Conference foundr::firearms

Some Syndney Moring Herald Articles on the shooting and the ban.

http://www.smh.com.au/daily/archive/960429/pageone/pageone.html

http://www.smh.com.au/daily/archive/960430/pageone/pageone4.html

http://www.smh.com.au/daily/archive/960617/pageone/960617-pageone2.html

Ahhh Gi'day...

    Well, I should give an update on how things are going. There have been
    no elections since the bans were announced. The laws are not yet fully
    implemented in my state, New South Wales (they are talking about 1st
    July 1997) because they need to set up a register from scratch.
    Queensland is also dragging the chain for the same reason and "special
    circumstances".
    
    But the confiscation and buyback is almost 9 months old. In some
    states, it's already over, or just about to be. Ours has been going
    since last September, and is due to finish this September. There is
    quotes of almost 400K guns being handed in across Australia. The gun
    control crowd thinks that this is 10% of the available guns, and a
    "good start" (they are like sprinters - love "good starts")
    
    If they think there is only 4M guns in Oz, they are dreaming, but they
    have always concentrated on what they would like the world to be, and
    not how it is. Of course, in the states with registration, the "buy
    back" consisted of a threatening letter from the registry, and a wait
    in a queue down at special "collection centres".
    
    Now let's have a look at this 400K number. There is only 60K of those
    been handed in from NSW. There is 150K from Victoria. These states have
    about the same population (Vic a bit (1/2M?) less) of around 4-5M.
    
    Now Victoria has registration, and the 150K are obviously as a result
    of the register. The 60K from NSW are mostly from the dealers and other
    junk guns (the police went around and cleaned out the dealers). Now
    this number includes ALL SEMI-AUTOS (Shotguns, .22's, Centrefires), and
    ALL repeating shotguns (Pump action, anyway) from over 5M people.
    
    Another little snippet. In Vic, it was difficult to get a semi-auto,
    unless you had "sufficient reason". In NSW, until 1992, it wasn't any
    more difficult than a B/A .22 than any semi-auto (without a pistol
    grip, anyway). Since then, you've required a different permit, but it
    wasn't difficult to get. All military style semi-auto's were banned
    here in 1992 (esp. the SKS). They didn't get many of them handed in
    either. I've heard the importers say that there was 75K SKK/SKS's
    imported in Oz alone, mostly into NSW and Queensland.
    
    So, Vic with semi restrictions and register = 150K
        NSW with not many semi restrictions and no register = 60K
    
    Me thinks there are a lot still out there. And the anti-gun groups are
    crowing that only about 30-50% of people will get the new licences at
    all (for non-semis). I suspect they will still have their guns, because
    they can't get compensation if they don't meet the criteria for a
    licence. You can ONLY get compensation for a gun that is specifically
    BANNED.
    
    There was talk about issuing a licence to everybody that currently
    wants one, and only introducing the new "genuine reason" for people
    that are applying for the first time. The Regulations that put the
    teeth into the act have been rewritten, and we are seeing what they
    come out with. It's all supposed to start on 1 July, I can't see it.
    
    And the buyback? Well, even the "success" stories start to ring a
    little hollow around NSW and Qld, blind freddy can tell that there are
    a lot of hardware out there, and now that the colours of the anti's
    have been nailed to the mask, there won't be anybody standing in line
    to sign a register.
    
    The govt is going to start a new advertising campaign to make people
    comply with the legislation and warn about the end of the amnesty in
    the buy back. The media will lap it up, they like to help give the
    impression that "everybody" will comply. I don't think the media have
    that much credibility with the shooting fraternity.
    
    The campaign will be different in Qld, because of claimed "special
    circumstances" (mainly, they know that Qld'ers have a real independant
    streak, and they really don't want to get the gun-owners' backs up).
    The anti's have now started making all sorts of threatening noises
    about "tough measures", even though the govt haven't yet gotten out the
    big stick (because their research tells them that it will be counter
    productive).
    
    There is reports in the latest shooters' journal that many gun shops
    are recording only sales of military calibres, such as .223 and .308.
    It appears that there is "widespread fear that other calibres may not
    be so widespread in the future" --- Read into that what you will, I
    know what the people I know are buying and why.
    
    One more - the police minister here has CLAIMED that the reason there
    aren't many hand-ins in NSW is because of the fact that you don't get
    your money on the spot (like in Victoria), and that here you must take
    your firearm into a police station, whereas it's a collection centre in
    Vic. They are thinking of changes to make this the case in NSW. Yeah,
    that must be it, people won't hand in their guns because it's a long
    walk to the cop station, or the cheque takes three weeks.
    
    However, I suspect he knows the real reason - but he won't be admitting
    it publically now, will he??

    
    
    	gad, what a mess. 
    
    

Interesting. I've been saying it for quite a while: people will do pretty
much exactly what they want to do, regardless of laws.

    Hi,
    
    	Is ammo banned as well or just short supply is certain
    	military calibers ? (ie .223 and .308).  
    
    	Also, any mentions about the rise in "gun thefts" ?? I'd imagine
    	lots will turn up "M.I.A.". ;)
    
    tom

Ahhh Gi'day...

    Ammo is not banned, although they were originally going to ban the
    importation of ammo that is for "banned" guns (read 7.62*39). But they
    seem to have backed away from that, there are quite a few B/A 7.62*39
    around, quite a few SMLE's got converted as well.
    
    I heard a rumour that the Feds were banning the importation of FMJ
    ammo, but I don't think that happened. Anyway, with the new laws, the
    States can ban anything they want at any time without going to
    parliament, under the guise of "regulations".
    
    There is no real need for gun thefts in my state, because there is no
    register. They will just disappear. It has happened in other states -
    and a hell of a lot of it happened in the UK.
    
    The ammo story is interesting. It seems that there is a feeling that
    you might want to keep .223 and .308 (I thought it was just me!!). I
    know that there are a lot of people who are going to have guns on
    register, and ones off register (same caliber). That way, you always
    have ammo for it (you can only buy ammo for the calibre you have
    "registered").
    
    I believe that there are ammo restrictions, like how much you can buy,
    and how much you can have. I suspect they haven't figured out about
    reloading yet, so as long as you don't assemble the rounds, you may be
    ok. I suspect quite a few people are going to have a case or two under
    a tree out in the bush.
    
    Because you now need to prove a genuine reason for a gun, and have to
    show "special need" for anything that isn't a bolt action .22, many
    people will have them, and won't be able to get a license for them. You
    won't be able to sell them, because the market will be awash with 'em.
    I suspect we will be off to court on this one, as effective
    confiscation without compensation.
    
    Research by the Commonwealth Law Enforcement Board has shown that 60%
    of people have said they WILL comply with the new laws. I suspect that
    this number is HIGH! Everybody I know is saying that they will comply,
    (especially if a stranger asks them), but I suspect they won't be.