school teams.
    

    High School teams????????

    High School teams = St. Leo's, which Gougetown (tm) managed to
    squeeze by, 112-39.  This one oughta really get the men ready for the
    rugged Big East schedule, I'll tell ya.
    
    
    - ACC Chris
    

    re: -.1
    
    You're right, these type of games won't do anything to get them ready
    for the Big Games... the competition in the Intra-squad games has
    to be a whole lot tougher.
    
    So why do they play them ? Well one reason is that the NCAA isn't
    in the business of scheduling games and leaves that open to the
    Schools and conferences.
    
    Clearly a number of schools and conferences hide from competition. 
    If the Big East was one of those, then why did the Big East/ACC
    Challenge series occur ?
    
    It would be interesting to find out how many other conferences have
    been offered similiar opportunities and turned them down. 
    
    Until the other conferences open up to challenge matches schools
    will be relegated to filling the balance of their non-conference
    schedules with a bunch of no-names who are in it only for the $$$.
    
    
    
    
    

    
    Unfortunately, still comatose and in critical condition.
    
    Bull
    

Nova goes down at LaSalle, 71-70. Greis missed a free throw down 68-69
that was the margin of loss.

Is BC really that bad?

TTom

    Big East Prediction
    
    1.  Syracuse     	Even though Boeheim is still the coach, they
    		      	have just too much talent not to finish first.
    
    2.  Georgetown    	Mourning and Mutombo are first rate, but who are
    			the forwards?  That is where SU has a big advantage
    			IMO.
                        
    3.  St. Johns,      SJU, PC, Pitt and UConn will mix it up for positions
    -	Providence,	3-6.  Both play styles that drive SJU nuts,
    -   UConn &		but SJU is strong up front, while PC and UConn
    6.  Pitt		are more guard-oriented.  Pitt's starters are
    			among the best in the land, but they'll miss Miller.
                        As much as I love SJU, they may be overrated.
                                                
    7.  Villanova &	Both Rollie and PJ will get the max from their
    8.  Seton Hall      teams.  However, Villanova is real young (and
    			Greis still doen't dominate on a nightly basis).
    			SHU has looked real good so far, but I think
    			their young guards (two (2) frosh and a JUCO)
    			may catch up with them.
    
    9.  Boston College  Now that I've predicted this , they'll probably beat
    			SJU Saturday night.                   
                           
    Redmen Phil
    

	1.  Syracuse  ...but can they beat Georgetown in the tournament ?
		      They have a lot of talent, and the intangible called
		      DESIRE...something SU teams haven't shown consistently
		      in the past.  With hard, honest workers like Thompson
		      and Owens running the team, and a determined lottery
		      pick in Coleman, they just won't get caught napping
		      this year.

	2.  G'town    Awesome in the paint.  Good backcourt.  Only Syracuse
		      can play with them.  Could Syracuse and G'town go thru
		      the Big East schedule with as few as 3-4 losses combined ?

	3.  St. John's  I believe in this well-balanced team.  With Miller gone
			at Pitt, they're the best of the rest.

	4.  Pittsburgh  Talented starting 5, and one awesome player in Brian
			Shorter.

	5.  Villanova	Rollie will have Greis, Bekkedam and the freshmen
			pulling out miracles again this year.  Maybe a huge
			upset.

	6.  Seton Hall  They've made a believer outta me.  That freshman guard
			is great.

	7.  Providence	Not enough in the middle.

	8.  UConn	Always talent, but never meet expectations.

	9.  BC		next year....


Joe

    
     1. Georgetown  surprise, surprise. The depth of the bench and the
                    guard play gives them the edge over Syracuse. I believe
                    once they turn up the pressure on the Orangemen the
                    O-men will turn the ball over. Besides they have a
    		    Shaugnessy (tm) who can shoot. Freshman look good with
    		    Edwards averaging 9 assists....
    
     2. Syracuse    plenty of talent, even a decent enough bench it looks
                    like to go about 8 deep. Owens is dream player who
                    appears to have no weakness. Coleman should be Big
    		    East Player of the year. Thompson's an excellent scorer
                    but not ball handler and this will be their downfall.
    		    Probably will finish second to Georgetown during the 
    		    regular season but win the Big East tournment
    
     3. St Johns    good team as already stated. Starting 5 is solid, the
                    bench needs someone to come forward.
    
     4. Seton Hall  the freshman guard are playing excellent, good size on
                    the frontline and an excellent coach
    
     5. Pittsburg   loss of Sean Miller was devastating to this club.
                    another team with good starters and little bench.
                    Coach is definately a minus
    
     6. Providence  nice team but soft in the middle as Joe said....
    
     7. Nova        Gries never has found the fire he needs to be a top
                    notch middle man. 
    
     8. UConn       did they real loose by 31 last night to the Redman?
    		    Yes they did, makes you wonder...
    
     9. BC          needs help everywhere....
    
    mike

Sorry to get out of the "rank the teams" mode, but I'm still reeling
on the ropes this morning after UCONN's 31 point loss last night!

I guess early on we must have been playing Girly-Mon teams...(I thought
they'd taken Little Sisters of the Poor off the schedule!)

Oh well, another poor season (sigh)....

Dejectedly,
Chainsaw

re:  Seton Hall's Freshman guard

His name escaped me when I talked about Seton Hall a couple of replies
back, but after watching him last night against Villanova, I don't
think I'll forget it again  ---->  Terry Dehere.  He's a bigtime
clutch player...and only a freshman.  I've seen bits of 3 games
on TV so far this season, and he's done something good in all 3.
His 3-pt heave at the end of the game (to keep Vill at bay) was
a terrific, and gutsy shot.

I don't think it's a reach, even at this very early stage of his
collegiate career, to say that he may be the best Seton Hall has
ever had...and that includes Calandrillo (sp?) and McCloud.


As for tonight's game, despite SU's historically slow starts in
Big East regular-season play, I believe they should beat Pitt
tonight.  It may be close for a good part of the game, but
SU's multiple weapons should wear-down Pitt at the end...just
too much to cover, especially with the lack of able bodies on
Pitt's bench.

SU has had its problems with Pitt at The Dome, but has never lost
at Pitt.


Joe

    No need to mention anyone other than Seton Hall, the BEAST OF THE BIG
    EAST!!!!!!!

    Frank not so hard on our beloved Huskies.  I mean if G'town shot 28
    for 80 from the field including 2 for 17 form three land they also
    would lose by 31.  I have not lost NCAA aspirations yet......
    
    Jimbo

    
    Well Joe, pretty good call on the game. I only saw the last five
    minutes or so when the O men finally took the lead only to let it
    get away again. Edwards hit the big three pointer near the end
    to put them in posistion for the win.
    
    Final was 80-78. Steven Thompson scored the game winner with 5 seconds
    left after Coleman I think blocked Jason Mattews shot. He jammed the
    ball to put them up by one and actually hit the succeed free throw
    to give them a two point cushion. Brookins rimmed a three pointer
    and the tap back was unsucessful as time ran out....
    
    I'm already sick of Vitale......
    
    mike

    It's been a long time since I've seen a Division I team fall apart the
    way Pittsburgh did last night. Man was that awful.  Completely inept at
    handling the press.  It must've been agony for Sean Miller to watch
    them literally hand this game to Syracuse.  They outplayed 'em, but
    didn't deserve to win, if that makes any sense.
    
    As to Syrexcuse (tm), this team is UNC but with more talent.  They need
    guards bad.  Edwards shows promise, but the Stevie Thompson at point
    guard "experiment" has (not surprisingly) failed.  Unless they find a
    point guard (no likely) and a shooter (more likely), this team is gonna
    fail to live up to expectations.  (Definition of that in my book is 1.
    No Big East Title, and 2. No Final 4 appearance.)
    
    
    - ACC Chris

Re Jimbo --


Well, Father Jimbo, I must confess.  After seeing them down big, when
9pm came around, I decided to see if Syndex was in effect and try and
watch Roseanne on Channel 40 out of Springfield  (Ch 8 in New Haven
had the game).

I watched Roseanne, then play Remote Roulette to watch the score
mount.

True, there still is plenty of season left....

later,
Chainsaw

    Syracuse dodged a bullet last night- very lucky to pull it out......
    
    They won't stay on top for long.
    
    Hawk

Syracuse showed that the only way to play them is with a zone defense.
Their outside shooting is not good, and Thompson does not create offense
with penetration into the seams of the zone (something Billy Owens must
do from the wing as well).

They were very lucky to come out of Pittsburgh with a win...very lucky.
As Chris stated, only Pitts' inability to handle the press allowed SU
to come back.

Despite SU's lack of outside shooting and point guard play-making, they
still could have won this much more easily had Owens not had such a
horrible shooting game.  I don't have the stats, but at one point he
was 4-22 !!  Must be the worst game of his life.  Obviously that
won't happen often, if ever, again.

Positives:

		Coleman played like the BEST PLAYER in the country...
		("6'10" and behind the back...the Monster Masher!" -
		 Dickie V)

		Ellis showed a LOT OF ENTHUSIASM and is a good defensive
		center

		Edwards is not a timid player...If I was coach, he'd
		be the point guard by tournament time, with Thompson back
		at small forward and Johnson as 6th man...even if Edwards
		is just an average point guard, at least he has the instincts
		for the position (what a big 3-ptr for a freshman !)

		the full-court press with Coleman at the front was very
		good

		Boehiem actually used Hopkins and McRae (9 players in total),
		in search for a combination that would lift the team

		they owned the offensive boards...I believe I saw a late
		stat showing them with 30 offensive rebounds at that point

Negatives:

		half-court offense was horrible, and it all stems from the
		point...whether it's Thompson's inability to pentrate and
		create opportunities for others, or his slow movement of
		the ball around the perimeter

		outside shooting was bad...1-15 (I think) from 3-pt land
		at one point in the 2nd 1/2

		poor shot selection !!

		not getting Coleman the ball enough, when they needed a hoop

		Owens was totally out of it offensively

		Ellis made a few stupid fouls


Villanova is at The Dome Saturday night.  SU will get another great opportunity
to work on its 1/2-court offense.  Boehiem says Massimino designs the best
zone defenses in the country.  SU should win by more than 10, as the Cats
don't have the athletic players that Pitt has.

Joe

    
    
    	I did not see the Pitt/SU game, but from the comments and from
    previous viewings of the Panther's this year, it is my opinion that
    their coach has got to go.  Pitt has been in every game down the
    stretch, but have lost some tough games that they should of won
    if the coaching was better.  Granted, they are without Miller and
    their entire freshman recruits, but Evans just hasn't done a good
    job of coaching down the stretch.  They could of beaten NC state
    but they folded down the stretch when Evans refused to call a timeout
    to settle his team.  They lost to Ga. Tech on a last second shot
    when it shouldn't even of come to that after leading by 18 in the
    first half.  Now, they lose to SU, again, down the stretch after
    "falling apart".  I don't like Evan's because he just can't seem to
    coach in crunch time.  Pitt got rid of the football coach and now
    it's time to clean house and get rid of Evan's.  Maybe then Pitt
    will win some games down the stretch and more importantly, they
    will recruit some kids that can read and write!!
    
    							bill..g.
    

    re: .23
    
    As good as Dehere is,remember,he was only the third best player
    on his St. Anthony's team last year. Bob Hurley Jr. is starting
    at Duke and Jerry Walker is a sitting out the season as a Prop 48
    at Seton Hall.
    
    Imagine Seton Hall next year with Walker and super recruits 
    Luther Wright (7'2) and Bryan Caver! PJ's goal this year is 
    fourth with an NCAA bid. My big East prediction:
    
    Georgetown
    Syracuse
    St Johns
    Seton Hall
    Villanova
    Pitt
    Providence
    Conn
    BC
    
    

    Don't know much about Pitt's coach to say he should be fired, but a
    coach is responsible to instill the basic fundamentals of every aspect
    of the game into his ballplayers.  The fundamental the Pitt players
    lacked last night was coming to the ball, not standing around waiting
    for it to come to them.  Had they moved even a little bit better, they
    would've won easily.
    
    Hawk

>    The fundamental the Pitt players
>    lacked last night was coming to the ball, not standing around waiting
>    for it to come to them.  Had they moved even a little bit better, they
>    would've won easily.

This is fundamentally true, but I still have to give Syracuse credit with
the trapping pressure they utilized.  Coleman at the baseline was a very
good move...similar to Pitino's use of Ewing at the top of the Knicks'
full-court press last year.  Remember, three of the big steals via the
press last night were by Coleman (followed by his "behind the back dribble"
and jam), Owens (at 1/2-court), and Ellis (on an inbounds pass).  That's
6'10", 6'8" and 6'10" the Pitt players are trying to pass around...and
all 3 three are quick and have good hands.


re:  Dehere and Hurley

From the little I've seen, there's NO WAY Hurley is a better player than
Dehere...I don't care what he did in high school, or who his father is.



Joe

    re:  SU-Pitt
    
    IMHO, SU would have easily blown this game out if they had any kind
    of decent shooting night....when the favorite comes to town and
    shoots a paltry 31% from the floor while the home team is lighting
    them up in the 65% range...its gonna be close (remember GTown-Nova).
    
    Pitt played way above their heads while SU couldn't get the ball
    to drop.  From memory the shooting stats at the half were something
    like 13-22 for Pitt and 13-45 for SU.  Same number of buckets but
    twice as many shots to get them.  Billy O was 4-22 which is by far
    his worst outing.
    
    SU dominated with the trapping defense and the boards where all
    theirs...I would bet that Coleman out rebounded Bobby Martin and
    Brian Shorter combined....
    
    All Syracuse needs is a point guard to come through and they'll
    be OK.
    
    Newc

    
    You're right Newc, but ole Boehiem is so intend on putting his best
    five atheletes out there, that he will not develop a point guard this
    year and when Thompson gets pressured watch out. Owens and Coleman are
    going to have to do a lot of ball handling to bail this team out
    against teams that press....
    
    Hawk, trust us Evans should be fired. He rides the shirttales of David
    Robinson to a better job (navy to pitt), he inherited a team of
    superstars that had far more talent than anyone else in the big east
    and I believe tied for the Big East regular season title, lost in
    both tourneys earlier. The lineup he wasted: Charles Smith, Jerome
    Lane, Demetruis Gore, Rod Brookins and some other hot shot whose name
    escapes me right now.....He's a good recruiter with no scrubles, very
    strick disciplinarian to cover up his fundamental and game situation
    coaching defeciencies.......
    
    mike
    

Mike --

You cain't totally badmouth Calhoun.  He has done some tremendous things
for the program, and in my mind anyway is the best coach they've
had in years.

One problem I see with UCONN is the ability to recruit great players.
Perhaps I'm being naive in seeing this as an academic thing, but while
UCONN is a good school, if you were a great hoop player (who had half 
a brain too -- or is that a non sequiter?) would you rather go to Georgetown
or UCONN?   Personally, I'd like my diploma to read Georgetown...

So, until UCONN can come up with some tremendous players, they will 
at best be mediocre...

Chainsaw

PS  At least we can be proud that the UCONN program is clean....

    Good rumor I read yesterday in the aftermath of Penn State's joining
    the Big Ten.  West Virginia, Rutgers and Temple to leave the Atlantic
    10 to join Syracuse, Pitt and BC as the Division 1 football schools
    in the Big East.  The Big East would be a 12-team league with those
    6 plus UConn, Providence, St Johns, Seton Hall, Villanova and
    Georgetown.  Atlantic 10 would be shrunk to the Atlantic 6 and it
    would have UMass, URI, St Josephs, St Bonaventure, Duquesne and
    George Washington left.
    
    It would achieve the long-stated goal of having a major, all-sports
    conference for the football schools in the east.  What I heard is
    that the Big East would be two 6-team divisions, teams would have
    10 games in their division and 6 games against the other division,
    giving them the same 16 game schedule they have now.  I don't know
    how the divisions would be made, though.
    
    John

    Somehow Frank I doubt the kids going to Georgetown on basketball
    scholarship  are all that concerned with the academic superiority 
    of the Hoyas over UConn. They're going there for 1 reason:  HOOPS.
    
    Along these lines there's no reason Calhoun should have as an excuse
    UConn's possible academic inferiority.  Combined with Connecticut's
    well-known surplus of quality high school hoopsters I find it a bit
    surprising that, in the long and storied history of the Big Beast
    (dig intended) they've never made a run into the upper echelons of the
    league.
    
    Put another way, if Seton Hall can do it, UConn should be able to do
    it.
    
    
    - ACC Chris
    

Perhaps, Chris, I'm speaking from the point of view that most kids
in Connecticut that can, go *outside* of Connecticut to school.  Most
of my friends did.

I think also, when you come right down to it, that it's kind of a Catch-22.
A really good kid will want to go to a school where he has the possiblity
of a nat'l champeenship (say IU ;^) ) like Georgetown.  Until UCONN
can cop some of those kids, they won't have the talent.

I think there are a lot of better coaches than Calhoun out there, and
someday I'd like to see UCONN have a high caliber coach....Calhoun
isn't {insert name of favorite nat'l-champeen caliber coach}.

But, I don't totally BLAM him...

Someday....

Chainsaw

This weekend's Big East action (all Sat games):

	St. John's at Boston College
	Pittsburgh at UConn
	Providence at Georgetown
	Villanova at Syracuse


Joe

    Has anyone heard any further word on Ramon Ramos?

    	Jim, on SportsCenter last night they said his condition was upgraded
    from critical to serious and was taken out of intensive care.
    
    				/Don

    ...but he's still in a coma.
                                         denny

Last night on one of the SPORTS talk shows, they were discussing a
new conference in the EAST.  The loss of Penn St. hurts East coast
football and the other top East schools (West Virgina, Syracuse, Pitt)
are concerned.  They mentioned a NEW conference might be created for
football AND basketball.  This means some of these schools could leave
the BIG EAST.  I was very surprised to here this.  They said although
Syracuse earns big bucks through the BIG EAST, they are still a football
school.  I only heard the last half of the discussions so my facts
could be off.  Nonetheless its enough to make me nervous.  Anyone else 
hear anything on this.

                                                        Alan

> They mentioned a NEW conference might be created for
> football AND basketball.
> Anyone else hear anything on this.

Alan, see note 17.39.  John Hendry indicated that there's talk of expanding
the Big East to 12 teams.


re: Ramon Ramos

WFAN also said last night that the respirator has been removed and he's
breathing on his own.  They said his reflexes are showing some movement
as well.


Joe

The bomb that Syracuse fans were waiting for came early, and was delivered
by Villanova (somewhat unexpected).  I thought St. John's would give SU
its first loss, now they may give them their 2nd.

Villanova hadn't beaten Syracuse in 7 tries, but used excellent outside
shooting and ball-movement, along with a tightly-packed zone defense
to smoke SU in their own building.  Massimino called it one of Vill's
biggest wins ever, and given the way they did it, I can't argue with
him.  They made 43-49 foul shots...just that they got that many is
amazing !

Syracuse's problem continues to be lack of an offensive attack against
a zone.  I don't care how bad they are shooting from the outside, they
have to run an offense that will over-load a zone and create better shots.
I've criticized Boehiem unmercilessly about his lack of offensive discipline,
and it doesn't look like he's ever going to change.  As a Vill radio
announcer put it, "they just stand around in the 1/2-court set".

The Idiot put Tony Scott and Mike Hopkins (outside shooters) in the game
when it was too late (Scott hit 3 consecutive 3's), and the same announcer
said, "it's a little late for this".

One other significant comment:  Billy Owens has been non-existant in the
Syracuse offense in the last 2 games (in terms of what you expect from
one of the top players in the country).  He had a poor shooting night
at Pitt, and Sat he went many minutes without touching the ball.  He
had his 1st (and I believe only) FG toward the end of the game, on a
follow-up layup.  He has to become the focal part of the offense
for the rest to get into it.  He will eventually, but Wed against
St. John's is long enough.


Joe

more re: Owens

If he doesn't play like an off-guard (ie: penetrate from the wing, take
the outside shot, and not as a 2nd option), The Idiot may have to consider
moving him to small forward, where he can work inside (where he was his
most impressive last season).

This might sound like over-reaction to just 2 bad games, but I could
see a re-thinking on the starting five.  Put Owens at small forward,
Thompson at the off-guard, and insert Edwards as the point, benching
Johnson and using him as a 6th man.

Whatever the positional makeup, this team will live and die on Billy
Owens' ability to lead it (or lack of).


re: PC-G'town game

What a great game !  I have a friend in the office that's a PC grad
and he's been commenting over the last year about PC's inability
to close-out the close games (ie: getting the right shot, holding the
ball, etc.).  It was never more evident than Sat, when Screen intercepted
a pass to give PC the ball with less than a minute to go, and PC ahead
by 2.  He immediately turned it over on a 5-second violation.  They
gave G'town all they could handle.  The big guys weren't that effective,
with PC effectively taking it right Mourning time and again, and Mutombo
sat the bench for most of the 2nd 1/2 (no foul trouble that I was aware
of).

G'town-Pitt should be interesting.  But Pitt should self-destruct under
the Hoyas pressure.


Joe

    Trouble is Joe, even *with* Owens back on form they've still got point
    guard problems.  
    
    Baywhine (tm) really blew this one.  All those early season games
    trying Thompson at point guard really wasted what could've been a
    golden opportunity to give Edwards PT.  If he'd put him there at the
    beginning, he'd practically be a sophomore now.  Now he's a true frosh,
    with little crunch-time experience, and a wicked schedule to try and
    build confidence.  Not a bright move.  Not at all.
    
    This Syracuse team would've been a perfect one to put through the
    rigors of a killer early season schedule.  They've got the experience
    that could've handled it and by now they'd know exactly what they have. 
    Instead they loaded up on their usual cupcakes and found out nothing. 
    Now they've gotta try and make adjustments at a most difficult time.
    
    
    - ACC Chris
    
    

You're right on the mark Chris.  Not surprisingly, Mike Edwards got a
ton of playing time Sat night.  Just as I was about to say it, the
Vill announcers said it for me.  His PT and the fact that Tony Scott
came in and buried 3 3's may give us hope that chgs can still be
made.  I believe there's still time...and Edwards has played quite
a bit, but hasn't been told that he's the guy.  Boehiem is so bad
though that he will most likely stick with his starting five, convinced
that their hard work and determination is the only answer.  He always
places too much emphasis on the players making it happen, instead
of coaching adjustments (in-season, in-game).

In pre-season I indicated that the worst senario that SU could be
faced with re: the point would be to get to the end of the season
realizing that Thompson wasn't the answer, and forcing either
Owens or Edwards into a role that they weren't prepared for.

The college season isn't long enough for late adjustments.


Joe

    The fack that SJU doesn't play much (any?) zone should work to SU's
    advantage tomorrow evening at the Dome.  Plus, SU will be hungry
    for a win in front of the home faithful.
                     
    SJU is playing fairly well at this point, but I'd be more confident
    if the game was in MSG.
                                                   
    This will be a real tough one for the Redmen.  They need to stay in
    the game early and not let Coleman, Owens and Thompson get the crowd
    going crazy.
    
    Redmen Phil
               

    If SJU can put pressure on the ball at the top then they have a
    good shot at this point in time.  However, if they go with a man
    to man D then they will get smoked on the inside by SU.
    
    As for the PG situation, I agree that Boeheim blew it when he decided
    to go with Steve T instead of Edwards.  I have been down on David
    Johnson (the consumate black hole) all along and felt he should
    be on the bench.  The Orangemen should have been working with the
    likes of Edwards, Tony Scott and Mike Hopkins at the Point and 2G
    spots all preseason.  This would give them some outside shooting
    in the games that they were being Zoned to death.
    
    Oh well, another typical disappointing performance by the Orangemen.
    They could have been dominate with a lineup of Ellis, Coleman, Owens
    and Thompson all playing similar roles as last year and just letting
    Edwards take over the Point.  But no, we have to give Owens and
    Thompson new roles to learn while fitting The Black Hole in the
    lineup somehow.
    
    Newc

    
    Well good ole Stompkins (tm) almost gave it away last night. In this
    day and age of the 3 pointer no lead is too safe. Why he started to 
    stall at the 8 and 1/2 minute mark with his team flying along on all
    cylinders offensively is beyond me? Pitt when on a 16-2 run to cut the
    lead to 10 before the Hoyas put it back in gear and put it away. 
    
    Evans could qualify for stupidest coach in the big east after last
    night's showing. He's got no bench and he's got his starters out 
    there trying to physically intimate Mourning. It was close to a fight
    between Mourning and Shorter. Can he really afford to loose Shorter
    for two games? Plus he certainly could have done some substituting
    with them trailing by as much as they were in the first half...
    
    Hoyas can shoot straight this year though and have a much better
    arsenal offensively. Mutumbo improves every game. John please just
    sit back and let them run....they'll be no stopping them....
    
    mike
    

    Pitt was a team tailor made to lose to Georgetown.  You've gotta have
    guards to play with them (as Carolina found up).  We got eaten alive not
    by the Twin Towers but by their backcourt, which is outstanding.
    
    Providence proved this.  They've got a great backcourt and not much up
    front and the game was there's to win.
    
    
    - ACC Chris

Doctors in Portland, Oregon, say Trail Blazers rookie center
Ramon Ramos has begun to come out of his coma by showing an
increased level of brain function.  

Ramos, who suffered severe head and neck injuries in a car
accident December 17th, has shown signs that he is beginning to
regain some awareness.  

The head of neurosurgery at the Oregon Health Sciences
University Hospital, Doctor Kim Burichel, said Ramos, who
remains in serious condition, has a 75 per cent chance of
regaining some awareness over the next two months.  

Burichel added that if Ramos were to regain awareness, there
was a 75 per cent chance that he would be able to live
independently with his family or some type of nursing care.  

The doctor said that it was only remotely possible that Ramos
could return to professional sports.  Ramos helped Seton Hall
advance to the N-C-A-A championship game last season.

    It isn't much Jeff, but I'll take it. That's great news.

    Let's Hoyas, let's GO !!! Let's Hoyas, let's GO !!!
     Let's Hoyas, let's GO !!!  Let's Hoyas, let's GO !!!
    
     Let's Hoyas, let's GO !!! Let's Hoyas, let's GO !!!
     Let's Hoyas, let's GO !!! Let's Hoyas, let's GO !!!
    
    Hope this helps !
    
    DrM

    > Let's Hoyas [sic], let's GO !!! Let's Hoyas [sic], let's GO !!!
    
    
    - ACC Chris
    

    
    Thanks Jeff....
    
    Yes Chris, they can be beaten and it will take good guard play to do 
    it cause you have to beat the pressure in the backcourt. By the same 
    token though this opens up the guard play for the Hoyas to bury you
    back as Tillman's 39 proved. Last year they relied on Smith too much
    this year they're spreading it around and everyone is getting into the
    act offensively even Mutumbo. If Edwards can continue to grow and lead
    the "second team" they should be devasting come tourney time.....
    
    mike

    > they should be devastating by tourney time.
    
    Yup, just like last year.  Heh heh!
    
    
    - ACC Chris
    

>                      -< Edwards now but Autry later... >-

Edwards won't be sitting on the pine during his collegiate career, IMO.
He was rated the #7 graduating high school point guard last year, so
he has talent.  I like his quickness and scoring ability.  He's an
offensive player, and has shown some quickness to the ball on D.

I don't know where he'll fit in with Autry coming in.  Autry looks like
a real "top" point guard.  Can they both play in the same backcourt ?


re:  St. John's trip to SU tomorrow

Just what Louie wanted to see --->  Syracuse coming off it's worst home
defeat in recent memory, and to a team that they shouldn't have lost to.
SU hasn't played well in its 1st 2 BE games, so the motivation will be
at its peak.  SU will truly have to be in their yearly "early BE slump"
to lose this one.


Joe

    re .62
    
    > Like last year ....
    
    Are you refering to North Carolina Cyst ?  still smarting from that
    butt-kicking that the Hoyas applied ?
    
    Well,  don't wipe the shoe polish off the seat of your pants, ACC
    Cyst, JT and the Hoyas have got plenty more where it came from ....

    
    good shot Chris, but Duke was certainly not chopped liver with the
    college player of the year, and as usual Stompkins(tm) was out
    coached.....
    
    hope we can repay them this year....
    
    mike

    Georgetown looks strong,but they've hardly been tested.Providence,not
    your average national power,could have beaten them.IMO these are how
    the rankings SHOULD be.
               1.Michigan
               2.Kansas
               3.Georgetown
               4.Illinois (Even with their loss to MINNIsota they arestrong
               5.Syr-excuse
    
    o I remember last year when an analyst was asked about the tournament
     he said,`Why don't we wrap it up in a gift and hand it to
    Georgetown'
             
    
    
    Gimmie a break !!
    
    Better luck next time.
    
    
    RE Garbarino-Do you still like Syrucuse in the Big EAst?

Path: shlump.nac.dec.com!decwrl!lll-winken!uunet!zephyr.ens.tek.com!tekig5!tekig6.PEN.TEK.COM!alse
From: alse@tekig6.PEN.TEK.COM
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball
Subject: Ramon Ramos Update
Message-ID: <5335@tekig5.PEN.TEK.COM>
Date: 9 Jan 90 18:01:32 GMT
Sender: root@tekig5.PEN.TEK.COM
Reply-To: alse@tekig6.PEN.TEK.COM ()
Distribution: usa
Organization: Tektronix, Inc., Beaverton,  OR.
Lines: 28
 
 
   Excerpt from the Oregonian Tuesday Jan. 9 :
   
    Ramon Ramos remains comatose, but the coma is lightening, the head of
  neurosurgery said Monday. 
   "Ramon remains unaware of his environment, but is showing an increasing
  level of function. He is opening his eyes, follows things around the
  room and reacts to the presence of people."
    "However, he is still unable to respond to verbal commands and does not
  speak or interact with anyone."
    Its estimated that Ramon has a 75 percent chance of regaining "awareness"
  over the next two months. If Ramon accomplishes that, he has a 75 percent
  chance to improve to the point where he can live independantly, either
  with his family or himself.
    "It is only remotely possible, however, that he will return to pro-
  fessional basketball."
    Ramon is expected to remain at University Hospital for several weeks to
  month. He is getting intensive nursing care and passive physical therapy.
  Active physical won't come until he recovers enough to actively participate
  with a therapist.
   
 -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 -                                                                           -
 -                                 Al Seaman                                 -
 -                                 alse@tekig6.PEN.TEK.com                   -
 -                                 Beaverton, OR                             -
 -                                                                           -
 -----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Path: shlump.nac.dec.com!decwrl!wuarchive!uunet!zephyr.ens.tek.com!orca.wv.tek.com!windsurf.WV.TEK.COM!rogerc
From: rogerc@windsurf.WV.TEK.COM (Roger M. Christal)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.basketball
Subject: Ramon Ramos And His Replacement
Message-ID: <5812@orca.wv.tek.com>
Date: 9 Jan 90 18:43:24 GMT
Sender: nobody@orca.wv.tek.com
Reply-To: rogerc@windsurf.WV.TEK.COM (Roger M. Christal)
Organization: Tektronix, Inc., Wilsonville, OR
Lines: 46
 
Reported in The Oregonian, January, 9, 1990 and reprinted without
permission. 
 
----------------------------------------------------------------
 
Ramon Ramos remains comatose, but his coma is lightening, the head of
neurosurgery at University Hospital said Monday.
 
Ramos, a rookie with the Portland Trail Blazers, received serious head
injuries in a one-car accident Dec. 17 and has been hospitalized since
then.  He remains in serious condition.
 
"Ramon remains unaware of his environment, " neurosurgeon Kim Burchiel
said, "but he is showing an increasing level of function.  He is
opening his eyes, follows things around the room and reacts to the
presence of people.
 
"However, he is still unable to respond to verbal commands and does
not speak or interact with anyone."
 
Burchiel estimated that ramos has a 75% chance of regaining
"awareness" over the next two months.  If Ramos accomplishes that,
burchiel said, he has a 75% chance to improve to the point where he
can live independently, either with his family or by himself.
 
"It is only remotely possible, however," Burchiel said, "that he will
return to professional basketball."
 
Burchiel said he expects Ramos to remain at University Hospital for
several weeks to a month.  He is getting intensive nursing care and
passive physical therapy.  Active physical therapy, the doctor said,
won't come until he recovers enough to actively participate with a
therapist. 
 
----------------------------------------------------------------
 
The Blazer front office announced yesterday that they had signed free
agent rookie Nate Johnston to a 10-day contract.  The 6' 8" forward
was the last man cut from the roster prior to this season.  He had
signed with the Jazz but was waived on December 15th.  The Blazers
stated their intentions to fill the spot left by Ramos with a forward
capable of playing both small and power forward roles.
 
 
 
 -=<<  Roger Christal  rogerc@orca.WV.TEK.COM  +1 503 685 2116  >>=-

>    RE Garbarino-Do you still like Syrucuse in the Big EAst?

I have hope.  Thompson, Owens and Coleman are VERY talented.  Can
Boehiem fail to finish at least 13-3 in the Big East, and reach
the tournament finals ?  It'll be his worst coaching job ever if
he does, and we all know his inabilities are countless.

Syracuse has traditionally been a slow Big East starter (last yr
they started BE play at 1-4), and they eventually get it together.
I believe they'll do the same this year, and the "Thompson at the
point" experiment will be a bad memory.  But most of my hopes are
based on Billy Owens having the year that everyone thinks he's going
to have.  5-35 from the field ain't it.  A college basketball team
can ride on the shoulder's of one player, and Billy has the talents
to be that player for Syracuse.  Thompson doesn't.  And Coleman
doesn't handle the ball enough to be that player.  If Billy accepts
the leadership role, and plays that way, other teams won't be able
to stop Syracuse's offense that easily.  When he scores and assists,
he'll make the 1/2-court offense much more effective.


Joe

    	How about that team from UCONN!!! two big east blowouts in a row
    and we weren't the ones getting blown out 8*)  I hope they maintain
    tHis streak as I believe there up against Syracuse or Seton Hall
    this weekend on the road.  Pretty soon they'll be in the also receiving
    votes category and then onto cracking the top 25.  Well I can hope 
    for it anyway.
    
    Jimbo

    
    Nice comeback by the Friars last night. The beat Seton Hall at home
    after the Hall had opened up about 15 point lead early. Screen took
    over just before the end of the half to cut it to four. The second
    half started with a big 10-1 run by Prov to take the lead. Forced
    Seton Hall into some TO and took some smarter shots. Hall never got
    closer than 3 the rest of the game. I think the final was 77-71 or
    close to that. 
    
    Dehere had another solid outing. Avent looked good too, they'll come
    around JOSH.....
    
    Is there a slower center than Marty Conlon in the league??
    
    
    
      yup Tom Gries   ;^)
    
    mike

GO UCONN!!!!!


I couldn't believe the news report.  Fortunately, I had not turned the
VCR off after taping Drug Wars, and was able to replay back the
sportscast to see that UCONN picked up it's first ever win in Villanova!!!!!

Yeah!

Chainsaw

Interesting game at Villanova last night --> UConn beats them by 17
for their FIRST EVER win at Villanova.  WOW !!!  Does this make UConn
a 36-point favorite in their game against SU next Monday ?

How does Rollie feel ?  After declaring that his team accomplished
"his biggest win ever" at The Dome Saturday night, this, most likely
represents his worst defeat ever.


SU-SJU on ESPN tonight at 7pm.


Joe

Well I have to give Boeheim credit, he didn't change his use of players
(in fact, he used Edwards less last night than in any game this season),
but he did implement some offensive changes.  He didn't allow anyone to
take a 3-pt shot, and he created ball movement, especially to the base-
line and low-post areas.

Coleman had the ball much more, and Thompson and Owens were setting up
along the baseline a number of times.  Thompson didn't stay out top
much at all last night.  Their shooting % went way up (56%), and they
controlled the game handily in the 2nd 1/2.

St. John's defense wasn't very aggressive.  They tried a zone, but did
go to a man-to-man at times.  They appeared somewhat tentative...almost
like they feared an SU team coming off a humiliating defeat.  Their big
men had very quiet games.

The 3 big players (Coleman-24, Thompson-20 and Owens-17) all had big games,
and that's what they need to win.  I still would have liked to see Edwards
used more, and Hopkins and Scott get some minutes.  But that part of Jim
Boeheim (not playing the young kids, or using 8-9 players) probably will
never chg.


re:  recruiting

Phil,  what's the word on a Bronx kid named Shawnelle Scott (6'10") ?
Vitale mentioned that St. John's and Syracuse are both after him.

He also mentioned that SU is in the hunt for the following kids:

	Ed O'Bannon	Lakewood, CA	top 12 player, 6'8" forward
	Shon Tarver	Oxnard, CA	top 40 player, 6'5" off-guard

They both have a "short list" and SU is on them, along with UCLA, Arizona,
UNLV...


Joe

    Joe,
    	I can't agree with your tentative part, at least for the first
    half.  SJU's big guys were playing very, very well in the first
    half (down by only 1) and for a while I really thought we'd pull
    it out.
    
    Boeheim adjusted very well in the second half, and the Redmen
    sort of self destructed.  Our shot selection was remarkably like
    trowing bricks.  On the other hand, SU's percentage for the second
    half was what, 62% or something?
    
    I also remember SU in the second half really clogging the paint
    and getting rebounds - again a reversal of the first half.
    
    Damn!!!!!!!!
    
    Kev_OW(tm)
    

>    	I can't agree with your tentative part, at least for the first
>    half.  SJU's big guys were playing very, very well in the first

Yeah, you're right...they did play pretty well in the 1st 1/2.  I just
didn't get the impression that the Johnnies were very aggressive...but
it's just a perception, and since I'm watching from a Syracuse point
of view, I could be way off.


Vitale had another interesting comment about Kenny Anderson (freshman
point guard at Geo Tech).  Apparently his 2nd choice was SU, and not
NC (as many thought).  Imagine what this team would be like with
Anderson at the point ?

That's 2 prime-time players that Cremins has gotten over Boeheim.  The
other was Dennis Scott (although he was quoted as saying he just didn't
want to deal with the snow and cold of Syracuse, NY).


Joe

    Boeheim is really doing a poor coaching job.I was watching Edwards play
    in the 1st half and he was playing great!!!!
    
    
    
    
    
    If Boeheim has a problem playing younger players,he should be fired.

    RE Garbarino
    
    Are you a SU fan???

    I didn't know about Kenny Anderson's second choice either and
    when Vitale said it, I was almost ready to heave my cookies!!!!
    
    Although it was a long, long time ago, I graduated from the
    same High School as Kenny and because of that tie, I root for
    him and his team.  Had he not gone to Ga. Tech and selected SU instead,
    I would have had a real hard time splitting my loyalties between
    SJU and SU.
    
    Now I have the best of both.......
    
    
    Ahhhhhh
    
    Kev_OW(tm)
    

>    If Boeheim has a problem playing younger players,he should be fired.

The chances of Boeheim being fired are next to none:

	1)  he's a Syracuse alumnus
	2)  his career coaching record is among the tops in Div I NCAA
	3)  annually he wins 20 games
	4)  annually he gets SU in the NCAA tournament
	5)  he's had SU in (I believe) 6 Big East finals (won only 2)
	6)  he recruits top talent
	7)  his basketball program pays all athletic dept bills by
	    drawing more attendance than any other school in the country

Of course, his critics say the only real accomplishment he can claim
is #1.  I believe the program has and will be a winner because of the
fan backing, the Big East, the Carrier Dome and national television
exposure.


BTW, as many know by now, I AM a BIG SU FAN.  I grew up in the Upstate NY
area, where SU sports is the only game in town.  My father attended SU
briefly, and I went to LeMoyne (a Jesuit school in Syrcase...one mile
from the SU campus).


Joe

    Re: Boeheim's program pays all athletic bills in the A.D....
    
    Is that true?  I heard on the radio when someone was talking about
    Syracuse he said that Boeheim admits that football is still the
    tradition and the biggest draw and attention getter in Syracuse,
    not basketball, although he is content with that.
    
    Charles

    Basketball probably nets more money than football in most years
    because of the lower expenses involved in fielding a successful
    basketball team.
    
    Boeheim is also in SU's equivalent of a Hall of Fame.  He has about
    as close as anyone can get to a lifetime job in coaching, I would
    bet.
    
    John

    
    Plus with Evans, Thompson, Obrien, Calhoun coaching in the division
    he don't look so bad...
    
    ;^)
    
    mike

My brother's fiance has friends up in that area, and when he was up 
there with her visiting, he brought me back a SorryExcuse T shirt.

I guess I'll have to get him an NC shirt to get back at him...

Actually, I didn't think of it that way.  At first I was going
to say Clemson, but I realized that on one of my many trips to 
South Carolina, I had already picked him up one of those.

NC was the next school that came to mind. ;^)

later,
'saw
    
    

>    Re: Boeheim's program pays all athletic bills in the A.D....
>    
>    Is that true?  I heard on the radio when someone was talking about
>    Syracuse he said that Boeheim admits that football is still the
>    tradition and the biggest draw and attention getter in Syracuse,
>    not basketball, although he is content with that.

I heard on a network telecast once (a few yrs back) that revenues from
b-ball (attendance, TV, radio, etc.) pay all other sports' bills.

As for football being #1, I really doubt that.  I lived in the area
for 20+ yrs and while football was #1 in the 50s, 60s and early 70s,
b-ball came on to be #1 in the mid-70s (when they went to the Final
Four in '75).  I don't think there's any comparison now (from what
I see as a fan).  Basketball captures the fans' interest all year
'round.


Joe

    Shawnelle Scott is a 6'10 (11?)" C who hopes to play BF in college.
     
    I don't see it.
    
    The only time I saw him this year (on TV), I was not impressed.  The 
    announcers kept saying what soft hands and quick feet he had, but to 
    tell you the truth, I wasn't impressed.
    
    He is, however, a big body, something that SJU definitely needs.
    
    I understand that Georgia Tech and Arizona St. are still in the
    hunt.
    
    Regards,
    
    Redmen Phil
           

    I for one was disappointed in the Redmen's performance vs. SU.
    
    I thought they had the tempo exactly where they needed it in the
    1st half, but hurt themselves the first few minutes of the 2nd half
    by being more tentative then they were in the 1st half.
    
    YES, the Redmen were tentative.  Only Jason Buchanan (who I falsely
    predicted would be a major liability) and Billy Singleton looked
    like they were in the game, along with Boo Harvey.  Rob Werdann and 
    Malik Sealy did not play as well as they have been, and Jayson 
    Williams was awful, both on offense and defense.
    
    However, I still luv 'em, and we do get SU back in the Garden on
    January 29.
    
    Redmen Phil
    

>    However, I still luv 'em, and we do get SU back in the Garden on
>    January 29.

Don't remind me...that's the toughest part of SU's schedule:

	1/23	Pitt @ SU	(SU hasn't beaten Pitt at home in their
				 last 3 tries)
	1/27	SU @ G'town	(SU has never won at the Cap Center)
	1/29	SU @ St. John's	(SU doesn't have a good record there either)


Joe

Weekend results:

	Villanova 102, Providence 74
	UConn 79, Seton Hall 76
	Syracuse 81, Boston College 66
	St. John's 71, Pittsburgh 70
	Georgetown 74, DePaul 64

The biggest surprise is the score of the Vill-PC game.  Villanova scoring
102 pts ?...against a good defensive backcourt ?  The Wildcats have been
a Jeckyl-and-Hide team so far in the Big East.  They stomp Syracuse at
Syracuse...then get crushed AT HOME by UConn...and now they paste PC
at Providence.  Sounds like a team you don't want to meet in the
Big East tournament.


After seeing Syracuse LIVE at Conte Forum against BC over the weekend,
I'd have to give Georgetown the edge right now.  Seeing them in person,
they're very much the same old Orangemen who think they can turn it on
whenever they want to.  They get a little lazy on defense, and what was
a 10-pt lead on the worst team in the Big East, ended up being a 40-40
tie at halftime.  In the 2nd 1/2 they played well on both ends of
the floor and won fairly easily.  But when you play Georgetown, you
can't expect to go full-throttle for 40 minutes when you aren't used
to playing that way against everyone else.  The mental approach to
the game must be consistent night after night.

I enjoyed the pre-game introductions.  Of the SU players, Billy Owens
got the biggest hand.  And Boeheim was loudly booed...it was embarrassing.

Some game comments:

	-  the ban on 3-ptrs by Boeheim is gone...they may have taken
	   6-8 shots and made 1/2 of them (Edwards and Owens)
	-  SU went with mostly a 2-3 zone in the 2nd 1/2 and shutdown
	   the BC offense (BC had scored only 12 pts in 12 minutes of the
	   2nd 1/2)
	-  Coleman has to be the best rebounder in the country (as Dick
	   Vitale claims)...he gets rebounds that he shouldn't...SU is
	   really going to miss him next year...in 4 yrs of watching him,
	   I don't remember many (any?) taking the ball away from him once
	   he gets his hands on it
	-  Coleman brought up the ball against the full-court press a number
	   of times...some in the stands wondered why, but it was obvious
	   that he had no trouble doing it with whoever was trying to guard
	   him
	-  Edwards played almost the entire 2nd 1/2 at the point, with
	   Johnson on the bench, Thompson at the off-guard and Owens
	   playing forward with Coleman and Ellis/Manning
	-  Manning looks good, but must get more aggressive and stop
	   the silly "touch" fouls
	-  Hopkins was the only other sub...with 3 minutes to go in the game
	-  Doug Able can play on my team any day...he plays much taller than
	   his 6'5" height
	-  Corey Beasley was the unexpected surprise for BC...his inside
	   scoring and passing caught SU napping...he was responsible for
	   BC's hanging in there in the 1st 1/2, but the zone took him out
	   of the game
	-  Bryan Edwards can play, but for some unknown reason, the coaches
	   benched for part of the 2nd 1/2


SU at UConn tonight.  UConn always plays Syracuse tough.


Joe

    I saw the Hoyas and I wasn't impressed.They shot horribly,and were
    behind in the second half.But fortunately,for them they have great
    defense.I think SU and Georgetown will be very close.

    	UCONN did it again, now they've won three big east games in a row
    and two of those were on the road.  This week could possibly put
    the huskies in the national eye, as they have Syracuse tonight and
    G'town on Saturday both at home.  I would hope that they sweep but
    I'd be happy with one win.  
    
    	Does anybody have the time of Saturdays game vs. G'town?
    
    Jimbo

    
    I only got to see the last 2 minutes of the Huskies-Orangemen game
    last night and when I turuned on the game, I WAS SHOCKED to see
    that UConn was up by 3!!!! I never thought they had a chance to
    beat the Orangemen.  Just goes to show ya how a) wrong I could be,
    b) how good the Huskies are and c)what a great game college BB really
    is.
    
    UConn beats Syracuse by 8-9 points!!!
    
    Congrat's Saw....
    
    (but look out for 1/27 - that's when SJU is gonna kick yo butts!!!!)
    
    ;^)
    
    Kev_OW(tm)
    

    re:  Typical SorryExcuse (Tm)
    
    	Even being a Big Orange Fan, I have to agree.  Very typical
    for Baywhine (Tm).  The Orange are flat from the outside and UConn
    is dropping the zone into the paint.  So instead of bringing in
    the shooters (Hopkins & Scott), he leaves in the Bricklayer David
    Johnson.  I have to give him some credit for going with Edwards
    in the 2nd half who created offense with penetration.
    
    	Where or where are Hopkins & Scott ?????
    
    	Newc

Go UCONN....

Knocked off 4 B.E. opponents in a row...  what has gotten into this team?
Steroids????

Keep up the good work boys...

Chainsaw

    All you UConn Husky fans - just wait until January 30th when your
    girly-mon basketball team has to go up to Amherst to play the 10-3
    (6-0 in the Atlantic 10) University of Massachusetts Minutemen.
    The Dawgs will get slaughtered!
    
    John

Hey John,

ANy idea if tickets to games at the cage are getting tough to come by ?

Will I have to wait and see them at the civic center ?



thanks,

  Metz

    	Heh, heh, heh...  Hey John a "minute" is how long UMASS will
    be in the game.
    
    				/Don

    JH
    you's only sayin' that 'cause you's know's LOUIEEE'S
    REDMEN gonna whup UConn 2 day's earlier and the
    Huskie's will still be shell shocked!!!!!
    
    Sorta like kickin' 'em when they're still
    down!!!
    
    HTH
    
    Kev_OW(tm)

>    	Where or where are Hopkins & Scott ?????

	"why did he leave them, there (on the bench) all alone..."

All SU fans know exactly where the shooters are ----> ON THE BENCH !!!

How does a coach like this get this job ????  Any high school coach
could recognize SU's weaknesses and realize that if he has talents
on the team to fill the weak spots, he uses them !

By Boeheim's own admission, SU is weak at the point, and in outside
shooting.  He's starting to use Edwards more and more....but what
about the outside shooting ????  He's been around this level of
competition long enough to recognize that Johnson, Thompson,
Owens, Coleman and Ellis aren't good outside shooters.  All are
open-floor, inside/baseline power players.  Any good team needs a
complement of inside and outside play, and Boeheim seems to be
ignorant of this.  He can talk all he wants about how the level
of play isn't as good with some of the bench players, but he's
losing games because he doesn't have an outside shooter, and
he won't go anywhere until he finds one.

UConn (to their credit) played as deep a 2-3 zone as I've ever seen.
The middle man was literally just in front of the hoop.  Not much
room for inside passing (Edwards did find some creases), and not
many easy offensive rebounds.

There's always one team that gives another one trouble year-in-and-
year-out, and UConn is that team for SU...and Tate George seems to
save his best for the Orangemen.  Watching him play Syracuse you
wonder why he isn't All-Big East.


Joe

    Re: .100
    
    Metz,
    
    Tickets are getting harder and harder to come by.  3 of the last
    4 games have been sellouts even with the students being home on
    semester break.  If you want to try to go, you should get tickets
    now.  No games were scheduled for the Springfield Civic Center this
    year, all games were scheduled to be on campus.
    
    John

Possible get-together gentlemen?????

Always a good game, what with UCONN and Zoo-MASS, uh, excuse me, UMASS
being next-door neighbors....

Chainsaw

    
    	I wonder why Boeheim is playing David Johnson so much???  He can't
    shot from above 10ft, misses many layups, can't hit free throws...
    The only thing he's got going for him is that he can jump, therefore
    grabs his share of offensive rebounds and plays some D...  He should
    start the Edwards kid and bring Johnson as his 7th or 8th man...
    
    Luis

>    He should start the Edwards kid and bring Johnson as his 7th or 8th man...

you're right...If I was coach (ha,ha,ha), I'd have it this way:

	starters:
	Ellis, C
	Coleman, F
	Owens, F
	Thompson, G
	Edwards, G

	subs:
	Johnson, F
	Manning, C
	Hopkins/Scott, G

I don't think Boeheim could afford to have both Hopkins and Scott in the
game at the same time, but one or the other, with the starters, would
be a big improvement.


Joe

I've kept quiet up until now, but after looking at this morning's paper I need
to sound off a bit....How the heck can Kansas be ranked number 1 in the nation
when the team leaders stats are as follows:

Schedule Strength:  Kansas   76.24        Field Goal Percentage: Kansas  54.1 #2
                    GT       73.53                               GT      51.9

Team Offense:       Kansas   95.4         3-pt  FGP:             Kansas  47.0 #4
                    GT       92.1                                GT      N/R

Team Defense:       GT       61.8         Scoring Margin:        GT      30.3 #2
                    Kansas   Not Rated                           Kansas  25.1 #3

  
Rebound Margin      GT       17.7 #1      Defense FG. PCT        GT      36.1 #1
                    Kansas   N/R                                 Kansas  N/R


Won-Lost Percentage Kansas   1.000 #1
                    GT       1.000 #1



Seems to me that the Hoya's have an edge statistically....


-Mike       

    How many Division II and Division III schools did Georgetown play
    in the non-conference?  I remember Kansas knocking off #1 UNLV to
    start the season, then beat another very highly ranked team to win
    that tournament.  Meanwhile GT beats a Div. III school 112-39.
    
    Big deal.
    
    
    Spud

    Anybody got, as of today, the entire BE standings with win-losses?
    
    TIA
    
    Kev_OW(tm)

    Tony Scott can drill the jumper. Believe me. I've played playground
    ball with both Scott and another kid from the Big East who lived
    down the road, Greg Woodard from 'Nova. The area in New York around
    Rochester is becoming a basketball hotspot. Woodard and Scott are
    from Rochester, and Kansas' shooter, Terry Brown, is from Clyde-
    Savannah, about 35 miles from Rochester. Woodard's older brother
    was on my softball team a couple years ago, and Greg could've played,
    but, you guessed it, he was gone at basketball camp.
    				Raider_Rich
    

re:  G'town and Kansas in the polls

Don't get too hung-up on polls during the season.  The better team
will show-up in the NCAA tournament, and my bet is G'town will go
further than Kansas.  Kansas beat UNLV when they were #1 and LSU
when they were #2 (St. John's when they were #15), so that's why
they're there.  G'town is the best team in the country.


Joe

    GEORGETOWN HOYAS RULE !
    

    	But will G'town be able to withstand the Huskie express Sat.
    night?  It wouldn't suprise me to see an upset.
    
    Jimbo

A ticket for the game has gone from *hard* to get, to
utterly *impossible*.....

Chainsaw

>    	But will G'town be able to withstand the Huskie express Sat.
>    night?  It wouldn't suprise me to see an upset.

I think G'town will win this one by 15 or more.  While UConn has played
well, they aren't (IMHO) a Top 20 team.  They always (for whatever reason)
play Syracuse tough at home.  I don't remember the last time SU swept
them in the season series.  SU held them to 20 pts for over 20 minutes
at one point, and lost the game because they didn't have an answer to
the packed-in 2-3 zone (ie: their own inabilities).

G'town's more intense D, big guys in the middle, and good outside
shooting should make this a "no contest".  Tate George will crumble
when the Hoyas attack him, and the UConn 2-3 won't be effective against
Tillmon, Bryant, etc.  UConn played some 1-3-1 and man-to-man against
SU, and when they did they gave up pts very quickly.


Joe

    Anybody know how the Big 10 did in the basketball rankings for the 80s?
    
    					Steve

    Frank, I don't think its going to be too hard to get a ticket.  I mean
    what self respecting scalper is going to turn down cash. 8*)  I'm going
    to guess that to get a decent seat we'll have to drop $25 apiece.  Any
    more than that and I'll sit in the civic pub and drink 4 $6 pitchers
    and watch there feed of the game.  My prediction is UCONN 79 G'town 78
    in OT.  
    
    Jimbo

    No,in my opinion,Michigan is the best team in the nation.Followed by
    Kansas.

>    	"There is a new video out in the Syracuse stores: Jim Boeheim
>     	 on basketball.  What is next, Pia Zadora on acting?"

we know what video NOT to buy for our kids !

By the way, anyone hear or read of a Bobby Knight comment in which he
said something like..."give me the following 3 schools, and year after
year I'll be in the NCAA Finals"...and he listed Syracuse as one of
them ?  A friend told me he read it, but couldn't remember where.


Joe

We should be hearing of an SU player transferring soon.  Boeheim has lost
a player in each of the last 4 or 5 yrs.  They eventually get fed-up with
his use of them, and I can't blame them.  His great recruiting class 4 yrs
ago of Coleman, Thompson, Duncan, Hughes, Rowe and Eric Rogers, is now down
to Coleman, Thompson and Eric Rogers (a washout).  It's very possible that
the class of Owens, Johnson, Manning, Hopkins, Scott and Siock (all sophmores)
could end-up following a similar pattern.

My guess is that Tony Scott will be the one.  I've heard too much talk about
his all-around offensive talents, but have yet to see any recognition from
the idiot on the bench.  He'll take his talents elsewhere.


Joe

    
    Pia on acting, good one T as usual....
    
    As for UConn the winning comes to an end. They will not be able to pack
    it in as they did against Cuse or be able to handle the pressure of
    the guards. With the twin towers it fairly impossible to go inside
    so unless they're long range shooters are on fire expect another
    SJU type game....
    
    GT 86  Uconn 69
    
    mike

this week's schedule:

	Georgetown	at	UConn
	Providence	at	Syracuse
	Boston College	at	St. John's
	Seton Hall	at	Pittsburgh
	St. Joseph's	at	Villanova


Joe

    I agree with whoever said that Bayheim(tm) uses his players poorly.
    However, I dont think Tony Scott will transfer. He's still way too
    skinny to bang with the guys in the Big East. Last year he was 6'7"
    and weighed 180 lbs. This year he's "bulked" up to 190-195. Still
    too thin. Man can he shoot, though. He's a playground legend around
    here already and he's only been at gone for 2 years. 
    			     Raider_Rich  
    

someone asked a couple of days ago:

	Georgetown	4-0	14-0
	St. John's	4-1	15-3
	UConn		4-2	14-3
	Syracuse	3-2	12-2
	Providence	3-2	9-5
	Villanova	3-3	10-8
	Seton Hall	1-3	8-6
	Pittsburgh	0-4	5-9
	BC		0-5	6-9


Joe

    
    
    Oh, now DrM is a Georgetown fan... how's this come about... don't
    tell me... you went to school there right?  Give me a break pal...
    DrM = the ultimate bangwagon jumper...
    

    
    He does know how to coach defense and recruit so he's not a total
    waste. I agree though that he does need an offensive coordinator
    as they still have a hard time getting the ball into the towers.
    Mutumbo still only knows how to dunk offesively. He should have
    developed a hook or something by now......
    
    mike 

Gee, T

You been talking to Corrigan?

TTom

    	UConn beat Georgetown last Saturday night.  It's a shame that
    'Saw is on vacation.  8^)
    
    				/Don

    
       No it isn't!! :^>
    
       Bull
    

    
    send big crow hlo1-1/q10 some 20 point victory by the hoyas  ;^(
    
    65 points when they've been averaging 88 a game, UConn must have
    played some good defense from what I can see. Glad I missed this
    one.....
    
    Oh well, I never really expected them to go undefeated anyways....
    
    mike

>    65 points when they've been averaging 88 a game, UConn must have
>    played some good defense from what I can see. Glad I missed this
>    one.....
    
>    Oh well, I never really expected them to go undefeated anyways....


Mike, they probably did a good job of slowing the game to a "snail's
pace" as they did with Syracuse.  Against SU their "D" consisted of
a tightly packed 2-3...any time they got out of this, they got burned.

Impressive win for UConn...I certainly thought they'd get their butts
handed to them, but they won.

Hey Mike, SU at Georgetown this Saturday.  The way things are going,
I'd have to say Georgetown by 15.


re:  SU-PC

Providence made all the big shots down the stretch and deserved to
win.  They were down 9 with about 5 minutes to go, and didn't come
up empty in any offensive trip.  Conlon's two 3-ptrs probably won
the game, as they were getting 3 when SU was only getting 1 (out
of 2 foul shots).  SU lost it at the foul line.

Even though SU played their game offensively, I am still able to
find fault with Boeheim.  PC is shooting 3s down the stretch, and
Boeheim has SU in a 2-3 zone. ???  Unbelievable !

The loss should prove devastating to the team's confidence.  They've
now lost 2 of 3 at home to teams they shouldn't lose to.

One good sign is that, while he may not be starting, Michael Edwards
has become the SU point guard, and he seems to be doing a lot of positive
things --> outside shooting, handling the ball, passing inside, penetrating,
etc.  But still no outside shooting from the wings...and Scott and
Hopkins didn't see any action Sat either.


Joe

    I read in USA Today that G'Town didn't score for the first **7:08**
    of the ball game.
    
    It's hard to overcome that type of cold spell.
    
    Congrats to UConn. THey've knocked off two Top 5 teams in less than
    a week.
    
    DrM

Hey you Syracuse fans, can you remember all the heart-breaking losses
in recent Syracuse history ?  Along with Sat's game against PC, four
others quickly come to mind:

	Georgetown beating SU in the '84 Big East final in OT
	St. John's beating SU in the '86 Big East final on a last shot
	Indiana beating SU in the '87 NCAA final on a last shot
	Georgetown beating SU (at The Dome) in a '88 regular-season
		game on a last-second shot

And if you want to stretch it, who could forget Georgetown beating SU
in the final game at Manley Field House ('77 ?) ?

In all of these games, SU had late second-half leads, and couldn't
put the game away.  In my book, winning the close ones comes from the
bench, and I'm not talking about substitutes.

Can anyone remember Syracuse coming from behind to win one at the
buzzer ?  I can't.



re:  Syracuse and the Big Ten

All you Big Ten guys know that the only reason those schools would want
Syracuse in their league is 'cause they need someone to replace Frieder.

From an emotional standpoint, I want to say "NO WAY !!".  But, from a
financial and football standpoint, Syracuse probably would do it in a
minute.  Will their football program be helped ?  YES.  Will their
basketball program be hurt ?  NO.  Will they make more money ?  YES.

And I believe an affiliation with the Big Ten wouldn't be detrimental to
SU's academic standing.

:-)



re:  Calhoun

I don't remember who was criticizing Jim Calhoun, but I'd trade Boeheim
for Calhoun in "the bat of an eyelash".  Of course, I'd take any Division
1 coach over Boeheim....



Joe

    
    Joe,
    
    of course it was me who was bad mouthing Calhoun. I'm so adept at
    putting my foot in my mouth, I'm ambidextrous at it... ;^(
    
    hAs Georgetown ever beaten SU by thirteen???
    
    mike
    

>    hAs Georgetown ever beaten SU by thirteen???

Mike,

They hammered 'em in last yr's BE finals.  It may have ended only a 9-point
game (I think), but G'town had them by 20 at one point late in the game.

In recent years, most of the games have been "nail-biters"...I think there
was some stat (before last year) that they had played 5 or 6 in a row that
were decided by less than 3 points.

In Ewing's freshman year the Hoyas trounced SU twice during the regular
season, but SU beat them by 20(?) in the 1st round of the BE tournament.
SU had Santifer, Routens and Bruin that year, with (I think) Andre Hawkins
at center (6'7").

In the 70s the teams seemed to play fairly even games, with both taking the
home games.  But in the 80s I've seen SU intimidated by G'town.  They also
seem to get too "psyched", and play out of their heads.


Joe

    
    Georgetown's 88 points/game average is very misleading. Most of their
    games have been against division II and III opponents.
    
    RE: SU to the BIG-10
    
    I sure hope not. This is getting ridiculous. Pretty soon every school
    east of the Mississippi and north of Kentucky will be in the "BIG-10".

    Hats off to the Huskies.
    
    Some thoughts on the game.  Went down to buy tickets from scalpers, and
    the lowest price we coud find was $50 a ticket single seats only, and 
    people were buying them like hotcakes.  Once we got over the initial
    disappiontment, we wandered into a bar called Challenges to watch
    the game.  This bar was the first sports bar I have ever been to that
    has a TV on each table that you can control along with the usual six
    foot screen and multi 25 inch sets.  UCONN got out to a quick 12-0
    start and basically held on from there.  Nadev henefield(sp) had three
    or four three pointers down the stretch to ice the game.  I'd have
    to say that the steals UCONN made were the difference in the game.
    
    Jimbo

    
    True Hoot, but they were able to maintain it with their first four 
    Big East games. What surprised me was they were getting balanced
    scoring.
    
    Well Rollie almost masterminds another one last night loosing to the
    Hoyas 70-69 with the Hoya's Mark Tillmon make a block on a gam winning
    shot with under 3 seconds on the clock. Rollie took two technicals in
    the first half to put his team down by 7 but they battled back took a
    lead and finished the half down by 2. Hoyas opened up an 11 point lead
    with about 8 minutes left in the game but the Wildcats came right back
    to fight it out to the wire. A real foul plague game it took 2 1/2
    hours to play. Must have been over 60 foul shots taken between the two
    squads. Does anyone switch defenses better than Rollie?
    
    Well a few weeks into the season now and I have to say I don't like the
    6 foul rule. I thought I would, for sure it helps the Hoyas but games
    are slowing down because of it and although it hasn't happen yet I feel
    a major fight breaking out soon due to the aggresiveness of the
    players. I also think it will hurt the players big time come the
    NCAA's. Coaches will be able to adjust easy enough, but the players?
    
    mike
    
    
    

>    Well a few weeks into the season now and I have to say I don't like the
>    6 foul rule. I thought I would, for sure it helps the Hoyas but games
>    are slowing down because of it and although it hasn't happen yet I feel

Mike, I agree with you.  I was all for the 6-foul rule too, but have found
that I don't like it either.  Foul trouble is something that is a part of
the game, and this yr it's really non-existant.  I thought SU and G'town
would benefit most by keeping their superior big men in the whole game,
but what appears to be the case, is the other teams, that aren't as deep
in the middle are able to keep their guys in the game, thus taking away
what would be a huge advantage for SU and G'town.  My guess is SU and
the Hoyas won't have any trouble in the tournament, but the others may.


re:  last night's SU game

What was most surprising was not that they won a home game :-), but that
Boeheim appears to have officially abandoned the Thompson at the point
experiment.  Edwards started last night, with Thompson, Owens, Coleman
and MANNING.  Johnson and Ellis were on the bench.  Johnson played, but
Ellis never got in (injured?).  And the most significant fact was TONY
SCOTT played a TON OF MINUTES.  I listened to the 2nd 1/2 on the radio
and Scott played almost the whole 2nd 1/2.  The announcers, while quick
to point out he is "rough around the edges", couldn't say enough about
what his presence  on the floor did to open up Pitt's defense.  He only
hit 1 of 6 3-pt shots, but the fact that he can hit them changed the
game.  He passed well, and even jammed over Shorter once.  The announcers
said all along that Scott is the best kept secret on the team...maybe
his emergence will help turn the team around.  I just can't believe
Boeheim used him !!

Like they said though,  we need a couple more games before G'town
for this unit to be ready for the Hoyas.


Joe

    
    Also Joe teams are fouling deliberately with parttime players to slow
    tempo down against teams they are over-matched against. It's a real
    mess. I hope they throw it out next year....
    
    mike

    I heard Tony Scott played THIRTY_EIGHT minutes!!! Unreal. Never
    thought Baywhine(tm) would see the potential this kid has. On the
    playground I've seen him drill 10-15 twenty-two footers in a ROW!!
    He's got radar. Look out Big East, Rochester NY is coming. Tony
    Scott and Greg Woodard, super-sophs!!
    				Raider_Rich
    
    

    Tonight:	The Big East Leaders, St. John's University
    
    				vs.
    
    			The "occasionally" ;^) dangerous Friars of
    
    			Pwovedence College
    
    
    
    	7:00PM on ESPN
    
    Be there or be square!!!!
    
    
    GO LOUIEEEEEE!!!!!
    
    (gee, too bad Cody's not here ;^)
    
    
    Kev_OW(tm)
    

    
    A couple of dozen notes back there was a reference about
    how the game had passed LOUIEEEE by etc.,etc.
    
    WRONG
    
    Except for homer-loyalty (and a 6 pack bet with my PC alum brother),
    I wouldn't have continued to watch the game - too slow but that's
    my point about LOUIEEE.  He coached the Redmen to a tough win by
    playing real slowdown ball to keep PC off their rythmm.

    Barnes, especially during the last 5 minutes of the game (which
    took about an hour to play), countered very well but SJU was shooting
    fouls effectively.
    
    I couldn't help but think that LOUIEEE wanted this game to really
    emphasise slowdown as a precurser to Monday's game against SU.
    
    SJU STILL ON TOP OF THE BIG EAST!!!!!!!! (who wudda thunk that??)
    
    ;^)
    
    Kev_OW(tm)

>    SJU STILL ON TOP OF THE BIG EAST!!!!!!!! (who wudda thunk that??)

Hey Kev, PC was on top of the BE last year after a few weeks...


re: last night's game

they can't implement the rule "2 shots, or the ball", OR "2 shots AND the ball"
on fouls in the last 2 minutes of the game, fast enough, as far as I'm
concerned.  I know some are going to say, "making free throws is part
of the game", etc,  but just look at how boring last night's final 2 minutes
were !!!!     What WAS an exciting game, turned into a "foul line farce".
I find fouling at the end of the game (NBA or NCAA) to be the worst
part of basketball, and it needs correction.  IMO, people want to see
the game decided by game execution, not by the best free throw shooters.

I would suggest that if such a rule were implemented, it should be done
with a reduction in the shot clock from 45 to 24.  This would eliminate
some of the stall tactics as well.


Joe

Anyone hear the report about the 10 eastern schools looking to form
an "all sports" conference ?  A guy at work says he heard it on WRKO
this morning.  Apparently Syracuse, BC and Pitt are talking about
splitting from the BE to join:

Miami,  Fla St,  South Carolina,  W Vir,  Temple,  Rutgers  and Vir Tech

in a new Eastern All Sports conference.  A "conference call" (pardon the
pun) was made yesterday among all of the schools.  The word in the street
is that with Penn St joining the Big 10, the eastern indeps feel they
need to do something quickly (especially for their football pgms)
before another in their ranks leaves them.

In related news, it appears that the votes are there for the Atlantic 10
to bounce Penn St out on the ass, effective at the end of this season.
Penn St wants to remain in the Atlantic 10 thru the '91 season.


Syracuse not play St. John's, G'town or Villanova twice a year ?  That
would be sad.  But I'm sure we'd still see at least one "meaningless"
game a year.


The BE would be reduced to:

	Georgetown
	St. John's
	Villanova
	Seton Hall
	Providence
	UConn


Joe

    Then, you could take the remnants of the Atlantic 10 and merge it
    with the Big East - Massachusetts, Rhode Island, St Josephs, Duquesne,
    St Bonaventure and George Washington.
    
    Probably just a pipedream but that Eastern Football League (or whatever
    it would be called) sounds good.
    
    John

    Huskies beat St. Johns by 10.
    
    Jimbo

    Damn!!!!!
    
    :*(
    
    Kev_OW(tm)

    Re: 160
    
    Agreed.
    
    Redmen (#1, at least for now) Phil
                                
    

Road wins have been surprisingly common in the Big East this year...
especially upsets:

	Vill	won	@ UConn
	SU	won	@ Pitt
	SH	won	@ Vill
	Vill	won	@ SU
	UConn	won	@ Vill
	UConn	won	@ SH
	Vill	won	@ Prov
	St. J's	won	@ Vill
	Prov	won	@ SH
	Prov	won	@ SU
	G'town	won	@ Vill
	St. J's	won	@ Prov

Visiting teams have a 16-14 record so far in Big East play.

Can St. John's win at UConn, and SU win at G'town tomorrow ?


This weekend's schedule:

	Prov	@	BC
	St. J's	@	UConn
	SU	@	G'town
	Arizona	@	Pitt
	Vill	@	Seton Hall

it will be great if Pitt knocks off Arizona...

Joe

    This win could be the biggest win in SU history.
    
    The Orangemen absolutely dominated the Hoyas and won easily 95-76
    
    The difference??
    
    
    Michael Edward's play at the point!!His play allows Stephen Thompson to
    play on the wing more and allow him to score.
    
    
    Billy Owens had 36 points and he and Coleman continually broke the
    Hoya's invisable full-court press.Derrick had his usual 20.
    
    
    Another big factor was Leron Ellis.He was giving Alonzo alot of
    problems down low and he really took him out of his flow.
    
    
    After this game I think you'd have to give the edge to SU in the Big
    East.

    Biggest win in SU *history*????  I tink you're strettcchhiinngg
    tings a bit Sappee.
    
    
    - ACC Chris
    

    Wish I could have seen SU crush the Hoyas.  Instead, I had to watch
    Clemson at Carolina.  Snif.  Grrrrr.   Grumble.  Cry.
    
    	--dan'l (who's wondering if he can put a satelite dish on the
    	  	 patio of his condo)

    Syracuse is going nowhere.  The story in the Big East this year is Jim
    Calhoun's Huskies at UCONN.  They've now won 6 straight games in the
    conference and are tied for first place.  Could they be this year's
    Seton Hall?
    
    Laker_Ken

The Scene:

	The Chainsaw, in the Chateau Granville in downtown Vancouver,
	nursing a Jack Daniels on the rocks, watching Late Sports
	Early (the custom on the west coast).

	Suddenly, the UCONN-Georgetown score appears on the screen.
	The 'Saw almost chokes on his drink...with disbelief he
	rises from the couch, jumps up on the table and gives
	a Connecticut War-Whoop.  Then, out to the balcony to tell
	the entire city of Vancouver, that UCONN, just knocked
	of the #1 team in the nation.


	The following week, in Billy McHales, nursing a Red Hook Ale,
	sees that UCONN knocks off St John's... this time, just a smile.

	
This morning, on the Radio, UCONN ranked 14th.

The state is buzzing....


Yes, I was on vacation, now, as Arnold is fond of saying:  I'm back.


Remember, The Saw is Family.

'Saw

    
    Fortunately for me I guess I missed the first half of the SU/Hoyas
    game. Good game by SU their primetime players played just like that.
    I though the Hoyas might catch them when it was 75-69 or so but a
    couple of turnovers and fouls took away their momentum and SU
    regrouped and took control. The Stomper and the Whiner both tried
    to give this one away. Stomper refused to use the Towers and Baywhine
    pulled out of the man to man and went with the stall offense to early.
    
    Oh well I guess will have to get ya at Dome Joe  ;^)
    
    also another good game that was reduced to so-so by the fouling in the 
    end. Of course the fact the SU made for a change must have you
    smiling...
    
    
    mike
    

    Just wait until tomorrow night, 'Saw, the carnage from Amherst will
    be awful.  The Huskies will return to Storrs (it used to be called
    Storr, until they built the second one) with their tails between
    their legs, whimpering all the way.
    
    John

> Could they be this year's Seton Hall?

I was thinking the same thing this weekend.  Still, there's a long way to
go, and it's usually the teams that:  1) maintain a high level of play
all year;  or 2) peak at the end, that do something in the tournament.
Can UConn maintain this level all year ?



re: biggest SU win ever ?

SU's win over G'town (and Ewing) in '85 at The Dome was pretty incredible,
and the string of wins in the 1st BE tournament in the '80-81 season
(St. John's?, G'town and Vill-->triple OT) were unbelieveable.  And don't
forget beating NC in '75 to get to the Final Four.

This was a great win...mostly because it came at a time when SU needed a
big win, and they did it to their biggest rival, at a gym in which they
had never won.  They've been reeling, and they shook-up the lineup BIG TIME
and it appears to be paying off.  They're going through a major adjustment
and a win like this could send them flying.  And beating G'town AT G'TOWN
will give them endless confidence down the road in the BE and NCAA tournament.
If you can beat G'town on the road, you can beat anyone, anywhere !

Game comments:

	-  the lineup chgs:  new starting point guard, Thompson now moves
	   to off-guard, and Owens to small forward...Johnson on the bench,
	   and Scott getting very important minutes off the bench...this
	   team seems to have all the right combinations, and people playing
	   where they should be playing
	-  Ellis was a big factor on the defensive end...it appears he's
	   injured his hand and that must be why he didn't play vs. Pitt...
	   if he could cut down the fouls, he'd make SU that much tougher
	-  Georgetown's pressure defense was nonexistant, in fact, it sparked
	   SU's offense (52 pts in the 1st half)...I'm sure Thompson will slow
	   it down next time
	-  SU's big men had their way with G'town inside all day...this was
	   SHOCKING !!!...the way Thompson played Mourning/Mutombo (or didn't
	   play them), SU had 2 6'10" guys to 1 for G'town, most of the time
	-  Owens' says he feels better playing small forward, and he sure
	   looks it...36 pts !...he penetrated along the baseline and from the
	   wings very well...he was terrific at the end, controlling the ball
	   (wanting the ball)---> no one could handle him
	-  Owens and Coleman make SU almost impossible to press...the big men
	   that guard them can't stay with them;  their height allows them
	   to pass easily over the top;  and they free-up Edwards and Thompson
	   to go to mid-court, so that when they get the ball against the
	   backside of the press, you have good, quick ball-handlers igniting
	   a mini-fastbreak
	-  "Tony Scott's jumpshot looks good even when he misses" - Billy Packer
	   ...I love seeing this kid come off the bench, and what's impressed
	   me is his mixing-it-up inside...he isn't timid, and his 6'8" from
	   the off-guard spot is going to help a lot

If they win at St. John's tonight.....


Joe

    Great prediction on tomorrow's UMass-UConn tilt, JHendry.  Many
    of you realize that JOhn knows football; well he also knows college
    basketball, too, and is always an impartial observer.  The Minuteman
    rout of the hapless Huskies will come as no surprise to any noters
    now.  Thanks for providing a useful service, John.
    
    NAZZ

Umass needs to break their losing streak. I think it's reached 4 or 5 in a row.
The perfect way to do it would be against the Huskies especially after the OT
loss in football this season.

If they do lose I'm gonna quote T's Indiana inexperience dogma however :-)

They've got a very youthful team that will need a year or so to meld into
a contender.....


Metz

Oh ye of little faith....

UConn is getting hot.  In a matter of a month (well 6 weeks) they
have risen from  9th in the Big East to 1st.

While it is true that I am somewhat cautious about this game (as
UMass does not have the aura of Georgetown to get the Huskies
excited and fired up) I think that they should win the game.

Go Huskies...
Chainsaw

    Huskies will destroy umass.  Chris Smith is the Big East's Chris
    Jackson.  Hannefeld is this year's Andrew Gaze.  umass alumni will gag
    on their granola in the stands.  
    
    Laker_Ken

    Re Tessier
    The Huskies have no chance when they come in the Dome or anywhere else
    for that matter!!
    
    Yeah they lost(SU) to UConn,but this is before Boeheim woke and started
    Edwards.Uconn has no chance in the BE tournament.

    RE Knorr
    
    How do you tink Knorree?????
    
    

    NAZZ, I know John H., and I like him. he is a good man, knows his
    stuff, and is unparrelled (except for me :-) when it comes to the
    numbers.
    
    But don't give me that 'impartial' stuff when it comes to UMass.
    
    :-)
    
    Doc 

    Well UCONN fans the AP rankings are out and the huskies are #13!!!
    After an easy jog against UMASS Tuesday night the huskies will
    have to crank it up Sat night against a Providence team which
    matches up well against them.  On the St. Johns game my little
    bro was on campus for the game and said it went absolutely crazy
    after the win.  I guess they are calling the student section the
    "huskie pound" which I would take to mean that they all buy snow
    cones at the snack bar and throw them at the opposing teams. 8*)
    
    UCONN 84 UMASS 64
    
    Jimbo

    Two consecutive big wins on the road for Syracuse!

>    Two consecutive big wins on the road for Syracuse!


It wasn't a pretty finish, but Syracuse had what it took down the
stretch to hold on.  Owens and Thompson had big FGs in the final
2 minutes, and Johnson cooly hit the net on 2 FTs to ice it.

SU looked incredible in the 1st half, and only a lot of "chippies"
from blocks, loose balls, etc. kept St. John's close.  But in the
2nd half, SU's offense was barely alive, and they were getting
eaten up inside with their man-to-man defense.  Coleman couldn't
handle (or didn't try hard enough) Williams on the defensive end,
and he never saw the ball on the offensive end (still can't believe
this happens).  SU had a number of empty trips, and Boeheim finally
went to a 2-3 zone to stem the Redmen's tide.  Jimbo also kept
Edwards out too long (IMO), as St. John's 1-3-1 ("ambush") was giving
SU all kinds of trouble.  For a while it looked like the "lost"
Syracuse team of just a couple weeks ago.  But Edwards and the zone
seemed to even things out, and Syracuse held on to a game that appeared
destined to go the Johnnies' way.

Billy Owens IS becoming the player everyone thought he'd be.  If he
and Coleman play at this level the rest of the way, they'll be tough
come tournament time.

Tony Scott played a little in the 1st half, but not at all in the
2nd half.  Same for Richard Manning.  Johnson gave some quality
minutes on both ends of the floor.  He really could be a valuable
6th man, if used properly.

All-in-all, SU came out smoking, and then appeared to try to
protect a win, and almost didn't.  A big win, nonetheless, and
a super-tough BE roadtrip (Georgetown and St. John's in 3 days)
ends in 2 wins.  SU is now 4-1 on the road in the Big East,
with trips to Villanova, Providence and Seton Hall left.


Joe

    
    You pretty much covered it Joe, just wondering do you think they should
    become Owens' team? It's supposed to be Coleman's team but he does get
    lost in the offense end and he shouldn't. I really don't think you can
    blame the guards for his getting lost because he has the ability to
    handle the ball himself quite well and should come out to get it more
    often.....
    
    Kev, what can I say they tried and it looked like Louie was pulling all
    the right strings especially defensively. Sloppy passing by Boo was the
    killer in this one. He made some great plays but the bad ones
    out-weight the good ones.
    
    2 guys fouling out with 6 fouls available? Rediculous! I don't like
    the chances of our teams come tournment time especially team with no
    bench (SJU) or teams that refuse to use thier bench (SU)....
    
    mike 

    Huskies by 19 over the overmatched UMASS team.  The line on this
    game was only 4.5 oh what a steal it was.  If I had only put the
    ranch on this one 8*).  
    
    Jimbo

    I did want my crow hash for breakfast yesterday but couldn't get
    in.  Now it's cold (barf).
    
    John

That's okay John....we weren't going to rub it in.

I thought UMASS did well with what they had.  They had some incredible
athletic plays, and nice three point shots.  It was close during the
first half.

Having been to the Cage once, I know how that noise and crowd can
affect an opposing team!

Jimbo, your prediction was almost right on (in pt difference anyway)...

13th is the highest the Huskies have ever been ranked.  Connecticut
is buzzing about this, lemme tell ya!

Chainsaw

    It's just nice to see us be competitive with teams like UConn and
    West Virginia after being down for so long.  I was at UMass for
    the tail end of the glory years in Minuteman basketball (I was a
    freshman when Al Skinner and Rick Pitino were seniors and was there
    for all 4 years of Alex Eldridge and company) and the last 11 seasons
    have been really rough.  I just hope Calipari stays for a few years,
    clearly, he's been the difference.  We need to get more depth to
    go along with what's become a decent nucleus.
                                               
    My true pipe dream is for Rick Pitino to come in as head basketball
    coach and athletic director one day.  There's no way we could ever
    match what he's making at Kentucky, though.  
    
    There is a complaint I have about college basketball and it gets
    worse every year - does anyone have any idea how it can stop the
    endless parade to the foul line at the end of games?  I used to
    love to watch college hoops.  Now, I can only watch if it's a team
    I care about because the games bore the hell out of me, and it's
    at the point where I pray for blowouts so the endless foul - time
    out - foul - time out - strategy won't work.  Who else feels the
    same way and what does the sport have to do to change?  Quite honestly,
    this strategy is ruining the game.
    
    John

Umass was actually with in 8 points at 83-75.
Then uconn took over and stopped the minutemen allowing them 0 (zero) points for
the last 4 minutes or so.

It's nice just to actually read about Umass in the globe for a change.

Go Umass. Break the 5 game losing streak....

>Metz

I had a friend that I used to work with who was at UMASS when
Dr J. was playing there.  He said the lines that used to form for
tickets was as long as the ones for Stones tix....

The Cage is an interesting place.  It's old, but it has a lot of
character...I hope they don't decide to get a new field house....

'Saw

    Excellent observation John and I agree.  The college game has a problem
    with end of game fouling and it needs to be addressed.
    
    One thing that clearly is NOT helping is the intentional 2-shot foul. 
    A truly bad rule that puts the officials in a no-win situation.  That
    rule should go, or at least be reserved for *true* intentional fouls,
    like the one that LSU punk pulled on Kenny Smith that resulted in a
    broken wrist and (ultimately) an early exit for the Heels in the '84 
    NCAA's.
    
    One obvious thought:  eliminate the 1-and-1 the last X minutes of a
    game.  By giving 2 shots on *any* foul (like the NBA) you immediately
    reduce the value of fouling.  Also incorporating the international rule
    of giving the offense the *choice* of shooting free throws or taking
    the ball out-of-bounds would do the trick.
    
    These things are pretty obvious though.  The bigger question in my mind
    is why doesn't the NCAA's do something about this??  There must be some
    sinister reason that revolves around money.  I suspect it has to do with 
    the fact that end-of-game fouling prolongs games and increases ad 
    revenues.  Also it increases the possibility of upsets, which are always 
    good for the ratings.  Again though, you can bet money is the issue, not 
    the integrity (or quality) of the game.
    
    
    - ACC Chris

    The Cage has been renovated.  The floor is no longer dirt and the
    bleachers are now permanent.  It actually looks pretty nice inside
    but it's no bigger than it was before.
    
    The money to design and build a new arena was finally appropriated
    at the end of the 1988 legislative session.  The money is in a separate
    account and can't be touched, though I don't know if there'll be
    enough money to run it when it's open.  The center is going to consist
    of a 10,000 seat basketball arena with an ice rink, a set up similar
    to that of Conte Forum at BC but bigger (and unfortunately, there's
    no way there'll be enough money to start a hockey team either) with
    a second, smaller rink for public skating and intramurals.  For
    those of you familiar with the UMass campus, it's going to be down
    near the baseball field and track, on the current site of the ag
    school's barns.
    
    Interesting story about the ag school and its proximity to baseball.
    The silage pit is behind the right field wall of the baseball field
    and the general wind direction is fortunately not that way (blowing
    in from right = east wind).  A friend of mine played baseball at
    Harvard a few years after I graduated and the one game his Harvard
    team played at UMass during his varsity career occurred on a day
    when the wind was blowing in from right.  He called me when he got
    back after the game complaining, "how did you guys ever stand that
    awful stink?"  I replied "1 - you were lucky, that usually doesn't
    happen.  2 - you unfortunate people who go to school in the city
    don't learn to appreciate good country odors among all the concrete
    and 3, a university isn't a real university unless it has an ag
    school, and I didn't see any cows at Harvard the last time I was
    on campus.  So there."  That shut him up for a while.
    
    John

    I was at UMass during the glory days.  When I was a freshman, you 
    could stroll in any time and stretch out on the bleachers and watch
    a pretty good team, led by a fine forward named Billy Tindall. In
    1968-69, Joey DiSarcina and Peter Gayeska captained a fine 17-7 
    squad, but people began to get to the Cage at 6:00 to watch the
    freshman team go undefeated.  By the end of the year, the Cage was
    packed by 5:30, but still no lines.  They came the following year.
    After a poor start (5-5), UMass won all but one of its remaining
    regular season games, and got nipped by Marquette in the first round
    of the NIT (Dean Meminger and "the Secretariat of college forwards"
    Bo Ellis led the Warriors to the NIT title).  In February, the lines
    began to form at 5:00 for the 8:00 game.
    
    In the 1970-71 season, it was worse.  The Cage would be shut down by 
    6:30, per order of the fire marshall.  For the BC game that year, I 
    got there at 2:30 and was about 50th in line.  They let us in about
    4:45, and the Cage was packed by 5:00.  We stomped BC, then later
    destroyed Syracuse and UConn.  AH, those were the days!!!
    
    NAZZ

>    There is a complaint I have about college basketball and it gets
>    worse every year - does anyone have any idea how it can stop the
>    endless parade to the foul line at the end of games?

John, I talked about this in note .160 after the same thing happened at
the end of the PC-St. John's game.  My suggestion at the time was to
adopt the "2 shots &/or the ball" rule, and at the same time implement
a 24-second clock to eliminate delay tactics and force teams to play.

Intentional fouling at both the college and pro level is the worst part
of the game.  I don't even like all of the "incidental" fouls called...
let 'em play.


re:  G'town roster news

Since there has been no mention of it here, it's possible you haven't
heard:  Milton Bell (sophmore G/F) has left Georgetown.  He's
transfering somewhere (?).  I've seen him a little, and he appears to
have a lot of raw, "scoring" talent.  Great legs, in terms of speed
and leaping ability, and a decent touch on his shot.  I thought he
was a player that would emerge as one of those "surprise" G'town
scorers in the future (ala Mark Tilmon).  Georgetown and Syracuse
both lose a player every year, it seems.  Guess you can't keep every-
one happy.


re:  next yr's elimination of 3 games from the schedule

Heard on WFAN during lunch that people in Syracuse estimate the loss of
the 3 games will cost them $1M in revenues.  Apparently there's talk of
taking the curtain down and possibly moving the court to the 50-yd line....
talk about redefining "long-range view" !  It sounds crazy, but they'd
actually put 50,000+ in that place a couple times a year.  I heard that
tickets for the season finale against Georgetown (REMEMBER, THIS IS A
REGULAR SEASON GAME) are selling for up to $200 each.



Joe

Visiting teams have a 19-19 record so far in Big East play.


Joe

	Seton Hall	@	Boston College
	UConn		@	Providence
	Georgetown	@	St. John's	(CBS, 12 noon)
	Villanova	@	Pittsburgh
	Syracuse	@	Florida State	(Prime, 1pm)


Joe

    Some predictions 
    			St Johns 76  G'town 75
                        UCONN    84  Prov   80
                        Pitt     72  Vill   60
    
    Jimbo

    Jimbo,
    	Thanks for your kind thoughts but let's not ferget
    that the Hoya's (yecch) are coming off an embarrasing defeat
    and LOUIEEE's guys are 0-2 in thier last games.
    
    Man, I hope they pull it out and wump those D.C. guys but
    I gots this cloud over my head .....
    
    GO LOUIEEE!!!!
    
    Kev
    

    I just returned from the SJU-Gtown game at MSG.  SJU put up a good
    fight, but with Jayson Wiliams out most of the game, they didn't
    have enough depth to carry on.  
    
    Now, I just heard on WFAN that Williams fractured his right foot
    again, and is out for the season!! 
              
    The Redmen will surely struggle the rest of the season.
    
    Redmen Phil (in mourning)
    
            

Huskies win by 15 over Providence.  Score a lot closer than the game.

G'town won also, so there is still a 1st place tie in the Big East.

Also,  The seven wins in a row in the Big East for UConn is a school 
record...

Chainsaw

    The Huskies defense in the first half was incredible.  They completely
    took Providence out of their game.  Then, they slowed it down in the
    second half.  Henefeld put in some really pretty fade-away shots, and
    this kid can pass!  The only problem I can see with this team is that
    they lack a consistent outside shooter.
    
    Laker_Ken

    RE .201
    
    I guess that streak will end after we crush them in the Dome.

>    The only problem I can see with this team is that
>    they lack a consistent outside shooter.

Their inside play doesn't scare anyone either.  Let's see what happens
the 2nd time around, after teams adjust...beginning Saturday night at
Syracuse.


Joe

    SU has definately adjusted to UCONN's gameplan,which is to slow down
    the Orangemen.But now we have a true point guard that doesn't work.They
    have no inside people that can handle DC or Billy Owens.If SU is at the
    top of their game they should win by about 10-15 points.
    
    
    O_Jason

    Re. "But now we have a true point guard that doesn't work."
    
    If he doesn't work, get rid of him! ;)

    The point was that now we have a true point guard,a gameplan to slow
    down SU won't work.

The fight for the regular season title should be intense.  With Jason
Williams gone, St. John's won't be the contender they should be.  This
means that SU, UConn and G'town will be trying to avoid the #2 and 3 spots,
and a possible semi-final match-up against each other.  Providence or
Villanova could still give someone a tough game, but based on the current
results, I'm sure one of the top 3 would rather face them than each other.


BTW, anyone know if the UConn-SU game is being televised in the Boston
market ?  NESN ?  Sportschannel ?  ???


Joe

    Some thoughts on the weekend.
    
    UCONN had a very easy time stomping PC.  I was miffed I really thought
    
    this would be a tight game, but we'll take it.
    
    St Johns had every right to defeat G'town.  They just didn't have the
    big man depth after williams was gone, Buto fouled out and with Werdamn
    sitting with five.  Its too bad they lost Williams he's a big part of
    that team.
    
    Jimbo

UCONN ranked 8th!

That's the highest ranking *ever* for this team.  

Needless to say, folks in Connecticut are excited.


Chainsaw

    
    Tried to reply to Mr. Sapp yesterday but if you watched last night
    you saw for yourself the perfect way to slow Syracuse down is give
    them a 10 to 12 point lead and let Jimmy try to coach. He'll pull off
    the man to man (definately thie best defense) and go to half court
    offense when this team should just run all night along....
    
    Seton Hall shot extremely well and played some good defense. They
    killed themselves with turnovers. They must have had 25 or more.
    Still they were right there with a couple of minutes to go as Syracuse
    lacked the killer punch last night. 
    
    Looks more and more like Syracuse is becoming Billy Owens' team. He's
    really taking charge out there. Reminds me of Bird with speed. If he
    develops some consistancy in outside shot, look out NBA. 
    
    Joe, I've got a question concerning Owens has he put on weight this
    year? He looks to me to be more solid in the upper body. Last year
    he looked like a freshman this year he looks like a MAN....
    
    mike
    

>    Joe, I've got a question concerning Owens has he put on weight this
>    year? He looks to me to be more solid in the upper body. Last year
>    he looked like a freshman this year he looks like a MAN....

I don't know Mike.  He does appear to have bulked-up in the chest and
shoulders, therefore bringing more definition between his waist and
upper body.  One thing's for sure, he's playing much stronger inside.
He's impressed me with his rebounding in a crowd...at times I think
it's Coleman, and I'm surprised to see that it's Owens.  Coleman's
rebounding will be missed, but if Billy continues to improve, it
won't be as big a blow as it could be.

Owens' complete game is starting to come together.  He's definitely the
best player to ever grace the SU campus.  They showed a graphic last
night that he's in the top 10 of the Big East in assists, scoring,
FG%, steals and rebounds.  Throw in blocked shots and FT% and he'd
be the perfect player (if he isn't already).  I'll be ecstatic when
he consistently drives inside and dishes to the other big men, making
him an almost unstoppable inside force.

He should have a terrific Junior season, and if he stays his senior year,
he may be the Wooden Award winner, and the #1 pick in the draft.

People wonder why SU fans are demanding so much this year, but if
Coleman and Owens go #1 in their respective drafts....????


re: last night's game

You're right Mike, the worst thing that can happen to SU when they're
playing a weaker opponent, is for them to get up big (57-43).  You
could see them get out of their offense....Coleman hanging around
the 3-pt line.  How many passes were made to the interior in the
last 10 minutes of the game ?  Maybe just 2 (both by Tony Scott).

Of course, offensive consistency and discipline come under the coach's
job description, in my book.


re:  SU-UConn this Sat

UConn is going to see a much better SU team than the one they beat a few
weeks ago.  Edwards at the point has improved not only the point, but
the off-guard (Thompson) and small forward (Owens) positions as well.
3 positions are stronger now than they were then, and SU was only down
3 with 2 minutes to go, and had shutdown the UConn offense after
the 1st 10 minutes (30 pts) of the game.  SU's man-to-man defense
is better also.

I'll be surprised if SU doesn't win this game.  And it should be by
more than 10.


Joe

    I'd rather see SU play AT Missouri than Seton Hall at the Dome.They
    seem to know just when to get pumped up for a game.
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
   O_J

    Re Joe
    		First of all I want the Huskies to win.  The realist
    in me see's the talent Syracuse has and says this could be the
    end of our streak, but to predict a win by 10 points is a lot
    of hope and very little realism 8*)  The huskies will stay close
    to Syracuse because they always do.  Syracuse can not beat the
    huskies by 10 because they can't shoot foul shots down the stretch,
    and you can believe the huskies will foul everyone but Owens.  Throw
    in the Jimmy B. factor and its going to be a game that is won in
    the last minute.  Maybe we'll win and maybe we won't but I'm making
    a ton of money because the huskies always cover.
    
    		On a side note I was watching Arsenio last night and
    he had on Michael Jordan.  The conversation was really funny one bit
    went like this
    
    	Arsenio:  Who's the dirtiest player in the NBA?
    	Jordan:  Without a doubt 95% of the players would say Lambier or
                 Bird, and I dont like Lambier.  I mean I'll be on the
                 break and Lambier will be coming full speed ahead and 
                 everbody knows he ain't gonna block my shot(lotsa
                 laughter) I mean how is he gonna block my shot when I'm
                 wearing Air jordan's and he's wearing Addidas.  The man
                 is 6'11" and he can't jump.
    
    
    Jimbo

    
    actually Jimbo, Coleman is also a good foul shooter shooting right
    around 80%. They've all improved except Thompson. He's the guy you
    want to foul but if at all possible he never sees the ball at the
    end of the game unless it's a breakaway. Because Coleman and Owens
    can handle the ball they're able to keep it out of Thompson's hands
    for the most part.
    
    Did Jordan really say Bird as one of the dirtiest? Hard to believe
    
    
    mike

>    They've all improved except Thompson. He's the guy you
>    want to foul but if at all possible he never sees the ball at the
>    end of the game unless it's a breakaway. Because Coleman and Owens
>    can handle the ball they're able to keep it out of Thompson's hands
>    for the most part.

Very good comments Mike.  If you saw what they did against SH the other
night, Thompson was at 1/2-court against the press...as you say, "unless
it's a breakaway".  My gut says get him out altogether, but he's an
automatic "2" in a break situation, and that could "ice" a game.  He's
also a good defender.

Coleman and Owens make pressing SU nearly impossible (ie: a waste of time).
Both handle the ball as well as a guard, and are tall enough to see over
the press.  Given that they're usually guarded by another big man, the
press is rarely effective against them.


re: my UConn prediction

I hear ya Jim, but this time (a first) UConn won't be sneaking up on
on the Orangemen, looking like a Big East cellar-dweller.  If they go up
there, under this situation, and lose a close one, or win, they deserve
to be among the Top 8 in the country.  I'll be shocked.  SU is just so
much better now than they were on 1/15.  I see heavy pressure on Smith
and George, and plenty of intimidation inside.


re:  VAXmail from Ken Burgess

Ken Burgess is a SU senior that worked for DEC during the summer and
conversed in this note.  He wrote yesterday and gave a little update.
Apparently Ellis missed some time a couple weeks ago 'cause he injured
an ankle.  Also, Johnson walked out of practice last week, but returned
the next day, and played well against Fla St.  Rumors are buzzing about
a possible transfer.  (I don't think they'd miss him that much...unless
he starts hitting the "J", Scott is going to get more of his time.)

The crowd favorites are Conrad McRae and Tony Scott.

Thanks to Ken, I have tickets for the "sold out" SU-ND game next wkend.


Joe

    
    Well tonight's game has got me worried. Not so much who will win even
    though Pitt is playing better, but will a fight erupt? The last time
    they met Shorter and the gang were none to kind to Alonzo and it almost
    broke out then, I got a feeling that if Pitt tries the same tatics
    we're going to see a fight tonight. Hopefully I'm wrong.....
    
    IS BC getting their act together? a one point loss to Nova. Or were
    Rollie's boys sleeping?
    
    UConn won it last tuneup game big last night over Fairfield from here
    on it all Big East games. A win over SU this weekend would give them
    the inside track to the title as they still have two games left with
    BC and one with Seton Hall. The Hall might surprise them but the two
    BC games should be givens......
    
    mike
    

    The only way Syracuse *SHOULD* lose the UConn game is if they invite
    Roosevelt Bowie back to play center and they put Dwayne Washington's
    head on Edward's body. They are playing much better than they did
    during their (annual) January swoon and I think the Boreya's game was
    the turning point for them. Maybe Boeheim will get a couple of "T's"
    late in the game and have to turn it over to one of his assistants.
    
    Then again, I've seen SU teams lose too many games they should have
    won. I wonder what Roy Danforth is doing these days???  

    >Did Jordan really say Bird as one of the dirtiest? Hard to believe

No it's not.  All those years of being coddled by the referees won Bird 
a few MVPs and the Celtics a few titles.  Good thing Magic, James and
the rest of the Lakers never needed *that* sort of help!

Dan

       Notice the *s in Dan's last reply? These guys still don't git
    it1
                                     Denny

    
    Geez /Don isn't Dan taking enough of a beating elsewhere's?
    
    mike

Game 6, when Laimbeer shoved Kareem on just about every hook shot he
took, but was only called for a foul on a few?  That game 6?

Dan

Kareem Abdul Jabbar ? The guy that fouled on every sky hook he ever put up by
shoving off with his left arm ? The guy that never got called for it ?

That Kareem Abdul Jabbar ?


MEtz

       Yup! That's the one Metz!
                                Denny

>Kareem Abdul Jabbar ? The guy that fouled on every sky hook he ever put up by
>shoving off with his left arm ? The guy that never got called for it ?

No Metz, not at all.  The skyhook was a syphony in motion, the most unstoppable
offensive force in the history of basketball.  It is why the NBA gave tacit
approval to the opposing players to foul Jabbar without a call so often
throughout his career.

The mechanics of the shot made it almost unblockable.  The accuracy made
it a great weapon.  A complete skyhook was NEVER an offensive foul,
although I will grant that double and triple teaming often left Kareem where
he couldn't swing into it right, and occasionally did commit an offensive
foul, just like many other players.  But when he swung into it in full,
rocking backwards off of his left foot, right arm extended high over
head, eyes focused on the front rim, *left arm crooked extending only as far 
as the space over his feet*, that was NEVER an offensive foul.  Kareem
was always entitled to that airspace, even though the refs so often let
the opposing center encroach it, and give that extra shove to the hips
and chest, that Laimbeer attempts to specialize in.

Dan

    
    you got me rolling big time with that explanation of the hook Dan...
    Poor Kareem, why if it wasn't for the refs he would have score 40,000
    points...
    
    hahahahaaaaa
    
    mike

    re mike
    	What Jordan said was that if all NBA players were asked who was the
    dirtiest player 95% would say Lambier or Bird.  It was funny as he was
    describing how Bird plays.  Jordan says he's fronting Bird when all the
    sudden he'll fel tugging on his shorts and then Bird pops out the other
    way and hits the three.  He also said and I'll try to quote but it was
    late "Bird overcomes his natural inability because he's got no speed
    and he can't jump but he's a smart player.  He uses his smarts to make
    him a great player."  That might not be word for word but that was the
    jist.
    
    re Joe
    	I don't agree with the sneaking up principle.  UCONN year in and
    year out has been a thorn in Syracuse's side, especially the last four
    years since Cliff Robinson (rom the Buffalo area) has been with the
    huskies.  I don't have any stats just a biased memory but I believe
    Robinsons best games every year were against Syracuse.  He always
    seemed to turn it up a notch.  Do you happen to know if the game is
    being televised in the Boston area, maybe tape delay on NESN or 
    something?
    
    Jimbo

    Re: Jimbo
   {(on Bird) 
    
    Funny thing but I remember the EXACT point being applied to
    (Sen.) "Dollar" Bill Bradley when he played for the Knicks.
    
    Guess what goes around comes around.....
    
    (only difference is they didn't have 3 pointer's those days)
    
    Kev_OW(tm)
    

    
    Thanks Jimbo, I certainly know that Bird has his cute little tricks
    and is no saint but I can think of a few other guys who are much
    dirty.....
    
    He probably just didn't mention Magic cause they had to play them
    last night  ;^)
    
    mike

>    	UCONN year in and year out has been a thorn in Syracuse's side

Agreed.  But year-in-and-year-out SU has shown a tendency to under-impress
against lesser opponents.  UConn isn't going to be looked at as a lesser
opponent this time...not when they're a game up in the loss column.  I
spoke with a friend last night who lives in Syracuse and he says it's
a very hot ticket.

My point:  I don't believe Syracuse will *allow* the game to be brought down
	   to UConn's tempo (ie: dictated to them) this time.  If UConn
	   holds Syracuse to the low 60s or under, I'll be VERY IMPRESSED.


re:  the game on Boston TV

I checked with NESN and they don't have it at all (Vill-St. John's at 8pm;
Northeastern vs. ? at 10pm).  Looks like a night with a scratchy radio
broadcast.


Joe

    I was watching the Georgetown-Pitt game and both of the announcers
    agreed that the Hoyas are the *CLEAR* favorites to win the Big East.
    
    Any thoughts??
    
    
    O_J

    I agree, as much as I hate to, that Georgetown is the best team in the
    BE.  A win over Pitt isn't much to brag about this year, though. 
    Syracuse will do its yearly el foldo soon or wait for the NCAAs to
    begin and then crash.  UCONN, St. Johns, and Providence are playing
    over their heads, IMHO, and reality will soon set in if it hasn't
    already on the Friars...though I'd love to see any of them take it.
    
    FWIW, Pitt will be back next year with Sean Miller and some monster of
    a freshman they picked up in Yugoslavia or something.  He can't sbeak
    Englis too goods jet, so he's a prop 48 (along with 5, count 'em, 5
    other recruits).  Look for Evans to be on the hot seat next year.  It's
    as long as Gottfried got.
    
    	--dan'l
    

    Sorry,but Georgetown was embarassed by SU.I'm not saying that the
    Orangemen are going to win the BE,but this year they are better than
    Georgetown.With Ellis on the team they can stabilize Alonzo,which they
    did on 1/27 and we all know about the other two men in their
    frontcourt.
        The next game between SU & Georgetown will be tough,mainly becuase
    J.T. will not let them get blown out like they did before.
    
    
    
    
    
    O_J

    I was trying to think of this last night, and maybe someone here can
    help me.  While Doug and I were conversing "High above courtside"
    thanks to some tickets I won in a contest, I was trying to recall the
    Pittsburgh guard who I saw a few weekends ago.  I only saw Pitt once
    this year, but this guy had a so-so first half, got reamed by the coach
    in a second half TO, and then played some amazing ball.  He looked to
    be about 6'8" or so, had excellent ball handling and driving skills,
    good penetration and had a couple of nice lay downs.  Bit of a head
    case from the way the announcers were talking about him, and the coach
    treated him, but seemed to have a lot of potential.  Can anyone
    identify him and add to this?
    
    Dan

>    Pittsburgh guard who I saw a few weekends ago.  Can anyone
>    identify him and add to this?
    
Dan,

It has to be Darelle Porter.  He was used as the 6th-man before Sean Miller
was hurt and lost for the season.  He IS NOW the point guard, playing beside
Jason Matthews (the shooting guard).  He's 6'4".

I checked my Big East yearbook, and he's the only one it could be.  They
only play 7:

	Rod Brookin(F), Pat Cavanaugh(G), Bobby Martin(C), Jason Matthews(G),
	Darelle Porter(G), Brian Shorter(F), Darren Morningstar(C)

He and Matthews fit your description, but Matthews rarely plays the point,
and is more of a perimeter player.



Joe

re:  the announcers saying G'town is the clear favorite

There's a good chance those comments are based solely on who's on the bench
('though announcers and writers won't admit it).  Thompson's dominance of
Boeheim sticks in peoples' minds (as it does in mine).  So even if Syracuse
(as they are presently playing) is the better team, they won't get the vote
of confidence from anyone.  People remember the chokes over the years, and
the one constant is Boeheim.  Just listen to analysts' comments:  "they're
inconsistent"..."they don't play with enough intensity"..."they don't seem
to have what it takes down the stretch to win the close ones".

USA Today had a mid-season report, and not one writer (of 3) had SU in the
Final Four...and yet LSU was there twice.

Syracuse's talent, and Coleman's and Thompson's desire may overcome
Boeheim's deficiencies.  Their dominance of G'town's frontline was no fluke...
it wasn't that the Hoyas just had a bad day.  SU proved that day that
Georgetown can't play them man-to-man, or up-tempo.  They may beat SU next
time, but it'll be a "slow it down, low 60s game".  Thompson will beat Boeheim.


>    FWIW, Pitt will be back next year with Sean Miller and some monster of
>    a freshman they picked up in Yugoslavia or something.

The only player (that plays now) that won't be back is Brookin.  His loss
is minor.  They will be a good team next year.


Joe

    
    Joe it could have been Bookins too as he somtimes moves into the 
    backcourt where he first started with this team. The reaming out
    part sure sounds like him but then again Evans reams everyone that's
    his style. 
    
    It probably was Porter though.....
    
    Mr. Sapp, SU has two potential number 1 picks and Ellis because of his
    size and defensive abilities will probably be a first round pick as
    well. Hoyas have the depth. Coaching is equal as far as I can see
    except for the Stomper usually being able to intimatidate Jimmy into
    some mistakes.
    
    Joe excellent point about how bad Coleman wants it, he's definately
    the player to make the difference. Thompson can be negated by the
    Hoyas constant pressure and the fact that about 6 different guys
    will take shots at him defensively. Coleman is the key. If Owens
    stays steady and Coleman dominates this team can go all the way...
    
    mike

	Marathon Oil	@	Boston College
	UConn		@	Syracuse
	Florida		@	Georgetown
	Providence	@	Pittsburgh
	Villanova	@	St. John's
	Oklahoma	@	Seton Hall


Joe

    Fella, ya don't have to like him, but Thompson is a greta coach,
    and gets more outof his players than Boeheim.
    
    Moreover, the Mourning-Mutombo combo in the middle is the best 1-2
    punch in NCAA history. If it isn't, it will be. The inside games
    of the two teams is a standoff. G'Towns backcourt rates a slight
    edge because of their ball-handlers. And coaching is definietly
    in the Hoyas favor.
    
    Don't believe the hype - the Orange have a damn good team, ut the
    Hoyas are better ...

    Go Marathon OIL!!!  Whadda Team.  They are Slick, I tell ya, slick!
    No friction on that team.  They can PUMP up the fans, WELL I tell
    ya, Marathon Oil goes the distance.  They ooze confidence, they
    can run with the best of em, they really SPREAD the court.   Yes
    sir-re babe, the Ol' Marathon Oil team will DRILL the opposition.
    
    Sarge
    

    Hey Doc, whaddyamean, Thompson is a greta coach??  Who's he coach?
    Greta Waitz?  Greta Garbo???
    
    JD

       Maybe Hansel and Greta?
                                  Denny

    
    Marathon Oil spilled by BC.  Film highlights at 11:00.
    

Both teams are hot now.  The Dome is a big advantage for Syracuse and they are 
playing much better than the first time these two teams met.  Still, I think
the Huskies have a good shot to win.

When you look at the statistics, UCONN shoots in the low 40 %, they usually
get out-rebounded, and they have struggled at the foul line.  But they play
real tough defense, they make the opponent turn the ball over alot, they 
always seem to make the key rebound or 3-point shot, and most of all, they find
some way to win.  
They don't rely on one player to carry the team so if Smith or Henefeld is 
having an off game, someone like Gwynn, Cyrillic, Depriest,  will come up 
with a big game.     

Syracuse is a legitimate top 20 team and most likely a top 10 team.

UCONN has been tagged a suprising team, playing over their heads.  I
think the Huskies would love nothing more than to beat SU for a second time
and hopefully gain the recognition that UCONN is one of the best teams.

Like I said, SU is one of the top teams but I still expect the Huskies
to give them a real tough game.

Prediction UCONN 74  SYRACUSE 70


Jim

> Syracuse is a legitimate top 20 team and most likely a top 10 team.
					   ^^^^^^^^^^^
"most definitely"....IMHO...They will be at least a #2 seed in any
Regional.


Syracuse last 2 yrs:
			Big East play....
		'88-89			'89-90
		------			------
		1-4 after 1st 5		3-3 after 1st 6
		6-0 next 7		4-0 next 4 (and counting)
		3-2 finish		???


Joe

re: -1
The point is that SU is a very good team and most people expect them to be
at least a top 20 team and more than likely a top 10 team with a chance to win
it all.  The Huskies are having an equally great season but many people expect 
their bubble to burst and don't really consider them to be a top team.

When Syracuse is on, they can beat anyone.

But they do get into slumps where they'll lose two or three in a row.  If they
get into one of their free-throw slumps and they play against just a good, 
not great team, they can be beaten.    

If SU handles UCONN ok, then I would think they are a likely final four team.
But being a Huskie fan, I expect (well at least I hope for) a Huskie win.  If
the Huskies do win, I wouldn't be suprised to see a Syracuse slump for a 
couple games or so.

Jim

    re:The Game Saturday
    
    This will be tough one for SU,but if they concentrate and don't listen
    to Boeheim(-:) they should win.
    
    
    re: The Best 1-2 punch in history
    
    In a word,NO!!
    
    
    
    O_J

    
    Does anyone out there know if the UConn-SU game is going to be
    televised tomorrow?  I looked in today's USA Today, and they didn't
    have any mention of the game being televised.  It's hard to believe
    that a game between the 12th and 6th ranked teams in the country
    won't be on national TV, especially in this day and age with so
    many games being televised.  
    
    I know that SU is going to be on ESPN Monday against Villanova,
    and on NBC or CBS next Saturday when they'll annihilate Notre Dame.  
    Looks like the Duke fans were right, it'll be NIT for Digger's boys
    this year.
    
    
    Joe
    
    

>    Does anyone out there know if the UConn-SU game is going to be
>    televised tomorrow?

It's not on any TV station (locally) that I could find.  No national
TV, that's for sure.  These networks get locked into games before
the season, and they can't, or won't, change their schedule.  It's
a shame, 'cause planning for surprise teams should be part of the
package.  This game would draw a big audience (especially given
it's a Sat night).


Joe

Well, UCONN lost, but only barely.  I think a 4 point loss to
Syracuse, in the Dome, is nothing to be ashamed of.

The team showed tremendous character in coming back, when lesser teams
might have rolled over.

Syracuse did what they had to do down the stretch.  If there had
been a little more time, the outcome might have been different.
(Lombardi always said "We didn't lose, we just ran out of time" 8^))

So, now to see how UCONN can bounce back.

At least it wasn't the blowout that some were predicting....

Chainsaw

GO UCONN!!!!!

Impressive performance by Syracuse.  They came out smoking with 1st-half
spurts of 11-0 (to start the game), 9-0 and 11-2 (I believe), and kept
UConn at a comfortable distance most of the way.  The closest UConn got
was the 90-86 final.  SU had a 10 to 15-pt lead most of the game, but
withstood a couple of UConn rallies in the 2nd 1/2.

The Huskies got as close as 6 or 7 with about 6 minutes to go, but
SU pushed it back to 10.  With ~50 seconds left, SU had an 8 or 10-pt
lead, but Ellis missed the front-end of a 1-1, and after a UConn bucket,
Coleman threw an inbounds pass away which led to another UConn basket,
and the 90-86 final.

Can anyone who saw the game tell me what defense SU was playing in the
final minutes ?  I heard the game through a fading radio signal, and
it sounded like UConn was getting uncontested shots.  I guessed that
it must have been Boeheim's horrible 2-3 zone...the one Providence exploited
to come back from 9 down with 2 minutes to go.  SU would get a bucket, or
make a free throw, and within the time it takes to dribble up court, UConn
would answer.  Syracuse made its last 7 FGs while holding off UConn, but
the Huskies made 10 of their last 14 (I believe).

Boeheim teams traditionally have not finished games very well, and this
was another example.  It comes with their not being a good 1/2-court,
and free throw shooting team.


Someone in here had mentioned that UConn's weakness was lack of good outside
shooting...well, if they hadn't had the outside shot Sat, it could have been
a 20-pt win for SU.

Nice defensive job by SU on Henefeld.  They appeared to make him the focus
of their defensive strategy, and it worked.  I believe he had 3 pts in the
1st 1/2.

Chris Smith a 0 pts in the 1st 1/2;  25 in the 2nd !

I was impressed with UConn's heart.  They never gave up.  SU had a little
spurt (3 layups on consecutive trips down the floor) with just under 8 minutes
to go that gave them a 15-pt lead, and when UConn took a timeout I thought
it was cruise-control time.  But they kept fighting.

I was also impressed with UConn's ability to play an "up-tempo" game.
The way the 1st 1/2 was going I thought they'd never be able to keep up,
but they showed they have some offensive players.


Another big challenge for Syracuse tonight:  at Villanova.  Shouldn't be
hard for them to get up for this game, after Rollie's boys beat them by
25 or so up at The Dome.


re:  other games this wkend

Anybody have the BC-Marathon Oil final ?

Did you hear what Tubbs (Oklahoma's coach) had to say about the Big East
after their win over Seton Hall ?  It was something like:  "if you need
some sleep, watch a Big East game....you don't need a prescription from
the doctor, just watch a Big East game".   Wow !  Please, put us in
the same Region with this guy !!   PLEASE !!!!  SU-Oklahoma !!!!!  I WANT IT !!!

Is it true that Georgetown only scored 56 pts against Fla ?  Did the Gators
hold on to the ball or what ?

Nice gutty job by St. John's in beating Vill handily.  And Pitt is playing
much better the last couple of weeks.  117-102 over PC.  They're 4-1 in
their last 5.



Joe

    
    Yes Joe, The Hoyas only scored 56 against Fla St.. Stomper the games
    player decided that Fla St. wanted to slow it down that was fine he 
    could do the same. Fla St. generally used atleast 40 seconds or so of
    the clock and held an early lead of I think 15-6. Here John insert Dave
    Edwards who turned up the offensive and defensive pressure and
    Georgetown went on 25-6 run to take a lead. Too bad Stomper doesn't
    have a clue on the uptempo game because he has the horses to run people
    out of the building especially when he puts Edwards at the point. He's
    also got to develop Mutumbo more this kid is a player. I think he's
    afraid to develop Mutumbo cause he'll upset Mourning too much if
    Mutumbo becomes the number 1 man at Georgetown.......
    
    oh well atleast T's loving it....
    
    mike
    

    Georgetown 56-40 over Florida (not State) as the Gators played a
    slowtown game.
    
    BC 86-79 over Marathon Oil.
    
    John

UCONN played it tough but give the Orangemen a lot of credit for dictating
the up-tempo pace of the game.  Syracuse played a great game and that huge
Dome crowd is really a big plus.

After having their 10 game win streak stopped, an inexperienced team like the 
Huskies could be in for a let down so it's important that Jim Calhoun does what he 
he has to do in order to avoid this.  

The Huskies will learn from this loss and I think they'll rebound ok. 

Jim

> The Huskies will learn from this loss and I think they'll rebound ok.

The fact that they didn't quit after taking a number of attempted "knockout
punches" Saturday night will prove to be a valuable part of their maturing as
a team.


> After having their 10 game win streak stopped, an inexperienced team like the 
> Huskies could be in for a let down so it's important that Jim Calhoun does
> what he has to do in order to avoid this.

Good point.  Streaks are important in any sport, but even more so in college
basketball.  UConn is in the NCAA tourney already, but if their level of
play loses some of its edge, what has been a terrific year could end suddenly
with a "one and done" tournament format.

The biggest game of the year could be tomorrow's against Pitt, AT PITTSBURGH.
With UConn having a light schedule the rest of the way (2 vs. BC, SH & Prov
@ home, and G'town the only toughie), the Pitt game is a must win to insure
a good finish (12-4 in BE ?).


Joe

    
    RE: Tubbs' Remarks
    
    I wouldn't be too upset at anything Tubbs says these days.  Just
    consider the source.  Remember, this is the same classless guy whose
    team was trying 3-pointers at the end of the first half in a game earlier
    in the year (I can't remember the opponent), just so they could
    have 100 points at intermission.  They ended up with 97 at the half.
    Also, I don't think that Kansas and Missouri would play Syracuse
    or Georgetown that close.  Kansas is ranked #1 because they only
    have 1 loss, but the only formidable teams they've played since the
    preseason NIT are Missouri and Oklahoma, and they lost to Missouri.
    
    Both the Big East and Big-8 have 3 teams ranked in the top 13, but
    from top to bottom, I think the Big East is a better conference.
    We should get a better idea come tournament time.  In case anyone
    doesn't know it, Missouri and Kansas square off in Lawrence tomorrow
    night.
    
    Does SU have anymore games before Saturday (after tonight)?
    When is Georgetown-SU?
    Thanx in advance.
    
    
    Joe

    re -1
    Kansas also beat LSU and UNLV and ST Johns.
    
    
    Georgetown-SU 3/3/90
    
    Be there!!!

    Syracuse, a 63% free-throw shooting team, hit 25 of 33 against 
    UConn on Sat. Wow. Stevie Thompson, a 47.5% FT shooter, hit 6-8.
    Derrick Coleman, a 72% shooter, hit 12-13. 
    			Rich
    

>    Does SU have anymore games before Saturday (after tonight)?

No.


>    When is Georgetown-SU?

It's 3/4/90.  Jason, I even sent you the schedule...c'mon guy.


Hey you SU fans, they still have some real tests in the regular season,
starting with tonight's game at Villanova.  They don't win there often.
The remaining schedule:

		2/12	@Vill
		2/17	ND
		2/20	BC
		2/25	@Prov
		2/28	@SH
		3/4	Georgetown

Too bad they buried themselves so early, 'cause they probably have to win
all remaining games to get a #1 seed in the BE tournament (and thus avoid
a semi-final matchup with either G'town or UConn).  It's not likely that
they'll do that (it would mean winning 12 in a row).

None of their BE wins have come easy this year.  Ironically, their best
performance was against Georgetown.  But every team has pushed them...
no easy Ws.  Will this help them in the NCAA tourney, or hurt them ?


Joe

Visiting teams have a 22-26 record so far in Big East play.  The home teams
are starting to assert themselves.  Visitors had a 16-14 edge just a couple
of weeks ago.


Joe

    	Oh well we lost BUT as predicted we covered and in purely economic
    terms thats a win.8*)  I didn't see the game or read anything about
    the game until this conference.  Does it piss anybody else off about
    the lack of coverage of Saturday night hoop games in the papers.  The
    Sunday paper can't cover it because of their early dealine but the
    Monday paper won't cover the games either because apparently its old
    news.  
    
    	From the sounds of it Syracuse got on top early and held on in
    a game that was not as close as the score indicates.  I can accept
    this loss because should the two teams meet again it will be on a
    nuetral court MSG or down the road in the NCAA's.  On any other
    court than the Dome I think the Huskies can compete equally with
    the Orangemen.  Congrat's to the Cuse fans it was a big win that
    they needed.  ON the UCONN vs. Pitt game UCONN should handle them
    easily as long as they control the tempo, otherwise Pitt could 
    pull an upset.  
    
    Jimbo

Jimbo, the big thing here was that UCONN did not roll over.  They
never quit, and I think might have pulled it out if they'd gotten
a couple of breaks down the strectch.  If they'd held tight in
the beginning of the game, and not allowed Syracuse the runs that they
got, it might have been different.

UCONN is ranked 10th this week.  Nothing to sneeze at by any means.
Syracuse lost to Villanova last night.  If UCONN plays well this
week, then they will probably move up.

In a related story, the UCONN Women's team, broke into the Top 25,
as they are ranked 25th in the nation this morning...

Chainsaw

Depressing loss for Syracuse last night.  Never was SU's problems in
a 1/2-court set against a good 1/2-court defense more clearly displayed
than last night.  I don't think they had a FG for nearly 10 minutes of
the 1st 1/2, and had one stretch where they shot 5-25.  What amazes me
is that during that stretch, and at the end of the game, they did't
get the ball to Owens or Coleman.  No offensive play-making to get them
open.  You can't tell me that a defense can shut down both of them without
leaving someone (Thompson) wide open.  It's nice to see that Edwards has
the guts to take the shots at crunch time, but you have to go to your
All-Americans in that situation.

Another point about the 1/2-court offense is that Boeheim has his
centers coming out too far to set-up as a high post.  They should be
getting the ball at the foul line, not the 3-pt line.  You make a zone
collapse on the ball.  By going so far out, you do nothing to a zone,
while taking one of your big men away from the basket where he's useless.

Another problem they had was rebounding on the defensive boards.  Villanova
got way too many offensive rebounds by players crashing the boards.  Rafftery
talked about SU's good man-to-man defense, but not boxing-out on the shot...
especially defenders away from the basket.

Can someone tell me how Richard Manning traveled with that rebound ???

And what happened to Tony Scott ?  In a game that screams for an outside
shooter, he's sitting on the bench.  Was this just a little experiment
by Boeheim ?  Why was Tony Scott good enough to play most of the Georgetown
game, but not good enough to play against Villanova ?

If you're an SU fan you'd like to think that games like this will be good
for Syracuse...they'll help them prepare for the tournament and similar
"slow-down" teams.  But they've seen this stuff all year, and while they're
getting better, they don't appear to have mastered it yet.

Looks like a #3 seed in the BE tournament, just like last year (G'town #1,
SH #2).  They'll probably have to beat Vill, UConn and G'town to win it.
Their string of 4 consecutive BE Final appearances could be in jeopardy...
and this, with the most talented team they've ever put on the floor.


Joe

    Raftery also said during an intermission last night to watch out for
    Pitt.  Can he be serious?!?  I wrote the Panthers off at the beginning
    of the season when they lost Sean Miller and had the Prop 48 problems. 
    Anyone share Raftery's opinion?  I didn't see Pitt's last game against
    Georgetown, but they couldn't have been too impressive in that loss.
    
    But I guess anything can happen during these "boring" basketball games. 
    How exciting, I would like to ask Mr. Tubbs, are 40-point
    differentials?  The only exciting thing about Sooner ball is when they
    get shut down on offense by a good defense.  Now, isn't that the Big
    East in just about every game?  I'll take defensive strategy over
    offensive street ball any day.
    
    	--dan'l

    
    
    I share Raftery ideas of Pitt. Shorter and Martin give them a tough
    inside duo, Brookins can be as spectacular as he can stink out the
    joint, Mattews is good and Porter streaker. Problem for them is depth
    and direction. If they get it going earlier though they can be tough
    on anyone. Just ask Arizona.....
    
    All I can say about last night Jim was if that wasn't a loss to hang on
    the coach I don't know what is. If I'm Boehiem I don't care how talent
    Thompson is when he decides to fire up three pointer his butt is on the
    bench. Still can't understand his fascination with zone defense when
    his guys are so much better at man to man....
    
    A+ for Rollie  F- for Jimmy....
    
    mike

    
    RE .257
    Kansas played LSU, UNLV, and St. Johns in the preseason NIT, but
    it's since then they haven't played much competition.
    
    Note 264 brought up some very good points about SU not being very
    efficient in their half-court game.  Not only were they not exploiting
    'Nova's 2-3 zone, when the Wildcats switched to a man-to-man in
    the 2nd half, Syracuse still didn't get the job done.  Anyone knows
    that you beat a zone by attacking it inside, and SU just didn't do
    that.  If SU goes up against a team early in the tournament that plays
    a very disciplined zone, they could be in trouble. 
    
    I'm glad to see that New Mexico St. finally cracked the AP poll
    at #25.  They're playing at UNLV Thursday.
    
    
    Joe

    Congrads for that UCONN huskie team.  They won last night 80-77.
    I'm glad they pulled this game out and COVERED again, but to be
    perfectly honest I didn't wager on them because the game was a big
    ? in my book.
    
    Jimbo

I saw the second half.

Pitt refused to die, UConn refused to let them win.  The deciding factor?
Henefeld.  This kid is REALLY good.  He had a big second half, which
gave him a career high point total (27 I believe)...  He answered the
call everytime it was put to him....

'Saw

    
    Well we now have a three way tie at the top thanks to Providence ;^(..
    
    Friars win one for Al C. 94-90....
    
    Great game from start to finish. Providence hit somewhere between 12
    and 15 three pointers. Did a good job on the boards and really took
    Mourning and Mutumbo out of the game. If Tillman and Bryant hadn't
    been hot from the outside this one would have been a blowout by
    Providence. I like to single out Carlton Screen for Prov but I can't
    because they all had a great game.....
    
    Still though I was happy to see the Hoyas run the ball instead of
    slow down and hey what can you say except Prov has our number atleast
    once a year......
    
    mike

I thought UCONN and Georgetown were tied for first, and Syracuse was in
second place.

Laker_Ken

P.S.

UCONN's schedule is pretty easy from here on in; they're in good position.

>    Well we now have a three way tie at the top thanks to Providence ;^(..

Amazing, isn't it Mike ?  Just when I was preparing for a #3 seed for SU,
they're now back in the race for the #1.  They need G'town to beat UConn,
and of course they'll have to beat G'town themselves, and then if they don't
trip-up against BC, Seton Hall or Providence, they'll get the #1 (3-way
tie, they'd have the better record among the 3 head-to-head).

I don't know if I've mentioned this before, but a friend of mine believes
he's spotted a Georgetown weakness:  scoring !  He believes that Tilmon
is their only legitimate scorer.  He sees Mourning and Mutombo as limited
offensive players if they are not sitting right next to the hoop.  There
other forward (whoever's in there) does little scoring, and Bryant is a
ballhandler and defensive player.

He may have something here, as the 2 teams with open-offense strategies,
PC and SU, have given G'town trouble.  Every year G'town carries that
aura of "#1" with them, and MAYBE they aren't the best in the Big East
this year.

Being a "well-seasoned" SU fan, I won't believe this until SU beats them
3 times.


Joe

re 3-way:

	My paper lists G-town and UConn tied for 1st, followed by
	SU....

    
    Yup my mistake I forgot that SU dropped the game the night before
    to Nova. Might have been a subliminal way to remind the SU crowd
    they drop one  ;^)....
    
    Anyways Joe, your friend has a valid point. Tate/Venison was supposed
    to be the scorer from the small forward slot we needed but has yet to
    produce. Bryant isn't a bad shooter but he's streaky, he's better off
    when he takes a few drives first to warm up. Edwards hasn't been given
    any freedom to shoot and gets benched when he takes a wild shot.
    Doesn't make sense to me with him averaging 40 a game last year JS
    should let him shoot more. Mourning has range to foul line but they 
    never run any hi-post for him. He also throws his hook down at the
    hoop instead of a slight arc so he tends to have many bounce out.
    Mutumbo has a jam period. This is why I keep harping on why they
    must run to get the easy baskets and cover up their lack of fire
    power.
    
    I think by the end of the year they'll be starting Edwards, Bryant
    at guard Mutumbo, Tillman at the forward spots and Mourning in the
    middle. They'd be better if Mourning moved to forward and Mutumbo
    to center but hey i ain't the coach.....
    
    mike
     

    
    one more thing play Mike Sable will ya JT!!!!
    
    mike

    
    Tonight's Best Bet:
    
    SJU vs. Seton Hall
    
    ESPN @ 9:00
    
    (where's WardleVane anyhow?????)
    
    That ACC "filler" of NC at 'ginia  is just that -
    
    A FILLER TILL 9:00
    
    (so there ACCChris   ;^)
    
    Kev_OW(tm) when he's not on jury duty!
    

    
    Didn't get to see the game maybe Kev or Phil has details. I do know
    that SJU won in overtime 90-81 and Boo had a monster....
    
    He's really excerting himself offensively now that Williams is out..
    
    oh and the good guys won the filler game   ;^)
    
    mike

>    Anyways Joe, your friend has a valid point. Tate/Venison was supposed
						 ^^^^^^^^^^^^

Hey Mike, what's the deal with this guy's name ?  If it's Tate, why does
he have something else on the back of his shirt ?


Joe

    He puts his mother's name on his jersey, or so I've heard.
    
    John

    Boo hit a 3-pointer as time ran out in regulation; SJU had less
    than six seconds to bring the ball up and get off the shot.  Sorry
    to see the Hall lose, but they deserved it -- too many turnovers.
    
    /Ed

    Mike,
    	T'wasn't the most exciting contest to watch.  The majority
    of the time SJU had a good lead and then it would dwindle.  I think
    it wasn't until the 4:00 to go mark that SJU was in danger of blowing
    the lead and the game.  Around that time PJ made a defensive change
    and they just harrassed the daylights out of SJU and scored a lot
    of points on our turnovers.  By far the best part of the game was
    the last 3 minutes.  They'd turn it over, we'd turn it over.
    
    SJU had a 10 point lead going into the half.
    
    Boo was the man of the night.  something like 5 seconds left in
    regulation, SJU was down by 3.  One second to go and Boo flicked
    up a 3 pointer!  Basket and then time expired.
    
    Most of the game was slowdown against slowdown.
    
    Weirdann is showing a little more life out there but he's not as
    agressive as I'd like.  The announcers were totally yecch! (how's
    that for adult expression?).  They loved Singleton's every move
    and seemed to be plugging him as a draft candidate.  I dunno.
    
    
    LOUIEEEEE had on a new sweater.  The puke yellow and green triangle
    thing must have been buried by a dog or something.  The one
    he had was a basic drab (but still ugly) brown thing with little
    fuzz balls stuck on it.
    
    We needed that win to stay in the hunt.  Saturday we play the Friars
    and then on Wednesday we play Mike's slimeballs ;^).
    
    HTH,
    
    Kev_OW(tm)
    

    
    Thanks Kev, see ya next week....
    
    Joe, John is correct Vension is Tate's mother's madien name. I believe
    that she recently got a divorce and had her name changed back to Vension
    legally so he takes it on his shirt for her but doesn't change it
    legally because it would cause too much confusion for him....
    
    this weekend
    
    seton hall  georgetown    saturday
    nova   pitt                 "
    syracuse  notre dame       "  one of the few times all year I'll
                                   passionately root for the o-men
    sju    prov                saturday  
    bc     uconn                 "
    
    unless there's some major upsets we shouldn't see to much change in the
    standings....

>    nova   pitt                 "
>    syracuse  notre dame       "  one of the few times all year I'll
>                                   passionately root for the o-men
>    sju    prov                saturday  

These games could have some significance in the NCAA tournament selection
process.  A USA Today writer said he doesn't see any independents getting
in the tourney, unless ND can come up with some upsets (they have SU
tomorrow and I think Missouri and another Top10 later this month).

Villanova and Providence are the 5th and 6th teams in the Big East to
be considered, in my mind.  Can the Big East send 6 ?  My gut tells me
no.  I think G'town, SU, UConn and St. John's are a lock, and BC,
Seton Hall and Pitt are almost definitely out.  So that leaves Vill
and PC in the middle.  If I were selecting, I'd take PC, based on
their wins over SU and G'town.


Joe

    
    Plus PC has only one loss where it was manhandled against UConn. The 
    rest have been tough losses under 5 points when they failed to
    deliever at the end. Also with uptempo style and three point shooting
    tendencies they make for a very exciting and entertaining team. Last
    year's NCAA game against Virgina was one of the best of the tournment
    and I doubt that fact will be lost on the committee.....
    
    for my money the best game last year was Iowa/NC State.....
    
    mike

Current standings:

	G'town		8-3	19-3
	UConn		8-3	21-4
	SU		8-4	18-4
	St. J's		8-4	20-6
	PC		6-6	13-8
	Vill		6-7	14-12
	Pitt		4-7	10-12
	SH		3-8	10-12
	BC		1-10	7-14


Could it finish ?....

	SU		12-4	23-4	can they really sweep G'town ?
	UConn		12-4	25-5	loses at Cap Cntr
	G'town		12-4	23-4	big game at The Dome
	St. J's		9-7	22-9	front-court exposed, loses to PC & Pitt
	PC		8-8	17-10	wins @ St. John's
	Pitt		7-9	13-14	takes out Vill twice
	Vill		7-9	15-15	loses to cross-town Temple
	SH		4-12	11-16	only knocks off Pitt @home
	BC		1-15	7-19	can they surprise UConn or Vill ?

Weakspots in the predictions:  SU beating PC on the road and G'town at home;
St. J's losing 3 of final 4 BE games;  PC winning at St. J's;  SH beating
Pitt @ home;  Pitt winning 3 consecutive road games.


Tournament ?

	SU - BC/SH					UConn - Vill

	St. John's - PC					G'town - Pitt


Joe

    I've just about had it with Boeheim and his sorry bunch.They loose to a
    mediocre N.D. team.
    
    
    Don't count on a Big East title,even though this loss doesn't hurt them
    in that respect.
    
    
    
    
    a-very-depressed-O_J

    
    Well the loss saturday to me seems that ole Boehiem has one and only
    one thing on his mind this year and that is to win the Big East title
    or tournment. They were so unmotivated it was pathetic. Jimmy really
    shouldn't put all his eggs in one basket. Last year the Stomper did
    and look what happened. They had nothing left for the NCAA's they left
    it all on the court in NY........
    
    Carlton Screen has to be considered for Big East Player of the year...
    He's been playing possesed. If Providence finishes as they have been
    playing the last few weeks they'd have to be a darkhorse to win the
    BET........
    
    mike

>                         -< Can you spell c-h-o-k-e? >-

Well guys, I was at The Dome for this heartbreaker.  With 3:42 to play
I told the next guy that they weren't going to win it.  Then, after
Owens hit the scoop with 3 seconds left, I couldn't believe they were
going to win it...and they didn't.  Can someone tell me why Boeheim
didn't have someone in front of the guy inbounding the ball, so he
couldn't make that easy pass to halfcourt ???  If you put someone
on the ball, it makes ND come into the backcourt to get the ball,
use more time, and most likely get a poor shot.  Boeheim blew it again.


And what about his use of substitutes ?  Johnson didn't play, and Manning
saw little PT.  Hopkins hasn't played much in BE games all year, and he
plays significant minutes Sat.  Scott seems to be riding a roller-coaster
in terms of PT....none, a lot, none, a lot.

Edwards took more shots Sat than in any 3 games combined, and it hurt them
badly, as he was 3-16, and most of the shots were deep and, at most, 10
seconds into the 45-second clock.  And of course, the shots came out of
Coleman's and Owens' pocket (they took 20 combined, making -I think- 12).
They're going nowhere unless Coleman and Owens carry them, and this is
a big problem for Boeheim.  In college basketball, one great player can
carry a team (Bird and Ind St.; Manning and Kansas), and SU has 2 that
only got 20 shots between them.

Mike, I have to agree about the lack of intensity.  It showed in their
rebounding.  ND owned the glass for the most part.  It was "1 and done"
for SU.

After such a good turn-around when Edwards took over the point, SU has
taken a huge step backwards after last week.  They don't presently
have the consistency day-after-day to win even a small tournament like
the BE.  And they will have to build some big-time momentum (ie: beat
G'town to close the regular season) over the next 2 wks in order to
progress in the NCAA's past the 2nd round.


Joe

    when does SU play G'town again??

    Last weekend of the regular season, either March 3 or 4.
    
    John

    
    March 4th John to be exact. It seemed to me like Boehiem actually
    looked at this like a practice game and payed the price for it.
    Syracuse's biggest problem in this game was the only time they swung
    the ball around the perimeter was when Coleman went out to point.
    Aren't they supposed to swing the ball in order to get him open down
    low?
    
    mike
    
    providence/ uconn to night should be a dandy . game is at uconn i'll
    take the underdog outright tonight.....

>    It seemed to me like Boehiem actually
>    looked at this like a practice game and payed the price for it.

Amazing Mike, I thought the same thing while sitting in the stands.
Mike Hopkins comes into the game very early in the 1st 1/2...why ?
It appeared he was experimenting.  Johnson doesn't even get into
the game ?...after he was your starter up until 1/23 ??

We don't know all the internal stuff at practice and in the locker-
room, but it seems strange that Scott plays a lot vs. Pitt and G'town,
and then doesn't see much time until Sat.  Boeheim should be jelling
this team, and it appears he's separating it.


gotta go...


Joe

    Just have a score I'm going home to watch it on tape but the ticker
    says
    
    			UCONN 75  PROVIDENCE 72  (OVERTIME)
    
    Jimbo

    Great game last night for UConn, and PC has nothing to be ashamed of!
    
    National rankings I heard on the radio this morning have G'town #5 and
    UConn #6!  Go big east!
    
    =Bob=

It sure seemed like neither team wanted the game last night.  UCONN blew the
lead and did everything in their power to hand over the game in regulation.  They
failed to score a field goal in the last 8 minutes of regulation, and they were
clanging their free throws.  Then, in OT, Providence returned the favor by also
clanging free throws at an alarming rate.  With about 40 seconds left, UCONN had
the ball and the score was tied.  They killed the clock and with 3 seconds left
Nadav Hanefeld bounced in a 3-pointer from the top of the key.  Great win for
UCONN; however, one thing became clear as I was watching it.  UCONN's youth
really showed last night.  When it was crunch time, they were very nervous and
could have easily lost this game.  With only one senior on the team (Tate George),
they lack the steadying influence that more experienced players provide.  They
could still go far in the NCAA tourney, but I wouldn't be surprized if this
inexperience factor proves to be their downfall.  On the positive side, all this
youth means that they should be solid for the next couple of seasons!

Laker_Ken

    Good Commentary Laker_Ken but there is one thing about the youth
    factor you may not have considered.
   	Nadav Hanefeld is 22 years old (maturity)
    	He was a member of the Israeli Olympic Basketball team (knows
    								pressure)
    	Recently discharged from the Army ('been around?)
    
    He may be a freshman but it isn't the same thing as being a 17-18
    year old frosh.
    
    HTH
    
    Kev_OW(tm)
    

    Kev,
    
    	Age doesn't necessarily mean maturity.  I saw the guy play
    	a couple of weeks ago.  If he made a shot, he was sky high.
    	If he missed a shot, he would hang his head.  The coach
    	had to keep the guy's chin up for him.  He does hustle and
    	try hard though..........
    
    Claybone

   
    
    RE: "Age doesn't necessarily mean maturity."
    
    Clay,
    
    ABSOLUTELY!!!!! All one needs to do to prove your statement
    is read this notesfile.!!!!
    
    :*)

    
    Disappointing night of b-ball, in my opinion. Noway, nohow is UCONN the
    6th best team in the country. Unless that was by far the worst game
    they have played. Very boring. I was hoping someone would win it in
    regulation so they could cut to Indiana-Purdue. Then that game was a
    total blow-out. Purdue was far and away the best team on ESPN last
    night.

>    Disappointing night of b-ball, in my opinion. Noway, nohow is UCONN the
>    6th best team in the country. Unless that was by far the worst game
>    they have played.

One game can be very misleading...a team can look very different from night
to night, from team to team.  Style, matchups, mental approach to the game,
all can create misleading impressions of how strong/weak a team is.

Most of the guys that were with me at the SU-ND game (not having seen SU much,
if at all, this year) were surprised that they were highly ranked.  Of course,
had they seen the wins over G'town and UConn, they'd think they can beat
anyone in the country.

UConn is a good team.  I don't know how far they'll go in the tourney.
They haven't had a tough out-of-conference test.  And their big wins in the
conference have come at home (well, they did beat PC on the road).  I don't
know if they're #6, but as most commentators say, there aren't any dominant
teams this year.  Is Duke really a #3 ?  Not in my opinion.  UConn is well-
balanced, and plays good defense.  I think the lack of a good big man will
hurt them if they get deep (3rd/4th round) into the tournament.

As Billy Packer said, after picking his top 16 seeds (for the NCAA Regions),
"The beauty of this year is that 30 other teams could beat any of these 16
on a given night on a neutral court."


Packers seedings:

	East		Southeast		Midwest		West

	Duke		Kansas			Missouri	UNLV
	Georgetown	Georgia Tech		Purdue		Oklahoma
	Michigan St	LSU			Arkansas	Syracuse
	Louisville	Michigan		Connecticut	Oregon St

Duke #1 in the East ?  Coach K gets more "slack" than I think he deserves.
Mich St a #3 seed in the East ?...while Syracuse (also a #3) is sent packing
to the West ?  Michigan #4 ????

I would love to see the West as Packer sees it.  Syracuse would its best
shot at getting to the Final Four in this situation.  I don't think they'd
have to deal with games in the 50s against UNLV and Okla....and how I'd
love to smack Tubbs around.


Joe

> have to deal with games in the 50s against UNLV and Okla....and how I'd
> love to smack Tubbs around.
    
    I wouldn't count on smacking Tubbs around.  OU is coming around
    and looked good against Missouri.
    
    The BIG-8 has 3 teams that can go all the way this time.
    
    Cowboy
    

UCONN tried to protect their lead over PC from about midway in the 2nd half.
They ran down the shot clock to about 15 seconds each time before taking a shot
and a lot of people were just standing around on offense.  As stated earlier,
they went 8-9 minutes without a FG and they missed a lot of free throws.

The lesson to be learned is that by trying to protect their 10 point lead,
they totally got out of their offensive sync and let PC get back into the game.
UCONN can't try to protect a lead for 10 + minutes in a game, not against a
good team like PC.

A win like this for UCONN should help mature a "young" team and they better
realize that just because they are ranked # 6, the opponent isn't going to roll 
over and play dead.

Jim

>    I wouldn't count on smacking Tubbs around.  OU is coming around
>    and looked good against Missouri.

After seeing Missou against KU, and Okla vs. Seton Hall, I think SU
can play with either.  Their game styles match-up nicely with what
SU wants to do, and I'll bet SU plays better defense, and has a
front line that neither has had to deal with in the Big Eight.

I don't see either playing zone defenses, and that's been the only
thing to stop SU this year.  Who on Okla is going to guard Billy and
Derrick 1-1, without fouling out ?


re:  UConn and missing FTs

apparently they are the worst FT shooting team in the BE this year...
yet SU gets all the publicity

Joe

    re .299
"""noway, nohow is UCONN the 6th best team in the country"""
    
    I beg to differ it says it right here in the paper UCONN #6 so there
    8*)
    
    Jimbo

    Syracuse spanked BC last night 105-69. Close game till about 5 min.
    left in the 1st half, from what I've heard.
    				Rich
    

    
    
    GAME OF THE NIGHT!!!!!!
    
    
    ST. JOHN'S REDMEN    vs.       Child's Slimeball Hoya's
    				(what the h*ll is a HOYA anyway?????)
    
    		ESPN    7:00
    
    
    GO LOUIEEEEEE!!!!!! (and get another sweater, pleeze?)

    While the mascot for Georgetown is a bulldog (why, I don't know)
    Hoya comes from a cheer used at Georgetown back in the early part
    of the century.  Being a Catholic University (Jesuit no less), Latin
    was heavily used there and one of the cheers used was Hoya Saxa,
    meaning "what rocks".  This was probably in reference to the linemen
    standing stern like rocks.  Georgetown did have excellent football
    at one point before it de-emphasized, like so many other Catholic
    Universities around the country.  The nickname Hoyas has stood since.
    
    By the way, Kevin, the Apostrophe Police has penalized you for
    incorrect usage in typing "Hoya's" (sic).  Naughty, naughty.  :-)
    
    John

    
    Unfortunately Kev, it's my dart night so unless the Bar I go to has
    gotten a TV and cable since I was there last, I'll miss this one.
    
    Boils down to one player for SJU, Boo Harvey. If he can handle the
    pressure distribute the ball and score big then SJU has a good chance
    to win. Werdamm and Mourning should balance one another off. You gain
    with Mahik and Singelton but loose with that back at the two guard.
    
    great performances by guards kill us all the time, Chris Jackson, Pearl
    Washington from the past and Carlton Screen this year has been an
    achilles heel for the Hoyas.....
    
    I thought they got the name Hoya because it rhymes so well with
    PARANOIA......  ;^)
    
    I think someone said it has to do with a Rock? The one in the Stomper's
    brain when it comes to offense...
    
    mike

    
    Hey John, is there any subject you don't know something about?
    
    mike

    There's a lot I don't know about.  I read SI every week, TSN every
    week and a couple of monthly publications along with daily papers.
    I also have a pretty good sized library at home and I have a good
    memory, so I remember obscure stuff like the derivation of Hoyas.
    
    I only do it with things I'm interested in, for example, I have
    no interest in horse racing, so I only remember things about it
    in passing.
    
    John

    Your royal Fuzz,  ;^)
    
    As I had intended to denote possesive sense and ownership of Mike
    "owning" the slimeballs, I stand firm in my conviction that the
    apostophe was correctly used.  It was not intended to mean plural,
    because that could have indicated that there could be more than
    one slimeball Hoya school around and to the best of my [sic] limited
    knowledge, but if there were/are more of them, Mike could
    own them too!
    
    I vaguely remember Sister Mary Virgin Without Sin saying something
    about "special" rules useage of apostrophe's when ownership and
    vowels were concerned.  If you believe that I am wrong, then perhaps
    you could provide me with the appropriate documentation and direction
    for me to mend my ways and sin no more! ;^)
    
    Hey, let's have a trial......
    
    Kev_OW(tm)
    

    Hopefully,SU can get back in gear after being embarrased by Notre
    Dame.I'm not expecting a Big East regular-season championship,but a
    tournament win is a very good possibility.
    
    
    As far as seeding goes,I'd love to see SU get a shot at Tubbs and the
    Laters(-:),or even UNLV!!
    
    
    
    
    
    Just 'chillin
    
    O_J

    
    
    I can see SU handling Tubbs' boys but UNLV seems to be cooking now that
    Butler is back. Right now If I had one and only one pick for who will
    win it all it would be UNLV....Fortunately for me I get to pick as
    many winners as I want it just cost me more $$$$$$$$$$$....
    
    Don't worry about SU winning the BET. It's in the bag. I'm going to
    the tournment and if there is one team I do not want to see win it
    it is them...I hope to see someone new win it like Providence....
    
    of course if the Hoyas win I won't be upset either... ;^)
    
    mike

>    I'm not expecting a Big East regular-season championship,but a
>    tournament win is a very good possibility.

Believe it or not, SU still has a very good chance to win the BE regular
season championship.  If they beat Prov, Seton Hall and G'town, and
G'town beats UConn (@home), SU's the regular season champs.  All 3 teams
would be 12-4, and SU would 3-1 against the other 2 head-to-head, while
UConn would be 2-2, and G'town 1-3.


re:  BE tournament

Mike, we may not see SU and G'town in the finals.  Sounds bizarre, but
maybe we'll see UConn-PC, or UConn-St. John's.

If I had to put money on it right now, I'd bet on a UConn-G'town final.


re:  Nadav Henefeld

Any of you UConn guys know if this guy is committed to staying for 4 yrs ?
I heard some college hoop talk on WFAN, and some callers were questioning
whether he is this yr's version of Andrew Gaze (ie: leaves school as soon
as the b-ball season is over).

If he does, expect the NCAA to look into this "rent a foreigner" approach
to building a b-ball team.


Joe

    re: Last
    
    If Su does end up winning the Big East,don't you think the momentum of
    sweeping Georgetown would help them win the tournament??
    
    
    Just a thought............
    
    
    
    O_J
    z

    YABBA DABBA DOOOO!!!!!!!   HOOORAY!!!!!!!!!
    
    For those of you who don't know ( especially YOU Mikey!!!),
    the clean cut, all-american, desegregated, motivated, honorable
   etc, etc guys from SAINT JOHN'S UNIVERSITY just happened to kick
    a little ( a lota?) Georgetown butt earlier!!!!   :*)
    
    LOUIEEEEE, taking my advice about the sweater, pulled a quickie
    by wearing the turd brown one in the first half.  In the second
    half he appeared with a neato fly-fisherman knitted pattern and
    the HOYAs (O.K. "a.p."?) were done for!!!!
    
    Interesting fact - of the last 11 slimebag losses at THEIR home
    court, SJU stuck it to them six (6), yup SIX, times!!!!
    
    Yeah Right Phil, sure the game has passed LOUIEEEEE bye!!!!  ;^))
    
    For most of the game I didn't think we had any chance to even make
    it close.  First half shooting was about 37% while Mikey's slime
    was 20%+ better.  Weirdann got 3 quick fouls and sat out most of
    the half.  Muto held his own ( all things considered), and Boo played
    like dog dung!  SJU down by 10+ frequently and they weren't playing
    crisp ball.
    
    Second half was similiar except Weidann managed to neutralize the
    Hoya rebounding edge.  Singleton was a major factor in this too!
    
    Anyhow, the "No Show" of the game, Boo Harvey, made an appearance
    at about 8 seconds to go with SJU down by 2 (I forgot who got the
    GU rebound).  He simply dodged a defender on the run and just popped
    up a GOOD 3 pointer!!!!!!
    
    Whatta ending!!!!!
    (Congrats Frank, even though you are on vacation, for UConn's
    undisputed first place!)
    
    Hey MIKEY ->  nya nya nya revenge is soooooo sweet!!!!!

    Yes, Louiee did get a new sweater, and Greg Harvey is still
    "unboolievable" as he beats the Hoyas with a three-pointer.
    
    Still, the game has passed Louiee by, in my opinion, and I'm as
    die hard as they come.
                                                    
    In any case, this was a great win for a team in need of a BE win,
    since they still have Pitt on the road, before finishing up with
    SHU (and Marko Lokar?) at home on March 3.
    
    Redmen Phil                                 
    

    C'mon Phil,
    How can you say that the game has passed LOUIEEEEE by?
    He's got a school with NO dorms.  Therefore he's got to 
    get bodies (primarily) from the NYC area.  The others room in 
    private houses.  That factor tends to diminish the amount
    of quality players he could recruit.
    
    With that limitation, he's still able to ALWAYS put a competitive
    team on the floor!  Sure, he's still not won the NCAA's (always
    the bridesmade?), but EVERY team he's had in recent years has been
    a ranked team (occasionally in the TOP 10)!
    
    Face it, he's the best at making the most with the little he's had.
    (as a general statement).  He has the ability as a coach to control
    the game, regardless of the opponent - that is probably his legacy.
    SJU is always acknowledged as tenacious, tought, and never-say-uncle.
    
    Look at his W-L record.  Damn, the little guy is always about 70%
    in the win column.  Go back as far as you want and then look at
    who was on the teams.  You tell me  that he is an underachiever
    or that the game has passed him by.
    
    Granted, LOUIEEEEE has never changed his coaching strategy.  He's
    predictable, everybody knows what he is going to do/try.  So how
    come he still wins? (more than he loses)
    
    This year they had the biggest winning margin in SJU (BE) history
    against UConn, they just beat (a win is a win is a win, etc,) GU,
    they have a winning record, they were NOT embarrassed against the
    ACC, and and my PC alumni brother STILL won't bet against me (SJU)
    mano-a-mano!  He still wants the spread!!!
    
    Phil, the game hasn't passed LOUIEEE by;
    Society has.....
    The schools want the money
    the Kids want the money/fame
    TV wants the ratings
    The printed media wants contriversy
    "T" wants ACCChris
    etc.
    
    When was the last (only?) time LOUIEEE was crucified by
    the powers-at-large for underutilizing his talent?
    
    Gimme a break, pal, LOUIEEE can be only as good as the talent
    he can get.   You gotta understand he has to compete with
    all the "golden-fleece'rs of the rest of the NCAA.  Take Kenny Anderson
    or Hurley.  Both NY area kids who LOUIEEE didn't (couldn't?) get.
    Can you imagine what SJU would be if one (or both) went there? 

    Sorry to rant on so but I really believe that LOUIEEE does the most
    he can with the ammo he's got.  Occasionally he may be lucky enought
    to get a "superstar" but as you know, one man does not a super-team
    make (except if your name is Louis Ferdinand Alcindor).
    
    WOW!!! I just figured that this is the longest reply I ever wrote!
    (and that means 2+ years of OW(tm)) Since you hit a sensitive area,
    I probably would go on and on and on but since I have jury duty
    I better end this defense of LOUIEEEE now so I can adjust for tomorrows
    debacle.  ;^)
    
    (if you stayed THIS long),
    Thanks for listening?
    
    
    Kev_OW(tm)    (OW=Occasional Writer--as opposed to RON's)    
    

    
    Congrats Kev_OW and Phil. I kinda felt like the upset was a possibility
    yesterday and after the first couple of minutes I turned to the guy
    aside of me and told him the Hoyas were going down. I did get to see
    most of the game as they finally put a TV in the bar we played at last
    night. I had to badger the bartender though to get the game on. Sealy
    had a great game. You could tell early that SJU wanted it more. Also
    the Stomper's refusal to start Mourning and Mutumbo together is
    rediculous. Harvey may not have had the best game scoring wise Kev
    until it counted but he did handle the pressure without commiting TO's
    and that was his main job.
    
    Goergetown is in trouble this year because of one and only one reason
    Mr. T's buddy. Why he has to treat every game like a chess match and 
    let the other team dictate the tempo and then adjust to it and win at
    that tempo is beyond me. If he would just start Mourning, Mutumbo,
    Edwards, Tillman and Bryant and let them run they'd kill people.
    Edwards in an uptempo style would score more offensively and also
    dish more. With the way Mutumbo can run the court he'd get a ton of
    layups or putbacks in an uptempo style.  Cmon JT change your style will
    ya before us fans suffer through another "Deano" type year  ;^)...
    
    mike
    
    

    These two teams gave "mediocre" a whole new meaning last night.
    
    NAZZ

re:  SJU and winning at the Cap Cntr

In '85, when they met 4 times, St. John's won only once, and that was
at the Cap Center.  For some reason, they play well there.


re:  Boo Harvey

How old is Harvey.  ESPN was mentioning that he's had to sit out 2 yrs
with academic problems.  I know he was recruited in the same year as
Sherman Douglas.  How is it that he's still in college ?


re:  G'town

Hey Mike, just like Syracuse, they aren't as tough as expected this year.
Their offensive sets are unimaginative, and they don't run that well.
Also, their defense doesn't seem to bother people as much as in the past.

I still believe G'town and SU are the 2 best teams in the conference, but
as has been proven this year, on any night they can both be had.  That's
why I believe it's possible that neither will make the BE Finals.


re:  Villanova-Temple game

Anyone got the results of this one ?  If 'Nova dropped it, it's good-bye
NCAA tournament.


Joe

    
    Yeah Joe, but they don't run because of the coach not because they can't.
    The defense don't bother people as much anymore because most coaches
    have now placed a bigger emphasis on recruiting a top notch point
    guard, and in the big east anyways they've all seen the defense for so
    long they have come up with the proper answers to them. Even Jimmy ;^)
    
    GT needs a production from the small forward which they aren't getting.
    So far Jt has tried Allen, Tate and Jefferson to no avail. He should
    bite the bullet and go to a three guard offense.....
    
    mike
    

    You makes lots of good points....
    
    However, its a fack that I don't like his style of play (He wins,
    	     	but its too slow for me - I like PC's and UConn's style);
    	     its a fack that he doesn't recruit enough BIG bodies (SJU
    	     	has not recruited a big body in two years - last and this year,
    	     	they've only recruited another G, Lee Green, albeit a super
    	     	one, but they need to sign at the very least 6'10" Shawnelle 
    	     	Scott in the spring;
    	     its a fack he can't handle the press;
    	     its a fack that SJU makes the poorest use of the clock
             	late in a game when they are behind;
             its a fack that he can't teach the press (even when he
    	     	supposedly has that wierdo LoBalbo as his defenxive Guru;
             its a fack that he's not taken advantage of the 3-point
    	     	rule (look at Sproling...he's a robot);
             its a fack he doesn't know how to teach or play a zone
    		(he admits this himself);
    	     its a fack that this year, their recruiting has been terrible
    		(too many supers in NYC went elsewhere without considering
    		SJU);
    	     its a fack that year after year SJU is involved with less
    	     	"Name" recruits than any other BE schools;
    	     etc.
    
    I love the Redmen, but I'm trying to be realistic.  
                                     
    I see every SJU game either in person (around 18 this year) or on
    the tube, and I get frustrated knowing they can do better with better
    end-of-game play and a deeper, better bench.
    
    Redmen Phil 
    
                 

    re. .307
    
    >                             one of the cheers used was Hoya Saxa,
    >meaning "what rocks".  This was probably in reference to the linemen
    >standing stern like rocks. 
    
    Ahem.........out of the gutter and up on the curb John..... ;^)
    
    Clay

    SU plays Providence this Saturday.It should be a very close game.The
    Friars strength is their backcourt,which will give us some problems
    
    It's a must win situation for both teams;more so for Syracuse,if they
    want a BE title.
    
    
    
    
    O_J

    No way,no how is UCONN the #5 team in the nation.Believe me,I have
    tremendous respect for them and they probably are a top ten team,but
    #5?
    
    
    O_J

UCONN kicked Seton Hall's butt all over the place Saturday night.  I believe 
the final spread was about 20 points.  Big game is Wednesday night at George-
town!  Should be a great battle.  Anybody know if that game will be televised?

Laker_Ken

    
    Why not? They are playing great ball right now especially defensively.
    Offensively they spread it around well. They're solid just not
    spectacular. They only way they don't deserve it is if the Big East
    is over-rated. I don't think so, so based on their record they are were
    they belong........
    
    mike

>    No way,no how is UCONN the #5 team in the nation.Believe me,I have
>    tremendous respect for them and they probably are a top ten team,but
>    #5?
    
O_J,

Don't get so excited, polls mean little, save their possible affect on NCAA
seedings, and unless UConn knocks off G'town Wed, I'm sure they'll be at
most a #3, and probably not in the East.

As Mike said, they're a solid club.  They've beaten the teams they should
beat, and in the Big East that's the whole 2nd division...they haven't lost
to anyone other than Syracuse and St. John's since Jan-something.  That,
coupled with easy wins in the their non-conference schedule, gives them a
very impressive record.  Anything less than a #5 ranking would be a slap
in the face to the Big East.

Our guys (SU) on the other hand, have impressive wins against both G'town
and UConn, but have lost to the likes of Vill (twice) and ND....obvious
NO-NOs.

Give UConn credit, they've earned it.  But there are still more (and bigger)
mountains to climb.


Joe

    Yes UCONN is a great team,but tell me this,in the U.S.A. today/CNN poll
    Michigan was ranked ahead of them and they didn't lose over this past
    week.But some how Uconn jumped from 10 to 5 right past Michigan.
    
    
    
    Just don't understand it.
    O_J

    I was on the UConn campus for a conference on Saturday but couldn't
    get into the game Saturday night.  The level of excitement on the
    campus is unbelievable.  I toured the Gampel Pavilion and it's
    beautiful but too small - they could have easily built it bigger.
    
    John

    
    I think John they built it small to make the place a real pit for
    the visitors. Built-in home court advantage I believe.  :^)
    
    My uncle who's a real booster couldn't understand it either. They
    also have the Hartford Civic Center available for the big games.
    
    I believe Big East rules require that they have atleast 8000 seats.
    
    Michigan lost last week to OSU perhaps that why UConn jumped by them.
    Also UConn is finally getting recoginized around the country. 
    
    Still though rankings are screwy, Why LaSalle hasn't cracked the top
    ten with only one loss in beyond me. Sure they don't have the toughest
    conference schedule but they have beaten some impressive teams outside
    their conference....
    
    mike
    

Syracuse (Boeheim) still appears to be unsettled...still searching for the
right combination, and that's not a good sign at this point in the season.
Boeheim's benching of Coleman yesterday, while worthy of applause as a
disciplinary move (he missed a team mtg), sends a signal that this isn't
a finely tuned machine.

Also, the confusing substitution patterns continue.  Johnson was the 1st
sub in yesterday (6pts, shot the outside J nicely) after not playing a wk
ago vs. ND.  Apparently it was Tony Scott's turn to get NO playing time,
after significant minutes against ND and BC.  Maybe Boeheim's subs are based
on the team he's playing... ie: matchups, etc.  9 played yesterday, and all
9 got significant minutes, a departure from the norm.

Interesting use of Conrad McRae.  The kid played at a critical point of
the 2nd 1/2 (no one was in foul trouble).  He's going to be a player.
He's 6'10" and can move.  He's a good shot blocker and plays aggressively,
and strong.  Boeheim has said that he doesn't have an offensive game yet
(ie: is a "raw" talent).  But he was the 20th ranked high school player
in the country last year.  Obviously, another coach would have used him
more by now, but I think it's smart to get him in there before the tourney
starts...you can always use the extra big guy with only 5 fouls and LeRon
Ellis as your starting center.

Manning appears to be the opposite of McRae.  He's more skilled offensively,
but plays his whole game too tentatively.  The only thing he does with any
confidence is shoot the outside (15') jumper; not a prime requirement of a
6'11" center.  He misses the chippies, and doesn't hold on to the ball in
traffic.  He was hurting them badly during the stretch when PC went up by
8pts.  It was no coincidence that SU went on a game-winning 22-4 run after
Jimbo got my call to get Manning out and put Ellis back in.  Manning seems
to be in the middle of things when it ain't going SU's way...he missed a
game winning chippie at the buzzer in the 1st PC game...he traveled on a
shot that would have given SU the lead (with 1 minute to go) against Vill
2 wks ago...and then yesterday's game.

I wouldn't want to rely on Rich Manning for a significant length of time
in a crucial game.  Tough call for Boehiem.  He's got to commit to a backup
center.  Is it McRae or Manning ?  I know one thing, McRae won't be playing
behind Manning next year.

Mike Hopkins seems to be the 3rd pt guard (behind Edwards and Thompson).
He controls the ball nicely, but doesn't look for his shot.  It appears
Boeheim wants more alternatives at the point down the stretch, not wanting
to depend completely on one kid (a freshman).  I think it's a wise decision.

Billy Owens was terrific yesterday, and I stand by my prediction at the
beginning of the year:  SU will go as far as Billy Owens takes them.


Joe

>                         -< Simmons good shot at POY >-

Mike, as a Syracuse fan, I'd love to see Derrick go 1st in the NBA draft,
but if one guy can go ahead of him, it's Lionel "Train" Simmons.  With
his scoring ability, he should be a terrific NBA player.  It'll probably
come down to need -->  small forward vs. power forward.  You couldn't
go wrong with either.


Joe

    I too applaude Boeheim's benching of Coleman.But is it really going to
    discipline him??
    
    
    I mean really if your going to discipline him DON'T PLAY HIM!!
    
    
    I'm sure Coleman is saying to himself "Oh damn instead of playing 38
    minutes I'm going to play 36"
    
    
    
    
    O_J
    

After watching the syracuse  game yesterday I'm pretty convinced that they will
make an early exit from the Ncaa tourney. If they don't suddenly come up with 
a player that can hit the J from outside 15ft they'll be toast. As soon as 
PC started to pack the paint syracuse was lost. I don't why they stopped doing 
it at the end of the game.

If I was a coach opposing them I'd pack it in and dare them to make a J or 2.


Metz

    
    Actually Metz yesterday Edwards was hittin the J from beyond 15 ft. 
    In fact if Owens hadn't gone crazy Edwards would have been the player
    of the game.....
    
    Coleman really looked like the benching bother him. Boehiem proved once
    again the inmates run the aslyum.....
    
    and for the 451 st time I ask why does Boehiem play zone? Has he
    forgotten about the six foul rule?
    
    mike

Me?  I'm just enjoying UConn's prosperity this year.  

Ranked #4 in the nation.  That's pretty good.....

8^)

'Saw

    RE: Lionel Simmons #1 pick
    
    I think if there's a dark horse for the #1 pick it's Larry Johnson.He's
    a junior,but expect him to come out this year.
    
    
    
    O_J

>    I too applaude Boeheim's benching of Coleman.But is it really going to
>    discipline him??

>    I mean really if your going to discipline him DON'T PLAY HIM!!

O_J,

I look at the Coleman benching as saying 2 things:  1) to Derrick:  "you're
not bigger than this team";  and  2) to the younger players:  "if I can bench
him, I can bench you".

Jimbo has a lot of returning sophomores (4) and freshman (4) next year (they'll
have only 1 senior next yr --> LeRon Ellis), and this was a good time to make
a statement about expectations.


re:  the SU-PC game

The key to SU's winning the game Sunday wasn't because Providence didn't
play a packed-in zone, but because SU played terrific man-to-man defense.
They went on a 22-4 run late in the game.

I agree that SU has a weakness in shooting the outside jumper, but zones
bother them more because they do not have a disciplined 1/2-court offense
that includes quick ball movement and player movement without the ball.

Billy Owens and Derrick Coleman can hit the 15 footers against a zone, but
they quite often don't even touch the ball against these defenses.


re:  Larry Johnson

I wonder if his decision will hinge upon Tarkanian's decision to stay at
UNLV.  Some think Tark's gone after this season.  If Tark leaves, and Johnson
goes to the NBA, it could be a tough year for the Rebels next season.

For you SU fans, there's a kid (Ed O'Bannon) in Calif that has UNLV, Arizona
and SU on his "short list" of schools.  If the UNLV situation worsens, it
could mean that SU will only be competing with Arizona for him.

He's a 6'9" power forward that SU would like to be the heir apparent to
Coleman's spot.  He's even left-handed.


Joe

    
    Cmon Joe, if that was a statement being made by Boehiem then it's as
    weak as Stevie Thompson's free throw shooting  ;^)....
    
    Coleman had all he could do to keep from laughing....
    
    Hey Kev, guess who hit the winner again?  ;^) unconcious little
    guy that he is.... ;^)
    
    Maybe someday the announcers will realize the Sealy is the MAN for SJU
    now......
    
    ALL- BIG EAST PICKS:  Shorter, Coleman, Owens, Screen and Tillman
    
    			2nd: Sealy, Mourning, Boo, Smith (uconn) Henafield
    
    			3rd: Thompson, Bryant, Conlon, Mattews George
    
    mike

    Mourning for second-team??
    
    
    
    
    O_J
    

re:  Mourning on 2nd team

Shorter's been the better player, IMO, and Alonzo hasn't played better than
Coleman, Owens, Tillmon or Screen.  I agree with Mike's 1st team.  My 2nd team:

		Boo Harvey
		Malik Sealy
		Chris Smith
		Alonzo Mourning
		Stephen Thompson

Tough to leave Murdock from PC out.  Probably would have chosen him over
Harvey if it hadn't been for Boo's last-second heroics of late.

All-Freshman Team (not a wealth of talent yet):

		Terry Dehere (SH - freshman of the year)
		Michael Edwards (SU)
		David Edwards (Georgetown)
		Scott Burrell (UConn)
		Trent Forbes (PC)

Lance Miller and Arron Bain (both at Vill) have had good years too.


Player of the year:

		Derrick Coleman (Syracuse)



Early predictions on the NCAA tournament seedings (knowing UNLV lost last
night):

Top 16 seeds and where they'll go ?

East		South		MidWest		West
----		-----		-------		----
Georgetown	Missouri	Kansas		Michigan
Oklahoma	Duke		Purdue		UNLV
Geo Tech	UConn		Mich St		Syracuse
Minn		Arkansas	LSU		Ore St



Joe

    re .344
    
    	Joe I don't know if you are aware but Nadev Henefield from UCONN
    is a freshman, and should easily win freshman of the year and I would
    think he'd make at least third team all big-east.  As for all of
    my picks I'll put them in at a later date.
    
    Jimbo

    Dick Vitales All Rolls-Royce team
    
    
    College Basketball's starting five are:
    
    Gary Payton(Over Rumeal?)
    Kendall Gill (Over Jackson)
    Derrick Coleman (Over Larry Johnson)
    Alonzo Mourning
    Lionel Simmons
    
    
    
    
    I agree with all except Payton.
    
    
    
    O_J

>    Gary Payton(Over Rumeal?)
    
>    I agree with all except Payton.

	Have you seen the kid play? I've watched him quite a few
times, and he's the real deal.  Unstoppable is the word.

Jim M

    Yeah,the choice isn't UNBELIEVEABLE,I just figured Rumeal is the better
    of the two.
    Payton has scored 50+ more than once and is closing in on Sherman
    Douglas' all-time assist record.
    
    
    
    
    P.S. Joe,(if you know) was Sherman Douglas on last year's starting
    five??
    
    Thanx,
    O_J

    
    O_J, they coaches do not pick the starting five by posistions but by
    who they feel are the five best players in the conference. This is why
    Shorter and Coleman can both make the first team......
    
    Rumeal doesn't know defense and hotdogs too much for Dicky's taste...
    
    Kendall Gill does it all, Jackson doesn't have the all around game that
    Gill does....
    
    mike

    RE Gill
    
    You are right about Gill the kid can do it all!!He can play three
    positions(point guard,off-guard,and small forward. 
    
    
    
    
    
    O_J
    

>                          -< You forgot Henefield!! >-


You're right Jim, I did forget Nadav.  He definitely is on the All-Freshman
team.  It'll be interesting to see if he or Dehere get Freshman of the Year.

All-Freshman Team:

		Terry Dehere (SH)
		Nadav Henefeld (UC)
		Michael Edwards (SU)
		Scott Burrell (UC)
		David Edwards (G'town) --> I could be convinced to chg this
					   one...it's a weak choice

2nd Frosh team:

		Trent Forbes (PC)
		Arron Bain (Vill)
		Lance Miller (Vill)
		Mike Herren (BC)
		Chuck Sproling (SJ)

Sproling academically is a sophomore, but I believe he'll qualify in the
freshman picks just as Shorter did last year (he was Freshman of the Year).

One kid not listed above is Michael Tate (Venison...as in "deer meat")
of Georgetown.  I know the kid plays a lot (I think I've seen him start),
but in the games I've seen, I never see any significant contribution from
him...in any phase of the game.  In fact, that position (ie: small forward)
is a glaring weakness.  Thompson subs freely at that spot, and doesn't seem
to find the answer.

Mike, is this kid doing something that I don't know about ?


For the most part, there are no "jewels" among the BE freshman this year.


Joe

>    P.S. Joe,(if you know) was Sherman Douglas on last year's starting
>    five??

Yes, both he and Coleman were.  Last year's All-Big East selections:

	1st team:
		Charles Smith (G'town...player of the year)
		Sherman Douglas (SU)
		Ramon Ramos (SH)
		Derrick Coleman (SU)
		Brian Shorter (Pitt)

	2nd team:
		Dana Barros (BC)
		Stephen Thompson (SU)
		Alonzo Mourning (G'town)
		Jayson Williams (SJ)
		Cliff Robinson (UC)

	3rd team:
		Eric Murdock (PC)
		John Morton (SH)
		Jason Matthews (Pitt)
		Doug West (Vill)
		Andrew Gaze (SH)

	rookies:
		Malik Sealy (SJ)
		Billy Owens (SU)
		Alonzo Mourning (G'town)
		Brian Shorter (Pitt...rookie of the year)
		Marc Dowdell (Vill)

	defensive player of the year:
		Alonzo Mourning (G'town)

	coach of the year:
		P.J. Carlesimo (SH)


Joe

    
    Joe, I haven't heard of Tate causing any problems, he just hasn't
    produced so JT has been expirementing with the posistion and not
    with any success I might add. He's also not the greatest at giving
    freshman time. Standard BS I imagine that it takes time to learn his
    system. I really wish he'd give Mike Sable a chance at the posistion.
    I've only seen Mike play in one game and he performed very well in
    all facets of the game. Besides being a freshman, he a Shagnasty (tm)
    so I guess he's only there for window dressing.....
    
    Joe, you'll be eating those words next year about Edwards being a shaky
    pick when he becomes the pointman next year. He's definately the most
    create point I've seen at Georgetown. Biggest question is will JT know
    how to best utilize his talents.....
    
    mike

    The pointman of the year??Adrian Autry!!!!
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    O_J
    

    Georgetown entertains UCONN.The Hoyas are favored by 7,but it will go
    down to the wire.
    
    My prediction:
    
    UCONN 71
    Georgetown 73
    
    
    
    The Hall entertains SU,it will be a close one!!
    
    O_J

>    Joe, I haven't heard of Tate causing any problems

Mike, I didn't mean "problems" when I asked if he was doing something
that I wasn't aware of.  I was asking if he was playing better than
what I had seen.


>    Joe, you'll be eating those words next year about Edwards being a shaky
    pick when he becomes the pointman next year.

My comment isn't a reflection on his ability, but on his contribution.
He just hasn't had the playing time to make me confident that he's an
All-Big East Freshman.  For example, MICHAEL Edwards has had the
opportunity, and based on his play I believe he should be on the
Freshman team.

Conrad McRae was picked by some publications to be an IMPACT freshman
for Syracuse, but he's hardly played to this point.  If Boeheim is smart,
he'll play a lot more down the stretch.


Joe

    Hall over SU
    UConn over Run D and C
    
    
    JoJ

    
    
    ok Joe, just my paranoia in full bloom with the tough game tonight..
    
    Nope Tate has played any better or any worst than any game you've
    probably seen. Minimal contributions at best....
    
    On Edwards I look at some of the things this kid does offensively
    and defensively and I know he should start but he doesn't. And let
    him take one bad shot and he's on the pine. JT's a jerk! Edwards would
    have about 20 more assists if the big guys were ready for the dumpoff.
    
    mike

Some thoughts on BE Tournament seedings:

	-  Villanova has locked-up the #5 seed with their win over
	   BC last night...they're 8-8, and even if PC wins Sat vs.
	   Pitt and becomes 8-8, Vill beat PC both times

	-  I believe that if UConn wins tonight (and over BC Sat), they get
	   the #1 seed, and SU will get the #2 (if they beat SH) regardless
	   of the outcome of their game with G'town Sunday ('cause they'll
	   be 1-1 vs. UConn while G'town will be 0-2)


With UConn getting in the NCAA tournament this year it means that every
BE team has been to "the big dance" since the formation of the BE conference.
UConn last made the NCAA tourney in 1979, the year before the BE formed.


Joe

    ok Joe, I think Henefeld generally is not percieved as a freshman,
    because of his age and the composure he has when he plays, he's in
    constant poker face mode.
    
    	Big game tonight, oh how I hope UCONN hands the hoyas a loss at
    home, but being realistic I'll settle for a close game that could
    go either way with UCONN covering the spread and or winning outright.
    I do think the huskies need to lose this game to be able to win 
    the big east tourney though.  Right now the whole state of CT is
    just buzzing about this team, and I'd rather have the letdown be
    now than in the big east tourney.  If they win the tourney look for
    a final four appearance, if they don't they'll be eliminated in the
    round of sixteen.
    
    	If Jayson Williams got hurt earlier in the season would Boo Harvey
    be big east player of the year?
    
    Jimbo

    RE: Final Four Appearance??
    
    Believe me,I have the upmost respect for UCONN.But to expect(?) a final
    four appearance may be somewhat off the wall.
    
    
    
    
    O_J
    

    Whoever said (I think it was someone in the Globe) that this will
    be UConn's first ever NCAA appearance is totally incorrect.  They
    were there a few times, most recently in 1976.
    
    John

    Well it wasn't pretty but SU escaped the Meadowlands and beat The Hall
    71-69 on a last second tip-in by Derrick Coleman.Seton Hall played very
    well.Edwards had about 14 pts and 8(?) assists.
    
    
    
    P.S. Joj I'm just kidding about Seton Hall,they have a very good team
    and will be chalenging for the BE title in a couple years.(of course
    they'll never beat Syracuse.........;)
    
    
    
    O_J

    Did I say this one was going down to the wire??
    
    
    Forget about it!! The Hoyas cruised and sent a message that they are
    still the beast of the east!!!The final was 84-64.If I were SU I'd be
    pretty nervous about Saturday's game.But to be honest the reason why
    the Hoyas dominated the game was because of the twin towers.UCONN's big
    people don't scare anybody so I feel that was the difference.Sorry
    UConn fans,but in the Big East it's still the Hoyas and the Orangemen.
    
    
    
    
    
    O_J

    Winner of Sunday's Georgetown at Syracuse game is assured of at
    least a tie for the regular season conference title.  UConn, if
    it wins at BC Saturday, will tie for the title as well.  St Johns
    will finish no worse than 4th and could tie the loser of the Georgetown
    at Syracuse game with a win in their final game.  Villanova will
    finish no better than 5th, Providence could tie them.  Seton Hall
    is one game worse than Pitt for the dubious honor of facing BC in
    the annual Big East "toilet bowl" game.  BC is far and away going
    to finish last.
    
    I don't know how the tie-breakers work for determining seeds.
    
    John

    If SU wins,do they have the title??
    
    
    
    O_J

    
    SU can only win it outright if they beat the Hoyas and UConn looses
    to BC hahahaaaaa.....
    
    SU can share the title with UConn with a win, but forget about it.
    Hoyas are not intimated by the dome whatsoever and revenge will be
    on their minds. Plus given SU hasn't played a decent game since
    beating us and UConn so chances look good for the Hoyas.....
    
    First SU shot of the game Steven "No Brains" Thompson with a 3-pointer.
    Nice dicipline there Jimmy.
    
    mike 
    
    

    
    oh yeah I forgot does anyone (probably Phil S.) have a seating chart
    for Madison SQ. Garden? I got section 310 for the BET. Shall I bring
    plenty of hankies for the nosebleeds?
    
    Are the ushers real male appandages or will I be able to move to better
    seats fairly easy?
    
    mike

    RE: Last
    
    Well when the orangemen crushed your Hoyas,itwasn't that the Hoyas just
    had a bad day.Our frontline DOMINATED Goergetown's.The reason why the
    Hoyas won't win Saturday is because Coleman & Owens won't let them.
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    `Nuff said
    O_J

    
    What was Coleman last night 4-15? I should worry...hahaa
    
    Mourning will not be embaressed again and Mutumbo will eat Coleman
    up....
    
    mike

    The M&M boys don't even compare with the "Motown Masher"!!
    As far as 4-15,look at what Mourning did against the Redman.The only
    true shot this guy has is a slam-dunk!!
    
    
    
    
    
    
    Hope this helps,
    O_J

    
    The Motown Masher is good no question about it but it's not his talent
    I question it's his mind....
    
    
    sometimes it wanders....
    
    besides Boehiem is still coaching SU, that's our Ace in the hole...
    
    mike

    His mind??Well let's talk about how Mourning makes ethnic slurs at
    Henefeld(SP).Yeah his head's really in the game.Alonzo has no class
    whatsoever!!And he TRIES to intimidate DC,but it doesn't work of
    course.
    
    
    
    
    Let's not get into a pissing contest,since we all know who the clear
    favorite is.........;)
    O_J

    
    Why, I thought you enjoyed LDUC's... ;^)
    
    besides talking trash as Mourning does, doesn't take his focus off the
    game. Also the Henefield incident is just hearsay we all know what a
    rebel rouser the Saw is...
    
    there is no clear favorite for this one I expect Syracuse to be a 3
    point favorite in the game because of the homecourt. SU will have spot
    GT 5 points or better to be consider a clear cut favorite....
    
    mike

    I didn't get it from`Saw.It was on a sports show.
    
    
    
    O_J

    
    most journelist tend to sensationalize anyways...  :^)
    
    I don't doubt that it's true, but unfortunately this has become a big
    part of the game. I don't recall players talking trash before the 
    eighties, it may have started when they elected Ronny "I can't
    remember" RayGuns president. He always talked a good game....
    
    Not that it's much of a defense for Mourning but if you've ever
    attended a Georgetown game and heard the slings and barbs thrown
    at them you might understand where they're coming from....
    
    mike

    According to the Globe:
    
    SU has the #1 seed with a win.  Period.
    
    GT has to win and has to have Pitt beat Providence.  If Providence
    beats Pitt, then GT would have to go through a coin toss with UConn,
    assuming the Dogs beat BC.
    
    UConn has to beat BC, has to have Providence beat Pitt and then
    would be in a coin toss with the Hoyas.
    
    John

Well, we lost big last night.

But I'm not too disappointed.  Actually, it was probably just
what the doctor ordered.  Nothing like a defeat to bring you
back to earth and get you in the mood to work hard....

Go Huskies....

Chainsaw

    
    Billy Owens needs just 8 pts to hit 1000 for his career!!He could pass
    either Coleman or Douglas next year.
    
    
    
    
    O_J

>    According to the Globe:
>    SU has the #1 seed with a win.  Period.

You beat me to it John (damn early-morning mtgs !).  I had indicated
before this that I believed SU would win the BE title with wins over
SH and G'town and a G'town win over UConn, and the Globe has confirmed
it.  I believe the tie-breakers are:

	1	head-to-head			SU-UConn split
	2	records vs. next best team	w/ SU win over G'town,
						they'd be 2-0, UC 1-1

The reason it goes to a coin flip if G'town and UConn tie is that the 2
clubs split, and (believe it or not) have identical records vs. all other
BE opponents.  For the same reason, I believe G'town and St. John's would
have to flip a coin to determine who's the 3 and 4 seeds.  So no matter
what happens (save a UConn loss to BC, and a SJ loss to SH), G'town appears
to be headed for a flip of the coin, and could end up anywhere from 1-4.

Tough luck for our Orangemen.  They could win the BE regular season title
and have to face G'town in the semi-finals...and that's their reward for
finishing #1 ???  As long as UC beats BC, SU will either be the #1 or #3
seed.


re:  last night's game at SH

Every game (except for the last BC game, and the G'town game) has been
a struggle for SU.  Last night was typical --->  up 11 with 5-6 minutes
left, and then they try to delay, get no offense at all, and end up taking
poor shots, missing free throws, and SH ties it with 8 seconds left.
Boehiem let Billy take the last shot (as he should), but he didn't create
any movement among the other players so Billy had someone to dump-off
to if he didn't have a good shot (which he didn't).  Only Coleman's tip
in saved the day.  Owens sees the floor so well, and is such a good passer,
that he could get the ball to someone with a better shot.  No creativity
from "the professor".

Edwards probably scored more (14) than in any other game, but he showed
his freshman tendencies by trying some questionable passes at a time when
SU needed to use the clock and take some good shots.

Coleman's tip was his only FG of the 2nd 1/2...tough shooting night.  The
shot he took (up 2) with 14 seconds left was awful (ie: air-ball).


re: Seton Hall's future

They do have some good young talent, but it's in the backcourt.  Their
frontline (Cooper, Avent, Volcy) are all seniors.  They've got Luther
Wright coming in next year to play center, so they'll be very young
and inexperienced there.  But look out 2-3 yrs from now !


re:  this SUnday's game

Mike,  Coleman comes to play, especially vs. the Hoyas.  I don't think he's
ever had a bad game against them.  And the fact that SU hasn't played very
well recently makes me think they will play well SUnday (like they did on
1/27).  As we discussed after their 1st mtg, Thompson will decide whether
G'town will win or not.  If he brings the game down to a 1/2-court contest,
G'town has a good chance to win (this is when the twin towers can be used
effectively).  But if there are open passing lanes, and room to drive to
the hoop, SU can take it.  For the 1st time in a long while, SU has the
more talented team.

As an SU fan, I want the regular season title (SU has never won the BE
regular season title).  It comes down to playing well on SUnday.  I don't
have confidence in this team being able to win 3 in a row against the
likes of PC, UConn and G'town next weekend.  And beating G'town SUnday
should give them a good seeding in the NCAA tourney, regardless of what
happens in the BE tounament.  If they lose in both places, they're
screwed.


Joe

    RE Georgetown 
    
    
    IMO,last year's team had the talent to beat the Hoyas.The problem was
    that Owens didn't develop quick enuff and he was playing power forward.
    
    
    
    Saturday should be interesting,
    O_J

    
    Owens wasn't allowed to develop last year because of Jimmy's star
    system which runs around seniority. Plus the biggest reason we
    see more of Billy moving forward this year is because Douglas
    is gone. Everything went through Douglas last year with good reason
    he's an excellent point guard. This year Billy had been called upon
    to handle the ball as well and it has brought out his whole game.
    
    Your right Joe, Coleman does play well against GT. I almost blew my
    cookies last night when Raf was pushing him for #1 draft pick, but then
    I thought about his career and how he has steadly improved all of his
    weakness to pluses and can understand how that would impress the big
    boys.
    
    Still would prefer to see GT uptempo it. They got the horses, sure 
    SU can run with them but in a slow down game I think SU has the
    advantage because it allows them to really get down defensively
    with their man to man and expose GT's weaknesses at the Forward
    spot. It comes down to the coaches, both are stinko one the whistle
    blows but in the pre-game prep JT gets the edge cause he'll have
    his defense ready and the kids more motivated....
    
    mike

    If Georgetown tries to run with SU they'll lose by 20 or more.This is
    exactly what happened to them the last time they met.The Hoyas tried to
    run with us but they couldn't.If they slow it down that gives them a
    very good chance to win with their great defense and shotblockers.
    
    
    
    
    O_J

    Oh well it appears UCONN got their a**es handed to them!!!  I do
    however think this was a good time to lose.  As far as the seedings
    for the big east tourney go I don't really think it matters because
    G'town, Uconn, cuse, and the redmen will all be in the semi's.  This
    means that whoever wind the title has two tough games to win period.  I
    think that any of the four teams can and have beaten each other, so
    lets play some ball!!!!
    
    I'll still stick with my prediction though that if UCONN wins the
    tournament, which is not a longshot by any means, they will reach the
    final four.  UCONN is a team of momentum I believe that they basically
    have three long winning streaks, and winning the tournament would
    set the state in motion.
    
    Jim Jim wake up UCONN didn't really shoot 19 for 67 last night it was
    all a hoya fantasy 8*)
    
    Jimbo
    

    Hey O_J, how come you're so quick to write off UCONN after one game? 
    Sure, Thompson's thugs beat the crap out of the Huskies last night, but
    UCONN did the same thing to the G-Men when they visited Nutmeg City. 
    And as for your SYRACUSE (acronym for Sorry Excuse) Orangegents, they
    only managed to beat the Huskies by 4 up at their Career Dome, while
    UCONN trashed the disrespectful underachievers back in the Constitution
    State.
    
    G-Town may end up taking the Big East tourney instead of the Huskies,
    but it sure t'ain't gonna be those illiterates from upstate New Yawk!
    
    Laker_Ken

    Oh another thing that might interest you-seeing that Huskies got beat
    by Georgetown by 20 and My Boys beat Georgetown by 19 at the Cap
    Center,that must mean we're 39 point favorites next time we meet,eh
    Ken?........................................
    
    
    
    
    
    
    Hope this helps,(-:)
    O_J

    
    
    Aw Ken,admit it,the best teams in the Big East are Georgtown and
    Syracuse.The sooner you realize that,the better off you will be.Where
    and when did I write off UCONN??I just said two best teams are SU and
    the Hoyas.
    
    
    
    As for UCONN beating us,it was very close.We were down by 3 with 2
    minutes to go.The game at the Carrier Dome wasn't as close as the final
    score would indicate.We went up by 17 with less than 5 minutes to
    go.
    
    >>       but UCONN did the same to the G-Men when they visited Nutmeg
    City.
    
    
    Get real.
    
    They won 70-65 which is hardly a blow-out.
    
    Your living in Dream-land once again,Ken.The Musties;oops!!!I mean
    Huskies are a very good team-that's it.Maybe you should stick to your
    beloved Lackers and hope(or maybe pray) that they beat Detroit,and
    don't count on that either.
    
    As I've stated before no one on the M-er um the Huskies can guard
    either Billy Owens or Derrick Coleman 1.
                                          1
    
    I will say that the Huskies have a very good team,and are a darkhorse(a
    la Seton Hall, and Providence) to make the Final Four.
    
    
    
    So Ken before you make  statements like that with basis(i.e. stupid
    statements) I think you should think twice!!!
    
    
    
    Just chillin'
    O_J

    Sorry for a typo I made,Ken it should be NO BASIS!!!
    
    
    Hope this helps,
    O_J

No matter what your allegiance, I think you all have to give
UCONN credit for one helluva a turnaround this year.   Who expected
it?  I sure as hell didn't, in fact I was writing them off early
this year.  (The note's in here some place...)

Being down by 17 with 5 minutes to go, and losing by 4, prompts me
to use the old Vince Lombardi quote:  "We didn't lose, we just
ran outta time..."

Over time, Gougetown and SorryExcuse have been the best in the BE.
But, this year, *obviously* the standings say the UCONN is right up
there with the best, and they deserve credit.  Will they do the same
nexted year?  Time will tell, but I sure hope so!

Go UCONN...

Chainsaw

    When your up by 17,and you lose by 4,it shows how good of a coach you
    have.
    
    
    O_J

With all of the games that Baywhine has blown in his career,
a Syracuse fan should be the last one BLAMming anyone else's coach...8^)

    
    At least the Stomper controlled himself to the extent that he didn't
    assault anyone (again) yesterday.

	But he did get three T's and the ole Heave-Ho.

	( The Hoyas also lost )

Mike JN

    
    haha Hoot, you got that right. It's too bad Cuse got all those free
    throws though cause getting himself tossed out was the best thing he
    did all day.
    
    Congrats Joe you got your wish. I hope you don't mind if I consider it
    a gift. Coleman had 27 and got the MVP of the game but again like last
    week I think Edwards should have gotten it. If he was hitting early
    this one was over.
    
    Jason, what did I tell you, 32-22 and ole JT decides to slow the ball
    down, Cuse sets up their defense and all of sudden it's a 4 point game
    and then Stompers antics. If he just kept jamming it down their throats
    Cuse would have been deadmeat. Jimmy didn't have any answers. 
    
    Really a shame the refs didn't have control of this one as rebounding
    action was rediculous pushing shoving grapping jersey all legal
    yesterday.
    
    Anyone else ready to agree with me that Mutumbo is a better player than
    Mourning?
    
    hopefully JT will step in front of bus and let Esherick run the show...
    
    maybe he can be the next Fischer  ;^)
    
    mike
    

    Well,gentlmen,as I promised Syracuse beat Georgetown.I really still
    believe that the Hoyas can't run with SU.They tried to do it at the Cap 
    and the got blown out.The only reason this game was close was becuase
    Billy Owens had only 3pts in the first half.But he came alive in the
    second half and calmly swished 2 free throws with 1 second left.
    
    
    This win will DEFINATELY give SU a #1 seed in the east.I expect them to
    win the tournament because the Hoyas are the only team that can reallt
    beat us,but it won't happen.SU is a very streaky team.If you give them
    momentum like yesterday,this very well could propell them into the
    final four.I'm not saying it will happen,but it does look good.The
    orangemen can even be #1 if they win their tournament and Missouri wins
    theirs(SU is #3).
    
    
    But my feeling is if Syracuse gets to the final four,they'll win `cause
    Coleman won't let them loose like they did when he was a freshman.
    
    
    
    `Nuff said for now,
    O_J

    
    Jason please tell Rollie M. that his boys can't beat SU for me please.
    I wish to see the look on his face. 
    
    They got blown out at the Cap because Su made their foul shots at the
    end and GT continually missed thre point attemps. If you have a tape
    of the game yesterday please re-watch the first 10 minutes of the game
    and tell me again how you feel that the Hoys can't run with them. If it
    wasn't for Edwards being super hot the score would have been like 32-14
    in the first 10 minutes. Look Stomper felt so bad for Jimmy never
    having won the title he took himself out of the game for him....;^)
    
    Face it man it was a GIFT, pure and simple don't gloat over it....
    
    mike
    

    
    	The only reason SU won was because of 3 technicals on Thompson.
    Otherwise this game would have been a blowout.
    
    sean

    
    	Envy?  nah.. All I need to think about is Keith Smart hitting
    that jumper with 9 seconds left... 8^)
    
    sean

>    	Envy?  nah.. All I need to think about is Keith Smart hitting
>    that jumper with 9 seconds left... 8^)

Talk about gifts...


Joe

    Joe what's your analysis of the game??
    
    O_J
    
    

    Boehiem will find a way to blow the Big East tournament and subsequent
    "big dance" bid, count on it.
    
    Mitch

a little late for this entry, but....


The agony is over:  SYRACUSE BEAT GEORGETOWN WHEN A TITLE WAS ON THE LINE !!
No matter what you fellas say about gifts, SU WON IT !!  I can talk about
gifts that SU gave away from now until the cows come home, but it never
negated the SU loss, or made me feel any better.

	SYRACUSE.  1990 BIG EAST REGULAR SEASON CHAMPS.


Until this year:

	-  Syracuse never won at Georgetown
	-  Syracuse never swept the season series with Georgetown
	-  Syracuse never won a big game against Georgetown
	-  Syracuse never won the BE regular season championship
	-  Syracuse never won THE BIG GAME !!!

Now, all that's over.

It was a great game.  I believe that neither team could play much better.
I can't even find much fault with the SU punching bag (ie: Boeheim).
I think he could have orchestrated better shots for Coleman (SU up 1 or 2),
and Owens (at the end of regulation).  But he's never gotten that right.

Wow, what a big win.  And Thompson gets thrown-out in front of 33,015 !!
It couldn't have been any sweeter.


As for the game:

	-  there should be no doubt that Derrick Coleman is the BE Player
	   of the Year...he did it all yesterday:

		min	fg	ft	rbs	ass	fouls	pts
		42	7-16	12-15	10-13	6	5	27

	   10 offensive rebounds, 6 assists, 27 pts!!...Musburger noted
	   that he's come up big against big teams, averaging 20+pts/game

	-  Mike, based on yesterday's game, you're right --> Mutombo is more
	   a force than Mourning, and I think it boils down to using his head
	   and keeping his cool.  Mourning was in foul trouble all day, while
	   Mutombo was blocking shots with his soft hands and coming down with
	   the ball.  It appears that Mourning needs to grow up...he wants to
	   do every thing in a BIG WAY (ie: dunks, blocks, raising his fist
	   in the air, etc.).  He was a no-show yesterday, while Mutombo was
	   clearly Georgetown's dominating force on both ends of the court.

	   Did he really block Coleman 3 times ???

	-  Did Georgetown play better because Thompson wasn't on the bench ?

	-  Georgetown's outside shooting was hotter than hell !  They had
	   7 consecutive trips at the end of regulation that resulted in
	   7 made FGs.  If they hadn't been hot, it wouldn't have gotten
	   to over time.

	-  I can see pressuring Owens up the court, but why did he foul
	   him with 1 second to go ?

	-  Michael Edwards' carried SU in the early going.  For the game he
	   was 5-7 from 3-pt range, with 18 pts.  He's got to shit-can that
	   alley-oop pass.  It's like a missile off the backboard.

	-  Only 5 people scored for Georgetown...only 6 played double-digit
	   minutes.  Packer thought it was interesting that Thompson wasn't
	   subbing as freely, but anyone that watches enough G'town games
	   knows that if John respects the other team, and it's a close game,
	   he doesn't go to his bench as frequently (he had 3 players play
	   over 40 minutes yesterday).

	-  Syracuse FT shooting:  26-34 (76.5%)

	-  G'town opened up in a man-to-man defense, and after SU took off to
	   a quick lead, they dropped into a zone (for most of the game).

	-  Syracuse executed it's 1/2-court offense pretty well, even when
	   Georgetown switched to the zone.  They again were able to find
	   passing lanes underneath, probably a sign of Mourning's and
	   Mutombo's lack of experience, as well as Coleman's and Owens'
	   passing ability.

	   Nice use of Hopkins in the 1/2-court offense while Mourning
	   sat out with fould trouble.  He didn't need Ellis' height, but
	   did need Hopkins passing ability and potential outside shot.


Hey Mike, one thing I've noticed this year in both games is that SU doesn't
appear to be intimidated by Georgetown.  In year's past they'd appear to
be too cautious, or play at such a "frenzied" pace that they never stayed
within their game.  In both games this year, they've continued to do the
things they do best.


O_J, I don't think this necessarily gives SU the inside track in the BE
tourney (hell, the #8 seed should be Pitt...I thought we're supposed to
get a cup-cake ?).  History will tell ya that SU could get beat in the
first round.  I may be wrong, but a semi-final vs. St. John's could
be easier than a quarter-final vs. Pitt.

I do think SU is the NCAA East #1 seed now, as long as they don't get
beat by the BC-Pitt winner.  If the #1 seed in the East is going to be
an eastern school, who are they going to pick above SU ?  Duke ?  UConn ?
Georgetown ?  Syracuse is 4-1 against these teams.



Joe

    
    What's to be jealous about? I mean I think we've won it more times than
    we lost it. 
    
    My true feeling is this I think the SU players played beyond their
    coach and deserved the win. Especially Coleman who for 4 years has
    tried his hardest to beat GT when it counted. I also think the Hoyas
    played exceeding well in a hostile enviorment and didn't deserve the
    antics of their coach or his poor decision making which came earlier
    than the antics.
    
    I still have the BET and the NCAA's to look forward to.....
    
    mike

    Re:JOe 
    
    I'm not saying that SU has the inside track to the BET title,but what
    I'm saying is based on how they've played I really think they can do it
    on momentum.
    
    
    O_J

>    I also think the Hoyas played exceeding well in a hostile enviorment
>    and didn't deserve the antics of their coach or his poor decision making

Agreed Mike.  I found a new level of respect for what Georgetown accomplished
yesterday, and because of that, a new level for my guys as well.  I thought
Georgetown did a great job knowing the big guy was sniffing jocks in the
locker room.  I thought Syracuse had it in the bag at halftime, but the Hoyas
proved me wrong.

And as for their ability to run with SU, I think you're right that Thompson
suppresses their talents, and they may be more of a force if they opened it
up, but I don't agree that they could have run the Orangemen out of the gym
if they wanted to.  In an up-tempo game SU would still win (IMO) 'cause they
have the horses that play that way all game long.  G'town would have to go
to its bench 'cause their starters wouldn't have been able to keep pace, and
Ronnie Thompson, Anthony Allen, Venson, et al wouldn't have gotten it done.

What slowed SU down was Georgetown's zone.  If they ran more offensively,
they risked not being able to control SU's offense with their zone.  JT
saw enough of SU's 1-1 ability in the opening minutes.  He got down because
of it.  Once he saw that, he committed to the zone, and a controlled running
game.


Joe

>    I'm not saying that SU has the inside track to the BET title,but what
>    I'm saying is based on how they've played I really think they can do it
>    on momentum.

You may be right.  One thing is true to this point:  in the big game, they've
come up big.  I'm just worried that they'll take Pitt too lightly and get
'surprised'...like they did against Villanova and ND.


Joe

    I've had trouble getting in for a week now, so here goes:
    
    re: Tate - I look for him to make an early exit from Gtown; he's
               been playing less and less, and Gtown has some new Frosh 
               coming in at the F spots next season.
                                      
    re: Sproling - I'm a die hard SJU fan, but to put him on any "rookie"
    		   team is absurd.  He just hasn't shown to be the player 
    		   everyone expected.  He teases everyone with one 3 a 
    		   game, and plays solid D, but that's about it.  However,
    		   for someone who was supposed to be a star, he's handled
    		   his role real well.
                   
    re: Payton - He originally was all set to sign with SJU unitl Louie
    		 decided to sign Elander Lewis and Marcus Broadnax, two
    		 players no longer in the SJU program.  What a mistake!
                                                            
    re: Harvey - BE POTY?  He certainly has had some great games, but
    		 in a few early games (i.e., Kansas, NC State, Syracuse) 
    		 he disappeared at the end.
                                
    re: Avent - He's only a Junior for the Hall.
                                
    re: Section 310 at MSG - I don't know, but I'll check.  Do you think
    			     you might have an extra ticket for Friday 
    			     evening (SJU/VU)?
                             
    Redmen Phil
    

    Joe I was reading about some of the top recruits in High School and I
    noticed a good bit them wanted or had interest in going to SU.Do you
    know if any of these big time players are going to sign.(or do you `if'
    they will)
    
    I heard about Adrian Autry,and they were comparing this kid to
    Anderson-THEY SAID HE WAS BETTER!!!They noted he would break Sherman
    D.'s all-time assist record,if he gets the playing time.They also said
    he is the ULTIMATE point guard!!!
    
    
    BTW-Doesn't this screw things up for Edwards??I'd still start this Kid
    if were the coach.
    
    O_J

    Jayson Williams will NOT be back this season.
    
    Redmen Phil
    

>    Joe I was reading about some of the top recruits in High School and I
>    noticed a good bit them wanted or had interest in going to SU.Do you
>    know if any of these big time players are going to sign.

O_J,

The only kid that I've seen as a signed commitment to SU is Autry.  I'll
check the Parade All-America list tonight.  I've got a few kids I'm tracking
(thanks to Dickie V), I'll see if any are mentioned.

Ed O'Bannon is one they're hot after.  He's supposed to be the Coleman
replacement.


re:  Autry

This will be a real problem for Boeheim (one of those nice ones to have).
I'm sure Edwards has played better than anyone expected, and should have
the job to start next year.  But let's face it, everyone says Autry is
a Top 10 player in the country, so Jimmy ain't gone let him sit long.

I'm hoping Autry has a good outside "J", and can then play a little of
both guard spots.


re:  Sproling

He played well in 2 games I saw.  It was a reach on my part, I admit.
It shows the lack of significant play by frosh in the BE this year.


Joe

    I think Edwards can play the of guard spot also.
    
    
    
    O_J

    Joe I don't want to pick but Syracuse is ONLY Big East regular
    season co-champs along with the Huskies.
    My thoughts on yesterdays game.  I think THE FOUL that put the game
    into OT was unbelievable.  My brother was in mid high five when that
    happened.  For anyone who didn't know the spread on that game it
    was Syracuse -2, so with four seconds left even a three pointer
    would have had G'town covering.  As a UCONN fan I was pulling hard
    for G'town so at least we'd get a coin toss for the number one seed,
    but I hate pushes.
    Does anyone know the tv lineup for the BET.  On Friday channel 38 is
    covering all the games starting at noon but they only have the games
    listed as quarterfinal #1 at noon etc....  
    
    
    Jimbo

Unfortunately, UCONN is playing at noon on Friday.  You would think they could
do a little better for the number 2 seed in the tourney.  Hope someone will
post updates in here on Friday.

Laker_Ken

    re: section 310 at Madison Square Garden - 
    
    	Not a bad seat.  Its at mid-court three (3) sections up.
    
    P.S.: Any extra tickets?
    
    Redmen Phil
    
                            

    re: 417
    
    Thur 7:00 PM  BC. vs Pitt
    
    Fri 12:00 PM  SH  vs UConn
         2:00 PM  Pro vs G'town
    	 7:00 PM  BC/Pitt  vs SU
    	 9:00 PM  V'nova  vs  St.J
    
    Sat Semi's  1:30 and 4:00
    
    Sun Final   2:30

    
    Does anyone have the complete list of starting times that they could 
    publish in here for me. thanks I know the matchup but not the times..
    
    Sorry Phil, I've only got two seats one for me one for the wife.
    Perhaps next year now that I know my uncle can get them through
    UCONN I can also place an order for you. Was a decent deal too
    97 bucks a piece for a ticket to all the games...
    
    Yeah Joe, you're probably right they couldn't run them right out of the
    gym 90 % 0f the time but they were well on their way to it sunday. 
    
    UCONN fans shouldn't complain about the 12:00 starting time as they got
    the least dangerous draw out of the big three. The Pirates certainly
    aren't pushovers but they have self destructed all year long. I keep
    watching them waiting for them to correct their porblem with turnovers
    but it doesn't happen. They've average around 20 a game, if they keep
    that to a repectable 10 or so they could give the Huskies a run.
    Problem is creating turnovers is one of the Huskies' strengths....
    
    Pitt is like a wounded Bear just looking for a reason to regain it's
    pride. Got top notch players in Shorter, Mattews and Martin who can
    matchup well against Cuse's bigmen and cause trouble. Stevie Thompson
    will need to have a big one here I feel if Cuse is going to have an
    easy time with this one. 
    
    Hoyas beat Prov by a point in the Cap Center lost by 4 at the Civic
    Center. They've been splitinng the season with the Hoyas since Pitino
    turned them around. Tough team for Georgetown because of Colon's
    outside ability. He forces Mutumbo or Mourning to come out and play
    him opening up the lane for the rest. Whoever wins this one, I hope
    they'll use the mo to carry them through and win the tourney...
    
    mike  

    Re. Adrian Autry -
    
    I have seen him play, both in person and on TV.  He is nowhere near
    Kenny Anderson as a ballhandler.  He has a pretty nice shot from 15-18
    feet, but is not a 3-point threat, he rebounds well for a guard, and
    can drive to the basket.  I think he'd be a better off guard than a
    point guard, but Boeheim may have promised him the point while
    recruiting the kid.
    
    NAZZ

    Don't feel bad that Autry isn't the ballhandler Anderson is.  Kenny
    just might be the best ballhandler on the globe, and I'm not
    exagerating.
    
    
    - ACC Chris
    

>    Don't feel bad that Autry isn't the ballhandler Anderson is.  Kenny
>    just might be the best ballhandler on the globe, and I'm not
>    exagerating.

ACC Chris,

What do you hear about Geo Tech and next year ?  One TV analyst speculated
that both Anderson (as a freshman) and Dennis Scott would go pro.


re:  #2 seed playing at 12 noon

I believe the reason (from the BE) is that they show-case the #1 seed
at 7pm, so the next "least competitive" game is 2 vs. 7 and they get
the 12 noon spot.  Then they schedule the more competitive games -->
3-6 @ 4pm, and 4-5 tops it off at 9pm.


Joe

O_J,

Where did you read about the high school recruits ?  I thought you got it
from Parade on Sunday, but they had "diddley".


Joe

    The word for Georgia Tech is as follows:
    
    Dennis Scott and Bobby Cremins have a "pact" which says, in effect,
    that if Tech makes it to the Final 4 he'll in all likelihood go pro.
    Additionally after the season Bobby is gonna make some phone calls
    and see where he'd be projected to be picked.  If he'll be a lottery
    selection he'll probably go pro.
    
    The chances of Tech making the Final 4 aren't too good, IMO.  Because
    Cremins doesn't use his bench his players have a tendency to get tired
    at the end of the year.  This problem is already apparent.  They're not
    shooting nearly as well now as they were at the beginning of the year,
    and they haven't exactly been winning every time out.  Cremins
    dedicated use of his "Lethal Weapons, Part III" is incredible. 
    Against Clemson only 4 guys scored at all, and Karl Brown only had 5
    points.  They've got talent inside, but he just doesn't wanna use
    the inside game.  At all.  So you've got a team that lives and dies by
    the outside shot that isn't shooting well.  Need I say more?
    
    On the other hand the chances of Scott being a lottery pick I'd say are
    quite good.  (Nazz, are you up for another bet?  ;^) )  The guy is an
    incredible shooter.  Marty Blake is on record as saying he's the best
    shooter for his size anywhere.  Plus Scott has thinned down and looks
    pretty mean, fit, and trim out there.  Many feel he lost weight in
    anticipation of going pro.
    
    Bottom Line:  Bye-bye, Georgia Tech.  (Sweet 16 at best.  Probably 
     		  won't go that far.  Definitely won't win the ACC
    		  Tourney.)
    
    		  Bye-bye, Dennis Scott.  See ya in the NBA.
    
    Rumors have also surfaced that Kenny Anderson may be eye-balling the
    pros.  I'd say the odds are against it at this point, but who knows?
    If he does go pro Carolina and Syracuse, the apparent losers in the
    Andeson sweepstakes, may end up the winners.  Why?  Cause they've got
    blue-chippers coming in (Autry and Phelps) who are a cut below Anderson
    but will probably stay for 4 years.  No way do they get either of these
    guys if they signed Anderson.  
    
    Funny world, recruiting.
    
    
    - ACC Chris

    From the NIKE Top 50 Profiles from 1988-89 and I quote "..Autry is
    not the scorer and doesnt have the offensive explosiveness of Anderson,
    but he is a better ballhandler and pure point guard. Already tabbed
    as the #2 prep guard ever in New York, behind Kenny Anderson.."
    	At the time, Autry was a Jr. and Anderson a Sr. 
    
    			Rich
    

I believe the following are the previous Big East tournament winners:

	'79-80	Syracuse
	'80-81	Georgetown
	'81-82	Georgetown
	'82-83	St. John's
	'83-84	Georgetown
	'84-85	Georgetown
	'85-86	St. John's
	'86-87	Georgetown
	'87-88	Syracuse
	'88-89	Georgetown


Last year's tournament program detailed all tournament results (ie: scores
from quarterfinals, semis, etc.).  I'll bring it in tomorrow and post the
info.


Some miscellaneous info that I remember:

	-  Georgetown has never lost a BE final
	-  the years in which Georgetown was eliminated (ie: didn't make
	   the finals), Syracuse beat them 3 times (semis, quarters, semis)
	   and Seton Hall beat them once (quarters)
	-  I believe Syracuse has been in the Finals 7 times, and is 2-5
	   (Georgetown gave them 4 of the 5 losses)
	-  SU has been in 4 straight finals



re:  recruits

O_J, along with Adrian Autry, 2 other Parade All-Americans are being recruited
by SU.  Autry is a 3rd-team selection.  Shon Tarver, also 3rd-team, is consider-
ing SU.  It's reported that he's the 2nd-best player in Calif, and is a good
shooting guard...6'5", very smooth, and can glide to the hole.  Ed O'Bannon
is on the 1st-team, and is the best player in Calif.  He is 6'9".



Joe

    I thought I saw a magazine on the High School players from won of the
    College previews.I'll look for it and put a reply in later.
    
    
    Re: Georgia Tech
    
    If their were any team in the nation I'd be scared of,as a `Cuse fan
    it's Georgia Tech.They exploit our weaknesses the best.I think it's a
    very good possibility that we may end up meeting in the regionals of
    the East.
    
                      
    
    
                           Best Bets for a #1 seed:
    
                                Syracuse
                                Purdue
                                Kansas
                                Oklahoma/Missouri(depends on big 8
    Championship)
    
    
    
    O_J

    
    How's Syracuse going to get a 1 st round seed when they get knocked
    out of the Big East Tourney in the first round?  ;^)
    
    Even if they make it to the finals the track record speaks for
    itself....  ;^)
    
    I'll give ya it's a different team but it's still the same coach...
    
    mike

>    I'll give ya it's a different team but it's still the same coach...

Stop reminding me will ya Mike.  I have to admit, I didn't mind looking
at his smiling face Sunday...trotting off victoriously.  And you don't
have to remind me of SU's track record, every SU fan knows it cold !!!
But before this year they had never won at the Cap Center...had never
swept G'town...had never beaten G'town in a game that counted.  Maybe
it'll be a COMPLETELY different year.  They ARE the best SU team (talent-
wise)...

You still sticking by your prediction that SU is going to win the BET ?


BTW,  I called and confirmed that TV38 IS going to broadcast ALL quarter-
final games on Friday.  I'll probably take the afternoon off and try to
keep you slaves updated on the UConn-SH game...maybe even some early
G'town-PC.


Joe

    
    Ok Joe fair enough I won't mention Muraco Mole no more  ;^)...
    
    And like you said you got a lot of pluses there for why this year is
    different but now that they are the top seed I don't see them winning
    it.
    
    My prediction is the winner of the Hoyas/Prov game will be the winner
    of the BET. why POPB nothing else....
    
    Seriously though let's says that Pitt wins, and Nova wins, the road
    to the finals becomes very difficult for them. Coleman said he came
    back for one and one reason only. That is to be the number 1 pick in
    the draft. I'd say he's lock if they can win both the BET and the
    NCAA's so......
    
    mike

    My prediction of the Tournament??
    
    
    In the finals  
    
    SU 85 
    Hoyas 83
    
    When SU has a chance to win the tournament,they've done it.They did 2
    years ago and I think they can do it again.I'm not saying they
    will,mainly because I have a lot of respect for the Hoyas and their
    great defense.But if Mutumbo isn't up for the game,forget about it.He's
    been their savior;and Mourning has been invisable.Some of that you can
    credit to Ellis who has played great defense in both of the
    games.Sometimes I wanted to call the guy the ultimate stiff,but he has
    presence out there!!The Hoyas CAN win it,no question about it,but I
    think I'll with the #1 seed fornow!!!
    
    
    
    O_J 

Below are the BE Tournament results to-date.  In 76 BET games, the lower
seed has only won 19.


'80 (@Hartford)
	3  G'town  60
	6  SH      47		G'town  76
						G'town  87
	2  SJ      48		SJ      66
	7  PC      44
							MVP Craig Shelton (G)
	4  UConn   79
	5  BC      68		UConn    61
						SU      81
	1  SU      bye		SU       92


'81 (@Syracuse)
	8  PC      67
	1  BC      65		PC	 49
						Vill	80
	4  Vill    65		Vill	 58 (OT)
	5  UConn   54
							MVP Leo Rautins (SU)
	2  G'town  58
	7  SH      52		G'town	 53
						SU	83 (3 OTs)
	6  SU      71		SU	 67
	3  SJ      66


'82 (@Hartford)
	1  Vill    88
	8  SH      73		Vill	 79
						Vill	54
	4  BC      94		BC       71
	5  SU      92
							MVP Eric Floyd (G)
	2  G'town  62
	7  PC      48		G'town	 57
						G'town	72
	3  SJ      54		SJ	 42
	6  UConn   52


'83 (@MSG)
9  SH	73
8  PC	64

	9  SH      56
	1  BC	   79		BC	 80
						BC	77
	5  SU	   79		SU	 74
	4  G'town  72
							MVP  Chris Mullin (SJ)
	3  SJ	   64
	6  Pitt    53		SJ	 91
						SJ	85
	2  Vill    69		Vill	 80
	7  UConn   68


'84 (@MSG)
9  SH   55
8  PC	59

	8  PC	   50
	1  G'town  70		G'town	 79
						G'town	82 (OT)
	5  SJ	   57		SJ	 68
	4  BC	   56
							MVP  Patrick Ewing (G)
	3  Vill	   75
	6  Pitt    65		Vill	 65
						SU	71
	2  SU      73		SU	 66
	7  UConn   58


'85 (@MSG)
9  SH	75
8  PC   77

	8  PC	   62
	1  SJ	   90		SJ	 89
						SJ	80
	4  Vill	   69		Vill	 74
	5  Pitt    61
							MVP Patrick Ewing (G)
	3  SU      70
	6  BC      69		SU	 65
						G'town	92
	2  G'town  93		G'town	 74
	7  UConn   62


'86 (@MSG)
9  SH	76
8  UConn66

	9  SH	   68
	1  SJ	   87		SJ	 75
						SJ	70
	4  Vill	   75		Vill	 64
	5  PC	   63
							MVP Dwayne Washington S
	3  G'town  57
	6  Pitt    56		G'town	 73
						SU	69
	2  SU      102		SU	 75 (OT)
	7  BC      79


'87 (@MSG)
9  UConn59
8  BC	61

	8  BC      51
	1  G'town  56		G'town	 84
						G'town	69
	4  PC	   80		PC	 66
	5  SJ	   51
							MVP Reggie Williams (G)
	3  SU      72
	6  Vill    66		SU	 99
						SU	59
	2  Pitt    96		Pitt	 85
	7  SH      88


'88 (@MSG)
9  UConn75
8  PC	62

	9  UConn   58
	1  Pitt    75		Pitt	 69
						Vill	68
	4  Vill    71		Vill	 72
	5  SJ	   68
							MVP Sherman Douglas (S)
	3  G'town  57
	6  SH      61		SH	 63
						SU	85
	2  SU	   67		SU	 68
	7  BC	   53


'89 (@MSG)
9  BC	81
8  SJ   74

	9  BC	   52
	1  G'town  82		G'town	 85
						G'town	88
	4  Pitt    71		Pitt	 62
	5  Vill    66
							MVP Charles Smith (G)
	3  SU      79
	6  PC      76		SU	 81
						SU	79
	2  SH      74		SH	 78
	7  UConn   66


Joe

Anyone got a paper with the All-Big East selections ?  I heard they were
announced Monday, and I caught just 4 names on the 1st team:

	Derrick Coleman		SU
	Billy Owens		SU
	Alonzo Mourning		G
	Mark Tillmon		G

I couldn't hear the rest, but I heard one PC fan lamenting over Carlton
Screen NOT making the 1st team.  Someone please help out here.


Joe

    Harvey from St. John's and Shorter from Pitt also made the six
    man first team.  No one from UConn.
    
    NAZZ

>    No one from UConn.

Did Nadav Henefeld get the BE Rookie of the Year ?


Joe

    I'm sure he did.
    
    O_J
    

    Oh yes Joe Mr. Henefeld certainly did get Rookie of the year.  I'll
    try my hand at the second team, the paper I had didn't have the
    third team.  On the second team were Mutombo, Smith from Uconn, 
    Screen from Prov.,and of course now I can't remember the two forwards.
    I believe they had six people on the first team and only five on the
    second.  I still have the paper at home so I'll check it.  
    
    I couldn't be happier with UCONN's 12 o'clock start, they'll 
    probably make it a holiday in Ct.  I wonder who would be able
    to look themselves in the mirror if they didn't take a two hour
    lunch Friday and watch the game.  I love this tournament and this
    year I might actually get to see more than one game of the huskies.
    After UCONN saunters past the hall, they'll be playing on CBS for
    the first of many times to come this year.  Brent mushmouth actually
    has a chance to redeem himself for his total snub of UCONN last weekend
    
    Jimbo

      
    
    You mean Hennefeld beat out Terry Dehere of S.H.?

Based on the previous tournaments, here's the winner of the BET by seed:

	#1	4 times
	#2	3 times
	#3	2 times
	#4	0
	#5	0
	#6	1 time		SYRACUSE !!!!
	#7	0
	#8	0
	#9	0

In the LAST 6 TOURNAMENTS, the #1 or 2 seed has one the championship.


Joe

    re:-1  You might as well change the stats for the #3 seated team, add 1
    for the HOYAS for this year.
    
    mitch..

       How come I can reply over here? Has Hank Gathers put a whammy on his
    note?
                                    denny

>                              -< out on a limb.. >-

mitch,

I tell myself I'm not superstitious, that I only look for patterns, and
one that has held up for G'town is that they don't win the BET when they
don't have a real dominant year (like this one...at least when you compare
it to expectations).  I think they're gone in either the 1st or 2nd round.
They were unconscious against Syracuse Sunday, and they still didn't win.
They aren't going to shoot that way for 3 straight games, and I don't
think they have enough offensive answers to beat PC, UConn and SU/St. John's
on consecutive days.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not convinced SU is going to win it.  A few weeks
ago I had doubts whether either G'town or SU would make the Finals, and
I still do.


Joe

Sometimes I talk sports, or so they sang
In the friendly confines of OURGNG
But lately, I feel rather smitten
Cuz all my notes are still being written
I try to say my piece at all cost
But my network partner keeps getting lost!
If makes me uptight, a little squeemy
Why caint it be fixed by a technoweenie?
Of bantering, scores, p_names and torts
These are the things I miss about SPORTS
I can hear Johnny Most screaming, I bet
Someone stole the Net! Someone stole the Net!
I tried maps, messages, even bread crumbs
But my path, it always succumbs
To the sireen that beckons like thunder
And takes my network for hers, like plunder
My partner, my partner, I feel flossed...
Everytime I look for you, you keep getting LOST! 

    re .445
    
    Dream on,nobody's gonna stop the Orangemen this year!!
    
    
    HA HA!!! (8^)
    
    O_J

    Re: Who's gonna make the finals
    
    Well,I can say one thing;and that is PC can beat the Hoyas on a given
    day.UCONN can do the same to the Hoyas.But if Joe is right you might as
    well wrap it up and give the thing to SU because IMO Georgetown is the
    only who can beat us in a big-game.
    
    
    
    JMO,
    O_J

I'll try to post updates during the afternoon from home.  Also, for those
of you having trouble connecting to OURGNG from PKO, if you have an
account on the USEM cluster use that...it's a breeze....quick connect
and it doesn't drop it.


Joe

From listening to the first half on the radio:
   
	An "Ugly" first half
        UCONN shooting around 33%
        SU has 16 turnovers
        Smith and George have 12 points each
        Henefeld playing good D but terrible shooting.  Three early shots were
           air balls. 
        Dehere for SU has made some good plays
        Sellers in limited role for UCONN (sore knee)
        Burrel in rare start for Depriest
        SU was within 4 with a few minutes to go in half 

    more info:  UConn is 14-18 for FTs, and has 10 steals
    
    
    at 1/2-time they announced the All-BE Rookie team:
    
    		Scott Burrell (UConn)
		Lance Miller (Vill)
    		Michael Edwards (SU)
    		Terry Dehere (SH)
    		Nadav Henefeld (UConn)  *Rookie of the Year
    
    
    Joe

    Who won??
    
    
    
    O_J

    Don't know the final....but I was told that UConn was up by about 17
    with less than 4 minutes to go.
    
    
    Nelly

    Damn!!!........8^
    
    
    PC was all over Georgetown at the beggining of the game,but the Hoyas
    are slowly bringing themselves back into the game.
    
    
    
    
    O_J

    
    Final UCONN 76  Seton Hall 58
    
    almost half time Georgetown 28 Providence 26
    

    At the half....Georgetown 35 - Providence 31
    
    Providence went out to a 12-0 lead, only to be outscored 35-19 the rest
    of the first half.
    
    
    Nelly

    Any later scores on PC-Hated Hoyas?
    
    Earlier, someone referred to Seton Hall as SU.  It really threw
    me for a loop.  Don't we use standard Big East abbreviations?
    
    Syracuse = SU
    Georgetown = G, G'town
    Connecticut = UCONN
    Seton Hall = SH
    St. John's = SJU
    Pittsburgh = Pitt
    Boston College = BC
    Providence = PC
    Villanova = 'Nova
    
    
    Or am I being too cranky and picky on a Friday afternoon when I
    should be watching Big East basketball instead of working...
    
    						Roland
    						SU '83

    Who does SU play tonight?????
    
    
    
    
    
    
    O_J
    

    Georgetown wins 78-77, in a game that shouldn't have been that close.
    G'town had a 13-pt lead with about 3-4 min to play, but then the foul-
    parade began, and despite OK FT-shooting by the Hoyas, they played
    remarkably STUPID down the stretch, fouling Providence right back...
    it was really incredible.  They even fouled people shooting 3-ptrs
    (twice).  If PC had made their FTs (Murdock missed 2 of 3, and Colon
    1 of 2 with under 1 minute to go) it really would have been
    interesting.  Bent hit some deep 3-ptrs to make it close at the end,
    following missed FTs by G'town.
    
    
    They gave the BE All-Conference teams at the half:
    
    	1st team:
    
    		Derrick Coleman	(SU)	* Player of the Year
    		Billy Owens (SU)
    		Boo Harvey (SJ)
    		Mark Tillmon (G)
    		Alonzo Mourning (G)
    		Brian Shorter (Pitt)
    
    	2nd team:
    
    		Chris Smith (UConn)
    		Carlton Screen (PC)
    		Stevie Thompson (SU)
    		Malik Sealy (SJ)
    		Dikembe Mutombo (G)
    
    	3rd team:
    
    		Nadav Henefeld (UConn)
    		Jason Matthews (Pitt)
    		Tate George (UConn)
    		Dwayne Bryant (G)
    		Marty Conlon (PC)
    
    	Defensive Player of the Year:		Mutombo/Mourning (share it)
    
    
    
    Joe

    SU plays Pitt.  It's going to be a tough one O_J.
    
    
    Joe

    I think it will be a tough one also.
    
    
    
    My prediction: 
    
    SU 85
    Pitt 77

    I don't see how Mourning would get a defensive player of the year over
    Coleman.I like Mourning's ability,but Coleman has been considered by
    many to be the greatest rebounder in the modern basketball era.I think
    he is about 55 from Ralph Sampsons all-time record.I f he really works
    his *** of from now on,he could get it.
           
    
    O_J
    

re: .461

Sorry about throwing you for a loop by mis-typing "SU" instead of "SH" for
Seton Hall.

Of course if UCONN can get by Georgetown then it could be a UCONN - SU final.

Jim

    re .466
    
    Both Mourning and Motombo are better defensive players than Coleman
    - who  is a good one.  He rebounds well, and blocks shots - but
    those two change the complexion of the game - the *dominate*
    defensively,something Coleman doesn't.  
    
    Simple as that.
    
    JD

    Wrong.Coleman has consistantly been one of the best shot-blockers in
    the nation.He doesn't rebound `well',he is a dominating rebounder.In
    the first game with the Hoyas he outrebounded Mourning and Mutumbo
    combined.
    
    
    
    
    
    O_J

    O_J,
    
    I didn't demean Coleman.  Perhaps one day you'll let someone with
    an opinion that doesn't match your orange-tinted one to have their
    say.  In my opinion, and in the opinions of those who voted, and
    of many announcers, scribes, et al, Mourning and Motumbo are considered
    better defenders than Mr. Coleman.  In your opinion, Mr. Coleman
    is the greatest player in the world, perhaps.  Fine.  I have no
    problems with that, as you shouldn't with me stating my opinion.
    I still feel that both Mourning and Motumbo dominate a game defensivly
    more than Coleman does.
    
    JD

    You are probably right.I think Mutumbo is a better defender than
    Coleman.But Mourning has hardly been dominating these days.IMO,Mutumbo
    is better than Mourning.
    
    BTW-I only have orange-tinted views when SU is winning.   8^
    
    
    
    O_J

    I HATE IT WHEN THEY PLAY LIKE THIS!!Well it wasn't pretty,but SU beat
    Pitt 58-55 on Colemans block of Shorter in the final seconds.They
    didn't deserve it,but they won.Pitt played an outstanding game slowing
    it down to frustrate SU-and it almost worked.If they had a point guard
    the would've won.......
    
    
    O_J

    Pitt snatches defeat from the jaws of victory yet again.  What a
    frustrating year to be a Pitt fan --  as opposed to other years :-).
    I think it's time to purge the whole program - starting with the
    A.D. Bozik!  Sean Miller probably would have helped pull out a game or
    two but the problem's are much deeper.

    Pitt really blew it.  Up by 1 and they turn the ball over on a foolish
    5-second call.  However, I have to say that SU got a break on that
    Coleman hoop.  Was that a clear case of charging or what?!  At any
    rate, I thought Pitt executed well on offense at the end when they managed
    to get a shot from point blank range.  Unfortunately, Coleman made a
    sensational block.   Great game plan by the Pitt coach.  
    
    Laker_Ken

    Re -1
    
    Yeah and then we go and blow out `Nova.Anyways Ken,I gotta admit your
    Huskies played a great basketball game they beat Goergetown 65-60.They
    won because Mourning and Mutumbo were invisable.In the SU game,Coleman
    had 25 points and 23 rebounds.Yeah,Mourning is a much more dominate
    defensive player than Coleman.......8^
    
    
    
    
    O_J

    Well I'm not the type of guy to gloat but yeeeeeeeeeessssssssss!!!!!
    
    		UCONN BIG EAST TOURNEY CHAMPIONS. 8*)
    
    To all the Syracuse fans nice try, better luck in the NCAA's as a #2
    seed that is. 8*)
    
    Enough of that, I thought the game was hard fought though without
    Syracuse's 10-0 start UCONN would have handled them even easier.
    I sure hope Sellers will be full strength for the NCAA's.  I thought
    the key to UCONN's win was keeping Owens out of the game, some may
    be the fact that his back is in a constant knot, but a healthy Owens
    with Sellers on the bench for the mostpart, would have changed the
    complexion of the game.
    
    Jimbo
      
    By the way Tom Garry, wait till I see you hahahahahahahahaha

    YeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeHaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!!!!!
    
    Don't you just love this team?!  How can you not?  First they manhandle
    Mutombo and Mourning and today they frustrate Coleman and Syracuse. 
    Another great job by Calhoun a the bench.  They play nonstop with
    incredible tenacity at the defensive end, and exhibit a special unselfish 
    chemistry on the offensive end.
    
    For you Syracuse fans, congratulations on another exciting season of
    basketball.  Hope to see ya in the final four.  
    
    As for O_J, our friend who scoffed at the Huskies and said they didn't
    belong up there with G-Town and the Orangemen,
    
    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAH !!!!!

    That should read "Calhoun AND the bench."

    When the hell did I ever say they didn't belong with us??They did play
    a great game and are in a great position to get to Denver.As for
    SU,this could be a blessing in disguise.If we go out West,that's our
    best chance.
    
    F to Jimmy Boeheim for not getting the ball to his superstar.Billy
    Owens was hurts so that was a factor.
    
    
    
    O_J

    Well it looks like another year of SU choking.
    
    
    
    P.S.= And this was our best chance!!
    
    
    Oh well,maybe next year.......8^
    O_J

OH YEAH!!!!!

I'm not gonna rub it in to the Syracuse or the Georgetown fans, but
please permit me one "I told you so"...

What a game.  Some clutch plays down the stretch, some tenacious
defense....

UCONN is the only team in the history of the Big East to knock off
the two powerhouses (Syracuse/Georgetown) in winning the Champeenship.


Jimbo, where you at, man?  I need a high-five!


I feel great.  This state is simply electrified this morning....


One Happy Huskie Fan,
Chainsaw

PS  Bweent Pussberger is an even bigger dork than I always thought....

        Being an SU fan, let me offer congratulations to UConn for an
    extremely well played game. I felt they were in trouble after the Pitt
    game and it showed near the end of the first half when UConn put it
    to them to take a 42-35 lead. I could have sworn SU shot under 50% for
    the game from the field but they went 29 for 51. Amazingly, a great
    foul shooting team like SU goes 11-22 at the line. :^). Until they
    learn that those foul shots win games, more tough times are ahead.
        Compare this to UConn's 21-26 effort. I think UConn got the easiest
    #1 seed of any team and should have no trouble making the regional
    finals. Look what could've been Boeheim...
        SU should have no trouble until the first round of the regionals
    but I said the same thing the year they drew Navy and some kid named
    David Robinson.

I know I've played this song before, but put up with it yet another time...
There's a reason that Syracuse is 2-6 in BET Finals, and it's their coach.
UConn played a good game, but there were many opportunities for Syracuse to
win this thing.  I can't believe Boeheim had Tony Scott and David Johnson
on the floor at crunch-time (ie: tie game with 4 minutes to go).  While
both did a fine job, Syracuse needed sound ball-handling at that point in
the game.  Johnson's give-away, and Scott's walk killed them, when the game
was still up-for-grabs.

How can you put the season on the line with 2 players that haven't been
there consistently all year ?  There's a basketball philosophy:  If
you're going to get beat, get beat going with your best.  How can Boeheim
allow his offense to not get Coleman and Owens the ball ???  Syracuse's
advantage against this team was inside, and they didn't use it !

Boeheim went away from Edwards 'cause George was taking him to the hole
too consistently.  So he sacrifices ball-handling for defense, and as it
turned out, he had neither when it counted most.  UConn's only offense
for most of the 2nd-1/2 came from their guards' penetration.  So why
not play a zone ???  Billy Packer hit the nail on the head.  UConn isn't
a good shooting team, so play a zone, take away the driving lanes, and
make them hit the outside shot.  This would have allowed Edwards to stay
in the game.

Coaching problems aside, Syracuse didn't play well either.  In the 1st 1/2
they broke the full-court pressure consistently, only to throw it away at the
other end, or miss A CHIPPIE.  They also missed too many free throws.  They
really didn't play well in any of the 3 games, but Coleman won the 1st 2 for
them...and he hardly saw the ball yesterday.


Jimbo used Scott and Johnson quite a bit this weekend.  Hopkins saw limited
playing time, only in the 1st 1/2.  Manning hurts them every time he steps
on the floor...cheap fouls on the defensive end, and fumbles and missed
"bunnies" on the offense.  Someone better light a fire under this kid's
ass this summer.

It's nice to see Boeheim going 9 deep off the bench, but he should have done
this all year so they'd be ready for the tough situations.


Joe

>        I think UConn got the easiest #1 seed of any team 
>    Look what could've been Boeheim...

ain't it the truth...and Syracuse is staring at Virginia or ND, if they
get by Coppin St. (wouldn't you know that most of the analysts would say
that they're the best #15 in the tourney, and will give SU a tough time !).

But UConn doesn't have an easy ticket to the Final Four.  Given their
defensive strategy, they have 2 of the best teams at handling that pressure
right in their Region, in Duke and Kansas.  Both handle the ball very well,
and Kansas seems to have thrived all year on finding the open man.  So
while UConn should make the Final 8 without any problem (LaSalle or
Clemson in the 3rd round),  they'll have a stiff test after that.


>        SU should have no trouble until the first round of the regionals

They have a tough draw, with the following as possible opponents in the
Southeast Region:

	Virginia/ND	(I'd love to see an SU-ND rematch)
	Minnesota/Missouri  (Missou was supposed to be a #1 somewhere, and
			     some have Minn as a Final Four)
	Mich St./LSU/Geo Tech

Interesting that they may have to play Missouri in the round of 16 again.
They beat them in a great game in the same situation last year.  And all
SU fans get a little nervous seeing a Big Ten team along SU's path in the NCAA.


Joe

       Joe, quite frankly Virginia is the only team that worries me until
    the potential matchup with Missouri. Holland has his team playing at
    the top of their game right now and with Holland leaving, his kids seem
    to be playing extra hard at the moment. I would also love to see a
    rematch with ND but I don't think it will happen. They are probably THE
    team most undeserving of a bid this year. 
       I'm not taking anything from UConn after yesterday's gam, but I do
    think SU got a little cocky after jumping out to such a quick lead,and
    then seemed a little too bewildered to bother climbing back into the
    game and pressing the way they can. They've shown it all year, play
    hard for a period of time, relax, let the other team back into it by
    trying to protect a lead (read sitting on the ball) and wondering how
    the other team made the game so close. Their game is attacking the
    other team, not some third-rate impression of Dean Smith's four-corner
    offense. 
       On the plus side, they do seem to be a little more patient against
    teams that slow it down, and some of their recent wins shows that they
    can win close games, unlike previous SU teams. 
       You're right, UConn doesn't have an easy road to the final four, but
    at least theirs is paved. :^) If I were SU, I'd much rather face BU
    than Coppin State. (Who the hell is Coppin State?)
    

                             Extremely Mega-huge

                          !!!* C O N G R A T S *!!!

                       To `Saw and all the other Conns

                                   Mike JN

    Coppin State is a historically black university in VA. I believe.
    
    And as usual, the NCA tries to annihilate the small black schools
    by sticking them against a Top 5 team in the first round, no matter
    how good they are (and I hear Coppin State is GOOD). :-(

    .....and as usual, the NCAA has prevented any small white schools from
    even playing in the tournament....no matter how good OR bad.  :^)
    
    
    Help this hopes,
    
    Nelly

anyone know the winner of the Southern/texas southern game ?


Joe

Some teams from Dan Sheridan's Odds:

Oklahoma	3:1
UCONN           4:1
Mich. St        4:1
UNLV    	5:1
Kansas		5:1
Syracuse	6:1
Georgetown	6:1
Purdue		7:1
Arizona		8:1
Louiville	8:1
Mich		10:1
Missouri	10:1
Duke		10:1
...
St. John's	50:1
...
Providence	150:1
...
Notre Dame	300:1
...
Villanova	3000:1
...
BU		5,000,000:1
...
Coppin St 	750,000,000:1
Towson State     1 billion:1

    re .487 (DrM):
    
    Coppin State is in Baltimore (my dictionary lists them as having an
    enrollment of 2600).
    
    
    py

>Coppin St 	750,000,000:1
>Towson State     1 billion:1
    
    Re .487
    
    I'll bet a dollar on Coppin State. It's a better shot than the lottery.
    Just think of how much of a long shot Buster Douglas was.

>    Towson State     1 billion:1
    
    Anyone know where I can put down a couple of bucks?  8^D
    
    Cowboy
    

    re: DocZero
    
    I think it's unfair to accuse the NCAA of being racist because they've
    put a black school against a #1 seed.  It's got nothing to with race -
    it's just the way they do it.  (i.e. #1 seed vs. #16 seed)
    
    The whole issue of whether or not THIS is fair is certainly a valid
    subject that I'd like to discuss, but it's got nothing to do with them
    being a black school.
    
    
    - ACC Chris
    

    
    	Doc,
    
    	FWIW, the winner of the Ivy leagues gets a pounding from one
    	of the top teams, on an annual basis as well.  
    
    	When I was there and Brown won the ivies we played Syracuse
    	(W/ Pearl Washington) and were annihilated.  
    
    	So, to answer a different question, yes there are little white
    	(ivy :-)  schools that make it every year.  
    
    	Jeff

>>    	FWIW, the winner of the Ivy leagues gets a pounding from one
>>    	of the top teams, on an annual basis as well.  

Well, not always true.  I remember a Penn team in 1979 that did a little better
than that ;^).

I also remember a Princeton team from last year that got alot more respect this
year.  They've got the 13th seed (instead of the traditional 16th due to being
team #64 in the nation) and are only 10,000:1 underdogs.

j.

    re .494                                                          
    
    Unfair ? Chris, this has been going on for years ! Check the history
    books ....
    
    Chris, I did not insinuate race. I stated a fact - when a historically
    black school (ie. SMALL, low-$$$$$) wins a automatic bid to the
    NCAA tourney, they automatically get stuck against the best team,
    or one of the best 5 in the country. 
    
    I'm sick of it. It becomes self-justifying bulls-it for the NCAA,
    "Hey, we *knew* they couldn't compete, that's why we invite only
    the majors .... "
    
    Why throw them in as sacrifical lambs ? What makes the small schools
    an automatic 15-16th seed ?
    
    It isn't fair, plain and simple. Seeing that Princeton is aslo a
    victim makes me hesitate on race, but as an alumni of a HBI, I can
    speak from experience and knowledge ....
    
    Doc 

    
    I would think playing a team from the top 5 would be a plus.  More
    notoriety, and if you pull an upset you're way ahead of the game.  
    Hell, those teams aren't going to win anyway, so why not go for 
    the gold?  The only justification for wanting a lower spot is a better
    chance at advancing one round, hence more dollars, but isn't that 
    rationale an example of what you guys are railing against anyway?
    
    If I'm a fan of Princeton, I'm relishing the chance to take on a
    Georgetown.  Princeton won more respect in *losing* that game last year 
    than they would have in beating a lesser opponent.  This year, the kids
    from BU are ecstatic about being seeded #16 with a shot to take out a
    local power like UConn.  I guess it just depends on how you look at it.
    
    glenn
     

    But Doc, the fact is it has nothing to do with race.  There's no
    question the low seeded teams are put in an immense hole.  It may or
    may not be fair - depends on your perspective.  My point is only that
    the black schools aren't being treated differently than the non-black
    schools.  It's just the way it is, and your Princeton example proves my
    point.
    
    
    - ACC Chris
    

    To all you Huskie fans................
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    WELL BE BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    
    
    
    
    I am really pissed right now.Jimmy screws it up for the umptenth
    time.With all the talent this team has got,we'd win it all if Bobby
    Knight were the coach.Dick Vitale said Jimmy Boeheim was the best
    recruiter in college-basketball today.He gets the best talent around
    and the SOB can't win with it.
    
    
    
    
    A very disapointed SU fan,
    (O)rangeman_Jason

    
    I find this whole debate rather amusing.  College basketball is the
    only major sport that gives the little schools *anything* (maybe even 
    too much) and yet people complain all the more.  The whole notion of 
    a 64 team tournament is an egalitarian one.  It gives small schools
    and small conferences a moment in the spotlight.  Although I enjoy some
    of the aspects of the enlarged field, not being a year-round devoted
    follower of the game, I could live with the NCAA shortening the
    tournament and playing off with 32 or even 16 teams.  Yet for once the
    NCAA spreads the wealth-- no doubt at the expense of low early-
    tournament TV ratings-- and something as trivial the rankings elicit 
    accusations of greed, ill will, prejudice, favoritism, hypocrisy, etc.
    *Somebody* has to be seeded at the bottom.  Isn't anybody just happy to
    be there?
    
    glenn
    

>    but as an alumni of a HBI, I can
			   ^^^

Doc,

What is the school name ?



re:   1 vs. 16

IMO, the #1 seed should be rewarded by playing the weakest teams (ie: get the
easiest draw) in each round.


BTW, nice balancing job by the NCAA committee with re: to the BE teams:

	Southeast:	Syracuse, Villanova
	West:		Providence
	East:		UConn, St. John's
	Midwest:	Georgetown


Of the Big 3, UConn and Georgetown could meet in the Final Four semis.
Syracuse could only play either one in the NCAA Final.


The toughest bracket in the tournament has to be the West, with:

	UNLV, Ohio St, Providence, Oregon St, Louisville, New Mexico St,
	Michigan, Alabama, and Arizona.


Hey Mike, I'm interested in hearing your view of the BE Final.


O_J, Boeheim=SU disappointment...it'll always be that way.  I thought things
were starting to change with the 2 wins over Georgetown, but yesterday
brought us back.  Going in to yesterday's game CBS showed a stat that SU
was 7-0 going in to games vs. Top 20 opponents (teams that were Top 20 at
the time they played SU)...Owens, Coleman and Thompson all averaged about
18-19-20 pts each.  Yesterday Owens had 13 (5-11 FGs), Coleman had 13 (5-6)
and Thompson had 21 (10-14).  COLEMAN TOOK ONLY 6 SHOTS !!  You look at
these 2 teams and say SU's strength is up front, UConn's is in the back-
court.  Today you see that UConn got 58 pts from 3 guards, and Derrick
Coleman took 6 shots...and Michael Edwards played only 1/2 the game.

He should have gone zone !


Joe

    Yeah,your right Joe.I remeber you saying that this is Billy's team.That
    it is.If he plays to his full potential I think we can get out of the
    Southeast alive.I have a funny feeling whoever wins the Southeast will
    win it all.Look at the top 5 seeds and you will notice that they've all
    been in the top ten at one time or another.Michigan
    St.;SU;Misouri;Goergia Tech; and LSU.This is by far the strongest
    region.It's gonna be tough!!
    
    
    O_J

    O_J, for your edification:
    
    Re. .479 "When the hell did I ever say they didn't belong with us?"
    
    Perhaps the following might refresh your memory.
    
    .364  "Sorry UConn fans, but in the Big East it's still the Hoyas and 
           the Orangemen."
    
    Aren't you forgetting some other team?
      
    
    .387  "Oh another thing that might interest you -- seeing that the
           Huskies got beat by Georgetown by 20 and My Boys beat Georgetown
           by 19 at the Cap Center, that must mean we're 39 point favorites
           next time we meet, eh Ken?"
    
    About that career in Vegas as a line-maker you were contemplating?  I'd
    suggest keeping the day job.
    
    
    .397  "This win will definitely give SU the #1 seed in the east.  I
           expect them to win the tournament because the Hoyas are the
           only team that can beat us, but it won't happen."
    
    The Hoyas are the ONLY team that can beat SU, huh?  I swear that you
    must be overlooking that other team.
    
    
    .416  "Laker_Ken is scared of Syracuse."
    
    Yup.  Anywhere in upstate New York scares the hell out of me.  They've
    got more UFO sightings up there than anywhere else in the country. 
    Damn straight I'm scared.
    
    .449  "Dream on; nobody's gonna stop the Orangemen this year!!!
           HA HA!!!"
    
    Hey O_J, ever hear of this guy named Boeheim?  Nah, I didn't think so. 
    If you had, you would know better than to make that kind of statement. HA
    HA!!!
    
    
    .450  "Who's gonna make the finals...you might as well wrap it up and
           give the thing to SU because Georgetown is the only who can
           beat us in a big-game."
    
    Wrap it up and GIVE the thing to SU?  Now I know why you said that. 
    You were hoping they would GIVE it to SU.  God knows they couldn't have
    won it on their own!
    
    
    And from the CELTICS conference:
    
    5.837 "As for your beloved Musties, forget it.  They have NO chance
           against the Hoyas...Once again you're living in dream-land." 
    
    
    As a B actor once said, there you go again.  And if I'm living in a
    dream land, please don't wake me up!  At least not until Denver.  As
    for you, I imagine you must be mired in a nightmare.  You close your
    eyes at night and try to go to sleep, but you keep seeing Huskies
    scrambling all over the floor, nonstop hustling, deflecting balls. 
    They're all over the place.  You cry out, "Give the ball to Coleman. 
    Give it to Derrick," but all you hear back is a lonely voice saying,
    "We can't find him.  He's invisible."  The next thing you see in your
    nightmare is Tate George stepping to the line again and again and again
    and again and again and again drilling the ball through.  The nightmare
    always ends the same way (as it does every year) as you see a geeky
    looking guy with glasses on the bench choking on a chicken bone.  He
    can't spit it up, and nobody knows how to do the Heimlich manuever. 
    Finally, the horn sounds and up comes the bone.  Boeheim lives for
    another day, another year, another chance to recruit the best players
    in the country and then think up new, unique, imaginative ways to get
    the least out of them.
    
    
    O_J, I sincerely hope that his has helped.  
    
    'Nuff said.
    
    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHA
    
    
    Laker_Ken
    

It seems there are some different opinions on the strongest region in
the tournament.  The Globe and some TV people felt the Midwest was the
toughest (Oklahoma, Purdue, Georgetown, Arkansas, Illinois, North Carolina (8))
Some one stated that the West and another stated the the Southeast was the
strongest.  I personally feel its either the Southeast or Midwest, followed
by the West with the East being the weakest by far.  UConn is really in 
good position and I hope they can get to Denver.

Providence-Ohio St. should be a great first round game.  Both teams are
playing really well right now.

The best second round game could be Georgia Tech - LSU. 

                                                                Alan

    Just heard a stat on the radio tonight.  The 8 schools that are playing
    at UCONN (OOPS I MEANT THE HARTFORD CIVIC CENTER) 8*) hee,hee,hee ya
    gotta admit not getting the short end of the stick sure doesn't suck.
    Anyways each of the eight schools gets a whopping 250 tickets to the
    games to distribute.  I think thats terrible.  I can just imagine
    what the local gangs are gettting for tickets probably $100 a game for
    the huskies.  
    
    One good thing I do remember is on the Thursday of the games the
    before game shootaround is open free to the public.  The courant
    usually publishes the times that each team gets to practice.  A few
    years ago I actually saw the chair thrower and Mr. Cremins up close and
    personal, though I didn't have quite the climax Mr. Knorr had meeting
    Deano. 8*)
    
    Jimbo

>> The best second round game could be Georgia Tech - LSU. 

I'm going to go out on a limb and predict that the winner of the Ga. Tech/LSU
game will go on to win everything.

j.

Laker_Ken,

I was rolling!  That was great.  I'm not a big person to rub it
in, but I have to admit that was sweet...

Go Huskies....
Chainsaw

    
    Well Joe, Being a ABSU fan I loved the final game that and the fact
    that we were sitting with the Huskies' fans all weekend long and it
    was nice to share their joy. As for the game, I'll never understand
    JB and his substituting patterns but UCONN played super defense.
    They overplayed the heck out of Owens, Coleman and Edwards when he
    was in the game. They forced Thompson and Coleman to bring up the
    ball which didn't allow SU to properly set up their offense. Edwards
    who was big in the wins against Pitt and Nova because his outside shot
    was on and open up the middle for Derrick was out of it.
    
    You have to give UCONN all the credit in the world they were the best
    team in NY this weekend. You watch them shoot 40%, you look at them
    atheletically and you know SU and GT have the better atheletes but
    still UCONN wins. Why, defense and coaching (Mr. Calhoun I owe you
    an apology). They just take away what you do best. On saturday they
    took away GT's inside game. They forced us to the perimeter and we
    didn't answer. We made some costly turnovers and the coach once
    again pulled a chocko. The best lineup GT put out there was Mutumbo,
    Stolmeyre, Edwards, Tillman and Bryant. In the first half they got
    us the lead, in the second half we never saw Edwards and Mutumbo went
    to the bench with four fouls and JT played the game like he only had
    5 fould per player. Even still UCONN was playing with more emotion
    than GT and even more minutes by these guys wouldn't have made a
    differences.
    
    the weekend was great, the garden is a super place to see a game. The
    UCONN fans although maybe not the most knowledgable (atleast around me)
    were passionate. They screamed, yelled, bitched and clapped for just
    about every call during all of their games. SU fans on the other hand
    could only be heard if Derrick or Billy was doing a 360 slam or some
    other fancy type play. 
    
    Pitt should have taken SU out in the quarters only Jody Silvestri kept
    them from doing so. He was also there to aid SU on sunday and did so
    for most of the game but to his credit he did call the travel on
    Scott. But for what he did to Pitt. I'll never be able to stomach
    the guy. I was ready to go down to the court to tell him what a jerk
    he was....
    
    and if you go the New York soon anyone don't miss the Musical Review
    Black and Blue it was as good as any of the games I saw this weekend...
    
    mike
    

    re:  Laker_ken:
    
    Brutal Juice, Brutal.
    
    RE:  Calhoun - I'm real happy for this guy.  Like I said a long
    time ago, I hated to see him leave Northeastern, but I knew he'd
    mold a winner.  UCONN plays Jim Calhoun basketball - he gets the
    most our of what he has, they scramble, they box out, they execute.
    However, I do get nervous about their foul shooting.
    
    They could potentially meet Indiana in Round 2 - which could be
    a tough game due to the coaching matchup.
    
    One of the best first round games should be LSU - Villanova.  Rollie
    is great at preparing a team when he has time - Isn't he like 21-2
    in Round 1 games?  (Or some other impressive stat...)
    
    JD

re:  1st-round match-ups

A guy at work here pointed out that the most interesting 1st-round
game to him was Ohio St-Providence:  a real test of conferences.
He's right.  Both schools finished in relatively the same position
within their conference, so it'll be interesting to see who wins
(on a neutral floor).  Vitale and many others claim the Big Ten is
the best conference in the nation.  Well, those statements start
to be tested Thursday.

Syracuse may play 2 Big Ten schools in the Southeast (Minn, Mich St).
Mich St is picked by most to make the Final Four, at the expense of
Syracuse.



re:  Tubbs vs. Georgetown in Midwest Final ?

Will I actually be a Hoyas fan for a day ?  How incredibly exciting it
will be if Georgetown lays some "D" on these boys and crushes them on
NATIONAL TV !!!



Joe

If I was Calhoun, I'd order the players to do nothing but SHOOT this
summer.  No one-on-one, just lotsa shots:  Foul shots, three pointers...

Kind like Bird in the off-season.

Calhoun is on a gold mine, and if they improve their shooting..watch out...

'Saw

    
    Well guys this was mentioned over in the ACC and the rumor I heard
    at the game from a booster (who was on the inside enough to attend
    all of uconn's funtions in NY) is Calhoun is gone the assistant
    coach has got the job. Nothing will be said until after the season.
    Supposedly from what this person said 500K and house. I think she
    said he curreently gets 200K from uconn. One fan actually though
    Cahoun would forfeit the 300k and stay loyal....
    
    ******remember this is only a rumor*****************
    
    mike

	In recent years, the team that beat Xavier in the first round went on
to win the whole thing.

	Anybody planning on putting a few bucks on Kansas State?

Mike JN

    
    Jim also another observation SU gave Terino Walker no respect at all
    and he burnt them. If he could have hit the layups he'd have had about
    5 to 10 more points. And again in a big game even Coleman and Owens
    can't hit from the line. Hoyas also gagged bigtime from the line
    in both games. If Marty Conlon does take a stupid intentional against
    Mutumbo they might have caught them. Mutumbo hit the two and they
    missed they missed the one and one when they got fouled on the
    possesion. Mutumbo had missed two previous foul shots so he was shaky
    but without the peopl in the lane is was cool as a cucumber...
    
    mike

    Ken once again,you have a hard time understanding replies.In my reply I
    said the Hoyas and Orangemen are the best in the Big East.So does that
    mean I meant they can't play with us??I don't know where you find your
    logic but you better look somwhere else.The question wasn't how good I
    thought SU is.So you still haven't answered the question.And about the
    39 point crap if you can't take that as a joke;your hurtin'.
    
    
    As far as "Laker_Ken is scared of SU" goes,what the hell does that have
    to do with how good of a team UCONN is??So I'll ask you again,where did
    I actually say UCONN didn't belong with us??I said they just might be
    able to get to the final four.
    
    
    You've really out done yourself,this time Ken.
    
    BTW-Where did I say nobody was gonna stop SU??
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    O_J
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    I'm outta here,
    O_J

    Did anybody here that Tubb's guarenteed a National Championship if his
    team shoots 50% or better.
    
    
    
    
    BTW-Dickie V. said UNC was going to beat OU.
    
    
    
    
    O_J

>    Did anybody here that Tubb's guarenteed a National Championship if his
>    team shoots 50% or better.

I saw it somewhere.  It'll be sweet when he goes down.  I loved Vitale's
prediction:  "get ready Oklahoma, 'cause you're going down".


re:  Big Ten

Hey Big Ten fans, I've seen a little of each Big Ten team, but not enough.
Can someone give me a scouting report on Minnesota and Mich St ?


Joe

    I'll be rooting for OU for the sole fact that I have Skeeter Henry on
    my team for the NAZZ contest!!!
    
    
    O_J

Well, for all you Syracuse fans, yesterday Boeheim gave the proper 
credit to UConn.

He said simply that they are a darned good team, lots better than
people even know...

FWIW,
'Saw

> Well, for all you Syracuse fans, yesterday Boeheim gave the proper 
> credit to UConn.

> He said simply that they are a darned good team, lots better than
> people even know...


Why would we care what Boeheim says ??? :^)  He's the reason we lost !!!!


Seriously, I heard him on WFAN Monday night (he stayed in NYC for a dinner
given by the Downtown Athletic Club) and he gave credit to UConn.  He said
that going in to the game they knew that they'd have trouble with their
guards (so why didn't he do SOMETHING about it ??).  He said that he'd
rather play a club who's strength is in the front-line, where SU's strength
is.  He said that's why they match-up better with Georgetown and had more
success against them.  He said he wasn't able to play his "big team" against
UConn.

He said that the game was lost by careless turnovers, and while UConn is
going to create them by their defense, his players made too many mistakes.
He also said that Billy Owens was not 100%, and that hurt them, in that
he couldn't be as actively involved in breaking the press and in the 1/2-
court offense.

His view of the game was that turnovers lost it, 'cause they shot 54%
from the field, and when executing the offense, got the shots they
wanted.  He said the reason Coleman didn't get more than 6 shots was
because they were denying him the ball, and he was bringing the ball
up against the press ("he can't pass the ball, and get to the other
end and score all in the same trip")---> see Billy Owens comment.

Finally, he said that UConn's pressure defense is as good as any they'll
see in the tournament, and that his team will be ready for anyone.


Joe

    
    
    
    The best thing for this guy to do is to get the hell out.The city of
    Syracuse puts such a microscope on it's basketball team(since it's the
    only thing they've got) that he'll have to get out sooner or later.Then
    we can higher either Valvano or Doug Moe(personally I like Moe)
    
    
    
    
    
    O_J(a.k.a. `C.T.')
    

>    The best thing for this guy to do is to get the hell out.

Hey O_J, you'll love this one....when we at the SU-ND game in Feb and
Owens hit the go-ahead bucket with 3 seconds left, during the timeout
my brother yells out, "take Boeheim out !!!"


My picks for the Final Four:

	Kansas
			Oklahoma
	Oklahoma

						SYRACUSE

	Arizona
			Syracuse
	Syracuse


What did you expect ???

Going in I didn't believe SU could win it all, but when you project
the winners of the other regions, if that's the Final Four, they can win
it, 'cause they present problems for all of those teams.  Kansas might
be the toughest on them, but they've played just better than .500 down the
stretch, that's all.  I believe that if they're going to be beat, it'll
be Missouri or Mich St that'll do it, and given Missou's level of play
lately, and the fact that Mich St has a starter with a broken foot....

The selection committee didn't do Notre Dame any favors.  They have to
play Virginia at Morgantown, VA in the 1st round.  If they advance, they
get Syracuse and after that possible Missouri...some teams that they've
already played this year, and have revenge on their minds.



Joe

    >> my brother yells out, "take Boeheim out !!!"
    
    I love it!!Here are my picks for the final four:
    
    
    
    
    Kansas
    SU
    `Vegas
    Oklahoma
    
    
    
    Like Joe said,what did you expect??When Su is on they can beat
    anybody.I think they'll get past Missouri and meet with Michigan St.
    a team I think could win it all.
    
    
    
    `Just chillin
    
    O_J

    I was watching the scores,and I noticed that Michigan St. was losing in
    the first half!!!
    
    
    could be intersting if they lose,
    
    
    O_J

    Providence lost, and so did `Nova.
    
    
    
    O_J

>    Providence lost, and so did `Nova.

Villanova I 1/2 expected, but Providence really let us down...up big with
4-5 minutes to go and they lose in OT.  I guess what comes around goes
around....they, more than anyone in the BE came back in the last few
minutes of games to either win or make it close, and they "got it done
to them" last night.

BE is 1-2.  Not good.


Joe

    Joe,when does the `Cuse game start??
    
    
    
    Thanx a lot,
    O_J

>    Joe,when does the `Cuse game start??

7:07pm.  If they win, their game vs. the Vir-ND winner will be on CBS at
2:20pm Sunday.  I'm really hoping it's ND...I want another shot at these
guys.


Joe

    
    Joe, you'd be better off to play the tougher competition to tune up
    for a run root for UVA....
    
    my heart's still bleeding from the prov loss....
    
    mike

    Missouri is about to be eliminated.They're down by12 with about 5 to
    go.
    
    
    
    
    O_J

    The Tigers lost.This will make it easier for us to get to the
    regionals.If we can get by these first two teams.
    
    
    
    O_J

    Well,we beat UVA on yet another sensational block by Mr. Coleman.I'm
    not happy about this win but you must consider that it was in Richmond
    and this was Terry Holland's last hurrah.He probably used that famous
    "Win one for the gipper" crap,which kept them in the game we they were
    seemingly out of it.But we won and were in the sweet16 with a 63-61
    victory.
    
    One thing I do know is that Michigan St. is going down!!`Tech's gonna
    whip them!!!
    
    
    
    Joe,you got your wish;Tubbs and his Laters(-:) lost to UNC!!!
    
    
    Ah.....,what a day!!!!
    O_J

      Georgetown gets stomped by the "Mouseketeers" HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
    I love it. Whatsa matter John, Can't take a punch from Mickey?
    
      I was going through my alumni magazine from SU looking for some info
    on the basketball team and came across an article about Boeheim. It was
    one of those typical fluff pieces, but what struck me as funny was one
    of the last paragraphs by a childhood friend of Boeheim's :
    
       "In the early 1970s, before Jim made head coach, he wasn't sure what
    he was going to do," says Santelli with a laugh. "He thought maybe he'd
    have t ocome back and run the family business." Boeheim's late father,
    Jim Sr., owned the local funeral home.
       
      The article shows a picture of a former teacher of Jimbo hanging over
    a sign that says Boeheim-Pusater Funeral Home.
    
      Maybe Boeheim just moved his office to the DOME. :) :)
    
    Scott

What a frustrating win.  The game went from one in which SU was cruising,
to one that they barely won.  First, CBS cuts away from the game with
SU up 12.  We find out that SU increases the lead to 15.  When they finally
take us back, Vir hits a FT to make it a 10-pt lead (a little over 7 minutes
to go).  The rest of the game was ugly, from an SU standpoint.  I think
they made only 1 FG in the last 8 minutes (I think Vir outscored them
22-9 to close-out the game).

Boeheim puts in his "defensive" team (Johnson and Ellis for Scott and Edwards)
and forgets that SU has to score too !!  Then he pulls the ball out and starts
the delay game....SU's at it's worst when they're up big and they slow it
down and use the clock.  He's lost a game this way already, and has come
close to losing 3-4 others.  You'd think he'd see this, realize it isn't
working, and leave his offensive players in and gamble that he'll continue
to score enough to keep a comfortable margin.

A better team would have beaten him yesterday.

Once again Coleman isn't in the offense in the 2nd 1/2.  He had 15 pts
at the 1/2, and had only 1 shot in the 2nd 1/2.  And you can't tell me
Vir denied him the ball.  At 6'10", they don't have anyone big enough
to deny him the ball !!!  He has been their dominant player all year...
he's done it all, including making the big plays when they had to be
made.  If Boeheim doesn't make him the center of this team's offense,
they're going to lose.  In the beginning of the season I said that SU
would go as far as Owens takes them.  I want to chg that to: they'll
go as far as Coleman takes them.


On the positive side, Billy was taking his share of shots...now he just
has to make more of them (7-18).  He still looks hesitant at times.
I expected him to create more offense for both himself and others...but
many times he gives the ball back when an initial opening isn't there.
Maybe he'll really take over next year, when he IS the #1 option.

I think Boeheim made a good move starting Tony Scott in both games so far.
The announcers said he's trying to light a fire under Ellis, but I believe
that we'll see a lot of 3-guard play out of SU this weekend, with Minn,
Geo Tech and Mich St standing between them and the Final Four.  All 3
feature "guard-oriented" offenses.  Scott gives them more offense, and
is quicker on defense.  And what a difference he makes when the other
team plays zone.


With all the upsets, this tournament is wide-open, and no one out there
is a huge favorite.  Other than UConn, I don't see any team that specializes
in a slow, deliberate offensive attack, which is good news for SU fans.
Syracuse's problems will be in match-ups with teams that feature big, scoring
guards.  They may have more trouble winning the Southeast Region, than they
will if they get to the Final Four.  Of course this can be offset if The
Idiot uses his advantage inside --->  no one left in the tourney has a
Derrick Coleman.  Each night, the rest of the way, he can go out and
dominate.



Joe

    
    Hey Joe, 
    		I'm an SU fan also!  Do you kind of get the impression that
    Boehummer doesn't have any idea when to make a substitution?  When he
    does, I'm not sure if he want's a defenseive or an offensive
    substituiton.  I think the team has won their share of close games, not
    because of his coaching ability, but because of the caliber of ball
    players on the court at the time.
    		I think they can get passed Minn., but if Ga. Tech can beat
    Michigan State, SU will have their hands full trying to stop the
    3-point shot offense of the Yellowjackets.
    
    					Juan

    
    Hey Joe, atleast they won. I knew without even looking at my set
    that as the lead was evaporating Edwards had to be on the bench.
    What an idiot Boehiem is, lucky for him he has Thompson in the
    conference to make him look good.....
    
    Like the announcer said if 'no one figures out how to beat UCONN's
    press the title is theirs...'
    
    If ole JT had any guts he'd have pulled Mourning after the cheapshot...
    
    mike

>    Like the announcer said if 'no one figures out how to beat UCONN's
>    press the title is theirs...'

Mike, even though UConn beat SU last week, we did beat them once already
this year, and despite the close final score, it was a 10-15 pt game most
of the way.  I think that with a healthy Owens, SU can get them again.
Packer said SU can beat UConn's pressure with their big men, and they
did for most of the 1st 1/2.  Then they got a little careless, and Owens
was pretty much a non-factor.  I wouldn't mind another shot at 'em.


re:  Juan

You're right, most of the time his substitutions do not make sense.  He
was on the money in both games against G'town, but rarely in any other
game this season.  Maybe he's more comfortable against teams with big
frontlines (he says they match-up better).  His infatuation with Manning
has frustrated me.  I see he didn't play yesterday.  Hopefully he's
discovered who his players are for this tournament.  Johnson, Scott/Ellis,
and possible Hopkins should be the only subs.  Now he has to use the
proper strategy...ie: make sure he uses his big horses.  And he shouldn't
have Johnson in the game at the end...he must have a true point guard in
there...as Bill Raftery says, "take the point guard out, and you don't
have a HEAD".


Joe

    My feeling is that if we get to the final four and beat UNLV(if they
    get there) well win it.
    
    
    
    O_J

    My thoughts on the Big East Games:
    
    UCONN absolutely dominated Cal.  Cal. never got out of the box and
    looked like they didn't belong in the same league.  It was nice to
    see Smith hit 5 three pointers also.
    
    Syracuse won ugly.  When they were up by fifteen I thought they were
    playing as good as I've seen them. they were spreading the points
    around playing solid D and as soon as CBS switched the game they
    fell apart and let Virginia back in the game.
    
    St Johns fell apart and clearly should have won this game.  Boo Harvey
    disappeared in the first half and came back for a respectable 17 (i
    think) points in the second half.  I thought Seally played
    exceptionally well along with Buto but when Hurley cut in front of
    him and he picked up his fifth foul, the end was near.
    
    G' Town looked terrible.  I found it hard to believe they even made
    this close but I have to give them alot of character points for not
    hanging their heads and quiting.  When Hill fouled out and the hoyas
    went on the run I really thought they would pull it out.
    
    I think the final four is shaping up to be UCONN vs. Arkansas and 
    Syracuse vs. UNLV.  I sure would like to see an all Big east final
    but I think UCONN would have an easier time with UNLV because they've
    never faced UCONN and would turn the ball over mucho times.  I think
    Georgia tech might beat mich st. but that's as far as they go.
    
    Jimbo
    
    

    If we end up meeting UCONN again,we will be more than ready;you can be
    sure of that.
    
    
    
    O_J

    Boo Harvey actually kilt the Redmen.  He was 4 - 20 from the field.
    If he had shot 40%, the Johnnies woulda won.
    
    But, to me, the game summed up the Redmen season all too well.
    
    JD

    I was really surprized at St. John's yesterday.  I couldn't believe the
    way Louie let them play down the stretch.  As Duke was cutting the lead
    and making a run, St. John's was totally out of control on offense. 
    It seemed as though their offense dissolved into Boo Harvey going 1 on
    2 and ending up taking some ridiculous shots with plenty of time left
    on the shot clock.  That was selfish playground ball at its worst.  The
    announcers kept talking as if Harvey was doing an incredible job at
    keeping the Redmen in it.  At 4 for 20 from the floor, he ended up
    hurting them a helluva lot more than he helped.  I can't remember the
    last time I've seen a Carnesecca team look so undisciplined.
    
    Laker_Ken

    
    Boo didn't get much of a break in the parts of the game that I saw.
    Every time he shot the ball, someone was hitting him or knocking him
    down. SJU didn't get much of a break from the zebras.
    
    Dennis
    

>    Boo didn't get much of a break in the parts of the game that I saw.
>    Every time he shot the ball, someone was hitting him or knocking him
>    down. SJU didn't get much of a break from the zebras.
    
	Didn't really care who won that game, but I will say this about
the play that brought on the T. I didn't see any difference in the way
Brickey stole the ball then in the way he lost the ball and got bailed
out with the foul. If they didn't call the first, then the second shouldn't
have been called. Of course the St. John's player was wrong to
cost his team 2 foul shots and the ball by picking up the T....

    Jim M

    
    yeah but the other team out there was Duke the darlings of the NCAA's.
    They always manage to get the calls and the nice sweet seeding in the
    tourney. Clemson wins the regular season title, Georgia Tech the ACC
    tournement and they both get shipped out while Duke stays home. I guess
    it's there reward for running a clean program...
    
    Joe, I agree that SU can beat UConn and can handle the pressure I don't
    know who else can but I suspect Arkansas could. Duke can if they let
    Hurley get going but it's possible to get under his skin as King Rice
    showed. Still though should they meet in the finals (SU UConn) I got
    to go with UConn cause of the coach and the confidence factor. Jimmy
    will figure he has to go to his best athletes lineup to beat them
    meaning Edwards will sit. Also if they get down they'll be wondering
    if they can, while if UConn is down they know they can come back...
    
    Still though I don't think either will be there....
    
    gut feeling today is Georgia Tech/Arkansas final....
    
    mike

    > yeah but the other team out there was Duke the darlings of the NCAA's.
    > They always manage to get the calls and the nice sweet seeding in the
    > tourney. Clemson wins the regular season title, Georgia Tech the ACC
    > tournement and they both get shipped out while Duke stays home. I guess
    > it's there reward for running a clean program...
    
    No Mike, it's their reward for having their Athletic Director on the
    NCAA Selection Committee.  He's been there the last two years and Duke
    has gotten more than a kind seed, *especially* relative to the other
    ACC schools.  Having Duke seeded higher than Tech is absurd, just as it
    was absurd last year to let them stay in Greensboro and send Carolina
    packing.
    
    Anybody know how many years these guys serve on the committee?  
    
    
    - ACC Chris
    
    
    

>    yeah but the other team out there was Duke the darlings of the NCAA's.
>    They always manage to get the calls and the nice sweet seeding in the
>    tourney.

Coach K makes me sick.  I'm sick of looking at his pointed nose.  Why is it
that he doesn't have a "can't win the BIG ONE" label ?  He's been to the
Final Four 3 of the last 4 years and has come up dry in all 3.


re:  a possible UConn-SU final

Mike, I'm not so sure UConn would have any "intangible" advantages.  They
are the younger team.  They've never been this far.  Coleman and Thompson
have played in an NCAA title game.  SU knows they can beat them, and they'd
be very UP for it, given their loss a wk ago.  IF, SU gets that far, Coleman
would be on a MISSION.  With an injured Rod Sellers, no one would be able
to stop him...(if The Idiot lets him play)


Joe

    
    thanks Chris for the clarity. Alls I know is they sure get extra
    special treatment especially with the refs who help their defense
    look better by putting their whistles in their pockets....
    
    mike

    
    But Joe, while what you say maybe true the bottom line is Jimmy will
    be pulling the strings and he'll pull the wrong ones. I just know
    it. I can see them now with Thompson, Coleman, Owens, Ellis and
    Johnson out there, no one to get the ball to the inside people
    so Stevie out's there firing up airballs from three point land.
    And of course the old achillies heel foul shooting will kill them.
    they have hit them better than ever this year, except in the biggest
    game they were involved in this year (BET Finals).
    
    UConn is young but has two steading hands in Henefeld and George. When
    the others start to panic these two search out/goto the ball and
    restore order.
    
    mike

>    But Joe, while what you say maybe true the bottom line is Jimmy will
>    be pulling the strings and he'll pull the wrong ones.

history says you're right....


Joe

    
    I think that putting Scott in at center is a big mistake.  Granted, I
    don't think Leron belongs in their either, but Scott can provide
    offense in a close game.  If Scott gets into foul trouble early, then
    he's forced to sit out.  I say let Manning or even McRae start at
    center.  This is a position that typically in the SU offense doesn't
    provide much anyway.
    
    						Juan

    
    but Scott doesn't play center. When Scott is in the game Derrick
    moves to the hole where he dominates the glass but gets lost
    offensively.
    
    I think the new lineup has been very effective. It has gotten
    Ellis playing better. Probelm has been that Johnson has been
    getting minutes at Edwards' expense when he should get them
    at Thompson's expense...
    
    but hey that's Jimmy....
    
    mike

>    I think that putting Scott in at center is a big mistake.

>    I say let Manning or even McRae start at center.


Juan,

I don't think Scott is playing center when he's in there.  I think he's
playing a swing position (guard/forward).  I noticed he guarded a forward
on Virginia Sunday.  Coleman takes the center spot (on D).  I think
Boeheim will play this lineup against teams that feature guards, and are
basically not big...and they don't have an active big man in the middle.
Ellis is still the defender of choice (IMO) against teams with offensive,
dominating centers (there ain't many in the Sweet 16 -> certainly not in
the Southeast Regionals this weekend).

As for Manning and McRae, I've voiced my concerns over Manning's lack
of aggressive play...he's so hesitant, that at this point of the tournament
(unless they're up big) I can't see taking a chance on him going in there
and missing shots, fouling, fumbling rebounds, etc.  There may be a spot
for McRae...especially if they need some intimidation and rebounding in
the middle and/or Coleman or Ellis gets in foul trouble.


Joe

>    Probelm has been that Johnson has been
>    getting minutes at Edwards' expense when he should get them
>    at Thompson's expense...


right on the money Mike.  Everyone needs a blow, and Johnson's style
of play is more like Stevie's than anyone else's.


Joe

    The key to beating Conn is keeping the turnovers to a minumum.If
    you do that they are VERY beatable.So if we do end up meeting again
    we'll have to keep from turning the ball over.
    
    
    
    O_J

    
    
    As far as SU being Coleman's team,I agree.But Billy is ALMOST as
    important.When he and Coleman are at their absolute best this team can
    beat anybody---------------->Case in point....Billy had 11??against
    UCONN and Derrick had about 13 and only took about 7 shots.That won't
    happen again.
    
    
    
    Finally a good coaching move by the idiot to start Scott.This helps the
    team in more than one way.It gives Ellis AND Scott motivation to play
    well.Every time I see this Scott kid I like him more and more.I
    remember last year when Billy Packer said to watch this guy and he said
    last year's freshman class was one of the best they've had in
    while(except the class of `90 was thebest!!).What does he way
    180??That's how much Charles Smith,formally of Georgetown weighs at
    6-0.IF this kid gains about 30-40 pounds over the summer he'll be
    unbelieveable next year.If we get to the regionals and face Ga.
    Tech,they will have a tough time doubling down on Coleman becuase that
    would leave Scott wide open and he'll nail it just about every
    time!!!Tony is also a pretty good rebounder too!!!Georgia Tech may have
    Dennis Scott,but we got Tony Scott!!!....8^
    
    
    
    
    
    O_J

    
    and I'll take Dennis Scott anyday over Tony. Maybe in time Tony will
    develop an all-around game, chances are probably not with JB as his
    coach. Dennis does it all....
    
    mike

>	Georgia Tech may have Dennis Scott,but we got Tony Scott!!!....8^

O_J, we can't look past Minnesota.  There's an article in USA Today, and
this team is pumped-up looking at the opportunity to knock-off SU.  They're
playing the "Rodney Dangerfield routine" --> "we don't get no respect".
So they'll be a real challenge.  One thing that scares me is that they're
a good rebounding team, which may negate some of SU's advantage inside.
But a positive for SU is that Minn's leading scorer is a forward (Burton),
so he'll really have to work for his points, with Owens guarding him, and
Coleman and Ellis lurking to help out.  Also, Minn supposedly isn't a good
road team, and playing in New Orleans (ie: a Dome) should be a slight
advantage to SU.

I can see a very close game, with SU pulling it out at the end.

It's possible that the SU-Minn game WON'T be the primetime game in the
Boston area on Friday night.  Victim of the Loyola-Marymount infatuation
that's starting to take over this tournament....


Joe

>    Dennis does it all....

He's a great outside shooter, but his complete game didn't surface until
this year (he's a Junior)...and he's been a starter since his freshman
year.  Everyone needs time to develop, and while SU's Scott isn't
regarded as highly and Dennis, he really hasn't had the playing time
to-date.  He's got a lot of talent, and next year will be a terrific
compliment to Billy.  They will carry the scoring load for SU.


Joe

    RE: a few back
    
    I don't understand why the Orange DON'T play Conrad McRae.  As
    someone said before - most of what the Orange get from the center
    position this year is defense and rebounding.  And McRae is an
    eraser!  (I believe Dicky V called him a "leaper deluxe".)  He
    provides defensive intimidation.
    
    On the other hand, I think Manning plays very soft for his size.
    He seems to prefer the baseline jumper to banging hard inside.
    Even if he was playing fairly well, I wouldn't see him spelling
    Ellis, I'd see him maybe spelling DC.
    
    For the record, I'm thrilled to see Tony Scott in the lineup.
    
    Does anyone know about Coleman's attitude about the tournament.
    If it were me, and I missed the free throws that probably cost
    the national championship, I think I'd be on a mission.  (And
    I think he is - when he gets the ball...)
    
    
    							Roland

    re .560
    
    LMU infatuation ? What makes you think that we all want to watch
    BayWhine (tm) and his band of underachivers ?
    
    Besides LMU plays some fun basketball .....

    
    Joe, didn't say that Tony wouldn't improve, just don't think at the
    present moment he has the body to rebound or play the defense that
    Dennis plays....and of course getting under SU fans' skin is a favorite
    past time....
    
    of course this week they're playing the big ten so go SU........
    
    mike
    
    

>    LMU infatuation ? What makes you think that we all want to watch
>    BayWhine (tm) and his band of underachivers ?

not all do...but the weekly TV ratings usually show that SU games are
high-viewer games.  They themselves have a "fun" approach to the game.
I believe the SU-Duke game was ESPN's highest rated NCAA b-ball game
ever.

Besides all that nonsense, SU is a Big East school, and last time I
looked around, the Boston market has a Big East school in it.  If it
was Georgetown playing Minn, I'd much rather see that game ("of local
interest") than a westcoast team vs. Alabama.  Give a break...


Joe

Roland,

You make some good points:

>    I don't understand why the Orange DON'T play Conrad McRae.
>    And McRae is an eraser!  He provides defensive intimidation.

I've heard Boeheim, and a Syracuse beat-writer, describe McRae as
"raw" offensively.  I would have used him in situations where I
needed defensive intimidation and rebounding.  Boeheim gave him
some time during the season.  But he had to settle on his 7 guys
for the NCAA tournament, and Conrad isn't one of them.  I believe
the rotation is VERY set at this point, and only foul trouble, or
weird match-up problems, will bring a McRae in the game.  I think
Hopkins and Manning will see little time (if any) as well.  Scott
and Johnson are his guys (from what we've seen so far).


>    On the other hand, I think Manning plays very soft for his size.
>    He seems to prefer the baseline jumper to banging hard inside.

Perfect description.  When he shoots inside, he chokes.  What he needs
is a couple of jams...just so he can taste what's like to score with
some intensity...something he hasn't got.
    

>    Does anyone know about Coleman's attitude about the tournament.

He said one of the reasons for returning was to get a national championship.
If I were him, I'd be screaming for the ball more...otherwise he can kiss
his championship bye-bye.



Joe

    
    
    When I was making the comparison of Scott to Scott,I was just
    kidding.As far as the Gophers go I think they have a very good team in
    it will be tough for us.
    
    
    
    O_J

SU is 13-3 on the road this year.  Minnesota supposedly isn't a good
road team.

The key for Minn to beat SU is to keep the ball out of Coleman's hands,
and keep Billy on the perimeter (where Billy's game is restricted, and
Minn's good rebounding will be even better).  I'm assuming Minn doesn't
play zone defenses, so this is a big challenge for them.


Joe

    
    Big question for SU is how Edwards will handle the Minny guards.
    both are big around 6'6". Offensively I believe he'll be able to out
    quick them but defensively I'll bet he gets posted a lot. It might
    force SU into zone to help out which isn't their best defense. 
    
    definately an interesting matchup.....
    
    Coleman or Owens has to step forward and dominate this one or Jimmy
    can go warm up the bus....
    
    mike

    
    Does anyone know how tall the Minn. starting five are?  What type of
    offense do they like to play? (ex:fast break, slow down,etc.)

    >>    Does anyone know how tall the Minn. starting five are?  What type of
    
    I believe they are approximately 33' 7"
    
    JoJ

    Guys,I can't beleive what I just saw.This HAS to be the biggest choke
    in the history of ANYTHING!!!!!!!!!! 1,that's right 1 second left and
    the guy guarding Tate George sits there and let's him take an
    uncontested shot!!!!!!!UCONN didn't win it,Clemson lost it which is why
    UCONN will go NOWHERE after this!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    
    Cheers and smilies to all!!
    
    O_J

    Gee I was thinking the exact same thing, right up until the 1 second
    expired.  Up by 19 points with ~5 minutes and almost lost.  
    
    Not to nitpick, but the Clemson player didn't let him take an
    uncontested shot.  He jumped up quite high in fact.  If you look
    at the film you'll see the UCONN player caught the ball, took a
    LARGE step away from the basket (at the same time the Clemson player
    was in the air) and shot the ball.  Definately not uncontested.
    
    The Wizard

    Wrong.He did not want to foul him.He just put his arms up to show he
    didn't touch him;the analyst pointed this out.........
    
    O_J
    

    
    Which is probably exactly what his coach told him to do. It was a
    great pass and super clutch shot by George. I feel good for him cause
    he had just choke 3 seconds earlier....
    
    Hats off to the clemson coach Ellis. I can think of about a dozen
    coaches off the top my head who would have a tirade on the sideline
    when George's shot went through. He took it with class...
    
    mike

    I wanted UConn to win but......
    
    I find it very hard to believe that Tate George, or anyone, can catch a
    pass going away from the basket, stop, turn around, jump 2 ft. straight
    up, THEN release the ball for the shot, all in 1.0 second.  Now, around
    11pm EST, during the half of whatever game was on, they analyzed the
    play, and the "expert" pointed out that the clock officially stops at
    the buzzer.  They showed the play a couple of times with the announcers
    voices dubbed-out, and only a little crowd noise and the buzzer could
    be heard.  And yes, Tate clearly released the ball just slightly before
    the buzzer.  But what the expert analyst conveniently ignored was the
    several tenths of a second that the buzzer lagged from the game clock. 
    That was the difference.  Tate actually had more like 1.4-1.6 seconds,
    which I still find hard to believe he could make it, but it would be
    more believable.  I really think Clemson got robbed on this one,
    especially the way they miraculously fought back and took the lead.
    
    JMHO.
    
    Hawk

    The only team I would have wanted to win less than UConn would be
    BC.  My downstairs neighbor (a Clemson graduate) and I were both
    all excited about the Tigers winning, and then to see that happen,
    well, neither of us are very happy today.
    
    John

    
    Why in the day and age of high-tech scoreboards with tenth-second
    displays can't they synchronize the clock with the buzzer to any better
    than a half-second?  Seems rather obvious, but these clock-buzzer
    controversies continue to occur...
    
    Actually, the timekeeper did a very good job of getting the clock
    started when the ball was caught.  Often you'll see a half-second lag
    there on the front end, but he anticipated well.  With that in mind, 
    from my experience where you will almost always see some small amount
    of extra time granted to the shooter (both as he catches the ball and
    the fraction of a second before the ball actually leaves his hand), I 
    think George's shot was good.  Good call.
    
    glenn
    

    Hawk, et al,
    
    You'd be amazed at what can happen in a second.  THink
    about it.  High schoolers have run the 100 yard dash in 10, which
    means they can average 10 yards per second.  Go outside, measure
    10 yards and run.  See what you can do.  Just think of sports and
    think of all that happens in one second.  It was good, it is over.
    O_J, you just simply crack me up.   Didn't you say something about
    NO WAY UCONN would win the Big East Tourney?
    
    I think it was good for UCONN to blow the big lead.  Think it will
    put things back into perspective. If they had kept the huge lead,
    they may have gotten too cocky and confident, but instead they came
    to gut check time and won.
    
    JD 

    No I didn't say no way Uconn would win the Big East
    tourney.............
    
    
    
    
    
    O_J