Conference napalm::guitar

Hi Scott.

It's not terribly difficult to do.  Once you get the saddle peice out of
the bridge slot,  mark a line on the saddle, perhaps 1/16, and sand down to 
that line.  Then try it, if that doesn't feel right yet, shave off another
1/16.  

Have you ever had the guitar setup, or is this the way it's been
since you bought it ?  

You could also check to see if the neck needs to be adjusted.  If
there's too severe of a bow, that will cause action problems too.
Has it progressively gotten harder to play ?
(an indication the neck may be bowing)

as far as string gauge goes, check out some of the light and
ultra-light Daddarios, and Dean Marckley sets.

Personally, for the hassel, and the cost of having someone do it right
the first time, it's worth the 15/20 dollars you'd pay to have it done.

good luck.

/r

Twelve-strings are notorious for neck-pitch problems.  

If the action is really bad and the neck is straight, you *could* do more 
harm than good by cutting down the bridge.  The ideal solution is to have the 
neck repitched.  Cutting down the bridge will usually hurt the tone, volume
and clarity.  If it's a really good instrument, take it to a qualified 
person and have it done right.  If it's a cheap instrument, cutting down the 
bridge might be a reasonable solution.

I shaved the bridge on my 12-string and now it needs a neck repitch *and* a 
new bridge, but it's not worth it.


Bob

    Yeah, not difficult to do.  Just be careful that you keep the bottom
    edge of the saddle square, otherwise it won't transfer as much of the
    sound and you'll lose volume.
    
    Curious, do you tune the guitar to D (as most 12 string players do)? 
    The reason I ask is that I had a 12 string ages ago and I didn't know
    this and tuned the thing to E like normal and the action was
    horrendously high and stiff!  I didn't learn that I wasn't supposed to
    do that until years after I got rid of the thing.  
    
    You can also get silk and steel strings (which have lower string
    tension) and tune it to E if you want.
    
    Greg

Are we talking about the bridge or the saddle?  Shaving the saddle is no big 
deal.  As Greg said, just keep it level and not too low.  

Bob

re:4

I ***Assumed*** the saddle..

I'd shudder to think of whacking off some of the bridge face...

    I agree with Greg. 12 strings work best when tuned to D rather than E.
    A lot of 12-string players do this and use a capo at the 2nd fret. This
    gives you the same open notes as if you were tuned to E with no capo,
    and it greatly reduces the tension on the neck. When you reduce the
    tension, the neck will usually pull back further, resulting in lower
    action.
    
    Mark

    re: .6
    
    	That raises a question for this neophyte. If I reverse what you're
    you're saying, all I have to do is capo the 2nd fret & use my tuner as
    I would normally do? This would give me open E with Capo & D without ?

>                      <<< Note 2423.7 by JUPITR::GIBSON >>>

    
>    	That raises a question for this neophyte. If I reverse what you're
>    you're saying, all I have to do is capo the 2nd fret & use my tuner as
>    I would normally do? This would give me open E with Capo & D without ?

Theoretically correct, but it can be hard to get an accurate tuning with the 
capo already clamped on.  It may sound great with the capo on, but when you 
take it off, you're likely to be a bit out of tune.


Bob

I think the point of down-tuning an acoustic is theoretically
an o.k. thing to do,,, however, I also think that today,
it isn't neccessary.  

I'd say, gauging on what I know about Washburns, (you get some dawgs,
but they do make a nice guitar) I'd say your best bet would be to take
it somewhere, have a reputable luthier look at it, and then, search
out a set of light gauge strings...

Capos are o.k. but I'd bumb totally if I always had to depend on one.

/R

PS: Speaking of 12s..  I fell in love with a Guild last weekend.

A really 'perti thang too...  Curly maple, thin body, trim neck..
then I saw the price tag..  one too many zeros.. $1,300....

Ahh, maybe zom-day no ?

>I think the point of down-tuning an acoustic is theoretically
>an o.k. thing to do,,, however, I also think that today,
>it isn't neccessary.  

    I woudldn't do it without knowing for sure.  It's my understanding that
    many of them are still not braced well enough to withstand standard
    tuning with standard strings.  Some are though, so I'd check with the
    maker before you do it just to be sure.
    
    Greg

RE:10

Guilds, Takaminie, Ovations, Gibsons, Martins

Should be o.k.

Getting in to the others..

Some of the Washburns, Ibanez, Yamahas

Basically the way I hear it, it can be guessed by price....

Anything under $400.00  could be suspect..

    
    I personally think messing with the sort of things spoken about thus
    far is the LAST thing you should do. The 12 string by definition:
    
    1) Will present more strain to the fingers (there's more strings to
    press!). This is just an inescapable fact.
    
    2) Suffers inherently from poor intonation unless you have one of the
    very rare instruments where each string has its own individual
    adjustment. This is most often manifested when playing higher up the
    neck. Some argue that this poor intonation is what gives the 12 string
    its distinctive sound. This could be so.
    
    I too think the real answer is:
    
    - Try tuning down a tone and either playing in a different key if in a
    group situation or using a capo at the 2nd fret.
    
    - Use light gauge strings.
    
    If you insist on slapping capo's willy-nilly up the neck you will have
    to virtually totally retune a 12 string. If you play barre chords or
    anything much above 5th fret you may find it sounds out of tune. As
    said before, this in fact could be said to be what gives the 12 string
    its character.
    
    The 12 string is a great instrument (I have an Ibanez) but it is
    extremely limited compared to a standard steel strung 6 string
    acoustic.
    
    Richard