Conference napalm::heavy_metal

    HI BUCK...  you know i thought many a times of starting a note
    like this, etc.. 
    
    but from the other side of the coin... i support my *so"s music
    all the way.. really.... i try and keep myself busy, but also be
    supportive... (thats why i started helping out more and trying to
    learn sound, it gave me something to do when i was at his gigs..
    
    as far as *so's i guess it depends on the relationship and what
    both people want out of it and how much sacrafices each other is
    willing to make for each other (if any). and i cant say for sure
    if lifestyles are a big part or it all or not.. .... ..
    
    bands are just like any other hobbie/sport/work..
    depends how much the person that is in it and how much they are
    committed to the relationship/music..
    
	just like say my horseshows used to take me on the road 
    2-3 days at a time (once a month) time involved etc.
    if they werent there for support/helping me out i think i would
    take a long hard look at the relationship..
    
       
        i look at it this way 1/2 and 1/2 ! maybe not looking at it over
    a weeks time but over a period for a couple of months things should
    be pretty much even...
    
    	
				wendy o'
    

    Ahh Mr. Buckley.  Leave it to you to put such a relevant note in
    here.  I can identify with you.  I think I may even be in a more
    difficult situation.  Here's my story...
    
    I was always interested in music.  Period.  From the time I was
    like 3 years old I've been doing something musically related.  In
    Jr. High I started with the band thing.  It never was a problem,
    because at that age (12, 13, 14) boys are supposed to be with boys
    more than they are with girls.  Even in high school my bands never
    interfered with my girlfriends, 'cuz high school is a pretty "open"
    type lifestyle.
    
    When I went away to college I studied music for a semester (forgot
    just about everything I learned, unfortunately), then gave it up
    to liberal arts.  All of my musical equipment was stolen from me
    at that time and I sort of relegated myself to just playing acoustic
    stuff on my own.  Long buildup huh?
    
    Anyway, the acoustic thing went along until, and after, I got married.
    And that was fine with my wife, 'cuz there was no "band" to compete
    with her for my time availability.  Then in '86 (after 10+ years
    of no bands), I met up with a guy that I used to play in a band
    with in high school.  One thing lead to another and suddenly we
    had a band.  It didn't go over too well at home (with either my
    wife or kids).  I could only do it if we rehearsed on nights when
    she worked (the time thing again).  Gigs weren't a big problem --
    that band only had like six of 'em and she used to like to come
    along and see me play.  But rehearsals cost us babysitter money.
    
    That band broke up and I was unhappy.  I liked playing in a band
    so I got together some people and Chain Reaction was born (SpringJam
    88).  Again I agreed that we'd only rehearse on nights when Peggy
    worked (this may not seem fair, but to me it is; she works three
    nights a week and if we rehearsed on one of the nights she was home,
    it'd be like choosing the band's company over hers plus she can't
    even hear the TV when we rehearse in my cellar).  So, things are
    going along fine.  Then we start getting gigs.  Now everybody knows
    there ain't a hell of a lot of money in local bands (at least to
    start), so we'd go off to a gig make $20 a piece and it'd all go
    to the babysitter (most gigs are on Friday nights, a night that
    she works).  Gigs on Saturday nights?  Well, if she comes, then
    I'm still pouring money into the babysitters' pockets and none into
    my own.  It's either that, or she sits home alone on a Saturday
    night while ol' Joe goes out and has a good time playing.
    
    How do I deal with this, you ask??  Large quantities of alcohol?
    Drugs?  No.  You just have to kind of be careful about what you
    schedule for gigs.  I limit myself to three gigs a month (mostly
    for my childrens' sakes -- I don't want them growing up with baby-
    sitters taking more care of them than their parents) almost always
    on Friday nights.  No more gigs for free: Heck that's like me paying
    to play!!!
    
    Most importantly, you have to make sure you devote enough time to
    the one you love.  And the time you spend together has to be "quality"
    time.  Not just sittin' in front of the tube watching a movie. 
    Sit down and talk together for an entire evening.  Round it off
    with whatever you like (wink, wink).  That can help immensely.
    Most of all you've got to be able to "bend" with your loved ones'
    needs.  Single people, or couples with no kids may have it slightly
    easier here, but if I see animosity building in my wife, because
    I'm spending too much time with the band, I cut back on my time
    with the band.  My marriage and my children are infinitely more
    important to me than anything else in the world.
    
    So, I guess it boils down to knowing what your priorities are.
    
    joe.

    Buck
    
    Just play your butt off and make enough money to buy her a really
    expensive present.  That'll shut her up!!
    Just kidding.  I always found it hard for me to really get involved
    with a girl in high school.  I would always like to come home and
    play at least for a couple hours.  I never thought that I would
    give that up.  And then one day, out of the blue she came.  I dumped
    my guitar in an instant and I knew she was the one for me.  I still
    play every once in a while.  She is even with me too! ! ! 
    I really think that it is priorities.  I am sure it is a lot harder
    if you are really dedicated to music.  In my situation, I always
    knew deep down that I would never make my career being a musician.
    Playing the guitar is something that I do to relax and release some
    of my frustrations.  I guess you are going to have to decide yourself.
    What a helpful note, huh??????
    
    jab

    
    	The previous replies have brought up some good points. I've
    	been gigging for 21 years. To have a relationship work, an SO
    	has to be either into music/bands, or very understanding.
    	During these years I've missed all kind of functions/parties,
    	and I even played on Christmas! When I gigged on my/or my SO's
    	birthday, we'd have a party at the gig.
    
    	I hate the term "Quality Time", but it applies here. Doing
     	something *very* special with the SO can help alot. Something
    	they like to do. I used to gig 45 to 50 week-ends a year,
    	so I used to take my wife out to dinner alot (is *that* why
    	I gained 70 lbs?), and I bought her some nice jewelery. Oh, and 
    	a couple of times rented a nice hotel room near the gig for a 
    	kinda getaway weekend.
    
    	In summary, my experience is to make the most out of the
    	time that you have to spend together.
        
    	Guy
    

                         
    My main problem is finding practise time.
                                      
    I work hard at work (8:15 -> 6:00 (sometimes earlier, sometimes latter))
    and when I get home I sometimes just look at my guitar and think to     
    myself "uh uh! don't even think about it!".  I try and practise +/- 
    1.5 hrs a day - even on days when I feel like sh!t. Generally though 
    - after a couple of minutes I just get engrossed and lose track of 
    time and remember the ENJOYMENT aspect of it again and that no-one
    is forcing me to sit here for x hours and do this that or the other.
                                                                        
    (I think God blows my car up or steals it from me every now and then 
    when he sees that I'm not putting enough practise in - so I have to 
    stay at home for a hells age whilst the thing gets fixed and I have 
    nothing to do but sit at home and practise ! This has happened twice 
    now!).                                       
                                                                        
    On the band front - Its a pain coz Jon (Katch 22's other guitar 
    player) works nights (you guys call it 3rd shift I believe) every 
    other week so we get a rehearsal or something lined up only to 
    remember the Jon is on nights!! AcK !        
                                                 
    On top of that, its really difficult trying to have a social life
    or a relationship and striking the correct balance between the two 
    but luckily I have friends (and a girl) who are very understanding 
    and let me devote as much time as I need (within reason) to my music.
                                
    -Tony                              

    This is completely amazing!  I've been having some trouble along these
    lines and suddenly THERE is a note with discussion of the very issue!
    Is this something that rears it's ugly head every so often?  Is it a
    seasonal thing?  
    
    Like Tony and probably many of the rest of you, I have a demanding job
    and I tend to work quite a bit.  I also need to practice more than some
    people because my current skill level is inadequate.  
    
    My wife, many times, is not very understanding about my time, even
    though my band only practices once a week, typically.  I don't consider
    this excessive and if we weren't practicing, I wouldn't be doing
    anything useful anyway.  When we got married, I just played and
    practiced, but had no band.  Now that the band is working out and we're
    starting to play parties and such, she's starting to get more uptight
    about it.  
    
    Don't even get me started about what it takes to get permission to buy
    new equipment...
    
    Personally, I don't appreciate the "where are your priorities" or "when
    are you going to grow up" type lectures.  Fortunately, we have no
    children right now, so at least there isn't that added pressure.
    
    Greg
    
    Oh yeah...Jerry, if you start gloating about how supportive and easy
    your wife is in this dept, I'll come out there and strangle ya!  8^)

   >> She said that she liked our music, liked our attitude..and we
   >> got along real well. She stayed interested in rock and roll
   >> and I stayed interested in her. Eventually, we became engaged,
   >> got married and then the bombshell struck. 
   >> 
   >> She loved me...but HATED the music!! For 4 years or so she had been
   >> play-acting enough to make Meryl Streep look like a Barbie-doll.
    
    Dear me. This sounds very familiar. Similar problem here, but I've
    worked it out in a different way...
    
   >> Unlike my earlier attempt at a relationship, I believe in making
   >> it work, at all cost.
   >> 
   >> In this case, all costs meant the band which I eventually had to
   >> leave / the bass, amp and effects which I sold for a pitence and
   >> more than half of my 200 + album collection which I literally gave
   >> away.
    
    I fell into the same trap, but stopped before it got to my music.
    That's part of me. Sometimes it IS ME. As far as I was concerned, she
    could take it or leave it. *I* felt there was a point beyond which I
    wasn't prepared to go.
    
    Certainly, she didn't like my music, but it was tolerated. I also tried
    to not impose it on her. But ultimately, I am what I am, and if anyone
    doesn't like it, that's their problem.
    
    I suppose it comes down to what anyone is seeking. If you really
    believe/want someone (or something) that much you're prepared to give
    up anything. Then again, if that means making so much of a sacrifice
    that you end up unhappy, that doesn't sound too good. From personal
    experience, you end up damaging yourself.
    
    Make compromises, certainily, but make sure you leave a bit of yourself
    for yourself. And make sure you leave enough that makes you happy. If
    others aren't happy with that, well...
    
    SET KEEF/OFF=(PHILOSOPHICAL_SOAPBOX,SELF_PITY)
    
    Keef.
    
    I love my wife and I love metal but in my case the 2 just don't
    mix!!
    
    
    
    

    Re .10
    
    I screwed up the editing, and the bit after my signoff, shouldn't be
    there. It should be part of the preceding part that I marked with
    chevrons.
    
    Sorry (and that's totally ruined the impact of what I was trying to
    say) (:-(
    
    Keef.

    Well, as a follow-on to what I said before:
                                                                        
    We had some folks over for dinner that night and my wife made me play
    them the tape we made of a few songs from that party and she bragged on
    us and kept going on about how good a time she had there and all this. 
    
    I don't know what to think...
    
    I suppose that I'm fortunate (at this point) that the band I'm in
    doesn't play metal music.  I know that's kind of an odd thing to say,
    since I really love that musical style, but my wife absolutely hates it
    and I would hear no END of the flack if I was playing in a band that
    played it.  (FWIW, my band plays kind of new wave/alternative music)
    
    gh

    I've also had this problem with my wife.  Here are some keys that
    you may watch for to ease this problem:
    
    - Try practicing to a schedule.  Declare a certain number of hours
    during a specific time of day to be your practice time.
    
    - Give her the attention she needs so she doesn't feel left out.
    You can't be selfish in a relationship.  This I think is the key.
    You can't expect to do what you want all the time in a relationship.
    Even if you're not married, you might say, "It's my life and it
    isn't like we're married!"  Fine, then you don't have a relationship.
    It is a 2 way street, you can't take without giving!
    
    - Take care of business!  If you have other responsibilities that
    you're neglecting, she'll give you a hard time during/about practice.  
    This could be paying bills, yardwork, chores, or any general tasks. 

    - Bottomline: Make her happy and she'll let you reward yourself
    with the music you love.

    Mike

    re: .14
    
    >- Try practicing to a schedule.  Declare a certain number of hours
    >during a specific time of day to be your practice time.
    
    This is EXCELLENT advice!  Something I should be doing already.  I
    tried this awhile back (Buck, remember when I asked your advice on
    practicing?) and it was working out really well, until a series of
    vacations and such threw my schedule all off.  I'll definately have to
    start doing it again (pretty clear that I need the regimented
    practice)!
    
    gh
              

    Well, I've gone thru some of this too.  Here's some more comments
    to go along with all the other excellent advise here...
    
    Point 1.  Remember,  This is jealousy.  SO's get bent when they
    think you'd "rather" be spending time playing your guit (or whatever).
    Jealousy is insecurity.  You need an SO who is secure enough and
    independent enough to do her own thing.  I like women who are
    independent to the point of *me* having to schedule time with them,
    not them trying to get me out of practice.  You know the type of
    people who are ALWAYS on the go.
    
    Point 2. A lot of folks go bonkers when a relationship starts out,
    then as it fizzles and the novelty wears off... You lapse into the
    normal day-in-day-out routine.  They want to spend every second
    together at first, but lets face it;  You might go crazy if you
    don't get some air right ?  The trick (I find anyway) is to be up
    front from the very beginning and for god sake be consistent ! 
    Don't "I wanna spend every second with you baby" in the beginning
    unless your gonna want it to be like that forever... Changing pace
    a month into the relationship is a sure fire way to blow that
    relationship.
        
    I think Buck said something too...  I dunno if I agree with it.
    I might ask a gal to come to practice.  I tell her that it's gonna
    be boring, and I'm not gonna pay much attention to her.  I'm right
    up front with her that I have a relationship with my band, just
    as I do with her.  So maybe she comes and listens... Figures out
    just how boring it is (same section of song 350 times etc...), and
    soon enough, she wants to find things to do other than come to your
    practices.  I'm real close to my bandmates, so I just tell them
    (or I guess they expect it) when I'm chasing and bring her.  It
    doesn't last long...  Sometimes it's nice to hear what someone
    has to say about your sound too...  Sometimes we're (musicians)
    to over critical; Your SO might be honest with you, and tell you
    what S/HE thinks... 

    Take all this for what it is, but if your a bachelor(ette), and you want
    to find a SO, and you practice 3,4 or 5 times a week, your gonna
    need to make that person a part of what your doing...
    

    All this, of course, is just in my humble opinion.

    jc

    Just one, unrelated side point to interject here to this conversation:
    The comment I made about people not coming to practice was just what
    Jeff pointed out.  I am a rehearse-nut...do it til its right!  I've
    always had closed practices for a couple of reasons: 
    
    1) Doesn't distract the band members attentions (to detail, the music,
       etc). 

    2) The band doesn't feel like they have to `perform' for their guests.
       (ie - rehearsing sections over and over, working out bugs, tossing
        arr. ideas, etc)
    
    Just didn't want people to misconstrue on that fact...Its not like I
    don't want people there as a way of getting away from them or any other
    selfish motive. 

    Ditto !  Like Greg said, I found the perfect gal to work into a
    music engrossed life, but my ex was the exact opposite.  
    
    $ set scary/rank_on_ex_awhile <return>
    
    She'd b*tch about practice time but loved the *idea* of being with
    the band at clubs and stuff.  She'd b*tch about what little money
    I spent on toize but loved the money I made.  She'd b*tch about
    the time I spent practicing at home but loved it when people at
    a gig would come up and say " he don't do bad ... to be an old fart".
    And she especially didn't like the fact that clubs are crawling
    with women that are apprentice groupies and could care less if you're
    married or not - they're still gonna talk trash with you.  And the
    fact that she out weighed my guitar by about 170 pounds didn't help
    much (yup, looked like a CJ-5 with a full roll cage ...).
    
    She doesn't b*tch anymore ..... aaaahhhhhhhh .....
    
    But you must have your priorities straight.  Scarytoy #1 is just
    that.  She knows it, I know it, no problem.  And if you have to
    "butter 'em up" by doing little things like buying presents and
    all just to be able to play, well I'm afraid you may have the wrong
    SO.  That's kinda like saying taking out the trash is a form of
    foreplay.  You don't do dis ... you don't get dat.  Wearing pantyhose
    does restrict the blood supply to the brain on some models causing
    irrational behavior ...  
    
    
    
    				Scary
                                     
    

    He does it too...  I even saw flowers on the coffee table that he
    bought her...  Atta boy Scary.
    
    jc

    
    u get out of a relationship, what you put in......
    
    
    

    NOT TRUE .... lemme give ya the address where the CJ-5 lives
    now !  To me, it's better to know exactly how you feel and tell
    her the truth - either she/he/farm_animal is #1, or music is.  If
    they know your music is first, then you won't have to sneak around
    and play little head games to play.  If you're really in to both
    of 'em, you gotta be honest with them about your music.  Either
    they understand, or you got the wrong SO for you ...
    
    
    
    				Scary ....

                Re: .19
                
                sounds  like   your  ex  should  be  called  "mr.
                scary"!!!
                
                170 pounds more than a cj5!!!  yuk!
                
                - rob who likes the nice 110lbs top sort of women
                -
                
                :')
                
                

    RE: .22
    
    Bingo.  Ya can only beat a horse until it's dead...Further attempts
    at beating it will only hurt your hand.  Yike.  How prophetic.
    
    jc

    It all depends on where you are coming from, who you are, and what
    is important to you.  To my way of thinking, anyone who would place
    music before a SO is a selfish, egotistical f*ck-head.  I mean music
    wasn't on what's-his-names list of human needs, but love was.
    If I had to choose between playing in a band and having a
    loving wife and family, the band would be history in about 7.5nSec.
    Then again, I'd never *be* in a situation where I'd have to choose
    'tween one or t'other, 'cuz I do have control over my level of
    involvement in all activities.

    joe.

    
    	I believe the secret is to find an SO that will be under-
    	standing of the situation and willing to support u on
    	the issue.
    
    	I mean, getting married and then joining a band is alot
    	different than joining a band and then finding a girl-
    	friend ... in case #2 you've gotta make sure that the
    	girl you're dating can accept the practices/etc.
    
    	Basically, Joe's right ... but only to a certain extent.
    
    							GTI
    

    I agree with Joe and GTI.  There should be no reason why 2 mature,
    consenting adults, can't have a sharing relationship and still be
    aware of what is important to their partner!
    
    Of course I have a wife and 3 children also (with one on the way),
    but all of my family loves music too.  They understand me!
    
    Mike

    Well, I would TRADE being in a band for a loving wife and family
    and all that rot ( ;^) ), but only if she understood my need for
    bangin' headz and made me join back up...  In other words, Joe is
    quite right.
    
    jc

    Pete's probably right too in the respect that I *do* have a family,
    but it is also equally true that well-adjusted humans need to love
    and be loved.  If you want to drift from relationship-to-relationship,
    I suppose you could then place your music first, but the minute
    you admit a *lasting* relationship (or one that you want to last),
    you have to start compromising.  Now what most everyone else has
    said is that *the ideal* relationship consists of two people willing
    to be accomodating to the other's needs.  I agree that that sort
    of relationship is the best possible.
    
    	"And I am human and I need to be loved,
    	 Just like everybody else does."
    
    	joe.

    I kinda like the way a gold wedding band reflects stage lights ...
    
    It's good to know that there are some other guys out there that
    can rock the cradle and rock the stage too !
    
    
    				Scary

    
    RE:: last few.
    
    	 I started gigging way before I had an SO, that was not an issue.
    	 My parents were very supportive and my dad used to drive us
    	 our gigs. By the time I had an SO, music was too much a part
    	 of me to even *think* of giving it up. As a matter of fact,
         the times I was not in a band, I'd be so unhappy that she would
    	 encourage me to join a band.
    	 And, my wife and decided that the only way we could afford
    	 a house was for me to gig 3 or 4 nights a week. This was tough
    	 for a while, but we spent as much time together as possible.
    
    	Guy
    
    

    FELLOW PLAYERS,
    This is very touchy problem! I think it's better if you
    have a band before you have a girlfriend, so then when
    the girlfriend comes around the band isn't a question.
    She already knows that you play and she's not used to 
    spending alot of time with you.  Then if she complains
    she knows the band was here before her and will be when
    she is gone!  If she is bored while your practicing(because
    my band has closed practices too) then sign her up for
    aerobics!! 
    
         Fortunatly my girlfriend loves the band I play in
    and would kiss my *ss if I didn't go practice!!
     Plus she gets along with the band members and sometimes
    she even gives us some ideas!!
    
      Everything is wonderful now but with my ex. I joined the
    band after we were going out so i can relate with alot 
    of players in here!!It was HELL!!
    
                    LATERS,
                    R A G M A N N
    

    SORRY THAT WAS KICK MY *SS IF I DIDN'T GO TO PRACTICE!
    
                 R A G M A N N
    

    
    	I was going to say ...
    
    	... if I were you I'd be missing alot of practices!!
    
    	8^)
    
    							GTI
    

    
    I've just got into quite a well known local band (they've supported
    Annhialator, Saxon, Onslaught, had stuff out on vinyl/CD etc..) and I 
    have no social life left whatsoever. The only night I get a chance to 
    party is on Saturday night (I study at The London Guitar Institue on 
    Friday nights). If you really want something, you have to work your ass
    off for it. Thats what I do. No partying during the week. No steady
    girlfriends. Period.
    

    Good for you TTT...I hope to catch your a$$ on HBB someday!
    
    Buck, believing your dedication is the way to go!

    Plus Tone, it helps when the opposite sex isn't interested in you
    anyway. ;^)
    
    BTW, Flip had told me about your audition, congratulations dude!!!
    
    /Mike

    
    Thanks for the kind wishes folks, Yo Flip, leave my hair out of this!!!
    
    -Tony 

    This is the closest thing I could find to a relationship note.  
    
    Is it possible to have a stable/long relationship with someone that has
    completely different tastes in musical styles?

    No!  Well maybe if you both work hard at it & put aside your musical
    differences!  But that's hard when you fight over which radio station
    to listen to...
    
    Birds of a feather flock together...
    
    but on the other hand...
    
    opposites attract!  So give it a shot.

    I thnk it's difficult and the more your music means to you the more
    difficult it becomes.  To me, music is one of the most important things
    in my life, and my spouse absolutely detests a lot of what I like.  We
    have a *little* overlap in tastes (mostly because I like a lot of very
    different kinds of things), but for the most part we can't even listen
    at the same time...  It causes problems sometimes.
    
    As far as listening time, I have a long drive into work and a Walkman
    in my office and I listen when she's not around.  She's home more then
    I am, so she listens when I'm not around.  
    
    When we're both around, we watch TV...  ;^(
    
    Now, the real problem as I see it is what music I want to go see
    performed (or play myself).  I like to go out and catch bands and it
    seems fairly rare when my wife will like the bands I want to go see. 
    This is a big conflict, since she won't go, yet expects me to spend
    (seemingly enormous amounts of) time with her too.
    
    Sorry, no big insights here on how to solve it.  She basically lets me
    go watch a band by myself or with other friends every once in a while
    and I don't play the stuff she doesn't like when she's around.  It
    helps, but I think it would be a lot better if we really liked the same
    kinds of music.
    
    So basically, I donno how to fix it, but here's some ideas and a little
    something to let you know you're not alone.
    
    Greg
                                               

    I had an ex-SO from OK.  Note the keyword "ex"  ;^)
    
    Buck liked Metal...SO liked C&W.  Was there a draw?  Sorta, but in the
    long run many a fight was had over which tape was going to rool the
    car tape deck for the evening!!
    
    Buck, who fought long and hard for Satch, which was up again the Desert
    Rose Band!!

    Re Greg..  I am living in the same world as you dude!  Except with me
    there is virtually NO overlap between my wife and I.  I think she sees
    me as a juvenile throwback, and I am 8 years older than her!
    
    I think a relationship is more likely to work in totallity if you have
    the same musical tastes at least.
    
    
    GAZ

    
    	The problem here is that people who don't like H_M don't like
    	H_M ... and that's usually end of story.  BUT ... those who
    	do like H_M most probably have "roots" in other types of music
    	and also listen to them.
    
    	So we have the H_M crowd who will listen to a variety of dif-
    	ferent styles, and the non-H_M crowd who hates H_M.  And that's
    	where the trouble starts, when the H_M lover tries to listen to
    	H_M when the non-H_M lover is present.
    
    	I also don't have a solution, besides Greg's "listen when she's
    	not around, or keep your distance and listen" theory.
    
    							GTI
    

    That's interesting because I haven't always like HM, it grew on me over
    time.  Why can't a HM hater do the same?  On the other hand, there is
    quite a bit of HM that I DO NOT like.
    
    My wife and I do have common ground.  My roots are in rock and pop and
    that's what she likes.  She even attends hard rock concerts with me,
    but metal is out of the question.
    
    Mike

    I love rock and my ex hated about 90% of it,I took her to Judas Priest
    and Megadeth and she walked out of both after 2 songs.She did like
    stuff that was "funky" ie RHCP and one or 2 others but that was that
    and all else was crap.Then again she liked some intensely shite music
    %)
    
    
                                                  Staynz

    
    
    Theres is no cure.
    
    Either you compromise, or you don't.

    
    	I'm not married, but I have 2 sisters.  Neither of them like any
    	H_M, except the occasional wimpy ballad, and both are into dance
    	and/or slow [Basia and others].
    
    	They simply don't listen to H_M, so they'll never "learn to like
    	it" because they won't give it a chance.
    
    							GTI

    
    
    thats like my sister,the wimpy ballad stuff,she also bought "slippery
    when wet" because JBJ was "cute".........ack
    
     no offence to anyone out there but its a shitty reason to buy an lp
    
    
                                          Staynz

    
    	RE: Ian
    
    	Does she listen to it and enjoy it??
    
    	As far as not liking the same types of music.  Well, when I
    	first started seeing Chris, he was into the Van Halen hard
    	rock heavy metal scene and I was big into dance music.
    
    	Somewhere along the line, he started listening to the likes
    	of Paula Abdul and I was popping Metallica into the tape
    	deck.
    
    	Now?!  I hardly listen to the tape deck in the car but
    	yesterday it was Skid Row, today it was LL Cool J... (8
    	I can't complain...
    
    	tigg~~~ who says give a little, take a little

    
    
      I don't know I haven't seen her in a month,she did listen to the
    other non H_M stuff(Jeff Healey,Steely Dan etc)but not much rock.
    She liked DLR only 'cause of just a gigolo and she wanted his bod.
    
    
                                       Staynz

    Compromise is the only solution - when I get in the mood for something
    REAL heavy, I resort to headphones of just playing it when I'm in the
    car by myself.  My wife doesn't hate HM by any means, but I know she's
    not crazy about it, so I don't *make* it an issue ... she doesn't mind
    my music at all ...
    
    .... that is, as long as I'm not playing in bars every weekend ...
    
    Scary (retired due to compromise ...)

One thing that hasn't been mentioned here, is that the majority of the people
don't really care that much about music! Just by virtue of being in this
notesfile, we are in the minority - we're people who are very active about
music and have definitive tastes. 

I have friends taht don't give two sh*ts about music in general - they don't 
have large album collections, they don't go to concerts, and they don't even
listen to it on the radio much (why do you think talk radio [AM] is more 
popular than music [FM]?). Music is not the central issue in most people's 
lives!

I think the only time that musical taste can come between a relationship is
in these cirumcumstances: 
	a. both people would have to be very "into" music - meaning it makes
	   up a large portion of their life and lifestyle.
	b. both would have to be really inconsiderate and unbending in what
	   they listened to.

Seems to me that with all the chemisty that has to go into making a 
relationship work, music can't be the deciding factor. If its a problem, then 
it just has to be a symptom of a larger problem.

alan

    RE: -1
    
    ... bingo.  Very true words indeed.
    
    And believe me, if music *isn't* a big part of someone's life, there's
    NO way to make them understand what it means to you ...
    
    Scary (who doesn't need to be talkin' about this crap today ... where's
    my pistol ?)

    RE: -2
    
    ditto on BINGO!
    
    ...and if you think MUSIC is a fixation that illudes most peoples
    lives, you should try having a roller coaster fixation...that REALLY
    weeds people outta your life, lemme tell ya!

    
    	RE: Buck
    
    	Unless you name them as a beneficiary.  8^)
    
    							GTI
    

    There *WILL* come a time when you'll have to choose ... a definite `no
    win' situation ...
    
    Scary

       And that's........"SCARY"!
    
                           Frizkid
    

    re: Scary
    
    That's a pretty depressing thought, dude.
    
    gh

    ..anyone still reading this topic??.....my 2 cents....i guess this is
    why i've almost always dated musicians....like me, they spend time
    rehearsing etc and have seperate lives in different bands but we share
    the same enthusiasm for the music ...and since it's such a huge part 
    of my life i wouldn't want to be involved with anyone else .......
    the other good part is when you go see your honey's band play, you can
    flirt with the guys in the audience and he won't
    notice......hahahahahahh......go ahead, bash my head in,....see if i 
    scare.........../k "moi".............p.s. the down side is...when you
    break up with 'em, you can't ever go see their bands play
    again..boohoo....

    Who says?

    ...re: -1..i assume your referencing the part where i say you can't go
    see them play again, right??....personally, unless we happen to be 
    great friends at the end...which has never happened to me in my entire
    lifetime...i don't want to give them the satisfaction of seeing me
    there.....does that explain better....??....not to mention, pay the
    damn cover charge, uh uh, no way....(tongue firmly in cheek).../k

     I'd never go out with a female musician unless they wore leather
    and hade blonde hair.......8)!
    
                            Frizkid
    
    
                               

    ....thanks friz...i take that as a vote of confidence.....and drummers
    all have such great shoulders to hang off of.........(wink
    wink)...please no barfing aloud...../k
    

    I used to go out with non-musicians, and it blew cuz they couldn't
    relate to the whole "band" scene.  Now I r a coaster enthusiast, 
    and it blows cuz de ladies can't relate.
    
    Dr. Doomed

    Poor Baby.. 8(
    
    Im sure there are millions that would want you!
    

    ...bucky baby....you need to find a music nut who loves coasters.....
    there are STILL a few of us around........../k...
    

    BTW...maybe the ladies are scared cause of that coat you where...you
    know, the one that says coaster enthusiast....maybe they think it
    means you like to drive with no brakes...!!.../k who's really reaching
    here but what the hell........

    As I said before, being involved with someone not in tune with the band
    scene *is* difficult, exactly the way Buck said.  They just don't
    *understand* the commitment, time, and schedule (oftentimes) that it
    takes to persue music on a professional or even professional-hobby
    level.
    
    I don't believe that I could ever make a living as a musician, but even
    if I could, that would definately be a difficult situation.  Gigs start
    late in the evenings, and finish late at night.  People accustomed to a
    9:00-5:00 business world can't (and don't want to) deal with that.
    
    One thing it does require, if you're gonna keep your relationship
    together is a lot of TRUST and COMMITMENT, two things many
    relationships seem to be severely lacking these days.
    
    What do you do?  
    
    gh
                                                         

    
    I think everyone's mind is sorta sucked out as you open the door to the
    building, or...is it just mine....
    
    hey Buck, my Cousin is a Coaster Fanatic, but she's only 11 so I
    wouldn't think you were interested, if you are, you are one sick human
    being, EXACTLY the kind i like....
    
    		{Insert a picture of me High-Fivin' Buck}
    
    Then again, maybe I'm the one who is:
    
    Sick
    Deluded
    Mentally Deranged
    Silly
    Stupid
    All around crazy (like al)
    Or all of the above. 
    
    The above list is random and is in no certain order...
    
    /k - Who says your the only one who's brain left at the last exit, mine
    side-swiped off an overpass 50 miles back 8)
    
    Chris, who really thinks he needs help

    re: /k
    
    Personally, I would go see my x-boyfriend's band play ( and do
    )..mainly because they just happen to be playing at DCL sometimes when
    I go.  He knows I'm not there to look at him.  I like their material,
    and I also like $.25 beer.  I guess it all depends on the
    circumstances. 
    
    No, I wouldn't make a special trip to some bar I've never been to just
    to see them play though...
    
    lirp'

    RE: Chris Cesspool (or whatever your lasrt name is...)
    
    I ain't bald...I just like my hair in the "you're in the Marines now!"
    fashion, so all these metalheads equate that with "you ain't got no
    hair"!
    
    Oh yeah, about that 11 year old cousin...where's she live?!?
    
    RE: /k
    
    Ask Fizzy, me hates brakes (set life/no_brakes!!).  Brakes are for
    Valleyfair!  (boo hiss)

    My relationship lacks nothing......
    
              I am IMHO most lucky!(I think Greg can tell ya that).
    
    She's not a musician but a big music fan.....This helps a little.
       Our first gig she freaked out!!!
            She wanted to bash all the girls in the head...But she's
    mellowed.  Hell...If she was in a band and had guys hitting on her:
         I'D BE RAGED TOO!
    
             She has no problem with the time involed with the band and
    even more importantly she LIKES the band's music.<--Important!!!!!!
         
           Buck....Grow some hair.8)
    
                                    Frizkid
    

>             She has no problem with the time involed with the band and
    
    I'm curious, were you spending a lot of time with bands when you first
    got together?  I think expectations have a lot to do with it.  When I
    first met my wife, I played a lot at home, but didn't play in a BAND
    the whole time we dated, so I don't think the amount of time required
    hit her until a couple of years later when I got into another band.
    
    It's taken her a couple of years to get used to my current level of
    practice (two nights a week) and more is a problem unless there's a
    special event coming up or something.  
    
    That's her expecation.  If I'd been playing in a band that practiced
    4-5 nights a week when we met, then she would probably have grown used
    to that (or dumped me).
    
>    even more importantly she LIKES the band's music.<--Important!!!!!!
    
    YES, YES, *YES*!!!  This is vitally important!!!  
    
    My wife has been fairly supportive of my musical work *when I'm playing
    the style of music she liked*, but I played in a band doing a style she
    didn't like for awhile and got a lot more grief from her.
    
    She will also give me grief if she decides she doesn't like people in
    the band I'm playing with.  This has also happened in the past.
    
    Fortunately, she likes the material I'm working on now and the person
    I'm working with, so things are good.
    
    gh
                                                                   

    You`ve got to be a pillock if you put yer missus before yer band. 
    (Especially if the band is going places).
    
    Joe Strummer.
    

    
    RE .79
    
    Ooooohhh. Mister Buckwheat, I didn't see a smiley after the cesspool
    remark. I might have to hurt you... Some day. Back to business.
    
    RE: Frizzyyyy
    
    	'Kay, so what if you see a really, really, really good lookin' babe
    in the audience, and you don't notice, but through your whole set, yer
    checkin' her out. And your girl notices this. What do you say when she
    brings it up after the show??
    
    Chris, who loves human delicousy (however it's spelled)
     

       Chris--That's part of playing live....I move around too much
    behind my set to have anyone notice that I'm checking anyone out!
     
                 I'd rather have a fan than a one-night stand.......
    
                         Frizkid
    

    
    Oh yeah, I forgot your a drummer, you don't count.
    
    What about your lead singer, has it happened to him.
    
    Chris, who is pokin'

    re: CC
    
    Belated 8^)

I gotta agree here - you have to have the right mate (or SO if you will).
I went thru a lot of girlfriends before I found one that gave a sh*t about
me being a musician (I use the term loosely).

My SO is very supportive of HardBall even though she isn't a musician.  She
lends a hand in everything we do.  She's the CEO of the business, she handles
the money, taxes and all that crap.  She also attends all of our practices 
(at least four nights/week) and helps out there if she can too.  But...

The one problem is women.  She gets pi$$ed when women hit on us.  Of course it
doesn't help that I'm a major-league flirt either, but I consider it part of
being a musician - it's business to keep the ladies coming back to see us.
Getting off stage and flirting back is business.  She doesn't see it that way,
though.  She IS getting used to it, but I can tell it troubles her...Especially
when those ladies come back and flash us.  That is precisely the reason for
the patented "HardBall Automatic Panty Launcher".   :)

Anyway, if you don't get support for something you love, *from* someone
you love, then perhaps your someone needs a boot-in-the-butt.  :)

jc

    
    Actually, my ex- used to get wicked jealous of flirting at gigs too. So 
    have other ex-'s. I don't consider it flirting though.

    
    Tell me, It's 'Job Requirements' right, Pete?
    
    They shouldn't get jealous unless you actually do or say something
    tangible like. Let's go in the back and ^&$#! Besides the more jealous
    they are the more work they put into the extra-curicular stuff! hee hee
    
    Chris, who thinks jealousy is a good motivator

    
    With all the rehearsal time and gigs, and endless junk that goes
    with it, it really effected my last relationship. She was 33 and 
    wanted to settle down and my music career threatened her wonderful
    picture and it really started getting in the way. This coupled with
    alot of other stuff doomed the whole thing.

RE: Automated Panty Launcher

Best addition to the HardBall stage show since the invention of
lights and smoke machines.  :)  Cyclic rate of 27 PPM !!
Unless they are cotton, which are cheaper but uglier, then the Cyclic
rate drops to 22PPM.

jc - Wagagagagagagagaaaa...

    Pete....I guess I'll find out in 7 years about the older women.
    
       Coop...You're killin' me.....But cotton panties rip easier!
               In the wise words of Scary. 8)
    
                        Frizkid
                                             

    
    Who says you have to wait, Frizzy-bizzy-subaruizzi!
    
    Go out and find a woman around 35....fun!
    
    it's no secret Women hit their sexual peak between 30-40... of course
    everyone knows when men hit theirs.... hee hee hee
    
    
    Chris, who is in a slightly perverse mood

>    Besides the more jealous they are the more work they put into the
>    extra-curicular stuff! hee hee
    
    Yeah, extra-curricular stuff like MAKING YOUR LIFE A LIVING HELL! 
                                       {picture Sam Kinnison voice}
                                                  
>    Chris, who thinks jealousy is a good motivator
    
    I don't really care to motivate someone to do that...
    
    gh

       I'll wait until my woman comes of that age and then I'll see.
                Everybody know I prefer younger women...Peak or nor peak.
    
              HEy...What's up with the names?
    
                          Frizkid
    
    

    
    S'ok, Ise just making someone else's points visible. they aren't mine
    they're my evil twin Skippy's.... when I find him...
    
    
    Chris, who knows that they make lives living hells

    Women:
            You can't play music with em' and ya wouldn't play music if
    they weren't so impressed by it!
    
                        Frizkid
    
          

    SHEEEZZZ..
    
            I can't hide anything from you guys!
    Greg..what I was trying to say was younger than 30.
             I agree with Coop(POseur-Bud from hell):
                   Some women just peak!!!!!!!!!
    
                            Frizkid
    

    
    
    
    	Ya gotta love those younger chicks! ;')
    
    
    	I never had a problem with any of my girlfriends and the band...
    
    	My last girlfriend I went out with for 3 years, she always
        supported me.. And the girl I'm seein now supports it 100% and 
    	does'nt bitch at all about practicin (it also helps that her best
    	friend is my guitarists girlfriend! ;')
    
    	But she does get pissed when girls stare at me when I'm on stage
    	and they try to get me to notice them, but all she'll do is just
    	come up to me after the show and make it known I'm with her! 
    	(dang!) ;') But like Frizz said, I'd get pissed too!!!
    
    
    	JW-

    Jesse;
    
    
    Yep.

Cindi does the same thing whit=pose...

She'll come up and lay a big ole sloppy kiss on me.
I don't mind, but it sure ruins the effect.
Imagine the audacity !!
:)

    That serves the same purpose as a dog pissin' on a bush ... markin'
    their territory ...  8^)
    
    Scary

But I should also qualify this -

The club we play in is staffed by some VEERY attractive girls who are
either ex-strippers or dancew during the day.  All their friends come 
over when they get off (no pun) of work.  Some of them are EXTREME 
exhibishionists - ergo, wer get flashed a LOT.  Cindi could do without 
that...  But it'd be a shame if they stopped - I'm just getting to where
I can continue to play without rucking-up !

jc  :)

Scary - you crack me up.  I'll be sure to NOT let cj read that.

:)

    ...er, i hate to bust into this "boy's club slapping each other on the
    back" thing you got going here, but men are just as bad as women....my
    ex used to practically haul me off the stage at the end of a set so the
    other guys in the room knew that he was with me......frankly, i kinda
    like that neanderthal behaviour sometimes........ahahhahah!.../k

    
    Yeah, like that would happen to a woman....sheesh. Can you guys believe
    the imagination of this woman, huh. Just kiddin'. You're right though
    it is neadrathal...though I wouldn't know cause I've never been in a
    band....But i sing in the shower!!!
    
    
    Chris, who has no idea what he just wrote

Yeah, I like it when CJ drags me around too.
:)

    re: ...123.....on occasion, real life has surpassed my imagination.....
    /k

    Well, one of the things that helped me get through the business of NOT
    playing in bars was owning up to the double standard I was living.  My
    wife loves to party - loved to hear me play, didn't matter if it was
    country or metal.  But she couldn't deal with the drunken females that
    really didn't care if I was married or not - I guess it got to be a
    game with 'em or something, 'cuz I surely don't stop womens hearts.
    
    So she got to where she wouldn't go to gigs because she'd always end up
    pissed at some girl.  Makes things real cold when ya come home at 3am.
    
    So when an ultimatum was issued, I was forced into an uncomfortable
    situation.  But, if the tables had been reversed, I would have snatched
    her ass out of a band so quick, her head would STILL be spinning ! 
    Fair is fair ... we're both possesive/jealoyus types, so this IS the
    best solution.
    
    Scary (valueing differences on the homefront, where it matters ...)

    	This is kinda funny, I seem to be running into this problem
    recently,and this confrence caught my eye. My girlfriend used to be
    real cool about the "band thing". Then again I used to be the bassist
    in the band an didn't receive much attention, but recently I started a
    new band and I couldn't find a decent singer(seems to be a constant
    problem). Well to make a long story short, I am now the singer and the
    bassist. Things have changed alot on my side. I've noticed I get alot
    more attention from other women, and you bet your a** that my
    girlfriend notices too. She has complained about it, but I just keep
    telling her that it doesn't matter because I love her. I think she
    hears me, but deep down she thinks that I'm going to meet someone else.
    Little does she realize that the girls that are flirting with me
    because I'm a musician are a complete turn-off to me. Hell I didn't
    even want her to know that I was a musician till we started really
    getting close. I really don't know exactly how to deal with this maybe
    it's because I'm a musician or maybe it's because I'm only twenty-two.
    My guess is it's a little of both.
    
    
    				If anyone has any advise I'd like the info.
    
    							Jim
     

    Jim..  You Shouldda came to Ol' Uncle_Al in the First_place..
     I've Got the Answers to All of yer Questions if You've got the Money
      to Pay me In Gold.
    
    
     Soultion....But A Bag Over yer Head When yer on Stage!
    
        Crazy_Problem_Solved_Girl_Friend_Happy_Al

    
    Forget that Crazy guy JIM!
    
    As being a woman that has been in your girlfriends situation, all I 
    can say is to keep reassuring her. It doesnt get any easier and 
    Trust is the biggest factor!
    
    SueJ

    Are you doing anyhting wrong?
    
    no.
    
    Are you responding to these women?
    
    no.
    
    Are you looking for someone new?
    
    no.
    
    The problem is hers, not yours. You need to find out why she is
    insecure and then figure out what the worst case scenario is and decide
    if you want to work on it or not.

    If you are giving her no reasons not to trust you, then you may be
    fighting a losing battle.  Jealousy can be a very ugly thing.

    
    Trust is certainly the key.  You can 'reassure' her, but you can't end
    up making that a vocation.  It'll get old pretty quick.   Some folks
    are insecure and jealous, but they need to put it in perspective. 
    Yeah, being a musician can expose you to the temptation of groupies,
    but for heaven sakes you could 'meet someone' while pumping gas or find
    someone to leave your girlfriend for in the produce aisle of the
    supermarket.  :}
    
    Reassure her and then act according to your words.  After that, the
    issue is 'hers'.
    
    /jen  

    Yes- Jealousy is one of the worst feelings/emotions in the world!

    Spend your breaks between sets with her.
    
    If your spending them with the groupies, it's not surprising that she
    might feel that way.
    
    If a groupie comes up while you're on break, put your arm around her
    and that tells her that you're making it clear to the groupie "not
    interested, already got one I like thanks".
    
    	db

    Re: last few
    
    yeah our singer gets most of the attention too...
    of course it's usually girls who are still in high
    school but thats another story...
    
    I've seen some really hard up groupies before hit on
    band after band the whole night...it's pretty scarry
    
    Shane, who thinks it should be illegal for some women to
    wear leather outfits that are obviously 10 sizes too small.
    
    

    
    
    But I would think the girlfriend would get REALLY jealous if he did
    that- put his arm around the groupie!

    	This is pretty cool, I didn't expect this much of a response. I do
    make sure that all the groupies realize that I am with her and happy. I
    really think that her problem lies with her last boyfriend, he was a
    real loser, and she caught him cheating on her many times. When
    something like that happens to you, especially when it is your first
    relationship it seems to make it much harder to trust anyone. I only
    know this because I've had a girlfriend who cheated on me, and for the
    longest time I couldn't trust anyone. I guess one day I realized that
    just because she wasn't trust worthy doesn't mean that no one else is
    either. The thing is getting her to realize that I am trust worthy. I
    think the best way is to just follow all your advise and just keep
    reasuring her that she is the only one I want.  
    
    
    			Thanx everyone I really appreciate(sp?) your input,
    
    							Jim
    

    Jim-- No Problem!!
    
    Perfect spelling of APPRECIATE!
    
    ;)
    
    SueJ

    
    A simple comment...
    
    ...Who do you go home with at the end of the night??
    
    Tell her that and say "think about it".
    
    

    Pick your nose or kill puppies on stage. Then they will leave you
    alone.

    But if after that, they're still intrested...GET OUT!!!
    
    	J