Conference bgsdev::skiing

	In Europe skiing off the trails is done all the time.  Their
	name for it is something like "off piske" (I know this is not
	the correct spelling, someone please correct).

	And their standard practice is that the SaR is charged to the
	person being resuced, which can be pretty expensive since it
	usually involves a helicoptor.  But at the same time you buy
	a lift pass you can buy insurance too that covers SaR costs
	(plus possible medical since I don't think most US health
	insurers will cover your medical costs in this case?).

    
    I'd say the #1, absolute mandatory rules to skiing out of bounds would
    be to ski with a group of 3 or more folks.  It just makes sense.  I
    would never go o.o.b. without at least 1 other person.
    
    After skiing some serious out of bounds at MRG last weekend, I'm going 
    to purchase a helmet ASAP.

    I read somewhere that the recommended group minimum is 4;  in the event
    someone gets hurt, 1 can stay at the site and the other 2 can buddy up
    to get help.
    
    Up at Whistler there are signs at all the major exit pointsa from the
    patrolled areas indicating you are responsible for any SAR costs.  They
    also recommend you have a chat with a Ski Patrol before heading off -
    partially to make sure you know what conditions 'outside' are really like
    and I guess indirectly so the patrol has an idea how many may be
    heading off to the wilds.
    
    On the really dangerous days, a patroller will be physically located at
    the boundary recommending you stay 'in bounds'.
    
    	Owen.

    
    I'd be interested in knowing what defines a "dangerous day" at
    whistler.  I can only imagine! 

    My definition would be when the avalanche danger is 'high' or 'extreme'
    but the weather is clear and the slopes look really inviting.  Usually
    a minimum of 30cm of new snow has fallen within the past 48 hours. 
    What adds to the problem for Whistler is that often there may have been
    a warming trend a few weeks before that sets up a nice slippery surface
    for all our nice new snow.  We tend to have wetter snow than say
    Colorado so there's an additional snow density factor that comes into
    play.
    
    If the avalanche danger exists but the weather is really bad the lifts
    in the high alpine area tend to be closed anyway.  The alpine area for
    Whistler Mountain has I believe approximately 120 known avalanche
    paths, many of which are actually inside the ski area boundary.
    
    Historically I think every two years or so at least one skier is killed
    in an avalanche somewhere around the Whistler area.  For example I
    think 3 were killed while heli-skiing in Dec, 1996.  That group was a
    ways away from the ski area but there was another incident where the
    snow cloud from the slide was seen by the Ski Patrol and investigation
    showed that 2 people had been buried - unfortunately they only managed
    to save 1.
    
    I remember one very sunny day at Blackcomb where I skiied Blackcomb
    Glacier about 12:00pm and had a great run, went back up for a 2nd run
    at about 2:30pm and they had closed off the area because of a large
    (Class II?) that had occurred within the last hour.  That day they had
    a couple of patrollers at the entrance because things looke pretty
    innocuous, the slope was very inviting yet the danger had changed from
    none to high within the course of the hour due to the warm weather
    conditions.
    
    	Owen.

    For serious o.o.b. venturing, you should probably also have some sort
    of backpack with a few essential pieces of survival gear handy.  Maybe
    some food and water at a minimum.  The closest to o.o.b. I com is
    skiing the Pine Hill hiking trail off the side of Wachusett Mtn.  which
    is only doable after some serious snowfall.  No Avalanche danger but
    there are a lot of trees and a lot of rocks and it is very easy to get
    in trouble quickly.  Only being 100 yards from a road and alona and
    hurt could still be deadly.  

i agree that you should go w/ at least 2 other people.
unforetunately, rarely can i get more than 2 people interested
in doing something out of bounds.  2 is the min; 3 is better.
when i skied cannon a few weeks back after 12" of new snow, i had
to find a couple hot skiers to hit mittersil w/ me as well as a 
few poaching runs.  no one wanted to take a day off and hit cannon
at the last minute (gotta get yer priorities straight! :-)
woods/out-of-bounds is where the real good skiing hides imo.
too many ski areas groom,groom,groom,groom until there is NOTHING
to track up...  loon would groom the woods if it could, i'm convinced.,
never go to loon on a powder day.  i have the same problem with hiking
in the whites.  often times i cannot find anyone to go w/ me, so i
venture out alone.  i don't need any lectures from folks in here, i
know i'm taking a risk.  i've also hiked 500+ miles in new england
and i know what to expect, where weather comes from, etc.
a cellphone would be my best defense, or at least a 2-way HAM radio.

jeff-- the term you are looking for is off-piste (pronounced 'pissed').

jc

.7s reference to poaching reminds me that the discussion in this topic
also applies to ducking ropes at ski areas.  You can be just as hurt and
_alone_ on a closed trail as you can in the woods.

Brad 

definitely; always bring someone along if you are poaching.
if i ski alone, sometimes i'll hang out until i see someone else
considering it, then i'll ask if i can jam down the trail with them.
works out well, they watch after me, etc...


                     <<< Note 1576.8 by PATRLR::MCCUSKER >>>

.7s reference to poaching reminds me that the discussion in this topic
also applies to ducking ropes at ski areas.  You can be just as hurt and
_alone_ on a closed trail as you can in the woods.

Brad