Conference napalm::guitar

    Ok, I'll kick this off as I have a clone.
    
    Did Steinberger think of the headless wonder first or was it Status?
    
    Phil

    Ned Steinberger comes from a noble tradition in the guitar biz...like
    Leo Fender and Nat Daniel, he doesn't play and has a background in
    engineering.  He got involved with Stuart Spector when the Spector
    NS-series basses were designed back in the late seventies (were they
    named after Ned?).  At that time he felt that modeling the electric
    bass after a *guitar* failed on two counts:  weight distribution was
    poor due to the elongated neck and the resonances of the wood caused
    dead spots.  His answer: get rid of the headstock and use synthetic
    materials to control the resonances.
    
    After being turned down by all the major manufacturers, Ned went into
    production himself with the original L-series basses.  They were first
    seen in 1979, by 1982 they were easily found in major music stores and
    on stages with world-class players using them.  Since then , the
    company has branched out into guitars and models with wood bodies, but
    the XL bass remains the flagship of the line.
    
    The L and XL basses are perhaps not the perfect or ultimate bass but
    they were certainly designed with *working musicians* in mind.  Why do
    I say that?  Well, first, the size and weight were reduced so that it's
    easy to transport and comfortable to wear.  The unique boomerang-shaped
    strap hanging system supports the bass at the center of gravity so that
    the neck feels "weightless" and is equally comfortable to play at any
    angle.  The double-ball string system not only makes it simple to
    change strings, but allows *swapping* strings out, for instance at a
    recoridng session where a different string type might be needed.  Of
    course, the synthetic neck need never be adjusted and the lack of dead
    spots makes for an instrument that sounds punchy and full over its
    entire range and plays almost effortlessly. One can certainly argue the
    asthetics of the design and even the sound (which is excellent, but
    perhaps not to everyone's taste), but it's hard to argue that it's not
    a successful design.
    
    How to tell an L series from an XL series:
    
    L series				XL series
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++	+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    body cap screws on top		body cap screws on bottom
    
    curved leg rest plugs into body	flat leg rest, hinged and
    					permanently attached to body
    
    2 volumes, one tone			volume, balance, tone 
    
    bridge has no markings		Steinberger logo on bridge
    
    battery cover uses screws		battery cover has quick release
    
    some early basses have		EMG pickups
    Bartolini pickups, most have
    EMGs
    
    
    Other series:
    
    P-series:	
    bolt-on synthetic neck, wedge-shaped wood body, passive EMG pickups
    
    M-series:
    bolt-on synthetic neck, Fenderish wood body, active EMGs
    
    Q-series (bass only):
    bolt-on synthetic neck, contoured wood body, active EMGs
    
    
    							Brian

    Interesting comparison between Ned Steinberger and Leo Fender.  Both
    designed instruments from largely practical considerations, and ended
    up revolutionizing the industry.  The designs of both men are driven
    primarily by things like manufacturability, modularity (I've heard taking
    a Steinberger apart compared to disassembling a rifle), ergonomics
    (like the Steinie strap hanger and Fender "Custom Contours"), yet the
    results in each case are unmistakably beautiful and tend to become
    classics of their form.
    
    /rick

    Thanks Brian and Rick for the last two. I'm certainly impressed with my
    clone and am considering getting my paws on the real thing.
    
    Phil

I recently got a steinberger and now that the bridge is set up correctly it's 
a great guitar. As soon as I get the pickups I ordered for it, it's going back
to the factory to have the routing etc. done to install them...(i bought
Semour Duncan Live wires classic strat in the middle/neck and a classic 'bucker
in the bridge)...


dbii double midi rack puke!

    Here's a piece of Steinberger trivia I just found out.  The original
    company was bought by Gibson in 1987.  The company is still maintained
    as separate operation, but no longer independently owned.  It appears
    that there are close ties between Ned Steinberger and Gibson; he's been
    doing some design work for them.  One that I know about for sure is
    that truly awful looking square'ish sci-fi bass from the late 80's
    (can't recall the model).
    
    /rick

    
    Just wanted to alert Steinberger guitarists - pay close attention to
    the strings you buy.  I decided to restring mine with a .009 set, so I
    just casually asked for a set of "niners" for the Steinberger.
    
    Two sets for $8, not bad.  A couple of days later, I go to put them on
    and yes, they're double-ball-ended, but they don't have the little
    threaded ball on one end so that you can set your Transtrem correctly!
    So I cut the threaded pieces off of the old strings.  But, these are
    too thick (deep) to allow proper adjustment on some of the strings, so
    the Transtrem is temporarily disabled until I either (a) grind down the
    old threaded ball ends to facilitate adjustment, or (b) get to a store
    that has proper Transtrem strings.
    
    Bottom line: no damage done, just wasted time...now I have to play the
    ol' Les Paul...
    

Hmmm...threaded ball end?

I've been using D'Addarrio's in .009 and the ball ends look the same to me.
What am I missing  here?

dbii new steinnie owner

Hmmm...threaded ball end?
    
    	Well, yeah, how can you set the Transtem up correctly if you can't
    set the "range"?  I don't know if there's actually a Steinberger term
    for range, but on my guitar (it's an XL2, or something like that), you
    do the normal intonation setup, and then you shift up a step (ex. E to
    F#), use the tuning gear to make it exactly F#, then shift down two
    steps below normal.  The variation from the expected pitch (C# in this
    example) tells you whether you need to turn the threaded ball deeper
    into the tuning mechanism, or to bring it back up.  When you've got it
    right, one step up is F# and two steps down is C#.
    
    Maybe there's more than one kind of Transtrem????  I'll have to check
    this out next time I'm in a store with multiple steinies.
    

Hmm my transtrem has a screw adjustment that moves the (for want of a better 
word) socket that holds the ball end up and down to adjust this.

dbii

    
    You want some free strings?
    

Sure, what kind do you use???

dbii

After a couple of weeks of playing my L2, I'm starting to get the hang of it. 
One thing is for sure, bodyless Steinbergers are a really different animal when
it comes to ergonomics and a lot of things I was doing unconciously with my
P-bass (or any regular wooden bass) I'm now acutely aware of.

There's no doubt that the reduced weight is a real boon, and the shortened neck
(because of the lack of a headstock) means playing in cramped quarters doesn't
require so much manuevering.  It's particularly helpful when you want to get in
close to a shared mike with another singer. Tone-wise, it's more versatile than
my P-bass due to not only the second pickup but to the wider freq response of
the EMGs. It goes lower and has a crisper sound, which helps define the notes
better in the mix of a band (my band members commented positively about this).
The tuning is super precise and tuning stability is incredible. The neck plays
very fast (although I would prefer a thinner neck myself, I can deal with it).

Transporting it is wonderful.  I've done a couple of gigs where packing in and
out was one trip...bass in gig bag over my shoulder, amp head and speaker cab
strapped to a folding handcart (the kind you use for shlepping luggage through
airports).  Yeah, I could stuff my P-bass into a gig bag, but the balance over
my shoulder isn't nearly as good.  For gigs in the city, especially if you need
to use public transportation, there's no contest here. Heck, for a rehearsal
where the amp is there already, I could ride a bike with the bag slung over my
shoulder.

But the ergonomic adjustments are the most interesting part.  First off, my
habit of resting my forearm on the body is not possible, as there is no body. 
I also found some of the vibrato and slide techniques I've been using don't
translate because otf the balance of the body and the low mass...apparently on
the P-bass I actually push against the instrument, which is not free to move
very much. For instance, using a shaking vibrato with my thumb *not* anchoring
my hand to the neck causes the Steinberger neck to swing upwards.  Sliding up
the neck can also cause this.  These particular problems relate directly to the
strap hanging pivot used on the L series basses, the other basses and all the
guitars use regular strap mounting and so wouldn't have the same problem.

The issue of grabbing the wrong note because of the missing headstock and the
body joint so far up the neck (visually disorienting... your brain keeps
telling you there can't possibly be a fret 3/4" from the end of the neck) was
mostly taken care of after a few days of shedding, but I still grabbed a couple
of clunkers on the gigs when running on autopilot. 

Funny, a guy sat in at the gig last night and the bass totally threw him.  He
told me he couldn't play it at all.  I guess the only worse thing for him would
be if it had been fretless to boot 8^)  8^)  

The bottom line is that if the Steinbergers feel odd to you in the store, go
back and try them a few more times.  Adjusting to the feel takes some time but
I think it's worth it.  Unless something drastic happens it's going to put my
P-bass into semi-retirement.

    Ahhhhhh, I've been biten by the GTS Bug!!!
    
    
    It's usually not a good thing when Dave Bottom (db_II) and I get
    together, as one of us usually ends up buying something!  Last
    time we jammed, Dave checked out my KH Quattro and Testarrosa...look
    at him now!!  8^)
    
    Anywho, Dave brought his Steinberger over last night to test drive the
    Peavey 5150.  WOW -- whadda tone!!  Clean, clear, RIPPING!  Not sure
    if it's only the EMG's, the guitar, or a combo of the two.  I may
    be putting EMG's in my Ibanez VERY soon.  My guitar sounds cool through
    the 5150, but Dave's sounded GNARLY.  It also bluesed out and cleaned
    up really nicely when you wanted it too.
    
    HMmmm....

hee hee hee hee ! My chance to pass some GTS back to the source of one of my
many fevers!

Buck the pickups are EMG's the humbucker is an 89 (humbucker/single coil) and
the singles are the SA's. I love 'em!

As long as I'm in the right note I should share this story:

Back in May I decided that one humbucker in my berger was not good enough. 
I contacted Stienberger service and made arrangements to have the body routed
for two additional single coils and shipped the guitar. I got a estimated
return of about 2 weeks. 3 weeks goes by, no guitar. I call, "Yep sorry 
I'll get that right out" weeks go by, no guitar...I call "Yep sorry, I'll
get that right out"....weeks go by, no guitar, I call and get a receptionist
who tells me "Steinberger is moving to Tennessee, noone is here except me and
the movers, there's nothing you can do but call on July 6th, and BTW I do not
give a f* about your problem as I get laid off today after I lock up". I was
rippin about then. I called my good buddy Al up to grouse about it and lo and 
behold the Steinberger rep is in his store, I get the number of the supervisor
of the dude who has been stringing me along (800 number no less) and I call the
guy, and am pretty mellow but firm that I needed the guitar back for the 4th
of July gig (it's July 2nd). They call me the next day (dude from repairs).


"So you've got good news?"

"I have medium news"

"Wot??"

"we lost the body to your guitar, I can replace it with a new one (factory 
finish blem) in your choice of colors 'if that's ok with you', otherwise
there is no way you'll get it back for the 4th"

I reluctanly agree, and do handsprings when I get off the phone. The guitar 
arrives July 3rd at noon. I open the package and it's practically a brand new 
guitar, the body is nearly flawless, the neck has been set up, the trem has been
set up, they shipped a new tremelo bar as I didn;t ship mine down (expecting it 
to get lost), it's got new strings a new rubber band on the headstock etc.

I ended up taking a very used single pickup berger and getting back what is
essentially a brand new 3 pickup for a modest investment. 

The moral of the story:

Sometimes adversity can work out ok.

I'm very pleased. Would I do business with them again? Yes, IMHO they made
good on a very bad situation and made the customer (me) very happy. Had they
merely routed my old body I'm certain it wouldn't have come out as good (since
the spacing on the single pickup is different it wouldn't have looked as
evenly spaced).

one very happy customer 

dbii

    
    
    That kind of explains why the strings I ordered in April still haven't
    arrived...
    
    

Yeah they moved to Nashville, into the Gibson facility. For those who don't know
Gibson bought out stienberger somthing like 5 years ago (it was news to me too).

dbii

    Just curious, how much did it cost you to have them rout the guitar?
    What kind of pickups were put in, theirs or something else?
    

The charge for the work was $140. I supplied the pickups they supplied the labor
and the 5 position switch. I put and EMG 89 and two EMG SA pickups in.

Even more interesting, they have yet to cash the check....

dbii

    Gibson is slow in cashing checks.  They do GREAT work.
    
    The Custom shop can make ANYTHING.
    
    Jay Tashjian
    

    
>    The Custom shop can make ANYTHING.
    
    I sure wish they'd make some anti-grav's for my LP Custom...
    

    Time to hit the gym, dude!
    
    Greg

    
    I could spend the rest of my life in the gym and it ain't gonna
    strengthen the collarbone I broke in a motorcycle crash.  Of course it
    had to be the left one...Even with the cushy spring-loaded strap I keep
    on the LP, the site of the fracture gets a little "sensitive" after a
    while...
    
    Hey, I just barely touched my truss rod adjustment and things are
    falling back into place.  Now that it works I think I'll re-string
    it...
    
    Speaking of Les Pauls, I thing the reason I didn't recognize the
    source of my strat problem is that my Les Paul has been rock solid for
    the 10 or eleven years I've had it.  I've never had a guitar that
    needed that sort of adjustment before.  Seems pretty weird, like the
    kind of thing you'd run into with wooden tennis rackets or something.
    

>    I could spend the rest of my life in the gym and it ain't gonna
>    strengthen the collarbone I broke in a motorcycle crash. 

    You might be surprised.  I had major problems with a shoulder I messed
    up *until* I started working out again.  I guess a dislocation would be
    a different type of problem, but I was shocked at how much difference
    it made.

    FWIW, I dislocated the shoulder in question lifting weights and
    immediately stopped working out when it happened.  For the next four
    months, I couldn't lift my right arm any higher then shoulder height
    and I couldn't put any weight on it without severe discomfort.  

    When I started working out again, I could barely lift 5 lbs with that
    arm.  Within 6 weeks, it had improved so much that I was back up to
    whatever it was I'd been lifting before (still not a whole lot, maybe
    50-60 lbs), my flexibility had come back, and the nagging pain was
    gone!

    Even though the nature of your injury may not make it such a big
    candidate for that kind of improvement, you may still find it helps to
    build up the musculature around the weak bone.

    Greg (once a workout animal, now a TV couch-crab :-( )

    re:-.1
    	Working out not only add muscle mass but bone mass as well!!!!
    FJE

    Current address/phone for Steinberger in Nashville:
    
    Steinberger Sound
    1050 Acorn Drive
    Nashville, TN 37210
    
    (615) 872 - 8420
    
    							Brian

    Steinberger is now selling a new low cost line (list $800) called
    "Spirit by Steinberger".  Laid out with EMG selects and wood bodies,
    they look a lot like the Hohner clones.  Haven't seen one yet, but the
    catalog blurbs state wood bodies, phenolic fingerboards (Hohner used
    wood) but no mention of the neck, so it may be wood or it may be
    graphite like the big brothers.   
    
    Guitar with two hummers surrounding a single coil and whammy, basses in
    four and five string fretted flavors. 
    
    Meanwhile, the latest Hohner basses I've seen have dropped the Select
    soapbars in favor of a more traditional PJ setup.
    
    							Brian

    Saw some Spirits today.  Street price was $500 for a four-string bass,
    $575 for a guitar.  No active electronics, otherwise, ringers for the
    Hohner models.  The dealer was unsure exactly where it is made, but the
    bridge still says "licensed by Steinberger" as if it is of foreign
    manufacture.  Workmanship looked to be at least as good as the Hohners,
    and the phenolic fingerboard is a real plus.  Available in black and
    white.
    
    						Brian

    What's under the paint?

   >What's under the paint?
    
    A Hohner logo   8^)  8^)  8^)
    
    

    I meant carbon fiber epoxy stuff, or wood...actually...

    Re: .31
    
    The whole thing is wood except the fingerboard.  Not as good a bargain
    as the Hohner clones used to be (they've been going up in price, but
    used to sell around $350) but having the Steinberger name on it is
    gonna cost you $$  8;(
    
    The Hohners seem to still be in production, but the latest basses I've
    seen have PJ setups instead of the EMG Select soapbars.
    
    							Brian

    Does anyone know of an authorized Steinberger dealer in the
    Worcester County area of Massachusetts? For that matter, does
    anyone have the address for Steinberger guitars?
    
    I just bought one of these funny looking things and the one
    problem I have with it is that the lap rest is broken and
    I need to buy a replacement.
    
    Thanks for the help!
    
    Mike

    Don't feel bad - a friend of mine bought one and the headstock was
    missing completely!
    
    Dave

    Looks like the Gibson ownership is starting to have some effects.
    
    In addition to the budget Spirit line, I see that Steinberger is now
    shipping Q5 basses with natural finishes (previous wood-body models
    were available only in solid colors) and with Bartolini pickups instead
    of EMGs.  I suspect the fact that Bartolinis are offered on most of the
    current Les Paul bass lineup may not be totally unrelated.  
    
    I haven't seen any recent Steinberegers at dealers except for the
    Spirits, seems they have fallen out of favor lately?
    
    							Brian

I can't find a 'berger dealer in Maine, although I suspect Daddy's is one.
I never do business with them anymore...for personal reasons. But honestly
this last couple of years I haven't done much business with anyone except
Al. That has to change as I'm out of strings and he shoveled the remains
of his string stock into a dumpster the other day, wasn't much good.

    I was checking out one of the M-series guitars the other day (I think
    that's the model; composite headless neck, Fender-ish body, had the
    standard Steiny trem not the Trans-trem).  Nice axe, but one thing
    that struck me was the action seemed a bit high.  I did the old neck
    relief check by pressing the low E at the first and last frets; it
    *did* seem a little on the high side.  Maybe not excessively so,
    but certainly more curve than I typically set in my neck.  It was
    really noticable (and a problem) playing in the upper registers.
    Note that on Steinberger basses I've tried, the neck relief seems
    about perfect.
    
    So to anyone who has or has played a Steinberger guitar, do you find
    the action on these a bit high?  Is it possible the neck on this one
    has actually moved?
    
    /rick

    > So to anyone who has or has played a Steinberger guitar, do you find
    > the action on these a bit high?  Is it possible the neck on this one
    > has actually moved?
    
    The action on mine is excellent (IE, very low) all the way up the neck.
    It's definitely that guitar, not Steins in general..
    
    Tom

Mine was so low I raised it. I couldn't get ahold of the strings to bend 
them.

dbii

I should have added that unless you have good string  tension they tend to
bow a bit, at least mine does. I can't run the standard .009's on mine but
if I run the sets with the heavier bass strings  it's fine.

No truss rod...

dbii

    
    Looking for Steinberger dealers
    
    Can anyone give me some names/numbers for dealers that have guitars in
    stock? I've called Steinberger to get a list of dealers in my area, but
    none of them have any in stock. It seems Steinberger are in a transitional
    state since being bought by Gibson. 
    
    The new number and address for Steinberger
    
    Steinberger Sound
    18108 Redondo Circle
    Huntington Beach, CA USA 92648-1398
    tel 714-848-8923
    fax 714-843-5731
    
    Thanks
    CERASO
    
    

    
    re last
    
    i found a "used" gm4t at elderly instruments out of michigan. i say
    used in that it has never been sold but is 3 years old. i'm getting 
    a good deal on it so i sent off a check today. should have it next week
    just in time for the holiday (i hope , i hope).
    
    CERASO

    
    
    got my new/used GM4T today and if the standby gods smile on me tonight
    i hope to give it good workout.
    
    CERASO