Conference misery::feline_v1

    You are right, there isn't a whole lot of info in here about cancer.  I
    did a keyword check on both Cancer and Tumor and came up with a handful
    of notes.  If you haven't read through them yet, you might want to, but
    it doesn't look as though any of the cases were the type of cancer your
    cat has.
    
    I had a cat that had Lymphoma, a cancer of the lymph system.  I lost
    him just about a year ago.  I would feed him special treats, like crab
    meat and raw steak to keep him eating.  He also got baby food mixed
    into his canned food.  And I gave him fluids when he wasn't feeling
    well enough to drink.  We also lavished him with attention.  He had a
    very happy last few months.
    
    Since this topic hasn't come up before in Feline, anything that you
    feel you can share with us would be appreciated.  I have added the
    keywords Cancer and Tumor to your base note so that in the future those
    looking for info will find this topic.
    
    Jo

    I'm very sorry about Murphy.
    

    I am also sorry.  I hope you can make Murphy's last few months happy
    ones.  
      Nancy DC
    

    	Yes, I did give Murphy some raw hamburger last weekend, and he
    loved it.  Guess it's no worse for him than raw mouse that he used to
    eat.  Also, I've given him baby food (lamb is one of his favorites)
    when he wouldn't eat anything else.  
    
    	He does seem to be dehydrated, and I'm not sure what to do for
    that.  I've given him turkey broth and chicken broth from cooked
    poultry (no salt tho').  If he weren't so difficult to take to the vet,
    I'd just take him in and let her inject fluids.  
    
    	The vet said she had never seen this kind of tumor in a cat in her
    15 years of practice.  However, she had seen it in dogs.  In fact, she
    had 3 cases of this in dogs just this summer.  In one case, it was 
    caught early enough (only one tumor) that wide area surgical removal
    was expected to get all of it.
    
    	The vet also said that treatment of symptoms in dogs included
    antiacids and antihistamines.  When the tumor cells break down, they
    generate acids in the stomach (causing the animal to not want to eat)
    and histamines which cause alergic reactions.  When Murphy gets to 
    this point (if cats react the same as dogs), I will probably decide
    then to have him put to sleep.  For now, anyway, he's getting enough
    to eat and seems happy enough (especially with all the extra love and
    attention he's getting.
    
    Barbara

    Just spoil Murphy rotten and show him alot of love!!!!  Normally
    when one of my guys aren't eating...they will always chow down
    on chicken or baby food.
    
    Please keep us posted....
    
    Sandy

    There are a couple of things you can do to help him stay hydrated.  One
    is have your vet teach you to give him lactated ringers sub-q (under
    his skin).  It is very easy and will make him feel better.
    
    The other thing you can do is buy some lean beef.  Cut it into cubes.
    Place a glass jar inside a larg pot filled with water.  The water
    should come right up to the edge of the jar but not go in the jar.
    Place some of the beef cubes into the jar and set the pot to a simmer.
    Meat juice will start to collect in the jar, pour that off and save it. 
    Keep simmering until all the beef cubes have become dessicated.  When
    no more meat juice collects, toss out the beef cubes.  The juice is
    what you are after.  Offer the meat juice to Murphy.  It is very
    concentrated and loaded with nutrition.
    
    Jo

    In a horrible coincidence, Sweetie has just been diagnosed as having
    this.  The vet is removing the tumor tomorrow and will have a better
    idea next week as to whether it's been caught in time.  I'd warn people
    to keep an eye out for quite small lumps -- this felt to me like a
    very small scab or somesuch, but when I looked at it I could see that
    it was a sort of small whitish lump.  It could very easily be overlooked.
                                                        

    Actually (please, God) if Sweetie's has been caught early enough, it's
    thanks to your note.  I had noticed the lump but thought it was
    probably just some minor skin thing that wasn't important;  your note
    made me pick up the phone and call his vet.
    

    I am so sorry for the both of you.  Karen, I'm keeping good thoughts
    that the prognosis will be good.  Hang in there.
    
    Giudi +3

    Are either of these cats white?
    
    Jo

    Sweetie is a black/grey/slightly white tabby.  The tumor is way under
    his dark fur, so we aren't dealing with sun exposure.
    

    I hope that all will be okay with both Murphy and Sweetie.  Karen,
    Sweetie might like some of the beef juice recipe as a treat, even if he
    isn't that sick. :^)  Give them both hugs from me.
    
    Jo

    	Murphy is orange with white on his face, belly and paws.  There was
    one lump that appeared first, but I thought it was just a scab and
    forgot about it for awhile.  It was about 2 months before I got him in
    for surgery, and by then he had 3 lumps.  My vet said that this kind of
    tumor can be completely removed if caught early.  This is one reason
    why I started this note.  I don't want to alarm people, but just like
    for humans early detection and removal of cancerous tumors may prevent
    spreading.  In Murphy's case, I waited too long to have the vet look at
    him.  One reason (excuse?) is that he's impossible to handle at the
    vet's, and I have to give him a tranquilizer before the visit.  I've
    learned from that though and will not hesitate next time to have any
    unusual condition examined as soon as possible.
    
    	I'm sorry to hear about Sweetie, but maybe it's still early enough
    to be completely removed.
    
    Barbara
          

    Barbara, did the other tumors occur near the first one?  I'm concerned
    about missing future ones when I look for them, since they are so tiny.
    

    Karen & Barbara, I'm really sorry to hear about your cats. This is
    just awful. I'm thingking about all of you.
    
    Hugs,
    Bonnie

    	No, all three tumors were in different places.  The first was on
    his back above the left shoulder, the second on the left side of his
    belly under his left front leg, and the third in front of his right
    shoulder.  They started looking like scabs, but by the time they were
    removed they looked like raised stalks about 1/4 inch high with scabs
    on the end.   When I realized they looked like that, I got him to the
    vet's as soon as I could.  I wouldn't want anything looking like that
    to be on my skin!  When the tumors were removed the vet said they were
    already spreading under the skin, and she had to remove a larger area
    than she expected to.
    
    	Now he has a 4th tumor on his belly near a hind leg, but at this
    point it wouldn't do any good to remove it.
    
    Barbara

    Snoopy's had lumps on her feet and sometimes chest, back, and tail;
    about two years ago one was biopsied and diagnosed non-cancerous, so
    usually I've assumed they all are.  These lumps do have to come off
    because they inevitably rupture and bleed (takes weeks or months), and
    I sort of try to 'save them up' by not having surgery until one does
    rupture or gets really large (Snoopy's had a total of eight or nine of
    these in the past eighteen months, so it's expensive and risky to have
    an operation for each one of them.)
    
    After reading this, I think I'll check her over carefully tonight (she
    hasn't had any lumps for a while.)  And consider repeating the biopsy
    if she has a lump.  I may lose some skin, though--Snoopy doesn't like
    me to look between her toes or feel her belly. :-)
    
    Best of luck with your cats.  For the one that won't drink, what about
    the water from a can of tunafish (the kind for people)?  Snoopy loves
    that so much I can't pour it into a bowl on the floor because she
    sticks her head under the stream (she can't wait til I'm done pouring.)
    Sticky, messy.  Maybe if I had another cat to lick it off her...
    
    Lisa Dean and Snoopy

    	These lumps were unique (and ugly) looking.  The raised up part was
    covered with tiny bumps and the scab was at the top.  There was never
    any bleeding or discharge that I could see, and I never saw Murphy
    licking those areas.  They must not have bothered him at all.
    
    	This weekend I'll try the beef juice recipe and give him tuna juice
    diluted with water.  At the moment he's eating very well and shows no
    signs whatsoever of being sick.  Maybe he has more time left than I
    thought!
    
    Barbara

    Sweetie's doesn't have a scab on top.  It's whitish and lumpy and
    about half the width of a pencil eraser.
    
    He's in having it removed this (Calif) morning.
    

    Well, that's what Murphy's looked like in the early stages.  When it
    got to be the size of a pencil eraser there was a scab over the top.  I
    didn't see the first one before it had a scab, but I did see the
    others.  I hope Sweetie's doing ok now and that either the tumor was benign
    or that it hadn't spread.  Let us know what the vet says after surgery.
    
    Barbara

    The vet knows Sweetie's tumor is Mast cell because of yesterday's biopsy
    (sp?)  What we still need to find out is if he can remove all the
    cancerous tissue in today's operation, or if it has spread too far; 
    that's what the lab report due in next week will tell us, as far as
    they can determine, I guess.  Assuming Sweetie comes thru the surgery
    okay. :-(
    

    Gentle thoughts and prayers to both the kitties.  Please keep
    us posted.
    
    Sandy

    Hang in there Karen.  This must be so hard on you.
    
    Gentle hugs,
    
    Jo

    So far so good.  The vet thinks he has the complete tumor excised, but
    he won't know for sure until next week's lab results.  I asked him
    about the possibility of spreading and recurrence even if the lab
    results are okay, and he said about 5% of these tumors are connected
    with a form of the disease that tends to recur and spread;  it didn't
    sound like it was actually a matter of their spreading because they
    were caught late.  On the other hand, he hustled Sweetie into the
    operation pretty quickly after the mast cell diagnosis, so maybe this
    is just a "bedside manner."
    
    Thanks everybody for your support.  Hugs to Murphy, too.
    

	Purrs and pawsitive thoughts to both Sweetie and Murphy.  It's
	so difficult when our babies have problems :^(

	Sandy

    I'm not sure if this is the right place for this, but this note has me
    a bit paranoid I think. 
    
    I had my 1 year old, Feendoonie on my lap sleeping last night, and
    discovered two lumps on her hind leg. I tried to see if they were scars
    or bites, but couldn't tell. She's black and her skin is grey, and it's
    very hard to see.
    
    I'm sure all of you will say to get her checked, but should I wait a
    few days to see if they go down? I've spent almost 300 dollars in the
    last minth on vet bills for my two, and thought I was all set till next
    year, and now this! Of course I'll figure out how to pay for her if I
    need to bring her in.
    
    She was at the vet Tuesday with Furby to get her second FELV shot, but
    he didn't do a real check up then. He saw her a few weeks ago for a
    physical, and didn't seem to notice anything then. 
    
    I don't know how long they have been there. Dhe usually sleeps on her
    other side when on my lap. (you know, creatures of habit, right?)      
    The thing that worries me the most, is that
    they don't seem to bother her at all! If they hurt, I'd at least know
    it was a scratch or bite or something. 
    
    So, am I being paranoid, or should I rush her right in?
    
    Thanks in advance.
    
    Y

    	I'm sure there will be different opinions, but I would say wait a
    few days.  It's Friday, and maybe you could get a better look at the
    lumps over the weekend.  You should be able to see if they are
    scratches or scars.  However, if they look like smooth, round lumps
    just under the surface of the skin and are attached to the skin, I'd
    have them examined on Monday.
    
    	Good Luck!
    
    Barbara

    If one of the things the vet did was to give the kitties
    their yearly shots maybe the bumps are from these.
    
    Check with your vet and see if they gave her a shot in the
    leg or took blood from there. If not, tell them about the
    bumps and see what they have to say, wait or bring the kitty
    in immediately.
    
    Barbara & her 3M's

    You might look at them with a flashlight also.  That gave me a better
    look at Sweetie's.
    

    Try to get a good lock at the area - check to see if it's red, inflamed
    and whether the cat has been licking at it.  I first felt bumps on
    Stitch's hind leg that felt like a cyst - the next day he was licking
    at them and they had gooten quite red - it turned out to be Rodents
    Ulcer.  In any event, you should have the vet check it out.
    
    Giudi

    Thanks for all the replies! I hadn't thought about it being from shots.
    I'll ask hubby tonight if Dr. Patil gave her any shots there. She got
    rabies, 4-in-1 and FELV all in the same day, so maybe he tried to
    spread them out?
    
    I'll keep an eye on them this weekend, and see what happens. I'll also
    try to get abetter look to see if they are inside or outside.
    
    Thanks again for your support! My prayers are with the other kitties in
    this note too.
    
    Y

    Rabies is usually a IM shot and would be given in the back leg, in the
    muscle.  4-in-1 and Felv are both sub-q usually and would be given
    under the skin at the shoulder.
    
    Jo

    Pardon my ignorance, Jo, but what do IM and Sub-q mean?
    
    Bonnie

    Bonnie,
    
     I believe IM is intra-muscular and sub-q is subcutanial (sp.) which
    means under the skin.
    
     Jo, 
    
     I believe your right, but I figured I could check to make sure before
    I panic! ;-) I'll be poking at my poor kitty all weekend now worrying
    about this! 
    
     I need my vacation!!!!!!
    
    Y

    Thanks, that was quick!
    
    Bon

    Taja has a few lumps on his lymph nodes.  The vet told me to check them
    every once in awhile to ensure they don't enlarge in size or shape. 
    They could have originated from an old injury, or worst case, the
    beginning signs of lymphoma.  We will have to wait, watch, and hope
    that the latter doesn't occur.
    
    -Roberta
    

    I hope Taja is okay.  I've had "funny" lymph nodes myself, from
    various previous teeth things, for years, so he may well be fine....
                    

    Hi all,
    
     Well, I poked at Feendoonie all weekend, and I believe her lumps were
    "boo boos". One of the lumps is gone, and the other one feels like a
    healing bite. Furby bites her on the butt all the time, so I think it
    may have been from too much rough housing. What a relief!
    
     Thanks for the advice to watch her over the weekend. It saved me a few
    bucks at the vet!
    
    Y

    
    
       My prayers and thoughts are with you both.  I lost my baby Sylvester
    to cancer about 6 mos ago and upon finding out he had tumors and only
    had a short time, I gave him all his favorites for food and to make
    sure he was getting enough water I would also blend it up in a blender
    with water (he ate it up) and gave him extra extra extra love and attention.
    
    
    
    Diana, Tykey & Domino

    I don't have any definitive news about Sweetie yet.  I got a message
    second-hand from the vet's assistant because he was handling an
    emergency, that the verbal report from the lab seemed like the tumor
    might be the "less dangerous" kind, but that he wanted to see the
    written report, which he should have by the time Sweetie comes in to get
    his stitches taken out on monday. He also wants to do a blood test
    then, which I guess means he might want to see if it's gotten into the
    blood....
    
    The Cornell book says Mast cell tumors are the fourth most common kind
    of skin cancer in cats, and most are benign but some are rapidly
    spreading malignant ones that spread to other organs in three to six
    months.  So, I don't know at this point if there's any possibility if
    the growth was benign, or if it's cancerous and the question is has it
    spread or was it removed in time.  The vet removed a LOT of tissue in the
    area;  I'm trying to imagine what Murphy must have looked like with
    three of these removed.
    
    Meanwhile Sweetie seems to be doing fine and all three cats are getting
    cuddled so much there's a constant low hum of purring in the house.

    
    .40 - Our paws are crossed...
    

    I just got a call from the vet and the news seems to be good;  he
    thinks he got all the tumor.  He also said that he's had very good
    success in controlling even very bad looking Mast cell tumor situations
    with steroids, when they occur in cats;  the prognosis for dogs is less
    favorable.  Barbara, did your vet mention the possibilities of steroid
    use for Murphy?  (I'm sending you this message by email as well in case
    you don't read FELINE for awhile.)    
    

    I hope he got everything, Karen. I'll be thinking about you & sweetie.
    
    Bonnie

    Thanks for the note about steroids.  I just spoke with my vet, and she
    had heard of treating this type of tumor with steroids.  She said it 
    would not prevent the spread of cancer or prolong Murphy's life, but it
    would improve his quality of life for the time he does have left.  So
    I'm picking up the medication today and will see if it helps.  After
    the surgery to remove 3 areas of spreading tumors, the vet hadn't
    expected Murphy to live as long as he has.  However, he is still 
    eating, drinking and hunting mice outside, so I'll do whatever I can
    to make him feel as well as possible.
    
    Barbara

    I hope the steroids help make him comfortable.  I had understood
    my vet to say he was able to prolong cats' lives for several years with
    the steroids, but perhaps I misunderstood.  I'll ask him again when
    Sweetie is in for the blood test and stitch removal on Monday.
    

    Barbara, I asked my vet again, and he said he believes that the steroid
    treatment does have a chance to prolong the life of cats (probably not
    dogs) with this condition.  He mentioned one cat that he had treated
    who had a mast cell tumor the size of a quarter on its stomach before
    it was detected;  he put the cat on steroids and over the course of a
    year the tumor disappeared;  the cat has been off steroids for six
    months now with no recurrence.  Of course, I don't think there are any
    guarantees that this works always.
    
    I asked if the medication you were giving Murphy was liable to be the
    right kind, dosage, etc., and he said yes -- it would likely be 
    prednisone (sp?) or prednilosone (sp?).
    

    I've heard that only some Mast Cell tumors are malignant.  One book I
    have says one out of 3, and I think a previous reply here sais only 5%
    are malignant.  The lab test showed that Murphy's 3 were malignant and
    that "mature cells were present at the deepest levels of the tumors." 
    I think that means there is a high probability that it has already
    spread to the blood and organs.  
    
    Maybe the cat who was successfully treated with steroids did not have
    the malignant kind of tumor or maybe it was caught early enough that
    the single tumor had not spread.  However, a tumor the size of a
    quarter is very large!
    
    Anyway, I'll try anything!  Murphy is getting prednisone (sp?), 1/2 a
    tablet twice a day for one week, then once a day for one week, and then
    every other day till some time in the future.  The pills were really
    inexpensive -- only $3 for about 20.  So far he still has only one new
    tumor, and seems to be feeling better in general (better appetite, at
    least.)  I'll post any changes or progress here.
    
    Thanks,
    
    Barbara
    

    So far so good with Sweetie.  The written lab report says it looks like
    the tumor was completely removed.  I'm waiting for the results of the
    blood test that was done yesterday.  If its clear, besides
    checking Sweetie at least once a week for new tumors, he gets a blood
    test every three months for a year;  if it's spread to the blood, the
    vet is going to put him on steroids.
    

    Glad to hear the good news, Karen.
    
    Give Sweetie extra hugs & kisses for me tonight! :*)
    
    Bonnie

    Karen, that is good news, !!!! we send kittyhugs and pawpats..
    Kate, Happy, Preschie, and Kissy..

    And, the blood test came back clean.  Whew.  No question, Sweetie and I
    owe catching this early to Barbara.  A zillion, zillion thanks.
    

    That is wonderful news Karen.  I am so glad for you and Sweetie.  Many
    thanks to Barbara for creating this note when she couldn't find this
    topic in Feline already.
    
    Jo

    Such great news Karen!
    
    Giudi

    Hi Karen,
    	I'm also very happy for you and Sweetie.  It's really great that we
    can use a notes conference like this one to share life-saving
    information.
    
    	Murphy isn't doing as well as he was a week ago, even with the
    steroids.  This morning he only had a couple bites of food and wouldn't
    eat anything else.  Maybe he'll eat better this evening when I can be
    with him all evening to try different foods.
    
    	If only I had had him checked earlier or had this information
    earlier, we might have had a chance of catching it in time.  But if
    this note only saves one other cat (like Sweetie) the experience will
    not have been a total loss.
    
    Barbara

    I'm so sorry Murphy isn't doing so well.  I'm praying for him.
    When a friend of mine had cancer a few years ago, he said his sense of
    taste changed, (everything seemed very salty), so maybe this is what's
    happening with Murphy....
    
    Karen
    

    Hi,
    
     Karen has a point about things tasting different. When my dad had a
    spot of cancer in his esophagus (sp) he wouldn't eat because he said
    everything tasted like raw bread dough. If that's not enough to get
    someone off their chow, I don't know what is! Keep trying different
    things. My dad practically lived on apple pie during that time. It
    seemed to still taste good, and had lots of calories too.
    
    Hope this helps.
              
    Y

    Barbara, 
    
    Was wondering if you have tried the beef juice recipe and if Murphy
    liked it.  I have used it, and offered the recipe to others but never
    gotten any feedback from anyone on it.
    
    Hope Murphy is feeling better soon.
    
    Jo

    No, I meant to try the beef juice but forgot completely about it.  I'll
    print out the recipe again and promise to try it this weekend and
    report back.  Murphy ate well last night and again this morning.  Every
    time he skips a meal, I panic and think he'll never eat again!  Then
    he returns to normal eating, especially if I give him several choices.
    
    Barbara