Conference misery::feline_v1

Does your cat go outside?

If so, it is possible that some nasty child did the deed.

Karen

    If the bloody area is spreading, does he has some type of a rash
    there that may have caused the lost whiskers and the bleeding (from
    him scratching it)?  You might want to have him checked for ringworm,
    flea allergy, and other skin problems.
    
    Jo

or, a bite during a fight.  at any rate, we cannot see the injury and
don't know what's wrong...but if it seems to be getting worse, RUN to
the vet - it sounds like infection.

				D

    To the Vet, to the Vet, to the Vet, vet, vet.....
    
    But of course, you are already humming that little tune.  Let us
    know what the Vet says..
    
    Sandi and the Storm Troopers
    
    

    Willy does go outside, but this injury happened in Maine where there
    are no other houses or children around.  I'll let you know what the vet
    says.  Thanks for the feedback.  I'll question the flea allergy & ring
    worm.
    
    Thanks again,
    Sonia

    Could he have just missed being caught in some sort of animal trap,
    not a steel jaw trap, I hope.  And had to pull out his whiskers
    to get free?  And now the area is infected?  Sure glad he's going to
    the vet.
    

    The area isn't infected (yet), but I wanted to catch it before it does
    get infected.  When we bring them (2 cats & a dog) up to Maine the 2
    cats love to chase each other around the house in the early mornings.
    The house is not completely finished so he probably could have caught
    the whiskers in plywood or 2 X 4's or who knows what!  As for animal
    traps - I would say that that is pretty unlikely as there are only a 
    few houses nearby and the others are about a mile away thru a heavily
    wooded area, but you never know - nor will we I guess!
    
    Thanks again,
    Sonia

    It's the heavily wooded area business that made me wonder if someone
    was setting animal traps in there for wild game.  I was concerned that
    he might get caught in a trap again, if that's what's going on.
    

    Wow,  I hope not!  My husband will kill me if he here's one more excuse
    for not letting them out.  As it is - I only let them out during the
    daytime & they stay right around the house & shoreline.  I'll keep an
    eye out.  
    
    Sonia

    This sounds similar to something that Percy had. He came in one day
    with a bald patch on the top of his head - no wounds, nothing, just a
    bald patch. The fur soon grew back. We put it down to a fight with
    another cat.
    
    Lisa plus Pookie and Rolf.
    

    Well, the vet (new, young, technical guy) said that it looked like a 
    skin disorder of some kind.  He thought that it might be "eosinophilic
    granuloma" (if that's spelled correctly - I can hardly read his
    writing).  He gave me an antibiotic that is given in drop form and also 
    some panalog cream to put directly on the wound.  He also said that if
    it didn't get better in a week, which he said that it probably wouldn't
    if it was what he thought it was - I would need to get him back to the
    vet to have him put on steroids & then drop him off one day for a
    "punch biopsy".  I don't want to do either of the last 2 steps, so I
    hope the cream & drops work.  In fact if they don't I'm going to
    request one of the other vets that I'm more familiar with & trust their
    judgement.
    
    Thanks again,
    Sonia
    
    P.S.  Has anyone had a pet w/ this disorder?

    Actually a punch biopsy, assuming its teh same as one done on humans
    is not a big deal.  I had one done once.  The doctor used a local a
    anesthetic and took a tiny piece out (think of the smallest
    pill you've ever seen, something like 1/8 inch in diameter.  He took 
    one stitch, but I suspect only because it was on my face.
      I guess they might
    have to give a cat a general anesthetic, but since there are locals
    that really totally numb teh area, I suppose it depends on the cat.
    
    re: percy's bald spot
    
    By coincidence I was asking my vet about the phenomenon of cats'
    shedding like crazy during visits to the vet's office, and what
    possible purpose this could serve from an evolutionary viewpoint,
    and he says that he often sees cats who have been in a fight and
    have had a hunk of their hair taken out but the skin underneath
    it totally undamaged, so the looseness of the hair under stress is
    a good thing.
    

    p.s.  they use a special tool that quickly "punches" out a piece,
    hence the name, so don't envision a long cutting process.  Hope nobody
    squeamish is reading this, oh, well, too late :-)

    re: .13 - if that's the case then sedation may be all thats required.
    General anesthesia always carries a risk so doctors - animal and human
    - only do it when its absolutely necessary.
      Nancy DC

    If the doc feels that a biopsy is called for, I would do it.  Granuloma
    is a word that is often associated with different types of cancer.
    It would be best to find out if this spot on your cat's face is
    cancerous or not.  
    
    Is your at white?
    
    Jo

    That last line should have said "Is your *cat* white?"
    
    Jo

    Hi Jo,
    
    No, he is a long haired gray & white Tabby of a sort.  
    
    The medication is healing the area (I think) - but the hair is not
    growing back!  I will get another opinion before going any further than
    the medication already prescribed as I just don't trust that new vet. 
    He hardly even looked at the are.  Although he did look inside Willy's
    mouth.
    
    Thanks again,
    Sonia

    It will take some time for the hair to grow back.  I had Kaitlin
    spayed in early May, and her tummy hair is just now starting to
    sprout to a noticeable length.
    
    The reason I asked if your cat was white is that they seem to be
    more sensitive to the sun, and have more problems with granulomas
    than other colors of outdoor cats.
    
    Jo

>    The reason I asked if your cat was white is that they seem to be
>    more sensitive to the sun, and have more problems with granulomas
>    than other colors of outdoor cats.
    
In fact, my vet mentioned that it was especially good that Hannah is
an indoor-only cat because she is mostly white (lynx point) and would
be VERY prone to skin cancer.  It seems that Dr. Lee is treating several
cases right now - and says if you must let a light-colored or mostly
white cat outside, it is important to use a good spray-on sun screen 
around the ears, head, and the back of the cat....of course, you need 
to be sure the cat won't lick it off and get sick.

One of my cats was diagnosed with Eosinophilic Granuloma Complex a few
months ago.  According to one of my cat books, vets aren't really
sure what causes it: could be an allergy (to something eaten, or breathed)
or it could be a virus.  Eosinophils are a type of white blood cell;
the cat's immune system is trying to fight off something it thinks has
invaded the body (allergy, virus, whatever) and these white blood cells
tend to collect in various parts of the body.

According to the book, it is quite common, and manifests itself in many ways 
(hence the word "complex").  My cat had one of the most common: lots of little 
scabs, lined up in a row, along the inner thighs of both hind legs.  Another 
common manifestation is the rodent ulcer (usually on the lower lip, I think).

My vet mentioned that steroids are one of the most effective treatments,
but he was reluctant to start out with that, so he put my cat on progesterone 
for several weeks to see if that would wipe out the problem.  It did, after 
only a week or two, but the vet had me continue to give my cat pills
for several weeks after that just to be sure.  He mentioned that for some
cats, this is a seasonal problem (so I'll be watching out for it next
spring!) but for others it never really goes away (some cats are on
a regular treatment of steroids).  Fortunately for my cat, that wasn't
the case.

While on the progesterone, he was definitely not himself: he ate more and
went from being a very active cat to a couch potato.  He gained a whole
pound in a month! But within a week of being off medication, he was his
active self again, and has been fine ever since (it's been over a month 
now since his last pill). 

I hope your cat recovers as quickly!

- Debbie.

P.S. The cat book I have is great: it's written by the Cornell University
Vet school which I believe has a cat clinic.  It's more a medical manual
than a cat care book -- it's great for looking up more detailed information 
on the diagnosis your vet has made, (and getting answers to the questions 
you didn't think to ask in the vet's office).

    Debbie,
    
    Thanks so much for your reply.  I have been wondering what exactly this
    disorder is.  What is the name of that book you have at home?  It
    sounds like a great reference source.  I would love to buy a book like
    that.
    
    The Vet I went to said that cats handle steroids better than dogs or
    humans, but it sounds like your cat had side effects.  I really hope I
    don't have to put him on steroids!  But, I will do whatever is
    necessary to help him.
    
    Thanks again (great info),
    Sonia

    Sonia,
    
    The book that the previous noter refered to is the Cornell Book
    of Cats, and you can get it for about $25 at the bookstore.  I bought
    my copy at a cat show for $22.  It really is a great book.
    
    Jo

    My husband bought me a great book called "The book of the Cat".  I will
    quote from it what it says about the "Eosinophilic granuloma":
    
      The commonly (but wrongly) termed rodent ulcer which may be seen on
    the top lip or elsewhere is not, unlike human disorder of the same
    name, cancerous.  The proper name for the condition is eosinophilic
    granuloma.  It responds well to steroid drugs and to cryosurgery (in
    which the ulcer-like growth is destroyed by freezing).  True cancerous
    mouth tumours are, unfortunately, quite common in cats, occurring
    mainly on the gums, tongue, tonsils, lips and nose.  They cause
    swelling, difficulty in eating and bleeding from the mouth.  Although
    they tend not to metastasize (spread to other sites in the body), they
    usually recur soon after removal.  In fact, removal is often not
    possible and the cat eventually has to be put down.
    
    Again, this is taken without permission from "The book of the Cat".
    
    Good FYI.
    Sonia

      Just wanted to let everyone know that Willy's boo-boo is healing up.
    He hates me giving him the medication by eye dropper, but he loves the
    cream that I put on him!  Hopefully it won't come back.
    
    Sonia

    Well, as of today - Willy has a bump on his lip in that same location.
    I'm very nervous and will take him to the Vet if it doesn't go away by 
    tomorrow.  This is really starting to sound like to "eosinophilic
    granuloma" now!  My poor Willy.
    
    Sonia

    Sonia,
    Thanks for referring me to this note!  It did give me more information
    and now I can perhaps add a little to it.
    
    DR. Holub gave Ruby an injection of cortisone the night I brought her
    in.  He strongly felt that it was E.P. even though we tested for
    ringworm.  Some of the above statements above were pretty much the same
    as his.  He did not want to give her Ovaban yet, too dangerous for a
    whole female (probably ok for a neuter/spay or male).  If her sore
    doesn't clear up in two weeks COMPLETELY, we will be giving her another
    shot and then possibly a third.
    
    The morning after she had her shot there was a noticeable difference!
    She seemed more like herself and not so fuzzy or plumped out.
    (Orientals usually look like little greyhounds and when they don't feel
    well they sort of get fuzzy and hunch up.) The sore had actually dried
    up and seemed to be shrinking in from the borders.  Every day now it
    has gotten better.  Hopefully, we won't need another shot.  They do say
    tho that it can recurr.  I want to show her again and thsi could be
    really bad.
    
    Another odd thing: the Dr. had mentioned something about the teeniest
    possibility of genetics.  Well, two days ago I found out that another
    cat (younger) related to her had developed what sound like a similar
    sore.  At this point I am waiting to hear what her diagnoses is.  It
    sounds to me like this is a new skin disease and could really use some
    research.
    
    Thanks again,
    Karen, Ruby, Stinky, Wing
    

    Was the related cat also a white?  I think that the link is in the
    color, not the genetic makeup.  Whites are more sensitive to skin
    problems.  I attended a seminar about skin disorders of cats once,
    and almost every slide that the vet showed us was a white cat. 
    One of the other attendees questioned that and we were told that
    the self whites are more susceptible than other colors of cats.
    
    Jo

    Little bit (a tabby) has a skin problem on his nose that the vet and
    I are watching.  Although he is a tabby, the fur on his nose is white,
    and it's easy to see how he could have gotten sun damage when he
    used to go outdoors.
    

    re: white cats - The vet told us the same thing about white dogs.
    

    and for white horses too.....

    Hi again,
    
    Well, I never should have cancelled that biopsy.  Willy's got another
    sore - the same as the 1 before.  It looks worse though!  Now I can't
    get another appointment till next week!  I'm considering calling
    another vet.  My Vet did not offer the cortisone shots.  They really
    need to do more research on this...
    
    I cancelled the biopsy the last time as the area had cleared up.  I
    didn't think that they could do a biopsy on a clear area - am I wrong?
    
    Thanks,
    Sonia

    That is a question for the vet to answer.  They may be able to identify
    abnormal cells under a microscope that you wouldn't be able to see
    yourself.
    
    I would plan on having the biopsy done this time.  I would also
    stick with the same vet for now, since he knows the history of the
    problem.  If he didn't offer the cortisone, there may be a reason.
    Ask him about it.
    
    Jo 

    What is the difference between E.P. & E.G.?  Also, what is Ovaban - is
    that another word for Steroids?
    
    Karen, how is Ruby doing?  Any other signs of this coming back?
    
    Thanks,
    Sonia

    Ovaban is female hormones.

    I believe that Ovaban contains steroids.  This is unconfirmed though.
    
    Jo

    Well, the results have come back that Willy has Eosonophilic Granuloma
    (sp)!  He will be going in every 2 weeks for 3 - 6 weeks for injections
    of steroids.
    
    Sonia

    re: .36 - isn't this the same thing that Ruby has?  (White oriental)