Conference back40::soapbox

	With a reported IQ of 140, one would think she could remember
	that the underwear goes on first, _then_ the clothes.

	<grin>..... 

        re: IQ

    just goes to show that education does not necessarily equal common
    sense (or decency for that matter)....


    jim

    i think Madonna is immoral and therefore should be  a) spanked and then
    b) made illegal :-)

    spanked ?? spanked ???
    
    did i miss something ?
    
    ric
    :-)

	Chip, if she is immoral, and we spank her, what will that make us?
Maybe our immoral expert Jeff Benson can help us with this one.


Glen

    -1 why righteous, of course... :-)

| <<< Note 307.7 by WMOIS::GIROUARD_C >>>


| -1 why righteous, of course... :-)

	Even if we enjoy it?

    Glen:
    
    You're full of it.  Connie Francis had more number 1 hits than
    Madonna!!

| <<< Note 307.9 by MKOTS3::JMARTIN "You-Had-Forty-Years!!!" >>>


| You're full of it.  Connie Francis had more number 1 hits than Madonna!!

	Aparently not Jack. In fact, Connie would have to rank no better than
3rd, cause Whitney is #2 with 12.


Glen

SOURCE: Billboard Magazine

    yup Glen, even if we enjoy it. it's our inalienable right to pursue
    happiness. it's even in the Constitution! :-) 

	Chip.... should you be combining the Constitution in with Religion? One
is correct, while the other one is sometimes Right. :-)

that last single she had out was dreadful, the one about being unconscious
or whatever (I'm sure it plaigarises something, but I can't remember what
offhand).  Huh huh... that one sucks!  huh huh huh...

Chris.

    There's no doubt about it, Madonna is smart and talented. If only she
    could phrase better when she sings.

    Does she really have an IQ of 140? That's pretty intelligent.

    Glenn

| <<< Note 307.13 by COSME3::HEDLEYC "Lager Lout" >>>


| that last single she had out was dreadful, the one about being unconscious
| or whatever 

	Chris, unconscious? I thought that was a morning after thing with
her.... (God, we're both naked. Does that mean we did.... I must have been
unconscious!!!!)


Glen

| <<< Note 307.14 by POLAR::RICHARDSON "Ooo Ah silly me" >>>

| There's no doubt about it, Madonna is smart and talented. If only she could 
| phrase better when she sings.

	And if she could put the words together better too!

| Does she really have an IQ of 140? That's pretty intelligent.

	Combined you got everyone beat!

She could be nocturnal I suppose...

Chris.

    It's not the words, it's the air.

	Yeah, and if you couldn't see that she was arguing with Letterman for
publicity, then it's understandable why you might not believe she has an IQ of
140.


Glen

    Doesn't mean she doesn't have a high IQ.

    I've met some incredibly brilliant people who don't have a clue where
    they are on the planet.

    
     I couldn't care less about Maddonna..
    
    Don't listen to her music, don't watch her.. don't read about her...
    
    Don't care...

| <<< Note 307.21 by POLAR::RICHARDSON "Ooo Ah silly me" >>>


| I've met some incredibly brilliant people who don't have a clue where
| they are on the planet.

	Yes, you've met me.... :-)

| <<< Note 307.22 by SOLVIT::KRAWIECKI "Be vewy caweful awound Zebwas!" >>>


| I couldn't care less about Maddonna..
| Don't listen to her music, don't watch her.. don't read about her...
| Don't care...


	Andy, for once I agree with you 100%!  But we are talking about Madonna
here...... 

    .0
    
    nobody, not even madonna, ever went broke underestimating the taste of
    the public.

    
    
    OK, who let Rodenhiser into Glen's account?
    
                                    (note the proper use of the
                                     apostrophe!)
    
    
    W.
    

Talking of interviews, the ones that I've seen/read give the impression
that she's a deeply unpleasant and self centred old cow, although
I guess that may in part also be a product of her publicity machine...

Chris.

| <<< Note 307.25 by SMURF::BINDER "vitam gustare" >>>

| nobody, not even madonna, ever went broke underestimating the taste of
| the public.

	Ever hear of Andrew Dice Clay? He's pretty broke...

    
    
    
    Are you his accountant?

    
    Sharon Stone has a cuter face than Madonna.
    

    .30
    
    yeah poor Madonna is sliding down the boinkability scale
    
    from watching "In Bed with ..." she strikes me as one sad girl trapped
    on the treadmill and not enjoying it particularly
    
    she is talented inasmuch as she writes good songs that often reflect a
    current trend or indeed start a new trend
    
    ric

    >Glen:
    
    >You're full of it.  Connie Francis had more number 1 hits than
    >Madonna!!
    
    Bzzzzt. Sorry, but Madonna had 11 number 1 hits, making her the
    number 1 number 1 (among females anyway). Connie Francis had 8
    number 1 hits, making her a distant fourth.
    
    -b

    
    Maddonna... Madonna.... Shladdonna... Blondonna....
    
    Who cares?
    

    Sorry...I was going on documentation I had from 8 years ago.
    
    Top three American artists with number 1 hits...
    
    1. Elvis
    2. Rickey Nelson
    3. Connie Francis

This Madonna, she's a performer or something?

    
    yes..and she wears very "pointy" bras.
    
    

    
    Joanne
    
    or something

    > yes..and she wears very "pointy" bras.
    
     Thus terrorizing fellow lifeboat occupants. ;-)

    Or waterbed occupants.

    Speaking of the pointy bra thing...my 4 year old daughter Krystin was
    channel surfing a few weeks ago and came across MTV.  Madonna was on
    with one of her outrageous outfits and Krystin says, "Mommy, is that a
    bra?"
    
    Me:  "Well honey, it's supposed to be".
    Krystin: "How come you don't have one like that?"
    Me: "I don't want one"
    Krystin:  "Yeah, it looks like it hurts"
    
    
    

    I wonder if they issue safety glasses to short people before Madonna
    walks into the room...
    
    -b

    re the pointy bras
    
    does she still do this ? thought that was 1990 or thereabouts
    
    ric

    I saw her on David Letterman the famous time when she was cursing up a
    storm ('F'...) and refusing to leave, and being a poor interviewee
    (sp?) and thought, well, so much for her careeer!  I couldn' believe
    Dave brought her back again.  How did that one go?  

 They could take Madonna, Beavis and Butthead, and MTV and toss them
 all over a cliff and I don't think the world would miss them for more than
 a second or 2.




 Jim

    <--- You wouldn't but the world would and replacements would be quickly
    found.

    
    
    i am a fan.  have been since her 'holiday' days.  probably will be for
    a very long time.  just bought her 'bedtime stories' cd.  not bad.  i am 
    not saying i like or agree with everything she does.  just that i like a 
    good portion of her music.
    
    

>    <--- You wouldn't but the world would and replacements would be quickly
>    found.


  That's the scary part..

	Her music isn't bad, but what she does sometimes just makes
me want to hold her in contempt of life.

ME

    Or just hold her. ;-)

    
    does she still grab her crotch?
    
    inquiring mindless people would like to know.

| <<< Note 307.33 by SOLVIT::KRAWIECKI "Be vewy caweful awound Zebwas!" >>>


| Maddonna... Madonna.... Shladdonna... Blondonna.... Who cares?

	The other ones I agree, but Madonna???? :-)

    I love her music, but can't stand her.
    
    My hubby says that only 3 words comes to mind when he looks at her...
    
    
    Sexually Transmitted Diseases !
    
    
    

| <<< Note 307.32 by MPGS::MARKEY "Calm down: it's only 1s and 0s" >>>


| Bzzzzt. Sorry, but Madonna had 11 number 1 hits, 

	I heard on the radio this morning 13, but someone else sent me mail
saying the same thing (11). 

| making her the number 1 number 1 (among females anyway). 

	My friend also told me she ranks 3rd for most #1 hits. But I don't know
if that's for non-group arrrrteeests or not. (aka solo :-)

| Connie Francis had 8 number 1 hits, making her a distant fourth.

	Who's 3rd? The lady with legs like butta?

    I don't find her particularly attractive. Never have, never well.
    Not a female sex symbol by any stretch of the imagination. Seems
    to routinely find unattractive hair cuts and wear clothes that
    while intended to be sexy, suggest images of household appliances.
    
    Her voice is adequate, and has been used to good advantage by
    the _real_ talent behind Madonna: Patrick Leonard. The fact that
    he has squeezed so much out of a women with relatively little
    natural talent or training is more an indication of his talent
    than hers.
    
    Favorite Madonna songs:
    
    		- Justify My Love
    		- Remember (from "With Honors")
    		- Spanish Lullaby
    		- Live to Tell (I think that's the name... it's
                  from a movie soundtrack with Christopher Walken
                  and Sean Penn).
                - Borderline
                - Vogue (extended dance mix)
    
    -b

    
    I agree with Glenn, she's got lousy breath control.  The only support
    she has is in her underwear 8^).

| <<< Note 307.55 by POWDML::LAUER "Little Chamber of Fuzzy Faces" >>>


| I agree with Glenn, she's got lousy breath control.  

	Then maybe she should buy Certs?



Glen

    RE: Breath control
    
    She did a live concert from Australia that was on HBO. She had a live
    band and as best as I could tell was also singing live. What struck
    me was that she did not stand still for the entire affair. Every
    song was choreographed (difficuly choreography too), and she managed
    to bounce around for two hours _and_ sing. While not breath control,
    I will say that she is in superb physical shape and being able to
    do this suggests someone who does works _very_ hard at was she
    does.
    
    -b

>    I will say that she is in superb physical shape and being able to
>    do this suggests someone who does works _very_ hard at was she
>    does.

Like Hulk Hogan.

    Yes, like Hulk Hogan... and your point is... ?
    
    -b

    A blurb on the recently released "Encyclopedia Madonnica" (I don't know
    who wrote it) mentioned some pointed advice she had for Paula Abdul,
    who was embarking on her first tour.   She said if Abdul was going to
    try to sing for real, she should stand still, because it's not easy.
    
    I don't care much for her fashion sense.  She looks best in the classic
    40s mode, like in the Vogue video.  She has good bone structure.

    Hulk Hogan is doing concerts?

| <<< Note 307.61 by POLAR::RICHARDSON "Ooo Ah silly me" >>>


| Hulk Hogan is doing concerts?

	Yeah.... but his stage name is Billy Idol!

    I have been a fan of Madonna's for a long time.  If you've never seen
    her perform live, you've never seen a live show.  The amount of work
    that goes into her shoes is _amazing!!!_.  She does not hold back on
    anything...dance, costume, lights, etc.  She gives herself completley to
    her audience (ahem).
    
    Her voice is weak live.  She sounds much better after she's been
    through the boards a couple of times.  But you've got to hand it to
    her, she's incredibly talented as a dancer, a PR queen and an
    entertainer.
    
    More power to her (as if she needed anymore)
                                                                       

    I've never really taken notice of Madonna's shoes before.

| <<< Note 307.64 by POLAR::RICHARDSON "Ooo Ah silly me" >>>

| I've never really taken notice of Madonna's shoes before.


	I have....

    
    ....are they pointed like her bra things?
    

    >I have been a fan of Madonna's for a long time.  If you've never seen
    >her perform live, you've never seen a live show.
    
    Well, I have seen her live show (on TV) and it was OK, but I've
    seen much better shows, frankly. That's not to say I wasn't
    impressed with some aspects of it (as in her ability to dance
    _and_ sing, as I mentioned earlier), but all that stuff doesn't
    add up to the "greatest show on earth" to me.
    
    I've seen many concerts that impressed me more than Madonna.
    Gentle Giant took my breath away, and they didn't dance at
    all. Dave Brubeck with Christopher Hogwood and the Handel
    and Haydn Society was pretty damn impressive too, again
    sans dance. Max Roach at Sonny's in NYC was a real trip, and
    Queen was pretty mind-boggling too. And of course, Peter
    Gabriel's Secret World tour was certainly no slouch!!!
    
    -b

>>    If you've never seen
>>    her perform live, you've never seen a live show.

	This has to be hyperbole, because otherwise it's laughable.

  I thought Madonna was pretty good in "A league of their own" and she was also
pretty good in "Desperately seeking Susan". Some of her other stuff was pretty
bad. 

  Her kinky sex act is tons of fun and really seems to get blood vessels
popping in a certain segment of the population. 

  As for her music, it's ok. They make a good background for her rock videos
which tend to be better than average. 

  George

    <--- This troubles me.

    
    Well Glenn, if ever given the chance I would snarf Madonna anytime.
    Hoppe this helps

    Hoppe so too!

    .38  Levesque
    
    Gary Larson does have the best bead on Madonna; that Far Side
    Cartoon from Sept. 10/11 '94 is definitely a keeper ;-}  
    
    I enjoyed Vogue, but basically I think she is another triumph of
    packaging over talent.
    
    

    She manages to keep in style with modern times...which is somewhat
    frightening if you really look at her, her videos or her live
    performances.

    .57
    
    (Sorry for the delay, I've been working)
    
    I certainly wouldn't complain about her breath control during a live
    show.  I realize she dances.
    
    What bothers me is her breath control, support and phrasing during
    numbers recorded in a studio.  Unless you're telling me she dances
    during recording sessions?

    No, Deb, I'm not arguing with your critique of her technique. I
    was only pointing out that she does appear to have worked on a
    certain aspect of technique a great deal, to the point that I
    was impressed by it.
    
    -b

RE      <<< Note 307.76 by POWDML::LAUER "Little Chamber of Fuzzy Faces" >>>

>    What bothers me is her breath control, support and phrasing during
>    numbers recorded in a studio.  Unless you're telling me she dances
>    during recording sessions?

  Most popular singers have lousy breath control.

  At least by opera standards,
  George

    
    
    <-- well there you go comparing apples to oranges...
    
    

    
    Is that "orrranges" or "arrranges"?

	Are we in the orchards again??? 

    Grove y man grove y.

    She certainly looked good standing on that car in Body of Evidence. 
    Wonder how many takes William Dafoe flubbed on purpose? What an actor
    to try and remember what he was to do next. Have always enjoyed her
    music videos. How long has she been around as a star performer? Like
    her or not, she's successful. Thought she was ideal for her part in
    Dick Tracy. Better to see her dancing  and singing than having to
    listen to or watch some of the other boring singers. Got a lot of fans
    so she's doing something right.
    

    After the Brit-awards she stated that she wasn't pregnant. 
    Who ( or what) would be the perfect father would for her child ?
    
    ..Mc
     

    isn't D. Rodman trying out for that part?
    
    actually, i heard (on some show) that Rodman is playin' hard to get and
    Madonna is chasing... there's a pair that would beat a full house!
    
    Chip 

    
    well, I like her music and think alot of her actions are PR related, it
    does keep her in the public eye. I do think she would be a very fun
    date. She will eventually settle down and get married, as to whom is
    the question.
    
    Mark

	If you look at the tv shows, how many of them have you heard her name
on? I know when I was dating my ex, who absolutely LOVES Madonna, I heard her
name just about every week. Even on the X-Men once! 


Glen

    Re: .86
    
    >She will eventually settle down and get married, as to whom is
    >the question.
    
    The name Sean Penn ring a bell?

    If the father is Dennis Rodman, I wonder what color the
    baby's hair will be! :-)
    
    -b

    >she will eventually settle down and get married
    
    what, like a good little girl??!  sheesh.

    
    Chelsea,
    
    She is no longer married to Sean Penn.

| <<< Note 307.88 by OOTOOL::CHELSEA "Mostly harmless." >>>


| The name Sean Penn ring a bell?

	Well, she married him, but she never settled down. :-)

    Re: .91
    
    >She is no longer married to Sean Penn.
    
    Well, duh.

    
    Sean Penn, was he like an actor, or something

	One with a temper!

    -.2
    
    		No!

    Sean Penn (most notably of "Falcon and the Snowman" fame, also
    appeared in a movie with wife-to-be Madonna called "Shanghai
    Surprise" that made many golden turkey award lists), brother
    of actor Christopher Penn ("Bill and Ted's Excellent Adventure"),
    and singer Michael Penn.
    
    -b

    
    Re: .93
    
    gee Chelsea, when I grow up, i want to be just like you, arrogant,
    overbearing, and know-it-all.
    
    Mark

>>    of actor Christopher Penn ("Bill and Ted's Excellent Adventure"),

	I'll bet he'd rather people associated him with "Reservoir Dogs",
	"Short Cuts", e.g.  ;>

    Madonna SNARF.

    >	I'll bet he'd rather people associated him with "Reservoir Dogs",
    >	"Short Cuts", e.g.  ;>
    
    Granted, I just figured for a quick one-liner that most people
    would have heard of, B&TEA was a good choice. Frankly, I had
    forgotten about Reservoir Dogs though... that probably would
    have been the better example.
    
    -b

    
    Wasn't Christopher Penn in _Footloose_ also?

    
    Yes

    
    Also in Mobsters

    Re: .98
    
    >arrogant, overbearing, and know-it-all.
    
    You got all that from two words?  Gracious.  Next time I'll include a
    lecture on the kind of intellect that would find it necessary to tell
    me that Madonna is no longer married, and we'll see how many adjectives
    you manage to extract from that.
    
    You got off lightly.  Live and learn.

    
    S'right Mark!!!
    
    You coulda got the whips and chains and stiletto heels!!!
    
    
    Be greatful!! ;)
    

    
    Oh great Chelsea!!!!!! Who in the hell said I was talking to you
    when i wrote that reply?? Are you always this pompous, or is it
    just me?
    
    Mark

    
    <-------
    
    It's you Mark.... go back and read .98 and see if there's any else
    around here named Chelsea...
    
     Unless of course you were refering to Billary's kid...
    

	She's on the radio!!!!!!!  

    She's on the refrigerator!!!!!

    Re: 107
    
    >Who in the hell said I was talking to you when i wrote that reply??
    
    You did.  Your .91, in its entirety:
    
    |Chelsea,
    |
    |She is no longer married to Sean Penn.
    
    Quit while you're behind.

    
    which penn was in 'fast times at ridgemont high' (along with a bunch of
    other now pretty well-known actors)???
    
    

    Sean Penn (and Pheobe Cates, Judge Reinhold, Eric Stoltz)

	Let's not forget his prison movie, Bad Boys. What he did with a pillow
case and about 10 cans of coke was painful......

    
    <-- I'm definitely intrigued by this!
    
    What DID he do?

    beat the crud out of the bad guys, of course.
    (He learned how from Madonna)

    Quit talking about The Fallen Madonna (with the big boobies)

    he loaded up a pillow case with about 10 cans of soda and waited for
    these two punks to come and get him. he tee'd off on 'em both big
    time.
    
    he wasn't too bad in that.
    
    i thought he stunk in the move with M.J. Fox (can't remember the name
    of the movie) as a Viet Nam soldier.
    
    Chip

    .97
    
    hey, i was in "Shanghai Surprise" as an extra ! filmed some scenes at
    Shepperton studios.
    
    she was a good looking gal then (just started working out so was pretty
    sleek but not yet too muscly)
    
    how's i know that was :-
    
    the scene being filmed was a street market scene and cos the conditions
    were so cramped, they were using radio mikes instead of the ones on
    booms. so there we were milling around when suddenly it's "cut cut
    Madonna's mike isn't working". these technicians swarm out from behind
    the scenery and proceed to pull Madonna's costume (nurse's outfit
    oo-er) up over her head to get at the mike giving yours truly a great
    glimpse of all this superstar flesh from about 4 yds away.
    
    sigh
    
    ric

    
    >>(and Pheobe Cated, Judge Reinhold, Eric Stoltz)
    
    
    you also forgot courtney thorne-smith (or is it smith-thorne) and
    jennifer jason lee...
    
    
    and i saw bad boys a couple of times...it was a pretty good movie,
    actually, even if it was a bit gory at times...
    
    

    I think Madonna should have children and be a good wife.
    
    Instead of acting like a brazen jezebel.
    

>  <<< Note 307.117 by SNOFS1::DAVISM "And monkeys might fly outa my butt!" >>>
>                                 -< Talk Hard >-

>    Quit talking about The Fallen Madonna (with the big boobies)
        
        gawd! That was one of the funniest Brit-coms ever!
        
        Andy
        

	What's wrong with being a jezabel?

    
    
    jean liked her...
    
    

    <---- :-) :-) :-)

    .21
    
    Tee Hee Tee Hee Tee Hee Tee Hee Tee Hee Tee Hee Tee Hee!!!!!

    
    {ahem}  "Gene".

    {ahem} I don't think so Mz. Deb. Raq was referring to Jean Loves
    Jezibel, the group that did "been caught stealing". Their name
    is actually something to do with smack (heroin), but I forget
    exactly what... Perry Farrel, the JLJ front man, now fronts
    Porno for Pyros, who I happen to like quite a bit (especially
    the song "Pets").
    
    -b

    
    I'll doublecheck my button when I get home tonight.  

    Thats Janes Addiction Bri that Perry fronted.
    Peter

    Oh man... I picked a really bad day to give up LSD! :-)
    
    You're right of course. Just hand me the dunce cap now
    and be done with it.
    
    -b
    
    (I'm shutting up now before I have Kurt Cobaine fronting Pearl Jam)

    
    um, yes, deb...i wasn't refering to our gene, but the one -b
    mentioned...so there %^pPpPpPpPpPpPpppp....
    
    (wow...who would have thunqed it...you correcting me...and were
    wrong...)
    
    ;> ;> :>
    
    

    Uh oh Raq. I gots bad news for you. I went and looked over
    in the MUSIC conference, of course _the_ most comprehensive
    source of musical information in the known universe, and
    it is, in fact, Gene Loves Jezebel. I think we both better
    quit while we're ahead.
    
    And, of course, apologies to Mz. Deb... appropriate groveling
    will ensue at a later time.
    
    -b

    
    Raqhoney, you may come over and grovel any time now 8^).
    
    Bri, I'll accept yours later on 8^).

    Can I borrow your new knee pads? :-)
    
    -b

    
    -b
    
    Sucking up big time -b

    {wooooooooooooooosh}

    <------- what's that the sound of?

    
    
    Sucking up big time???
    

    I thought he was having a five knuckle shuffle.

    Madonna has a new movie coming out!  Madonna has a new movie coming out!  
    Madonna has a new movie coming out!  Madonna has a new movie coming out!  
    
    Tank Girl, look for it at a reputable theater near you, or don't.  This
    is one I am sure to miss. 

	If Madonna is in it Brian, then there will be no Miss..... 

    > what's that the sound of?
    
    It's the sound of sucking up big time, as Andy explained, after
    screwing up not once, but _twice_, in the same note. On music
    related subjects which is supposed to be something I know
    about. I'm still rather red-faced, I'm afraid.
    
    -b

    
    as well you should be -b

    She should stop acting like a painted hussy,then perhaps she could get
    a nice boyfriend.
    
    Could I now spark a conversation about Wayne Hussey of the Mission?
    
    Or perhaps he sang for The Cure. Oh,no er,perhaps it was Spear of
    Destiny. Er,or Sisters of Mercy.
    

    She should stop acting like a cheap tramp,and show some respect to her
    mother.
    
    Super Tramp are a good band - and what band was Frank Zappa in?
    Er,Mothers of Invention I beleive.
    
    oh dear.
    

    Frank Zappa was not "in" Mothers of Invention. Mothers of Invention
    was Frank's band. There's a difference, ya know.
    
    -b

    
    er Stu, you been hitting the bottle a little early today?? :-)
    
    Mark

    
    her mother is dead...has been for nearly 30 years...
    
    

    In that case,she should show some respect to her father.
    
    Mind you,her papa does preach,and she`s being losing sleep,`cos she`s
    keeping her baby.
    
    I think I should go home. It`s been a long week.
    

    Hey, Madonna has always been my lucky star.  Everytime I hear her music
    it touches me like the very first time.  And yes, I do believe in love
    and I have something to say about it.  However, I have never been in love
    with San Pedro, I don't care where the party is, and my father never
    preached to me cause I never got in trouble deep.  Some boys hate me
    some boys love me and I think that's OK, cause just like a prayer thier
    love keeps on pushing my love over the borderline.  
    
    MJ
    
    

	That sent me deeper and deeper into laughter. good one!

    
    .151
    
    did you think of that little ditty all by yourself?
    
    Mark

    Well, uh (look down at floor), gee, (shuffle feet), yeah.  I mean,
    (smily shyly) yes.

    .151
    
    I don't understand it... you are like in love with Madonna?

    Uh, like, no.

    Why not?
    

    Well, Madonna's purty and all, but I tend to like gentlemen callers.
    
    MJ (Mary Jo)

    Well, then that explains it.
    
    Glad to meet another nongay.
    
    And Glen, I didn't say "meat".
    
    Glenn

    <------- (giggle)

    ahhhh... mj, mary jo :-)

    .151 Excellent! Didn't miss much with that one.
    

    
    er like Nancy, please feel free to take this clue. .151 was like
    words from alot of Madonna's songs. Not quite as funny when you have to
    explain it.
    
    Mark

    .151
    
    brill  - didja really do that yourself ?
    
    ric$admiringly
    

    re .163
    
    Are you saying that I'm not funny?   Twenty paces and draw!!!
    
    MJ

    
    re 165>
    
    er MJ.. please reread the note again, I was referring to Nancy Morales,
    not getting your little ditty in 151. HTH
    
    Mark

	Hey, guess who is at #1 again on the pop chart???? I'll give you a
hint.... it's MADONNA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Nope Mark you were definitely telling MJ she wasn't funny.

    
    Wasn't.

         88888888888                      PPPPPPPPPPPPPPP
	8888888888888                    PPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP
       888	   888                   PP              PP
       888	   888                   PP              PP
       888	   888                   PP             PP
       888	   888                   PPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP
       888	   888  --------------   PPPPPPPPPPPPPPP
       888888888888888  --------------   PP
       888	   888  --------------   PP
       888	   888                   PP
       888	   888                   PP
       888	   888                   PP
       888	   888                   PP
	8888888888888                    PP
         88888888888

    
    My, my, what a tongue.

    Why the better to lap you with my dear....

    
    
    
    
    				omigawd
    
    
    

    
    mj and Glenn (18 others)
    
    I was referring to Nancy, please reread the note. I said its not as
    funny when you have to explain what mj wrote. Now, this is the last
    time I will explain this, understand??? :-) :-) :-) I personally
    thought .151 was creative and funny, ok mj?
    
    Mark

    
    
    		I always suspected you had a good sense of humor! :')
    
    		MJ

    
    Personally, I was going to suggest resolving this with pointy
    bras at 20 paces.
    
    

    
    oh dear (tm)

    .174
    
    ????

    
    Oh no, Nancy's not keeping up again 8^).

    .151  I just read it, it is funny!
    
       Rosie

    
    <------ You bet your bippy

    Is a bippy a pointed bra?

    
    er no, it is slightly lower, found on the backside, some people
    have their brains there. HTH
    
    Mark

    SSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS	SSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
    liding right on outta here... [blush]

    I'll see your bippy and raise you another.

    
    You can see Mark's bippy? Were there any cactii nearby?
    
    -b

    
    
    	Well, not exactly near _by_............ ;')

    
    just remember, the cactus is our friend

    
    	And a friend in the rear is a friend so dear.

    {cough}  But....

    
    spit it out already Glenn!!

    It was a play on words Mudstuffin.
    
    ;-)

    
    	butt...{ahem}

    
    well bust my glutious maximus

    gluteus

    
    I simply must start using spellchecker, I must........

    	
    	I must...I must...I must increase my...oh forget it.
    

    lust?

 Like a snarf

    Snarfed for the very first time...

	Well, Madonna is at #1 again. This makes 3 weeks now. Projections are
for her to spend 1-3 more weeks there. 

	Her album went double platinum as well. Nice to see it's doing so well. 



Glen

 Big deal

    
    RE: .202
    
    Well woop-de-doo....

| <<< Note 307.203 by CSLALL::HENDERSON "Friend will you be ready?" >>>


| Big deal

	I'm glad you agree Jimbo! :-)

    Way to go Madonna!  You deserve it!  You _are_ number one and
    absolutley deserve all the fame and fortune you have raked in over the
    years.  No one deserves it more then you.  I applaud you and every
    number one smash you've ever had!  Keep up the good wo....HELP ME!  I
    CAN'T STOP WRITING GOOD THINGS ABOUT MADONNA!
    

    Do like I do.
    
    Glenn/Deirdre/Pamela/Franny/Ned/Dierdre/Anton/Sean/Alice/Jimi/Pauline/Rex/
    Nathan/Melanie/Ursula/Hildegard/Nigel/Boutros Boutros/Leslie
    

    re: .206
    
    I'm getting Rodenheiser flashbacks...  (I know, I probably mis-spelt
    his name...)

>>                                -< rodenhieser >-

	really??  so it's pronounced roden-hee-zer?

    

    
    
    		Pray tell, who is he?

    I was close...I almost spelt it the other way.  8^)

    well, he who spelt it....

    >>>I must...I must...I must increase my...oh forget it.
    
    
    i take it you, too, read judy blume...
    
    
    :>
    

    
    
    	I haven't read Ms. Blume since I was in bloom.  
    	Thanks for the memory!
    

    
    
    ya mean 'mammory'???
    
    

    
    
    "Are you there God? It's me, MArgaret"
    
    
    
    
    :*)
    Terrie
    

    
    
    	"Then again, maybe I won't..."
    
    

    
    
    thank you terrie...i have been trying to remember the name of that book
    since yesterday...
    
    
    one of my favs growing up... ;>
    
    -raq
    

    
    	Mammories...like the corners of my mind....

    >>  -< the corners of one's chest, methinks >-
    
    
    ...only when i am laying (or lying) down...
    
    
    

    _Mammy_, Glenn's teasing me again! >-
    
    

    
    not only that, he's jousting with you as well.

    Now joust a minute!!!!

	Madonna had a pajama party this weekend with 1500 fans. And you people
thought she didn't wear pajamas!!!  I do hope she didn't poke anyone in the eye
with her cones though....


Glen

    
    Yea, I saw some of it on MTV.  Madonna read a bedtime story about a
    spider who invited all these bugs to tea.  Naturally, no bug would
    stick around, rightfully distrusting the nature of the spider. 
    Finally, a wet, helpless moth had no choice but to accept the spider's
    kindnesses and when it discovered how kind the moth was it went and
    told everyone.  Eventually bugs flocked to her tea party enjoying the
    finest delectables while the spider ate flower blossoms, sparing her
    guests.  The moral of the story was not to judge a bug before you know
    her.  I suspect Madonna sees this ridiculous story as analogous to
    herself.  Only one problem, spiders always eat their prey.
    
    She's lost the cones and now goes for the more natural look.  Her new
    video/song (Let's Get Unconscious?) was premiered.  The song is not to
    my taste but the video is pretty good, very surrealistic, which means it
    doesn't make a lot of sense but is interesting to look at.  Naturally,
    she's proud of it.
    
    Madonna may enjoy her fans but I think she really just enjoys their
    adoration.  She's obviously much brighter than her average fan.
    
    Madonna is interesting to a degree.  She, through cunning, ambition and
    intelligence has maneuvered her way to the top.  Yet she takes herself
    very seriously and wants others to as well.  She's an enigma.  Yet I
    can't help but sense a great lonliness and lack of fulfillment in her.
    
    jeff

    I saw some of her pj party also.  As always, I was impressed by her. 
    She's got this amazing new video, a number one hit, holds the record
    for the most number one hits ever by a female solo artist and is about
    to start shooting Evita in the starring role.  Wow.  I didn't get to
    hear the story cause I had to run off to the theatre, but I would guess
    that she's a spider when she wants to be.
    
    MJ

    
    I am truly appalled that Madonna would be cast as Evita 8^p.  How
    Hollywood can you get?

    Mz. Deb, I agree. And I'll also predict that the movie will be a
    major bust due to this ridiculous decision. The critics loath
    Madonna in movies; and with good reason. How any producer could
    get talked into such an obviously bad choice is beyond me...

    -b

	Deb, you lost out to Madonna...right? :-)

    
    <-- 8^)
    
    

    .231
    
    >Yet I
    >can't help but sense a great lonliness and lack of fulfillment in her.
    
    hey Jeff, i agree with you !
    *swoon*
    
    see .31
    
    ric

    Madonna has been vying for this most coveted role for over two years
    and has beaten out Meryl Streep and Patty LuPone for the role!  I think
    Madonna has her place in this world, but stepping into LuPone's shoes
    for this is going to be impossible for her.  We should just thank the
    good lord that her voice can be digitally altered for her singing in
    the movie.  
    
    P.S.  If you haven't heard LuPone sing Don't Cry For Me on the original
    Broadway album, lend an ear...she's amazing!!!!!
                 

    Any comments on her video for Bedtime Stories?
    

 No comment

	Weirdest video I've ever seen. I just saw it Saturday night. Not sure
if I like the new song either. Will have to hear it some more.

	BTW, her song, "Take a bow" is number 1 AGAIN! This makes 6 weeks it
has been there! 




Glen

    Ma - Don - A
    Ma - Don - A
    Ma - Don - A
    
    You are getting sleepy.......

ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

    
    
    RE: .242.....were those the Bud wis er frogs taking
    on a new act?  :*)
    
    
    
    
    
    Terrie
    

    
    But of course!
    
    Ribit
    
    MJ

    THere is a real estate "for sale" sign at the end of my street that
    describes a house as "Madonna".
    
    My only comment was that I've seen Madonna's house (my sister lives a
    few doors down).  Ugly doesn't work well.  Butt Ugly comes close.  It's
    bad enough that a group of neighbors got together and petitioned the
    city to make her repaint the thing.
    
    What used to be (formerly Houdini's) white stone castle is now orange
    and black stripes.  The stripes go different ways.  Yuk.
    
    Anyway, why somebody would describe a house as "Madonna" certainly
    hasn't seen the real thing...

	Is the house wearing cones? It might explain why it's called Madonna.

    Speaking of Madonna, has anyone seen the trailer/promo
    for "Tank Girl"? It's truly a marvel how they can make
    a film look so profoundly stupid in just 30 seconds.

    Even for Madonna's acting career, this could be a new
    low.

    -b

	Brian, do you think Madonna is in that movie???? If so, me thinks yer
tanked...

    re: .248
    
    No, it's not Madonna, it's the nun that used to be in
    the "Father Brown Mysteries" series.....

    
    Oh well, I coulda sworn the "M word" was in it. So shoot me.
    
    -b

    re: Madonna house.
    
    I haven't seen the "Madonna House", but Madonna's house does indeed
    have cones on the turrets.  Orange and black cones.  Vertical, though.

| <<< Note 307.250 by SMURF::MSCANLON "oh-oh. It go. It gone. Bye-bye." >>>

| No, it's not Madonna, it's the nun that used to be in the "Father Brown 
| Mysteries" series.....

	Are you sure you don't mean, "Father Dowling"? If it is her, that is
Ricky Nelson's daughter. 


Glen

    
    No, it's not Tracy Nelson in Tank Girl.  It's Lori Petty who played 
    Geena Davis' little sister in A League Of Their Own which co-starred......
                 
    			MADONNA!!!!!
    
    MJ

| <<< Note 307.251 by MPGS::MARKEY "The Completion Backwards Principle" >>>


| Oh well, I coulda sworn the "M word" was in it. So shoot me.

	BANG!

    <------ Eeeek!

From jo@odi.com via Desperado:

Subject: Um, doing what?

After landing the lead in the long-delayed movie version of "Evita,"
Madonna confided to reporters that she'd "been on her knees for five
years to get the part."

    
    
    praying, i am sure
    
    

	well, Madonna being the good Christian girl she is, could it be
anything else BUT praying? :-)

    or the longest geneflect(sp?) in history! oh, that's one knee,
    isn't it... :-)
    
    Chip

    
    So, Evita will suck, the only remaining question is: "how badly?"
    
    -b

    -1 nice one Brian!!!
    
       Chip

    	(I think) I heard "Bedtime Stories" on the radio -- at least that
    	was what the DJ said it was.
    
    	Didn't like it at all.

    Re: .260
    
    genuflect

	No way.... Madonna was MADE for this part!!!! :-)

	I agree with Joe, I didn't like Bedtime Stories. But then again it took
me a while to get into Secret. 


Glen

    Thank you, Chelsea... Imagine, me, a formal parochial school alumni
    missing that one! I'm lucky I remembered it actually... :-)
    
    Chip

>                          Imagine, me, a formal parochial school alumni
>    missing that one!

You wore a tux to school?  And you have multiple personalities?

    I'd give 'er one.

    .267 depends... whom are you addressing? :-)
    
         that's f-o-r-m-e-r, f-o-r-m-e-r... hey, i'm doing doing pretty
         well for me these days!
    
         Chip

    If "Bedtime Stories" sounds a little "weird" it's because Bjork wrote
    it.  My brother pegged it immediately (Oh my god, she's trying to be
    Bjork now)  Madonna could never sing like Bjork.  Which is why althoug
    I think Bedtime Stories is the best song Madonna has recorded since
    Lucky Star, it would sound ten times better if Bjork had kept it for
    herself.
    
    I likethe video.  Instead of trying to be attractive/sexual, which she
    hasn't been since she dyed her hair all one color, she portrays a
    nightmare being, the PERFECT role for her ever since the Heidi from
    Hell fiasco.
    
    Lisa

	Heidi from hell??? Please splain....

    
    I think he means her 60s/pornography phase (ERotica).
    
    jeff

	Thanks Jeff.

    It's a she, first of all.
    
    There was a promotional party for the SEX book.  Madonna dressed in a
    Heidi frock (cleavage prominent), shaved her eyebrows, wore braids
    coiled on top of her head, and carried a stuffed lamb.  Truly
    frightening.
    
    Lisa

    
    
    who is bjork???
    
    

    
    > who is bjork???
    
    Former singer of the Sugarcubes...
    From Iceland...
    Totally awesome songwriter...
    Much cooler/better/weirder than Madonna will ever be...
    
    -b

>>    Much cooler/better/weirder than Madonna will ever be...

	aye

    thats harsh ...
    
    Madonna wrote some *fine* tunes in the 80's
    
    (i was going to mention "Like A Prayer" but that would undoubtedly
    trigger off another enormous religion rat-hole ... 8^(   )
    
    ric

| <<< Note 307.275 by GAVEL::JANDROW >>>


| who is bjork???

	he some kind of ball player?

    Think you're confused with that Bork dude who couldn't get confirmed
    to the Supreme Court :-)
    
    

    Bjork has a pretty cool voice.   Too bad her 'Debut' CD is not recorded
    well.
    
    
    -steve

    I like her music from the early days (When Holiday came out) but I
    think the last CD (Bedtime stories) does just that, make you sleepy. I
    like her upbeat music, and have not heard any new stuff for quite some
    time. She is very gimmaky and that makes her business grow by leaps and
    bounds.

    Is Bjork sexy?
    
    I`m not sure,really. Unusual features for sure. Her voice is pretty
    smart.
    

    >Is Bjork sexy?
    
    >I`m not sure,really.
    
    fun to find out
    
    ric
    8^*

    
    
    sorry heiko, but i don't have a compose key, and when i try to cut/paste
    from my character map, it comes out a different letter...
    
    
    

    
    It looks like a different letter to you, but it prolly looks ok to us.

    
>>    And you dare say they don't matter. IT LOOKS THE SAME TO YOU !

	brrr, err,  I thought Mz Deb was talking to Raq when she said
	that, no? 

	btw, Heiko, thanks for the alternate method explanation.  That
	works for me.  I was diacritically challenged before.


	Di

    As for Bjork's sexiness...

    Yes, I think she is sexy. Of course, it's in the offbeat way
    that I define sexy. For instance, Kim Bassinger is not sexy,
    Rosanne Arquette is.

    I'm not into perfect beauty. A certain "flawed" beauty is
    much more appealing to me. I like pretty, but I can't relate
    to the usual definition of "beautiful".

    To risk sounding a bit like a perv, I think Bjork's beauty
    (and sexiness) is in her child-like qualities.

    To sum up, I'd do her, but I'd card her first! :-) :-) :-)

    -b

    >that I define sexy. For instance, Kim Bassinger is not sexy,
    >Rosanne Arquette is.
    
    both are ok by me 8^)
    
    >To sum up, I'd do her, but I'd card her first! :-) :-) :-)
    				^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    
    just *what* does this mean???  8^{	bizarre it sounds!!
    
    ric

    >>To sum up, I'd do her, but I'd card her first! :-) :-) :-)
    				^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    
    >just *what* does this mean???  8^{	bizarre it sounds!!

    It's a Yankee expression for check someone's ID, i.e., make
    sure they are of age. Usually applied to alcohol purchases,
    but implies what I meant it to imply here...

    -b

    >Kim Bassinger
    
     She leaves me cold.

    .298
    
    oh how disappointing
    
    i thought it was some new exciting sexual practise 8-(
    
    ric

<---- you ruined a good cone snarf!

>    >Kim Bassinger
    
>     She leaves me cold.

Well, you win some, and you lose some, Doc.

    Recasting Evita: Argentine Movie Takes on Hollywood

    By IAN PHILLIPS

    Associated Press Writer

    BUENOS AIRES, Argentina (AP) - As if an unflattering Broadway play
    wasn't enough. Now, Hollywood's plans to cast Madonna as Evita Peron
    has Argentina crying for its legendary first lady.

    The president is outraged. The archbishop calls it blasphemy. A local
    filmmaker has launched his own production, with official support, to
    set the record straight.

    "Evita was a pioneering feminist, not the prostitute others would have
    you believe," said movie producer Victor Bo.

    Bo's film, to be called "Evita: The True Story," is backed by President
    Carlos Menem, who is a Peronist, and will feature a squeaky-voiced
    Argentine soap opera star, Andrea del Boca. Production is to begin in
    March.

    While the Broadway musical "Evita" painted the second and most famous
    wife of dictator Juan Peron as a corrupt populist who slept her way to
    power, the Argentine production will promote her image as a champion of
    the masses.

    To many Argentines, Eva Peron was nothing less than a saint.

    They didn't take kindly to the Broadway musical, which was banned in
    Argentina. And for many of the former first lady's fervent admirers,
    casting Madonna in a film version of "Evita" only adds insult to
    injury.

    "A total and utter disgrace," said President Menem. The Argentine
    version, he said, will be "a film about the real Evita, not like one of
    those fakes people who know nothing about her life have been making."

    Antonio Quarraccino, archbishop of Buenos Aires, called Madonna
    "pornographic and blasphemous. An insult to Argentine women."

    The Hollywood version of "Evita," directed by Alan Parker, is set to go
    into production in January, and will be filmed mostly in Budapest,
    Hungary, a decision that producers said was based on budgetary and not
    political concerns.

    In 1993, Menem granted American filmmaker Oliver Stone access to the
    presidential office to film his own version of "Evita." The president
    changed his mind a week later after many Peronists protested. Stone
    later scrapped the project.

    Few subjects split Argentines as passionately as Evita's controversial
    legacy.

    Admirers still hang her portrait in their homes and her name is evoked
    during political and union rallies. But detractors are inclined to
    agree with composer Andrew Lloyd Weber, who before his musical's 1979
    opening said Evita was "easily the most unpleasant character I've
    written about."

    Eva Duarte met Peron in 1945, as he was preparing for the presidency
    and a decade after she came to the capital to be a stage and radio
    actress.

    They were married a year later, and almost immediately, Evita became a
    heroine to the poor masses and blue-collar workers. She helped get
    women the vote and her Eva Peron Foundation built schools and hospitals
    and bought gifts for needy children.

    All state workers were obliged to contribute two days' salary per year
    to her charity, money her detractors claim was siphoned off for private
    use.

    Despite claims that she despised the rich, Evita would appear in public
    wearing expensive gowns and jewelry.

    On one occasion she explained her predicament: "Tonight you see me in
    disguise, wearing these loathsome trappings I have to put on because of
    my job. Pay no attention. You know I would rather be with you."

    After she died at the age of 33, her husband asked the Vatican to make
    her a martyr. The request was turned down.

    Said Bo, the filmmaker: "She never got the credit she deserved."
                                                                    

    
    I simply can't understand WHY Madonna would be cast as Evita.  It's so
    bizarre.
    
    Did Patti LuPone turn it down?
    
    

    
    The things that happen when you lose rights to your play.
    
    								-mr. bill

	Well, Madonna would make a good Evita..... :-)

    
    	Well, does anyone know the true Eva story?
    
    	Did she sleep her way to the top?
    

| <<< Note 307.307 by BUSY::SLABOUNTY "Peek-a-boo ... I can see you." >>>


| Well, does anyone know the true Eva story?
| Did she sleep her way to the top?

	She slept with Eddie Arnold..... 

    
    	No, you mean Arnold Ziffel.
    

	Was he on Green Acres??? :-)

    The swine flew with impunity.

	Madonna's song, 'You'll See', debut at #8 on the top 100. I thought for 
sure that meant she would go to #1. She went from 8, to 6, to 9 (where else 
would Madonna go after 6?), to 11, to 12, to 11, to 10, to this week, back at 8.

	Very weird things happenin on the charts these days. Songs that had
already been in the top 10, fall back down the chart to the 20's (slow
decline), and then work their way back into the top 10. I've never seen this
happen so much before. And songs seem to be staying in the top 40 for 6 months
or better now, instead of just a few weeks. Does this mean music is getting
better? 


Glen

> Does this mean music is getting
>better? 



 Does the amount of money a movie makes in its first weekend indicate the
 quality of the movie?




 Jim

| <<< Note 307.313 by CSLALL::HENDERSON "We shall behold Him!" >>>

| Does the amount of money a movie makes in its first weekend indicate the
| quality of the movie?

	Jim, we ain't talking a 1 week thing here. For a song to stick around
in the top 40 for 6 months or better (which more and more songs are doing) is
no one week quality meter. 



Glen

    
    	My sister told me that Madonna was pregnant.  Is this true?
    

How should I know what your sister told you?

    
    	That part I was pretty sure about.
    
    	Was what she said true?
    

| <<< Note 307.316 by NOTIME::SACKS "Gerald Sacks ZKO2-3/N30 DTN:381-2085" >>>

| How should I know what your sister told you?

	Gerald....please come clean my terminal..... thanks. :-)

	I hadn't heard that. I just saw a Madonna interview on Saturday, which
aired on VH1. Don't know when they taped it though. They made no mention about
it. She was asked what will people do when she dies. She responded, "Kiss my
ass". :-)  When asked to explain, she responded with stuff like Marylin Munroe
was seen as trash/slut while she was out there, and she was always getting
slammed by the media (figuratively). But when she died, she became an icon. She
mentioned a couple of other people as well. 

	Considering she has had 1 more #1 song than Whitney, she remains the
woman with the most #1 songs. Not too shabby. Now if only her acting ability
could match her success in music. :-)


Glen

    I've seen worse actors than Madonna.

    
>it. She was asked what will people do when she dies. She responded, "Kiss my
>ass". :-)
    
    
    	Hmmm, not an entirely black-and-white scenario here, is it?
    

    
    re: .319
    
    
    Not many, though...

    
    as much as i like madonna, there's no way to justify (ahem) her acting. 
    it's really bad.  and as far as i know, not that i know all, but still,
    madonna is not pregnant, tho she i looking to be so soon...
    
    

	I think if she does not do a good job in Evita, she can kiss off ever
acting again.... although she somehow keeps getting movie roles. 


Glen

    Naw, she can always hook up with Bubba to do a remake of "Hot for
    Teacher".

    
    	Glen, Madonna will always be in demand because she's controversial.
    
    	It doesn't matter that she can't act her way out of a wet Kleenex,
    	because she's reasonably attractive and has a nice body and that's
    	why perverts like me [not necessarily me, mind you, but perverts
    	like me] will still go to see her at the movies.
    

    
    
    Does she still have that space between her teeth???
    

	Shawn, because I go to her movies, does that make me a pervert? 

    Well, at least you go to see her movies, which I believe, Shawn
    actually claims to see her at the movies. I don't believe it.

    
    	RE: Glen
    
    	Yes, it does.  You probably go for all the well-built guys she
    	drags around with her.  I bet you loved the "Justify My Love"
    	video.
    
    
    	RE: space between her teeth
    
    	She'll never get rid of that.  It gives guys something to aim
    	for, and makes things more exciting.
    

| <<< Note 307.329 by 7892::SLABOUNTY "Don't like my p_n? 1-800-328-7448" >>>


| Yes, it does. You probably go for all the well-built guys she drags around 
| with her.  

	In her movies?

| I bet you loved the "Justify My Love" video.

	Actually, no. There are a few of her songs that I just can't stand.
That being one of them. I usually don't watch the videos when the song bites.

	But I did see Truth or Dare...... 


Glen

The SNL "Wayne's World" skit where they do a take-off of "Justify My Love" 
and Garth plays one of the dancers is pretty funny

    doodlydoodoodlydoodoodlydoo

	Yeah, that was pretty funny.....

    
    
    	She's causing quite a ruckus in Argentina.  Argentinians (?)
    	don't like the fact that she will be playing Evita in the 
    	movie version of the stage show.  They see it as an insult
    	to their heritage.
    

       evita peron...certainly a paragon of virtue.  i put her
       right up there with imelda marcos.

	It will be interesting to how she pulls this one off. IF she does well,
then she will have put in a lot of hours to do that. But my guess is she will
not be all that well in this. But I hear that miracles do happen.


Glen

    
    
    	Oph, from what I've heard, there are *two* stories about
    	Evita Peron.  One that makes her out to be a domineering,
    	power hungry youknowwhat.  Another states the exact opposite.
    	Have no idea which one is true.  
    

    
    	RE: JJ
    
    	That's been going on since it was announced that Madonna would
    	be starring as Evita ... gotta be almost a year by now.
    
    >	Oph, from what I've heard, there are *two* stories about
    > 	Evita Peron.  One that makes her out to be a domineering,
    > 	power hungry youknowwhat.  Another states the exact opposite.
    
    	I wonder which side will be featured in the Madonna version?
    
    	8^)
    

    yes, she had modest beginnings and so she became a folk hero
    of sorts when she married juan.  and she played that persona 
    to the hilt and laughed all the way to the bank.

So I guess Argentina is crying for her?

    
    Nope... she specifically asked them not to...
    

    come to think of it, madonna is perfect for the part.

    
    
    > come to think of it, madonna is perfect for the part.
    
    Yeah, Bonnie... she could add this to her other list of "movie"
    credits!!!
    
    
    BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
    

    she wasn't so bad in 'dick tracy'.  i mean, i know her 
    acting ability cannot compare with von dame's, but not
    everyone can be so gifted.

    
    Not since Richard Starkey has one individual gone so far 
    on so little real talent.
    
    Just my $0.02
    
    !joan
    

    
    	RE: "Dick Tracy"
    
    	I was never impressed with her looks until I saw part of that
    	movie, and I thought she looked incredible.  And her acting was
    	OK too.
    

    richard starkey?  is that not ringo?  i beg to differ
    if it is, !joanie!!!

    
    Ringo is indeed that dude!
    

    I beg to differ on Ringo, as well.  At first, I didn't think much
    of Ringo's abilities, but then I read some "music" analysis books
    that picked apart the Beatles' songs, and in retrospect he's not
    too bad, actually.  Listen to how he keeps something like "Ticket
    to Ride" from getting tedious, for example.  Keeps changing the
    rhythm, throws in different little beats now and then at the ends
    of the choruses and certain lines, and so on.  He's probably better
    than most of the "Dad bought me a drum set" drummers in rock bands
    from the early-to-mid 60's.
    
    Chris

    ringo is an EXCELLENT drummer!!

    
    Oh, if only Mr. Markey were here...you think he was hard on Garcia?
    
    ;^)
    

    
    	Too bad he didn't have the pleasure of playing with a good band,
    	isn't it?
    

    >ringo is an EXCELLENT drummer!!
    
     <giggle> Then again, this is coming from someone who thought a Dylan
    concert was the best she'd ever been to so a lack of experience seems
    to be indicated. ;-)

    As with most things, you have to look at this in a historical
    perspective.  In 1963 or 1964, who was a better band than the
    Beatles?  Of the bands that were around in those years, who
    could drive a relatively guitar-less song like "Twist and Shout"
    along better than Ringo's beat?
    
    It's easy to dump on Ringo and even the Beatles now, but in 1964,
    we were mostly listening to Bobby Vinton, Lesley Gore, and the
    Beach Boys (talk about an overrated group).  The Beatles revived
    rock-and-roll, and it was just as well since things were getting
    pretty boring.
    
    Chris

    
    Don't get me wrong...I think The Beatles invented the modern pop style
    now emulated by everyone from ABBA to XTC; and I also believe that a
    better drummer might not have contributed as well to that formula.
    
    But let's face it...Ringo was one lucky guy!
    

    I know what you mean about the Beach Boys being overrated.
    
    I prefer The Who and the Faces from that period. 
    
    
    

    .354
    
    mark, the level of your pomposity is exceeded only by
    the level of your chauvinism.

    And your level of ill-humor.

    hardy har har.

    
    	And don't forget Lippy the Lion.
    

  oh dear.  mark and oph were getting along so well there for 
  one brief shining moment too. ;>

    A Playboy interview with John Lennon a few months before his death was
    on the WWW a little while ago, may still be; Lennon respected Ringo's
    drumming skills.  
    
    DougO

    
    	Well, Vince Neil probably considered Mick Mars to be the best
    	guitarist in the world.
    
    	IE, it's a biased source.
    

    
    
    
    What a rat-hole!!! I love it!!!!
    
    From Madonna to Evita to Van Damme to Ringo!!!!
    
    
     Only in da box!!!!!
    

    
    	tramp/vamp/champ/camp
    

    who should we ask then, shawn?  we all know that john
    was _forever_ praising paul's stuff - not critical at all.  
    yeah, you're right, lennon couldn't be trusted to make an 
    honest assessment.

    
    	How about a pop music critic?
    

    oh, ask someone who _writes_ about music, rather than
    _plays_ it?  i'll take lennon's word on the matter any day.

    
    	So you judge the talent of a drummer by the opinion of a guitarist?
    
    	That's almost as invalid as its reversal.
    

    
    
    So Shawn...
    
    Amongst your fabulous collection of artists in CDs... whom did you
    consult before buying them??

    i'll take a musician's judgement on another musician - especially
    one who played with said musician, oh, for how many years? 25?
    30?  

    
    	Andy, I'm a music critic of sorts.  I hear songs, judge their
    	merit using my own biased scale, and buy the album with said
    	song[s] if I so desire.
    
    	Bonnie, I guess it was about 15-20 years.  Whatever, the number,
    	probably too many.  But a biased opinion is a biased opinion,
    	especially after that length of time.  Maybe Ringo wasn't so
    	much good as he was consistent.  John was comfortable playing
    	with him, and that could lead to some of the bias.  But that
    	doesn't mean Ringo was especially good.
    

    baloney.

ham

I don't think Ringo was the world's greatest drummer, but he was the best guy 
for the job.  Anyone who thinks a better drummer would have made a better 
group should try listening to some of the failed supergroups where each 
musician was competing for the biggest ego and loudest noise (just imagine a 
band with Richie Blackmore on guitar, Dio singing, Ginger Baker drumming etc, 
it'd be terrible!)

Chris.

    
    
    All I can say to that, Keith Moon.

    >i'll take a musician's judgement on another musician - especially
    >one who played with said musician, oh, for how many years? 25?
    
     That's clearly a biased source. If they are still on good terms (not a
    given in the music world), what do you expect him to say, that he
    sucked? Please. Ringo certainly fit well in the Beatles, but as far as
    musicianship goes, he was nothing special (this is being quite
    generous, frankly.) You wanna know about musicians, you ask other
    musicians, preferably those who aren't in the same band and who don't
    consider themselves to be in direct competition. Not that it
    _necessarily_ takes a musician to judge another musician- many
    knowledgeable critics have never picked up an instrument yet still know
    the difference between a good musician and a mediocre one.
    
     Go into a place like Daddy's Junky Music or E.U. Wurlitzer or other
    place that sells instruments to musicians and ask about Ringo's
    musicianship and tell us if you get any answers at all that don't
    entail a plurality of laughter...

    It`s difficult the judge what makes a good musician.
    
    Eg,I expect Allan Holdworth is a far better guitarist than er,the bloke
    from the Undertones,but i`d much rather hear "Teenage Kicks" than 
    "Metal Fatigue" any day of the week. So to me,the Undertones bloke is
    much better.
    
    

    first of all, when i wrote "Ringo is an EXCELLENT drummer"
    i meant it as a take-off on Dustin Hoffman's line in "rainman"
    (i'm an EXCELLENT driver).  
    
    secondly, i was just playing around with !joan.
    
    thirdly, i think that Ringo is a competent drummer.  and
    i have no doubt that 25 years from now people will still
    be listening to his band's music.

    
    	Wow, the Doctah agreed with me.
    
    	This is clearly a good day.  8^)
    

    Shawn, I always suspected you needed a life.

    
    	I could have told you that.
    

    >	Wow, the Doctah agreed with me.
    
     I do every time you're right. :-)

    
    	Yes, I noticed you've done it both times.
    

    When people are asked about Ringo's musicianship most often they're
    comparing him to the other Beatles.  John and Paul wrote nearly all the
    songs- Ringo only a handful (Octopus' garden is the only one I can
    think of off-hand, and its a twinky little thing.)  OK, so he wasn't
    anywhere near John and Paul in the song-writing department.  But that
    isn't what we're really discussing here- we're talking about his
    drumming.  And by the report of a person that went through the
    craziness with him (Lennon), Ringo replaced someone who wasn't working 
    out, he did work out, and quite well.  Maybe that means he was merely
    adequate.  I don't like to second-guess Lennon on it.  The rest of you
    can think as you like.
    
    DougO

    So, did Ringo go out with Madonna or sumpthin'? 

    
    	No, silly, they're both self-proclaimed musicians.
    
    	Do try to follow along.
    

    Ringo replaced Pete Best becasue Best was good looking and overshadowed
    John and Paul in that department.  Hence, his departure.
    
    Paul McCartney had some of Ringo's drumming dubbed from Abbey Road and
    Ringo and he were quite angry at each other.   Ringo isn't in league
    with drummers like Neil Pierts (sp), and Collins from Genesis.
    
    -Jack

>and Collins from Genesis.
    
ol' Slaphead isn't that great a drummer.  I'd rate the likes of Simon Phillips 
(of virtually every band in existance) and Simon King from Hawkwind.

Chris.

    
    	Phil Collins' claim to drumming fame is 11 beats in "In the Air
    	Tonight".
    

    That's my point.  He's still more talented than Ringo!

    
    	You know, you do have a point there.  He's got Ringo bettered by,
    	oh, 11 beats.
    

    Compared to the drummers today, Ringo sucks. He couldn't keep up with
    any of the drummers in the big name bands, or even Anton on the
    Letterman show.

    Drumming has changed immeasurably since the sixties.

    well, of course beca sue Best would be better looking being a girl 
    and all.

	What about that Madonna chick.....

    >I'd rate the likes of Simon Phillips 
    
     Excellent drummer!

    Neil Peart is astounding.

    For a canuck.

    
			  (__)
                          (oo)
                   /-------\/ 
                  / |     || \ 
                 *  ||W---|| SNARF! 
                    ~~    ~~  

    

    Oh yeah. 
    
    Nevermind.
    
    ;^)

    Actually, Peart is one of my favorite drummers. Couldn't miss the
    opportunity to tweak, however. (It's amazing how quickly youse guys
    forget my ancestry, but that's a different problem, I suppose...)

    The guy's endurance is second to none.

    As for the forgetting part, we obviously have all eaten too much food
    cooked in aluminum pots.

	I hear that Madonna has taken up playing the drums. 

  .404  try a broom handle to the ceiling.  she might pipe down.

    
    	So she looks for taut skin and bangs on it?
    

    
    I agree with Glenn, Neil Peart of Rush is a *great* drummer. He's my
    personal favorite.

    I might enjoy Neil if I didn't have to put up with Geddy Lee's
    vocals - BLUUURRRGGGHHH!

    they fit the music, though. Rush without Geddy Lee wouldn't be the
    same.

	Madonna fell to #11 this week. sigh.......

 Glen, the way you can tell them apart is that Sue J is a BRAT::

:-)
kb

ahhhhh.... thanks KB!

    
    	And Karen is just as attractive and SMART2.
    

    ah ha!,,, Someone told me someone called me a brat!  8P
    
    Yes Iam and Im damn proud! ;)

    she is a brat... I know for sure.. :-)

    Yes and look whos talking Baby! ;)

issat the coffee man?????

    
    	No, that's Sue.
    
    	You'll catch on eventually.
    

    Sue Jennison worked with me in both HLO and MKO.  I can affirm her
    bratness!! :-)

    What about her ilk?

    >> What about her ilk?
    
    
    And that would be ??? Slabo will tell me...
    
    SueJ

    
    	I don't know, Sue.  These people are all taking the same wacky
    	drugs and are stuck in some nasty hallucination.
    

    Ok...Honey.

honey??? slabo??? gasp!

    
    	Yes, sorry, Glen, but my heart [and anything else of mine she's
    	interested in] belongs to Sue.
    

	I'm sure the other women are relieved!

Especially MzDeb.

          
    >>  She (and the film) didn't even get a single nomination.
    
    10. ART DIRECTION: ''The Birdcage,'' ''The English Patient,''
        ''Evita,'' ''Hamlet,'' ''William Shakespeare's Romeo & Juliet.''
        
    11. CINEMATOGRAPHY: ''The English Patient,'' ''Evita,'' ''Fargo,''
        ''Fly Away Home,'' ''Michael Collins.''
    
    12. SOUND: ''The English Patient,'' ''Evita,'' ''Independence
        Day,'' ''The Rock,'' ''Twister.''
    
    16. ORIGINAL SONG: ''Because You Loved Me'' from ''Up Close
    and  Personal,'' Diane Warren; ''For the First Time'' from ''One Fine
    Day,'' James Newton Howard, Jud J. Friedman and Allan Dennis Rich; ''I
    Finally Found Someone'' from ''The Mirror Has Two Faces,'' Barbra
    Streisand, Marvin Hamlisch, Bryan Adams and Robert ''Mutt'' Lange; ''That
    Thing You Do!'' from ''That Thing You Do!,'' Adam Schlesinger; ''You Must
        Love Me'' from ''Evita,'' Andrew Lloyd Webber and Tim Rice.
    
    20. FILM EDITING: ''The English Patient,'' ''Evita,'' ''Fargo,''
        ''Jerry Maguire,'' ''Shine.''
    

  .585  I suppose technically he's correct - they didn't get a single
	nomination; they got multiple nominations. ;>

Ooops.  Accompanying article only talked about not getting nominated and
I didn't check its accuracy on the big picture.  Shame on me.

/john

	Has anyone seen, 'Evita' yet? Is it any good? If I liked musicals I
would go see it, but why waste my time when I don't like them?



Glen

    >	Has anyone seen, 'Evita' yet? 
    
    I'm sure somebody has.
    
    >Is it any good? 
    
    Latest reports indicate a thumbs down.
    
    >If I liked musicals I
    > would go see it, but why waste my time when I don't like them?

    Good point. Stay at home and get going with the knitting.
    
    

I saw it. It stunk. I should've stuck a sharp stick in my eye. Don't
waste your money.

Pete

    I saw it and thought it was great and was especially impressed by both
    Madonna and Antonio.  The difference between you and me is that I love
    musicals but can't stand Madonna - figured I'd give the movie a try
    anyway on a half-price night and thoroughly enjoyed it.

<---ok, now there is a review I can believe! A person who dislikes Madonna
liking her. This is good! 

    Madonna cannot hold a candle to the likes of Patti LuPone in the voice
    or public persona department.  I saw _Evita_ on stage a few years ago
    and thought it just another of Lloyd Webber's meretricious over-the-top
    spectacles.  When I want to see a good musical, I'll look for something
    like _Kismet_ or _Kiss Me, Kate._  Or even _Sunday in the Park with
    George._  But not something with Lloyd Webber's derivative hackery all
    over it.

	Would it help if I told you that he owns a MAC? 

Mac.  NNTTM.

Better yet, his next opus will be in Latin.

    Then again what can you get for $8 - half a paperback? Appetizer at a
    posh restaurant?
    
    I liked it.  It doesn't quite jell.  She's not a great actress.  But it
    is a fascinating story and passed two hours without pain.  (Except for
    the eardrums.  Why do theaters have the sound turned to pain level
    these days?)
                          
    Axel

     ALW's music makes me want to hurl with 
     impunity.



     i thank you.

but how about with some accuracy?

    Yes, yes.  With impunity indeed.  Everytime one of the many seemingly
    endless parade of ALW musicals or shows or whatever they are is
    advertised on the radio I cannot get my stubby little digits to change
    the dial fast enough.  Joe's Coat of Crayolas was one of the worst
    offenders.  

    It's amazing what a high level of appreciation of the stage arts we
    have in here compared to the population in general. While no
    self-respecting soapboxer would be caught dead taking in in an Andrew Lloyd
    Webber production, the man enjoys unparalleled success in the theater
    industry.

    Nobody ever went broke underestimating the taste of the masses.

I heard a piece on ALW on NPR last night.  Apparently his latest opus isn't
going to see the light of day.  The reporter warned that this isn't the
end of him.

>    Nobody ever went broke underestimating the taste of the masses.

Wine and wafer?

    ALW stuff is gushy romantic tripe and I hate it I hate it I hate it!

    As opposed to the more cerebral G&S?

    Oh yes, he thinks it's all cerebral!

    Chorus echo: Oh yes, oh yes, he thinks it's all cerebral! He thinks
    it's all cerebral, cerebral cerebral, he think's it's all believable.

    Bah.  Snobs.
    
    JCS - (pre-broadway spectacle) loved it.
    Cats - never saw it.
    Evita - loved it.  Two words - Patti LuPone.
    Phantom - mixed.
    Joseph - never saw it.
    
    
    ALW certainly has no lock on over-the-top spectacles.  For some
    recent examples, just see _Les_Mis_ or _Miss_Saigon_.
    
    								-mr. bill

  .607  yup, that's it.  if you don't like the pablum somebody
	spews out with frightening regularity, you must be
	a snob.  rrright.

  Guess that makes me a snob

    Snob?  Heheheheheh!  Most hardly.  I generally don't go for the ahts
    whether it is the churnings of AWL or the rehashing of Gilbert
    O'Sullivan.  I am certifiably unkultured.  

	You didn't know that already, Jim????  :-)

>  .607  yup, that's it.  if you don't like the pablum somebody
>	spews out with frightening regularity, you must be
>	a snob.  rrright.

    I guess where it seems snobbish to me is not the mere fact that you
    don't care for ALW's musicals or style, but the way you express it. You
    don't say "I don't care for it." You denigrate its worth, as if anybody
    with a single firing neuron could not escape your conclusion that ALW's
    work is "pablum". Yet millions of regular theater goers delight in the
    performances of his work, which are some of the longest running shows
    on Broadway. And this means, according to -dick, that all those people
    have no taste. And you appear to concur with this sentiment. Is it any
    surprise such an attitude appears to be snobbish?

  Gee, I sort of like some of the Webber.  I judge musicals this way :
 a few days after seeing one, do I find myself humming or singing one
 of the tunes ?  Thus, My Fair Lady, or West Side Story, or Oklahoma,
 would place very high.

  By that standard, some of the Webber is quite good.  Sorry.

  bb

    OK Mark, now defend the millions who like Jim Carrey and David
    Letterman.
    
    

   .612   go bang yer head - i'll express it however i want.  i think it's
	  pablum and so i'll say that.  if you want to get a complex
	  about it, that's not my problem.  i've seen you express
	  your dislike for plenty of things without any qualifiers.

    If Madonna's such a big star, how come I can't name even one of her
    tunes?
    
    

>   <<< Note 307.616 by WECARE::GRIFFIN "John Griffin zko1-3/b31 381-1159" >>>

>    If Madonna's such a big star, how come I can't name even one of her
>    tunes?

      prolly 'cuz she wants to name them herself.

    
    

>   .612   go bang yer head - i'll express it however i want.  
    
     And who said you should do otherwise?
    
    >i've seen you express your dislike for plenty of things without
    >any qualifiers.
    
     SFW? I don't give a <r.o.> if someone thinks I'm a snob. For example,
    some people think I'm a wine snob. If liking the good stuff more than
    the plonk makes me a snob, so be it. I really don't care.