Conference misery::feline_v1

I'm not entirely sure what kind of cat you're looking for, since there's no 
such thing as a "Tottypoint Siamese".

If you're talking about a Siamese-looking cat, with a mostly light, plain 
coat, and a Tortoise-shell pattern in the points (ears, mask, tail, feet) 
only, this is called a "Tortie Colorpoint Shorthair".

If you're talking about a Siamese-looking cat with a Tortoise-shell pattern 
all over, this is called a "Tortie Oriental Shorthair".

In note 315.20, there's the address and phone number of an OSH breeder.  
I'm not sure whether she also breeds Colorpoints, but if you gave her a 
call, she can tell you who else around here does.  She's also a real nice 
person to talk to.

Ray

    Well, according to my conversation with Ray, I am not looking for
    a siamese.  She looks like a siamese to me. :-)  Samantha is 4 months
    old, she is cream colored, she has brown points except for her feet.
    all four of her feet are pure white.  She also has a white splotch
    on her nose.  She has the siamese cry and the siamese disposition.
    Can anyone tell me what kind of cat she is and where I can get another
    one?  PLEASE!!
    
    Holly

    
    Holly,
    
    I don't know if this will help, but my sister's cat Chaka looks
    much like what you describe.  He is a Tabby/Himalayan hybrid. He
    has a chunky Persian sort-of body, green eyes, cream coat (shorthair)
    with brown (sealpoint) points and white socks.  You might check
    with the local animal shelters; Tabby/Siamese and Tabby/Himmie crosses
    can't be *that* unusual.
    
    Rita
    

Re: 0 and .1:

FYI, it is a Tortie point Siamese.  Several associations refuse to admit (read
politics) that Siamese breed true in tortie, lynx and a variety of other
"non-standard" colors.  The Colorpoint Shorthair breed is a Siamese whose
humans won't admit their heredity.  Genes are genes.

Why?  For some organizations the reasoning is based on international
considerations:  A "pure-line" Seal Point Siamese in Britain (known originally
as a Royal Point) will produce only Seals.  The points even show at birth.  So 
they say that these other variations were caused by introducing "non-Siamese"
crosses and they don't want their elite breed corrupted.  A valid point.

However, years ago USA breeders bred Siamese to produce a variety of colors
yielding the commonly known Blue, Lilac, and Chocolate Points in addition to 
Seal Point.   As an aside, the "points" may not show for several days, even 
weeks after birth.   

The story goes that this eventually resulted in tortie and lynx patterns.  When
these first appeared, they were sold as pets and not registered.  Later several
breeders bred for these patterns and felt since they breed true that they
should be considered Siamese.  Another valid point.  Hence the battle. 

This has happened in several other breeds also ... as a recent example, look 
at the "new" colors being recognized for the Aby breed.  These have been around 
for years and hidden from the public.

Whether you call it a Siamese or a Colorpoint Shorthair, it's still the same
cat.  I don't know any breeders of Tortie Point Siamese/CPSH off-hand.  If you
pick up a cat magazine and look for breeders in the back, look under these
"two" breed headings. 

re:  Rathole coninues...

I made the "political" point to Holly when I had her on the phone.  In my 
experience, it's the old-line breeders and the registries and standards 
that say that "Siamese only come in sealpoint, bluepoint, chocolatepoint, 
and lilacpoint.  Everything else is an abomination."  It's even worse than 
Matt said.  For example, it's genetically possible to get all of the 
standard Siamese colors from breeding Colorpoint Shorthairs.  These cats 
are *indistinguishable* from canonical Siamese, both genetically and 
physically.  Yet, they can't be registered as Siamese some places! 
Amazing... 

More to the point, from Holly's physical description, her cat sounds more 
like a creampoint, but might be someone's experiment (read "accident"), 
and not a recognized breed at all.

In any event, this'll only be settled when someone with a practiced eye 
sees the cat, or a good picture.

Here's my referral:

	CHINACAT Cattery -- Siamese, Orientals, Colorpoints, & Ocicats
	Bobbi Beyer
	Box 188
	Hudson, NH  03051
	603-882-8814

Bobbi's another very nice person.  She goes to many of the local shows.

Ray