Conference misery::feline_v1

    Janice, KMR is a milk supplement especially for young kittens. 
    Your vet should carry it, or a local animal feed store.  Also, please
    consult your vet if the kitten is getting weak.  It doesn't take
    long for a little baby to dehydrate.
    

      They also have little tiny bottles with nipples that are designed to
    be used for itsy-bitsy kitties... We found an abandoned newborn about 6
    years ago and raised her on KMR and a 78 pound Girl-dog's tender
    love... This huge GSD cross took over the Mother role for this
    orphan...
      Most pet-food stores also carry KMR.. My suggestion is that you get
    the LIQUID rather than the powder, since the powder's a bit hard to 
    disolve completely... 
    
    JM

    And don't forget to help the kitten eliminate by licking
    its tummy! :-)
    
    Seriously, I had a abandoned newborn that I bottle fed with
    one of those special "kitten nursing bottles" available  from
    a pet-food store, and kitten formula. (don't remember if it
    was KMR).  After she was done eating, I had to rub her lower
    abdomen & privates with a warm, damp facecloth to stimulate
    her bowels to eliminate.  This is what mommy kitty does by
    licking. (I WASN"T going to lick the kitten, no matter what!:-)
    This was suggested by my vet.  A warm damp cottonball is ok, too.)
    Rub GENTLY, BTW.
    
    Good luck!
    
    L-          
    

    
    
    thank you all for your quick responses ... i'm not sure if i'll
    lick the tummy or not ... i don't like furry tongue, so i'll 
    probably opt for the warm cloth, too ... 8'P  slurp slurp
    
    i do have another question ... can i do this as a supplement to
    the kittens feeding, or should i take it on full-time after 
    starting it?  i don't really want to take it away from the mom
    completely, but i wonder if she'll treat it kindly ... she's
    always laying on it and i wonder if she's trying to kill it?
    if i do have to bring it to work with me maybe i should bring
    two so they'll keep each other warm?  
    
    i'm going to the pet store now and see about the KMR and the
    kitten bottles.  
    

    re .3/.4
    
     The "licking of the LOWER---MUCH LOWER---tummy also causes an almost
    INSTANT reaction...one you CERTAINLY wouldn't want to have your FACE
    anywhere near...(YECHHH!!).
    
      What my Girl-dog did was substitute for the mom-cat....but you gotta
    understand that what's wholesome and desireable to a dog isn't exactly
    the same to humans....to HER, re-cycled KMR was a treat...
    
    JM

    
    
    i guess i was an over-reacting 'grammy' ... i went home for lunch
    yesterday, with KMR and bottle in hand, and tried to feed the kitten
    in question (little nadine), but she didn't like it ... minutes later
    wanda came in and took over .. and it looked like nadine was in there
    with the best of them .. since then i have seen them all eating and
    wanda licks them, and i guess everything is normal after all..  it
    makes me feel much better..  now i know what to do 'if' a kitten
    isn't getting enough to eat 8'D  ... thanks for the info.
    
    janice
    

      RE .6
        WHEW!! Glad THAT's resolved!! It may have been the case that Wanda
    had some nipples that weren't giving milk for a time...this has
    happened in most mammals at times...but the stimulation from the
    nursing usually activates them... A cat SHOULD be able to care for as
    many as 10 or 12 kittens(depending on the health and size of the
    mother, of course..), so Wanda should have not problem now..
    
      Even if you DID have to feed one of the kittens, I think Wanda would
    have taken the responsibility for the "tummy-licking" on her own...
    
      But the bottomline is good...the baby is being taken care of!!
    JM

    
    
    wow, i didn't know that cats could accomodate so many ... the kittens
    are starting to open their eyes and a couple of them have the cutest
    purrs while they're eating ... sorta tinny little rattles ... soon
    they'll be out and about playing and getting into mischief ... i'm
    looking forward to that :'D  
    
    the big kitties love the kmr so it's not going to waste ... now i have
    a new treat for them.
    
    purrr purr
    janice
    
    

    HOW MANY KITTENS!!!   Good grief, Hallie is known for having big
    litters.  Can you imagine 10 scottish folds thundering around the
    house!!
      Nancy DC

    
    HeeHeeeheee,
    
    10 scottish folds thundering around the house?  Sounds like kitty
    heaven to me!!  (or an approching storm)  TeeHee,
    
    Feline Silly,
    
    

    > 10 scottish folds thundering around the house?  Sounds like kitty
    > heaven to me!!  (or an approching storm)  TeeHee,
    
        OR BOTH!

    Gee, and I thought 7 was bad!   It'll be kitty hell when they all get
    to be 6 weeks or so!  ;-)
    
    cin
    

    And I thought 5 was enough!  (It WAS) !!!!  It was soooo easy the
    first 4 or 5 weeks - I really thought there was 'nothin' to it!
    sigh.  
    
    Well, 2 of the 5 have 'new' homes - I still have 2 pretty little
    Exotic girls available if anyone is interested.  I'll probably
    bring them to the Salem MA show.  They are a busy threesome !!
    Who ever would have guessed that tiny kittens could be soooo
    messy !!
    
    E.T._learning_about_a_new_dimension_in_cleaning

     Cin , 7 four footed huggies.. hmm.. now I wonder where my special
    "jeans and sweat shirt are.. the ones with ALLLLLLLLL those ..
    p-o-c-k-e-t-s are.. hmm.. come see Auntie Kate, little huggy..
    Heh-Heh..  We had a "birthday  celebration for Preschie..
    she was 7 monthes on the 24th,, we did  it Friday.. while
    I was home.. Cin, ti just does not seem possible that
    she is 7 monthes old.. Btw.. i took her see Dr Eric,,
    she had  to have her stitches removed.. YEAH RIGHT.. she only
    had 2 out of 12 left.. the little dickens.. I suspect
    her and Happy   were "practicing medicene without a "kitty license"..
    Dr Eric was "quite surprised".. as a matter of fact.. he said.
    " hmm.. typically this 12 stitch, double stitch" works with kittens..
    hmm..apparently  not only is she a  cutie,, she is also quite
    a bit smarter than I thought.. ".. and of course during our
    entire conversation.. Preschie was purring away.. in his arms.. licking
    him, giving him kitty kisses.. hmm.. with that WHO ME?. I wouldNEVER
    NEVER DO ANYTHING LIKE THAT.. PURRRRRRR.. PURRRRRRRR..
    Kate

    Ah, I see Precious has been patronizing the
    "Mips and Belle Home Vetrinary Course" in
    stitch removal.  ;-)  ;-)
    
    We went through *two* sets. One set of
    dissolving stitches which were "dissolved"
    within 24 hours of arriving home, and a
    second set of stainless steel stitches
    of which Mips removed all but two by the
    time they were taken out!
    
    On the bright side, my vet is starting to
    take pity on me because I show up there so
    often!! ;-)
    
    Mary-Michael, Niniane,Charm,Dream,Boogie,Mips,Belle & Misha

     re.15 Hmmm.. I am quite sure the "little darling" gets by with a
    little(lot of ) help from her kitty friends.. MY Vet said.. she
    also  succeeded  in winning the "pity me award".. they had her out back
    in a cage,, and she would sit up with her back paws thru the bars..
    (Yes it is "family trait",, right Cin). and when the staff would
    walk by.. she would purrr and mew, and tap them with her front paws..
    as if to say.. Excuse me,, but I need to be picked up and loved..
    RIGHT NOW.. purrrrrr,, purrrrrrr.. so she spent 90 per cent
    of her visit in someones arms.. she did take a small nap and have
    beakies and lunch.. ( my friends Auntie Linda and Uncle Phil were
    here visiting so they picked her up.. after Lunch..) Auntie Linda
    said.. she was soooooo cute..  when they went to get her.., it
    was like .. OH yes,, the 2 "easy marks" are here.. I think I will
    really put on my act..HELP, purrrr..  purrrr.. they had poor  little
    me in a cage.. poor me.. purrrrrrrrr.. puuurrrrrrrr
    Kate

    
    
    hi again ... well, unfortunately all but one baby died.  it was heart-
    breaking ... the three seemed to be feeding one day and the next day
    one was dead and the other weak and one frisky???   i took the weak 
    one and tried feeding it with the bottle but he (sasquatch - an
    adorable double-pawed grey) didn't open his mouth ... i had to force
    him every time.  it was not fun ... he loved to be cuddled and purred
    every time i petted him .. he was promised to my friend anna, but if
    he had lived i don't think i could've parted with him.  
    
    the frisky one i'm feeding as a supplement to what little she gets
    from her mom (wanda) ... she's just over two weeks and walks ... and
    cuddles and is wonderful ... she's gonna make it no problem.  wanda 
    is still taking care of the potty detail and i was wondering how
    soon i should get her a dirt box?  when do they start to go on their
    own??  the vet says i can start to put some soft solid food in her
    formula at 21 days which is a bit early ... i'll see how wanda's one
    milk-producing nipple is holding out then (friday) ... 
    
    she walks to me and likes to snuggle on my neck ... she's a lovebug
    and i try to give her as much companionship as i can since her little
    brothers and sisters didn't make it.... and, cause it's fun.  
    
    
    anyway, i'm just curious about when kittens start to use a kitty box
    and not need the stimulation from mom.  
    
    a sad "grammy"
    
    janice,rocky,wanda and "lovebug" (still haven't decided on a good name
    for her ... she's gray on the back, white on the tummy and legs, with
    a couple yellow patches ... i anyone has any suggestions i'd like to
    hear them) thanks
    

    Sounds like Lovebug may be a dilute calico.  I love those.  Anyway,
    I usually keep a small litter tray really close to the birthing
    box so that the mom can show the kittens how to use it.  Mine start
    climbing in it at about 3 weeks old, and start munching litter.
    Don't worry if she eats litter, they almost always do and it doesn't
    hurt them.  They usually don't start going on their own until they
    are on solid food.  Once they go on food, mom won't want to clean
    them up anymore.
    
    I usually start making up plates of mush (canned cat food, plus
    some baby food, plus some water) when they are three weeks old.
    Since your momcat is having trouble with her milk, you could start
    the kitten on foods now.  They first few days they walk in it more
    than they eat it.  You have to dip your fingers in the stuff then
    rub it on their faces.  You can also dunk their little faces in
    the stuff to give them the idea, otherwise they seem to think that
    you want to hand feed them for the rest of your life. :^)  The hungrier
    the kitten is, the more successful the feeding will be, so don't
    try feeding her just after you have seen her nursing.  I try to
    catch them just as I see them all going looking for nipples.
    
    Jo

    
    
    re. 18 ... thanks jo ... guess i'll go get some baby food at lunch time
    on my way home for her noon meal ... she's insatiable so hopefully the
    solid food will satisfy her more.  this is gonna be fun ... i hope 
    she likes my 'cooking'.  
    
    janice/rocky/wanda/'lovebug' ;')
    
    

    
    
    well, i just got back from feeding my li'l lovebug ... i got some
    gerber strained turkey,beef and lamb ... started her off on a kmr
    and turkey 'shake' ... she loved it!!  i started by giving it to 
    her on my fingers and she did end up biting at my fingers trying
    to get the food, but due to the time factor and the fact she was
    wasting away to nothing i decided to make the shake ... she was
    quite the mess after her lunch, but mom enjoyed cleaning her up
    and wanted to finish off what was left on the dish (in fact she did
    when i wasn't looking).  since she loves to eat i think she'll pick
    it up in no time.  
    
    thanks again for the helpful tips everyone.  
    
    janice, rocky, wanda, and the lovebug (slurp)