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Conference napalm::guitar

Title:GUITARnotes - Where Every Note has Emotion
Notice:Discussion of the finer stringed instruments
Moderator:KDX200::COOPER
Created:Thu Aug 14 1986
Last Modified:Fri Jun 06 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:3280
Total number of notes:61432

1851.0. "VOCAL COMPRESSION" by FDCV07::DADDIECO (That's Just The Way It Is .....) Mon Jun 04 1990 18:44

Could this question possibly have a simple answer?

Here goes --- 

Lots of p.a. racks have a compressor as part of the standard equipment.

What I want to know is - -- - why?  Specifically, does a compressor limit the 
amount of feedback that may be generated and if so, with that limiting 
functionality/capacity, do you lose any volume if the compressor is actively 
working to cut a bout of feedback?  Not sure how to phrase this but - is it 
correct to assume that a compressor will indeed limit a feedback signal and as 
such overly compress and cut the vocal signal significantly?  Does this make 
any sense?

I guess I understand the compressor's value in cutting the P_pops and such, 
and I understand that it can smooth out the lows and highs in vocals, but does 
it have any value in eliminating feedback?

Any information would be appreciated.

Thanx ... Dan
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1851.1Compressors are great if you know how to use emICS::BUCKLEYParadise in the sandMon Jun 04 1990 19:2618
    A compressor works well on the vocals because it limits the dynamic
    range of the vocals being processed, which helps bring them "up and
    over" the rhythm section!
    
    A compressor will not eliminated feedback by nature!  A compressor
    boosts low level signals and puts a "ceiling" on high-level
    transients...if feedback starts as a low-level hum (as it usually
    does), the compressor will boost it to the threshold level!!!  This is
    where a Compressor/noise gate works well...so that absence of signal is
    gated, and not compressed (boosted).
    
    While a proper compression ratio will smooth out the vocals pops (P's),
    a poorly set compressor will actually cause pops, siblance, and
    "breathing" (the noise of heavy, poorly-set compression).  A compressor
    can be a VERY effective addition in a PA, but you really have to know
    the in's & out's of one to have it be benifitial to you.
    
    B.
1851.2Awesome Sound!ELESYS::JASNIEWSKIThis time forever!Tue Jun 05 1990 14:4037
    
    	Compressors are awesome!
    
    	My experience using compressors on the Vocals has been very
    successful. The type I use is a DBX and I've found the their best
    kind is the "threshold" vs the "linear" type compressor. I believe
    that the signal level runs through untouched until the "threshold"
    level is reached, at which point the signal is attentuated according
    to the compression ratio. The ratio range on my compressor is between
    1:1 and 2:1 and I typically use between 1.2:1 and 1.4:1 -
    
    	I've had problems with feedback while using the "linear" type
    compressors (your typical stomp box kind); however the "threshold" kind
    has given me no such problems. This definitely has to do with the
    threshold mode of operation because the linear ones start to compress
    too soon; you turn the volume up to compensate and when the vocals stop,
    the gain comes back up too high and you get feedback. Now you could
    turn the compression ratio down some, but it seems you end up turning
    it down to nothing as you juggle the settings. Then you say "Why
    bother?"
    
    	Using a threshold compressor on the vocals will give you a very
    nice "produced" sound that is much more "listenable" than the blasting
    of amplified vocals you get without one. Also, as WJB mentioned
    earlier, the average of the vocal dynamics can sit above the other
    instruments - without the feedback you'd likely get by simply crankin
    it up. It's a one of those audio illusions - it *seems* louder only
    because it's louder for most of the time, instead of varying all over
    the place in dynamic range.
    
    	And this is a definite trick that every soundman should have
    in their skill set. Most of today's studio sound is heavily compressed
    and most people identify with that sound as what sounds "right to
    them" or even "pleasant". Personally, I couldnt imagine even attempting
    to do vocal sound reinforcement without my trusty DBX 119 or 122!
    
    	Joe 
1851.3PELKEY::PELKEYProfessional AumbreTue Jun 05 1990 16:3416
You survive without one, till you buy one, then you wonder how you ever
made it without one.

I'll also renforce Bucks words of wisdom..

In the hands of a skilled soundman who knows how to use it,,, it's
a wonderful tool..

In the hands of an unskilled soundman, who don't know how to use it,
it's certain death, but the bruite side is, they're fast to learn on
cuz they're unforgiving creatures.  You hear the mistake right away,
and baptizim by fire is usually a two or three weekend process.

Once you get the hang of it, you'll never-ever do with out.

the better the compressor, the more you can do with it.
1851.4Let's Name Some Names?FDCV07::DADDIECOThat's Just The Way It Is .....Tue Jun 05 1990 21:169
    re: .3  "the better the compressor....."
    
    What's a better compressor - - I was looking at a stereo compressor
    made by Symetrix - was planning to use one side for the mains and one
    for the monitors.
    
    Is there a more widely used compressor?  Maybe the ones made by dbx?
    
    d.
1851.5ICS::BUCKLEYParadise in the sandWed Jun 06 1990 12:446
    -1
    
    I'd take a look at the stereo DBX unit...the one that ahs the built in
    noise gate!!!  This is ESP. helpful if you are compressing monitors!!!
    
    B.
1851.6DNEAST::BOTTOM_DAVIDNice computers don't go downWed Jun 06 1990 19:293
I have a symetrix 525 and it's very very good!

dbii